#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2011-09-11

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:03] <ukscone_afk> 45% uploaded in 3h38m 3h59m remaining
[0:03] <ReggieUK> :(
[0:06] <ukscone_afk> well you can't have it anyway ReggieUK -- i blocked your ip (or will when i work it out :) )
[0:07] <ReggieUK>
[0:11] <ukscone_afk> ok i don't want no sky cooties infecting my server
[0:11] <ReggieUK> :)
[0:11] <ukscone_afk> they might try to hack my phone
[0:12] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@adsl-75-16-237-76.dsl.kntpin.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[0:12] <ReggieUK> at sky broadband they're too fscking stupid
[0:12] <ReggieUK> but that probably means their systems are wide open
[0:12] <ukscone_afk> :)
[0:12] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@ has joined #raspberrypi
[0:12] <ukscone_afk> bt's used to be and vodaphones
[0:13] <ukscone_afk> used to be able to get into vodaphones billing systems via JANET :) it was the 80s but bleeding heck it's asking for trouble to have your billing systeem accessible from the university network
[0:14] <ReggieUK> just a wee bit
[0:15] <ReggieUK> kids, sweetshop....
[0:16] <ukscone_afk> http://www.nerdydaytrips.com/
[0:17] <ukscone_afk> ReggieUK: not only was it on JANET it ran on a VAX running VMS too talk about temptation considering 90% of JANET hosts were VAX's running VMS so 98% of all CS students knew all the security holes in VMS
[0:19] <ahven> yay, I have automatic root logon in qemu, now we are talking :P
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[1:00] <ahven> ok, kernels are building, time for sleep
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[1:46] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5ac9ad39.bb.sky.com) Quit ()
[4:31] <ukscone_afk> ok vm is uploaded and can be downloaded now
[4:41] * ukscone_afk (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has left #raspberrypi
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[4:58] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:03] * jimerickson (~jimericks@97-125-216-83.desm.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:09] * ShiftPlusOne (~shift@124-148-184-109.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
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[9:21] <ahven> wohoo
[9:21] <ahven> clean rootfs boot :)
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[12:56] <ReggieUK> g'morning all
[12:57] <ahven> morning
[13:01] <ShiftPlusOne> ahoy
[13:01] <ReggieUK> hi
[13:02] <ReggieUK> did ukscone say which VM app. his VM is for?
[13:02] <ShiftPlusOne> I am guessing cirtualbox
[13:02] <ShiftPlusOne> *virtualbox
[13:02] <ReggieUK> cool
[13:03] <ShiftPlusOne> silly c... you're not a v! >=/
[13:04] <ShiftPlusOne> http://www.raspberrypi.org/?page_id=43&mingleforumaction=viewtopic&t=409.1
[13:04] <ShiftPlusOne> the last post is good for a cheap laugh
[13:05] <ShiftPlusOne> it's funny when people say things like "I will not buy it!" like they're somehow inconveniencing the project somehow.
[13:07] <ReggieUK> indeed, like some idiots actually believe the customer is always right
[13:07] <ReggieUK> not in any shop I work in your not
[13:07] <ReggieUK> if you're wrong, I'll tell you
[13:07] <ReggieUK> and I might snigger depending how wrong you are
[13:08] <ShiftPlusOne> well 'course customers can affect a product's success, but that mostly applies to profit-driven organisations
[13:08] <ReggieUK> he's not a customer yet though
[13:08] <ReggieUK> no one is :)
[13:08] <ShiftPlusOne> they're basically giving these away almost at cost
[13:09] <ReggieUK> indeed
[13:10] <ReggieUK> english appears to be the guys 2nd language too
[13:10] <ahven> and will not recommend to my friends too < like ALL of his/her friends have exactly the same hardware expetations :P
[13:10] <ahven> and a good product travels mouth to mouth even faster than ads itself
[13:11] <ReggieUK> so it seems he probably struggled with the context
[13:11] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, Liz warned me about people who's native language isn't English
[13:12] <ReggieUK> 2nd ethernet no workee
[13:12] <ReggieUK> not really going to go down too well
[13:12] <ShiftPlusOne> I should use that excuse next time I offend someone
[13:12] <ShiftPlusOne> oh I am sorry, English isn't my first language
[13:13] <ShiftPlusOne> well replace the "I am sorry" with more abuse.
[13:16] <ahven> I don't think your answer is helpful for me. I sent my request to the developers, if you are not one of them - please go away and don't waste your time here. thank you.
[13:16] <ahven> :D
[13:17] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[13:18] <ShiftPlusOne> Yeah, this is one of those situations I can't decide what the right thing to do is... he deserved the reply he got, but it just stirs up more tension, which is unnecessary.
[13:19] <ShiftPlusOne> so it's between calling people out on their bs or not feeding the trolls.
[13:19] <ReggieUK> he's obviously stressed out and doesn't understand the sentiment of the words that have been put in front of him already
[13:20] <ReggieUK> trouble is he's already had an answer from Liz, so mailing the devs will probably just get him more of the same
[13:20] <ReggieUK> 1. Read the FAQ
[13:21] <ReggieUK> 2. Read the Wiki
[13:21] <ReggieUK> 3. if it doesn't do what you want, we won't change the design, it's up to you to make the hardware work, or not....
[13:21] <ReggieUK> 4. profit
[13:22] <ukscone> morning all
[13:22] <ReggieUK> hi ukscone
[13:22] * neil (~neil@CPE-144-131-91-188.lns2.cht.bigpond.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:23] <ShiftPlusOne> morning, usscone
[13:26] <ReggieUK> anest really only wants to hear certain things wrt his query
[13:27] <ReggieUK> like 'That's a great idea, we'll get onto it straight away for you'
[13:27] <ReggieUK> I have friends like that
[13:28] <ReggieUK> that think just because they can articulate an idea that 1. It's a great idea 2. it can be done 3. its easy to do
[13:28] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, sometimes I get an idea and I don't see how stupid it is... but it feels brilliant to me and every who doesn't see it just "doesn't get it". 'course I recognise when that happens and try to take a step back and think it over properly.
[13:28] <ReggieUK> 4. it's worth the effort
[13:29] <ShiftPlusOne> on the other hand, some great ideas are not recognised by others until much later on... like a PC.
[13:29] <ReggieUK> sure
[13:30] <ReggieUK> but a 2nd ethernet port on a usb strangled port isn't a great idea :D
[13:30] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, I was just getting carried away with obvious observations there
[13:31] <ReggieUK> he could always look at what goes into an arduino ethernet shield and reverse engineer it to the pi
[13:31] <ukscone> he could also shove it up his a*** sideways
[13:32] <ShiftPlusOne> ukscone, what's this about keeping this channel PG-13?
[13:32] <ukscone> damn i am feeling really grumpy today. just yelled at the cat
[13:32] <ukscone> i used *'s
[13:32] <ReggieUK> it's when the cat yells back that you know you're having a realllly bad day
[13:32] <ukscone> yup i know wy thpuhg
[13:33] <ReggieUK> are you up late or woke up really early?
[13:33] <ukscone> i got bitten by mosi's last night and i always feel like s*** when i do as i'm alergic to them
[13:33] <ReggieUK> malaria?
[13:33] <ShiftPlusOne> oh... if they didn't suck enough (no put intended)
[13:33] <ukscone> up early coz the wife elbowed me and i have backache and i feel rotten
[13:33] <ShiftPlusOne> now you can be allergic to them?
[13:34] <ShiftPlusOne> *pun
[13:34] <ukscone> nope i'm just alergic to mosi's spider bites and a few other things i swellup like a balloon and headaches and sweats and well just feel rotton
[13:34] <ReggieUK> mosi bites from memory leave some nice big boil looking things if you're not careful
[13:35] <ShiftPlusOne> =(
[13:37] <ReggieUK> I wonder if the pi team have any code examples for messing with the gpio yet?
[13:37] <ReggieUK> anyone know how the gpio are presented to us?
[13:38] <ShiftPlusOne> in software?
[13:38] <ReggieUK> yes
[13:38] <ukscone> ReggieUK: they will be exposed in the sysfs for a start
[13:38] * WASD_ (~WASD@78-82-251-253.tn.glocalnet.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:38] <ukscone> but not sure if the gpio on arm1176 are exposed the sameway as in pxa
[13:39] <ShiftPlusOne> well if it follow the linux convention that "everything is a file" then yeah... it should be a simple io stream, right?
[13:39] <ReggieUK> I've not seen stuff on pxa
[13:39] <ukscone> i still can't findout if the arm1176 uses memory registers for allt he cool stuff
[13:39] <ShiftPlusOne> I use the word 'simple' loosely 'course
[13:40] <ukscone> ReggieUK: on the pxa2xx you mmap() certain addressed and you can just read/write from there
[13:40] <ReggieUK> that sounds like roughly what goes on with the leapfrog stuff
[13:40] <ukscone> the only thing to remember about arm and r/w memory is read a byte write a word
[13:40] <ReggieUK> and before I forget, thanks for the answers on dissecting those libs last night
[13:41] <ukscone> you can red half-word and word too but you must write a word
[13:41] <ReggieUK> obviously not what I wanted to hear but at least I can stop bruising my forehead looking for solutions that aren't there now :)
[13:42] <ukscone> ReggieUK: sorry i'm no real help as it isn't really that possible afaik unless you do a full reverse engineer or beat the maintainer to a pulp
[13:42] <ReggieUK> unlikely that I'll ever get near the maintainer
[13:42] <WASD_> I have a question: Will you be able to plug in standard 3- or 2-pin fans directly into Model B?
[13:42] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:43] <ukscone> send me enough twiglets and i'll go pay him a visit
[13:43] <ReggieUK> :D
[13:43] <ukscone> i'd want my body weight in twiglets
[13:43] <ReggieUK> WASD_ define standard 3/2 pin fan
[13:43] <ukscone> and i've put on all the weight back over th elast 4 years
[13:44] <WASD_> ReggieUK: I have some old fans from old computers laying around that looks like this http://www.inet.se/files/img/max/6308432_1.png
[13:44] <ReggieUK> going to need things like voltage, amp ratings, what's the 3rd pin for
[13:45] <ReggieUK> still not giving much in the way of info there WASD_
[13:45] <WASD_> I dont really know any more specificaitons. Do you have any idea if those will at least fit?
[13:46] <ReggieUK> if they won't fit they can be made to fit one way or another
[13:46] <ReggieUK> but it really depends on the ratings of the fans
[13:46] <WASD_> I see
[13:46] <ReggieUK> is there a sticker in the middle of the fan?
[13:46] <ReggieUK> it might have some info on them
[13:47] <ReggieUK> like 5v or 12v and 0.5a
[13:47] <WASD_> I have a few fans. If they wont work I can just buy a new for $10. I'm looking at one now that says DC12V and 0.06A
[13:47] <ReggieUK> 3rd pin might be a speed sense pin, or it could be a pwm pin so that you can alter the speed of the fan
[13:47] <WASD_> cool
[13:48] <WASD_> Is it neccesary to have a fan if you build a chassi out of wood?
[13:48] <ReggieUK> 12V fan isn't going to plug directly into the pi
[13:48] <ReggieUK> the gpio don't run at that voltage
[13:49] <ReggieUK> and 60ma might well be outside their operating current
[13:49] <WASD_> alright
[13:50] <WASD_> that was just one fan I was looking at on a website, I'm sure there are fans that use less power
[13:51] <ReggieUK> sure, the thing to do is check on the wiki/faq for the PSU voltage
[13:51] <WASD_> My next question is about SD-card limitations. Is there a speedlimit or a sizelimit to cards? I'm thinking about buying a high-speed one, probably 4 or 8GB
[13:51] <WASD_> I'm looking at two that says 15mb/s and 20mb/s
[13:52] <WASD_> do you have any idea about that?
[13:52] <ReggieUK> so in reality you'd need to either spur off the voltage regulator (if it gives enough power) or setup your own seperate supply voltage and then possibly use a small isolated circuit to control fan speed
[13:52] <ReggieUK> I don't have much of an idea about that, I'm pretty sure I saw them using an 8gb somewhere
[13:53] <ReggieUK> they spec the rootfs on a 2GB card, with enough space for your dev work
[13:54] <WASD_> I already have a cheap 4gb card at home that I will try at first. Hopefully i'll find it fast enough
[13:55] <WASD_> do you know how hot it gets without cooling, and if cooling is needed if you build a chassi?
[13:56] <ukscone> WASD_: no cooling is neccessary apparently. this is a mobile phone soc really and you don't see fans in mobile phones
[13:56] <WASD_> true
[13:56] <ukscone> they said after 10 hours of playing movies nonstop at a conference it wasn't any hotter than when it started
[13:57] <ukscone> well not noticibly
[13:57] <WASD_> nice
[13:58] <WASD_> thanks for the replies, all I'm wondering now is about SD-card speeds. I read somewhere in the wiki that the first boot will be really slow
[13:59] <ReggieUK> depends on your definition of slow I guess
[14:00] <WASD_> yeah, I can decide for myself once i test it if i find loading speeds slow
[14:01] <WASD_> Faster SD-cards is obviouslly faster if the reader supports it. But card-speed may not be the primary bottleneck
[14:02] <WASD_> my archlinux in a virtualbox boots in 17sec, I find that fast. Do you know how fast a 7200rpm harddrive can read?
[14:03] <WASD_> wikipedia says up to 1gbit
[14:03] <WASD_> that would be about 10 times faster than a SD-card, depending on its speed
[14:09] <ReggieUK> sure but you're never going to plug a hard drive directly into the pi, so its a moot point
[14:11] <ReggieUK> 6-8 seconds or less for this 393Mhz arm unit I'm using from leapfrog, no idea what speed the sd card is
[14:12] <ReggieUK> sd will be fine I'm sure
[14:12] <WASD_> are you talking about boot speed?
[14:12] <ReggieUK> yes
[14:12] <WASD_> nice
[14:12] <ReggieUK> but most of that isn't the SD card
[14:12] <ReggieUK> that's driver bringup mainly
[14:13] <ReggieUK> kernel load and uncompress is about 4seconds
[14:15] <WASD_> Will I be able to connect a usb-powered external harddrive?
[14:18] <WASD_> I'm thinking about power-supply
[14:21] * DRED (~Dred@109-126-235-157.domolink.elcom.ru) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[14:24] <ShiftPlusOne> yup
[14:26] <WASD_> Ok. I became a bit unsure when ReggieUK said that 12V fans wouldnt work, I suppose a harddrive uses more power than that
[14:28] <ukscone> harddrives that are designed to be powered (normally from two usb ports) by usb would only use what usb supplies so they'd run ar the correct voltage etc.
[14:28] <WASD_> good
[14:29] <ukscone> personally i'm planning on using a powered usb hub and/or port replicator and not bother to power anything from the raspi it'sself (other than flash drives)
[14:30] <ukscone> i have no logical reason for doing it that way it just seems a better approach and would put less stress on the raspi
[14:31] <WASD_> I have a usb-hub that can be externally powered if I need to
[14:32] <WASD_> I'm gonna set up an SSH-server so i dont need a screen/keyboard/mouse so I would only connect network and power, possibly my external harddrive too
[14:34] <ReggieUK> for 'in the field' work I'll use various 12V battery packs, from 2.4Ah to 20-30Ah
[14:35] <ukscone> someone i forget who from raspberrypi foundation said they use rc battery packs
[14:35] <ukscone> it was jamesh i think who said it
[14:35] <ReggieUK> If I had those and chargers for them I'd use rc packs
[14:35] <ukscone> and i think he said they were 7.4v
[14:36] <ReggieUK> 3.7,7.4,11.1v
[14:36] <ReggieUK> depending how many 'cells' they use
[14:38] <ukscone> ShiftPlusOne: didn't notice you are a forum mod now :)
[14:38] <WASD_> is the target release date still "end of november to start of december"?
[14:39] <ukscone> guess i better not kickban you here then afterall
[14:39] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, go figure =/... after I promised myself I wouldn't be a mod.
[14:39] <ukscone> WASD_: as far as we know, we've not been told of any change in plans
[14:41] <WASD_> Sounds good. But from experience it seems that almost everything is always is delayed. Hopefully that won't be the case here
[14:41] <ukscone> ShiftPlusOne: you need to go troll hunting now then. although that would cut down the number of forum members to about 50 :)
[14:42] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh, Liz is going for a friendly, welcoming forum regardless of how stupid someone is.
[14:43] <WASD_> Its sometimes hard to tell stupid people from trolls. And you dont want to accuse someone for trolling when they may just be stupid
[14:43] <ReggieUK> WASD_, we can only go by the information they give us, despite hackadays best efforts we know that they exist as alpha boards, they're currently roaming the planet showing them to people, we're getting demo vids of them running 'things', so far everything is as they say it is
[14:45] <WASD_> I used to play WoW and everything was always delayed, hence I'm having doubts about target dates.
[14:45] <ukscone> ShiftPlusOne: and a sheepfree zone too?
[14:46] <ShiftPlusOne> and to think I've been going easy on you 'cause you're having a bad day >=/
[14:46] <ukscone> ah but i haven't posted anything on the forum today (well only 3 or 4) and you have no power here bwahahahahahahhaha
[14:47] <ShiftPlusOne> huh? I wasn't talking about moderating.
[14:47] <ukscone> ah ok
[14:48] <ukscone> told you i was having a bad day
[14:48] <ukscone> the meds taste vile too and the coffee i made is horrible
[14:48] <ukscone> so i'm still being a bit dense
[14:51] <ukscone> bloody leech. someone just complete the vm torrent d/l and they didn't join the swarm as a seed
[14:53] <ShiftPlusOne> looks like obarthelemy was added as a mod as well =)
[14:56] <ukscone> yup
[14:57] <ukscone> not sure what TZ he's in but it's def. not usa, i suspect somewhere GMT+1
[14:57] <ukscone> so you cover the nights in the uk and he covers the rest of the day :)
[15:00] <ShiftPlusOne> well 'night
[15:07] <ukscone> night
[15:07] <ukscone> don't let the bedsheep bite
[15:19] <ReggieUK> ha
[15:33] <ahven> ah, night in the US :P
[15:35] <ahven> I have GMT+2 or 3, they change it too often and it's 16:35 atm
[15:36] <ahven> I don't understand why US still uses am and pm - it's so simple with 24 hours
[15:37] <WASD_> ahven: agreed
[15:37] <WASD_> I think you have GMT+3 now
[15:38] <WASD_> I'm in sweden and the clock is 15:38
[15:38] <ahven> probably yes
[15:38] <WASD_> I think we have GMT 2 and 3 depending on summertime
[15:39] <ukscone> well i don't knpow why anyone uses timezones anyway
[15:39] <ukscone> we all know the world revolves around me so we should use UTC
[15:39] <ukscone> Ukscone Time Coordinates
[15:39] <WASD_> haha
[15:39] <WASD_> timezones are so stupid
[15:40] <WASD_> EST, CEST, PST, UTC, GMT
[15:40] <WASD_> too many confusing names
[15:40] <ahven> wait, UTC=Coordinated Universal Time, why not CUT then? doesn't sound so good? :P
[15:40] <WASD_> there got to be a more logical solution
[15:40] <ukscone> ahven: because it's the french's fault
[15:41] <ukscone> they put words int he wrong order
[15:41] <ahven> unix time!
[15:42] <WASD_> unix timestamp or stardate is good
[15:42] <ukscone> all the people i know say universal time coordinates although it's "official" name is the coordinated unitversal time" because they translated it to french and then back again
[15:42] <WASD_> or perhaps not
[15:44] <ahven> WASD_: too early, works through 2323 and 2423 :D
[15:44] <ahven> to*
[15:45] <WASD_> I see
[15:45] <WASD_> 32bit unix timestamp ends 2032 or something
[15:45] <ahven> yep
[15:45] <WASD_> the universe would end before if it was 64bit
[15:46] <WASD_> IIRC
[15:49] * WASD_ (~WASD@78-82-251-253.tn.glocalnet.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[15:49] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@pool-96-242-229-98.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:49] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@pool-96-242-229-98.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Changing host)
[15:49] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:50] <IT_Sean> Morning
[15:52] <ahven> ello
[15:53] <ukscone> morning IT_Sean
[15:57] <IT_Sean> How goe sit?
[15:57] <IT_Sean> *goes it?
[16:01] <ahven> got a debian rootfs ready in it's bare form
[16:01] <ahven> thinking of what to do now :)
[16:05] * IT_Sean grumbes at the lack of good televison today, and pops a DVD in
[16:09] <ahven> the only watchable thing is F1 on tv atm
[16:09] <ukscone> IT_Sean: you mean you aren't going to do your patriotic duty and watch the 9/11 memorial like a good american?
[16:09] <IT_Sean> No. I am not.
[16:10] <ukscone> my lazyness actually saved my life that day
[16:10] <ukscone> i decided to have another half hour cat napping on the sofa rather than being whrre i shoudl be
[16:10] <ukscone> i.e. in the WTC
[16:12] <ahven> and you remind your wife every time when she calls you lazy? :)
[16:12] <ukscone> yup pretty much
[16:12] <ukscone> i missed a few things like that by pure fluke
[16:13] <ukscone> didn't get squished by a tree in the 1987 uk hurricane because my boss pissed me off so i told him to go **** himself i'd do it when i felt like it and missed the kings cross fire because someone had moved my modem cabel from my desk
[16:13] <ahven> imho WTC was just precision demolitions with planes added as a "cause" to these towers coming down :P
[16:14] <ukscone> ahven: and is the world run by alien lizards?
[16:16] <ahven> ofcourse :P
[16:17] <ukscone> ahven: now i know what your real name is :) david icke :)
[16:17] <ahven> well, I'll leave my views to myself then, this laptops keyboard isn't comfortable also for much text :P
[16:17] <ukscone> :p
[16:22] <ahven> one thing about cool chips is providing heat in the winter, when using raspi as an outdoor device
[16:22] <ahven> overclock it? :P
[16:23] <ahven> a light bulb seems a better choice, I imagine
[16:25] <ahven> 2nd gen raspi wishes topic has some good ideas too
[16:25] <ahven> I like the usb headers idea
[16:34] <ukscone> http://youtu.be/u47ffjxbjYk wow didn't think that was possible with an rc car
[16:37] <ahven> pretty long slides :)
[16:45] <ukscone> i didn't think the car would have enough weight for controlled drifting
[16:46] <ukscone> the wet is probably helping but still
[16:46] <ukscone> they slide allover the place normally but i know i can't control how it skids
[16:49] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@adsl-75-16-237-76.dsl.kntpin.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:51] * neil (~neil@CPE-144-131-91-188.lns2.cht.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[16:54] <ahven> I want a fuel powered rc plane in a long run, when I have actually time to deal with it
[16:55] <ahven> + spare money for it too :P
[17:23] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@adsl-75-16-237-76.dsl.kntpin.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: And therefore, dye this sky red. The time has come again for my body to only go forward / Even the 'people' who pass by and the 'things' which become lost in confusion / Will one day be like vanished memories)
[17:24] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@adsl-75-16-237-76.dsl.kntpin.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:25] * PaulW (~PaulW@CPE001310360dac-CM001e6b0f7310.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:26] * WASD_ (~WASD@78-82-251-253.tn.glocalnet.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:36] <- *WASD_* hello
[17:37] <- *WASD_* ';DROP TABLE messages;--
[17:39] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@adsl-75-16-237-76.dsl.kntpin.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:09] * IT_Sean_ (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:12] * IT_Sean_ looks around
[18:13] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@wireless.sit-co.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:14] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-71-194-107-12.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[18:23] * IT_Sean_ (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: !)
[18:27] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@wireless.sit-co.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[18:39] <- *WASD_* <b>hehe I am in the logs</b>
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[19:48] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5ac9ad39.bb.sky.com) Quit ()
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[20:46] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5ac9ad39.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:58] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@wireless.sit-co.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[21:19] <ahven> boo
[21:30] <IT_Sean> ack!
[21:33] <ahven> some people have trouble reading the FAQ and the forum :P
[21:34] <WASD_> I've read both!
[21:34] <ahven> :)
[21:36] <ahven> bah, really should have bought some liquid from the store while I had the chance
[21:37] <WASD_> I'm still wondering about SD card speed and size limitations
[21:37] <ahven> it should be ok to 32
[21:37] <WASD_> havnt found anything about that
[21:37] <WASD_> I'm probably getting 4gb, so speed limits is my primary question
[21:37] <ahven> theoretically 64 should work, as I remember
[21:38] <ahven> atleast it runs on a dedicated bus :)
[21:38] <WASD_> My local store sells 15gb/s and 20gb/s
[21:38] <ahven> megabits you mean :)
[21:38] <WASD_> oh yeah :P
[21:38] <WASD_> megabyte actually
[21:38] <ahven> yep, my bad on that
[21:40] <WASD_> So do you have any idea about speed limitations?
[21:40] <ahven> that I haven't read out from the forums
[21:41] <WASD_> I have a cheap 4gb card at home
[21:41] <WASD_> but I may buy an SDHC EXTREME HD VIDEO card that can get up to 20MB/s
[21:42] <ahven> "We're still haggling over what SD card reader to use (every penny counts at this stage) - I may be able to let you know sometime next week if we've made a final decision."
[21:42] <ahven> by liz
[21:42] <ahven> and that was August 31
[21:42] <WASD_> sounds good
[21:42] <WASD_> I feel that im starting to plan too early :P
[21:42] <ahven> we all are :D
[21:42] <WASD_> I have a personal document already with 45 lines of text
[21:43] <ahven> the production board draft isn't finalized yet, as I have understood
[21:43] <WASD_> yeah me too
[21:43] <WASD_> we've only seen alpha boards so far
[21:45] <ahven> if they would tell us the bitrate of the video in the blogpost, we would atleast know the minimum speed :)
[21:45] <ahven> it was 1080p, but what exactly
[21:46] <WASD_> I'm still unsure about cooling
[21:46] * ReimuHakurei (~kudo@wireless.sit-co.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:46] <WASD_> someone said it wasnt heated at all after 10 hours of video
[21:47] <ahven> yep, same with q3 :)
[21:47] <WASD_> but if you build a chassi you would need at least some holes in it
[21:47] <ahven> your mobile doesn't have them :)
[21:47] <WASD_> yeah
[21:47] <WASD_> true
[21:47] <WASD_> but my mobile doesnt render 1080p video
[21:47] <WASD_> some iphones got overheated
[21:48] <WASD_> at least phones have thick casing
[21:48] <ahven> " At the point this video was taken, this demo had been running for about 8 hours. I was busily getting attendees to feel the SoC, to emphasise the fact that it only draws 1W, staying surprisingly cool."
[21:48] <WASD_> sounds really promising
[21:49] <WASD_> lol http://www.raspberrypi.org/?page_id=43&mingleforumaction=viewtopic&t=467
[21:50] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[21:51] <ahven> I would think that the SD card slot would have to support minimum of class 6 (6 MB/s)
[21:51] <WASD_> I think thats what I have at home now
[21:52] <ahven> but I hope atleast class 10
[21:52] <WASD_> how fast is that?
[21:52] <WASD_> 10mb/s?
[21:52] <ahven> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital#Speed_Class_Rating
[21:52] <ahven> yep
[21:52] <ahven> check the table below
[21:52] <WASD_> those are not SDHC i suppose?
[21:53] <WASD_> 6MB/s seems quite slow when booting
[21:54] <WASD_> compared to harddrives
[21:54] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) Quit (Quit: kthxbai)
[21:55] <WASD_> my local store sells SDHC EXTREME PRO cards that says 45mb/s
[21:56] <WASD_> I cant find any x on them like that table talks about
[21:57] <ahven> usually they have class ratings, IF they have anything
[21:57] <ahven> I *think* x rating comes after class 10
[21:57] <WASD_> http://www.inet.se/files/img/max/5305661_0.png
[21:58] <WASD_> looks like class 4 from that icon
[21:58] <ahven> err, yeah
[21:58] <WASD_> and 15MB/s
[21:59] <WASD_> So i don't get how it works
[21:59] <ahven> benchmark it? :)
[22:00] <ahven> with a okish cardreader ofcourse
[22:00] <ahven> I would believe that class 4 a bit more
[22:00] <ahven> they are pretty common atm, for their cheap price
[22:01] <WASD_> I guess I'll have to wait until they decide which SD-reader to use
[22:02] <WASD_> I will probably find my cheap card that I have fast enough, if not i'll buy a faster one if the r-pi supports it
[22:05] <WASD_> I wonder how quickly they will go out of stock :P
[22:07] <ahven> I will put my money ready the moment they show me the production board ready
[22:31] <WASD_> 256mb ram isnt very much, and ram is very cheap today
[22:32] <ahven> well, it is still meant as a learning platform, can't forget that
[22:33] <ahven> I think the amount of memory is enough, run little daemons in parallel or one huge thing in foreground
[22:33] <WASD_> yeah
[22:33] <WASD_> perhaps SWAP could be used
[22:34] <ahven> bye-bye SD then :)
[22:34] <WASD_> just 256mb swap or so
[22:34] * _0bitcount (~0bitcount@ has joined #raspberrypi
[22:35] <ahven> I wouldn't create one
[22:35] <WASD_> do you think it will run a minecraft server? I think java takes a lot of ram, and it will probably only be able to support a few players
[22:35] <WASD_> I won't use swap either
[22:36] <ahven> probably will run, but since the server and the client actually uses java
[22:37] <ahven> you should try out minetest
[22:37] <ahven> written in C
[22:37] <ahven> okay :)
[22:37] <ahven> "If you have less than 1024MB RAM, the above line may cause problems with swapping and out of memory conditions, which makes the game hard to play."
[22:38] <WASD_> I'm just talking about the server
[22:39] <ahven> well, I'm reading the server part, it can be still put in bounds with parameters
[22:39] <ahven> run it on a pc and put a max memory limit of 200, whatever is left to the OS when it boots up
[22:40] <WASD_> arch uses less than that :P
[22:40] <WASD_> I think i had 35mb ram usage
[22:40] <WASD_> when i tried in a virtualbox
[22:40] <WASD_> but 200 is good for testing
[22:40] <ahven> still, minecraft it runs through java
[22:40] <WASD_> doesnt those 200 include java itself you mean?
[22:41] <ahven> java -Xms32M -Xmx512M -jar minecraft_server.jar nogui
[22:41] <ahven> The parameter controls how much memory is reserved on startup. Your server will start with 32MB RAM and whenever it needs more memory it will allocate some until it reaches the maximum of 512M. However, this will result in a little slowdown whenever the allocation is done.
[22:42] <ahven> the most memory is when you don't have framebuffer enabled, as I have understood
[22:43] <ahven> details will be found out when the devices are in the hands of the people :)
[22:43] <ahven> don't know about cpu usage though
[22:44] <WASD_> if the memory is enough, the primary bottleneck would be the network speed
[22:44] <WASD_> unless you got a fast internet or run on LAN
[22:45] <WASD_> I probably wont be running a MC server anyways, just interested in if it will work
[22:46] <ahven> the wiki will be filled up quickly once the software hacking begins :)
[22:46] <WASD_> eah :)
[22:46] <WASD_> yeah*
[22:47] <WASD_> hopefully it will be released in late november as they say
[22:47] <WASD_> I used to play WoW, and everything was always delayed. So i dont trust target dates anymore
[22:48] <ahven> since they don't take preorders, money fact can be pretty much removed from the issues list
[22:48] <ahven> I just hope it happens this year :)
[22:48] <ahven> finance sounds better
[22:49] <WASD_> what do you mean by money fact?
[22:49] <WASD_> not sure how preorders affect the release date
[22:49] <ahven> well, they are funding their first batch themselves
[22:49] <ahven> not enough preorders = delay
[22:49] <ahven> for example
[22:49] <WASD_> ah
[22:50] <WASD_> Well I'm sure they will run out of stock quickly :D
[22:50] <WASD_> 1500 registered members on the forum already
[22:50] <WASD_> I suppose most of them are going to buy at least one
[22:50] <ahven> yep
[22:52] <ReggieUK> 2
[22:52] <ahven> I'm going to get B atleast, but maybe A too, for smaller things
[22:53] <ReggieUK> I want 2 Bs
[22:53] <WASD_> I think a large majority will get B
[22:59] <ahven> but ok, night time for me
[23:00] <ahven> haven't had any dreams about raspi yet:P
[23:01] <WASD_> haha
[23:01] * PaulW (~PaulW@CPE001310360dac-CM001e6b0f7310.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[23:16] * WASD_ (~WASD@78-82-251-253.tn.glocalnet.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)

These logs were automatically created by RaspberryPiBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.