#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2012-02-15

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] <SpeedEvil> And that's contended if you've got a USB ass-rage device.
[0:00] <Thor> I mean : my idea is completely useless since I can't find a single board computer with affordable price and gigabit capability
[0:00] <SpeedEvil> mass storage
[0:00] * Guest87053 (~MagicalTu@w001.de.eu.xta.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:00] <Thor> SpeedEvil: yep okay.
[0:01] <Thor> Well, I'll proabaly buy some RPI to toy with anyway... But I won't buy 100 of em in that case :D
[0:01] <Plankalkuel> :D
[0:01] <Thor> Thanks Plankalkuel and SpeedEvil for your time and sharing your knowledge :)
[0:02] <Thor> RPI boards are a huge step forward, definitely.
[0:02] <Thor> bye all :)
[0:02] <mrdragons> Laters
[0:02] * Thor (~thor@unaffiliated/thor) has left #raspberrypi
[0:02] * R` (~RHA@ip7.j-k.kund.riksnet.nu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:02] <mrdragons> I think they're a step back. Worse technology packaged with a cheap, broken OS. Pfft.
[0:03] <mrdragons> :P
[0:04] <Plankalkuel> Yes. Cheap stuff always sucks ;)
[0:05] <mrdragons> I mean, it doesn't even have an i7
[0:05] <Ben64> $35 for the power of a smartphone
[0:05] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:05] <Plankalkuel> Maybe you can connect an i7 per GPIO?
[0:05] <Plankalkuel> ;)
[0:06] <Plankalkuel> Can't be THAT hard
[0:07] <mrdragons> Besides the incredibly difficult parts, yeah, that'd be pretty easy
[0:08] <mrdragons> Meh, nobody to troll atm. :\
[0:08] <Plankalkuel> :D
[0:11] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[0:14] <ReggieUK> :)
[0:16] <traeak> Ben64: i can get a smartphone for free though
[0:16] <traeak> hehe
[0:16] <traeak> well not really
[0:17] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7-rc1)
[0:17] <Ben64> also most smartphones don't have usb host or ethernet
[0:17] <Ben64> or let you load any software onto it
[0:18] * Guest87053 is now known as MagicalTux
[0:18] * MagicalTux (~MagicalTu@w001.de.eu.xta.net) Quit (Changing host)
[0:18] * MagicalTux (~MagicalTu@mtgox/staff/MagicalTux) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:30] <traeak> http://www.buy.com/prod/pogoplug-personal-cloud-media-sharing-solution-black/221688297.html
[0:31] <traeak> pogoplug on sale
[0:31] <traeak> lost thor oh well
[0:37] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:38] * pizza-dude (~fake@dhcp-077-249-161-109.chello.nl) Quit (Quit: The real world is just a crappy game... The ideal world can only be found within a game. Such was my believe. But if an ideal can be found within a crappy game, there may be an ideal route in the real world... for me to discover)
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[0:48] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[1:16] * jzu (~jzu@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[1:26] * Cemmy (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * CustomTronics (~mjtessmer@user-12l2tpe.cable.mindspring.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:27] * CustomTronics (~mjtessmer@user-12l2tpe.cable.mindspring.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[1:37] * xlq (~apropos@89-168-184-3.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[1:40] * zakmes_ (~zakmes@095-096-108-128.static.chello.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[1:47] * saua (~saua@193.81-167-3.customer.lyse.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[2:02] * jardiamj (~chatzilla@221-228-212-206-wiban.onlinemac.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:02] * |uen| (~uen@p5DCB196D.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:04] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[3:06] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:06] * uen| (~uen@p5DCB3D9C.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[3:08] * doug_ndndn (~doug@2001:470:1f09:18c8:219:d2ff:fe3d:7524) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[3:15] * Cemmy (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[3:16] * piofcube (~piofcube@piofcube.1billionhex.com) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[3:16] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit (Quit: The real world is just a crappy game... The ideal world can only be found within a game. Such was my believe. But if an ideal can be found within a crappy game, there may be an ideal route in the real world... for me to discover)
[3:21] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@74-115-197-42.eng.wind.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:24] * doug_ndndn (~doug@78-86-178-196.zone2.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:25] * victhor_ (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[3:28] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@74-115-197-42.eng.wind.ca) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[3:39] <mrdragons> Whoop, my bot's "IPC" now works, and my bot is officially about 20x more complex than it originally was
[3:44] <mrdragons> Probably isn't good that I've been studying operating systems while programming this
[3:44] <mrdragons> :P
[3:45] * dronf (~user@host-46-186-32-201.dynamic.mm.pl) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[3:56] <tntexplo1ivesltd> "IPC" ?
[3:57] <mrdragons> InterProcess Communication
[3:58] <mrdragons> Very loosely applied
[3:58] <mrdragons> Hence the quotes
[3:58] <RITRedbeard> this is gonna sound dumb, I don't do web dev stuff
[3:58] <RITRedbeard> on wikipedia, you know the rows/columns/spreadsheet
[3:58] <RITRedbeard> is that apart of xhtml std?
[4:06] * jardiamj (~chatzilla@221-228-212-206-wiban.onlinemac.com) Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 10.0.1/20120208060813])
[4:07] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:07] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca5626.bb.sky.com) Quit ()
[4:08] <mrdragons> Hmm, what do you mean exactly? Like the CSS stylesheet?
[4:08] <mrdragons> Or the tables?
[4:22] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: mkopack)
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[5:04] * MystX (~MystX@121-73-41-249.cable.telstraclear.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:06] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[5:20] * dRounse (~david@c-24-91-50-96.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:21] <dRounse> should i build a htpc with an atom board or wait for raspberry pi
[5:23] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:27] * SimonT (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/simont) Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88-rdmsoft [XULRunner])
[5:28] <MystX> dRounse: neither. Get a proper cpu
[5:29] * RITRedbeard (~RITReadbe@c-68-37-165-37.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[5:30] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[5:30] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:30] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[5:33] * dRounse (~david@c-24-91-50-96.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[5:34] * WASDx (~AINOR@81-229-79-162-no64.business.telia.com) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[5:34] * xenoxaos (~xenoxaos@c-68-80-44-179.hsd1.de.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[5:35] * wcchandler (~william@cpe-069-134-244-245.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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[5:37] * WASDx (~AINOR@81-229-79-162-no64.business.telia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:46] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[5:51] * uber_lame (~kvirc@cpe-174-108-022-202.carolina.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:14] <tntexplo1ivesltd> MystX: =D
[6:26] * uber_lame (~kvirc@cpe-174-108-022-202.carolina.res.rr.com) Quit ()
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[7:03] <MystX> what?
[7:04] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:06] <tntexplo1ivesltd> 17:28 < MystX> dRounse: neither. Get a proper cpu
[7:06] <MystX> oh
[7:11] * zma1 (~zmac@c2s31-2-83-152-88-41.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[7:17] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 300 seconds.)
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[7:25] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 300 seconds.)
[7:27] <Tobias|> Apparently some CPUs aren't proper CPUs :<
[7:27] <tntexplo1ivesltd> well yeah
[7:30] <tntexplo1ivesltd> soooooooooo tired
[7:30] * RITRedbeard (~RITReadbe@c-68-37-165-37.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[7:41] * R` (~RHA@ip7.j-k.kund.riksnet.nu) has joined #raspberrypi
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[7:44] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[7:48] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 300 seconds.)
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[8:33] * tero (~0@aether.info) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[8:37] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@ Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
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[9:11] * qptain_Nemo (~qN@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:14] * jzu__ is now known as jzu
[9:21] * jzu (~jzu@ Quit (Quit: Kick out the jams, motherfuckers!)
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[9:47] * MystX (~MystX@121-73-41-249.cable.telstraclear.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[9:49] <Mowee> Morning
[9:49] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[9:51] <RaTTuS|BIG> \o
[9:51] <tntexplo1ivesltd> big?
[9:52] <tntexplo1ivesltd> evening
[9:52] <RaTTuS|BIG> BiG yes - becase without it the nick is already registered by other peoples - I was not a common user of freenode before last year ,.,.,.
[9:53] <tntexplo1ivesltd> ah I see
[9:53] <tntexplo1ivesltd> makes sense
[9:54] <RaTTuS|BIG> so I stick with the nick i use on coldfront
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[10:10] * warddr (~warddr@2a01:4f8:140:72a1::151) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:12] * Tolian_ (~kvirc@ Quit (Quit: Bye!)
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[10:30] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:32] * RITRedbeard (~RITReadbe@c-68-37-165-37.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[10:34] * zma1 (~zmac@lan31-h01-31-32-96-210.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:43] * maciejjo (maciejjo@nolajf.pl) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[11:17] * haltdef (~ponies@81-179-237-230.static.dsl.pipex.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[11:20] * stereohead-away (~stereohea@fiber-087-195-245-144.solcon.nl) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
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[12:04] * zakmes (~zakmes@095-096-108-128.static.chello.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:05] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[12:08] * |uen| is now known as uen
[12:09] * nemrod (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
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[12:23] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[12:46] * Da|Mummy (~Veki@cpe-76-190-200-98.neo.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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[12:57] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@ec2-107-22-199-66.compute-1.amazonaws.com) Quit (Changing host)
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[13:20] * Space_Man_ (~space_man@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[13:43] * DexterLB (~angel@95-42-18-195.btc-net.bg) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[14:10] * atts (~asheehan@static-99-136-171-68.axsne.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[14:13] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-148-189-239.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[14:15] * datagutt2 (~datagutt@ Quit (Changing host)
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[14:17] <SpeedEvil> Is there any data on the camera interface?
[14:17] <SpeedEvil> It's not in the 'datasheet'
[14:17] <RaTTuS|BIG> no not yet
[14:18] * SpeedEvil is wondering about using it for generic data in from a suitable source.
[14:19] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca5626.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:22] <friggle> it's GPU side so not public
[14:22] * RaTTuS|BIG was wondering if you could hook the hdmi of one to the cameral of another
[14:23] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:38] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:43] * EiNSTeiN_ (~einstein@unaffiliated/einstein/x-615171) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[14:43] <SpeedEvil> I suspect that's unlikely.
[14:43] <SpeedEvil> I'm unsure of the display interface to the camera interface
[14:46] * EiN_ (~einstein@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:47] * EiNSTeiN_ (~einstein@unaffiliated/einstein/x-615171) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:51] * EiN_ (~einstein@ Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[14:55] * unplode (ada79aac@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[15:06] <Caver> Gert was talking in the forums about using the CSI for something, but did say that it's connected to the GPU only
[15:06] <Caver> I guess there is the HDMI CEC stuff - no idea how fast it is though
[15:07] <Caver> (data line that comes back from the TV with the IR commands)
[15:08] * jmontleon (jmontleon@nat/redhat/x-cytcrczhhkzzzchs) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:09] * RabbidRabbit (~RabbidRab@188-221-246-28.zone12.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:10] <victhor_> HDMI CEC is for sending simple commands across devices... such as button presses on remotes and power on/off commands. You can imagine the sort of bandwidth required for this - almost none.
[15:13] <Caver> quite .... I've no idea the data rates people are wanting
[15:13] <hamitron> always "more"
[15:13] <hamitron> ;)
[15:14] * diplo (~diplo@5ad6e9e7.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:14] * Martix (~martix@4.177.broadband3.iol.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:14] <Caver> http://wiki.novoflight.com/index.php?title=HDMI-CEC_Overview - says 416 bits per second ...
[15:14] <Caver> ahah ... true
[15:14] <Caver> as far as I know the high speed HDMI is one way only
[15:15] <mjr> yes
[15:15] <unplode> When the board was initially proposed wasn't it going to run off of HDMI power?
[15:16] <Caver> I doubt it, the device making the HDMI signal, has to provide the power, so it would never have worked!
[15:17] <unplode> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/power-using-hdmi you are correct sir
[15:20] <Caver> it would have been a great idea for all the media player types though
[15:21] * RabbidRabbit (~RabbidRab@188-221-246-28.zone12.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[15:23] <unplode> I just remember back when the board was not much more than a hdmi port on one side and a usb port on the other, shaped like a flash drive that this was proposed, looks like the design has come a long way since then
[15:23] <Caver> yeah ....
[15:23] <Caver> was that the one with the camera on top?
[15:25] <unplode> here we go: http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2011/05/06/pcb_610x458.jpg
[15:25] * jj- (~E0551814@82-128-216-172.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:25] <Caver> thats the one!
[15:25] <unplode> Shame they're not putting out that model as well
[15:25] <Caver> I don't know ... was that the one with the 8bit cpu?
[15:26] <unplode> not sure, either way, more options are usually better than fewer, although if it is 8bit than the arduino would be a better option
[15:27] <ukscone> keeeyboardisfinallydeeeadnospaceekeeeyandeeekeeyisflakeeey
[15:27] <SpeedEvil> ukscone: Vacuum cleaner.
[15:27] <Caver> oh yeah I agree .. much more of a homage to the Acorn BBC B ... loads of ports you can do all kinds of things with :)
[15:28] <Caver> ukscone, undo screws ... remove electronics ... dishwasher :)
[15:28] <Caver> only hope your good at touch typing, as the letters might not survive
[15:29] <ukscone> laptopkeeeyboardmouseeeborkeeedtoo
[15:29] <SpeedEvil> Turn keyboard upside down, bang repeatedly.
[15:29] <ukscone> laptoponlastleeegsanyway
[15:29] <SpeedEvil> Apply hoover nozzle and rubit over the keyboard.
[15:30] <ukscone> beeeeeendoingthatforweeeeeeeksitsahpsoitisn'tworthfixing
[15:30] <Caver> ah ... you need to spill more coffee on it ... it's not had it's caffine fix, us old 'un's need 1st thing
[15:31] <ukscone> justmeeeansthatican'tworksohaveeetospeeendtheeedayreeeelaxing
[15:31] <jzu> for a separate keyboard, a shower works well IF you use a fan after that
[15:31] <jzu> done it a few times
[15:31] <Caver> ahahah
[15:31] <Caver> brave
[15:31] <jzu> I haven't tried it with a laptop, however
[15:32] <jzu> (and I won't)
[15:32] <Caver> sniggers
[15:32] <Caver> ukscone does this mean a day off? ... so *tragic*
[15:32] <ukscone> wifeeehaspromiseeedmeeeaneeewoneeewheesheegeeetsheeeruniformcheque
[15:33] <Caver> bless you
[15:33] <Caver> *hands you a hankie*
[15:33] <ukscone> icoulduseeetheeneeetbookbuttheeeni'dhaveeenoeeexcuseeetospeeendthedaylisteeeningtomusic
[15:34] <Caver> it's 2:33pm
[15:35] <Caver> shift bust too?
[15:35] <ukscone> flakeeey
[15:35] <ukscone> altkeeeyandnumpadworkbuttoomuchlikeeehardwork
[15:36] <Caver> got a external usb one kicking around?
[15:36] <SpeedEvil> Keyboards are genreally inexpedive on ebay
[15:36] <ukscone> nopeeedon'tbeeelieeeveeeinusb
[15:36] * Delboy_ (~Kombajn@250-236.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[15:37] * nxo (~nxo@gateway/tor-sasl/nxo) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:38] <jzu> ukscone: one day, you will see the light
[15:38] * nxo (~nxo@gateway/tor-sasl/nxo) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:38] <ukscone> usbiseeevil
[15:38] <Caver> ahahaha
[15:38] <Caver> ok ... who are you .. what have you done with the real ukscone
[15:39] <ukscone> burieeedintheeebackyard
[15:40] * Caver phones IT ... hello ... yes ... my scone is broken ... can you send me a new one? ... yes .. the uk type ... thankyou
[15:41] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:41] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:42] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6)
[15:44] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:49] <SpeedEvil> I'm using an external ps/2 keyboard
[15:50] <Caver> lol ... me too
[15:50] <hamitron> with what?
[15:50] <Caver> only last year I stopped using my original Cherry AT one *sobs*
[15:50] * hamitron uses PS2 because his KVM switch is PS2
[15:50] <hamitron> and VGA /o\
[15:51] <hamitron> that reminds me
[15:51] <hamitron> need a PS2 to AT adapter
[15:51] <Caver> *opens draw*
[15:51] <Caver> how many do you want?
[15:51] <hamitron> 1
[15:51] <hamitron> :)
[15:51] <hamitron> I think they are cheap off ebay
[15:52] <hamitron> and because of that, I decided to not keep a broken AT keyboard
[15:52] <hamitron> (was trying to save space)
[15:52] <ukscone> stole the kids keyboard while he is sleeping. still funky but better
[15:53] <Caver> yay
[15:53] <hamitron> :)
[15:53] <jzu> sleeping ?
[15:53] <SpeedEvil> I'm using it as it's an IBM 'spacesaver' - with a trackpoint.
[15:54] <SpeedEvil> It only has PS/2
[15:54] <ukscone> yup not woken him up yet
[15:54] <ukscone> was waiting until i had his keyboard
[15:54] <SpeedEvil> I bought a couple recently imported from Canada, to replace my dying one.
[15:54] <SpeedEvil> I find it very useful as much of the time I'm computing under a blanket.
[15:54] <Caver> damn this channel and it's PG13 rating ... so many feedlines
[15:54] <SpeedEvil> This means that the trackpoint is awesome.
[15:55] <ukscone> he has late classes today 12:15pm to 8pm
[15:55] <Caver> as long as it's wipe clean
[15:55] <SpeedEvil> You can't use a mouse under the blankets.
[15:55] <ukscone> so he won't be home until 10pm
[15:56] <hamitron> you can use a mouse under a blanket, if you have a sturdy mouse mat :)
[15:56] <SpeedEvil> It doesn't work well
[15:57] <SpeedEvil> It gets tangled with the sheets.
[15:57] <hamitron> hmmm, never found it tbh
[15:57] <hamitron> I did need an extension though
[15:58] <hamitron> short cable means you can't stop drafts
[15:58] <hamitron> :/
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> Electric blanket ++
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> I've had no heating this winter.
[15:58] <hamitron> :D
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> Hence I've been spending a lot of time on the sofa.
[15:58] <hamitron> this is the first winter I have bitcoin heating
[15:58] <hamitron> \o/
[15:58] * unplode (ada79aac@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[15:59] <hamitron> seti@home on cpu was not as good as this
[15:59] <victhor_> y u no waste power with the biology projects on boinc instead? :/
[15:59] <victhor_> or f@h
[16:00] <SpeedEvil> You can recover the power money on bitcoin
[16:00] <SpeedEvil> 'free' heating.
[16:00] <hamitron> because me and my friends had a mini league going on s@h
[16:00] <hamitron> ;)
[16:00] <Caver> SpeedEvil, is your heating broken - or just skint?
[16:00] <hamitron> yeh, I get paid to be warm.... can't complain
[16:00] <SpeedEvil> Caver: Both.
[16:00] <SpeedEvil> Caver: But I could in principle fix it.
[16:01] <SpeedEvil> Caver: It's just that if I did, I'd have no money to spend on insulation upgrades.
[16:01] <SpeedEvil> To heat properly would cost ~1400 quid.
[16:02] <Caver> ouch
[16:03] <SpeedEvil> And I'm on ~5000/year at the moment.
[16:03] <hamitron> can't you get grants for insulation?
[16:03] <Caver> JS?
[16:04] <Caver> nods ... well make sure your on the cheapist tarrif too
[16:04] <hamitron> or just start bitcoin mining ;)
[16:05] <hamitron> this room had gets ice most winters, hasn't dropped below 14 C with 2 x 5870 working 24/7
[16:05] <hamitron> s/had/that/
[16:07] <Caver> can you pay power bills with bitcoin yet?
[16:07] <SpeedEvil> hamitron: Well...
[16:07] <SpeedEvil> hamitron: I can get grants for loft insulation. But I have that. I can get grants for cavity wall - but I have no cavity.
[16:08] <Caver> nods ... blankets on the walls can help, but ... not a long term one
[16:08] <SpeedEvil> hamitron: It's basically reduced to either insulate the outsides of the walls, and render that - or rip out all of the internals, insulate under the floor and the walls.
[16:08] <SpeedEvil> Which is a _major_ job.
[16:09] <hamitron> Caver, bitcoin currently generates about double the cost of the electricity
[16:09] <hamitron> so why is it so cold?
[16:09] <Caver> in the uk?!
[16:09] <hamitron> Caver, yes in the UK
[16:09] <victhor_> what can you buy with bitcoin?
[16:10] <hamitron> I buy real cash
[16:10] <hamitron> :/
[16:10] <victhor_> lol. buying money.
[16:10] <urs> Some more-or-less useful gizmos on the internet here and there.
[16:10] <victhor_> so you actually get paid for mining instead of just bitcoins? cool
[16:10] <urs> And of course tons of illegal stuff.
[16:10] <victhor_> lol.
[16:10] <hamitron> yeh well, ?4,000 in under a year
[16:10] <hamitron> so not to be sniffed at
[16:11] <hamitron> profits not as high now ofc
[16:11] <victhor_> well, I can't seem to find anything more legal than shell accounts that accept bitcoin for payment so...
[16:11] <hamitron> you can buy time codes for WoW, eve online and stuff
[16:11] <hamitron> vpn
[16:11] <hamitron> there is also a casino site
[16:11] <urs> http://www.pocketartillery.com/ is one of the more useful things you can buy with btc
[16:12] <victhor_> not much useful to me then :/
[16:12] <hamitron> victhor_, me neither
[16:12] <hamitron> but I'll take the real cash ty ;)
[16:12] <Dagger3> VPSs are available, and there's sites that will sell you gift certificates for e.g. Amazon
[16:12] <Dagger3> but it doesn't really matter what you use them on; it's all money in the end
[16:13] <hamitron> yeh
[16:13] <hamitron> I think I may buy a new motorbike
[16:13] <hamitron> well, another
[16:13] <hamitron> I want a proper British classic
[16:14] <hamitron> :)
[16:17] <Caver> all very nice, but not a actual way to pay the heating bill
[16:17] <Caver> hehehe .. new != british classic surely
[16:18] * mkopack (~mkopack@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:21] <SpeedEvil> ssh root@dev beep
[16:21] <SpeedEvil> argh
[16:22] <mkopack> So, everyone else see that Fedora Remix 14 event @ Seneca college on the 22nd??? Anyone else wondering if we should be reading into that date at all? :)
[16:23] * badoing (~chatzilla@ip-109-91-216-72.unitymediagroup.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:26] <badoing> hello, is there a 7" touchscreen which will defenetly work with the raspberry pi?
[16:26] <ReggieUK> no
[16:27] <badoing> ok, thanks
[16:27] <victhor_> I saw some HDMI input ones which had USB touchscreens, but they were too expensive
[16:27] <victhor_> actually DVI input, but still...
[16:27] * FFes (~Frank@office.admea.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:27] <Caver> I think plenty are around, but cheap ... no
[16:27] <badoing> i found some touchscreens too, but i don't know if they will work
[16:28] <Caver> see the faq entry!
[16:28] <Caver> got a link?
[16:28] <badoing> yes, i read the faq entry
[16:29] <Caver> good ... always worth asking
[16:29] <Caver> will it blend?
[16:29] <ReggieUK> unless it's confirmed as working then really, there's no definites
[16:29] <Caver> if you've read the FAQ you will know the answer to that
[16:29] <ReggieUK> some stuff probably should work
[16:30] <ReggieUK> and there's nothing to stop people cobbling stuff together to get a working solution
[16:30] <ReggieUK> spi ts controller and a 7" eee touchscreen + any 7" composite or hdmi screen would do the trick
[16:31] <ReggieUK> or usb touchscreen + any hdmi/composite screen too
[16:31] <badoing> ok, thanks for information. i will have a look at this later again
[16:32] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:32] * badoing (~chatzilla@ip-109-91-216-72.unitymediagroup.de) Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Iceweasel 3.5.16/20120131235502])
[16:40] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[16:41] <zgreg> unfortunately most cheap touchscreens are resistive
[16:41] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:42] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@74-115-197-42.eng.wind.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:42] <Caver> I think if someone can work out a cheap converter box for one of the popular phone types, they might be on to a winner
[16:43] <Caver> like a iPad screen
[16:43] <Caver> as they are made in enough bulk to be likely to become cheap
[16:44] * zma2 (~zmac@lan31-h01-31-32-96-210.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:45] <Caver> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Apple-iPad-2-2nd-Generation-Gen-Replacement-LCD-display-Screen-same-day-dispatch-/180811828344?pt=UK_Replacement_Parts_Tools&hash=item2a19398c78#ht_2743wt_913
[16:46] <zgreg> these are DSI screens, I think
[16:46] <Caver> I don't know if that includes the digitiser too
[16:46] <zgreg> so they should be able to work, with proper firmware support
[16:46] <zgreg> no idea about the touchscreen digitizer
[16:46] <zgreg> usually these use i2c
[16:47] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:48] <Caver> hmmm so again possible, but both require soldering
[16:48] * vipkilla (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:48] <Caver> the iPi :)
[16:49] <Tachyon`> there's a nokia phone oled display that will apparently work with the pi
[16:49] <Tachyon`> 640x360 truecolour etc.
[16:49] <mkopack> Honestly, for what you'll spend to try to make a tablet out of an rPi, you could go buy one of the cheaper ones, and it'd probably work about as well...
[16:49] <Tachyon`> just needs an adapter for the internal connection
[16:50] <Tachyon`> and they're avilable for not much money, give a proper console at least, lol
[16:50] <Caver> lol I'm just kicking ideas around
[16:50] <Caver> what your average android/ipad does not give of course is gpio pins to play with
[16:51] <mkopack> true...
[16:51] * zma2 (~zmac@lan31-h01-31-32-96-210.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) has left #raspberrypi
[16:52] <Caver> as a internet surfing tablet - of course it's a bad idea
[16:52] * vipkilla (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has left #raspberrypi
[16:52] <Caver> as a cheap terminal with easy hardware hacking abilities ... that had potential
[16:55] * victhor_ (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:56] * kism3t (~kism3t@client-86-25-195-15.bsh-bng-013.adsl.virginmedia.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[17:02] * smw (~smw@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:03] * smw (~smw@ Quit (Changing host)
[17:03] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:04] <mkopack> I'm just hoping that that Seneca College demo being on the 22nd is indicative of release date
[17:04] <Caver> why would it be? wishful thinking aside
[17:05] <ShiftPlusOne> Hello... anything new arouNd here?
[17:05] <ShiftPlusOne> ...around... with a capital N... it seems.
[17:05] <mkopack> just seems like it would be strange to have a release event for the OS for a device that isn't available yet :)
[17:05] <Caver> ukscone, seems to be keeping crumbs in his keyboard
[17:06] <Caver> a demo isn't a release event though
[17:06] <ShiftPlusOne> what's the OS/device?
[17:06] <mkopack> They DID say they're expecting the production units to be done by the 20th??? so if they get them on the 20th, 2 days to test them out and make sure they're ok, and then this Remix 14 Release event??? that would be about right
[17:07] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[17:07] <mkopack> Just gotta hope the chinese got the dang things right!
[17:08] <Caver> 20th = finished in chinsa
[17:08] <Caver> so .. couple days to get them, back to UK / distribution
[17:08] <mkopack> (and hope to god not stuck at customs)
[17:08] <Caver> ah
[17:08] <Caver> questions in parliment if that happened!
[17:09] <Caver> as the government keep mentioning it in their reports ...
[17:09] <mkopack> And, depending on how they're getting delivered, given the time zone difference - shipped from China on the 20th, if going air freight, COULD mean, in the UK on the 20th as well
[17:09] <Caver> nods ... I've no experence on that one
[17:10] <Caver> fingers crossed, but I'm not counting chickens yet
[17:10] <mkopack> It's often NOT the case for the US because it's shorter for them to go across the pacific, crossing the date line??? but for China->UK, probably over the pole, so not crossing the date line = same day delivery.
[17:11] <mkopack> and yeah, same here??? Hopeful, but not going to be the end of the world if it doesn't happen.
[17:11] <mkopack> Just thought that the 22nd Fedora release event seemed to be timed pretty close to the 20th, which would make for a nice surprise
[17:12] <Caver> :)
[17:13] <Caver> if they don't all sell out with in the hour, it going to be almost embarrassing!
[17:13] <mkopack> hehe...
[17:14] <mkopack> I just hope it's not a "Ok, they're going on sale at 9am GMT??? which is like 4AM US eastern??? REALLY don't want to be trying to type in my CC number half asleep
[17:14] <haltdef> setup paypal account now?
[17:14] <mkopack> nah, F Paypal
[17:14] <haltdef> pretty sure eben said it'd all be through paypal
[17:15] <traeak> ugh
[17:15] <traeak> paypal
[17:15] <mkopack> ???
[17:15] <mkopack> I thought they said they'd take CC or paypal???
[17:15] <haltdef> credit card payments through paypal
[17:15] <Caver> well they have to go on sale at *some* point, so it's not going to be convienient for exactly 50% of the planet ..
[17:15] <traeak> handling cardds yourself is a pita
[17:15] <mkopack> Dammit, I use the stupid paypal account so rarely I always end up having to have the password reset because I can't remember it
[17:15] <traeak> who's a paypal alternative?
[17:15] <traeak> mkopack: exactly....
[17:15] <Caver> you might want to get on to that right now!
[17:16] <traeak> mkopack: and paypal is pretty draconian about picking passwords, force me to pick one i can never remember
[17:16] <traeak> yeah, i'll change the password and write it down so i don't forget
[17:16] <Caver> shall we start a sweep stake on excuses for *not* getting one from the 1st bathc
[17:16] <Caver> batch
[17:16] <Caver> I'll start with "my cat caught fire, and I was too distracted" ....
[17:16] <Caver> 15/1
[17:16] <traeak> i got hurt on the hp touchpad dealy becaues my ebay account wasn't up to date
[17:17] <traeak> fleabay
[17:17] <haltdef> I wonder how many will be held back in case of faults
[17:17] <traeak> 10,000
[17:17] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[17:17] <haltdef> or if you'll just have to wait for the second batch
[17:19] <Caver> wait for 2nd batch would seem reasoniably
[17:21] <Caver> I wonder how much the GPU code will be updated after inital production
[17:21] <traeak> heh
[17:22] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@13-165-19.client.wireless.msu.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:23] <Caver> hi johnthebear
[17:23] <johnthebear> hey Caver
[17:23] <johnthebear> 5 days! :)
[17:23] <traeak> 5 days til the end of the world?
[17:24] <Caver> no the dawn of a new one :)
[17:24] * Caver hands out sick bags
[17:24] <traeak> nope, not until march :-p
[17:24] <slaeshjag> traeak: The and of Rpi's servers
[17:24] <johnthebear> well, yes for whoever is hosting the rasp pi site ;)
[17:24] <slaeshjag> end*
[17:24] <traeak> well yeah that
[17:24] <traeak> hopefully orders are handled on another server
[17:24] <traeak> although
[17:24] <Caver> they are!
[17:25] <traeak> the last hp touchpad sale did even take down ebay
[17:25] <traeak> i wonder if this is going ot be similar
[17:25] <mkopack> Caver: Re: GPU: I'm hoping they'll keep developing and enhancing interfaces to that GPU. That seems to be the biggest gripe people are having about the thing??? I totally get Broadcom being somewhat secretive about their IP, but at the same time, SO much of the power of the Pi is locked away inside that thing, it's a shame if we can't get access to it
[17:25] <traeak> ebay didn't go down, it just became almost totally unresponsive
[17:25] <mkopack> And yeah, sounds like I'll need to re-activate my Paypal account and set up my current CC
[17:25] <johnthebear> I expect this will be something like SparkFun's freeday
[17:25] <traeak> you shoudlnt need to worry about setting up a CC
[17:26] * qNemo (~qN@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:26] <mkopack> joh: I got in on that??? $100 of kit :) (which I then spent another $150 on top of that...)
[17:26] <johnthebear> I expect that there isn't enough supply to fulfill the expected demand, or is there?
[17:26] <mkopack> Oh, not even close
[17:27] <Caver> 10,000 units in the 1st batch
[17:27] <Caver> so ... we suspect not!
[17:27] <mkopack> which is basically nothing
[17:27] <johnthebear> mkopack: I've tried to snag my slice of freeday three years running with no luck every year
[17:27] <mkopack> HOPEFULLY, they've made arrangements with the chinese manufacturer to be able to do quick turnarounds on subsequent batches
[17:28] <mkopack> john: hehe, I got it in like the first hour
[17:28] * DexterLB (~angel@ Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[17:28] <johnthebear> maybe karma will finally be on my side and I'll get some pie :)
[17:28] <mkopack> Some of those captchas were a B*TCH though
[17:28] <traeak> captchas what a pita
[17:28] <johnthebear> yeah, but you only had to do it for an hour
[17:29] <mkopack> yeah???.
[17:29] <mkopack> Their server was slammed.
[17:29] <traeak> pretty soon only computers will be able to interpret captchas
[17:29] <johnthebear> for the first freeday it was "first come, first served"
[17:29] * DexterLB (~angel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[17:29] <johnthebear> I think their server actually melted
[17:30] <mkopack> lol
[17:30] <Caver> whats "freeday"?
[17:30] <johnthebear> SparkFun gives away $100,000 worth of stuff
[17:31] <johnthebear> to whoever can snag a peice
[17:31] * gabriel9 (~quassel@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:31] <johnthebear> they are an online electronics shop
[17:31] <mkopack> This year they hooked up the server to a geiger counter, to randomly pick winners..
[17:31] <Caver> LOL
[17:31] <Caver> thats cool
[17:31] <johnthebear> www.sparkfun.com
[17:32] <johnthebear> yeah, you had to enter captchas, and if you entered it at just the same moment as a ping on the counter, you won $100
[17:32] <mkopack> So you'd go to a web page, it would show a Captcha and you fill it in. If your submission lines up with the geiger counter getting a ping, you got a code for $100 gift to their site.. I picked up an Arduino Mega, and a Xbee shield/kit.
[17:34] <Caver> sounds like a urban myth! is it for real?
[17:34] <RaTTuS|BIG> sparfun - yeah
[17:35] <Caver> sweet
[17:35] <johnthebear> they do it as a publicity stunt/charity event/server test
[17:35] <mkopack> yeah, they do it every year
[17:35] <johnthebear> I order most of my kit from them, they are good peoples
[17:36] <mkopack> publicity, and they use it to hope that people (like me) who win some free gift card $$ in it will spend more than that code is worth
[17:36] <mkopack> I spent $250, so with the $100 code, I spent an additional $150 on them
[17:36] <mkopack> I get a lot of robotics stuff from Sparkfun and pololu.com
[17:36] <mkopack> I just wish Pololu's shipping wasn't so damn expensive
[17:37] <mkopack> I took advantage of Pololu's black friday sale as well and got a bunch of parts for like 50% off
[17:40] <mkopack> Goal #1 for when I get a Pi - get getting ROS compiled and working
[17:40] <Caver> :)
[17:41] <Caver> well you can start on the cross compiling now ...
[17:41] <mkopack> Cool! Video stream of the Robonaut being powered up and tested up on the ISS
[17:41] <mkopack> http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-iss-stream
[17:41] <mkopack> Eh, I'm such a Linux dummy, I wouldn't have a clue how to set up to do cross compiling like that
[17:43] * kism3t (~kism3t@client-86-25-195-15.bsh-bng-013.adsl.virginmedia.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:45] <mkopack> It's just SO weird seeing people standing sideways in the video??? Gotta love microgravity!
[17:45] <ShiftPlusOne> mkopack, thanks for sharing, that's pretty awesome.
[17:46] <mkopack> I'm impressed at how fluid it's movements are
[17:50] * FFes (~Frank@office.admea.nl) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[17:52] * Cracknel (~cracknel@ Quit (Changing host)
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[17:52] * diplo (~diplo@5ad6e9e7.bb.sky.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:53] <ShiftPlusOne> So what's it for exactly?
[17:54] <ShiftPlusOne> I am guessing it's not a sexbot
[17:54] <mkopack> Robonaut?
[17:54] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah
[17:54] <Caver> mkopack, there's pages all about cross compiling if your interested
[17:54] <ShiftPlusOne> just general purpose or a specific task?
[17:55] <mkopack> It's so they can put it outside and control it from the ground to do a lot of the outside maintenance type tasks via an astronaut on the ground, freeing up the guys on the station to focus on the science
[17:55] <Caver> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robonaut
[17:55] * piofcube (~piofcube@piofcube.1billionhex.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:55] <mkopack> Probably also do some of the maintenance stuff inside as well
[17:55] <ShiftPlusOne> as for cross-compiling, it couldn't be easier with sb2... well it could.. if they bothered to document the damn thing, but ukscone has the important bits covered on his blog.
[17:55] * shadowe989 (~shadowe98@74-32-105-114.dr01.rmny.wv.frontiernet.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:55] * shadowe989 (~shadowe98@74-32-105-114.dr01.rmny.wv.frontiernet.net) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[17:55] <mkopack> right now between meals, the required exercise, and sleep, it only leaves like 5 hours a day per astronaut for actual Science, and there's only 6 of them up there
[17:56] <mkopack> so the more they can offload the routine maintenance type tasks to robonaut,the more they'll be able to do productively up there
[17:58] <ShiftPlusOne> creepy http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Robonaut_with_zero-g_leg.jpg
[17:58] <ShiftPlusOne> that's uncanny valley right there
[17:58] <mkopack> lol, seriously
[17:58] <traeak> probably will make sense for someone to set up cross compilation packages
[17:58] <ShiftPlusOne> (not really, but still creepy)
[17:58] <traeak> the psp has a decent set for one
[17:58] <traeak> ofr course the psp has a much more limited set of libraries
[17:59] * jmontleon (jmontleon@nat/redhat/x-cytcrczhhkzzzchs) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[18:00] * datagutt2 is now known as datagutt
[18:00] <ShiftPlusOne> heh 'first human-humanoid handshake in space' *robot reaches for the crotch* O_o reminds me of the big bang theory and the robotic hand there =/
[18:00] <mkopack> LOL, yeah! HAHA
[18:00] <mkopack> I'm thinking it shut back down with the shake :)
[18:00] <mkopack> Which is why the hand is still extended like that
[18:02] <ShiftPlusOne> they are controlled from the ground, right?
[18:02] <ShiftPlusOne> stupid question I guess
[18:02] <ShiftPlusOne> wouldn't make much sense otherwise
[18:02] <mkopack> yeah
[18:02] <mkopack> It's basically a super advanced Telepresence robot
[18:04] <mkopack> I'm sure it has SOME autonomous capabilities, but it'll largely be remote operated
[18:04] <ShiftPlusOne> =/
[18:04] <ShiftPlusOne> bad shot
[18:04] * NIN101 (~NIN@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:05] <mkopack> hehe, yeah, "Yuri! Move your ass out of the camera lens!!!"
[18:06] <ShiftPlusOne> did they say that?
[18:06] <mkopack> HahA. no.
[18:06] <ShiftPlusOne> ah =(
[18:07] <mkopack> Man I hate how all of those various video streaming plugins make my Macbook's processor go to nearly 100% and the fan spin up??? geesh
[18:08] <ShiftPlusOne> you mean flash?
[18:08] <mkopack> Flash it the big one,??? but there are other video plugins used as well
[18:08] <mkopack> they ALL make the CPU peg.
[18:08] <mkopack> f'ing silverlight is just as bad
[18:09] <mkopack> I wish they'd all go away
[18:09] <ShiftPlusOne> silverlight is actually used? O_O
[18:09] <mkopack> No need for them anymore
[18:09] <mkopack> Yes, my stupid Graphics class (online) uses Silverlight to stream the lectures??? it SUCKS
[18:10] <ShiftPlusOne> =/
[18:15] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[18:16] <zgreg> HTML5 video performance also sucks, in general
[18:16] <zgreg> well, at least in chrome and firefox
[18:17] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, I am not very happy with html5, in youtube for example. I opt into the 'trial' once in a while to see if it's any better, but it never is.
[18:18] <zgreg> exactly the same experience here
[18:18] <ShiftPlusOne> linux or windows?
[18:19] <zgreg> linux, but that shouldn't matter
[18:19] <ShiftPlusOne> shouldn't, but might
[18:20] <ShiftPlusOne> (windows here though, so it doesn't, it seems).
[18:20] <zgreg> youtube's HTML5 player is quite unreliable and still doesn't support all features of the flash player
[18:20] <ShiftPlusOne> being able to speed up and slow down videos is pretty good though
[18:20] <zgreg> hm, I never had a use for that
[18:21] <ShiftPlusOne> neither.... but it's "nice to have the option"
[18:21] <zgreg> but the worst thing is that performance (as in, cpu% needed) isn't any better than flash, really
[18:22] <ShiftPlusOne> no cpu issues here though
[18:22] * ciptchy (d9270b8e@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[18:22] <Caver> ah well .. it's not going to happen on the Pi at least for now, as no flash ...
[18:22] <zgreg> no issues either, it's just way inefficient
[18:22] <zgreg> Caver: right
[18:23] <zgreg> but I bet people will believe hardware accelerated video playback will magically work, somehow
[18:23] <mkopack> right, but the Pi will do H.264 and that's what the non-Flash HTML5 players use
[18:23] <mkopack> That or the Google codec, but I don't think that one is supported on the Pi
[18:23] <mkopack> (yet)
[18:24] <zgreg> VP8 isn't supported, as far as I know
[18:24] <zgreg> and probably can't be accelerated, either
[18:25] <zgreg> H.264 acceleration is done with dedicated hardware blocks, and these don't exist for VP8
[18:25] <mkopack> greg, well, it probably could be, but would need to be supported in the GPU blob
[18:25] <zgreg> mkopack: well yes, in a sense, there's an implementation of a VP8 decoder for the DSP part of the GPU
[18:26] <zgreg> but that's rather slow and can only decode SD resolution video in realtime
[18:26] <mkopack> I'm kinda bummed that we won't be able to buy licenses for additional codecs on the Pi
[18:26] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Read error: No route to host)
[18:27] <ShiftPlusOne> well, they didn't rule it out
[18:27] <mkopack> I can't believe they still charge a license for MPeg2 - that's only been around for what, 18 years now???
[18:27] <ShiftPlusOne> in fact is seems like something they have considered and are interested in, but something that's not practical quite yet
[18:27] <Caver> how long is a patent valid for?
[18:28] <ShiftPlusOne> How come you can't have a different implementation? If you haven't seen the source code, how can they say you're ripping off their algorithms or anything like that?
[18:28] <mkopack> Shift: Yeah it's the issue of having to buy them in huge bulk licenses, and that's outside the financial ballpark for them right now
[18:28] <zgreg> a patent lasts 20 years, usually
[18:28] <RaTTuS|BIG> 20years
[18:29] <ShiftPlusOne> It is my understanding that you can't just patent things like that... you can only patent specific implementations. Or did I get that wrong?
[18:29] <Caver> so probably wishful to think there is only 2 more years to go then
[18:29] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:29] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@ Quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/)
[18:29] <Caver> depends which country
[18:29] <Caver> in america you can patent the general process - hence software
[18:29] <zgreg> ShiftPlusOne: that's the theory. but the practice is quite different. the US patent system is not opposed to software/algorithm patents
[18:30] <Caver> in the uk we'd laugh at you
[18:30] <zgreg> possibly mpeg2 support is still part of the GPU blob, only disabled
[18:30] <ShiftPlusOne> and then america would laugh back and have you extradited?
[18:31] <zgreg> maybe it'll be possible to hack it to enable mpeg2 support. or something.
[18:31] <RaTTuS|BIG> renditioned
[18:31] <Caver> well ... not compiled in to the binary blob at all - have a read on the config.txt thread!
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[18:31] <zgreg> oh, ok
[18:33] <ShiftPlusOne> wait, how the hell did Apple have Samsung products blocked from sale in Australia? The Australian Patents Act clearly says you can't patent a design =/
[18:34] <mkopack> Shift: Probably some of the other patents - things like using a swipe on the screen to unlock the device, and some others
[18:34] <ShiftPlusOne> ah yeah, that
[18:34] <ShiftPlusOne> the design crap must've been in other countries
[18:34] <ShiftPlusOne> hmm "An Australian standard patent lasts for up to 20 years.
[18:34] <ShiftPlusOne> An innovation patent only lasts for up to 8 years.
[18:34] <ShiftPlusOne> Pharmaceutical patents can last up to 25 years. "
[18:35] <zgreg> the patent system is a mess
[18:35] <mkopack> Frankly, the whole cell market is a frickin legal MESS
[18:35] <ShiftPlusOne> well... technology in general
[18:35] <zgreg> IMO a necessary and realistically possible step is to radically reduce the longevity of patents
[18:35] <zgreg> technology patents shouldn't last any longer than say, 5 years
[18:36] <mkopack> (ok, trying to eat chicken wings, while using the computer just does NOT work!)
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[18:36] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh, I have no problem with the 20 years, I have a problem with what is patentable... you shouldn't be able to patent things like software or even algorithms.
[18:37] * afterstart (ada79aac@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[18:37] <zgreg> sure, but I don't think you can avoid these kinds of patents entirely
[18:37] <ShiftPlusOne> or scrap the whole thing and compete on quality and merit >=/
[18:37] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[18:37] <afterstart> Is anyone thinking about the raspberrypi as a replacement for the $150 freedombox?
[18:37] <zgreg> most software patents come in a sort of "disguised" form
[18:38] <ShiftPlusOne> freedombox? is the name meant to be ironic?
[18:38] * NIN101 (~NIN@ Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[18:38] <afterstart> http://freedomboxfoundation.org/ nope
[18:40] <zgreg> ShiftPlusOne: wishful thinking, sadly
[18:40] <ShiftPlusOne> $150? It says it's a software stack
[18:40] <mkopack> Huh, never heard of it??? doesn't look like it's much more than a Linux computer set up to do everything over SSL or some other encryption
[18:41] <afterstart> It is multiple aspects of free communication, including a software stack (debian based) and a plug computer akin to sheevaplug etc
[18:41] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah... it doesn't seem to be anything 'new'... just existing software
[18:41] <zgreg> ShiftPlusOne: the point is, I think reducing longevity is something that realistically would *work* with the current system
[18:42] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c5233.dynamic.uiowa.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:42] <afterstart> warning pdf: http://freedomboxfoundation.org/doc/flyer.pdf
[18:42] <zgreg> abandoning all tech/software patents is not something that has any chance of becoming effective and real
[18:44] <ShiftPlusOne> zgreg, perhaps, but I can sympathise with the companies to some degree. You invest millions into R&D, it takes 5 years to pay off and you create a new great shiny thing. Then to think that in 5 years, anyone will be able to make the same great shiny thing.... it may be hard to pay off the money you invested in R&D and people may just "wait till the price drops in a few years" anyway when the 'generic' versions come out.
[18:45] <ShiftPlusOne> 20 years seems reasonable and makes R&D more worthwhile I think... just need to make sure the system isn't abused by limiting what can be patented.
[18:46] <ShiftPlusOne> afterstart, yeah the pi can replace that quite easily, I'd say.
[18:47] <mkopack> In general, the Pi SHOULD be able to do anything those plug computers do. The only big difference might be in terms of Memory??? the PI only has 256MB (Model B) and most of those plug have at least 512MB.
[18:47] <afterstart> wonderful, I think bringing the cost down from $150 to $50( pi + accessories) will greatly expand the possibilities
[18:49] <afterstart> I would imagine that since the distro they use is debian that it is possible to utilize a swap file/drive, I would think that would make most things that the origional would do useable on the raspberrypi
[18:49] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[18:49] <ShiftPlusOne> afterstart, forget swap
[18:49] * Guest41464 (yang@jazz.linuxshell.org) Quit (Changing host)
[18:49] * Guest41464 (yang@freenode/sponsor/cacert.assurer.yang) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:49] <afterstart> why's that?
[18:49] <mkopack> swap on Pi is going to be rather slow given the slow IO interface
[18:50] * Guest41464 is now known as yang
[18:50] <ShiftPlusOne> many reasons... slow IO and bad for the sdcard
[18:50] <afterstart> hmm, that is limiting then, although if most programs are cli, then 256 should be ok
[18:50] <ShiftPlusOne> afterstart, I don't thinkt he pi will have any trouble running those programs
[18:51] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:51] <afterstart> good, thank you everyone for the input
[18:51] <afterstart> one of my favorite software pantents: http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=7icOAAAAEBAJ&dq=6,606,101
[18:51] <ShiftPlusOne> but may just be making it up... no way to know before trying it. Maybe try booting it with qemu and see how it goes... if qemu can handle it, then the pi will too.
[18:51] <mkopack> Yeah, if you're going to be doing everything CLI, then you can run the version of the GPU blob that gives most of the RAM to the CPU
[18:53] <ShiftPlusOne> afterstart, nuh, given the year that was filed, things like that were actually innovative. A bit crazy reading it now though.
[18:53] <ShiftPlusOne> oh wait... 1999
[18:53] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh maybe not
[18:53] <ShiftPlusOne> I'd think Apple (or maybe even Xerox) would've done it before that O_o
[18:53] <zgreg> ShiftPlusOne: 5 years is a lot with high-tech stuff. plenty of time for research to pay off!
[18:54] * afterstart (ada79aac@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[18:55] <ShiftPlusOne> zgreg, not so sure about that. In rapidly developing technologies, sure.... but not when pushing developed technologies to the limit.
[18:55] <zgreg> ShiftPlusOne: ok, maybe 5 years is too short. but on the other hand, 20 years definitely is too long.
[18:56] <ShiftPlusOne> ok, let's agree on 10 years. I'll let the president know we've sorted it out.
[18:56] <zgreg> or the longevity should be adapted to the market the patent applies to, in a fine-grained way
[18:56] * ReggieUK wonders if he should chip in?
[18:56] <ShiftPlusOne> chip away
[18:56] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c5233.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
[18:57] <ReggieUK> patenting methods for accessing stuff like gestures is retarded, patenting ways you might point at stuff falls into that same category
[18:57] <ReggieUK> so things like that really need looking at in detail
[18:58] <zgreg> I don't think that'l realistically be possible
[19:02] * jmontleon (jmontleon@nat/redhat/x-eumhmpntlkbclcal) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:03] <ShiftPlusOne> ReggieUK, yeah, but think back to when GUIs were first coming out. Before the 'desktop' analogy and all that. Stuff like that would be pretty impressive and did hell of a lot to make computers usable for non-geeks. That patent there was basically tooltips, which I am sure would've been done before, but not an unreasonable patent (if it hasn't been done before 1999... and I am sure it has)... Well it is completly unreasonable for
[19:03] <ShiftPlusOne> 20 years, but in general it's something I think someone (the first person to come up with them) deserves some credit for.
[19:03] <ShiftPlusOne> Well, that's all over the place. Not sure if it even makes sense.
[19:08] * stcuser1 (~Yogesh@host-76-11-181-29.newwavecomm.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[19:12] <ShiftPlusOne> I am not suggesting that there were no GUIs prior to 1999, I am just using that as an example to show that some of the things we take for granted would've been pretty inovative at some time.
[19:13] <ShiftPlusOne> ... I'll get my coat.
[19:14] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:19] <traeak> wow why izzit such a PITA to inspect std::move() stuff with the new c++?
[19:22] * rodrigo_golive (quassel@nat/indt/x-cgjgrpgvttvdrwzq) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[19:26] <zgreg> because it's c++
[19:31] <traeak> no, it's compiler tools
[19:32] <zgreg> yes, but c++ makes things notoriously hard for debuggers
[19:33] <traeak> don't care about real time debugging
[19:33] <traeak> that's a big part of what unit tests are for
[19:33] <traeak> runing stuff in a debugger is a waste of time unless inspecting post mortem state
[19:42] * Behold (~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:42] <mkopack> Eh, yes and no??? There are times when you want to be able to step through the operation to figure out why you're getting unexpected results...
[19:43] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[19:43] * Behold is now known as BeholdMyGlory
[19:43] <ciptchy> is there a chance of getting a board ~2 days after its available on the store?
[19:47] * stcuser (~Yogesh@host-76-11-181-29.newwavecomm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:50] * ciptchy (d9270b8e@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[19:51] <traeak> heh
[19:51] <traeak> there's a chance of being able to put in an order 2 days
[19:51] <traeak> *if* they allow for orders while waiting for manufacture :-p
[19:52] * vipkilla (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:52] <ShiftPlusOne> he's gone
[19:52] <mkopack> At this point, who the heck knows??? We're all just speculating on the demand.
[19:53] <tntexplo1ivesltd> so what's this whole thing about teknoteacher?
[19:53] <mkopack> ?
[19:53] <tntexplo1ivesltd> I read the tweets, what's up?
[19:53] <traeak> oops
[19:53] <mkopack> Um, can you give some context? What are you talking about?
[19:53] <tntexplo1ivesltd> the latest r-pi tweets
[19:54] * vipkilla (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has left #raspberrypi
[19:56] <ShiftPlusOne> well the site in question seem to be down, so no idea
[19:56] <tntexplo1ivesltd> what site was it?
[19:57] * nxo (~nxo@gateway/tor-sasl/nxo) Quit (Quit: Verlassend)
[19:57] <mkopack> I don't know. I HATE Twitter, so hard to foliow WTF they're talking about
[19:57] <ShiftPlusOne> http://www.bbchelloworld.co.uk/
[19:57] <tntexplo1ivesltd> oh right
[20:02] * xlq (~apropos@89-168-180-5.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:03] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[20:05] * UnderSampled|tab (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-028.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:05] <piofcube> LOL as if the BBC would buy their domains from gandi.net and host their apps via cloudcontrol.de... It's a strange world I guess
[20:06] <rm> I can't grok how to use Twitter
[20:06] <rm> it seems so convoluted and illogical
[20:08] <tntexplo1ivesltd> o.O
[20:08] * vgrade (~martinbro@cpc2-nrte22-2-0-cust128.8-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit ()
[20:11] <mkopack> Any idea WTF the issue was with that? I didn't really follow what was going on, other than the Foundation was pissed about something
[20:11] <mkopack> Something related to a website somebody put up
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[20:12] <piofcube> There's a few blogs which are saying that the site is an official BBC project but these blog posts are (by the look of it) just random mumblings of Joe Public... I might be wrong but that's what it looks like to me
[20:13] <Kolin> aparently it was some pre-release site accidently leaked
[20:13] <Kolin> one of the developers may have been doing some work at home and put it on personal hosting
[20:13] <Kolin> wouldent be the first time i did that
[20:14] <Kolin> and if google got a hold of the url (maybe through google analytics code on it) it could cause some shit
[20:14] <mkopack> Ah, well, until the thing is released, they're going to have to deal with people popping up sites and such??? There's just so much hype around this thing..
[20:16] <piofcube> But considering we are talking about the BBC... which is just a big mix of committees and such-like, I don't think that an official BBC site would be done in this manner... Now, if this is a BBC employee doing something themselves... maybe... but the BBC is a domain registrar themselves.
[20:16] <ShiftPlusOne> no, it's nothing like that
[20:17] <ShiftPlusOne> no point speculating
[20:18] <Kolin> what domain was it on?
[20:19] <piofcube> bbchelloworld.co.uk
[20:19] <traeak> anyone know how many alpha/beta boards actually made it out into the wild ?
[20:20] * shadowe989 (~shadowe98@74-32-105-114.dr01.rmny.wv.frontiernet.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:21] <ShiftPlusOne> doubt it
[20:21] * nrdb (~neil@CPE-121-212-138-157.lns10.ken.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[20:25] <mkopack> They had 100 of the beta boards built, but I think only about 20 actually got put out into the wild. 10 went to the auction, I'm sure they kept one, and spread a few others out to groups working on things like Fedora and such.
[20:26] * piofcube watches Steve Gibson make up new words
[20:26] <mkopack> If you remember, they had a bug on the boards that they had to fix by hand that took some work to do. So I doubt they modded all 100
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[21:29] <ShiftPlusOne> waah... bored
[21:29] <ShiftPlusOne> time to give 'Not Tetris 2' a go.
[21:30] <xlq> Infinimario!
[21:34] <ShiftPlusOne> doesn't work
[21:37] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:48] <ShiftPlusOne> woo... a score of 2252 in NT2
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[21:53] * maxamaxim is now known as amaxm
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[21:55] <shortago> fun article on ars that the RP could help with: http://arstechnica.com/business/the-networked-society/2012/02/from-encryption-to-darknets-as-governments-snoop-activists-fight-back.ars
[21:56] <Thorn_> is it out yet
[21:57] <xlq> We really need better distributed routing algorithms.
[21:58] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[21:58] <shortago> so something like A* wouldn't work?
[22:02] * jluisn (~quassel@ Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
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[22:16] <mkopack> A* only works if you have a good map/graph with costs associated
[22:16] <mkopack> the network is constantly changing based on traffic flow though
[22:23] <xlq> The problem is that each node can't know about *all* the others.
[22:24] <xlq> I think a geographic algorithm might work for mesh networks, based on the idea that sending the data in the right geographical direction gets it closer to its goal.
[22:25] <shortago> How does tribler's algorithm work? They seem to have solved this issue.
[22:28] <shortago> or Village Telco / Serval Project for that matter
[22:28] <traeak> hehe
[22:29] <traeak> probability distribution functions
[22:29] <shortago> so assumed weights on nodes based on what probability?
[22:29] <traeak> probably could reduce that to a set of A* evaluations or something
[22:30] <traeak> or something...
[22:30] <shortago> traeak, i just threw A* out there because I knew it was fast and simple, I by no means know what the heck I'm talking about.
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[22:32] <traeak> shortago: a* is well known traversal algorithm that's better than naive traversal, it's fine for evaluation
[22:33] <traeak> tossing in probability makes things a bit more interesting
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[22:33] <traeak> you coudl stil do a* and estimate the probability that the a* you got will be the best one
[22:34] <shortago> couldn't the 'weight' just be determined by the number of nodes that connected noded have connected..... ok: I'm connected to 5 nodes, each one of them is connected to a particular amount of nodes, i.e. weight
[22:34] <traeak> *if* the weight is varying by time
[22:34] <traeak> and *if* that weight can be described by something like a gaussian
[22:34] <traeak> for any given time 't'
[22:34] <shortago> with each node ping the weight would be readjusted, no?
[22:35] <traeak> the weight then becomes a probability distribution (gaussian being easier to model)
[22:35] <shortago> I think you're overcompliating things a bit, couldn't connected nodes just relay back nodes with the best throughput?
[22:36] <shortago> eah, this isn't getting you any closer to the wanted data though, scrap my last couple of ideas
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[22:38] <shortago> NodeA(you) want Data on Node(X), I wonder, first how we determine that node(x) even has the data in the first place with no server
[22:38] <shortago> almost seems impossible to discover something without tracing out the entire node structure
[22:39] * jluisn (~quassel@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:39] <shortago> and if you're going to do that then you have an A* right in front of you anyway
[22:39] <traeak> each node would need to gather statistics on it's connection with another node (edge uncertainty)
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[22:58] <perrec> Has anyone thought about running FreePBX on the RaspberryPi?
[22:59] <perrec> sorry: http://www.freepbx.org/
[23:00] * OneFix_Work (~onefix@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:00] <Dagger3> I'm sure somebody has
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[23:00] <perrec> I've been looking and I can't find an arm version of their custom distro
[23:00] <Davespice> interesting
[23:00] <traeak> rtff ? (read the fforums)
[23:01] <haltdef> you'll probably need to compile it yourself
[23:01] <mdavey> hello all
[23:01] <perrec> haltdef looks like that's exactly the answer
[23:02] <perrec> as I just stumbled on someone who did just that for one of the arm based plug computers
[23:02] <Thorn_> o/ mdavey
[23:02] <Davespice> is it only for voip calls, or can it do trunk switching of physical lines? I suppose hardware would be needed for that
[23:02] <perrec> recompiled asterisk for arm based ubuntu on a plug computer anyway
[23:03] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@124-148-189-239.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Quit: 'night)
[23:04] <perrec> Davespice, don't know, but I'll keep searching
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[23:05] <Davespice> I'm guessing it must be for Cisco type voip phones
[23:05] <OneFix_Work> perrec: You probably could run it, but it probably couldn't have many clients attached to it
[23:05] <Davespice> oh no wait, the screen shots show trunks as a menu option
[23:06] <OneFix_Work> perrec: So, a home PBX or small (less than 10 lines) office might be ok
[23:06] <Davespice> I wonder if it could be set up with a Pi cluster
[23:06] <Davespice> you'd be able to do a lot that way
[23:06] <perrec> OneFix_Work: it would just be for home use so at most 3 connections, even then it would just be more of a proof of concept unless it really is simple, cheap, and easy. Then I will write up a tutorial for everyone.
[23:07] <traeak> you can run asterisk on more than a few hackable routers out there
[23:07] <OneFix_Work> perrec: I would look at PlugPBX
[23:07] <traeak> in fact one of those might be a better solution considering they are built around network throughput
[23:08] <OneFix_Work> traeak: That's what PlugPBX is built for
[23:08] <traeak> cool
[23:08] <perrec> Sheevaplug: $99, RaspberryPi:$35
[23:08] <traeak> you can load asterisk on a dd-wrt device as well
[23:08] <OneFix_Work> traeak: It's built to run on the SheevaPlug, but it would probably be fine on the rPi
[23:09] <traeak> i'm not sure what an rt-16n could handle for number of phones
[23:10] <traeak> seems they're not on sale now ;(
[23:10] <OneFix_Work> perrec: Actually, you will be able to get a version of the rPi for $25 without a network interface...which you can buy for ~$2.00 from Amazon
[23:10] <perrec> cheapest I could find was $79 for the rt-16n
[23:10] <perrec> still much more than a RP
[23:12] * NIN102 (~NIN@ Quit (Quit: NIN102)
[23:12] <perrec> either way it looks like a fun and useful project to test out on the RP
[23:12] * perrec (ada79aac@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[23:12] <OneFix_Work> BTW ... http://www.amazon.com/Rj45-Ethernet-Network-Card-Adapter/dp/B005CSOODY ... $1.28 10/100 USB adapter
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[23:28] <xlq> O_o
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[23:32] <bbeattie> So the Gertboard uses the L602 bridge driver (motor controller) supports up to 48v @ 4A (5A peak). I'm a CS not EE so can anyone who knows EE comment if I can get 10A at 18V without damaging the IC? My math would be 48v*4A = 192Watts and 192w/18v = 10.66Amps.
[23:32] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: What are you trying to drive?
[23:33] <bbeattie> G scale locomotive
[23:33] <mkopack> It's the current more than the voltage that's the problem
[23:33] <mkopack> current makes heat
[23:33] <mkopack> I'd think you'd blow the chip
[23:34] <mkopack> but I could be wrong
[23:34] <bbeattie> I thought watts made heat..
[23:34] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: Why don't you wire the gert board up to the controls instead of trying to drive the whole thing? It would probably be easier
[23:34] <mkopack> Why are you hoping to make the gertboard run the motor? The actual locomotive motor???
[23:34] <mkopack> Yeah, what OneFix said
[23:35] <mkopack> Use the gert to control the train, not try to drive it
[23:35] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: You will also want to setup sensors every so many inches on the track to keep it from flying off the track
[23:35] <bbeattie> Onefix_work: controls run $100+ for G scale locomotives (bascially a high end RC boat ESC)
[23:36] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: Yea, but you're still looking at it as a different problem than you should...
[23:37] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: One good starter project would be a slot car track
[23:37] <bbeattie> onefix_work: the r-pi will be connected to an rfid reader (tags every 10'), axle rpm counter (finer accuracy but considering wheels can slip the rfid tags will recalibrate), wifi (communication between locomotives),
[23:37] <mkopack> Yeah??? You should be able to find a cheap motor controller board??? Then use the gertboard to talk to it to control on/off and direction
[23:38] * Plankalkuel (~paethon@chello213047250034.tirol.surfer.at) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[23:38] <bbeattie> mkopack: been looking no luck. Ideally I'd need something that does Back-emf to count rpms of the motors (G scale locomotives have have 4+ DC motors per engine)
[23:38] <bbeattie> VDC from 0-20V that can support 10+amps are not easy to find sub $80
[23:39] <mkopack> Damn, how big is G scale? I'm only familiar with the stuff I had as a kid - the typical commercial toy stuff back from the 70's
[23:39] <bbeattie> and I'm looking for a solution not for just myself but the entire industry. I can hack something but that doesn't help others in the hobby
[23:39] <mkopack> Yeah, well, now you know why!
[23:39] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: Again, I would try making your project work with a slot car track and then scale it up...you're looking at it wrong to think you're going to drive a G-Scale locomotive with it
[23:40] <bbeattie> G scale runs on 2" (45mm actually) track. Locomotives weigh up to 45lb's each, 3' long, 5" wide
[23:40] <mkopack> Wow.
[23:40] <bbeattie> it's the only "scale" train that has track and locomotives that are weather proof.
[23:40] <koaschten> G as in Garden :X
[23:41] * mkopack (~mkopack@ Quit (Quit: mkopack)
[23:41] <bbeattie> ties are of ABS/UV protected so they don't brake and rust after a couple months.
[23:42] <bbeattie> ... My backup option is r-pi and a usb servo board ($20) and use a train ESC or boat ESC to power the locomotives. b-emf would be quite useful for the hobby though, which you lose with esc's.
[23:44] <tntexplo1ivesltd> if an IC has a max current stated, you can't excede that
[23:44] <bbeattie> mkopack: why would using the gertboard to run a locomotive be a bad idea architecture wise? Aren't the bridge drivers on the gertboard specifically for driving motors like a train motor (although ideally a smaller motor(s)?
[23:45] <tntexplo1ivesltd> * exceed
[23:45] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: If you are simply trying to re-invent the wheel, you're setting yourself up for failure. If you are trying to build a cheap system for automating the controls, then it will probably work ... and if you are looking to drive the whole set with an rPi, you're way off track (no pun intended)
[23:47] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: Because even if you could get it working ... as soon as you get a shorted track, your going to let the blue smoke out of your rPi
[23:48] <bbeattie> onefix_work: trains are battery powered...
[23:48] * kism3t (~kism3t@client-86-25-195-15.bsh-bng-013.adsl.virginmedia.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:48] <bbeattie> Many G scale guys are going li-po like the plane hobby for simplicity (and not having to clean tracks all the time)
[23:49] <bbeattie> 4-5 cell li-po 4A batteries run a train for up to 2 hours
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[23:49] * Da|Mummy (~Veki@cpe-76-190-200-98.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:51] <OneFix_Work> bbeattie: You can try it with your rPi, but I'm gonna steer clear of things that run that much juice through my equipment...
[23:51] <bbeattie> onefix_work: also, train transformers have short protection, you can short the track all you want and it never shorts locomotives electronics (which are very often used).
[23:53] <bbeattie> I guess I'm missing something, I'm not sure how the r-pi would be a problem when dealing with any high voltage or current systems as long as you don't short wires between the two circuits.

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