#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2012-01-31

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:04] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7-dev)
[0:06] * atts (~asheehan@static-99-136-171-68.axsne.net) has left #raspberrypi
[0:11] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:15] * hotwings (hd@secksy.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:15] * LiENUX is now known as LiENUS
[0:17] * saua (~saua@193.81-167-3.customer.lyse.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[0:19] * imnichol_ (~ian@ Quit (Client Quit)
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[0:21] * krake (~krake@p5790387F.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:22] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[0:25] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
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[0:29] * PiBot (~Raspberry@c-24-147-35-37.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[0:30] <DaQatz> Is it out yet?
[0:30] * PiBot slaps DaQatz across the face with a cast iron pan.
[0:30] <DaQatz> =)
[0:31] <ShiftPlusOne> I think you're stepping into thorn's turf here.
[0:31] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net245-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:34] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[0:34] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:36] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:42] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:48] <DaQatz> ShiftPlusOne PiBot has been doing that awhile now.
[0:48] <ShiftPlusOne> I know, I meant the actual question.
[0:49] <DaQatz> Ah
[0:49] <DaQatz> That was just to trigger PiBot
[0:49] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, I got it.
[0:55] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net245-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[0:55] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net50-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:56] <MystX> Is it out though?
[0:57] * feep (~feep@p5B2B5BBE.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[0:58] * r4m (~r5m@173-8-138-134-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[1:00] * jardiamj (~chatzilla@221-228-212-206-wiban.onlinemac.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:01] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:02] <tntexplosivesltd> I think it is
[1:02] <MystX> Yay
[1:03] <IT_Sean> no, it isn't
[1:03] <tntexplosivesltd> go check facebook, it's on there
[1:04] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:05] * koaschten_ (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:06] <MystX> Yeah I ordered mine already =P
[1:07] * amandarn_ (~mandarine@unaffiliated/amandarn) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:07] <MystX> Hmm. Im a bit unsure on how to hide/unhide things based on a cookie value
[1:08] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[1:09] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:09] <MystX> =\
[1:10] * amandarn (~mandarine@unaffiliated/amandarn) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[1:10] <mrdragons> On a server? Php script maybe?
[1:10] * DexterLB (~angel@77-85-4-201.btc-net.bg) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[1:11] <Soul_Est> nothing on the front page
[1:13] <MystX> mrdragons: yeah php
[1:13] <mrdragons> Maybe set a session cookie with user ID number or something, and only show certain things if their ID no is a certain number or greater?
[1:14] <MystX> Oh, win
[1:14] * DexterLB (~angel@77-85-4-201.btc-net.bg) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:14] <MystX> mrdragons: Yah i meant i wasnt sure how to actually change the picture state, based on a var.
[1:14] <MystX> The solution is a little messy, but meh
[1:16] <mrdragons> Dunno what you mean, code maybe?
[1:16] <MystX> Dw
[1:17] <MystX> Ah crap, i cant set the cookie in php =(
[1:17] <MystX> But its so easy!
[1:17] <mrdragons> why not, lol?
[1:18] <tntexplosivesltd> www.fail.org/php.php
[1:18] <tntexplosivesltd> XD
[1:19] <MystX> Because i want to do it when the user presses a button
[1:20] <MystX> unless when they press the button, i send a form with a hidden thing, then php sets the cookie
[1:20] <MystX> But that requires reloading the page
[1:21] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:21] <mrdragons> Still don't know exactly what you're trying to do here
[1:22] <MystX> Set a cookie when someone presses a button
[1:22] <tntexplosivesltd> ninja'd
[1:22] <MystX> I can do it in js, but js is gross
[1:23] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[1:25] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:25] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] <ctyler> MystX: you can set a cookie on content you target to an iframe. But that's even more gross than anything you'd see in js.
[1:29] <MystX> Lol, yup
[1:29] <MystX> I can deal with page reloading
[1:32] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net50-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has left #raspberrypi
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[1:42] <MystX> You know you got the PHP right when you reload and get a blank page =P
[1:43] <MystX> yay it doesnt work
[1:44] <tntexplosivesltd> MystX: dairy soon?
[1:44] * LiENUS (~yes@ip68-11-254-175.br.br.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[1:45] <MystX> Ooh now it does, that's quite snazzy
[1:45] <MystX> tntexplosivesltd: possibly..
[1:46] <tntexplosivesltd> noce
[1:46] <tntexplosivesltd> * nice
[1:46] <tntexplosivesltd> that works pretty well
[1:46] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net50-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] <MystX> Yeah
[1:50] <MystX> Added some nice text
[1:50] <tntexplosivesltd> niiiiiiice
[1:51] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Quit: cerberos)
[1:54] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net50-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has left #raspberrypi
[1:54] <ShiftPlusOne> Hmm I have a device which has a dc jack which needs 5v. I have a lab power supply, a 5v adapter with a wrong connector and a 9v adapter with the right connector. Wondering what the best approach is. Take the connector from the 9v supply and attach it to the 5v supply or take the connector off and attach it to the lab supply
[1:55] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:55] <ShiftPlusOne> lab power supply it is then
[1:56] * feep (~feep@p5B2B398E.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:57] <hamitron> ShiftPlusOne, I'd buy a transformer for under 10 quid off ebay
[1:57] <hamitron> ;)
[1:57] <ShiftPlusOne> and wait for a month for it to arrive from china?
[1:58] <hamitron> order now, for when the rpi arrives
[1:58] <hamitron> ;)
[1:58] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh, it's not for a pi
[1:58] <hamitron> oh, sorry
[1:58] <hamitron> just assumed.... been in the rpi channel :D
[1:58] * prebz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:58] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[1:59] * pizza-dude (~fake@dhcp-077-249-161-109.chello.nl) Quit ()
[1:59] <MystX> Thats a pretty poor assumption to make based on my experience here
[1:59] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh, I just finally found the documentation for my FPGA board, so I can finally fiddle with it
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[2:00] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: Haaa??s)
[2:02] <hamitron> MystX, I know :/
[2:03] <hamitron> *tired*
[2:05] * wiiguy (fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit ()
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[2:14] <ShiftPlusOne> the wire with a white strip across is meant to be negative, right?
[2:15] <MystX> =\
[2:15] <MystX> Probably
[2:15] <MystX> But I dont trust anything to be wired up like it should be
[2:15] <MystX> Multimeter it?
[2:16] <ShiftPlusOne> that's the plan.. I just can't find half of my stuff
[2:19] <ShiftPlusOne> on a dc jack, is inner usually meant to be positive?
[2:20] <ShiftPlusOne> I know there is meant to be a symbol ont he adapter, but not sure which one means what
[2:20] <Tachyon`> usually but NOT always
[2:20] <ShiftPlusOne> I have two hollow squares
[2:20] <Tachyon`> find something with a ground and poke it with a meter
[2:21] <Tachyon`> or just google for details on the device or a replacement psu and hope the picture is detailed enough to show the polarity
[2:21] <Tachyon`> which is generally printed on the PSU
[2:22] <ShiftPlusOne> Tachyon`, I did, what I think is the negative wire goes to the inside
[2:22] <Tachyon`> hrm, you don't seem very certain though
[2:22] <Tachyon`> what is it?
[2:22] <ShiftPlusOne> hang on, I'll type the situation up exactly.
[2:22] <Tachyon`> it might be quicker just to type the make/model of the device, whatever it might be
[2:23] <ShiftPlusOne> nope
[2:23] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[2:23] <ShiftPlusOne> I have a device which needs 5v, inner positive, outter negative. I have an adapter, but it's a wrong voltage, so I cut the wire off. It just seems to me that the adapter has the polarity the other way around and I need to put the wire with the stripe to +ve
[2:24] <ShiftPlusOne> Just want to make sure that the adapter indeed had the 'wrong polarity first.
[2:24] <ShiftPlusOne> wall warts have a symbol on them indicating which way it is
[2:25] <ShiftPlusOne> I want to find out what one hollow square inside another means.
[2:25] <Tachyon`> double insulated
[2:25] <Tachyon`> nothing to do with polarity
[2:25] <Tachyon`> just means no earth is required
[2:25] <traeak> hehe
[2:25] <traeak> nokia's n9 linux based phone is outselling all their wp7 phones
[2:25] <traeak> wowsers
[2:25] <ShiftPlusOne> ah thanks
[2:25] <Ben64> probably because wp7 sucks
[2:25] <ShiftPlusOne> which one indicates polarity?
[2:26] <Tachyon`> you should really poke the wires with a meter
[2:26] <Ben64> ShiftPlusOne: has a plus and minus icon on the thing
[2:26] <Tachyon`> do you not have a meter to hand?
[2:26] <Ben64> but yeah, multimeter
[2:26] <traeak> 1.5M n9's vs 600k lumia phones
[2:26] <Tachyon`> if there's no obvious symbol (and it would be obvious, with + and - markings) I wouldn't depend on stripes on wires as they can go either way
[2:26] <ShiftPlusOne> Tachyon`, yeah I've got a meter, but this is mostly curiosity >.>
[2:26] <ShiftPlusOne> anyway, I'll just go by the meter
[2:27] <Tachyon`> there's also the possibility it's an AC supply if no polarity is marked
[2:27] <ShiftPlusOne> Tachyon`, bingo!
[2:27] <Ben64> those are tricky
[2:27] <Ben64> ac-ac
[2:27] <Tachyon`> bear in mind, regulation too, if your device is expecting 5v and you feed it an unregulated supply, that could end badly
[2:28] <traeak> heh
[2:28] <Ben64> speaking of power, how well can the rpi tolerate different power
[2:28] <ShiftPlusOne> Tachyon`, I am actually feeding it from a lab supply using the wire I cut from the adapter
[2:28] <tntexplosivesltd> MystX: foosball?
[2:28] <traeak> fireworks
[2:28] <MystX> tntexplosivesltd: yup
[2:28] <Tachyon`> and usually if they have a regulator they want somewaht more than 5 in as there's a slight drop across the regulator
[2:28] <ShiftPlusOne> glad I cut the wire off the AC-AC adapter before I killed anything with it
[2:29] <Tachyon`> (assuming it's actually 5v internally and not 3.3 or something of course)
[2:29] <Ben64> will i have any problems with an ac-usb adapter
[2:29] <ShiftPlusOne> Tachyon`, it's 3.3 internally
[2:29] <Ben64> like for a cell charger
[2:29] <ShiftPlusOne> 5v goes to HDMi and all that
[2:29] <Tachyon`> ahh, so there might be a regulato then
[2:29] <Tachyon`> ah right
[2:29] <hamitron> AC-AC can be useful ;)
[2:30] <ShiftPlusOne> hamitron, isn't it just transformer then?
[2:30] <ShiftPlusOne> ... time to crack it open.
[2:30] <hamitron> erm, not sure
[2:31] <Tachyon`> all switched mode these days usually
[2:31] <ShiftPlusOne> which would be easier if they didn't melt it shut
[2:31] <Tachyon`> if it's got a real transformer the weight will give it away I'd think
[2:31] <hamitron> but scalextric uses AC-AC
[2:31] <hamitron> :D
[2:31] <hamitron> well, the newer stuff
[2:31] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah it's a fairly heavy adapter
[2:31] <Tachyon`> scalextric was ac-ac when I was a kid, 30 years ago, lol
[2:31] <hamitron> oh, it used to be AC-DC
[2:32] <Tachyon`> odd, wonder if they went to dc then back again
[2:32] <hamitron> the ones with the screwed on terminals are 13.5V DC
[2:32] <Tachyon`> I remember killing something when I was 6 or 7 because I didn'tknow the differnece
[2:33] <hamitron> which sort you have?
[2:33] <Tachyon`> tried to connect a toy to the mains once too via a tape lead, I was lucky to survive childhood
[2:33] <hamitron> hehe
[2:33] <mrdragons> XD
[2:34] <Tachyon`> oh, it was screw on I think, I really can't remember details, long time ago now
[2:34] <Tachyon`> I remember the cars would fly off the trakcs
[2:34] <Tachyon`> if going too fast
[2:34] <ShiftPlusOne> Tachyon`, my brother nailed a hammer into a socket with a metal toy gun. Quickly learned his lesson
[2:34] <Tachyon`> lol
[2:35] <hamitron> oh, the newer digital have moved back to DC again
[2:35] <Tachyon`> well I was definitely 6 or under at the time of the tape lead incident as it was the first house, just thought electricity was electricity, lol
[2:35] <hamitron> http://www.scalextric-car.co.uk/Track/Track_Power_and_Control/Power_Unit_C922/Power_Unit_C922.htm
[2:36] <hamitron> sort I had
[2:36] <hamitron> :)
[2:36] <Tachyon`> oh, it is DC
[2:36] <Tachyon`> that's the one though
[2:36] <Tachyon`> must have just overloaded something then
[2:36] <hamitron> my new ones are AC
[2:37] <hamitron> they convert to DC in the track section
[2:37] <Tachyon`> definitely looks familiar anyway
[2:37] <hamitron> and the new digital sets that let you change lane, are DC
[2:37] <hamitron> omg, may have to dig it out
[2:37] <hamitron> :)
[2:38] * cerberos (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[2:38] <hamitron> rpi scalextric race management
[2:38] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[2:39] * DaQatz (~DB@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[2:44] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c5709.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:44] * jardiamj (~chatzilla@221-228-212-206-wiban.onlinemac.com) Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 9.0.1/20111220165912])
[2:46] <ShiftPlusOne> gah... looks like I need to buy a USB-Blaster as well =/
[2:46] <hamitron> :\
[2:46] <ukscone> ok it's official ubuntu 11.10 sucks
[2:46] <hamitron> can't make one cheap?
[2:46] <hamitron> ukscone, since 11.04
[2:47] <ShiftPlusOne> ukscone, what did they do now?
[2:48] <ukscone> the dlsym bug
[2:48] <ukscone> fricking idiots
[2:48] <Tachyon`> enjoy your unity
[2:48] <Tachyon`> perhaps you'd like an ipad with that, lol
[2:48] <ShiftPlusOne> Well unity is optional
[2:48] <Tachyon`> well, optionalish, it's on by default
[2:48] <ukscone> Tachyon`: never liked ubuntu but then again i don't like debian, never been that keen on fedora, mandriva sucks :)
[2:48] <Tachyon`> you have to select somethign else
[2:49] <Tachyon`> oh, I've been using debian sine 1999
[2:49] <ukscone> the last disto i enjoyed using was suse in 2002
[2:49] <Tachyon`> used slackware for a few years before that
[2:49] <Tachyon`> because I had dialup and could buy it in shops
[2:49] * hamitron likes slackware
[2:49] <Tachyon`> so didn't have to download at 56k
[2:49] <ukscone> use gentoo for 4 years which was ok but a pig when i was doing some messing sround
[2:49] <hamitron> I never got into gentoo
[2:50] <ShiftPlusOne> ukscone, are you a python guru yet?
[2:50] <hamitron> I think my slow cpu put me off gentoo ;)
[2:50] <hamitron> by the time I had a better cpu, they dropped support for a stage1 install :/
[2:51] <hamitron> so drifted to linuxfromscratch for a nightmare of a distro
[2:51] <Ben64> i've been using ubuntu 10.04, works great
[2:51] <ShiftPlusOne> hamitron, not really a distro... more of an educational thing
[2:51] <hamitron> ShiftPlusOne, yeh :)
[2:52] <hamitron> never switched to it
[2:52] <hamitron> just used it when i wanted a headache
[2:52] <ShiftPlusOne> Before I played with linuxfromscratch, I didn't feel like I 'understood' linux. Then linuxfromscratch and gentoo really cemented it in.
[2:53] <hamitron> gentoo has some nice docs
[2:53] <ShiftPlusOne> but before that it was just an awkward version of windows to me
[2:53] <hamitron> arch I've never been able to run
[2:53] <hamitron> :/
[2:53] <Ben64> i went from a 2.4 to a 2.6 kernel myself
[2:54] <Ben64> thats what taught me a bunch
[2:54] * hamitron still likes 2.4 kernels
[2:54] * ShiftPlusOne notices no difference in kernel changes
[2:54] <mrdragons> Really? None at all?
[2:55] <Ben64> 2.4 to 2.6 was a bit change
[2:55] <Ben64> 2.6 to 3.0 didn't do anything really
[2:55] <mrdragons> Not even small things like different syntax and methods of module loading?
[2:55] <Ben64> s/bit/big/
[2:55] <mrdragons> Yeah, 2.6 to 3.0 wasn't much
[2:55] <ShiftPlusOne> what year did 2.6 come out?
[2:55] * wtpayne (~textual@pool-108-14-209-60.nycmny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:55] <Ben64> 2004? maybe
[2:55] <slaeshjag> 3.0 was Linux getting tired of big numbers
[2:55] <ukscone> ShiftPlusOne: not even started :)
[2:55] <mrdragons> Linus himself just said it's just another number; not really much different from 2.6
[2:55] <slaeshjag> Linus*
[2:56] <hamitron> 2.0 to 2.2 to 2.4 to 2.6 ll had some change, dunno why 3.0 came about :/
[2:56] <hamitron> all*
[2:56] <Ben64> cause its been 2.6 for a long time
[2:56] <ShiftPlusOne> 2003 it seems
[2:56] * wtpayne (~textual@pool-108-14-209-60.nycmny.east.verizon.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[2:56] <slaeshjag> hamitron: Some say it marks "the third decade"
[2:56] <ShiftPlusOne> I probably wasn't 'serious' about linux back then
[2:56] <hamitron> slaeshjag, I like that, will go with it
[2:56] <hamitron> :)
[2:56] <ukscone> ShiftPlusOne: i got sidetracked into helping some people turn my blog posts into something suitable as an education doc to teach kids
[2:56] <ShiftPlusOne> so I wouldn't have had much experience with 2.4
[2:57] <ukscone> so trying to idiotproof it for a variety of distros
[2:57] <ShiftPlusOne> ukscone, sounds time consuming =(
[2:57] <hamitron> linux has been very useable since redhat 6.0 (2.2 kernel) imo
[2:57] <hamitron> now it is just boring
[2:57] <hamitron> :/
[2:58] <Ben64> i hated redhat
[2:58] <ukscone> bloody is especially as this was the third install of ubuntu 11.10 as first time the install failed, 2nd time the update eff'ed up and this time well lets just say if i ever see mark shuttleworth i'll shove his ubuntu up his arse sideways
[2:58] <slaeshjag> hamitron: If you can't find a challange on OS-level, move it to userspace
[2:58] <Ben64> ukscone: thats why i only use LTS
[2:59] <slaeshjag> hamitron: Or, you could make Minix3 usable, pick your favourite :)
[2:59] <ukscone> Ben64: yes the blog used an lts but trying to see how modern we can get
[2:59] <hamitron> slaeshjag, yeh, I just seem to get lazy when stuff "works"
[2:59] <Ben64> 12.04 if you like things breaking :)
[2:59] <ukscone> but only another year of lts on the 10.04 left
[2:59] <Ben64> i did a round of updates yesterday, and X wouldn't start anymore
[2:59] <Ben64> had to fix that
[2:59] <slaeshjag> Ben64: That sums up my experience with Arch :)
[3:00] <ukscone> i think i'll just say fedora16 or ubuntu10.04 and wheichever debian works
[3:00] <Ben64> 10.04 has been stable for me as my main computer since it was released
[3:00] <hamitron> 10.04 is my last version of ubuntu, will now need i686 cpu
[3:00] <hamitron> :/
[3:00] <Ben64> not looking forward to 12.04
[3:00] <Ben64> unity pisses me off
[3:00] <hamitron> not tried unity tbh
[3:00] <slaeshjag> heh.. I think the last version of Ubuntu I really used was 6.06
[3:01] <Ben64> they don't seem to realize that i have a mouse
[3:01] <ShiftPlusOne> lol
[3:01] <Ben64> why would i want something that'd work better on a touchscreen
[3:01] <Ben64> same thing with windows8
[3:01] <hamitron> 6.06 reminds me of "having" to blank the whole hdd, to install
[3:01] <hamitron> ;)
[3:01] <ShiftPlusOne> *on a small touchscreen
[3:01] <slaeshjag> hamitron: I didn't install 6.06, so I can't say anything about it. I upgraded from 5.10 x]
[3:02] <hamitron> lucky :D
[3:02] <Ben64> i have an android phone if i want to poke a screen for a while
[3:02] <hamitron> slaeshjag, strange you should mention minix.... really considering it
[3:03] <hamitron> be a nice project on the pi
[3:03] <slaeshjag> hamitron: My main problems with it is the lack of support for threads and shared libraries
[3:03] <hamitron> my main problem is it is becoming netbsd
[3:03] <hamitron> :/
[3:04] <slaeshjag> in what way?
[3:04] <hamitron> not 100% sure how, but they are taking the toolchain or something
[3:04] <hamitron> 3.2 will be very different
[3:05] <hamitron> personally, 2.0 interests me more
[3:05] <slaeshjag> http://i.rdw.se/Sk??rmdump-Uppgraderar%20Ubuntu.png
[3:05] <slaeshjag> !
[3:05] <slaeshjag> *memories*
[3:06] <hamitron> :)
[3:06] <victhor> oh I actually ran 6.06 on 256 MB of RAM
[3:06] <slaeshjag> I think I did too
[3:06] <victhor> it worked poorly but it worked...
[3:06] <hamitron> yeh, it worked
[3:06] <hamitron> :)
[3:06] <victhor> now try that with 11.10 :>
[3:07] <slaeshjag> I don't remember if I had upgraded to 768 at that point
[3:07] <hamitron> now you need 2GB
[3:07] <hamitron> :/
[3:07] <victhor> I went to debian
[3:07] <slaeshjag> I'm at debian now :)
[3:07] <victhor> so far it's still working, but my ubuntu installs normally broke after 2 version upgrades
[3:07] <victhor> this one is a month old
[3:07] * hamitron is with slackware
[3:08] <hamitron> and win7
[3:08] <hamitron> :/
[3:08] <slaeshjag> heh... When I used slackware, the packages where older than the earth itself, has that changed?
[3:08] <hamitron> hmmm
[3:08] <hamitron> it is modern imo
[3:08] <hamitron> but using "old ways"
[3:09] <slaeshjag> well, if the package versions doesn't cause any problems, I guess it has changed x]
[3:09] <ShiftPlusOne> slaeshjag, so what, just over 10,000 years old?
[3:09] <hamitron> slaeshjag, packaging is really the same tbh
[3:09] <slaeshjag> ShiftPlusOne: Uh... According to my views, closing in on 5B :)
[3:10] <slaeshjag> hamitron: I remember having big issues with program requiring a newer libc
[3:10] <ShiftPlusOne> slaeshjag, good
[3:10] <victhor> my only problem with slackware was the age of the packages
[3:10] <victhor> still, it's maintained by only one person...
[3:11] <hamitron> I've just installed 13.37 with everything
[3:11] <hamitron> and trying it again
[3:11] <hamitron> normally I leave off X
[3:11] <hamitron> but need something to replace ubuntu
[3:11] <hamitron> still got 8.04 machines
[3:12] <hamitron> :/
[3:13] <acfrazier> I use Arch Linux
[3:13] <slaeshjag> My netbook can't run many other distros than Debian :o
[3:14] <hamitron> slaeshjag, i586?
[3:14] <slaeshjag> nah
[3:14] <slaeshjag> All kernels over 2.6.32 will make it crash
[3:14] <hamitron> oh? why?
[3:14] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[3:14] <slaeshjag> I think it has something to do with the WLAN card
[3:15] <hamitron> :\
[3:15] <hamitron> I got a load of machines that won't take a version of X.org beyond 7.3
[3:15] <slaeshjag> I don't mind, I'm a debian guy anyway P:
[3:15] <hamitron> with 3d drivers anyway
[3:15] <slaeshjag> :o
[3:16] <slaeshjag> The funny thing is: My platform is supposed to be supported in Linux 3.0 :)
[3:16] <hamitron> I suppose I could consider using the rpi's to replace them
[3:17] <hamitron> hmmm
[3:17] <mrdragons> >_>
[3:18] <hamitron> 12 r-pi
[3:18] <hamitron> :D
[3:18] <victhor> can't upgrade Xorg? ATI
[3:18] <hamitron> nvidia
[3:19] <victhor> :P
[3:19] <slaeshjag> heh... ATI is also crappy at drivers though >.<
[3:19] <hamitron> anything needing 71 drivers
[3:19] <slaeshjag> My netbook refuse to go into standby/hibernate with ATI's catalyst drivers
[3:20] <hamitron> which is annoying, as I tried to make sure all my comps had nvidia, for the unified graphics driver
[3:20] <victhor> my gnome 3 gets all funky with catalyst.
[3:20] <slaeshjag> And hardware accelerated video playback doesn't work, so pretty much anything over 360p is a nogo
[3:20] <victhor> I thought the legacy proprietary driver by nvidia supported newer xorg
[3:21] <hamitron> victhor, only kernels
[3:21] <hamitron> X.org changed how it works, and nvidia did backport changes to the 96 legacy driver
[3:22] <hamitron> but not the 71 driver, for geforce 2 and below
[3:22] <victhor> Oh.
[3:22] <hamitron> they said they "may"
[3:22] <victhor> GeForce 2 :O
[3:22] <hamitron> but that was a long time ago
[3:22] <victhor> does nouveau support that?
[3:22] <hamitron> yep
[3:23] <victhor> poorly or well?
[3:23] <victhor> I mean, does it at least render properly?
[3:23] <hamitron> as well as any other
[3:23] <hamitron> but no 3d
[3:23] <hamitron> :/
[3:23] <victhor> ah
[3:24] <victhor> I suppose there's not much interest in supporting it from either nvidia or nouveau, because it's too old
[3:24] <hamitron> well, nouveau is still young
[3:24] <hamitron> but with X.org issues, and now cpu issues
[3:24] <hamitron> I feel like giving up
[3:24] <hamitron> ;)
[3:25] <hamitron> certainly not support distro that require i686
[3:25] <hamitron> supporting*
[3:25] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (*.net *.split)
[3:25] * vgrade (~martinbro@cpc2-nrte22-2-0-cust128.8-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (*.net *.split)
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[3:26] <hamitron> <hamitron> well, nouveau is still young
[3:26] <hamitron> <hamitron> but with X.org issues, and now cpu issues
[3:26] <hamitron> <hamitron> I feel like giving up
[3:26] <hamitron> <hamitron> ;)
[3:26] <hamitron> <hamitron> certainly not support distro that require i686
[3:26] <hamitron> <hamitron> supporting*
[3:27] * dominikh (~dominikh@cinch/developer/dominikh) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:29] <victhor> I've been thinking about the "remove resistors to get I2S" post on the forum, these resistors are supposedly used to set a board revision to be read by software.
[3:29] <ReggieUK> got a link to that?
[3:29] <victhor> can't you include a parameter on the kernel command line to force a specific revision instead?
[3:29] <victhor> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/features-and-requests/sad-about-removal-of-i2s-why-was-this-change-made/#p34408
[3:30] * slaeshjag (steven@s.rdw.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:31] <ReggieUK> ooook, well, it depends on the software, do we have any sourcecode yet?
[3:31] <ReggieUK> for drivers?
[3:31] <ReggieUK> it will be in the gpio driver
[3:32] <ReggieUK> so it will look to read those pins to determine whether they're pulled up or down
[3:32] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[3:32] <ReggieUK> either that or in the core
[3:32] <ReggieUK> but the thing to do is look for those pins in the source code
[3:32] <victhor> interestingly, the board I worked with was a little fancier and used a EEPROM to do that, but nothing used it.
[3:32] <ReggieUK> do we have a pin map
[3:33] <victhor> not that I know
[3:33] <ReggieUK> victhor, which board?
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[3:33] <victhor> Gumstix Overo. The EEPROM was on the "expansion board", and according to Gumstix, it's supposed to be used by u-boot to automatically set some variables on boot time
[3:34] <ReggieUK> don't forget they went for cheap on these boards
[3:34] * prebz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:34] <ReggieUK> so eeproms are expensive in the scheme of things, 10k pullups are not :)
[3:34] <victhor> the overos are crazy expensive, the expansion boards even more so imo. :P
[3:37] <victhor> sure
[3:38] <Soul_Est> victhor: agreed
[3:38] <ReggieUK> it would appear that you don't have to remove the resistors apparently?
[3:38] <ReggieUK> just tack some skinny wire to them
[3:38] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@63-152-70-144.cdrr.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:39] <ReggieUK> but if not, as long as we get a decent look at the drivers I think we'll be ok
[3:40] <hamitron> amazed so much as changed from the beta board, myself
[3:40] <hamitron> was*
[3:42] <ReggieUK> it was a mistake
[3:43] <ReggieUK> you could always suggest to them that they put an 'override board ID' in the code
[3:44] <hamitron> ah :/
[3:46] * LiENUX (~yes@ip68-11-254-175.br.br.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:48] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb3:12:6c03:100e:8544:bc83) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[3:56] * pistacik__ (~root@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[3:57] <ReggieUK> there doesn't seem to be much in the way of anything that suggests they read the board id from those pins
[3:57] <ReggieUK> but i couldn't be sure
[3:58] <ReggieUK> so perhaps it's internal to the gpu-tethered bootloader
[3:59] * prebz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
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[4:03] * sightlight (b84f3609@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[4:04] <MystX> Aww.
[4:04] <MystX> sightlight's gone
[4:15] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[4:15] <MystX> ;-;
[4:25] * UnaClocker (~unaclocke@24-113-85-150.wavecable.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:29] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-170-49-236.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[4:58] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[5:10] <bbeattie> anyone pretty familiar with the gertboard?
[5:12] * prebz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[5:12] <mrdragons> I'm pretty sure there's less people familiar with the gertboard than the raspi at this point. :\
[5:12] * UnaClocker (~unaclocke@24-113-85-150.wavecable.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
[5:13] <bbeattie> yeah, figured as much but was curious if someone might be
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[5:26] <Soul_Est> bbeattie: Gert is the best person to ask at this point
[5:26] <bbeattie> on forum or direct?
[5:28] <Soul_Est> bbeattie: on forum via pm or directly. busy as he is, he does make time to respond.
[5:28] <bbeattie> understandable. thanks
[5:28] <Soul_Est> bbeattie: you're welcome
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[6:04] * Soul_Est loving tmux+irssi+nicklist
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[6:41] <smw> what are the dimensions of the raspberry pi?
[6:41] <smw> and are there any cases in existence that could hold it?
[6:42] <smw> dimensions == length, width, height
[6:43] <relaxed> info == website
[6:43] <smw> relaxed, I looked
[6:43] <smw> not in the FAQs
[6:43] <smw> no "credit card sized" does not count ;-)
[6:47] <SpeedEvil> You can scale width and height very accurately from the board pics
[6:48] <SpeedEvil> knowing the pitch of the ICs/connectors
[6:48] <smw> would it be wrong to say I am too lazy to do that :-P
[6:48] <relaxed> From the website: "The Raspberry Pi is exactly the size of a credit card ??? 85.60mm x 53.98mm."
[6:48] <MartijnVdS> also in the pic above the faq
[6:48] <smw> thanks
[6:49] <smw> MartijnVdS, now I see the sizes in the pic...
[6:49] <smw> MartijnVdS, I was looking before
[6:50] <MartijnVdS> Maybe they only show up once you know them
[6:50] <smw> MartijnVdS, I think so
[6:50] <smw> MartijnVdS, they are not labeled
[6:50] <smw> MartijnVdS, if I was asked what they were, I could guess.
[6:50] <smw> But they fade into the background ;-)
[6:52] <smw> and I am guessing no one makes a case yet?
[6:52] <MartijnVdS> people are waiting for hardware I think
[6:52] <smw> the case will be sold separately after they get mony from the first batch?
[6:52] <smw> MartijnVdS, yeah
[6:53] <MartijnVdS> also, it's not hard to make something from wood/cardboard/lego/3d printer material/etc.
[6:53] <smw> Right now I am imagining one made to take a WD passport drive and the board :-D
[6:54] <rm> I have some cardboard boxes
[6:54] <smw> rm, hm... there is an idea
[6:54] <rm> of about the right ballpark size
[6:54] <smw> cut holes in it
[6:54] <rm> plus/minus 2x
[6:55] * pnunn (~pnunn@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[6:56] <smw> although, what I want to see more than anything is dev tools for the GPU
[6:56] * smw prays that they are eventually released
[7:03] <Tachyon`> good morning
[7:03] * Stskeeps (~cvm@Maemo/community/distmaster/Stskeeps) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[7:03] <Tachyon`> since I can't bloody sleep
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[8:40] <Soul_Est> morning Tachyon`. It's ok, I can't sleep too.
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[8:41] * prebz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[8:42] <weuxel> I could sleep, but i had to get up and go to work.
[8:47] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@203-158-39-90.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:48] * Shift_ (~Shift@ Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[8:51] * izua (~izua@unaffiliated/izua) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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[8:56] * Hesmon (~fp@p4FDB6305.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:57] * Soul_Est starts nodding off.
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[10:29] <iu> hi,How long would it be,before a printer is connected and running okay with this computer?
[10:29] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[10:29] <Anppa> I'd estimate around three weeks :D
[10:29] <weuxel> depends on the os, depends on the printer, depends on the type of connection...
[10:30] <rm> about 5 minutes after you connect it
[10:30] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ has joined #raspberrypi
[10:30] <rm> Fedora/Debian/Arch support perhaps all kinds of modern printers
[10:33] <tntexplosivesltd> have a look for linux deivers for your printer
[10:34] <tntexplosivesltd> * drivers
[10:34] <rm> nope, don't
[10:35] <rm> if there are some 'Linux drivers' for your printer, it'll be a very bad sign
[10:35] * azalyn (~junon@modemcable007.174-23-96.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[10:35] <rm> stuff from the manufacturer will only support x86
[10:35] <rm> and if it's required, tough luck
[10:35] <rm> so better check the CUPS or even Fedora or Debian or Arch websites for a list of compatible printers
[10:37] <weuxel> I guess you could refer to a ppd file as a "driver" and there is nothing wrong with getting a decent one third party
[10:38] <iu> rm,I have no doubt your printer will be working in 5mins :)
[10:40] <tntexplosivesltd> rm: I meant third part
[10:40] <tntexplosivesltd> * party
[10:40] <tntexplosivesltd> "commercial" linux drivers suck
[10:42] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[10:47] <Davespice> I found cups to work very well with mine, I've got quite a new Brother Laser printer
[10:48] * gabriel9 (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[10:48] <tntexplosivesltd> nice
[10:49] * dirk| (~dirk@open7x0.xnc.de) has left #raspberrypi
[10:49] <tntexplosivesltd> I hate how some printers are becoming more and more proprietary
[10:50] <Davespice> the printer shows as local if you use cups, even if it's a remote printer or a samba one
[10:50] <tntexplosivesltd> that's useful
[10:50] <Davespice> yeah I know what you mean, what with all their scanning and photocopying abilities
[10:50] * gabriel9|work (~quassel@ Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[10:50] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah, nothing standard
[10:50] <Davespice> is it? does some software only work with local printers?
[10:51] <tntexplosivesltd> Davespice: it meant that the connection to the printer is transparent
[10:51] <tntexplosivesltd> * means
[10:51] <Davespice> okay
[10:51] <tntexplosivesltd> that's always good
[10:51] <tntexplosivesltd> means you can talk to the printer like it's local
[10:53] * azalyn (~junon@modemcable007.174-23-96.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:54] <tntexplosivesltd> transparency woth networks is always somewhat of a holy grail
[10:54] <tntexplosivesltd> * with
[10:54] * roban (roban@c83-181-13-245.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[10:55] <Davespice> yeah that's cool
[10:55] * Hesmon (~fp@p4FDB6305.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[10:55] * Hesmon (~fp@p4FDB6305.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:55] <Davespice> I'm using a Brother HL-2250DN
[10:56] <Davespice> it's not the best printer ever, but it prints quite quickly
[10:56] <tntexplosivesltd> oh yeah that's not bad
[10:56] * genbattle (~quassel@118-93-47-103.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:56] <Davespice> has auto duplex too
[10:56] <tntexplosivesltd> heh
[10:57] <tntexplosivesltd> so linux handles it fine>
[10:57] <tntexplosivesltd> * >
[10:57] <tntexplosivesltd> * ?
[10:57] <tntexplosivesltd> ffs
[10:57] <Davespice> yeah through cups
[10:57] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj1993) Quit (Quit: Procrast...)
[10:57] <Davespice> as I've just got it wired up to the Lan, it doesn't need a server to support it
[10:58] <Davespice> Brother also provide drivers from their site
[10:58] <tntexplosivesltd> so a cups port to arm should do the trick
[10:58] <tntexplosivesltd> (there probably already is one)
[10:59] <Davespice> yes... I would sort of expect that to be there...
[10:59] <Davespice> not sure if the driver would need a rebuild too though
[10:59] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:01] <tntexplosivesltd> Davespice: lol cups is somewhat of a print server itself
[11:02] <Davespice> yes I know, I meant in terms of a dedicated server
[11:02] * Hesmon (~fp@p4FDB6305.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[11:02] * Hesmon (~fp@p4FDB6305.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:02] <iu> The official rasberry pi sd card/operating system will that have printer drivers?
[11:02] <tntexplosivesltd> I doubt it
[11:02] <Davespice> Hi iu
[11:02] * genbattle (~quassel@118-93-47-103.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:02] <iu> hi
[11:02] <Davespice> I doubt it to start with
[11:03] <tntexplosivesltd> I don't see it coming with much
[11:03] <Davespice> but the package list should keep on updating slowly, as more and more packages become available over time you should start seeing them appear
[11:04] <tntexplosivesltd> it looks like arch linux arm has a very active package development (being rolling-release and all)
[11:04] <Davespice> I'm thinking to try a number of different OS's on different SD cards
[11:04] <Davespice> and yes Arch Linux sounds like it is going to be the most up to date out of all of them
[11:04] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah, ima stick with what I know XD
[11:04] <tntexplosivesltd> and what's small =P
[11:04] <Hopsy> my motherboard supports sata300 and sata600, the HDD I want to plug in is sata150. When I plug it in my pc reboots all the time. How can I solve this?
[11:05] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:05] <tntexplosivesltd> Hopsy: not at all relevant XD
[11:05] <Hopsy> sure it is
[11:05] <tntexplosivesltd> get an older PCI SATA card that does SATA150
[11:05] <Davespice> maybe you could get it to USB caddy and run it on the USB bus?
[11:05] <Hopsy> oepz, I forgot to tell my motherboard has a raspberrypi signature
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> that doesn't even make any sense
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> go away
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> XD
[11:06] <Davespice> *blank look*
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> hop on outta here
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> XD
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> see what I did there?
[11:06] <tntexplosivesltd> clever.
[11:06] <Hopsy> should I light you up tntexplosivesltd :')
[11:07] <Davespice> I think a usb caddy might be worth a try Hopsy, it won't be as fast as Sata but you'll be able to mount the drive and access it
[11:07] <tntexplosivesltd> !w
[11:07] <PiBot> tntexplosivesltd: in Upper Hutt, Wellington. Temp 18??C. Condition: Cloudy, Humidity: 73%, Later 23??C - 17??C. Condition: Cloudy.
[11:07] <tntexplosivesltd> ! forecast upper hutt
[11:07] <tntexplosivesltd> !w forecast upper hutt
[11:07] <PiBot> tntexplosivesltd: in Upper Hutt, Wellington. Temp 18??C. Condition: Cloudy, Humidity: 73%, Later 23??C - 17??C. Condition: Cloudy.
[11:07] <PiBot> Wed: High 22??C Low 13??C :Condition Chance of Rain
[11:07] <PiBot> Thu: High 20??C Low 10??C :Condition Mostly Sunny
[11:07] <PiBot> Fri: High 21??C Low 11??C :Condition Mostly Sunny
[11:07] <Davespice> tnt, can the PiBot tell me if I am going to get snow in London today?
[11:07] <tntexplosivesltd> !w forecast wanganui
[11:07] <PiBot> tntexplosivesltd: in Wanganui, Manawatu-Wanganui. Temp 17??C. Condition: , Humidity: 77%, Later 22??C - 15??C. Condition: Cloudy.
[11:07] <PiBot> Wed: High 22??C Low 12??C :Condition Chance of Rain
[11:07] <PiBot> Thu: High 17??C Low 11??C :Condition Cloudy
[11:07] <PiBot> Fri: High 23??C Low 12??C :Condition Partly Sunny
[11:08] <Davespice> !w London UK
[11:08] <PiBot> Davespice: in London UK on Tue Jan 31 09:20:00 2012. Temp 34??F. Condition: Haze, Humidity: 93%, Later 37??F - 27??F. Condition: Fog.
[11:08] <Hopsy> !w forecast Amsterdam
[11:08] <PiBot> Hopsy: in Amsterdam, North Holland. Temp 25??F. Condition: Clear, Humidity: 69%, Later 30??F - 18??F. Condition: Clear.
[11:08] <PiBot> Wed: High 30??F Low 16??F :Condition Clear
[11:08] <PiBot> Thu: High 27??F Low 12??F :Condition Mostly Sunny
[11:08] <PiBot> Fri: High 36??F Low 16??F :Condition Chance of Snow
[11:08] <Hopsy> why F :S
[11:08] <Hopsy> I want to see in celsius
[11:09] <Davespice> 25 F is like -1 or something I think...
[11:09] <weuxel> !w forecast Frankfurt
[11:09] <PiBot> weuxel: in Frankfurt, Hesse. Temp 28??F. Condition: Clear, Humidity: 49%, Later 32??F - 16??F. Condition: Mostly Sunny.
[11:09] <PiBot> Wed: High 27??F Low 9??F :Condition Clear
[11:09] <PiBot> Thu: High 23??F Low 7??F :Condition Clear
[11:09] <PiBot> Fri: High 25??F Low 7??F :Condition Clear
[11:09] <Hopsy> I also see weird char.
[11:09] <tntexplosivesltd> no idea what F is, it's a stupid measurement system
[11:09] <Hopsy> fahreneit
[11:10] <tntexplosivesltd> ???_???
[11:10] <Hopsy> however you spell it
[11:10] <tntexplosivesltd> I mean what it is in real numbers
[11:10] <tntexplosivesltd> I know what it stands for
[11:10] <Hopsy> :p
[11:10] <iu> tntexplosivesltd,does zoneminder work okay, on archlinux?
[11:10] <tntexplosivesltd> zoneminder?
[11:10] <Anppa> F is roughly 15.0 in real numbers :]
[11:10] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:10] <Hopsy> !wiki fahrenheir
[11:11] <tntexplosivesltd> iu: never even heard of it before, can't tell you
[11:12] <Hopsy> Kelvin is also a dumb temperature unit
[11:12] <tntexplosivesltd> Hopsy: why, it makes sense
[11:12] <tntexplosivesltd> it's used in most chemistry
[11:13] <Hopsy> but it makes it hard to me :(
[11:13] <tntexplosivesltd> it's just a linear offset
[11:13] <tntexplosivesltd> as opposed to a completely different scale like fahrenheit
[11:14] <Hopsy> or rankine, reaumur, wedgwood, planck
[11:14] <tntexplosivesltd> you're just trawling wikipedia now
[11:14] <Hopsy> should I generate my own temperatur unit
[11:14] <tntexplosivesltd> but then there will be yes another one
[11:14] <tntexplosivesltd> * yet
[11:15] <Hopsy> \care
[11:16] <iu> tntexplosivesltd , zoneminder is a security camera program that you can use to access, on the internet browser
[11:16] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah, I looked it up on pacman
[11:16] <tntexplosivesltd> community/mythplugins-mythzoneminder 1:0.24.1-4 View CCTV footage from zoneminder in MythTV
[11:16] <tntexplosivesltd> that's what there
[11:16] <tntexplosivesltd> it's in the main package repo, so I assume it works
[11:17] <tntexplosivesltd> not gonna try it
[11:17] <tntexplosivesltd> need to update everything, no internet =/
[11:17] <tntexplosivesltd> hmmmmmm bed time
[11:18] <tntexplosivesltd> night all
[11:19] <iu> bye
[11:28] <RaTTuS|BIG> !w
[11:28] <PiBot> RaTTuS|BIG: in Runcorn, Halton on Tue Jan 31 09:50:00 2012. Temp 2??C. Condition: Mostly Cloudy, Humidity: 87%, Later 3??C - -2??C. Condition: Mostly Sunny.
[11:30] <rm> !w
[11:30] <PiBot> rm: in Tyumen, Tyumenskaya oblast. Temp -28??C. Condition: Clear, Humidity: 76%, Later -27??C - -33??C. Condition: Partly Sunny.
[11:30] <weuxel> !w
[11:30] <RaTTuS|BIG> -28 ... brrrr
[11:32] <weuxel> !w Friedberg
[11:32] <PiBot> weuxel: in Friedberg, Bavaria. Temp 19??F. Condition: Mostly Cloudy, Humidity: 77%, Later 27??F - 9??F. Condition: Cloudy.
[11:32] <weuxel> !w Friedberg, Hessen
[11:32] <PiBot> weuxel: in Friedberg, Hesse. Temp 28??F. Condition: Clear, Humidity: 49%, Later 32??F - 18??F. Condition: Mostly Sunny.
[11:32] <jzu> !w
[11:33] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ Quit (Quit: cerber0s)
[11:39] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Quit: cerberos)
[11:45] <Davespice> anyone else from the UK here?
[11:49] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:50] * RaTTuS|BIG Davespice
[11:50] <RaTTuS|BIG> !w
[11:50] <PiBot> RaTTuS|BIG: in Runcorn, Halton on Tue Jan 31 10:20:00 2012. Temp 2??C. Condition: Mostly Cloudy, Humidity: 87%, Later 3??C - -2??C. Condition: Mostly Sunny.
[11:52] <Davespice> oh hey
[11:55] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@ Quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/)
[12:02] <Davespice> I heard we might get snow...
[12:05] * SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[12:06] * Martix (~martix@134.89.broadband12.iol.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:07] <RaTTuS|BIG> we may - not before the end of the week though [well herer anyway]
[12:08] <Davespice> I don't mind getting snowed in, but I really don't want to get snowed out!
[12:08] <RaTTuS|BIG> time to go and find a coffee supply
[12:08] <RaTTuS|BIG> yar ... so true
[12:15] * jluisn (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
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[12:17] * gabriel9 (~quassel@ Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[12:20] * SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) has joined #raspberrypi
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[12:44] * victhor (~victhor@ has joined #raspberrypi
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[13:19] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:23] * iu (~iu@host-92-7-93-34.as43234.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[13:24] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Quit: cerberos)
[13:25] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@c-24-11-54-36.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:29] <wiiguy> !w
[13:31] * rodrigo_golive (quassel@gateway/indt/session) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:31] * Davespice (~quassel@cpc13-haye17-2-0-cust146.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[13:33] <johnthebear> IT's quiet around here
[13:33] <Caver> very
[13:33] <johnthebear> I was thinking, there shouldn't be any technical problems with running mediawiki off of a a ras-pi, should there?
[13:34] <johnthebear> I mean, the sheva plug is also ARM
[13:34] <SphericalCow> no reason why you couldn't
[13:34] <Caver> speed aside ... no ... it's just software running on a linux platform
[13:34] <johnthebear> that's what I thought
[13:36] <johnthebear> are most of you in the UK? Where I am the sun is just about to rise
[13:36] <Aquilus_> Norway here.
[13:36] <Caver> Uk ... though more fog than sun here
[13:37] * iu (~iu@host-92-7-80-126.as43234.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:37] <Aquilus_> It's so cold here it feels like my hands are going to fall off.
[13:37] <Aquilus_> Good times.
[13:37] <mrdragons> Nah, I'm in the US
[13:38] <johnthebear> Norway... so about -15 to 0 C?
[13:38] <Aquilus_> -12, I think.
[13:38] <johnthebear> joy
[13:39] <johnthebear> it's made it up to 0 here today
[13:39] <mrdragons> lol
[13:39] <Aquilus_> Nice
[13:40] <johnthebear> I think we might even get to +5, so I guess I can't complain
[13:40] <Caver> johnthebear, where are you?
[13:40] <johnthebear> Michigan
[13:41] <johnthebear> US
[13:44] * Davespice (~quassel@cpc13-haye17-2-0-cust146.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:47] <ctyler> johnthebear: we've run mediawiki off a guruplug with good results and fairly low memory usage, so I wouldn't anticipate any real problem running it on the Pi.
[13:48] <johnthebear> cool, that is what I was hoping to here. I couldn't find much on line about anyone who had tried it though
[13:48] <johnthebear> *hear
[13:48] * zma1 (~zmac@ has joined #raspberrypi
[13:48] <Tobias|> Make sure you install php-apc/php-xcache if you do run it though
[13:48] <Tobias|> Will dramatically minimise memory usage/load times
[13:49] <Caver> heheh and set a model B so you have more ram!
[13:49] <Caver> set = get
[13:49] <Tobias|> (Those're bytecode caching PHP extensions)
[13:50] <johnthebear> okay
[13:50] <johnthebear> I've been trying to find a really light weight server solution that doesn't waste too much power
[13:50] * vgrade (~martinbro@cpc2-nrte22-2-0-cust128.8-4.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:51] * zma (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[13:51] <Tobias|> For that I'd go with nginx/cherokee
[13:51] <Tobias|> though they may be painful to configure
[13:52] <Tobias|> You won't be able to serve too many requests at once, mind you
[13:52] * vipkilla (~t_dot_zil@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:52] <johnthebear> the traffic would be really low, so only one or two people will be accessing it at a time
[13:52] <johnthebear> hence why we don't want to go through the hassle of making something larger and more robust
[13:53] <ctyler> johnthebear: we loaded our guruplug wiki up with a lot of content (a copy of a very active wiki) but only had a handful of clients connected, worked fine.
[13:54] * zma (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:54] <johnthebear> awesome, now I really can't wait for them to start shipping
[13:56] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[13:57] * zma1 (~zmac@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[13:58] * vipkilla (~t_dot_zil@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[14:01] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[14:01] <RaTTuS|BIG> you and about 70k others I think
[14:04] * vipkilla (~t_dot_zil@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:09] <Davespice> has anyone heard anything more about the Launch party?
[14:09] <rm> heh
[14:10] <Davespice> I'm going to try and persuade my employer to let us all go
[14:10] <rm> I have just now installed DokuWiki on a 500 Mhz ARM with 64 MB of RAM (58 actually usable)
[14:10] <mrdragons> Launch party? :D
[14:10] * Threepio (~threepio@S0106001f5b009dd8.vs.shawcable.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[14:10] <Davespice> yeah there was a forum topic about it ages ago
[14:10] <rm> 1.3 sec to generate a page, after installing PHP XCache: 0.3 sec
[14:11] <mrdragons> Nice
[14:13] <rm> R Pi will be more than usable as a personal web server
[14:16] <Davespice> do you think it'll run subversion okay?
[14:16] <jzu> well, it's a computer, you know...
[14:17] <Davespice> I'm not sure the memory requirements for that, it just needs Apache 6.0
[14:17] <jzu> with more RAM than was on my first web servers
[14:17] <feep> RAM is the main complaint I think
[14:17] <jzu> Apache 6?
[14:17] <jzu> oh
[14:18] <jzu> you mean Tomcat?
[14:18] <Kolin> subversion really isnt very resource heavy
[14:18] <Davespice> cool
[14:19] <jzu> btw, rm, I was wrong last week when you asked me if I had compiled a kernel on a NSLU2
[14:19] <jzu> I answered ni
[14:19] <jzu> s/ni/no/
[14:19] <Tobias|> ni!
[14:19] <jzu> but I did compile it
[14:19] <rm> I did too
[14:20] <jzu> I remember quite well selecting the console option
[14:20] <jzu> on a headless machine :-)
[14:20] <rm> it took more than 20 hours I believe
[14:20] <rm> and also the biggest problem was with LZMA being killed because of "out of memory"
[14:20] <rm> at it needs LZMA to pack the resulting kernel so it fits into flash
[14:21] <rm> so I made a script in place of /usr/bin/lzma
[14:21] <rm> that would replace all calls to lzma -9 with lzma -3
[14:21] <rm> :)
[14:21] <jzu> oh
[14:21] <jzu> ok
[14:21] <rm> did not find in the kernel source where -9 is specified
[14:21] <rm> I found one place, changed it, but it turned out to be not the place
[14:21] * zma (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has left #raspberrypi
[14:22] <jzu> why didn't I hit this one?
[14:22] <jzu> bah
[14:22] <rm> and each attempt took like couple of hours
[14:23] <rm> maybe you compiled it back when LZMA wasn't used yet
[14:24] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:24] <jzu> probably
[14:24] <IT_Sean> morning
[14:24] * Guest7197 (~datagutt@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:25] * Guest7197 (~datagutt@ Quit (Client Quit)
[14:26] * datagutt_ (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:29] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@203-158-39-90.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:31] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:35] * xe4l (~xe4l@gateway/tor-sasl/xe4l) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[14:38] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:39] * IT_Sean looks around
[14:40] <johnthebear> morning sean
[14:40] * jzu ducks
[14:41] <IT_Sean> heh... i just noticed the message count in my Outlook inbox. 2048
[14:41] <IT_Sean> :p
[14:42] * xe4l (~xe4l@gateway/tor-sasl/xe4l) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:42] <IT_Sean> dammit... someone just emailed me :/
[14:42] <IT_Sean> it was spam. ::Delete:: back to 2048
[14:43] <ShiftPlusOne> yay for round numbers
[14:43] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@bl20-125-13.dsl.telepac.pt) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[14:43] * IT_Sean has a customer that is beginning to irk him
[14:44] <haltdef> time to get all bofh on them
[14:44] <IT_Sean> Customer contated me (the friently support tech) the other day about being unable to reach a remote device
[14:45] * zma2 (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:45] <IT_Sean> So, i do some testing. The device is fine, it's a line noise issues.
[14:45] <IT_Sean> *issue
[14:46] <IT_Sean> SO, i tell the customer that...
[14:46] <IT_Sean> Customer replies "It isn't liune noise... the device isn't working"
[14:46] <IT_Sean> [I can dial the dammed thing & run diagnostics on it... it isn't the device]
[14:46] <IT_Sean> Customer is REFUSING to accept my diagnosis
[14:47] * zma2 (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[14:48] * ksaua (~saua@193.81-167-3.customer.lyse.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:50] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:50] <ShiftPlusOne> how do you deal with something like that?
[14:51] * saua (~saua@193.81-167-3.customer.lyse.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[14:52] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://tech.slashdot.org/story/12/01/31/0158238/mechanics-mistake-trashes-244-million-aircraft
[14:52] * zma1 (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:54] <IT_Sean> ShiftPlusOne: carefully.
[14:54] <IT_Sean> :p
[14:54] * zma1 (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has left #raspberrypi
[14:54] <IT_Sean> I'm going ot have to try every modem configuration i can come up with 'till i find something that'll cut through the noise.
[14:55] * IT_Sean digs out his big notebook of AT Commands
[14:56] <Davespice> hmm, I wonder if dropping the baud rate might help
[14:58] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb3:12:6c03:100e:8544:bc83) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:59] * roban (roban@c83-181-13-245.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:01] <ahven> IT_Sean: what use do you have for modems anyway, dialup, fax?
[15:02] * zma (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:03] * zma (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has left #raspberrypi
[15:04] <Anppa> 2400 bps broadband <3
[15:06] <IT_Sean> ahven: out of band access to devices.
[15:09] * Shift_ (~Shift@124-168-200-2.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:09] * IT_Sean pokes ahven with an analog modem
[15:09] <hamitron> how easy would it be to add video input?
[15:09] <hamitron> with no lag
[15:09] * djazz (~djazz@static- has left #raspberrypi
[15:09] <IT_Sean> hamitron: define "no" lag
[15:10] <IT_Sean> our best bet would be a USB input device
[15:10] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:10] <hamitron> USB input would have lag
[15:10] <hamitron> :/
[15:10] * Shift_ (~Shift@124-168-200-2.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Client Quit)
[15:10] <IT_Sean> well... guess your shagged then
[15:10] <hamitron> well
[15:10] <hamitron> no ;)
[15:10] <hamitron> just use the pi for something else
[15:10] <hamitron> and get something better suited to another idea
[15:12] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/592
[15:12] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@203-158-39-90.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:12] <IT_Sean> hamitron: there is a camera addon slated for the Pi, but, not for a while, iirc
[15:14] <hamitron> well, I was wanting "live" input from another video source, and to interact with it
[15:14] <hamitron> something like a games console for example
[15:15] <hamitron> lag would be pain when playing a game
[15:15] * iu (~iu@host-92-7-80-126.as43234.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:15] <Tobias|> Why would USB input have lag?
[15:15] <IT_Sean> whelp... unless they decide to add a Magical Lag-Free Unicorn Port to it at the last second... ...
[15:16] <Tobias|> The Kinect uses USB..
[15:16] <Tobias|> The eyetoy used USB (1.1 for that matter)
[15:16] <hamitron> same reason a usb hdd is slower for some things, than an esata drive
[15:17] <Tobias|> That's simply because it has lower bandwidth
[15:17] <hamitron> think there are more conversions
[15:17] <Tobias|> eSATA can be, what, 6gbps?
[15:17] <IT_Sean> yeah, but you don't NEED SATA bandwith for a camera
[15:17] <Tobias|> ^
[15:17] <hamitron> it isn't bandwidth I'm worried about
[15:17] <hamitron> latency....
[15:18] <Tobias|> I use a USB keyboard/mouse
[15:18] <Tobias|> Not noticing any latency here
[15:18] <victhor> don't bother with that, it's too little.
[15:18] <Tobias|> (Even though USB is terrible for keyboards compared to PS2 for other reasons)
[15:18] <victhor> if you really bother with it, the least latency you can get is from a parallel interface camera, which you can't use on the pi because it doesn't have this interface.
[15:18] <Tobias|> The biggest source of latency I imagine you'd have is the processing of the r-pi
[15:19] <hamitron> well, all usb video in devices I've used, cause latency
[15:19] <hamitron> :/
[15:20] <victhor> even dedicated cameras aren't true real time
[15:20] <victhor> you want a hard real time, build a analog system.
[15:20] <hamitron> not true, no
[15:20] <hamitron> I'm talking noticeable
[15:20] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-168-200-2.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:20] <victhor> if you mean "low fps" then yes that is common with usb webcams.
[15:20] <Tobias|> ^
[15:21] <hamitron> not low fps
[15:21] <Tobias|> You haven't defined where this magical latency is coming from
[15:21] <hamitron> a delay from input to output....
[15:22] <victhor> Low FPS
[15:22] <hamitron> not low FPS
[15:22] <hamitron> :/
[15:22] <victhor> are you using the maximum resolution on the camera?
[15:22] <hamitron> not low bandwidth either...
[15:22] <victhor> have you tried it?
[15:22] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb3:12:6c03:100e:8544:bc83) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:22] <hamitron> tried what?
[15:22] <victhor> reducing the resolution
[15:23] <victhor> my 1280x1024 camera can only provide smooth video at 640x480 or less
[15:23] <hamitron> I'm not using a camera
[15:23] <hamitron> just saying, the usb input devices I've used, have not matched the PCI cards
[15:25] <Tobias|> You wouldn't be able to handle smooth video input with the r-pi anyway
[15:25] <Tobias|> At least not at ludicrously low resolutions
[15:25] <hamitron> really? :|
[15:25] <Tobias|> Video processing's intensive yo
[15:25] <hamitron> my K6-2 300MHz does it atm
[15:26] <Tobias|> At what framerate and resolution?
[15:26] <victhor> I do not see noticeable lag on my webcam at VGA resolution, 30 fps
[15:26] <hamitron> 50 fps, PAL input
[15:27] <victhor> the new motion based gaming systems use USB peripherals (Kinect, PS Eye, even the original EyeToy), they all work fine so I suppose latency is not nearly as bad as you make it seem.
[15:28] <Tachyon`> heh, I still have a k6-2 350 board lurking around here
[15:28] <victhor> low fps is something that cheap webcams tend to have... but lowering the resolution sometimes makes it better
[15:28] <ShiftPlusOne> good info in the last website post =)
[15:28] <victhor> codecs :D
[15:28] <hamitron> webcams are not a worry, I'd go usb for them anyday
[15:28] <Tachyon`> actually had to use it briefly 2 or 3 years ago for a week when the magic smoke escaped my main motherboard on the windows box and I had no spare
[15:29] <hamitron> Tachyon`, I'm hoping the r-pi can match it
[15:29] <hamitron> :)
[15:29] <Tachyon`> I'd be very surprised if it couldn't, lol
[15:29] <hamitron> but usb video input devices are a no go from my experience
[15:29] <Tachyon`> ssh and irc was about all it was good for, it struggled with the modern web
[15:29] <hamitron> I've had 4 different devices :/
[15:29] <hamitron> Tachyon`, I still use mine daily
[15:30] <Tachyon`> (it was actaully the basis for my linux router for many years)
[15:30] <Tachyon`> but that was upgraded a few years ago finally to a more modern setup, with SATA etc., lol
[15:30] <hamitron> well, my other K6-2 I use daily
[15:30] <hamitron> 500mhz
[15:30] <hamitron> ;)
[15:30] <Tachyon`> they're at least power efficient compared to newer machiens
[15:30] <feep> my other car is a k6-2
[15:31] * Tachyon` doesn't even have one car, just an electric bicycle
[15:31] * feep neither :D
[15:31] <feep> oh god
[15:31] <hamitron> feep, yes?
[15:31] <hamitron> ;)
[15:31] <feep> my brain just seriously went "this other guy you know has an electric bicycle"
[15:31] <feep> brain
[15:31] <feep> you fail at probability.
[15:32] <Tachyon`> lol
[15:32] <Tachyon`> you appear to be in the US
[15:32] <Tachyon`> so that does seem unlikely
[15:34] <feep> germany actually
[15:35] <Tachyon`> oh, sorry
[15:35] <Tachyon`> thought t-dialin was a US provider
[15:35] * Tachyon` makes a mental note of that
[15:35] <Tachyon`> england here in any case
[15:37] <jzu> curious to know the bandwidth a Kinect needs
[15:37] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-168-200-2.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:37] <jzu> and what happens if you use the NIC at the same time
[15:39] <Tachyon`> well, nothing
[15:39] <Tachyon`> they're different bus
[15:41] <jzu> they're on the same port on the SoC
[15:49] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@c-24-11-54-36.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:54] * awilkins (~adrian@pdpc/supporter/professional/awilkins) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:54] * TonyHoyle (~TonyHoyle@tonyhoyle.broker.freenet6.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:56] * ali1234 (~ajbuxton@robotfuzz.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:03] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@bl20-125-13.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:04] * imnichol (~ian@somsen-128-149.winona.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:06] <ali1234> is there any hardware documentation available yet?
[16:06] <feep> no
[16:06] <ali1234> i would like to know the maximum clock speed of the SPI port, and the addresses of the registers used to control it :)
[16:07] * LiENUS (~yes@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:10] <RaTTuS|BIG> 700mhz ? [;)
[16:11] <TonyHoyle> Sure you're not confusing that with the 700ma power usage?
[16:11] <RaTTuS|BIG> clockspped ;-p
[16:12] <ali1234> 700mhz seems unlikely, the absolute maximum would expect is cpu clock/2
[16:12] <ali1234> but that also seems unlikely on an arm core
[16:14] <ali1234> what about the composite video out? is it configurable beyond "PAL or NTSC"?
[16:15] <TonyHoyle> Don't think anyone knows right now
[16:16] <TonyHoyle> I'd imagine you could feed X with some funky modelines to define different resolutions, but whether a TV would take them is debatable
[16:17] <ali1234> you'd imagine that, but that isn't how the N900 works
[16:17] <ali1234> on that, you can tell X whatever you want - the video out hardware then takes the X image, scales it down to 320x200, then blows it up to either PAL or NTSC (with big black boarders around it) and outputs it
[16:17] <IT_Sean> ali1234: i think i recall hearing something about the composite out defaulting to PAL, but being able to be set to NTSC. Forget how, or where i hear that, though.
[16:18] <ali1234> yeah that's what i was afraid of
[16:18] * atts (~asheehan@static-99-136-171-68.axsne.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:18] <IT_Sean> Don't quote me on that, though
[16:18] <ali1234> you can;t get a true interlaced composite signal out of any of these mobile GPUs
[16:18] <ali1234> cos they are hardcoded to only do PAL or NTSC with scaling
[16:19] <feep> >_<
[16:19] <ukscone> anyone got a few minutes?
[16:19] * WereCatf (~WereCatf@a564.ip12.netikka.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:19] <RaTTuS|BIG> depends
[16:19] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:20] <RaTTuS|BIG> as long as it's not complex and you don't mind if I vaniash ukscone
[16:20] <ukscone> RaTTuS|BIG: well i am completely out of sugar. not even any dunkin donuts packets in my stash and the store is like 100 yeardss away so i wondered if you'd go get me some and bring it to me
[16:21] <RaTTuS|BIG> I have some sugar but it's over there and the server room is calling
[16:21] <ukscone> oh and did i forget to mention i'd have to go down 2 lights of stairs too AND climb them back up too
[16:22] <WereCatf> Hmm. I wonder what I am doing wrong. I take the kernel source from github, compile it, start qemu with "qemu-system-arm -m 256M -M versatilepb -cpu arm1176 -hda rpi.img -kernel zImage -append "root=/dev/sda"" but all I get is a black screen
[16:22] <WereCatf> Any help?
[16:23] <ali1234> turn on the serial console of qemu and look for error messages
[16:23] <ali1234> sorry, i can't remember how you do that
[16:24] * RaTTuS|BIG going for sugar - I may be some time
[16:24] <feep> Invader zim age
[16:24] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@63-152-70-144.cdrr.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:24] <ukscone> WereCatf: using cnxsoft's instructions?
[16:24] <feep> *I
[16:24] <WereCatf> I compiled the kernel per the wiki, and otherwise following http://raspi.springnote.com/pages/8235930
[16:24] <ukscone> i had problems with his prebuilt kernel yesterday with a really weird errors
[16:25] * haltdef (~ponies@81-179-237-230.static.dsl.pipex.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:26] * diplo (~diplo@cpc1-trow1-0-0-cust13.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:26] * haltdef (~ponies@81-179-237-230.static.dsl.pipex.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:28] <WereCatf> Hmm, even with "-serial stdio" I am getting absolutely nothing
[16:29] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:30] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:32] <WereCatf> Uff, I cannot figure out what's wrong. The kernel compiles just fine and as I am using the default config I don't think that's the issue..
[16:32] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@13-164-111.client.wireless.msu.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:33] <WereCatf> Is there some sort of a guide that I could follow?
[16:34] <Caver> WereCatf, is this to run with qemu?
[16:34] <WereCatf> Aye
[16:34] <WereCatf> I do not have RPi board yet, though I do hope to get one later on.
[16:36] <ali1234> it's annoying that whenever someone asks for information about the SPI and GPIO etc on the forums, it degenerates into "sorry but NO soc has an open GPU!"
[16:36] * cerberos (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:36] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Client Quit)
[16:36] <ali1234> SPI and GPIO have nothing to do with the GU
[16:36] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[16:36] <WereCatf> ali1234, heh. True enough
[16:36] <ali1234> and lots and lots of SoCs have completely free documentation for that stuff
[16:37] <Caver> WereCatf, http://raspi.springnote.com/pages/8234994 any use?
[16:37] <WereCatf> I personally find it quite off-putting that there's lots of stuff behind NDA
[16:37] * cerberos (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:37] <Stskeeps> welcome to embedded devices
[16:37] <WereCatf> Caver: hmm, cannot find server raspi.springnote.com
[16:38] <ali1234> heh
[16:38] <Caver> WereCatf, it's working here
[16:38] <ali1234> Stskeeps: i don't need to point you to the omap3430 trm :)
[16:38] * haltdef is curious about that KDE tablet running mer
[16:39] <WereCatf> Caver: apparently Firefox had to be restarted, it had crashed or corrupted something. Again. >_> Wonderful. Anyways, I'll see about that link, will let you know if I can't get it to work!
[16:39] <Caver> yay :)
[16:39] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:40] <WereCatf> Ah, but that's only about compiling the kernel
[16:41] <ali1234> actually the most annoying part is the self proclaimed experts on the forum don't seem to understand the defference between an arm core and a soc with peripherals
[16:42] <ali1234> "all the pinout descriptions and block diagrams ??? that's about 50 pages of nonsense"
[16:42] <haltdef> I had no idea what an SoC was until I researched the raspberry pi a bit
[16:42] <ali1234> no, that's what developers actually need
[16:42] <haltdef> knew phones have a gpu, cpu etc but had no idea it was all on one chip :P
[16:43] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:43] <feep> [16:41:46] <ali1234> "all the pinout descriptions and block diagrams ??? that's about 50 pages of nonsense"
[16:43] <feep> what
[16:43] <feep> seriously?
[16:43] <feep> somebody srsly said that?
[16:43] <ali1234> yes
[16:43] <feep> holy shit
[16:44] <feep> talk about map-territory confusion
[16:44] <ali1234> an admin with 600 odd posts no less
[16:44] <feep> ;_;
[16:44] <Caver> http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:ALiJspgpc8UJ:www.cnx-software.com/2011/10/18/raspberry-pi-emulator-in-ubuntu-with-qemu/+arm1176+qemu&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk a better qemu thing, but seems to be offline at the mo so google cache of it
[16:44] <feep> why can't everybody be not dumb
[16:45] <Caver> well I think there is a awful lot of wishful thinking, and people not used to really bargin hardware, not being perfect
[16:45] <WereCatf> Caver: I'll see about that, too, then
[16:45] <feep> no I mean going
[16:46] <ali1234> it's not like the documentation doesn't exist and someone would have to be paid to write it
[16:46] <feep> "I can't make sense of this"
[16:46] <feep> "ergo it must be nonsense"
[16:46] <ali1234> and it's not like the information won't be reverse engineered within a few weeks of the boards shipping anyway
[16:46] <ali1234> it's just a pain in the ass
[16:47] <WereCatf> ali1234, it might be quite a daunting task to reverse-engineer several tens of megabytes of GPU binary.
[16:48] <ali1234> NO NO NO
[16:48] <ali1234> the GPU has nothing to do with it
[16:48] <Caver> ali1234, I wish ... not quite sure it'll be that quick
[16:48] <ali1234> i don't care about the GPU
[16:48] <ali1234> i am talking about low level peripherals like SPI and I2C
[16:48] <WereCatf> I understood that most of the drivers are communicating with one, large binary blob and that blob also includes GPU stuff
[16:48] * datagutt_ is now known as datagutt
[16:49] <WereCatf> And as such you'd have to reverse-engineer the whole blob
[16:49] <ali1234> that doesn't matter
[16:49] <ali1234> you do not need to reverse the whole blob
[16:49] <Caver> I'm more happy for someone to come out with nice python lib's for such things
[16:49] <ali1234> SPI and I2C are both excruciatingly simple
[16:49] <Henchman21> http://elinux.org/RPi_Low-level_peripherals ?
[16:49] <ali1234> typical implementations have about 4-5 byte registers involved with them
[16:49] <ali1234> the mystery is a) what is the adress of those registers and b) what do they mean?
[16:50] <ali1234> Henchman21: that page virtually no useful information at all
[16:51] <ali1234> it contains statements like "It is also possible to reconfigure some of the pins to provide an ARM JTAG interface."
[16:51] <ali1234> ok, how?
[16:52] <ali1234> and "Each GPIO can interrupt, high/low/rise/fall/change."
[16:52] <ali1234> great. how? and what is the interrupt vector that gets called when an interrupt fires?
[16:52] <Henchman21> isnt there already a jtag header?
[16:53] <ali1234> no, the jtag is muxed with gpio pins via undocumented registers
[16:54] <Davespice> hey guys, has anyone thought of using this stuff to prototype a case? -> http://sugru.com/gadget-lovers
[16:54] <ali1234> i recommend milliput, it's cheaper
[16:55] <ali1234> and it sets hard, not rubbery, so it's like real plastic
[16:55] <Davespice> ahh, mmhmm
[16:57] * WereCatf (~WereCatf@a564.ip12.netikka.fi) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[16:57] <ali1234> 60g sugru - $12.50. 113g milliput - $4
[17:02] <ukscone> crisis averted. there was a box of icing sugar in the bakery items closet
[17:03] * gabriel9|work (~quassel@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:06] * gabriel9 (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:08] * gabriel9 (~quassel@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:09] * haltdef (~ponies@81-179-237-230.static.dsl.pipex.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[17:10] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6)
[17:14] * LiENUS (~yes@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[17:14] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:18] * roban (roban@c83-181-13-245.cust.tele2.se) Quit ()
[17:19] <traeak> !w
[17:19] <PiBot> traeak: in Parker, CO on Tue Jan 31 09:53:00 2012. Temp 2??C. Condition: Partly Cloudy, Humidity: 41%, Later 8??C - -5??C. Condition: Mostly Sunny.
[17:20] * haltdef (~ponies@81-179-237-230.static.dsl.pipex.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:20] <Caver> ah so a don't get out of bed weather forecast then
[17:21] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:21] * IT_Sean grumbles and mutters and plots the demise of analog dial modems
[17:22] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:22] <Caver> analog dial modems?! in this day and age?
[17:24] * stereohead is now known as stereohead-away
[17:26] <koaschten_> holy shit awesome
[17:26] <koaschten_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=Y8YhED4IgQA
[17:26] <Davespice> I haven't seen one of those in years
[17:26] <IT_Sean> yup
[17:26] <Davespice> last one of those I saw was about 1996....
[17:26] <koaschten_> i have some us robotics56k somewhere...
[17:27] <Davespice> these are the ones that click as they dial and need an acoustic coupler for a phone handset?
[17:27] <RaTTuS|BIG> the frog fights back ;-p
[17:27] <koaschten_> wait for it RaTTuS|BIG
[17:27] <Davespice> and they drop the connection if someone 10 miles away sneezes?
[17:28] <koaschten_> you know, as if... fox news... was actually ... news ?!
[17:28] * IT_Sean sends Davespice some screechy modem noise
[17:28] <koaschten_> ;)=
[17:28] * koaschten_ helps IT_Sean out... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aV8DEJ8ydJQ *screeech*
[17:28] <koaschten_> that's actually exactly the model and make i had back then ...
[17:29] <IT_Sean> I don't need a youtube of modem noise. I hear it all day.
[17:29] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:31] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:31] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlhY1LXEF1o&feature=related
[17:31] <RaTTuS|BIG> try that one instead
[17:32] <Caver> groans
[17:32] <Caver> cos there is no way that would ever get tedious
[17:33] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:34] * troth (~troth@nat/hp/x-gupudokmdrghocyu) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:34] <Davespice> I can't belive people still use modems
[17:34] <Davespice> unless they live in a developing country
[17:35] <Davespice> our extremly remote places mind you...
[17:35] <Thorn_> like scotland
[17:35] <Davespice> yeah, perhaps if you live in Kintyre or something
[17:35] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[17:35] <Caver> I think IT_Sean is in USA
[17:36] <Davespice> USA has plenty of remote places still
[17:36] <Caver> yup ... adsl only does a few miles and then your back to good old 56Kbs (or less)
[17:36] <Caver> or satellite for lots of $$$
[17:37] <IT_Sean> I'm not using it for internet access
[17:37] <IT_Sean> We use 'em in the devices my company manufacturers
[17:37] <diplo> Davespice, we use analogue modems in about 80+ sites
[17:37] <diplo> As fax modems
[17:37] <Davespice> oh, so just to dial someones fax machine
[17:37] <diplo> Yep
[17:38] <Davespice> that's fair enough
[17:38] <Caver> I'm hoping next year I can unplug our fax finally
[17:38] <Davespice> but for web access I suppose I am thinking of
[17:38] <IT_Sean> We use them for remote access to devices.
[17:38] <diplo> A lot of the suppliers still won't accept email unfortunately
[17:38] <diplo> We've done that at places as well IT_Sean, when the dsl line has gone down
[17:38] <Davespice> what sort of device?
[17:38] <IT_Sean> That's what we do. Out of band management devices.
[17:39] <Davespice> like a pbx or something?
[17:39] <IT_Sean> no. We make a product that gives you access to the console ports on your netowkriong equipment, via a telco line, in the event your primary IP connection / entire IP network shits itself.
[17:40] <IT_Sean> Oh... and it's encrypted. :p
[17:40] <Caver> good!
[17:40] <Caver> ah is this like the old serial port masters
[17:40] <IT_Sean> with a modern twist, i suppose.
[17:40] <IT_Sean> *modern
[17:41] <Caver> modem ? :P
[17:41] <IT_Sean> well, the encryptopn is the modern bit. :p We are using ye olde analog dial modems.
[17:41] <Caver> :) tis a well understood technology
[17:42] <Davespice> okay so basically if someone were to tap the line and record the modem sound, they would only get garbage?
[17:43] <Caver> unless they have the encryptions keys - yes I'd imagine
[17:44] <Davespice> cool, so its like a fail safe solution, nice
[17:44] <Davespice> if half the internet gets taken down, you can fall back to the telephone network
[17:44] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Quit: cerberos)
[17:44] * cerberos (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:45] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:45] <koaschten_> yeah sad that USA never adopted ISDN
[17:46] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Client Quit)
[17:47] * cerberos (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:47] <Caver> lol - ISDN = It Still Does Nothing
[17:47] <koaschten_> at least it guaranteed 64kbit ;)
[17:48] <Caver> well 128 if you bond then
[17:48] <koaschten_> on 2 lines over one copper pair
[17:48] <koaschten_> compare that to analog
[17:49] * prbz_ (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:49] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:49] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ Quit (Client Quit)
[17:52] * diplo (~diplo@cpc1-trow1-0-0-cust13.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[17:52] * prbz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:54] <merlin1991> Caver: just like ntsc = never the same colour
[17:55] <Caver> more like Never Twice the Same Colour
[17:56] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:00] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[18:00] <Caver> mind you NTSC in USA is more or less dead now, apart from cable isn't it?
[18:00] <Caver> (PAL is fast going the same way here in the UK)
[18:00] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:01] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:01] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:02] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[18:02] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:05] * jmontleo (~jmontleon@c-76-19-35-6.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:05] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[18:06] * Spikey_ is now known as Spikey
[18:06] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ Quit (Client Quit)
[18:08] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb7:ca81:954c:25bd:16cf:bcc8) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:10] * NIN101 (~NIN@2001:530::216:3cff:fe71:5e1e) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:12] * awilkins (~adrian@pdpc/supporter/professional/awilkins) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[18:14] * cerber0s (~cerberos@ Quit (Client Quit)
[18:17] * ukscone1 (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:20] * TonyRogers_ (~rogers@ladymoor-gate.demon.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:20] * Soul_Est_ (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:21] * wcchandl1r (~william@cpe-069-134-244-245.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:21] * mrdragon1 (~lucas@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:22] * TonyHoyle (~TonyHoyle@tonyhoyle.broker.freenet6.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[18:24] * stereohead-away is now known as stereohead
[18:25] * TonyRogers (~rogers@ladymoor-gate.demon.co.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[18:25] * alien_ (~cristi@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[18:25] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:25] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:25] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@fedora/CodeBlock) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:25] * mrdragons (~lucas@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:25] * wcchandler (~william@cpe-069-134-244-245.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:28] * prbz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:29] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 9.0.1/20111220165912])
[18:32] * prbz_ (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[18:32] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@ec2-107-22-199-66.compute-1.amazonaws.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:33] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@13-164-111.client.wireless.msu.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:42] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[18:43] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:48] * cerberos (~cerberos@ Quit (Quit: cerberos)
[18:49] * Soul_Est_ (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Quit: brb)
[18:49] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:49] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[18:50] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:51] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[18:51] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:57] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:03] * ukscone1 (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has left #raspberrypi
[19:03] * ukscone1 (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:05] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb7:ca81:954c:25bd:16cf:bcc8) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[19:06] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[19:06] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:10] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@13-164-111.client.wireless.msu.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:11] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c52ca.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:22] * IT_Sean looks around
[19:23] <feep> hi
[19:23] * feep waves
[19:23] * IT_Sean waves back
[19:23] <feep> :D
[19:25] * stereohead is now known as stereohead-away
[19:33] * Soul_Est waves at feep and IT_Sean
[19:35] * IT_Sean waves at Soul_Est
[19:36] * feep waves
[19:36] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[19:36] * ksaua (~saua@193.81-167-3.customer.lyse.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[19:37] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[19:37] * ksaua (~saua@193.81-167-3.customer.lyse.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:39] * IT_Sean is having an off day, doesn't feel like being at work right now ,and would like very much to go home
[19:40] <feep> ._.
[19:40] <feep> those suck
[19:41] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:42] <IT_Sean> usually, i love my job. I just *don't* want to be here today, though.
[19:42] <MartijnVdS> "I'm not even supposed to be here today!"
[19:43] <ali1234> what's a vll?
[19:44] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: context?
[19:44] <IT_Sean> !w
[19:44] <PiBot> IT_Sean: in Boonton, NJ on Tue Jan 31 21:53:00 2012. Temp 54??F. Condition: Clear, Humidity: 33%, Later 54??F - 38??F. Condition: Mostly Sunny.
[19:44] <IT_Sean> awe man... it's warm and sunny too! ._.
[19:44] <ali1234> MartijnVdS: found in the boot partition of r-pi images
[19:44] * IT_Sean wishes he weren't stuck inside on such a lovely day
[19:45] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: what does 'file' say>?
[19:45] <ali1234> elf 32-bit LSB shared object, dynamically linked, stripped
[19:45] <MartijnVdS> So it's a .so with a weird name
[19:45] <ali1234> (it does not specify architecture though)
[19:45] <MartijnVdS> Ooh, indeed
[19:46] <ali1234> anyone know in what order the other stuff loads?
[19:46] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: where can I get one of those images?
[19:46] <ali1234> we have: bootcode.bin, loader.bin, and start.elf
[19:46] <ali1234> MartijnVdS: i found it on dropbox :P
[19:46] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[19:46] <MartijnVdS> "I was browsing dropbox, and suddenly.."
[19:47] <ali1234> start.elf is "ELF 32-bit LSB executable, version 1 (SYSV), statically linked, not stripped"
[19:47] <ali1234> the other two are "data"
[19:47] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: there's a tool for that, let me find it
[19:48] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: http://code.google.com/p/binwalk/
[19:48] <ali1234> loader.bin has some interesting strings in it
[19:48] <ali1234> oh look, a hardcoded list of resolutions
[19:48] <ali1234> nice
[19:49] <ali1234> "hdcp_on" lol
[19:49] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: binwalk will extract any files it recognises
[19:49] <Stskeeps> it's a full blown STB chipset, you know
[19:49] <MartijnVdS> (by signature)
[19:49] <MartijnVdS> it can even recognise file systems
[19:50] <ali1234> i doubt either of these files has a filesystem inside it. one is 16kb, the other is 300kb
[19:50] * LiENUS (~yes@ip68-11-254-175.br.br.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:50] <ali1234> bootcode.bin (the smaller one) references loader.bin
[19:50] <ali1234> so i guess bootcode.bin is the first one
[19:53] <ali1234> bootcode.bin only contains about 4kb of actual code, the rest is zeros
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> so it's like a boot sector
[19:54] * wwalker (~wwalker@ Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> what's in the 3rd file
[19:54] <ali1234> the start.elf?
[19:54] * wwalker (~wwalker@ has joined #raspberrypi
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> yes
[19:55] <ali1234> loads and loads of stuff
[19:55] <ali1234> it's 20MB
[19:55] <ali1234> probably the whole OS image for the "GPU" core
[19:55] * MystX (~MystX@ec2-107-21-100-215.compute-1.amazonaws.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:55] <MystX> Is it out yet?
[19:55] * PiBot slaps MystX across the face with a cast iron pan.
[19:56] <ali1234> /thirdparty/vcfw/rtos/threadx/filex/fx_utility_FAT_entry_read.c
[19:56] <ali1234> anyone know what arch threadx runs on?
[19:56] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:58] <ali1234> http://rtos.com/products/threadx/
[19:58] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:58] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[19:59] <MystX> ali1234: Er, anything?
[19:59] * schigndix (~androirc@ has joined #raspberrypi
[20:00] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@bl20-125-13.dsl.telepac.pt) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[20:01] <ali1234> main ARM and PPC
[20:01] <ali1234> *mainly
[20:03] * CustomTronics (~mjtessmer@user-12l2tpe.cable.mindspring.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:05] * Simon- (simon@proxima.lp0.eu) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[20:07] <ali1234> this has references to openMAX IL
[20:08] * Simon- (simon@proxima.lp0.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:08] <ali1234> ah, start.elf does load the kernel.img :)
[20:08] <ali1234> so loader.bin must load start.elf i guess
[20:10] * LiENUS (~yes@ip68-11-254-175.br.br.cox.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[20:10] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:11] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[20:11] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@ has joined #raspberrypi
[20:12] <ali1234> ooo, uncompiled shader code
[20:12] * CuriosDog (~stian@117.81-166-155.customer.lyse.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:12] <CuriosDog> Howdy all
[20:13] * uen (~uen@p5DCB178E.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:14] <Soul_Est> hi CuriosDog
[20:15] <CuriosDog> Heya Soul_Est
[20:18] <Soul_Est> !w
[20:30] * prbz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[20:31] * prbz (~prebz@c83-254-51-59.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:33] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:35] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb7:ca81:109b:50d2:39f1:19bd) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:36] <ali1234> i suspect this chip is a lot more powerful than most people realise
[20:37] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[20:40] * MuNk (~MuNk@2001:470:1f09:1ec1:210:75ff:fe1a:bdb0) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[20:40] <traeak> ali1234: we'll know when something is actually shipping
[20:40] <ali1234> hmm... mips? looks like mips...
[20:40] <traeak> what's mip s??
[20:40] <ali1234> the "GPU"
[20:41] <Stskeeps> well, broadcom does have a mips license
[20:41] <traeak> interesting
[20:41] <ali1234> disassembling start.elf as mips produces relatively senseful asm
[20:41] <traeak> doing the gpu with "mips" although it wouldn't be standard mips
[20:41] <traeak> you have access to that stuff then?
[20:42] <traeak> hehe, dual architecture chip
[20:42] <ali1234> i found it on the internets
[20:42] <traeak> what percentage of instreuctions looks reasonable?
[20:42] <traeak> i've seen reports that mips is more effcient than arm
[20:42] <ali1234> well the first two instructions are jal and nop :)
[20:42] <traeak> power efficient
[20:45] * CuriosDog is now known as CuriosTiger
[20:46] <ali1234> hmm... this is jumping around all over the place... maybe it's not mips
[20:47] <traeak> heh
[20:47] <traeak> its their own secret sauce apparently
[20:48] <ali1234> yeah there's far too many integer constants for this to be real code
[20:48] <ali1234> it does appear to have some debug symbols though
[20:50] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[20:51] * pistacik1_ (~root@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
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[20:53] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c57db.dynamic.uiowa.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
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[20:59] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@CPE0017f2324fce-CM0012250096a8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[20:59] * pistacik1_ (~root@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[21:02] * pistacik__ (~root@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:05] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
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[21:05] <mrdragon1> Whoop, awesome new blog post. ^_^
[21:05] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj1993) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:07] <MystX> Mmhm
[21:07] <MystX> "No you cant solder your own SoC you muppet"
[21:09] * mrdragon1 is now known as mrdragons
[21:09] <tntexplosivesltd> people are idiots
[21:10] <tntexplosivesltd> MystX: sightlight would
[21:10] <tntexplosivesltd> well he'd try
[21:11] <ali1234> the more i look at this code the less i want one
[21:11] <mrdragons> That chip is tiny; I think people are just thinking that hand is massive or something
[21:12] <ali1234> absolutely everything is mediated by the "gpu"
[21:12] <Stskeeps> ali1234: ARM is a sidethought in this, so not surprised..
[21:12] <ali1234> it's standard practice for broadcom. all their snapdragon stuff works this way too
[21:12] <mrdragons> What code?
[21:12] <ali1234> except there it's two arm cores and here it's arm + weird broadcom thing
[21:12] <Stskeeps> snapdragon == qualcomm?
[21:12] <ali1234> oh my bad
[21:13] <ali1234> always get those mixed up lol
[21:13] <ali1234> well, it's the same thing anyway
[21:13] <traeak> heh
[21:13] <ali1234> you have zero access to the real hardware
[21:13] * traeak waves hands around in a vague way
[21:13] <traeak> ali1234: the "blob" determines that...it acts like "the hardware"
[21:14] <ali1234> eg if you want to set a specific video mode you better hope that the real OS has a #define for that mode, because you can't directly access the pixel clocks
[21:14] <rm> hopefully shall educate children, as they start bumping into its various limitations and stonewalling by broadcom, on why proprietary hardware is bad :P
[21:14] <ali1234> the blob doesn't really act like hardware, it provides a very high level interface to it
[21:15] <ali1234> so the hardware would have registers that determine horizontal and vertical refresh rates and the pixel clock and so on. the blob has a function that accepts a predefined list of modes
[21:15] <mrdragons> Yeah, the graphics capabilities would be a lot lower though if they were to go with open source
[21:15] <ali1234> if the mode you want isn't there, tough
[21:15] <mrdragons> That, or cost a good bit more
[21:15] <ali1234> (even if you only want framebuffer, if you want a non standard mode you are screwed)
[21:16] <ali1234> this is a step removed from something like nvidia binary driver, because that at least has an api that maps closely to the real hardware
[21:16] <ali1234> this is... something else
[21:16] * IT_Sean (~cdi-1fors@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:16] <ali1234> where they can sell the same chip to everyone with a different set of features determined by the blob
[21:16] <Stskeeps> makes economic sense
[21:17] <ali1234> you might as well be running user mode linux :)
[21:17] <ali1234> it makes economic sense to sell it, but not to buy it :)
[21:18] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@ec2-107-22-199-66.compute-1.amazonaws.com) Quit (Changing host)
[21:18] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@fedora/CodeBlock) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:19] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) Quit (Quit: kthxbai)
[21:20] <traeak> and we'll see how well the "lima" driver works
[21:20] <traeak> when that goes live
[21:20] <traeak> actually i have a tablet right here with a mali400
[21:20] <traeak> its' the same tablet they'r egoing to sell with kde plasma
[21:20] <traeak> the zenithink c71
[21:24] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c57db.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
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[21:34] <MystX> Eww.
[21:38] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[21:39] <LiENUS> i heard eben took all of the pre-order money and went to mexico
[21:40] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[21:40] <victhor> be more creative, you said that already
[21:40] <LiENUS> newbies are in here im sure
[21:41] <LiENUS> plus everytime i say it as long as no one calls me out on it i end up with a few people who take the bait and ask where they can pre-order from
[21:41] <LiENUS> then me or someone else tells them they were up on raspberrypi.com but all the pre orders have been made and they'll have to wait a few months for the next shipment
[21:41] <LiENUS> voila more raspberrypis for me when they come out!
[21:42] <tntexplosivesltd> flawless plan
[21:42] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:43] <LiENUS> ok on twitter i saw them say that the pis are still at the factory
[21:43] <LiENUS> i thought we saw articles saying they had shipped
[21:44] <LiENUS> i thought one of the project guys posted on the forums said he got a call from the factory saying they shipped em so when they got em theyd ship em to customers
[21:44] <LiENUS> so are they still at the factory or on a boat?
[21:44] <piofcube> There's on a horse
[21:44] <IT_Sean> they are on a dinghey, which is inside the factory.
[21:44] <piofcube> they're even ... bah :S
[21:44] <LiENUS> where is on a horse?
[21:45] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:46] * IT_Sean (~cdi-1fors@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[21:46] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:47] <MystX> Anyone have a Evo 3D?
[21:48] <traeak> dunno what that is
[21:48] <LiENUS> i think its some kind of drug
[21:48] <MystX> Its a phone =P
[21:49] <traeak> i would make a comment but i'm pretty stinking guilty of off topic discussions
[21:49] <traeak> hehe
[21:49] * Jef91 (~jeff@ has joined #raspberrypi
[21:49] <mrdragons> You'll have to go to your dealer to pick one up
[21:49] <Jef91> Are the forums working for anyone else?
[21:49] * uen (~uen@p5DCB178E.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:49] <Jef91> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum seems to be down
[21:49] <traeak> ahh thanks for reminding me to check the site
[21:49] <traeak> new front page content!
[21:49] <MystX> Works for me
[21:50] <mrdragons> Works here
[21:50] <traeak> the forums are pretty useless right now considering everyone seems to be posting meme's
[21:51] <MystX> ???_???
[21:51] <mrdragons> Yep, the forums are slowly going downhills as more and more noobs join. :\
[21:51] <Jef91> What OS/Desktop will be offered by default on the Pi?
[21:51] <mrdragons> Prolly fedora/redhat or debian
[21:52] <Jef91> Cool!
[21:52] <Jef91> I'm hoping to get Debian Wheezy+E17 on it.
[21:52] <traeak> we'll have to see how quickly the mali gpu drivers take off
[21:52] <traeak> hmm
[21:52] <traeak> although i guess we can find benchies of the mali vs vidcore today
[21:52] <traeak> i'm just too lazy to look
[21:52] <ukscone1> anyone up on the kids and their twitter lingo?
[21:53] <ukscone1> anyone know what the abbreviation LKS means?
[21:53] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:53] <traeak> twitter is an abomination of time wasting
[21:53] <mrdragons> Twitter is for twits. :P
[21:53] <ukscone1> mrdragons: and identi.ca is for idents
[21:53] <traeak> twatters who use twitter
[21:53] <traeak> or something like that
[21:54] <ukscone1> and traeak you just went to the bottom of the list for a raspberry pi as i'm telling liz what you said :)
[21:54] <mrdragons> Heh, true.
[21:54] <traeak> ukscone1: hehe, that doesn't bother me as i'm pretty much overloaded for work
[21:54] <mrdragons> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/fragmentation/page-2/#p29728
[21:54] <mrdragons> ^liz speaking on the distro likely to be provided be default
[21:54] <traeak> ukscone1: for which comment? mali or bout the forums?
[21:55] <traeak> hmm..why did i decide to waste my time redoing all our smart pointers?
[21:55] <ukscone1> traeak: actually just on G.P. :)
[21:55] <traeak> probably because i dn't want to do the real work that sucks
[21:55] * atts (~asheehan@static-99-136-171-68.axsne.net) has left #raspberrypi
[21:56] <traeak> read up on some rust features last week and learned something which should help performance
[21:56] <traeak> and i like that crap (ugh)
[21:57] <feep> D vs. Rust: FIGHT
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[22:09] * LiENUS (~yes@2001:470:bbb7:ca81:109b:50d2:39f1:19bd) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[22:10] * R` (~RHA@ip7.j-k.kund.riksnet.nu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[22:27] <WASDx> is OpenGL not open source?
[22:28] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[22:28] <mrdragons> I was wondering the same thing; why call it opengl is it's not opensource? 0_o
[22:28] <WASDx> ClosedGL
[22:29] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:30] <koaschten_> Y U SO BAD AMUERICA http://christiansagainstnike.com/ ... someone lawyer up on that site for using Brian Eno's "An Ending". The RIAA will love it.
[22:30] <SpeedEvil> The interface to opengl being open-source does not mean that the low-level hardware is open-source
[22:30] <tntexplosivesltd> because access to its specification is open?
[22:31] <CuriosTiger> mrdragons: The specification is open source. Whether an implementation is open source is obviously up to the implementer.
[22:31] <mrdragons> But still, I thought it was like, open source and stuff. ;_;
[22:31] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:32] <mrdragons> Because it's been implemented on like kolibre OS and minuet
[22:34] * jluisn (~quassel@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:35] <mrdragons> Ah well
[22:36] <feep> SpeedEvil: no it doesn't
[22:36] <feep> opengl is not open source, what the fuck
[22:36] <feep> opengl is not source.
[22:36] <feep> it _can't_ be open source.
[22:37] <feep> that's like saying "is your toaster open source? "
[22:37] <feep> it's not even wrong.
[22:37] <feep> it's nonsense.
[22:37] <mrdragons> But my toaster *is* opensource
[22:37] <feep> no it's not.
[22:37] <MystX> Open source hardware =P
[22:37] <feep> okay I agree that was a bad example
[22:37] <feep> it's not though
[22:37] <feep> :p
[22:37] <mrdragons> One of my passions is open-source kitchen appliances
[22:38] <feep> this seems unlikely!
[22:38] <CuriosTiger> feep: "Open source" in a wider sense is applied to things like open standards. Your toaster can indeed be open source if, for example, the blue prints for it are available for free and you don't insist on being pedantically literal in your interpretation of the expression.
[22:38] <mrdragons> :P
[22:38] * barr5790 (~alan@cpc1-belf7-0-0-cust981.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:38] <feep> CuriosTiger: That is a valid argument
[22:38] <feep> however, it still doesn't apply to standards
[22:38] <feep> standards can at most be open.
[22:38] <SpeedEvil> My microwave is almost open-source.
[22:38] <SpeedEvil> If I get the phone properly attached to it.
[22:39] <koaschten_> mrdragons your toaster is an open heat source, yep
[22:39] <SpeedEvil> Old neo1973 phone that I intend to use as a microwave oven controller.
[22:39] <feep> And OpenGL is an open standard.
[22:39] <feep> So that's good.
[22:39] <feep> you know what would be hilarious
[22:39] <mrdragons> I'm not particularly caring, I just always assumed that open gl was, well, open source
[22:39] <MystX> But everything that's not open source is bad, right?
[22:40] <feep> if somebody made a spec that had in its license conditions that all implementations were open source.
[22:40] <feep> MystX: yes but sometimes we must allow a small badness for the greater good.
[22:40] * tntexplosivesltd looks over at the binary blob we will be using
[22:40] * mrdragons is now known as mrdragons-away
[22:40] <CuriosTiger> feep: That's been done, and the result tends to be that nobody implements the standard.
[22:40] <MystX> =P
[22:40] <tntexplosivesltd> MystX: no
[22:40] <feep> CuriosTiger: darn. :/
[22:40] <MystX> Was kidding..
[22:40] <mrdragons-away> I didn't mean to make a big deal out of this, geesh
[22:41] <feep> mrdragons-away: I just don't get how opengl _can_ even be "open source"
[22:41] <feep> it's not a thing that has a source.
[22:41] <feep> not even somewhat.
[22:41] <CuriosTiger> mrdragons-away: We're having a debate on IRC. I don't see how that's a big deal.
[22:41] <ali1234> wrong
[22:41] <tntexplosivesltd> closed source = accountablility = high(er) quality
[22:41] <feep> tntexplosivesltd: nice troll :D
[22:41] * feep gives it 7/10
[22:41] <ali1234> any given opengl implementation has a large amount of source code. most of opengl 1.x didn't even run on the gpu...
[22:41] <tntexplosivesltd> feep: I'm partly serious
[22:41] <tntexplosivesltd> XD
[22:41] <SpeedEvil> 'I only use open-source people amuse me.
[22:42] <feep> ali1234: yes, and opengl is in fact open source in the sense that there is an open source implementation
[22:42] <feep> ali1234: Mesa :)
[22:42] <SpeedEvil> Their bluetooth adaptor, keyboard, ...
[22:42] <feep> it's just shit slow.
[22:42] <tntexplosivesltd> SpeedEvil: yes I know a few people like that
[22:42] <tntexplosivesltd> very annoying
[22:42] <ali1234> mesa is in fact a wrapper on various opengl implementations
[22:42] <tntexplosivesltd> very smug
[22:42] <feep> but it's also a software library!
[22:42] <tntexplosivesltd> >.<
[22:42] <ali1234> one of which is software based
[22:42] <feep> and slow in most cases!
[22:43] <feep> due to the underlying hardware being mostly intel
[22:43] <feep> iow shit
[22:43] <tntexplosivesltd> ???_???
[22:43] * MystX (~MystX@ec2-107-21-100-215.compute-1.amazonaws.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:43] <feep> apologies to the kiddies
[22:43] <CuriosTiger> feep: Oh, you could write source code for OpenGL. Formal specifications in Z notation, for example, can be considered "source". (Yes, it's a stretch.)
[22:43] <feep> streeetch~
[22:43] <CuriosTiger> :D
[22:44] * MystX (~MystX@ec2-107-21-100-215.compute-1.amazonaws.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:44] <MystX> Ffs irssi
[22:44] <Thorn_> irssi is not responsible
[22:45] <Thorn_> pebkac
[22:45] * Kostic (~Kostic]@net12-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has left #raspberrypi
[22:45] <MystX> What, it locked up
[22:46] <MystX> Couldnt type anything, wouldnt let me kill it
[22:46] <tntexplosivesltd> MystX: or was it the ssh session?
[22:47] <feep> anybody got a razpi yet?
[22:47] * feep petitions for shell access~
[22:47] <tntexplosivesltd> what?
[22:47] <tntexplosivesltd> shell access?
[22:47] <feep> the team really should put up a farm of a few razzes
[22:47] <tntexplosivesltd> to what?
[22:47] <feep> and make a "request pre-release access" thread
[22:47] <feep> for opengl testing and the such
[22:48] <tntexplosivesltd> feep: shell access to what
[22:48] <feep> tntexplosivesltd: pies
[22:48] <MystX> tntexplosivesltd: no, tmux worke fine
[22:48] <tntexplosivesltd> MystX: o.O
[22:49] <ali1234> how are you going to test opengl over a remote shell?
[22:49] <MystX> ali1234: with science
[22:49] <tntexplosivesltd> feep: never heard "shell access" before, interesting
[22:49] * tntexplosivesltd heard something new today
[22:49] <tntexplosivesltd> =D
[22:50] <feep> :D
[22:50] <feep> ali1234: Xvfb :D
[22:50] <ali1234> is that even possible?
[22:50] <ali1234> i'm pretty sure this opengl implementation works by overlaying into the framebuffer at hardware level
[22:50] <tntexplosivesltd> X is a server...
[22:51] <tntexplosivesltd> oh, hmm
[22:51] <ali1234> so you would just get a black screen in your Xvfb
[22:51] <tntexplosivesltd> we should try
[22:51] <tntexplosivesltd> for science
[22:51] <ali1234> yes, i suppose that is a valid test
[22:51] <MystX> As long as you can play portal on it..
[22:52] <ali1234> lol no
[22:52] <MystX> What!?
[22:52] <feep> ali1234: I'd presume opengl has framebuffer support .. I'm fairly sure there's some egl stuff about that
[22:52] <feep> gles*
[22:52] <MystX> On noes. Stomach gurgling uncontrollably
[22:53] <ali1234> it has framebuffer in the sense that the hardware doesn't care if X is running or not because the opengl gets rendered into the framebuffer no matter what
[22:53] <ali1234> i suppose glReadPixels might be implemented... you could test that way... at like 1 fps :)
[22:53] <Stskeeps> i think it's more along lines of laid on top of the linux kernel's perceived framebuffer..
[22:54] <feep> I really just want to know if it runs :p
[22:56] <ali1234> remember back in the early days of hardware accelerated graphics where you'd take a screenshot, and you'd just get a pink rectangle instead of what was actually there?
[23:01] <ali1234> in some ways this is good, because it will be totally impossible to write programs which are not portable :)
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[23:41] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@13-164-111.client.wireless.msu.edu) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
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These logs were automatically created by RaspberryPiBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.