#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2012-01-15

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:07] * Jaseman_ (5f93f1a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[0:07] * Jaseman (5f93f1a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[0:07] <Jaseman_> lost my connection
[0:08] <mrdragons> Whoop, I wrote a small binary clock, and it works perfectly. ^_^
[0:08] <Jaseman_> what's wrong with the one in the system tray?
[0:08] <mrdragons> System tray? What?
[0:08] * BarryK (5211f3ec@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[0:09] <mrdragons> Oh, you mean that little bar at the bottom on windows? It's not in binary. :P
[0:09] * victhor_ is now known as victhor
[0:09] <Jaseman_> i dnot even own a watch anymore
[0:09] <iMatttt> But WHY do you even want a binary clock?
[0:09] <Jaseman_> gave it up years ago
[0:09] * BarryK (5211f3ec@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[0:09] <mrdragons> For teh 1337ness
[0:10] <iMatttt> :D
[0:10] <mrdragons> And the 4x4 grid looks cool.
[0:10] <mrdragons> Which it's not yet
[0:10] <Jaseman_> isnt there anything more productive you could write?
[0:10] <mrdragons> Possibly
[0:11] <mrdragons> But I do this for fun, screw "being productive."
[0:11] <Jaseman_> do you program in python?
[0:11] * yang_ (yang@jazz.linuxshell.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:11] <mrdragons> Nope, good ole C.
[0:11] <mrdragons> Well, I do, but this is in C.
[0:12] <Jaseman_> i would like a small program which can write to a text file and pull text from a text file
[0:12] <mrdragons> That's easy
[0:12] <Jaseman_> and hold the text in a string array
[0:14] <mrdragons> Sounds kinda boring
[0:14] <Jaseman_> yeah its boring i suppose - but useful
[0:15] <Jaseman_> what i really want it to do is create html text files
[0:15] * yang_ (yang@jazz.linuxshell.org) Quit (Changing host)
[0:15] * yang_ (yang@freenode/sponsor/cacert.assurer.yang) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:15] <Jaseman_> and be able to edit them
[0:15] <Jaseman_> maybe it would pull a webpage in....
[0:15] <Jaseman_> extract some info from it
[0:15] <Jaseman_> and then paste it into another html page
[0:16] <mrdragons> ctrl+c, ctrl+v?
[0:16] <mrdragons> That'd be easier done in python
[0:16] <Jaseman_> no i want it automated
[0:16] <Jaseman_> so that when the website gets updated
[0:16] <mrdragons> Like something between certain tags?
[0:16] <Jaseman_> the other page is also
[0:16] <Jaseman_> yeah maybe something like that
[0:16] <Jaseman_> not even sure why i want that
[0:16] <Jaseman_> it just sounds cool to me
[0:17] <Jaseman_> maybe it will gather up certain info from a number of sites
[0:17] <Jaseman_> and pull the info together
[0:18] * Construct (~Construct@c-67-172-234-30.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:18] <Jaseman_> and then if you imagine....
[0:18] <Jaseman_> this webpage that is created is on the network
[0:18] <Jaseman_> lan network
[0:18] <Jaseman_> people can access that without pulling it straight from the web
[0:18] <Jaseman_> sort of like a proxy in a way
[0:19] <mrdragons> Like store the info gathered on a local server's html page, so that people wouldn't have to go into the dangers of the internet to get it?
[0:19] <Jaseman_> yeah
[0:20] <Jaseman_> or maybe.....
[0:20] <mrdragons> Doesn't sound too hard
[0:20] <Jaseman_> a way to get around some sort of block
[0:20] <Jaseman_> that is in place
[0:20] <Jaseman_> maybe website was blokced
[0:20] <Jaseman_> but this one machine isnt blocked
[0:20] <Jaseman_> so it can pass the info on
[0:21] <Jaseman_> i dont even know what its for
[0:21] <Jaseman_> i just like the idea
[0:21] <mrdragons> Pretty specific for not knowing what it's for.
[0:21] <Jaseman_> well i have no idea what websites it might be
[0:22] <Jaseman_> it might end up being some kind of search engine
[0:22] <Jaseman_> pulling in pages and looking for keywords
[0:23] <Jaseman_> its just one of my many crazy ideas
[0:23] <Jaseman_> how about.....
[0:23] <Jaseman_> a chat bot...
[0:23] <Jaseman_> which when you speak to it
[0:23] <mrdragons> So this would run on the machine that's not blocked, which would go out and get some info between a certain class on a certain website(s), then put them into one html file to be served to the network?
[0:24] <Jaseman_> it searches the web for a similar phrase and finds a suitable answer
[0:24] <mrdragons> Already done
[0:24] <Jaseman_> yeah
[0:25] <Jaseman_> in a way the program would steal info
[0:25] <Jaseman_> and pass it off as its own
[0:26] <Jaseman_> the whole blocked thing isnt really important....
[0:26] <Jaseman_> on our work network nothing is blocked
[0:26] <Jaseman_> apart from certain ports
[0:26] <Jaseman_> but no web pages are blocked
[0:27] <jojo> except web pages on blocked ports
[0:27] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:27] <Jaseman_> okay here's another way of looking at it
[0:27] <Jaseman_> say youve got a corporate intranet
[0:27] <Jaseman_> but that intranet sucks
[0:28] <Jaseman_> and you cant find anything on it
[0:28] <Jaseman_> because its all over the place
[0:28] <Jaseman_> so you want to pull certain bits of it into one page
[0:28] <Jaseman_> and if those bits get updated
[0:28] <Jaseman_> your page also gets updated
[0:29] <Jaseman_> its a bit like having an advanced iframe
[0:29] <Jaseman_> but you have more control over how its displayed
[0:30] <Jaseman_> and you can filter bits out
[0:30] <mrdragons> Okay, and then I suppose you also want it to have a simple config file where you can specify which hosts you want to get data from and from between what tags or key words or something?
[0:30] <Jaseman_> that would make sense....
[0:30] <Jaseman_> then it could be customized for other purposes
[0:31] * smjms (~janne@dyn2-212-50-133-158.psoas.suomi.net) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[0:31] <mrdragons> I suppose I could try and make something
[0:31] <Jaseman_> dont feel you have to
[0:32] <Jaseman_> im just saying it MIGHT be something useful
[0:32] <mrdragons> I've been meaning to write something similar to get code from pastebin and store it
[0:32] <Jaseman_> i think the whole idea of it is....
[0:33] <Jaseman_> making the computer do some of the work which you might have to do manually otherwise
[0:33] <Jaseman_> it plucks things out of web pages
[0:33] <Jaseman_> and shoves it into new pages
[0:33] * Martix (~martix@4.177.broadband3.iol.cz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:34] <piofcube> A pie and mash bot? LOL
[0:34] * Martix (~martix@4.177.broadband3.iol.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:34] <mrdragons> Should the "plucked" data be put in separate files, or in one big conglomerate file?
[0:35] <Jaseman_> one big one i think
[0:35] <Jaseman_> well you might have several instances of it
[0:35] <Jaseman_> sending info to different files
[0:36] <mrdragons> That'd be a really simple script actually.
[0:36] * _ross (~ross@188-221-247-176.zone12.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:37] <Jaseman_> would it be useful though?
[0:37] <Jaseman_> more than a binary clock
[0:37] <mrdragons> Hey
[0:37] <mrdragons> Heyheyhey
[0:37] <mrdragons> Binary clocks are awesome
[0:38] <Jaseman_> why didnt you just download one
[0:38] <mrdragons> Because I can make one
[0:38] <Jaseman_> reinventing the wheel
[0:38] <Jaseman_> heres another idea.....
[0:38] <mrdragons> How so? What if I make a wheel I like more?
[0:39] <mrdragons> I can customize this to fit whatever I want.
[0:39] <Jaseman_> you subscribe to this 'thing'
[0:39] <Jaseman_> like a channel
[0:39] * Martix (~martix@4.177.broadband3.iol.cz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:39] <Jaseman_> which downloads torrents
[0:39] <Jaseman_> so some person picks a list of cool torrents
[0:39] * Martix (~martix@4.177.broadband3.iol.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:40] <Jaseman_> and you just trust that its going to download some stuff that you will want
[0:40] <Jaseman_> its like.....
[0:40] <Jaseman_> people who dont know anything about computers
[0:40] <Jaseman_> but they would like the top 40 albums
[0:41] <Jaseman_> and the latest movies
[0:41] <Jaseman_> so they click something
[0:41] <Jaseman_> and it downloads them all and then says hey you...
[0:41] <Jaseman_> ive got this and this and this for you to look at
[0:41] <jojo> are your fingers not getting tired
[0:41] <Jaseman_> and you then either watch it or delete it
[0:41] <Jaseman_> a little yes
[0:42] <mrdragons> Why don't you program it yourself?
[0:42] <Jaseman_> because im extremely lazy
[0:42] * _ross (~ross@188-221-247-176.zone12.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:42] <Jaseman_> and not good at programming
[0:43] <Jaseman_> im good at having the ideas
[0:43] <mrdragons> Well then get better a programming. :P
[0:43] <Jaseman_> but not good at putting them into practice
[0:43] <ReggieUK> from the 1/2 page I've just read, you're not even that good at ideas
[0:43] <Jaseman_> lol thanks!
[0:43] <ReggieUK> LOL welcome!
[0:44] <Jaseman_> its off the top of my head
[0:44] * victhor_ (~victhor@ has joined #raspberrypi
[0:44] <Jaseman_> you come up with an idea then mr hot shot
[0:44] <BarryK> feeds for torrents have been around for a while
[0:44] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Disconnected by services)
[0:44] * victhor_ is now known as victhor
[0:44] <Jaseman_> i see
[0:44] <ReggieUK> why do I need to come up with an idea for anything? your the one that claims he's good at ideas
[0:44] <hamitron> semi-automatic rocket to the moon would be cool
[0:44] <BarryK> the real fun comes when you try to automate the cleanup of the files afterwards lol
[0:44] <ReggieUK> you're*
[0:45] <ReggieUK> hamitron, nasa did that already
[0:45] <BarryK> lots and lots of string manipulation with regex
[0:45] <hamitron> ReggieUK, not with the name "hamitron" on the side ;)
[0:45] <Jaseman_> okay then.......
[0:45] <Jaseman_> voice recognition for video files
[0:46] <Jaseman_> so you play a movie
[0:46] * abacus1983 (~abacus198@cpc2-smal5-0-0-cust1292.perr.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:46] <Jaseman_> and get a text file of the script
[0:46] <BarryK> like vox commander
[0:46] <BarryK> ah ok you mean for subs
[0:46] <ReggieUK> why not just extract the subtitles
[0:46] <Jaseman_> because this is a home movie
[0:46] <hamitron> or listen? ;/
[0:46] <Jaseman_> because youve been filing your entire life
[0:46] <Jaseman_> filming it
[0:47] <ReggieUK> you're changing the goalposts as you go along
[0:47] <hamitron> no I haven't
[0:47] <hamitron> :|
[0:47] * abacus1983 (~abacus198@cpc2-smal5-0-0-cust1292.perr.cable.virginmedia.com) has left #raspberrypi
[0:47] <Jaseman_> and then after you die
[0:47] <ReggieUK> you just said video files, so you play a movie
[0:47] <Jaseman_> okay.....
[0:47] <Jaseman_> you film your day
[0:47] <Jaseman_> during the day time
[0:47] <Jaseman_> then when youre asleep that days film gets turned to text
[0:47] <Jaseman_> so every conversation is there
[0:48] <Jaseman_> then later on when you die...
[0:48] <ReggieUK> I've had 3 conversations this week
[0:48] <Jaseman_> your great grandchildren can have a conversation with you
[0:48] <Jaseman_> based on things you said when you were alive
[0:48] <mrdragons> That'd be weird.
[0:48] <Jaseman_> sort of like in superman
[0:49] <Jaseman_> when he talks to his dead dad
[0:49] <mrdragons> Is cleverbot open source?
[0:49] <jojo> take a class on articifial intelligence
[0:49] <mrdragons> ^^
[0:49] <ReggieUK> would just be easier for me to
[0:50] <ReggieUK> ignore that :D
[0:50] * Rob_ (~Rob@li299-28.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:50] <haltdef> :o
[0:51] <mrdragons> Meh I'm bored, back to programming a clock
[0:51] <Jaseman_> i wont need to translate my life from video
[0:51] <jojo> ...and then either lower your expectations or make some world-class breakthroughs
[0:51] <Jaseman_> ive already typed it in here
[0:51] <Jaseman_> also the reality is....
[0:51] <Jaseman_> your grandchildren wont give a crap what your opinion might be
[0:52] <Jaseman_> or great grandchildren
[0:52] * abacus1983 (~abacus198@cpc2-smal5-0-0-cust1292.perr.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:52] <ReggieUK> so your video translation idea is not good then?
[0:52] <Jaseman_> no its very bad
[0:52] <Jaseman_> there you feel better now
[0:52] <Jaseman_> i guess youre one of those people that likes to put an idea down
[0:52] <ReggieUK> so my theory on yu not being good at ideas has been proven?
[0:53] <ReggieUK> no I like ideas, I like good ones
[0:53] <Jaseman_> im not good at anything
[0:53] <Jaseman_> apart from spouting garbage
[0:53] * ^robertj (~Rob@97-81-71-34.dhcp.athn.ga.charter.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[0:53] <abacus1983> helloooo
[0:53] <ReggieUK> well, sooner or later you may hit a nugget
[0:53] <Jaseman_> sure...
[0:53] <Jaseman_> what about....
[0:54] <Jaseman_> a device that googles everything you hear
[0:54] <Jaseman_> in realtime
[0:54] <ReggieUK> for what purpose?
[0:54] <Jaseman_> say someone asks you a question
[0:54] <Jaseman_> oull have the answer immediately
[0:54] <Jaseman_> or.....
[0:54] <jojo> feed info into headsup display etc
[0:54] <Jaseman_> someones name is mentioned
[0:54] <ReggieUK> the amount of information that would be thrown at you constantly would just be too much to take in and disseminate
[0:54] <jojo> been proposed already
[0:55] <Jaseman_> and yuo get their full bio
[0:55] <ReggieUK> individual questions maybe ok but again, you've got to evaluate what is crap and what is good information
[0:55] <Jaseman_> maybe the software would do that too
[0:55] <jojo> main problem would be getting accurate speech recognition from multiple sources in noisy environments
[0:55] <mrdragons> Otherwise you'll end up in a bing commercial. :P
[0:56] <ReggieUK> and google doesn't give a crap about quality, just who's highest in their ranking system
[0:56] <Jaseman_> maybe its linked to wikipedia
[0:56] <Jaseman_> instead of google
[0:56] <ReggieUK> but wikipedia despite what people think isn't the font of all knowledge
[0:56] <jojo> second problem is working out what info is useful
[0:57] <Jaseman_> im always lloking stuff up in mid conversation
[0:57] <Jaseman_> someone will mention something you never heard of
[0:57] <jojo> again, this would be cutting-edge AI if it existed
[0:57] <Jaseman_> so you google it
[0:57] <Jaseman_> like beowulf clusters
[0:57] <jojo> so this is really not the channel to discuss it
[0:58] <Jaseman_> yeah its off topic i suppose
[0:58] <Jaseman_> but there didnt seem to be any conversastion going on
[0:58] <Jaseman_> so anythings better than nothing
[0:58] <ReggieUK> phallacy
[0:58] * zgreg (greg@ has left #raspberrypi
[0:59] <ReggieUK> especially when you want a vacuum
[0:59] <Jaseman_> you remind me of orac
[0:59] <ReggieUK> ooh blakes 7
[1:00] <jojo> but if you want to talk about ai find an ai channel
[1:00] <jojo> or if you want to talk about raspi then do
[1:00] <Jaseman_> ai on the raspberry
[1:01] * Jarii (~Jarii@host96-165-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit (Quit: I forgot how to forget)
[1:01] <abacus1983> are the pi's gonna be capable of using an external dvd drive on
[1:01] <RITRedbeard> I hope disk media dies a quick and graceful death
[1:02] <Jaseman_> im with you there
[1:02] <RITRedbeard> waiting for them to start releasing software in DVD cases as ROM SDcards
[1:02] <Jaseman_> i hate optical disc
[1:02] <Jaseman_> but its a good question
[1:02] <abacus1983> true but i have one lying around so
[1:02] <RITRedbeard> if you have the proper drivers for USB DVD-ROM yes
[1:02] <Jaseman_> because the sd card might be limited
[1:02] <abacus1983> ah k cool
[1:03] <Jaseman_> i would imagine linux will detect it
[1:03] <abacus1983> i would think so to
[1:03] <Jaseman_> does it come with 1 usb port or two?
[1:03] <Jaseman_> the pi
[1:03] <abacus1983> two
[1:04] * ratxue_ is now known as ratxue
[1:04] <Jaseman_> ok so you should be ok then
[1:04] <Jaseman_> im thinking logitech wireless keyboard and mouse
[1:04] <hamitron> won't it need seperate power?
[1:05] <Jaseman_> so one port to cover both
[1:05] <abacus1983> yep would he nice to use a bluetooth dongle and use one of apples nice bluetooth keyboards
[1:05] <Jaseman_> the usb port will provice some power
[1:06] <Jaseman_> i would guess
[1:06] <hamitron> but is "some" enough?
[1:06] <abacus1983> i would imagine so
[1:06] <Jaseman_> we'll find out soon enough
[1:06] <hamitron> true
[1:06] <hamitron> :)
[1:06] <abacus1983> hmmm what about a powered usb hub aswell
[1:07] <Jaseman_> well there will be so many wires coming out the thing
[1:07] <abacus1983> lol
[1:07] <Jaseman_> i would like to minimize the wires
[1:07] <hamitron> could make an addon board ;)
[1:07] <abacus1983> yeah an addon board would be cool
[1:07] <Jaseman_> i would share a cd rom on the network
[1:08] <Jaseman_> so you can access it that way
[1:08] <abacus1983> will we be ok to use usb hdd as i got a mini 60gb one here
[1:08] <Jaseman_> rather than direct connection
[1:09] <hamitron> usb hdd could have the same problem as a cdrom
[1:09] <abacus1983> true
[1:09] <Jaseman_> you can get NAS adapters that will probably run a cd rom drive
[1:09] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:09] <Jaseman_> over the network
[1:09] <abacus1983> but as metioned above linux may be ok for drivers
[1:09] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:09] <PiBot> IT_Sean| Wahey! Sean is here! :D
[1:10] <Jaseman_> i would make an iso file
[1:10] <Jaseman_> of the dvd
[1:10] <Jaseman_> and mount it
[1:10] <Jaseman_> if you have space to store the iso somewhere that's accessible
[1:11] <Jaseman_> like on a 1.5tb 2.5" hard drive
[1:11] <victhor> PiBot, you suck.
[1:11] <victhor> :P
[1:11] <Jaseman_> is this for movie dvd
[1:11] <abacus1983> nice
[1:11] <Jaseman_> or data
[1:11] * nils_2 (~weechat@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7-dev)
[1:12] <abacus1983> data
[1:12] <Jaseman_> i think the raspberry pi will be in truoble if it cant read in a usb hard drive or a pen drive
[1:12] <abacus1983> yep
[1:12] <Jaseman_> i mean for me that would be a major drawback
[1:13] <Jaseman_> i use my usb hard drive every day
[1:13] <abacus1983> true mine r always with me
[1:13] <hamitron> can you boot the pi over the network?
[1:13] <abacus1983> xmbc looks cool tho
[1:13] <Jaseman_> i dont think you can
[1:13] <Jaseman_> network boot it
[1:13] <Jaseman_> but not sure
[1:14] <Jaseman_> i would guess the answer is no
[1:14] <hamitron> shame
[1:14] <Jaseman_> unless you can find a clever way to do it
[1:14] <Jaseman_> by tricking it
[1:14] <hamitron> could probably put something on the SD
[1:14] <hamitron> but I'm been cheap here ;)
[1:14] <Jaseman_> i see where you're coming from
[1:15] * spiderdijon (~spider@spiderdijon.irconan.co.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[1:15] <Jaseman_> pulling resources from the network
[1:16] <abacus1983> i wonder if back track can be ported to it
[1:16] <Jaseman_> ive never known so much speculation
[1:16] <Jaseman_> over the imminent release of a small board
[1:16] <abacus1983> lol
[1:17] <Jaseman_> i think everyone got that madness over it
[1:17] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:17] <Jaseman_> lots of expectation
[1:17] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Client Quit)
[1:17] <Jaseman_> i think we all just 'get the concept' of it
[1:18] <Jaseman_> and thats maybe more important than the actual device
[1:18] <abacus1983> yep
[1:18] <hamitron> I'm torn between 4 or 5 different boards atm
[1:18] <hamitron> :/
[1:18] <Jaseman_> spoilt for choice
[1:18] <hamitron> yeh
[1:18] <Jaseman_> i ahve that problem all the time
[1:19] <hamitron> suppose I need to decide what I really need it for, first
[1:19] <hamitron> :D
[1:19] * NIN101 (~NIN101@2001:530::216:3cff:fe71:5e1e) Quit (Quit: NIN101)
[1:19] <Jaseman_> mobile phones - how the hell do you pick one?
[1:19] <hamitron> I don't have one
[1:19] <hamitron> ;)
[1:19] <hamitron> a mobile phone I mean
[1:19] <hamitron> ;/
[1:19] <Jaseman_> choice is good though...
[1:19] <Jaseman_> it drives competition
[1:20] <Jaseman_> i just wish there were always only 3 choices
[1:20] <Jaseman_> think i could handle that
[1:20] <abacus1983> i am just glad there scrapping crappy ICT
[1:20] <Jaseman_> entry level mid range and expensive
[1:21] <hamitron> I think it would be a mistake to teach everyone coding and how comps work still
[1:21] <Jaseman_> im dissillusioned with the whole education system
[1:21] <hamitron> plenty would be better working on the basic mathematical skills ;)
[1:21] <abacus1983> yeah would be scary due to how clever kids are these days but its better tjan learning excel
[1:22] <Jaseman_> well office skills are important
[1:22] <hamitron> I'd argue excel is more use, than assembly or C
[1:22] <hamitron> for most people
[1:22] <hamitron> ;)
[1:22] <Jaseman_> i have to assist people everyday with questions about either outlook, word or excel
[1:22] <abacus1983> yeah they are important but easier to learn in ur own time
[1:23] <mrdragons> Most people never use assembly or C, so yeah, probably
[1:23] <Jaseman_> i think you should learn everything in your own time
[1:23] <Jaseman_> and pick your own cyllabus
[1:23] <abacus1983> ill second that
[1:23] <hamitron> we do after school, don't we? ;)
[1:24] <Jaseman_> nothing worst than being forced to learn something you ahve no interest in
[1:24] <abacus1983> that is true
[1:24] <Jaseman_> if you need to know something out of necessity....
[1:24] <Jaseman_> then you will learn that anyway
[1:24] <mrdragons> Not necessarily, but yeah
[1:25] <abacus1983> anyways bye for now i need some sleep
[1:25] <mrdragons> Night yo
[1:25] <Jaseman_> goodnight
[1:25] <Jaseman_> me too
[1:25] * abacus1983 (~abacus198@cpc2-smal5-0-0-cust1292.perr.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:25] <hamitron> nn abacus1983
[1:25] <hamitron> nn Jaseman_
[1:25] <hamitron> not hardcore enough ;)
[1:25] <Jaseman_> i think this raspi project has been successful in bringing together a certain group of people
[1:26] <mrdragons> Definately, but it seems to be two distinct groups
[1:26] <Jaseman_> which are?
[1:26] <jojo> nutters and hardcore nutters
[1:26] <hamitron> haha
[1:26] <Jaseman_> lol
[1:26] <mrdragons> :P
[1:27] <ReggieUK> :)
[1:27] <ReggieUK> well observed
[1:27] <hamitron> cheap gits expecting everything for not much, and geeks?
[1:27] <mrdragons> Imo, the "hacker" types, and the people that want to learn from it
[1:27] <Jaseman_> well what i see is.......
[1:27] <ReggieUK> there's nothing wrong with excel etc. per se, it's just that when that's the only choice, you're screwed if you had an aptitude for programming
[1:28] <Jaseman_> the two types are positive people who encourange you
[1:28] <mrdragons> More towards what hamitron said. :P
[1:28] <Jaseman_> and the other type are the ones that only put you down
[1:28] <ReggieUK> at the moment our education system churns out people that can work on microsoft products
[1:28] <ReggieUK> we need them to also be able to write microsofts products
[1:28] <mrdragons> Microsoft doesn't want that
[1:28] <BarryK> yeah but that nonsense about use android and kinect SDKs is equally unproductive
[1:28] * hamitron refuses to use android
[1:29] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:29] <Jaseman_> after pi there wont be a microsoft
[1:29] <ReggieUK> of course there will :)
[1:29] <hamitron> pi is only slightly more than 3.11
[1:29] <BarryK> there's no point in making every 16 year old take a programming class because it'll end up being so watered down it'll stop being relevant
[1:29] <hamitron> :/
[1:29] <ReggieUK> but the difference will be that in 10years or 5years we'll hopefully be churning out the next google style entrepreneur
[1:29] <Jaseman_> every now and then....
[1:30] <hamitron> BarryK, exactly
[1:30] <Jaseman_> somehthing comes along that blows everything else away
[1:30] <BarryK> ReggieUK no we wont
[1:30] <Jaseman_> im hoping raspberry will be that thing
[1:30] <ReggieUK> I don't necessarily think we should be getting all kids to do programming
[1:30] <hamitron> I remember choosing electronics for GCSE, and now I've completed it all at uni..... nothing worth learning really :/
[1:30] <BarryK> by teaching a few hello world apps with high level sdks?
[1:30] <ReggieUK> ICT is valid for some
[1:30] <ReggieUK> just not all
[1:30] <ReggieUK> so you need a choice
[1:30] <mrdragons> I think everyone should be able to write a couple scripts
[1:31] <hamitron> mrdragons, vb? ;)
[1:31] <Jaseman_> i think its just there and take it or leave it
[1:31] <ReggieUK> BarryK, I know I sound altruistic but you've got to sow the seeds somewhere
[1:31] <BarryK> there should be more than 1 computers class and you cant learn real computer science without learning the bloody science behind it
[1:31] <mrdragons> hamitron: At the very least, yeah.
[1:31] <Jaseman_> its such a vast subject
[1:32] <Jaseman_> you cant really capture it all under one heading
[1:32] <ReggieUK> of course but when the BBC was around it wasn't a vast subject in comparison, so you could easily concentrate on the important bits
[1:32] <ReggieUK> like the mcu
[1:32] <mrdragons> I mean, today, it's a very useful skill, and there's not much to it.
[1:32] <BarryK> should have a digital literacy course and a computer science course
[1:32] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[1:32] <hamitron> ReggieUK, and now even pro can't build it all by hand ;)
[1:33] <Jaseman_> its a funny question... how much shuld you know
[1:33] <BarryK> but the computer science course can't just neglect low level computing
[1:33] <ReggieUK> and from that point you were semi-equipped to pick up all the logic etc. that comes with learning all about computers
[1:33] <Jaseman_> i dont know how my video card works
[1:33] <Jaseman_> and i dont care
[1:33] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:33] <Jaseman_> just plug it in and it puts out video
[1:33] <mrdragons> Then, get bluntly, why are you here?
[1:33] <mrdragons> *Quite
[1:33] <mrdragons> How did I type get...?
[1:34] <Jaseman_> but i dont need to know everything about the workings of the video card
[1:34] <ReggieUK> probably a freudian slip
[1:34] <Jaseman_> or how to build an lcd screen
[1:34] <ReggieUK> was probably going to be GTFO
[1:34] <hamitron> I think it depends on your area tbh.... I know more about electronics and assembly.... highest level I go is C
[1:34] <hamitron> but a comp science grad will be more java and stuff
[1:34] <hamitron> sadly, can't do it all well :/
[1:34] <ReggieUK> well, being an ideas man, it's helpful if you understand how stuff works
[1:35] <Jaseman_> i cant tell you why i want a pi.....
[1:35] <mrdragons> you just seem to be so indifferent to everything lower-down than a gui, and put anyone down that wants to go further
[1:35] <Jaseman_> i just want one and have a feeling its something important
[1:35] <ReggieUK> then you can realise at an earlier stage whether your idea is feasible and whether you should unleash it on IRC
[1:35] <BarryK> yeah but thinking you're going to take all kids through some rudimentary programming class and it'll somehow magically fix our broken UK workforce is just a complete pipedream
[1:36] <Jaseman_> i dont think that is the objective
[1:36] <hamitron> BarryK, +1
[1:36] <BarryK> for a start they dont even have teachers qualified to teach the ICT class let alone programming
[1:36] <ReggieUK> not at all and I don't think it will magically fix the workforce
[1:36] <ReggieUK> but like I said, you've got to sow the seeds somewhere
[1:36] <Jaseman_> what they said was.....
[1:36] <Jaseman_> in the 80's we dabbled with programming
[1:37] <Jaseman_> but this generation are not doing it
[1:37] <BarryK> sow the seeds by encouraging manufacturing and electronics industry not some nonesense about reforming the ict class
[1:37] <Jaseman_> and its quite worrying
[1:37] <ReggieUK> they should be doing that as well
[1:37] <ReggieUK> not instead of
[1:37] <mrdragons> Yeah, I'm the only one I know in my high school that can program anything other than java and html
[1:37] <Jaseman_> they just go to the high street, but the laptop and use it
[1:37] <hamitron> Jaseman_, imo it is because they are lazy and have everything handed to them on a plate.... what they want. also, they stand no chance of creating something as good as the commercial offerings :(
[1:38] <Jaseman_> im not sure.....
[1:38] <Jaseman_> they just didnt have any introduction to it
[1:38] <mrdragons> Then again I haven't met a lot of the nerdier people in my school, but still
[1:38] <BarryK> i'd love to know where all these programmer/teachers are going to come from. especially given anyone I know who you would call a "programmer" doesn't get out of bed for that sort of money
[1:39] <Jaseman_> how do you think linux ever got made?
[1:39] <hamitron> teaching is ok money imo
[1:39] <Hopsy> hey do you guys have started a project?
[1:39] <Hopsy> for raspberry?
[1:39] <mrdragons> I don't think the foundation is aiming at schools necessarily though
[1:40] <hamitron> at the brain storm stage, most people :)
[1:40] <mrdragons> I do
[1:40] <Hopsy> I want to join the vcrue
[1:40] <Hopsy> crue*
[1:40] <Jaseman_> i think the foundation is just supplying the hardware
[1:40] <Jaseman_> and then leaving the community to get on with it
[1:40] <BarryK> I dont mean the foundation I mean that nonsense Gove has been raving about this week
[1:40] * nichobb (~nichobb@host86-144-52-213.range86-144.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:40] <ReggieUK> BarryK I don't think they've necessarily thought out the timescale well enough
[1:40] <mrdragons> ^Well, they did say they plan to have educational materials prepared in the future
[1:40] <ReggieUK> but it's a positive start
[1:41] <ReggieUK> especially given that we're constantly told there are no jobs for graduates
[1:41] <Jaseman_> i kind of like the amatuer-ness of it all
[1:41] <Jaseman_> the fact its not some huge corporation
[1:41] <BarryK> timescale? there is no timescale, they're stopping regulating the curriculum for ICT this year thats it there is no replacement. the schools decide themselves
[1:41] <Jaseman_> something i worry about is the availability of the broadcom chip in future
[1:42] <ReggieUK> Oh? I thought they were doing more than that :(
[1:42] <hamitron> we don't even teach basic woodwork skills now.... ;)
[1:42] <BarryK> its not that there are no jobs for grads, its that every job no requires a degree
[1:42] <hamitron> all AutoCAD
[1:42] <BarryK> no that was just rubbish for the press
[1:42] <Jaseman_> we are not a manufacturing nation any more
[1:42] <Jaseman_> service industries
[1:42] <BarryK> one big giant call centre
[1:42] <Jaseman_> we cant even manufacture the pi here
[1:43] <ReggieUK> so is this based on your opinion or is it written that they're just ditching ICT?
[1:43] <hamitron> we will have to manufacture in the future imo
[1:43] <Jaseman_> ive read from several sources...
[1:43] <Jaseman_> that ITC is being reshaped
[1:43] <BarryK> they're not ditching ICT, just no centralised revised curriculum for it
[1:44] <ReggieUK> so better schools will teach programming to brighter students that want to learn it and the local secondary school will churn out microsoft drones by the sounds of it?
[1:44] <BarryK> they're calling it a "Flexible-curriculum"
[1:44] <BarryK> if even that
[1:44] <Jaseman_> what would you propose they do instead?
[1:45] <hamitron> bring back the slipper
[1:45] <ReggieUK> my sons school is a of the latter kind but they seem very enthusiastic about the PI when my son has mentioned it to the techs
[1:45] <Jaseman_> lol
[1:45] <hamitron> or we talking about IT? :-o
[1:45] <BarryK> I pretty much agree with the royal society on it
[1:45] <BarryK> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16515275
[1:45] <ReggieUK> they were already aware of it
[1:46] <Jaseman_> i do quite respect the royal society
[1:46] <Jaseman_> and that says a lot because there are not many things i do respect
[1:46] <ReggieUK> I wonder how many ICT teachers trained in ICT just because it was more of a garuanteed job but would swap to coding based teaching given the opportunity?
[1:46] <BarryK> well it was prof. furber who designed the BBC micro that carried out the study
[1:46] * Hopsy (~kvirc@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[1:47] <hamitron> ReggieUK, in my experience, most of those that go into teaching only, are those that are not good enough for the industry
[1:47] <hamitron> so very few?
[1:47] <hamitron> :/
[1:47] <BarryK> http://royalsociety.org/education/policy/computing-in-schools/report/?f=1
[1:47] <BarryK> full report is there
[1:48] <hamitron> on the plus side, they won't have the time to teach the kids much on it.... will just be an introduction
[1:48] <Jaseman_> just rip up the curriculum and learn whatever you want
[1:48] <BarryK> but it was less that 1% of newly qualified teachers were qualified programmers/ from computer science bg
[1:48] <hamitron> so can maybe find enough teachers who can handle it
[1:49] <ReggieUK> indeed, I read the government report on the bbc, something like 3 out of 750 ICT teachers were programmers
[1:49] <Jaseman_> a lot of teachers dont really believe in what they are doing
[1:49] <Jaseman_> they are told what to teach and they just go about that
[1:49] <ReggieUK> not really surprised at that Jaseman_
[1:49] <hamitron> too busy worrying about getting most out of their pension ;D
[1:49] <BarryK> well its just 30 years ago having 1 comuters class was ok, now it's a joke
[1:49] <hamitron> aye :/
[1:49] <ReggieUK> there seems to be a general push to teach kids to not compete
[1:49] <ReggieUK> just be average
[1:49] <BarryK> *computers
[1:50] <Jaseman_> thats socialisim
[1:50] <ReggieUK> no it isn't
[1:50] <Jaseman_> just be average
[1:50] <ReggieUK> well, not by a socialist government if that's what you're suggesting
[1:50] <ReggieUK> no way labour gov. could be called socialist
[1:51] <Jaseman_> i dont blame the government for everything
[1:51] <hamitron> aren't all 3 parties socialist these days? ;)
[1:51] <Jaseman_> im talking about the general idea
[1:51] <ReggieUK> ahh, ok
[1:51] <Jaseman_> but it does seem that in the UK people are not encouraged to succeed
[1:52] <hamitron> indeed
[1:52] <hamitron> :/
[1:52] <Jaseman_> in fact we seem to put every obstacle in the way of those that try it
[1:52] <hamitron> get a nice car, someone runs a key down it.... all about kciking a person down.... not doing better yourself to "beat" them
[1:53] <Jaseman_> someone once said.....
[1:53] <ReggieUK> I thought it was at least encouraging that the government was recognising that we have issues with ICT
[1:53] <Jaseman_> you're either part of the solution or part of the problem
[1:53] <ReggieUK> and equally encouraging that they mention a project like the raspberry pi too
[1:54] * nichobb (~nichobb@host86-144-52-213.range86-144.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Quit: AndroIRC - Android IRC Client ( http://www.androirc.com ))
[1:54] * Laurenceb_ (~Laurence@host86-178-5-168.range86-178.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:54] <Jaseman_> the positive people that want to make things better are in the minority
[1:54] <Jaseman_> the leaches vastly outnumber them
[1:55] <Jaseman_> and outbreed them too
[1:55] <ReggieUK> well, hopefully all the negativity will die down a bit soon and everyone will stop panning ideas and actually discuss them instead of polarising around them
[1:55] <hamitron> government can only do so much atm imo.... we need to work on the pi and projects/tutorials to show its potential, and show new users what it CAN do
[1:56] <ReggieUK> hamitron, of course, I don't expect them to fix everything, just put opportunity in the right places
[1:56] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has left #raspberrypi
[1:56] <Jaseman_> it might turn out that it can do everything in a mediocre way
[1:56] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:56] <PiBot> ukscone| <ukscone> Dear Santa. I've been good all year...Well most of the year....Okay f**k it, i'll buy my own
[1:56] <IT_Sean> heh
[1:56] <ReggieUK> hehehe
[1:56] <ReggieUK> hi ukscone
[1:56] <ReggieUK> hi SEAN
[1:57] <IT_Sean> hey ukscone
[1:57] <Jaseman_> right im going to bed
[1:57] <Jaseman_> gnight
[1:57] <hamitron> time for last coffee I think
[1:57] <hamitron> nn Jaseman_
[1:57] <ukscone> hi ReggieUK
[1:57] <ReggieUK> gn Jaseman_
[1:57] <ukscone> hi IT_Sean
[1:58] <BarryK> gn Jaseman_
[1:58] * Jaseman_ (5f93f1a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[1:58] <ukscone> night grandpa night sue ellen night john boy
[2:00] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[2:08] * hamitron yawns
[2:08] <hamitron> gone all quiet now
[2:08] <hamitron> :/
[2:14] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit ()
[2:18] * BarryK (5211f3ec@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[2:28] <ReggieUK> I'm trying to find the answer to something
[2:28] <ReggieUK> but it's unlikely I'll find it here
[2:29] <ReggieUK> that's why I've gone quiet
[2:29] <mrdragons> Can't hurt to ask
[2:30] <ReggieUK> ok, I've got a celestron nexstar 6SE, I've found the supplied cable that connects to the handset but I've also got a 2nd db9 serial cable with a 6pin plug that seems to also fit the ST4 port, is this an ST4 cable, or is it an aux port cable?
[2:30] * ReggieUK goes back to googling
[2:30] <mrdragons> Hmm, yeah, I have no idea. :P
[2:31] <hamitron> maybe easier to check pins with multimeter?
[2:31] <hamitron> ;)
[2:31] <ReggieUK> not going to help right now
[2:32] <ReggieUK> can't find the pinout for db9 to st4 or db9 to aux port cable either
[2:32] <hamitron> oh, you don't have a cable known to be good?
[2:32] <ReggieUK> I'm pretty certain that cable is pertinent
[2:32] <ReggieUK> and it definitely plugs into the mount
[2:33] <ReggieUK> but I don't know which port
[2:33] <hamitron> :/
[2:33] <ReggieUK> but it was attached to a couple of serial extensions with electrical tape to give it some weather protection (mainly to stop it getting moisture in)
[2:34] <ReggieUK> so I *know* it's a telescope mount cable for that mount
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[2:52] <hamitron> nn
[2:52] * R` (~RHA@ip7.j-k.kund.riksnet.nu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:52] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[2:53] * LiENUZ is now known as LiENUS
[2:53] * RRRRube (~RRRRube@94-30-69-14.xdsl.murphx.net) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
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[3:05] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:05] <RITRedbeard> Who was talking about HDMI to LVDS yesterday?
[3:06] <cornet> dunno
[3:07] * cornet found old project today which might be useful for r-pi people
[3:07] <cornet> though need to get it working again
[3:07] <cornet> well not my project but one i played with and helped test
[3:08] <cornet> abusing linux kexec to boot complete images rather than just kernels
[3:08] <ReggieUK> do you need to do that through kexec?
[3:09] <cornet> well the idea was you could load multiple images onto a cf card (this was for sokreis kit)
[3:09] <cornet> have a known working one then upload new one
[3:09] <cornet> reboot using kexec and if it didn't work fail back
[3:09] <ReggieUK> we've messed around with loading a kernel and dumping the rootfs into ramdisk via initrd (I think it was initrd, whatever lets you embed the rootfs with the kernel image)
[3:10] <ReggieUK> this was via usb
[3:10] <cornet> this dates back from when kexec was pretty new
[3:10] <cornet> so might be some other foo around now
[3:10] <ReggieUK> but getting uboot running on the r-pi would seem to be quite useful for doing everything these days
[3:10] <cornet> idea was for safely upgrading remote sokreis routers
[3:11] <ReggieUK> could do all sorts of trickery then
[3:11] <cornet> yer
[3:11] <ReggieUK> like mounting the rootfs via nfs shares
[3:12] <ReggieUK> which would be very useful indeed
[3:12] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Quit: Ik ga weg)
[3:12] <ReggieUK> only need a minimal SD card to boot the unit and the rest is done via network
[3:12] <cornet> aye
[3:12] * merlin1991 (~merlin@Maemo/community/cssu/merlin1991) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:13] <cornet> this was kinda having minimal boot environment then being able to boot into others safely
[3:13] <cornet> each with own separate paritions stored on same sd card
[3:14] <ReggieUK> oh sure, I'm not knocking it, just that things like uboot have superceded it, depending how you do things
[3:15] <cornet> yer will check out uboot
[3:15] <ReggieUK> uboot is on quite a lot of embedded stuff
[3:15] <ReggieUK> it talks to stuff at it's level, way before the os
[3:17] <cornet> right
[3:21] <cornet> shouldreally get a qeum instance sorted
[3:23] <LiENUS> so i heared the raspi was canceled
[3:24] <LiENUS> nah
[3:24] <LiENUS> i really her
[3:24] <LiENUS> heard
[3:24] <LiENUS> is there any chance the ship date will be anounced a few days early
[3:24] <LiENUS> so we can have launch parties?
[3:25] <cornet> woah, we have an excitable one
[3:25] <cornet> ;)
[3:25] <cornet> i suspect the deal is it'll be annouced when it's announced
[3:27] <cornet> would the launch party involve pies & rasberry daiquiri
[3:27] <cornet> ?
[3:27] <cornet> if so then i'm in
[3:27] * _inc (~inc@unaffiliated/-inc/x-0498339) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:27] * _ross (~ross@188-221-247-176.zone12.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:30] <_inc> hey people
[3:30] <_inc> everyone out on this saturday night?
[3:30] <cornet> yup
[3:30] <cornet> no one here
[3:30] <_inc> boring :(
[3:30] <_inc> just come back now myself
[3:31] <_inc> do you know if staff requent this channel?
[3:31] <cornet> no idea
[3:32] * StevenR (~foo@cpc2-sgyl27-2-0-cust391.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[3:32] <LiENUS> cornet, daiquiris for sure
[3:32] <LiENUS> i live n louisiana
[3:33] <LiENUS> where drinking and driving is legal as long as its a daiquiri
[3:36] <ReggieUK> it's an unofficial channel, pi org staff do not frequent here
[3:36] <ReggieUK> might get the odd mod off the forums
[3:36] <piofcube> You calling the mods... odd? ;-)
[3:37] * ratxue (~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[3:38] * victhor_ (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[3:39] <_inc> :P
[3:40] <_inc> i have a shop related problem, possible glitch in the cms. my query is likely lost amonst all the "is it out yet?" emails
[3:41] <_inc> (and no its not out yet, just something i noticed with the sticker preorder)
[3:53] * _ross (~ross@188-221-247-176.zone12.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:06] <mrdragons> Hah, binary clock not useful... Ha. I just integrated it into the alarm clock software I'm writing for the raspi, which will wake me up in the morning.
[4:10] <ReggieUK> g'night all
[4:11] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56ab.bb.sky.com) Quit ()
[4:14] <wwalker> top
[4:14] <wwalker> focus problem
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[4:23] * barr5790 (~alan@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[4:27] * stegal (~androirc@host86-180-56-111.range86-180.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[4:32] <duckinator> http://www.softwarefreedom.org/blog/2012/jan/12/microsoft-confirms-UEFI-fears-locks-down-ARM/ :(
[4:41] <mrdragons> Fuck microsoft, I can't wait until they die. Which they will, eventually.
[4:41] <Thorn_> over ballmers dead body
[4:42] <Thorn_> (buried next to 'Jobs)
[4:42] <mrdragons> how old is he?
[4:42] <mrdragons> >_>
[4:42] <Thorn_> 55
[4:42] <Thorn_> jobs died at 56
[4:42] <Thorn_> we could be in luck still !
[4:43] <mrdragons> Well, I don't want to wish death on anybody, nobody deserves that...
[4:44] <Thorn_> yet you can't wait until microsoft die?
[4:44] <mrdragons> Microsoft is a company, not a person, it's totally different
[4:44] <Thorn_> and how many people will lose their jobs and livelihoods when that happens?
[4:46] <mrdragons> Stupid morals. -_-'
[5:12] <piofcube> R-Pi site going offline on the 18th in protest against SOPA.
[5:16] <LiENUS> sales start on the 18th
[5:40] * _ross (~ross@188-221-247-176.zone12.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:55] * r4pha (~rapha@unaffiliated/r4pha) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[6:03] <mrdragons> Hmm, the sites going down on the 18th? Thanks for tellings
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[9:39] <pygo> lol LiENUS
[9:40] <LiENUS> was wondering when someone would catch that
[9:40] <pygo> I just got home from work
[9:40] <pygo> do sales really start then?
[9:40] <LiENUS> doubt it if they're shutting the site down
[9:40] <pygo> hah. k
[9:41] <LiENUS> wouldnt be surprised if they started on the 19th though
[9:41] <LiENUS> but itd be awfully short manufacturing lead they mentioned 3-4 weeks
[9:41] <LiENUS> on the 10th
[9:41] * Jarii (~Jarii@host96-165-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:42] <pygo> aye
[9:42] <pygo> I'm kinda glad they have a limit of 1 per person to start with. really only need one to start with
[9:42] <LiENUS> oi my work got fun
[9:42] <LiENUS> im going to be in a mardi gras parade
[9:43] <pygo> cool
[9:43] <LiENUS> i have to operate a (secure) wifi hotspot
[9:43] <LiENUS> that we can A) schedule surgery appointments on
[9:43] <pygo> nice
[9:43] <LiENUS> and B) run credit cards for microchipping animals out there
[9:43] <pygo> ah. I recomend a pfsense node that the wifi goes on, and people use a vpn client (pptp is probably fine). that way it's that much more secure
[9:44] <LiENUS> im going to use wpa enterprise with a rb751u from mikrotik
[9:44] <pygo> though it's not a financial institution or a bank or some oil company or something. so wpa2 is probably fine
[9:44] <pygo> cool
[9:44] <LiENUS> wpa enterprise is probably quite a bit more secure than pptp
[9:44] <LiENUS> and credit cards wont be over wifi, just the appointments
[9:44] <LiENUS> they'll be on a seperate vlan
[9:45] <pygo> indeed wpa ent is. pptp is silly by comparison.
[9:45] <pygo> been looking at doing it at home. will do eventually.
[9:45] <LiENUS> i have a lightweight way to do wpa ent
[9:46] <LiENUS> it'll be vpning (prolly via ipsec and possibly l2tp or maybe just eoip)
[9:46] <LiENUS> back into work and using the radius server there
[9:46] <pygo> cool
[9:46] <LiENUS> that way if i configure a machine to work on the wifi at work it'll work there too
[9:46] <pygo> I found eoip has a fairly high load on the CPU. mind you I did it on a wrt54gl
[9:46] <pygo> only got 8mbit throughput on it
[9:47] <LiENUS> ultimately i may end up building a dedicated setup for it
[9:47] <pygo> yeah. probably best. less stuff tends to break that way
[9:47] <LiENUS> throw a few batteries in a rubermaid style box and mount the wifi ap to it
[9:47] <LiENUS> but its a single day trial thing so we'll just be running an extension cord lol
[9:47] <pygo> lol
[9:47] <LiENUS> going to use my own spare personal gear for most of it for now
[9:48] <LiENUS> and it'll all run over 3g
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[9:49] <LiENUS> somehow though i get the feeling this wont end well but it'll be a fun try
[9:49] <LiENUS> if we end up doing more stuff like this maybe later on i can do the dedicated setup and put a weatherproofed raspi + monitor in it mounted to the box so the entire appointment scheduling system can be all in one
[9:51] <pygo> yeah
[9:51] <pygo> raspi is such a nice powerful little thing for what it is
[9:51] <pygo> I greatly look forward to learning some gpgpu programming on it
[9:51] <pygo> wanna finally make a spidery like robot
[9:52] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD2821C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:52] <pygo> make it sort of a pet. see about doing some sort of charging station for it. like a roomba
[9:52] <pygo> and have 802.11n
[9:52] <LiENUS> lol nice
[9:52] <pygo> yeah
[9:55] <pygo> so many things I want to do with it. should be good to pick back up on my electronics hobby
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[9:58] <LiENUS> i should build a robot that has a card swiping slot that your swipe your card it charges it and microchips your dog
[9:58] <pygo> haha
[9:58] <pygo> that'd be cool actually, for vets
[9:59] <LiENUS> itd be cooler yet if it could climb walls and had 8 legs
[10:00] <pygo> yup. I'm thinking six legs minimum. but servos are expensive. I could probably go the cheap route and just link some legs together. but that hinders moveability
[10:00] <pygo> I wonder how the climbing of walls will work
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[10:06] <MichaelMalus> ...An automatic hunter-chipper robot? You give it info on the dog and swipe the card, and it goes off and hunts it down?
[10:06] <pygo> haha
[10:06] <pygo> I'm thinking he means more of a vet style chipping bot
[10:07] <MichaelMalus> I don't think those need to climb walls much.
[10:09] <pygo> they might. some dogs are big and mean. at least the ones worth owning. well sans the mean part
[10:09] <pygo> hate small dogs
[10:10] <MichaelMalus> Hehehe.
[10:10] * MichaelMalus remembers his aunts Great Dane.
[10:11] <MichaelMalus> Was big even by Great Dane standards.
[10:11] <pygo> jeez. I've never seen one in person. but I get the idea
[10:11] <MichaelMalus> I've seen horses smaller.
[10:12] <pygo> love big dogs. specially the german shepheard type. had a german shepheard, rotweiler cross. best dog ever! seemed to be more german shepherd
[10:12] <pygo> hah
[10:12] <pygo> pony!
[10:15] <LiENUS> MichaelMalus, the climbing walls is just to be creepy
[10:15] <MichaelMalus> You ever seen Minority Report?
[10:15] <LiENUS> newp
[10:16] <MichaelMalus> My web is being weird, so I can't search it, but look on Youtube for the robots from it.
[10:16] <MichaelMalus> Can't remember quite what they were called. Spiderbots or something.
[10:17] <MichaelMalus> Here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=901lYbPmqu4
[10:19] <LiENUS> exactly
[10:19] <LiENUS> but more legs
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[13:40] <M^tt> good afternoon :)
[13:40] <haltdef> liar
[13:41] <M^tt> good <insert time of day here> :)
[13:41] <haltdef> liar!
[13:41] <MartijnVdS> haltdef: What's not good about it?
[13:41] <haltdef> dunno
[13:45] <MuNk> good day all :)
[13:45] <M^tt> I'm wondering if the opengl es supported by the RPI would be capable of running ProjectM ?
[13:47] <MuNk> well they did do a openGL ES2.0 release for android but that effectivly means its JAVA based, not sure how well JAVA gonna run on rPI for that stuff, any gfx in java is cpu/memory intensive normally and rpi-b aint packing alot of either.
[13:48] <MuNk> but id guess its possible
[13:48] <M^tt> Its just another thing that ill have to try when I get one :)
[13:49] <MuNk> they have a qt version of projectM that might be a good start point with QT being supported by nokia on rpi
[13:51] <M^tt> unsure how the beat detection works in projectm, will have to do some reading
[13:52] <M^tt> thanks MuNk, was unaware they had released the android one, last time i looked was nov last year
[13:52] <M^tt> although as you say not idea
[13:52] <M^tt> ideal*
[13:53] <MuNk> np, sorry cant be of more help, like yourself still waiting on a r-pi to play with :)
[13:53] <M^tt> Was toying with the idea of strapped them to the back of a few projectors, network controlled
[13:54] <MuNk> i just want to link multiples together for a hadoop cluster :)
[13:55] <MartijnVdS> Lots and lots of them
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[14:10] * Sish (~crys@182-239-169-122.ip.adam.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:12] <Sish> does anyone know of a DC++ server/hub that can be run on the raspberrypi?
[14:12] <haltdef> prety much anything open source linux can be ported to ARM linux with a recompile
[14:12] <Sish> cool
[14:13] <haltdef> how useful the performance will be is a different thing, usb and ethernet sharing the same "port" internally
[14:16] <mrdragons> Well, usb can transfer ~480M/s, and ethernet is 100M/s max on this. I think it'll be fine as long as you're not using it for anything really traffic-heavy
[14:17] <haltdef> I've never seen close to 480mbps of actual throughput out of usb2
[14:17] <haltdef> half at best
[14:18] <izua> huh, how come the usb and ethernet ports are 'shared' internally?
[14:18] <WASDx> i usualy get 30mb/s for my external harddrive
[14:18] <Sish> yeah, i know of people who have used WRAP boards and old/spare hacked routers with OpenWRT to run DC++ hubs on and it seems to work fine for them
[14:18] <mrdragons> Still, I can only get ~2M/s wireless on my laptop, I don't see it being an issue
[14:18] <haltdef> ethernet isn't part of the SoC, is provided by a chip that's a usb hub as well
[14:19] <izua> i still don't see how anything is shared?
[14:19] <haltdef> single usb coming off the SoC
[14:19] <izua> if it connects say, via SPI (although unlikely) it will send the same amount of data for both usb and eth traffic
[14:19] <izua> if it connected to two different chips, one for the usb, and another nic chip, wouldn't it have sent the same amount of data?
[14:20] <izua> hmm.. although it could buffer twice the data, so it might be faster i guess
[14:21] <haltdef> single chip provides two usb ports and ethernet and is only connected to the SoC by a single usb2 port
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[14:24] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[14:25] <Sish> but if the usb is only being used for power then the chip has full processing power available for ethernet?
[14:26] <haltdef> you mean the microusb port the pi gets its power from?
[14:27] <Sish> yeah
[14:28] <haltdef> that's just a dumb port attached only to the 5v and ground line I believe
[14:28] <Sish> well, if you're not using the other usb2 port either
[14:28] <haltdef> I was thinking for a hard drive
[14:31] <Sish> my idea was to just get one for a low power dc++ server, so the server app for dc++ can just run off the sd card, and no need for a hdd either
[14:32] <haltdef> do dc++ servers not host actual content?
[14:32] <Sish> no
[14:32] <haltdef> ahh
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[14:33] <haltdef> yea, the same software people use on openwrt should work
[14:33] <haltdef> same binary won't, most routers are MIPS I believe
[14:35] <Sish> it's just for a small community of <20ppl, so i'm thinking it could be fine for the job
[14:35] <MartijnVdS> There are some ARM routers out there, but not a lot
[14:35] <mrdragons> Nothing wrong with mips
[14:35] <haltdef> nobody said there was
[14:35] <MartijnVdS> mrdragons: Except rpi doesn't use it :)
[14:36] <mrdragons> I never implied you said there was
[14:36] <mrdragons> :P
[14:36] <haltdef> kinda did
[14:37] <mrdragons> Meh
[14:37] <mrdragons> We should debate about it.
[14:37] <haltdef> no!
[14:38] <MartijnVdS> Mass debate?
[14:38] <mrdragons> You first! >:(
[14:38] <haltdef> :(
[14:38] <haltdef> been trying to get znc running on my router
[14:38] <haltdef> hasn't been going well
[14:42] <MuNk> i spent yesterday trying to load-balalnce two wans on my router, they made the rt_tables file read-only. =/
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[14:45] <Jaseman> afternoon chaps and chapesses
[14:45] <MuNk> good afternoon =]
[14:46] <Jaseman> any interesting chat topics going on today?
[14:47] <Jaseman> i see the shop has pi's for sale now
[14:47] <Jaseman> only kidding!
[14:48] <haltdef> that was cruel
[14:48] <Jaseman> yeah fun though hee hee
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[14:49] <Jaseman> its so eagerly awaited
[14:49] <MuNk> >.> that was really evil Jaseman
[14:49] <Jaseman> more exciting than christmas eve
[14:50] <Jaseman> yep very evil
[14:50] <Jaseman> what would have been more evil was if i left off the only kidding part
[14:51] * r4pha (~rapha@unaffiliated/r4pha) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[14:53] <dmsuse> man i can't wait much longer for the pi :P
[14:53] <dmsuse> especially the gert board
[14:53] <Jaseman> ideal for a new game show...
[14:53] <MuNk> im hoping they come out end feb really :) cause i dont have spare money till then and i want atleast one :P
[14:53] <Jaseman> gather a room full of geeks
[14:54] <Jaseman> put in one raspberry pi and say fight for it
[14:54] <Jaseman> imagine the carnage
[14:54] <dmsuse> i'd throw a very badly written python script in the other direction then claim the pi for myself :D
[14:55] <Jaseman> it would be like finding nemo
[14:55] <Jaseman> mine mine mine mine
[14:56] <Jaseman> it pretty much will be like that anyway
[14:56] <Sish> i'm prepared to wait for the PoE version
[14:56] <Sish> that'd be so win
[14:57] <dmsuse> that would be nice
[14:57] <Jaseman> im waiting for the slim version (like sony did with ps3)
[14:59] <Jaseman> is there such a thing as wireless hard drive?
[15:00] <Jaseman> there should be
[15:00] <Jaseman> like a small wireless nas built in
[15:01] <MuNk> im sure you can get external caddys that connection via wifi instead of ethernet
[15:01] <MuNk> but speed of them would suck i guess =/
[15:01] <haltdef> depends, my wifi does 250mbps on a good day
[15:01] <Jaseman> depends if speed is an issue
[15:03] <Jaseman> im just thinking about all the damned wires coming out of the pi
[15:05] <dmsuse> lol
[15:05] <Jaseman> pity it couldnt have sata on the board
[15:06] <victhor> pity some people think $35 can have every single feature they want
[15:06] <rm> cost increase for something 5% of people would use
[15:06] <victhor> $35 computers*
[15:07] <MuNk> lots of wires? i plan to have only one :)
[15:07] <rm> you can get an USB to SATA dongle for $3
[15:07] <Jaseman> power?
[15:07] <MuNk> PoE, but yes power :)
[15:07] <rm> right, the issue then becomes how do you power your SATA HDD or whatever
[15:08] * mdavey_ (~chatzilla@host217-35-75-188.in-addr.btopenworld.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[15:08] <MuNk> why have a sata hdd, ill stick to the memory chips myself dont plan to have alot of storage and any i have will be on a network anyway
[15:08] <Jaseman> if you think about a normal mainboard
[15:08] <Jaseman> with processor and ram fitted
[15:08] <Jaseman> whats the cheapest?
[15:09] <victhor> those via mini-itx with the crappy processors.
[15:09] <Jaseman> how much are they?
[15:09] <rm> a P3 or P4 from 2004 in your local second-hand store
[15:09] <rm> for $10-$20
[15:10] <Jaseman> with ram as well?
[15:10] <rm> and then turn down the heating because you're going to need it less :)
[15:11] <MuNk> or if you are near any uni's ask tghem about there e-waste normaly have a p4+ you can get for free
[15:11] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56ab.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:11] <Jaseman> yeah you can get a whole pc for free if you look around
[15:11] <Jaseman> and are not fussy
[15:12] <Jaseman> lets just assume that you want only new unused
[15:12] <Jaseman> not second hand
[15:12] <MuNk> no referbished?
[15:12] <Jaseman> no
[15:12] <Sish> well, there are WRAP boards: http://www.yawarra.com.au/product.php?productCode=HW-AX3-M-500V
[15:12] <MuNk> (cant spell >.<)
[15:12] <Jaseman> completely new
[15:12] <Sish> not cheap though
[15:13] <victhor> I think the VIA mini-itx ones are less expensive, but I'm not sure
[15:13] <Jaseman> 305 dollars
[15:14] <Jaseman> is that australian dollars?
[15:14] <Sish> yes
[15:14] <victhor> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-D945GCLF-Mini-ITX-Built-Atom-230-Processor-Refurbished-Board-Only-/200699709456?pt=Motherboards&hash=item2ebaa28810
[15:14] <victhor> no RAM
[15:15] <Jaseman> well what youve said reinforces the strength of the pi then
[15:16] <Sish> mini-itx still need psu, and would draw a lot more power than the pi
[15:16] <Jaseman> pi needs psu too
[15:16] <Sish> wrap boards are more along the same family as the pi
[15:17] <Jaseman> im just wondering if for a little bit more money
[15:17] <Jaseman> if you can get a lot more bang
[15:17] * mdavey (~chatzilla@host217-35-75-188.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:17] <victhor> you can, just needs more power :)
[15:17] * Shy (Shy@pdpc/supporter/professional/shy) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:18] <Sish> not in such a small form factor that uses so little power
[15:18] <victhor> those mini-itx boards are much larger, but some are about the same price
[15:18] <Jaseman> the budget pc owner wont care about the size
[15:18] * dmsuse suspects broadcom had a huge amount of arm processors they couldn't sell so made the pi project
[15:19] <Jaseman> i dont think so
[15:20] <Jaseman> but i think they might stop making that chip
[15:20] <Jaseman> in not too much time
[15:20] <izua> is there a footprint-compatible replacement?
[15:20] <victhor> until they stop making these http://www.roku.com/
[15:20] <Jaseman> i dont know
[15:20] <victhor> they will still provide the processors
[15:21] <Jaseman> but im thinking ahead - lets say they make 4 million pi's
[15:21] <Jaseman> and then can no longer get the chip
[15:22] <dmsuse> raspberry pi v2 ;)
[15:22] <dmsuse> no doubt they probably already have a working version with a new chip
[15:22] <Jaseman> i dont think they anticipate it being that successful
[15:23] <dmsuse> i think they have already seen it is a success
[15:23] <dmsuse> and while waiting for manufacture, it gives them time to plan version 2 :P
[15:23] <Jaseman> yes but it still remains to be seen
[15:23] <dmsuse> i disagree
[15:23] <dmsuse> you can see on the forum there is huge demand
[15:23] <victhor> they are at a loss providing the chip at "production level costs" to the project.
[15:24] <dmsuse> plus each person by the sounds of it is going to buy like 5 of these
[15:24] <Jaseman> lots of people who are interested might not actually get one when the time comes
[15:24] <victhor> if they increase production and maintain unit cost, broadcom will get a profit from selling the chips
[15:24] <dmsuse> victhor: they are not at a loss, liz says in her recent post they are making ??5 per board
[15:24] <victhor> no, I meant broadcom.
[15:24] <dmsuse> oh
[15:24] <Jaseman> i hope they sell tons of them
[15:25] <victhor> I thought they were selling the chip to the foundation at unit prices used for large production runs
[15:25] <Jaseman> i only want one or two of them
[15:26] <victhor> they have a large customer for this chip already though, perhaps they are just putting these ones meant for the pi on their order
[15:26] <victhor> as to increase production volume and reduce costs.
[15:26] <dmsuse> what other customer is using this chip?
[15:26] <Jaseman> ill probably have one at home and another at work
[15:27] * PiBot (~Raspberry@c-24-147-35-37.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:27] <victhor> dmsuse, roku
[15:27] <Jaseman> well nothing is stopping someone else ordering 10k of them from the manufacturer directly
[15:28] <Jaseman> im sure they will give you the design plans
[15:28] * DaQatz (~DB@c-24-147-35-37.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:28] <dmsuse> ah
[15:29] <Jaseman> if we all got together and collected up ??200k
[15:29] <Jaseman> we could make they without the rpi foundation
[15:29] <haltdef> right, libstdc++.so is in /opt/lib but no executables that need it can find it, anyone happen to know how to compile these executables to look for it in that dir?
[15:29] <dmsuse> Jaseman: doubtful lol
[15:30] <Jaseman> only takes one entrepeneur
[15:30] <dmsuse> do you have the proprietory code they are using for the gpu to boot from the sd and talk to the hardware?
[15:30] <Jaseman> alan sugar might do it
[15:30] <izua> Jaseman: you could probably order some at a local pcb shop
[15:30] <izua> and with enough patience, even solder the chip
[15:30] <izua> but it won't come down to GBP25
[15:30] <Jaseman> i thiink rpi foundation encourage clones
[15:31] <Jaseman> they will provide that info on request
[15:31] <dmsuse> true it would be much cheaper
[15:31] <izua> the problem is that every client that will buy one will take part in a common fund
[15:31] <izua> so they'd get the cheaper per unit cost
[15:31] <dmsuse> Jaseman: i guarantee you 100% they wont :P
[15:31] <izua> Jaseman: aren't they going to provide the schematic and pcb layout?
[15:31] <Jaseman> lets say the first 10k run out
[15:32] <Jaseman> on day 1
[15:32] <Jaseman> and a week later someone else says i can sell you a clone one
[15:32] <Jaseman> would you get that or wait
[15:32] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[15:35] <Jaseman> i think most people would wait for the genuine one with the raspberry logo on it
[15:36] <Jaseman> i suppose it depends how patient they are
[15:36] <Jaseman> if they can wait a few weeks for the next batch
[15:37] <Jaseman> when the spectrum came out they were in competition
[15:37] <Jaseman> with the likes of acorn
[15:37] <Jaseman> and later commodore
[15:38] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:38] <Jaseman> pi doesnt have a competitor as such
[15:39] * Jarii (~Jarii@host96-165-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit (Quit: I forgot how to forget)
[15:45] * mikeanthonywild (4e952615@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[15:47] <mikeanthonywild> Afternoon all
[15:53] <Jaseman> hi
[15:56] <Jaseman> do yuo think there will be a magazine called Raspberry User
[15:56] <Jaseman> or PiPlus
[15:56] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6)
[15:56] <Jaseman> Raspi Monthy
[15:57] <Jaseman> each issue would have some python code for you to type in
[15:57] <Jaseman> and adverts for gert boards
[15:58] <Jaseman> and free keyboard sticker with issue one
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[16:02] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Client Quit)
[16:02] <mikeanthonywild> that's a nice little idea
[16:03] * LiENUS (~whodat@2001:470:bbb3:12:2475:431f:8302:e42a) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:03] <mikeanthonywild> reminds me of the BASIC magazines you used to get
[16:13] <Jaseman> yeah im getting an urge to buy some retro computers off ebay
[16:13] <amandarn> Guys, any of you have tested the TI "LaunchPad" kits, if I may ask ?
[16:13] <Jaseman> no sorry
[16:14] <Jaseman> imagine having a zx80, zx81, speccy, speccy+, +2, vic 20, c64, atari st, amiga, bbc b, electron, archimedes
[16:14] <Jaseman> probably wouldnt cost that much
[16:16] <Jaseman> i wouldnt care if they dont even work
[16:16] <Jaseman> would be nice just to look at
[16:17] <Jaseman> wish i had a spare room that i could devote to retro
[16:18] <Jaseman> lots of kids toys and old computers and lego sets and stuff
[16:18] <Jaseman> every man's paradise
[16:23] <MuNk> well i have a c64, zx80, zx81, zx80+128 (built-in casset tape player), some amigas and a few others most areboxed but all are working :)
[16:24] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[16:25] <LiENUS> someone needs to make a cassette tape adapter for raspi
[16:26] <ReggieUK> can't we just make a simulator
[16:26] <piofcube> a simple AD to GPIO interface would be possible
[16:26] <ReggieUK> make it play nasty whiny noises and make you wait an hour for your app to load?
[16:27] <MuNk> only timeyou want to wait for ever using a tape is with real hardware
[16:27] <ReggieUK> the pi has an audio jack on it, doesn't that have input on it?
[16:28] <piofcube> Though if it were a ZX81 re-creation you would have to make it fail loading the game 7 times out of 10 for accuracy ;-)
[16:28] <ReggieUK> piofcube, I was about to say something similar
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[16:29] <ReggieUK> how would you emulate the disappointment of the cruddy game you loaded compared to your mates BBC?
[16:29] <piofcube> I remember being so annoyed with that but then so happy when it finally loaded
[16:30] * PiBot (~Raspberry@c-24-147-35-37.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:30] <piofcube> I used to go to the local library to use their BBCs... they had 3 or 4 of them :-)
[16:30] <ReggieUK> I had one at home
[16:30] <ReggieUK> my dad had his own too
[16:31] <Jaseman> i just want to see them and touch the keyboard - as purely asthetic nostalgia items
[16:31] <piofcube> I did eventually but that was near the end
[16:31] <MuNk> i missed my micro-BBC machine :(
[16:31] <MuNk> i miss*
[16:31] <piofcube> I loved the keys on the BBC
[16:31] <Jaseman> a mac ii would be nice
[16:32] <piofcube> I used to convert my single sided disks into double sided by clipping notches out of the plastic... worked really well and saved a bit of cash
[16:32] <Jaseman> theres one on ebay for ??10
[16:33] <Jaseman> bbc b
[16:34] <_ross> The RPi audio jack isn't a "proper" DAC - it is just using the two PWM outputs on the chip.
[16:34] <Jaseman> i just couldnt go back to floppy disc or cassette tape now
[16:34] <_ross> There is no ADC in the SoC (let alone one that would be good for audio)
[16:35] <Jaseman> if someone will make an sd card reader for the bbc b, i might get one
[16:36] <Jaseman> and hdmi out :-)
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[16:42] <Jaseman> i guess there's no microphone socket on the pi
[16:42] <dmsuse> ^^ that is a shame
[16:42] <Jaseman> but then you could use a usb one
[16:43] * izua (~izua@unaffiliated/izua) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:43] <Jaseman> some of the logitech webcams have a mic built in
[16:43] <Jaseman> pretty good quality too
[16:44] <Jaseman> i wonder if you cuold output aido via usb
[16:44] <Jaseman> audio
[16:44] <Jaseman> it seems you can
[16:44] <Dagger3> USB sound cards exist, yes
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[16:46] <Jaseman> wow i just discovered that maplin do a usb robotic arm kit for ??30
[16:46] * r4pha (~rapha@C1202.karlshof.wh.tu-darmstadt.de) has joined #raspberrypi
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[16:47] <mikeanthonywild> Most of the main USB audio devices are supported by ALSA anyway
[16:47] <Jaseman> i think if you someone could write some python code that works with that it would be cool
[16:50] <Jaseman> i will most likely connect the headphone socket of the pi straight to my amp
[16:51] <Jaseman> 3.5 to phone cable
[16:51] <Jaseman> phono
[16:52] <mikeanthonywild> from what I've heard the audio jack does not give anything near audiophile quality
[16:52] <Jaseman> i dont care
[16:52] <Jaseman> as long as its reasonable - im not that fussy
[16:53] <mikeanthonywild> well that's ok then
[16:53] <Jaseman> essential software needs for me are....
[16:53] <Jaseman> firefox browser
[16:53] <Jaseman> vlc player with dvd decryption
[16:54] <Jaseman> skype perhaps
[16:54] <haltdef> you're not expecting the pi to run all of that are you?
[16:54] <Jaseman> and the firefox must have flash
[16:54] <Jaseman> hell yes
[16:54] <haltdef> prepare to be disappointed tbh
[16:55] <hamitron> be ok as a thin client?
[16:55] <Jaseman> if it cant do that then i wont be impressed
[16:55] <haltdef> it's going to be 22 quid
[16:56] <haltdef> if you want a board that can do all that spend ??100 or so on a pandaboard
[16:56] <DaQatz> Flash, Lol... firefox? in 128 or 256 megs ra???
[16:56] <DaQatz> ram*
[16:56] <haltdef> is there a flash binary for armv6?
[16:56] <ReggieUK> if you want better audio on the pi then get a cirrus logic chip and interface it to the i2s pins
[16:56] <DaQatz> And don't hold your breath on skype
[16:56] <Jaseman> isnt there a small version of firefox?
[16:57] <hamitron> maybe firecub?
[16:57] <haltdef> firefox for android and maemo is armv7 only if that's what you mean
[16:57] <Jaseman> well any im chat that can link to skype would do
[16:57] <_ross> or HDMI audio to your TV then use a headphone socket from the TV?
[16:57] <Jaseman> hmm i like that idea
[16:57] <rm> ReggieUK, there are many hifi and even hi-end Audio cards (or rather boxes) for USB
[16:57] <Jaseman> assuming you can get the music to go out of the hmdi
[16:58] <ReggieUK> indeed there are but wheres the fun? It's development board
[16:58] <rm> it's not.
[16:58] <hamitron> indeed, we should be hand building these amps with a soldering iron
[16:58] <ReggieUK> ?
[16:58] <hamitron> ;)
[16:59] <mikeanthonywild> ^^ Would sound like a fun little project :P
[16:59] <ReggieUK> it most certainly is a development board
[16:59] <ReggieUK> or did they just put the gpio pin header on for fun?
[16:59] <rm> haha
[16:59] <rm> did they put it in?
[17:00] <rm> it's no more a 'development board' than any PC mobo with a CPU and RAM
[17:00] <ReggieUK> ?
[17:00] <rm> and GPIO pin header is not actually soldered on
[17:00] <rm> if THAT was your only reason to call it a 'development board'.
[17:00] <ReggieUK> oh noes, does that mean someone would have to do their own soldering? is that what stops you developing on this board?
[17:01] <hamitron> I'd call it a dev board, because I intend to dev on it
[17:01] <hamitron> ;)
[17:01] <rm> seriously, so add some GPIO to an x86 mobo, and it becomes a development board?
[17:01] <rm> wow
[17:01] <dmsuse> dev?
[17:01] <hamitron> but I do actually have some plain motherboards atm, that I already use for this
[17:02] <hamitron> rm: yes, if it lets you dev what you need :/
[17:02] <Jaseman> i found this page about running firefox with low ram: http://www.stayupdate.com/firefox/increase-firefox-speed-and-decrease-firefox-memory-usage-20-tips/567
[17:02] <ReggieUK> http://www.geek.com/articles/chips/raspberry-pis-gertboard-expansion-board-already-works-video-2012019/
[17:02] <ReggieUK> DEV BOARD
[17:02] <rm> dev board = limited edition stuff with all sorts of I/O, and pre-supposes and existence of a "non-development" version
[17:02] <dmsuse> why use firefox, its bloatware
[17:02] <rm> which is not the case with R Pi
[17:02] <rm> an existence *
[17:02] <dmsuse> use midori browser
[17:02] <rm> it's a silly discussion anyway :P
[17:02] <hamitron> I don't agree with that definition
[17:03] <ReggieUK> you started it
[17:03] <hamitron> but I agree it is silly arguing about it
[17:03] <hamitron> :)
[17:03] <rm> majority of people will use this just as they would a regular PC motherboard
[17:03] <piofcube> They can no longer compile Firefox on 32bit as it's too big LMAO
[17:03] <dmsuse> ^^ true lol
[17:03] <hamitron> kinda sad :/
[17:06] <mikeanthonywild> I would recommend the Arch linux wiki for recommendations of lightweight alternatives
[17:07] <mikeanthonywild> https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=111878
[17:07] <Jaseman> well any browser will do i suppose
[17:07] <Jaseman> as long as i can play starfleet commander on it
[17:08] <hamitron> I honestly, can't see the point in using it as any old PC..... gotta be using it for something special
[17:08] <hamitron> :)
[17:08] <Jaseman> first of all i want it to do normal stuff
[17:08] <Jaseman> then venture into special afterwards
[17:08] <mikeanthonywild> Speaking of which, anyone up for a small Quake tourney when it's finally released?
[17:09] * theTroy (~troy@unaffiliated/thetroy) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[17:10] <mikeanthonywild> Or perhaps some other game which can be compiled for ARM and doesn't require commercial PAKs
[17:10] <_inc> OpenArena?
[17:10] <MuNk> if i managed to get one then sure :)
[17:11] <_inc> would the QuakeLive browser plugin operate on the RPi?
[17:11] <mikeanthonywild> Good shout, OA is already in the Debian ARM repos
[17:12] * Sish (~crys@182-239-169-122.ip.adam.com.au) Quit ()
[17:12] <mikeanthonywild> and according to the wiki it's downloaded as a native binary
[17:12] <mikeanthonywild> so I doubt it :(
[17:12] * mikeanthonywild (4e952615@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[17:13] <hamitron> openttd? :)
[17:14] <_inc> OK right, so I haven't been on the linux scene for a while. I've created a minimal debian VM with xfce4 as the window manager. All that is looking good apart from I still have to login from command line and manually 'startx'. Is there a login manager im missing or something?
[17:14] <hamitron> xdm?
[17:15] <_inc> hmmm, I'll have a look now
[17:15] <hamitron> I prefer to startx manually tbh
[17:15] * izua_ (~izua@unaffiliated/izua) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:16] <_inc> if I didnt, what file do I place the statx command? .bash_profile?
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[17:17] <hamitron> erm, iirc it is .bashrc
[17:17] <_inc> ill have a gander now. thanks
[17:18] <Jaseman> how about a pi docking station?
[17:18] * izua (~izua@unaffiliated/izua) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:18] <hamitron> to dock what?
[17:19] <hamitron> dock the pi on a main comp, or dock stuff on the pi?
[17:19] <_inc> Jaseman: thats something I was looking to do with mine, so i can dock the RPi at either my TV, HiFi or desktop setup
[17:19] <Jaseman> dock it to the psu and video and keyboard
[17:19] <Jaseman> i suppose its not necessary
[17:20] <Jaseman> you can just carry around the sd card
[17:20] <Jaseman> and have another pi if you move from location to location
[17:22] <Jaseman> you might want to put extension cables from each port
[17:22] <Jaseman> to a panel
[17:22] <Jaseman> so that you dont wear out the connectors
[17:23] <_inc> I would love a solution to have some sort of wireless sync from spotify on the macbook to my hifi x
[17:23] <Jaseman> and so that you have all the connectors on the same side
[17:25] <hamitron> but isn't the pi just for development and testing? for a real world device you'd have headers for such a setup
[17:25] <hamitron> or a board with a custom layout
[17:26] <Jaseman> i want to use it as my only pc
[17:26] <_inc> i dunno if i could do that
[17:26] <_inc> thats a bit too minimalist for me
[17:26] <Jaseman> well i have ps3 for games so....
[17:26] <Jaseman> if it can browse the web and server media...
[17:27] <Jaseman> what else you need a pc for?
[17:27] <hamitron> you really want faster machine to cross compile the stuff though, don't you? :/
[17:27] <_inc> flash will be a huge problem
[17:27] <_inc> at least initially it would
[17:27] <Jaseman> someone will find a way around that
[17:27] <Jaseman> like with the ipad
[17:27] <hamitron> fact is, the arm cpu on the pi is slow ;) need a faster cpu to do cpu intensive tasks
[17:28] <Jaseman> hopefully someone will make a faster version of it
[17:28] <hamitron> only way to live with a slower cpu for everything, is use smaller software
[17:28] <_inc> theres workaround for serving youtube videos via h.264 or webM or whatever, but actionscript style flash there is no alternative yet
[17:28] <Jaseman> which is more expensive
[17:29] <Jaseman> for those of us that work
[17:29] <_inc> apart from that browser that renders flash remotely and serves it to the iPad
[17:29] <Jaseman> well youtube is important to have
[17:29] <Jaseman> i dont care about flash games
[17:29] <dmsuse> ^^
[17:30] <Jaseman> if you want games get a ps3 or xbox
[17:30] <Jaseman> something designed for the job
[17:30] <_inc> Argos.co.uk uses flash to serve their product images for some reason
[17:30] <hamitron> or monster pc
[17:30] <hamitron> :)
[17:30] <_inc> and some clothing websites
[17:30] <hamitron> I got decent pc for gaming..... plus compiling large jobs
[17:31] <dmsuse> flash is 100% needed
[17:31] <Dagger3> _inc: it's so you can view the image through a tiny little viewport... rather than just showing you the entire high-res image all at once
[17:31] <Jaseman> well theyll hae to make a special page for pi users wont they
[17:31] <_inc> i dont understand why they dont go with jpeg/jquery or whatever
[17:31] <Jaseman> just dont shop there
[17:31] <_inc> Dagger3: would a more elegant solution be to use different quality images and a bit of jquery?
[17:32] <Jaseman> maybe there should be a pi homepage
[17:32] <Jaseman> so you set yuor browser to it....
[17:32] <Jaseman> and it will have links to tested websites
[17:32] <_inc> :P
[17:33] <Dagger3> I personally would prefer <a href="highresimage.jpg">High resolution image</a>
[17:33] <Jaseman> so you dont end up going to something that wont work properly
[17:33] <_inc> RaspberryPinternet?
[17:33] <Jaseman> yeah why not
[17:33] <IT_Sean> www.bla.pi ? :p
[17:33] <Dagger3> since I hate having to examine a big image in a 2" window on my 24" display... doing that is just stupid
[17:34] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[17:34] <Jaseman> they cater for mobile phone users
[17:34] <Jaseman> these online shops
[17:35] <Jaseman> well the webpage could have a meta tag
[17:35] <_inc> I hate the sites that have you examine the image at higher quality by using a virtual magnifying glass of sorts. I feel like Sherlock looking for evidence or whatnot
[17:35] <Jaseman> for jumping you to the Pi compatible version of the site
[17:36] <Jaseman> if theres enough pi users the sellers wont want to exclude that market
[17:38] <Jaseman> or...
[17:38] <Jaseman> some shops might take sale orders by email
[17:39] <dmsuse> it makes you wonder why shops such as argos do not get these things in
[17:39] <dmsuse> do they even have business managers?
[17:40] <Jaseman> they assume everyone is ruuning win 7 on a core i5
[17:40] <dmsuse> shame
[17:41] <_inc> does anyone share the opinion that the RPi wiki is starting to look like a huge datasheet? I think that for the RPi's objective (getting kids back into hobbyist hacking), the wiki would need to look less daunting for beginners
[17:41] <Jaseman> yes
[17:41] <Jaseman> i was scared away from it
[17:41] <_inc> styleguides need to be figured out i think
[17:42] <Jaseman> youtube tutorials is the way
[17:42] <_inc> video tuorials linked
[17:42] <_inc> yea some dude has already started a channel of tuts
[17:42] <_inc> on youtube
[17:42] <Jaseman> yes they are really good
[17:42] <_inc> I think lesson pages should be made and stuff like that
[17:43] <Jaseman> but not if you dont have access to any other computer
[17:43] <Jaseman> and you cant run youtube on your pi
[17:44] <Jaseman> you just need a good old hanbook
[17:44] <rm> you kinda can
[17:44] <rm> VLC can play youtube
[17:44] <rm> if VLC will be accelerated via the GPU, here you go, youtube works
[17:44] <_inc> Jaseman: starting to see why using the RPi is as a primary computer is a bad idea? :P
[17:44] <Jaseman> your talking about the computer novice here
[17:44] <WASDx> VLC has experimental GPU support yes
[17:44] <WASDx> works fine from what i've seen
[17:45] <_inc> i believe there is a VLC plugin for firefox?
[17:45] <WASDx> yes _inc
[17:45] <Jaseman> what you need is....
[17:45] <Jaseman> hire the community centre
[17:45] <Jaseman> and pull in all teh pipe smoking beardy weirdies
[17:45] <Jaseman> and show them how to set their computer up - in person
[17:45] <Jaseman> they will be in their element
[17:47] <Jaseman> build a community and let the novices teach each other
[17:47] <Jaseman> so that the experienced ones dont get hassled to death
[17:49] <_inc> Jaseman: sounds like this http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/Hackerspaces
[17:49] <_inc> but they dont all have beards and smoke pipes
[17:49] <Jaseman> but you know the audience im talking about
[17:50] <Jaseman> they were attracted to the low cost
[17:50] <Jaseman> the sorts that go to computer fairs and car boot sales
[17:51] <Jaseman> they like fishing and miniature railways
[17:52] <ReggieUK> this first run is aimed at the 'beardy weirdies' as you call them
[17:52] <Jaseman> volvo drivers
[17:52] <ReggieUK> to be picked up and run with by the hobby tech community, with the aim being that a lot of issues will be resolved by the community before the kids get near them
[17:53] <Jaseman> the kids will be too busy playing wii and sendind text msgs to each other
[17:54] <ReggieUK> you underestimate kids
[17:54] <_inc> definitely
[17:54] <Jaseman> i think some teens might get into it
[17:54] * Construct (~Construct@c-67-172-234-30.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:55] <ReggieUK> I think if it's played right you'll get 8year olds playing with one
[17:55] <Jaseman> i have a 6 yr old
[17:55] <Jaseman> hes playing burnout paradise as we speak
[17:56] <ReggieUK> not really a good comparison, a single 6 year old
[17:56] <ReggieUK> have you introduced him to anything other than pre-built PCs/consoles?
[17:56] <_inc> I think the RPi to this generation of kids could be like what the commodore64 was like for me
[17:57] <Jaseman> yes
[17:57] <Jaseman> hes not interested
[17:57] <ReggieUK> then you probably haven't mande it exciting enough
[17:57] <Jaseman> he does use youtube
[17:57] <ReggieUK> ...
[17:58] <_inc> make an RC Car with the RPi for him
[17:58] <dmsuse> i doubt any kid is going to like the pi to be fair...
[17:58] <Jaseman> but hes only just learning to read
[17:58] <_inc> or a Quadrocopter :P
[17:58] <_inc> dmsuse: how so?
[17:58] <Jaseman> oh he likes ms paint too
[17:58] <ReggieUK> _inc, indeed, the pi on it's own is an uninteresting lump, connected to other things, it'll be what you want it to be, kids need inspiring :)
[17:58] <dmsuse> well MOST kids these days have quad core computers to play their music and videos and 3d full action games
[17:59] <Jaseman> he uses the spray can to draw firework scenes
[17:59] <dmsuse> they won't give the pi a moments thought, in my opinion
[17:59] <ReggieUK> disagree on 'most' kids having quad core machines
[18:00] <izua_> dmsuse: yes
[18:00] <izua_> but those boxes have 0 usable IO from a hobbyists perspective
[18:00] <_inc> dmsuse: i get what you're saying, but that demographic of kids wont likely be interested in becoming a CompSci student or whatever
[18:01] <dmsuse> _inc: true, so i can only assume the only people this will help are the seriously poor and of those poor very few will actually "take to it"
[18:01] <ReggieUK> that's a failure on our part through education that they won't be interested in comp-sci, it's a shame that our kids get taught ICT which will give them a max ??20k skill level, instead of ??30k and up
[18:03] <_inc> I see the RPi as being the next step up from an arduino rather than a budget general purpose machine
[18:03] <Jaseman> when i saw a bbc computer for the first time i knew right away
[18:03] <Jaseman> this is what i want to be involved with
[18:04] <ReggieUK> _inc, agreed, it will do some stuff that a real PC will do and it'll do it well but expecting it to be a full blown PC on 700mhz is asking too much, something that seems to elude some people
[18:04] <Jaseman> there were about 3 other kids that were interested in it
[18:04] <Jaseman> in my class
[18:04] <Jaseman> the rest were not particularly interested
[18:05] <Jaseman> one of those kids now writes game reviews
[18:05] <Jaseman> for a magazine
[18:06] <ReggieUK> there were a few in my class, IT lessons were taken as an option and the classes were full
[18:06] * Hopsy (~kvirc@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:06] <ReggieUK> all my friends were interested in the bbc on one level or another
[18:06] <ReggieUK> also a well subscribed computer club that grew up around it
[18:06] <_inc> as far as programming languages are concerned, there is no limit to the RPi like there is with the arduino. hell, someone could even make a drag and drop interface for entry-level people to use the GPIO pins, work you way up to doing the same thing in C++
[18:07] <Jaseman> also depends on the area you live in
[18:07] <Jaseman> and what the parents are like
[18:07] <dmsuse> will a drag and drop teach you anything?
[18:07] <ReggieUK> It's a bit tiring really, reading/hearing all the negativity about the PI, if people keep thinking our kids won't aspire to stuff and don't give them anything to aspire to then they, err, won't aspire to anything
[18:07] <_inc> dmsuse: IO Signals
[18:08] <Jaseman> im positive about the pi
[18:08] <Jaseman> i just think it will be a different audience
[18:08] * Jarii (~Jarii@host96-165-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:08] <_inc> dmsuse: I mean like, have you seen what Automator (macosx) does for applescripts? completely drag and drop interface which effectively writes and applescript for you
[18:08] <Jaseman> if even one person gets interested in computers...
[18:08] <Jaseman> its a success
[18:09] <_inc> Jaseman: not financially :P
[18:09] <ReggieUK> I don't think it will necessarily be an easy path it's entrenched in our kids that computers are for offices
[18:09] <Jaseman> its not for profit
[18:09] <ReggieUK> but we have to start somewhere to address that
[18:09] <dmsuse> i have not seen that
[18:09] <Jaseman> when our generation are past it..
[18:09] <Jaseman> who will take out place?
[18:09] <Jaseman> there will be a skills gap
[18:10] <Jaseman> if we dont get the next gen interested in it
[18:10] <ReggieUK> this is hopefully the start, ICT needs to change and encompass everything that a computer can do for you
[18:10] <dmsuse> Jaseman: there are still millions of nerdy kids out there, all those kids will have a pi
[18:10] <dmsuse> but that is not the point
[18:10] <Jaseman> lets drop that topic
[18:11] <Jaseman> the pi is good and thats all you need to say
[18:11] <dmsuse> its okay :P
[18:11] <dmsuse> the gert board rules though :)
[18:12] <Jaseman> who is gert?
[18:12] <dmsuse> some guy that is making a board..
[18:12] <dmsuse> i have no idea..
[18:12] <Jaseman> i hope he gets celebrity status i really do
[18:12] <dmsuse> why?
[18:13] <Jaseman> dunno i just hope he does
[18:13] <dmsuse> but he didn't make the pi...
[18:14] <Jaseman> but hes somehow cuter as a character
[18:14] <Jaseman> just becuase hes called 'Gert'
[18:14] <haltdef> O_o
[18:14] <dmsuse> lol
[18:15] <dmsuse> one thing i have never understood is how people make these controllers to make motors move using a pc
[18:15] <dmsuse> i have always wanted to do it too, now i can :D
[18:15] <Jaseman> i want gert to have his own tv show
[18:15] <ReggieUK> http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/411
[18:15] <ReggieUK> gert already has celebrity status
[18:15] <Jaseman> Hello everybody Im gert and today we are going to be converting this old dishwasher into....
[18:15] <ReggieUK> not just 'some guy'
[18:15] <Jaseman> r2d2
[18:16] <Jaseman> a sort of techy scrapheap challenge
[18:16] <izua_> dmsuse: that's simple, usually a microcontroller :P
[18:16] <dmsuse> that would be an excellent show
[18:16] <izua_> which is sort of like an OS-less, barebones computer
[18:17] <izua_> you can still do that with a pc, just find a parallel port or something
[18:17] <dmsuse> izua_: well it's not so mucht he hardware connectivity I am talking of, it's the software
[18:17] <_inc> random note here, slim is quite a good minimal login manager. that is all
[18:18] <Jaseman> modders will like the pi
[18:18] <Jaseman> steam punk pi
[18:19] <izua_> dmsuse: oh, that's even easier
[18:19] <izua_> port |= (1 << pin)
[18:19] <izua_> sort of.
[18:19] <izua_> invert the mask to clear the bit
[18:19] <dmsuse> on windows~?
[18:19] <_inc> Quick servey? good lightweight browser candidates for the Pi?
[18:19] <izua_> do it fast enough, you have sort of a digital to analogue converter, although PWM stages come in handy
[18:19] <izua_> dmuse: on any C compiler
[18:20] <izua_> you just need to have port actually map to something
[18:20] <izua_> ie, an actual IO port
[18:20] <dmsuse> ah
[18:20] <izua_> there are still boxes with paraports around
[18:21] <Jaseman> that icethingy one
[18:21] <Jaseman> that comes with lxde
[18:25] <Jaseman> iceweasel browser
[18:25] <Jaseman> works fine on 256 ram
[18:26] <Jaseman> its based on firefox
[18:27] <pygo> and by based on, it is firefox sans the logo. only thing that wasn't GPL in firefox
[18:29] <_inc> thats some heavy modding :)
[18:29] <WASDx> my iceweasel actually crashed a lot
[18:30] <WASDx> when i tried it a long time ago, some beta version
[18:30] <WASDx> nowadays i use chromium
[18:31] <Jaseman> nobody will agree on a brower so...
[18:31] <Jaseman> just use what you like
[18:31] <WASDx> true
[18:31] <WASDx> same with distro
[18:31] <_inc> WASDx: whats the launch command for chromium?
[18:31] <_inc> my xfce menus are not playing nice
[18:31] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-254-48-178.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[18:31] <WASDx> _inc: for me in arch its simply chromium but in debian it is chromium-browser because there is some game named chromium
[18:32] <Jaseman> a lot of people are avoiding a gui
[18:32] <Jaseman> on the pi
[18:32] <dmsuse> shame
[18:32] <Jaseman> going command line only
[18:32] <WASDx> i'll use my pi as a headless server
[18:33] <_inc> me too, either that or xbmc media player
[18:33] <Jaseman> if youre only using ssh
[18:34] <Jaseman> to link in
[18:34] <Jaseman> you wont need xwindow
[18:34] <WASDx> yep
[18:34] <WASDx> i'll just connect it with hdmi or rca and install openssh server
[18:35] <dmsuse> would it be possible to use 2 pi's in a cluster to make it faster?
[18:35] <WASDx> there is a big thread about clustering going on in the forum
[18:35] <WASDx> i have no experienc of it myself
[18:35] <dmsuse> same
[18:35] <RITRedbeard> plan9
[18:35] <RITRedbeard> profit
[18:36] * prebz (~prebz@c83-254-48-178.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:36] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[18:36] <Jaseman> i think cluster is only useful for certain applications
[18:36] <Jaseman> like mass number crunching
[18:36] <RITRedbeard> lol
[18:36] * robde (~robde@p5790366C.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:36] <RITRedbeard> I just read Raspberry Pi page
[18:36] <WASDx> you could probably do it over the network-card which would be the bottleneck
[18:36] <Jaseman> where you can seperate the maths so that each machine does a little bit of it
[18:36] <RITRedbeard> English people complaining about SOPA, that's rich.
[18:37] <WASDx> compare 100mbit to regular RAM speeds
[18:37] <dmsuse> RITRedbeard: how is that rich?
[18:37] <Jaseman> depends how many machines you have in your cluster
[18:37] <Jaseman> and how complex the maths is
[18:37] <RITRedbeard> How many forms of ID do you need to buy silverware in this country again?
[18:37] <dmsuse> none?
[18:38] * robde_ (~robde@p57903468.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[18:38] <RITRedbeard> At least one.
[18:38] <dmsuse> however i do agree britain has no freedoms, mainly because we copy all US laws
[18:38] <RITRedbeard> No.
[18:38] <RITRedbeard> I can conceal carry when I go across the river.
[18:38] <RITRedbeard> You can't even think about a firearm otherwise the Ministry Of Luv will be after your arse.
[18:39] <dmsuse> you can carry a hunting rifle in a case anywhere you like...
[18:39] <_inc> conceal carry in the uk?
[18:39] <Jaseman> hush now the pair of you
[18:39] <Jaseman> make friends
[18:40] <dmsuse> k :P
[18:40] <MartijnVdS> Jaseman: make: *** No rule to make target `friends'. Stop.
[18:41] <Jaseman> i just dont want to read your trivial old arguement abuot which country has the best legal system
[18:41] <Jaseman> its too off-topic
[18:41] <MartijnVdS> --> ##politics, as we say on #ubuntu-uk
[18:42] <dmsuse> i don't want to argue political issues here, however SOPA is hardly irrelevant to this project. If it was they would not have posted it on the pi site :P
[18:43] <dmsuse> anyway.. as for the lan speed issue on clustering
[18:43] <MartijnVdS> dmsuse: people not in the US can't do a lot about what the US government wants to do though
[18:43] <dmsuse> it would still be faster than the sd card can read?
[18:43] <RITRedbeard> depends on what 'class' the card is
[18:43] <MartijnVdS> Class X = X MB/s read speed
[18:44] <MartijnVdS> or write
[18:44] <MartijnVdS> I always forge
[18:44] <MartijnVdS> t
[18:44] <dmsuse> well taking into account they say class 10's do not work on the pi
[18:44] <_inc> 10 is the limit for both lan and sd though?
[18:44] <RITRedbeard> probably write
[18:44] <MartijnVdS> dmsuse: yet
[18:44] <MartijnVdS> RITRedbeard: indeed, sustained write speed in fragmented state
[18:44] <Jaseman> just overclock it
[18:45] <dmsuse> they say they have only managed to overclock it by 150 before errors occur
[18:45] <Jaseman> i was joking
[18:45] <RITRedbeard> by 'they' do you mean those privileged enough to get a alpha/beta board?
[18:46] <RITRedbeard> "developer"
[18:46] <RITRedbeard> """"developer""""
[18:46] <Jaseman> can you run msdos on the pi?
[18:46] <MartijnVdS> no, MSDOS is not available for ARM
[18:46] <MartijnVdS> you could run qemu which emulates an i386 CPU which _can_ run DOS
[18:47] <MartijnVdS> but it'll probably as slow as DOS used to be ;)
[18:47] <Jaseman> i just want to run lotus 1-2-3 on it
[18:47] <Jaseman> wordstar and dbase3
[18:48] <dmsuse> Jaseman: use a dos emulator
[18:48] <Jaseman> and laplink
[18:48] <MartijnVdS> dosbox can do it too, I think
[18:49] <Jaseman> duke3d
[18:49] <Jaseman> multiplayer
[18:49] <Jaseman> under dos
[18:49] <MartijnVdS> Duke3d has been open sourced and runs natively on Linux ;)
[18:49] <dmsuse> ^^
[18:49] <Jaseman> ok
[18:49] <Jaseman> well that would be cool
[18:50] <Jaseman> we used to play 10 player duke every lunch time at work
[18:50] <RITRedbeard> You know what would be cool?
[18:50] <Jaseman> until we upgraded to win xp
[18:50] <RITRedbeard> If Pandaboard dropped to $100 on Raspberry Pi release.
[18:50] <MartijnVdS> RITRedbeard: Put RPi in a robot and have it _be_ a remote controlled duke nukem?
[18:50] <MartijnVdS> RITRedbeard: fully armed?
[18:50] <RITRedbeard> But then I woke up and I realized I was dreaming.
[18:52] <RITRedbeard> Actually if you were working a minimum wage job since the delay announcement you could probably buy a couple hundred RPis over.
[18:52] <MartijnVdS> if you hadn't bought food
[18:52] <RITRedbeard> Could probably save up with other individuals and buy a pick 'n place machine.
[18:53] <RITRedbeard> Blackmailed the board of directors at Broadcom.
[18:53] <RITRedbeard> Designed the IC in its entirety with discrete parts.
[18:54] * robde (~robde@p5790366C.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:54] <RITRedbeard> Conquer all of the known world like Alexander The Great.
[18:55] * robde (~robde@p57903A06.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:55] <MartijnVdS> RITRedbeard: You'd need to start a soldering sweatshop up north though
[18:56] * Ypsy (~ypsy@unaffiliated/ypsy) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:56] <RITRedbeard> That is fine. Many of my disenfranchised comrades in North America are looking for work.
[18:57] <MartijnVdS> "When I was young, we kept warm by the glow of our soldering irons"
[19:01] <dmsuse> lol
[19:03] <Jaseman> this SOPA thing seems all a bit late in the day
[19:04] <Jaseman> they should have put that in place in 1995
[19:04] <Jaseman> when internet was starting to become popular
[19:04] <MartijnVdS> Well there's the DMCA, Patriot act and CDA
[19:04] <MartijnVdS> I remember websites going black over the CDA
[19:04] <MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communications_Decency_Act
[19:05] * RITRedbeard (~RITReadbe@c-68-37-165-37.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[19:05] <Jaseman> lets say 'they' found a way to end piracy of music and software and movies
[19:05] <MartijnVdS> "end"
[19:05] <Jaseman> they wont necessarily make more money
[19:06] <Jaseman> people will just do without
[19:06] <MartijnVdS> People will find other ways to share stuff
[19:06] <Jaseman> i personally wouldnt care if no more new music was made
[19:06] <Jaseman> theres enough in back catelogue to keep me happy for the rest of my days
[19:07] <Jaseman> they are just churning out cover versions
[19:07] <Jaseman> even movies redone
[19:07] <Jaseman> flight of the pheonix, the wicker man etc
[19:08] <Jaseman> was nothing wrong with the original versions
[19:08] <Jaseman> and all the people who are too tight to buy windows
[19:08] * EiN_ is now known as EiNSTeiN_
[19:08] <Jaseman> will just move to linux
[19:08] * EiNSTeiN_ (~einstein@ Quit (Changing host)
[19:08] * EiNSTeiN_ (~einstein@unaffiliated/einstein/x-615171) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:08] <MartijnVdS> No they won't
[19:09] <MartijnVdS> they'll find a way to pirate Windows
[19:09] <Jaseman> im saying if they couldnt
[19:09] <Jaseman> if somehow they managed to cut it out completely
[19:09] <MartijnVdS> There will always be h4x0rs/script kiddies that h4x0r a version of windows
[19:09] <Jaseman> i would probably buy an oem copy of xp
[19:09] <Jaseman> if i had to
[19:10] <Jaseman> and make do with that
[19:11] <Jaseman> and if there were no music videos on youtube...
[19:11] <Jaseman> i think i could live with it
[19:11] <Jaseman> mtv and virgin put them out legally anyway
[19:11] <Jaseman> so whats the big deal?
[19:13] <Jaseman> and i dont care if record shops are closing down
[19:13] <Jaseman> you can buy cd's online
[19:13] <Jaseman> and it cuts the overheads
[19:13] <Jaseman> rant over
[19:13] <dmsuse> but those overheads provide your government with money to do wars :P
[19:14] <Jaseman> well there will be courier delivery
[19:14] <Jaseman> im sure they can tax that
[19:14] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-168-111-250.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:14] <PiBot> ShiftPlusOne| well we're running out of corners and the stoopid people corner is mine! >=/
[19:14] <Jaseman> via fuel tax
[19:14] <dmsuse> but a courier supplies the shop already...
[19:14] <Jaseman> and you probably drove to the shop
[19:15] <Jaseman> and fuelled your vehicle to get there
[19:15] <Jaseman> so they've got you every which way
[19:15] <dmsuse> what if you do it while on your weekly shop
[19:15] <dmsuse> so you would have used that fuel whether you went to get a cd or not :P
[19:15] <Jaseman> yeah they do sell cds in supermarkets
[19:15] <dmsuse> lol true
[19:16] <Jaseman> only mainstream stuff though
[19:16] <dmsuse> i am suprised those stores have stayed open so long
[19:16] <Jaseman> i bet i couldnt buy belinda carlisle's debut album in sainsbury's
[19:17] <dmsuse> lol
[19:17] <dmsuse> i say that in a petrol station once...
[19:17] <Jaseman> i got it used off amazon for ??2.40
[19:17] <dmsuse> *saw
[19:18] <dmsuse> amazon!?
[19:18] <dmsuse> something wrong with itunes :P ?
[19:18] <Jaseman> yeah
[19:18] <Jaseman> the bit rate
[19:18] <dmsuse> oh
[19:18] <Jaseman> i dont want in compressed mp3
[19:18] <ShiftPlusOne> they don't sell 320kb?
[19:18] <Jaseman> i rip my cd's as mds
[19:18] <MartijnVdS> 256ish kbps m4a
[19:19] <dmsuse> i was told you can't hear any higher than 128kb anyway?
[19:19] <MartijnVdS> not really that bad
[19:19] <ShiftPlusOne> and you think you can tell the difference between 320kb mp3 and something like FLAC?
[19:19] <Jaseman> well if you have an iso image of the cd
[19:19] <Jaseman> you can convert it down to whatever format you want
[19:19] <MartijnVdS> You think you can hear the difference between wav and flac? :P
[19:19] <Jaseman> to suit your mp3 player ot itunes or whatever
[19:20] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[19:20] <Jaseman> wav files would be ok
[19:20] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:20] <ShiftPlusOne> MartijnVdS, yes, if I store all my audio files as WAV, I will need to invest in a few more hard drives.
[19:20] <Jaseman> cds are baiscally wav files anyway without the headers
[19:21] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: ah yes and that's extra background noise
[19:21] <ShiftPlusOne> what background noise? wav files are pretty raw
[19:21] <Jaseman> just be more selective with your music
[19:21] * MartijnVdS uses FLAC -- banshee converts to mp3 as needed (i.e. when I drag files to my device)
[19:21] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: the noise of spinning rust
[19:21] <Jaseman> i bet you listen to the same few albums all the time
[19:21] <Jaseman> when you get bored with some...
[19:21] <ShiftPlusOne> spinning rust? what are you talking about? O_o
[19:21] <Jaseman> wipe them and replace
[19:21] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: Hard disks. Spinning rust.
[19:22] <MartijnVdS> Jaseman: I have 16G.. I can store enough mp3 music on there
[19:22] <MartijnVdS> Jaseman: also, 2TB in the desktop.. all my FLACs fit
[19:22] <ShiftPlusOne> and wav is relevant...how... what... I give up.
[19:22] <Jaseman> i have 120 gb of wma's
[19:22] <MartijnVdS> Jaseman: I have >500 CDs
[19:22] <Jaseman> about 2000 cds
[19:23] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: no, I was implying you'd be hearing the extra noise of harddisks if you used wav (as opposed to flac)
[19:23] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: as interference
[19:23] <Jaseman> sunday roast time
[19:23] <Jaseman> see ya
[19:23] <ShiftPlusOne> well that's news to me then
[19:24] <ReggieUK> I wonder how studios ever coped?
[19:24] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: If you're listening to music in the same room as 2 harddisks, you'll hear more harddisk noise compared to the room with 1 disk.
[19:24] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: not a lot more, but still: more
[19:25] <MartijnVdS> Nevermind.
[19:27] <ReggieUK> doesn't that depend on a couple of things
[19:27] <ReggieUK> like, are you wearing headphones
[19:27] <ReggieUK> or how loud you have your music
[19:27] <MartijnVdS> ReggieUK: OK, 200 hard disks in a datacentre
[19:27] <ReggieUK> now you're making the rules up as you go along
[19:27] <ShiftPlusOne> unless those hard drives have FLACs?
[19:27] <MartijnVdS> ShiftPlusOne: No, you need fewer disks for FLACs, so less disk noise
[19:27] <MartijnVdS> for the same amount of music
[19:28] <MartijnVdS> Not that it's enough noise to matter
[19:28] <ShiftPlusOne> Oh... I see what you've been trying to say all along now.
[19:28] <MartijnVdS> only people who buy those ??5000/meter audio cables would care
[19:28] <ReggieUK> meh, decent headphones = no noise
[19:28] <ShiftPlusOne> ah, audiophools, ey?
[19:28] <MartijnVdS> ReggieUK: I'd like you to meet my coworkers. :) They disprove your thesis on a daily basis.
[19:29] <ReggieUK> not in my house they don't
[19:29] <mrdragons> Good headphones are amazing.
[19:29] <ReggieUK> and that's where it matters, right here :)
[19:29] <MartijnVdS> well they do in my office :)
[19:30] <mrdragons> Wait, what are you talking about?
[19:31] <MartijnVdS> mrdragons: Noise.
[19:32] <mrdragons> Anything in particular about it? That's pretty vague...
[19:32] <MartijnVdS> mrdragons: Just that headphones aren't magic noise-removers if coworkers are involved :)
[19:33] <mrdragons> Oh yeah, espescially if they're open-back
[19:38] * barr5790 (~alan@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[19:45] <Jaseman> i dont like wearing headphones anymore
[19:46] <Jaseman> they are okay if you're going for a walk or something
[19:46] <Jaseman> but i dont want them on in the house
[19:46] <Jaseman> just think....
[19:47] <Jaseman> some chinese person is probably building raspberry pi's as we speak
[19:47] <dmsuse> does it matter?
[19:47] <dmsuse> i would prefer a chinese version
[19:47] <dmsuse> cheaper :P
[19:48] <Jaseman> not after import charges
[19:48] <dmsuse> i have ordered lots from china
[19:48] <dmsuse> i estimate they can deliver it for around ??3/4
[19:49] <Jaseman> i got an sd card from hong kong
[19:49] <Jaseman> was garbage
[19:49] <mrdragons> I personally can't listen to music without my headphones anymore, let alone earbuds. *shudders*
[19:49] <Jaseman> it failed whilst copying the first couple of files to it
[19:50] * UnaClocker (~unaclocke@24-113-85-150.wavecable.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:50] <Jaseman> also i bought some micro sd card readers
[19:50] <Jaseman> very small ones from hong kong
[19:50] <Jaseman> also failed in a few days
[19:51] * _inc (~inc@unaffiliated/-inc/x-0498339) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[19:51] <Jaseman> but they were like 99p each or something
[19:51] <dmsuse> hmm
[19:51] <Jaseman> so i got a kingston reader off amazon which worked a lot better
[19:52] <dmsuse> but the pi's are being made in china...
[19:52] <Jaseman> were the prototypes made there too?
[19:52] <dmsuse> no
[19:53] <dmsuse> well
[19:53] <dmsuse> maybe
[19:53] <dmsuse> i doubt it though
[19:53] <Jaseman> i think they got a sample one from china
[19:53] <Jaseman> before the 10k order
[19:53] <Jaseman> well i hope they did
[19:54] <haltdef> I got two for 99p from ebay, uk seller
[19:54] <Jaseman> sd cards?
[19:54] <haltdef> microsd to sd adapters
[19:54] <haltdef> I tend to kill them very quickly
[19:55] <Jaseman> oh...
[19:55] <Jaseman> these were no adapters...
[19:55] * izua_ is now known as bobby_Tables
[19:55] <haltdef> ..ick
[19:55] <dmsuse> i have only ever broke one
[19:55] * bobby_Tables is now known as izua
[19:55] <dmsuse> it got really really really hot
[19:55] * robde_ (~robde@p5790301F.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:55] <haltdef> my latest one went read only with no visible damage
[19:55] <Jaseman> the ones i had the plastic casing fell apart
[19:55] <Jaseman> and then it wasnt making a good connection
[19:56] * robde (~robde@p57903A06.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[19:57] <Jaseman> they should bring back punch cards
[19:57] * _inc (~inc@unaffiliated/-inc/x-0498339) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:57] <Jaseman> mechanical punch cards
[19:58] <Jaseman> you would need a lot of card to store 1 tb of data though
[19:58] <tntexplosivesltd> and it's write-once
[19:58] <Jaseman> doesnt matter
[19:59] <tntexplosivesltd> oh?
[19:59] <Jaseman> i keep having this idea about storing data on grains of sand
[19:59] <Jaseman> not sure how it would work exactly
[19:59] <mrdragons> I thought we already do that
[20:00] <Jaseman> no i mean yuo could literally get a cup full of sand
[20:00] <Jaseman> feed it into a machine
[20:00] <Jaseman> that would read and write data onto it
[20:00] <haltdef> you must smoke some good shit
[20:00] <Jaseman> lol
[20:00] <mrdragons> Um... Yeah...
[20:00] <Jaseman> it would laser small indentations
[20:01] <Jaseman> into the grain of sand
[20:01] <Jaseman> the depth of the indent would represent a letter of asci code
[20:01] <haltdef> please stop
[20:01] <Jaseman> ok
[20:01] <mrdragons> There's so many things wrong with that idea
[20:01] <ShiftPlusOne> and how would the data be sorted?
[20:01] <mrdragons> Just so many things
[20:02] <Jaseman> through a filter
[20:02] <ReggieUK> there aren't enough grains of sand
[20:02] <ReggieUK> and how would you sort them?
[20:02] <Jaseman> which can pull one grain through at a time
[20:02] <Jaseman> very quickly
[20:02] <tntexplosivesltd> then you lose 1 grain
[20:02] <Jaseman> it would be random access
[20:02] <mrdragons> Which, of course, would be faster than electricity
[20:02] <mrdragons> In an organized fashion
[20:02] <tntexplosivesltd> and everything turns to shit
[20:03] <ReggieUK> throw in some water and make a castle
[20:03] * _ross (~ross@188-221-247-176.zone12.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:03] <Jaseman> the order wouldnt matter
[20:03] <ReggieUK> ?
[20:03] <Jaseman> each grain would have an index on it
[20:03] <mrdragons> wtf
[20:03] <tntexplosivesltd> oh my god stop
[20:03] <ShiftPlusOne> and how would this index be stored?
[20:03] <ReggieUK> some ideas just never need to see the light of day
[20:04] <Jaseman> but think of all the deserts out there
[20:04] <haltdef> woo, sea's mental
[20:04] <Jaseman> waiting to be turned into data stores
[20:04] <ReggieUK> I wonder if theres a market for a laser arse scratcher, for instance?
[20:04] <haltdef> sounds like a jet engine
[20:04] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:04] <mrdragons> Why don't you, you know, take the silicon from the sand and actually do something useful?
[20:04] <ReggieUK> zomg, mrdragons, you mean like microchips?
[20:05] <ReggieUK> you could be onto something there :D
[20:05] <mrdragons> Like make a device with billions of transistors, yeah
[20:05] <mrdragons> But really, really small
[20:05] <ReggieUK> how small though?
[20:05] <ReggieUK> smaller than a grain of sand?
[20:05] <Jaseman> sub atomic
[20:06] <mrdragons> Pfft... I dunno, I don't think we'll ever be able to make anything useful that's smaller than a room
[20:06] <ReggieUK> who would need it too?
[20:06] <Jaseman> why does it have to be small
[20:06] <ShiftPlusOne> how tiny is your room? O_o
[20:06] <Jaseman> theres loads of unoccupied space on the planet
[20:06] <Jaseman> just make it huge
[20:06] <ReggieUK> so, about my laser arse scratcher, bad idea?
[20:06] <mrdragons> Exactly, who would ever want a computer in their home? XD
[20:07] <Jaseman> i can see a few probs with it
[20:07] <Jaseman> you might over cook your ass
[20:07] <Jaseman> and burn a tiny hole
[20:07] <Jaseman> right through
[20:07] <ShiftPlusOne> I think a laser would burn rather than scratch.... it might work as an arse warmer, but I don't know if there's a market.
[20:07] <ReggieUK> hence me using it as an example of an idea that should never see the light of day
[20:07] <duckinator> ReggieUK: use a UV light and advertise it for ass-tanning purposes
[20:07] <Jaseman> you could use the sand again
[20:08] <Jaseman> for arse scratching
[20:08] <ShiftPlusOne> actually the sand thing would make a cool demo
[20:08] <Jaseman> sand paper
[20:08] <ReggieUK> I want to scratch it not draw blood
[20:08] <Jaseman> very fine sand
[20:08] <ShiftPlusOne> oh there are many different grades of sand paper!
[20:08] <mrdragons> 3000 grit. :D
[20:08] <Jaseman> it will be coated to the inner side of your underwear
[20:09] <Jaseman> so you are being scratched as you walk
[20:09] <mrdragons> While holding a bunch of random characters inscribed into sand
[20:09] <ShiftPlusOne> and you can always follow the blood trail home
[20:09] <Jaseman> you may mock the idea now
[20:10] <Jaseman> but they thought man would never fly
[20:10] <ReggieUK> not just now, always
[20:10] <ReggieUK> could always use my ass as the grain reader
[20:10] <mrdragons> Yeah man, sand inscribing is the future, sorry for doubting you
[20:10] <ReggieUK> although you'd need to augment the ass for better resolution I expect
[20:10] <Jaseman> ill invite you over when after ive made a fortune with my sand lasering patent for data storage
[20:11] <Jaseman> maybe you could just store everything inside a single grain
[20:11] <mrdragons> If you're going to go that far, why not just store data in DNA?
[20:11] * LiENUS (~whodat@2001:470:bbb3:12:2475:431f:8302:e42a) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:12] <Jaseman> yes....
[20:12] <Jaseman> and inject it into your body
[20:12] <mrdragons> Think about it, you can store an incredible amount of data in a small amount of space, which, if mixed with an already living organism, could replicate itself
[20:12] <Jaseman> to recover the data you just take a mouth swab of your saliva
[20:13] <mrdragons> We could invent a new system, using powers of 4 instead of powers of two to read data
[20:13] <Jaseman> no instead of zeros and ones....
[20:13] <Jaseman> 256 seperate states
[20:14] <Jaseman> to cover teh asci code
[20:14] <mrdragons> You'd need 2048 to do that
[20:14] * victhor (~victhor@ has joined #raspberrypi
[20:14] <mrdragons> 1 ascii=8 bits
[20:14] <Jaseman> well we can just limit it to the alphabet
[20:14] <ReggieUK> something already stored data in dna
[20:15] <Jaseman> numbers 0-9 and symbols
[20:15] <mrdragons> ReggieUK: No way! Linky?
[20:15] * Faperdaper (~Faperdape@dhcp-077-250-027-109.chello.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:15] <ReggieUK> erm, it's full of data, hence us decoding the genome
[20:15] <Jaseman> well each indent would represent one byte
[20:16] <ReggieUK> liar
[20:16] <Faperdaper> Lol.
[20:16] <Jaseman> ive already made that joke
[20:16] <Faperdaper> ^ haha
[20:16] <dmsuse> just kidding :P
[20:16] <Jaseman> this morning
[20:16] <dmsuse> Jaseman: damn :(
[20:16] <Faperdaper> Obious troll is obvious
[20:16] <mrdragons> Well, I mean artificially stored. :P
[20:16] <Jaseman> cry wolf
[20:17] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:17] <Jaseman> i wonder what time of the day they will start to sell them
[20:18] <Jaseman> and which day of the week
[20:18] <Jaseman> im guessing 9am
[20:18] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:18] <mrdragons> Prolly on the 18th
[20:18] <mrdragons> But really, the DNA thing would be awesome
[20:18] <Jaseman> it could have some unexpected side effects
[20:19] <dmsuse> i feel sorry for the poor guy having to box, print and post 10k units
[20:19] <Jaseman> like you might change gender
[20:19] <mrdragons> Yeah, like having to watch out for actual viruses. >_>
[20:19] <Jaseman> what about the guy making the sd cards?
[20:19] <Jaseman> with the standard build
[20:20] <dmsuse> lol
[20:20] <dmsuse> nah i could do that within a few hours easily
[20:20] <Jaseman> 10 thousand of them?
[20:20] <dmsuse> yup
[20:20] <Jaseman> 84 per second you reckon
[20:21] <ShiftPlusOne> sending them out alone would take you the whole week
[20:21] <dmsuse> well say i have 20 card readers
[20:21] <dmsuse> and a script that changes led when its done
[20:21] <dmsuse> i just move down putting in the sd cards
[20:21] <dmsuse> then go back to the top remove and put new in
[20:21] <dmsuse> a few hours and its done :P
[20:21] <ShiftPlusOne> probably more than a week actually
[20:22] <dmsuse> do they even coming with sd cards?
[20:22] <dmsuse> im pretty sure they don't...
[20:22] <ShiftPlusOne> not at the start
[20:22] <Jaseman> no youll be able to buy the sd cards
[20:22] <Jaseman> but....
[20:22] <dmsuse> ah
[20:22] <dmsuse> i doubt they will sell many..
[20:22] <ShiftPlusOne> even when they do, I think they'll have blank sd cards and you'll download your own image... if they're smart anyway.
[20:22] <Jaseman> i bet they dont have 10 thousand power adapters and sd cards in stock
[20:23] <mrdragons> That's not that big a number
[20:23] <Jaseman> it is if you have to pay for them upfront
[20:23] <Jaseman> and hope someone buys them off you
[20:23] <ShiftPlusOne> and storage is a massive PITA if you don't have a warehouse
[20:23] * Ogoshi (~Ogoshi@5ad41351.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:24] <mrdragons> What I would expect them to do is forward orders for chargers to a separate company
[20:24] <dmsuse> 10k will fit in a bedroom easy
[20:24] <mrdragons> And they do have a warehouse, lol
[20:25] <ShiftPlusOne> I was speaking in general
[20:25] <mrdragons> Well yeah
[20:25] <ShiftPlusOne> (my garage and verandah are filled with ebay stock, it's annoying)
[20:25] <Jaseman> and each will have a slight scent of liz's perfume on them
[20:25] <haltdef> are you going to get all pervy on us again
[20:25] <Jaseman> yep
[20:25] <Jaseman> lol
[20:25] <dmsuse> liz banned me on the forum..
[20:26] <Jaseman> why?
[20:26] <ShiftPlusOne> if I was still a mod, I'd ban you too >=/
[20:26] <dmsuse> because i said it was rather childing to be calling peopel arseholes
[20:26] <haltdef> well I give up cross compiling for router
[20:26] <haltdef> nightmare
[20:26] <dmsuse> *childish
[20:26] <dmsuse> obviously without the typo's
[20:26] <mrdragons> How do you get banned from that forum? The mods are so lax
[20:26] <dmsuse> evidently not :P
[20:26] <ShiftPlusOne> did you get a warning first?
[20:26] <dmsuse> no..
[20:26] <Jaseman> i think you should refrain even using the word on the forum
[20:27] <Jaseman> even in opposition to it
[20:27] <ShiftPlusOne> I guess you caught her on a bad day or something.
[20:27] <dmsuse> must have.
[20:27] <Jaseman> who called someone an arsehole anyway?
[20:27] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:27] <dmsuse> nothing to do with the fact it was liz that was calling people arseholes, I am sure ;)
[20:27] <Jaseman> i didnt see that post
[20:28] <dmsuse> liz and another admin
[20:28] <ShiftPlusOne> or you were just being a distruptive arse.
[20:28] * robde (~robde@p579035BE.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:28] <Jaseman> the forum will go quiet
[20:28] * robde_ (~robde@p5790301F.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[20:28] <Jaseman> when they all get their hardware
[20:28] <dmsuse> maybe so, however i feel the original poster made a fair comment
[20:28] <Jaseman> eveyrone will be too busy to post anything
[20:29] <ShiftPlusOne> Jaseman, no it won't. Everyone will post their problems on there. "Halp! My linux isn't working!" and so on.
[20:29] <Ogoshi> I think the projext. Sid
[20:29] <Jaseman> yeah that will be boring
[20:29] <ShiftPlusOne> and don't forget "It doesn't run Windows 7 and minecraft!?!?!?! >=/"
[20:29] <Jaseman> and others saying...
[20:29] <Ogoshi> I think the project side of things will stay quite active on the forum
[20:29] <Jaseman> my sd card is missing
[20:29] <Jaseman> and the power supply
[20:29] <Jaseman> or ....
[20:29] <mrdragons> Ugh, I'm not particularly looking forward to all the noobs.
[20:30] <Jaseman> how do i switch it on?
[20:30] <dmsuse> how do you switch it on.... ?
[20:30] <ShiftPlusOne> plug it in
[20:30] <dmsuse> is that all ?
[20:30] <Jaseman> the raspberry
[20:30] <mrdragons> There's been an influx of them since we've gotten closer to the release date, now a lot of threads are questions that have already been answered by the FAQ
[20:31] <Jaseman> wheres the on button?
[20:31] <dmsuse> there isn't one...
[20:31] <ShiftPlusOne> there is no on or off.... just plug it in.
[20:31] <Jaseman> but someone will ask that
[20:31] <mrdragons> Ok but now its not booting what now
[20:31] <Stskeeps> i honestly wouldn't mind a on-off button on it
[20:31] <ShiftPlusOne> make your own
[20:31] <Jaseman> and wheres the vga connector
[20:31] <mrdragons> says "can not find kernel.img" wtf
[20:32] <dmsuse> let's just hope all newbs buy the sd card with linux pre-installed.
[20:32] <Jaseman> they wont
[20:32] <ShiftPlusOne> just need a manual to refer people to, that's all.
[20:32] <mrdragons> I hope not, I just hope they google shizz instead of going straight to the forums
[20:33] <Ogoshi> Is the point of the Raspi to learn all this though?!
[20:33] <dmsuse> totally is :D
[20:33] <Jaseman> i think most of the people that buy them will be seasoned IT boffins
[20:33] <Jaseman> like you lot
[20:36] <mrdragons> Nah, I think a lot of people are going to buy it just because it's a cheap computer. :P
[20:37] <Jaseman> those sorts of people wont have heard of it
[20:37] <dmsuse> but it's not so cheap...
[20:37] <Jaseman> rasberry pi? ya what? what ya on about?
[20:37] <mrdragons> I dunno, there's a ton of people that know about it
[20:37] <dmsuse> after buying an sd card, power cable, keyboard, mouse, hdmi/component cable
[20:38] <dmsuse> then tax and shipping
[20:38] <Jaseman> who doesnt own a keyboard
[20:38] * LiENUS (~whodat@2001:470:bbb3:12:2475:431f:8302:e42a) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:38] <Jaseman> any one that doesnt is dead in my view
[20:38] <mrdragons> That's a retarded argument
[20:38] <dmsuse> well, this is aimed towards kids with no coputer?
[20:38] <dmsuse> *computer
[20:39] <Jaseman> true
[20:39] <dmsuse> or did i miss something?
[20:39] <mrdragons> the board is just a motherboard
[20:39] <Jaseman> i cant imagine not owning a computer
[20:39] <mrdragons> Not a complete computer
[20:39] <Jaseman> its a basic human need
[20:39] <ShiftPlusOne> I think it's moreso parents who don't want their kids to get their computers all sticky.
[20:39] <dmsuse> mrdragons: then it requires further cost.. hence my retarded argument..
[20:40] <mrdragons> But the foundation acknolaged that the cost of extra peripherals wasn't taken into account in the price
[20:40] <dmsuse> k
[20:41] * atts (~asheehan@static-99-136-171-68.axsne.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:41] <mrdragons> It's still dirt cheap in comparison with a "normal" computer
[20:41] <ShiftPlusOne> but you get what you pay for
[20:41] <Jaseman> if you asked around the neighbourhood
[20:41] <Jaseman> someone would give you a spare keyboard for free
[20:42] * Ogoshi (~Ogoshi@5ad41351.bb.sky.com) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[20:42] <dmsuse> that's good to know, i have gone through about 10 keyboards this past year :P
[20:42] <mrdragons> Holy hell what are you doing on your keyboards? XD
[20:42] <dmsuse> coffee :P
[20:42] <dmsuse> it attracts it, somehow :P
[20:42] <tntexplosivesltd> you need a mechanical one, man
[20:43] <mrdragons> Ah, yep.
[20:43] <ShiftPlusOne> or that roll-out rubbery one
[20:43] <mrdragons> Or a sippy cup. :P
[20:43] <Jaseman> i have a saitek eclipse ii
[20:43] <dmsuse> ^ i have had a rubber fold up one before, they are really unresponsive
[20:43] <tntexplosivesltd> rubbery ones feel horrible
[20:43] <tntexplosivesltd> I am a mech convery
[20:43] <tntexplosivesltd> * convert
[20:44] <ShiftPlusOne> Speaking of coffee, I am going to go get some tea.
[20:45] <Jaseman> can you turn a speccy 48 into a usb keyboard?
[20:45] <mrdragons> Prolly
[20:45] <tntexplosivesltd> use a teensy =D
[20:46] * _inc (~inc@unaffiliated/-inc/x-0498339) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[20:46] <Jaseman> speak n spell keyboard
[20:46] <Jaseman> would be cool
[20:46] <tntexplosivesltd> =D
[20:46] <mrdragons> D:
[20:47] * _inc (~inc@unaffiliated/-inc/x-0498339) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:48] <Jaseman> modified typewriter
[20:49] <Jaseman> who needs keyboard anyway
[20:49] <Jaseman> onscreen keyb
[20:49] <tntexplosivesltd> that's all I use
[20:49] <Jaseman> with a mouse
[20:49] <tntexplosivesltd> mice are for pussies
[20:49] <Jaseman> touchpad
[20:49] <tntexplosivesltd> (pun intended)
[20:50] <Jaseman> you know those tiny keyboards for ps3 controllers
[20:50] <tntexplosivesltd> or the xbox ones
[20:51] <tntexplosivesltd> they suck
[20:51] <Jaseman> ive never used one
[20:52] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:52] <Jaseman> http://www.cartft.com/image_db/MiniKey_Komplett.jpg
[20:53] <mrdragons> You mean the tiny kind with hard plastic buttons where the keys always stick?
[20:54] <Jaseman> it might just suit a raspberry pi though
[20:54] <tntexplosivesltd> I think not
[20:54] * BarryK (5211f3ec@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[20:55] <tntexplosivesltd> usability--
[20:56] <Jaseman> im thinking of it for kiosk use
[20:56] * MystX (~MystX@ec2-107-21-100-215.compute-1.amazonaws.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:56] <Jaseman> like on a display of some sort
[20:57] <tntexplosivesltd> well it would need to be huge
[20:57] <tntexplosivesltd> because people are idiots
[20:58] <Jaseman> you could build a vending machine
[20:58] <Jaseman> hows that for a project
[21:00] <Jaseman> im sure gert could assist
[21:01] <tntexplosivesltd> for what though?
[21:01] <BarryK> i'll be trying to make a touchscreen jukebox type device for my kitchen at some point, depending on how long their 1 per house embargo lasts lol
[21:01] <Jaseman> lego spacemen
[21:01] <tntexplosivesltd> what would the assistance be needed for?
[21:01] <Jaseman> you cuold have them on a shelf
[21:01] <Jaseman> with old cd drives
[21:01] <Jaseman> so you eject the cd drive
[21:02] <Jaseman> and it falls off the shelf
[21:02] <Jaseman> and displenses your item
[21:02] * _inc (~inc@unaffiliated/-inc/x-0498339) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[21:02] <Jaseman> or chocolate bars or something
[21:03] <Jaseman> or you cuold modify an old flatbed scanner
[21:03] <Jaseman> as the thing that pushes the item
[21:03] <tntexplosivesltd> what would we need the assistance for?
[21:03] <Jaseman> nothing i guess
[21:04] <tntexplosivesltd> it's all pretty straightforward
[21:04] <tntexplosivesltd> not to discredit anyone
[21:04] <Jaseman> how many cd rom drives can you connect
[21:04] <Jaseman> to one raspberry?
[21:05] <Jaseman> self powered cd rom drives
[21:05] <tntexplosivesltd> gepends on the interface
[21:05] <tntexplosivesltd> * depends
[21:05] <tntexplosivesltd> USB ones, heaps
[21:05] <tntexplosivesltd> then use the eject command
[21:06] <tntexplosivesltd> linux ftw
[21:06] <Jaseman> now im thinking about some sort of cd rom drive dance
[21:06] <Jaseman> where the trays are opening and closing to music
[21:06] <tntexplosivesltd> lol
[21:07] <Jaseman> mexican wave of cd rom drives
[21:08] <mrdragons> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsQd2n99zS4 ?
[21:08] <tntexplosivesltd> would be ridiculously simple
[21:09] <Jaseman> yeah
[21:09] <ShiftPlusOne> I don't think any video will beat the bohemian raphsody played with various computer hardware video.
[21:09] <Jaseman> sounds like my kinda project then!
[21:09] <mrdragons> That was great
[21:10] <BarryK> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OmO-9c_kP4
[21:12] <Jaseman> raspberry would be good for that
[21:12] <ShiftPlusOne> BarryK, nice
[21:12] <Jaseman> the text should scroll
[21:12] <Jaseman> that would be nicer
[21:13] <ShiftPlusOne> though that looks like a classroom
[21:13] <Jaseman> marquee style
[21:13] <BarryK> lol pretty sure it is a classroom
[21:13] <ShiftPlusOne> so I am just wondering if one of the teachers decided to hijack a classroom to make a youtube video
[21:13] <tntexplosivesltd> sounds like a student though
[21:13] <BarryK> well uni tech lab i'd imagine
[21:14] <ShiftPlusOne> wonder how he justified that to the professor, lol
[21:14] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh, actually in my uni nobody would care, but still.
[21:15] <Jaseman> has anyone ever dismantled one of those electronic picture frames?
[21:15] <tntexplosivesltd> I have been meaning to
[21:16] <tntexplosivesltd> U have one, just haven't got around to it
[21:16] <tntexplosivesltd> * I have one
[21:16] <ShiftPlusOne> I'd imagine that many people have... check out hackaday, I am sure there is plenty about that
[21:16] <Jaseman> can you display the photos in a specific order
[21:16] <ShiftPlusOne> though it's normally about turning old laptops into picture frames
[21:16] * robde_ (~robde@p57903DCC.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:16] <Jaseman> or it shows them random sequence
[21:16] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:16] <tntexplosivesltd> often in filename order
[21:17] <tntexplosivesltd> but the delay between them is slow
[21:17] <Jaseman> a pi could be a good pciture frame
[21:17] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:17] <Jaseman> i think they are quite expensive aren't they?
[21:17] <Jaseman> to buy
[21:17] <tntexplosivesltd> ~$100NZ here
[21:17] <tntexplosivesltd> so whatever that is where you are
[21:18] <Jaseman> i think it varies a lot
[21:18] * robde (~robde@p579035BE.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[21:18] <Jaseman> on the screen size
[21:18] <tntexplosivesltd> and it would be able to be hooked up to whatever
[21:18] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:18] <Jaseman> but if you happen to have a lot of old lcd monitors
[21:18] <Jaseman> like i do
[21:18] <MystX> I only have 2 =(
[21:18] <Jaseman> they could be used for slideshows
[21:19] <Jaseman> ive got 3 19" monitors spare
[21:19] <Jaseman> 4 17"
[21:19] <MystX> Sweeet
[21:19] <Jaseman> and 6 15"
[21:19] <Jaseman> just sitting doing nothing
[21:20] <Jaseman> could hook a pi onto the back of those
[21:20] <Jaseman> and put them to some use
[21:20] <Jaseman> display boards
[21:21] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) Quit (Quit: kthxbai)
[21:21] <MystX> eyefinity
[21:22] * LiENUS (~whodat@99-188-184-130.lightspeed.btrgla.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:23] <Jaseman> if you could display a quarter of a movie
[21:23] <Jaseman> on each screen
[21:23] <Jaseman> or 6 screens
[21:24] <Jaseman> 3 wide and two high
[21:24] <Jaseman> and get it to show a movie across them
[21:24] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:24] <PiBot> ukscone| <ukscone> Dear Santa. I've been good all year...Well most of the year....Okay f**k it, i'll buy my own
[21:25] <BarryK> not likely, pretty sure the GPU on the Pi would crumble under that amount of stress
[21:25] <tntexplosivesltd> ya
[21:25] <Jaseman> 6 pi's could handle it though
[21:25] <tntexplosivesltd> but then you have to sync them
[21:25] <tntexplosivesltd> shotgun not
[21:26] <Jaseman> you just need to trigger the play button
[21:26] <Jaseman> so they all start at the same time
[21:26] <BarryK> so great for a single movie so long as you dont try and pause it, but pretty much hopeless for anything else lol
[21:27] <tntexplosivesltd> but they will bet out of time as they play
[21:27] <tntexplosivesltd> * get
[21:27] <tntexplosivesltd> there's no doubt about that
[21:27] <Jaseman> forget that then
[21:27] <BarryK> lol
[21:27] <Jaseman> stick with a vending machine
[21:28] <Jaseman> made from cd rom drives
[21:29] <BarryK> lol why cdrom drives and not just some basic stepper motors
[21:30] <Jaseman> because i have cd rom drives already to hand
[21:30] <Jaseman> and the eject feature is easy to trigger
[21:31] <Jaseman> cd rom drives.... on wheels
[21:31] <Jaseman> in a match of 'don't push me!'
[21:31] <Jaseman> the wheels are not powered
[21:32] <tntexplosivesltd> ???_???
[21:32] <tntexplosivesltd> stop talking
[21:35] * m910q (NoName@ Quit ()
[21:38] <Jaseman> its very quiet when im not talking
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[21:46] <ShiftPlusOne> people just need to recover from all the nonsense for a bit
[21:48] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:49] * robde_ (~robde@p57903DCC.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[21:52] <BarryK> I think my first bit of work will be a case with a powered usb hub powering the pi, a bluetooth controller, a wireless gamepad/keyboard controller and a IR sensor for XBMC and a few emus for a laugh
[21:54] <BarryK> but pretty much all of that will have to wait to see what libs are supported at release
[21:55] <ReggieUK> anyone that likes astronomy or science in general, BBC2 are running 3 consecutive nights of 'stargazing LIVE' starting tomorrow evening at 8.30pm -10pm and tues/wed 8pm-10pm
[21:56] * Faperdaper (~Faperdape@dhcp-077-250-027-109.chello.nl) Quit (Quit: Quit)
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[22:00] <dmsuse> stargazing?
[22:00] * Tobias| (~Tobias@unaffiliated/tobias/x-2050245) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:00] <mrdragons> Sounds kinda interesting, what kind of stuff will they be doing?
[22:13] <Thorn_> is it out yet
[22:13] <mrdragons> Yah I just got mine
[22:13] <mrdragons> It was only $1027
[22:13] * mrdragons didn't actually get one
[22:15] <wwalker> mrdragons: none of them went that cheap...
[22:15] <mrdragons> cba to convert pounts to dollars
[22:16] <Thorn_> 1.6
[22:18] * Hideki (~hideki@cpc1-york2-0-0-cust489.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[23:01] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[23:05] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:05] <PiBot> IT_Sean| That can be our motto! #raspberrypi, more fun than a spreadsheet!
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[23:08] * atts (~asheehan@static-99-136-171-68.axsne.net) has left #raspberrypi
[23:09] * Jaseman (5f93f1a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[23:14] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[23:18] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-168-111-250.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[23:25] <dmsuse> quiet :p
[23:25] <IT_Sean> Shh.. 's quiet time.
[23:26] * dmsuse sleeps
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[23:35] <cornet> somone needs to tell PiBot that anything is more fun than a spreadsheet
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These logs were automatically created by RaspberryPiBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.