#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2012-03-06

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:05] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:08] * mrdragons (~lucas@c-98-204-135-73.hsd1.md.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[0:08] * Flea86 (~Flea86@c114-76-82-206.thoms3.vic.optusnet.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:08] * PiBot sets mode +v Flea86
[0:12] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:12] * PiBot sets mode +v IT_Sean
[0:12] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[0:16] * stcuser (~Yogesh@ has left #raspberrypi
[0:16] * mrdragons (~lucas@c-98-204-135-73.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:16] * PiBot sets mode +v mrdragons
[0:27] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:31] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[0:31] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[0:34] * imsky (~ivan@c-71-194-152-46.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:34] * PiBot sets mode +v imsky
[0:36] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@ has joined #raspberrypi
[0:36] * PiBot sets mode +v tsdedst
[0:40] * Liam` (~quassel@ool-4a5ac74e.dyn.optonline.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[0:47] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:47] * PiBot sets mode +v JonSeals
[0:47] <Mookman288> Running the display and the pi on a single connector is gonna drive me mad.
[0:51] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:51] * PiBot sets mode +v mkopack
[0:53] <mkopack> Mmmmm Shamrock Shake....
[0:53] <mkopack> Yuck??? Cold McD's Burger
[0:54] <Flea86> mmm ^~^
[0:57] * evert (~evert@xvm-30-94.ghst.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[0:57] <unreal-dude> cold only matters with coffee :p
[0:57] <lars_t_h> i wish that the RPi had a FPGA chip = programmable digital electronics - http://opencores.org/projects has a lot of interesting HDL code
[0:58] <Flea86> lars_t_h: Just buy an fpga board? :P
[0:59] <Flea86> lars_t_h: Not sure if the GPU on the broadcom chip is actally an fpga, would be nice to know if it actually was one.. :)
[0:59] * mdavey (~chatzilla@host217-35-75-188.in-addr.btopenworld.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:00] <lars_t_h> Flea86, usually too expensive, better included on a SoC
[1:00] <mkopack> Flea: doubtful that it is??? usually you only use an FPGA for prototyping and then go to actual laid out silicon for production
[1:01] <mkopack> And never know, somebody might come out with an add-on FPGA board (ala Gertboard)
[1:01] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:01] * PiBot sets mode +v IT_Sean
[1:01] <mkopack> heya sean
[1:01] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[1:01] <lars_t_h> Flea86, is possible that the the Broadcom blob is the data for a FPGA
[1:01] * Liam (~quassel@ool-4a5ac74e.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:01] * PiBot sets mode +v Liam
[1:01] <IT_Sean> heya
[1:01] <lars_t_h> *it is
[1:01] <lars_t_h> hi IT_Sean
[1:01] <IT_Sean> o/
[1:03] <Flea86> lars_t_h: True, I think there are ARM core+FPGA SOC's out on the market, just not in the raspi form factor
[1:03] <victhor> actually it isn't that unusual to have this sort of firmware loading scheme on fixed function devices
[1:03] * LowValueTarget (~LowValueT@unaffiliated/lowvaluetarget) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * PiBot sets mode +v LowValueTarget
[1:03] <victhor> so I wouldn't have my hopes high on FPGA.
[1:05] <mkopack> Well, if shipping date continues to hold. I'll be eating Pi in last than a month ! :)
[1:05] <victhor> the farnell distributor over here still doesn't have a price or date... :/
[1:06] <Flea86> victhor: You know it's funny - I once owned this cheap/nasty AGP video card once (~2004).. had all sorts of drivers/patches for it etc. but when it finally died six months later (lol) I took it apart and found the device had am ~8mbit serial flash chip connected to the GPU!
[1:06] <Flea86> *an
[1:06] <mkopack> Whoa! AGP that late???
[1:06] * crackm (~chatzilla@brln-4db948c0.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[1:06] <mkopack> I thought AGP went away by like 1999
[1:07] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@ Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[1:07] <unreal-dude> lol
[1:07] <Flea86> mkopack: Well tbh cannot 100% recall if it was AGP or PCI, but it was a rather slow card
[1:07] * crackm (~chatzilla@brln-4d0c9aec.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:07] * PiBot sets mode +v crackm
[1:07] * crackm (~chatzilla@brln-4d0c9aec.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[1:07] <victhor> graphics cards have their own firmware
[1:08] <unreal-dude> believe it or not, when things become obsolete, they don't cease to exist! :)
[1:08] * IT_Sean thumps mkopack with a faulty AGP graphics card
[1:08] <Flea86> victhor: Ah, but *not* necessarily 'reconfigurable hardware' then?
[1:09] <victhor> yes
[1:09] <ReggieUK> IT_Sean, pfft, a man of your calibre and that's all you can muster
[1:09] <ReggieUK> an AGP card
[1:09] <Flea86> lol
[1:09] * ReggieUK sees IT_Sean's agp card and raises him a phys-x card!
[1:10] <victhor> some Creative audio cards with DSPs didn't have flash memory for the DSP firmware, so that has to be loaded by the driver
[1:10] * no-name- (~no-name@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:10] * PiBot sets mode +v no-name-
[1:10] <victhor> the DSP isn't "reconfigurable" per se... but you need to load firmware for it to work
[1:10] <victhor> same with many wifi cards
[1:10] * heymaste_ (~heymaster@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[1:10] <Flea86> victhor: I wish can remember the part number of that chip, because from whatever scant info I could dig up on that graphics chip, it sounded fpga-ish...
[1:10] <ReggieUK> is that the pi dsp you're talking about?
[1:11] * heymaster (~heymaster@2002:4e3d:d4bc:0:ac1d:7846:21f7:9735) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:11] * PiBot sets mode +v heymaster
[1:11] <Flea86> victhor: Pity I do not have that card anymore, it was toast long ago..
[1:14] * alk__ (alk@proxima.lp0.eu) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[1:14] <piofcube> I wouldn't mind knowing more about this board: http://p.twimg.com/AnQysmyCAAAXtzf.jpg:large :-)
[1:15] <Flea86> piofcube: looks like something out of an industrial control system..
[1:16] <piofcube> Flea86 yeah it is... it connects to the host PC via USB... I have two of them but I doubt I'd make any use of them LOL
[1:16] * IT_Sean reconfigures ReggieUK's phys-x card with a holt soldering iron
[1:17] * lars_t_h (~lars_t_h@002129239249.mbb.telenor.dk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:17] <piofcube> I would mess with them a bit to see the software on it etc but no time now :(
[1:18] * hamitron (~hamitron@just.screw-the.eu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:18] <Flea86> piofcube: That PCB could also be useful to you as an SMT parts source (i.e. SMT optoisolators etc)
[1:18] <Flea86> :)
[1:18] <IT_Sean> Surface mount components are buggers :/
[1:18] <piofcube> yeah there's some nice chips like latches etc
[1:19] <piofcube> even the button cell holders will be of use :-)
[1:19] <Flea86> piofcube: There even appears to be tiny solid-state relays on it! }:A
[1:20] * LowValueTarget (~LowValueT@unaffiliated/lowvaluetarget) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[1:20] <Flea86> IT_Sean: They are, if you're trying to hand-assemble surface-mount in quantity.. ;-0
[1:20] <Flea86> *especially so
[1:20] <piofcube> I do shudder at the thought of solderingsome of those components though... I wouldn't attempt the ARM chip LMAO
[1:21] <victhor> I was soldering a 0805 passive yesterday
[1:21] <jimbib> just a steady hand is needed
[1:21] <victhor> wow, they are much smaller than on the computer :P
[1:21] <piofcube> steady hand is something I often lack these days :-(
[1:21] <Flea86> piofcube: Hey! it's not too bad actually! here's a shot of a board I did recently using nothing more than a clean hand-iron:
[1:21] <victhor> but yes it isn't that hard.
[1:22] <Flea86> http://members.optuszoo.com.au/pioneer10/Flea86_21usb.JPG
[1:22] * Spikey_ (~chatzilla@cpc23-slam6-2-0-cust241.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:22] * PiBot sets mode +v Spikey_
[1:22] * Spikey (~chatzilla@cpc23-slam6-2-0-cust241.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:22] * Spikey_ is now known as Spikey
[1:22] <piofcube> That's a pretty nifty board there... I like the logo :-)
[1:22] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[1:23] <Flea86> piofcube: Thanks :)
[1:23] <IT_Sean> neat board. wassit do?
[1:24] <piofcube> no RTC I notice? :-)
[1:24] <Flea86> IT_Sean: It originally started out as an experiment to see if I could virtualise an *entire* PC's function using nothing more than a very fast 8-bit microcntroller - well that experiment worked!
[1:25] <Flea86> piofcube: That's what the expansion header up front is for ;-)
[1:25] <piofcube> cool
[1:25] <IT_Sean> awesome
[1:25] * alk (alk@proxima.lp0.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] * PiBot sets mode +v alk
[1:25] * piofcube waits for someone to ask if it can play Crysis.
[1:25] * alk is now known as Guest72184
[1:26] <piofcube> Flea86: One thing I wanted to ask about it
[1:26] * IT_Sean waits for someone to ask if it has flash, and can play CoD
[1:26] <victhor> hmm I do not have solder wick. Does copper wire work?
[1:27] <Flea86> piofcube: Haha no! though it *can* play Wolf3d and run MS-windows :P
[1:27] <piofcube> Flea86: Is it out yet?
[1:27] <Flea86> piofcube: Only in assembled-pcb form currently
[1:28] <piofcube> Flea86: are you taking pre-orders?
[1:28] <piofcube> sorry.. couldn't resist... but it does look pretty good indeed.. I wouldn't mind getting one though.
[1:30] <Flea86> piofcube: Well I've just got the feedback from all people who've ordered beta boards.. it's all good }:A
[1:30] * JonSeals_ (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:30] * PiBot sets mode +v JonSeals_
[1:30] <piofcube> victhor: I have used the outer on coax before for a solder wick... It was an emergency
[1:31] <victhor> turns out I put too much solder on a smd pad yesterday and the solder is all messy
[1:31] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[1:31] * JonSeals_ is now known as JonSeals
[1:31] <IT_Sean> your solder fu is not strong, grasshopper.
[1:32] <Flea86> IT_sean: lol
[1:32] <piofcube> I bought a bunch of IDE to CF adaptors the other week and the SMDs look like they were soldered by a blind sheep dog
[1:32] * discomeats (~howismyir@213-152-32-22.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) Quit (Quit: z)
[1:33] <IT_Sean> piofcube, was it made in china?
[1:33] <IT_Sean> 'casue, if so... it was probably a blind goat.
[1:33] <Flea86> IT_Sean: Yeah, foxconn's got all the panda's working for them :P
[1:34] <piofcube> doesn't have country of origin on but it did pass QC control because of the large sticker on it... O_o
[1:34] <Flea86> piofcube: QC you say? then it might still work then! lol
[1:34] <Flea86> just don't bump it :)
[1:35] <piofcube> unless that is what they were drinking during fabrication
[1:35] <IT_Sean> That just means that they punted it at a wall and less than 6% of the ICs fell off
[1:35] <Flea86> IT_Sean: haha flead-free solder strength test..
[1:35] <Flea86> *lead
[1:35] <piofcube> QC.. oh Quick Check... gotcha
[1:35] <IT_Sean> bloody lead free rubbish
[1:36] * IT_Sean grumbles
[1:36] <piofcube> IT_Sean: If you want lead fumes... you got to walk outside... near a busy road...
[1:37] <IT_Sean> where the arse are you that they still use leaded fuel?
[1:38] <mkopack> Race gas still has lead in it
[1:38] <mkopack> needed to get the octane boosted
[1:38] <piofcube> No... but I bet there's still plenty of it being pumped out
[1:39] * heymaster (~heymaster@2002:4e3d:d4bc:0:ac1d:7846:21f7:9735) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[1:40] <IT_Sean> And now, for something completly different: http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/4438/dscn1879d.jpg
[1:41] <mkopack> and that is?
[1:41] * garma (~NJ@cpc6-sotn11-2-0-cust198.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:41] * PiBot sets mode +v garma
[1:41] <IT_Sean> A 333MHz Motorola PowerPC ZiF CPU from the 2nd computer i ever owned :p
[1:42] * IT_Sean still has it
[1:42] * IT_Sean is thinking of getting it framed, and haning it on the wall
[1:44] * Lerc (~Lerc@121-74-232-17.telstraclear.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[1:46] * garma (~NJ@cpc6-sotn11-2-0-cust198.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:47] * oldtopman has some Morotola chips from the good old days of the Clones and such.
[1:48] <IT_Sean> I still have the computer that goes in, too. ...It isn't hooked up, though.
[1:50] * IT_Sean rips the flash chip out of a dead USB thumbdrive and flicks it at piofcube
[1:51] * Lerc (~Lerc@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] * PiBot sets mode +v Lerc
[1:51] * toxical (~francisco@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[1:52] * Delboy_ (~Kombajn@185-142.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[1:53] * JonSeals_ (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:53] * PiBot sets mode +v JonSeals_
[1:54] * Spikey (~chatzilla@cpc23-slam6-2-0-cust241.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:56] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:56] * JonSeals_ is now known as JonSeals
[1:57] <Mookman288> hmm
[1:57] <Mookman288> I need two miniature 2 port usb hubs
[2:01] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: off)
[2:02] * uen| (~uen@p5DCB298E.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:02] * PiBot sets mode +v uen|
[2:02] * danieldaniel is now known as [\\\\\\\\\\\\\\]
[2:02] * [\\\\\\\\\\\\\\] is now known as danieldaniel
[2:02] * imsky (~ivan@c-71-194-152-46.hsd1.in.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[2:04] * kyzz (18a6516d@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[2:04] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) Quit (Quit: shirro)
[2:06] * uen (~uen@p5DCB27A4.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[2:06] * Vampier (~Vampier@unaffiliated/vampier) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:10] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit (Quit: The real world is just a crappy game... The ideal world can only be found within a game. Such was my believe. But if an ideal can be found within a crappy game, there may be an ideal route in the real world... for me to discover)
[2:10] * Syliss (~Syliss@adsl-108-201-91-124.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:10] * PiBot sets mode +v Syliss
[2:10] * jzaw (~jzaw@macbook.dzki.co.uk) Quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
[2:10] * jimbib (~jimbib@cpc1-stav10-0-0-cust101.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[2:11] * artag (~artag@cpc2-bedf1-0-0-cust397.9-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[2:12] * DataSpree (~DataSpree@ip72-204-12-32.fv.ks.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:12] * PiBot sets mode +v DataSpree
[2:14] <DataSpree> What's new?
[2:15] <Syliss> the moon?
[2:16] <Da|Mummy> hes full
[2:16] * MattT1 (~Adium@cpc2-donc11-2-0-cust430.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:16] * PiBot sets mode +v MattT1
[2:17] <Syliss> lol
[2:20] * genbattle (~quassel@203-114-137-9.wir.sta.inspire.net.nz) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[2:21] * neglesaks (~peterbp@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[2:22] * JonSeals_ (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:22] * PiBot sets mode +v JonSeals_
[2:24] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[2:26] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:26] * JonSeals_ is now known as JonSeals
[2:26] * Liam (~quassel@ool-4a5ac74e.dyn.optonline.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[2:26] <Da|Mummy> 5v 1000mA enough to power pi?
[2:26] <mkopack> supposed to be
[2:27] <MattT1> i cant wait to get my pi :/
[2:28] * Simon- (simon@proxima.lp0.eu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:28] <Syliss> Da|Mummy: should, since the fuse maxes at 1000ma
[2:29] * MattT1 (~Adium@cpc2-donc11-2-0-cust430.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[2:30] * Matt_T (~Adium@cpc2-donc11-2-0-cust430.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:30] * PiBot sets mode +v Matt_T
[2:33] * kyzz (18a6516d@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[2:33] * PiBot sets mode +v kyzz
[2:34] <kyzz> I'm on Arch now and I don't know what to do
[2:34] <passstab> what does that mean?
[2:35] * Liam (~quassel@ool-4a5ac74e.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:35] * PiBot sets mode +v Liam
[2:36] * Simon- (simon@proxima.lp0.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:36] * PiBot sets mode +v Simon-
[2:36] <Syliss> lol
[2:37] <ukscone> just been discussing poisoning using arsenic & how to hide the evidence from postmortem with the kid for one of his college classes. what interesting conversations we have. think we'll ralk about cyanide next
[2:38] <piofcube> one of his college classes? His teacher isn't THAT bad is he?
[2:38] * shirro (~shirro@ppp102-6.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:38] * shirro (~shirro@ppp102-6.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Changing host)
[2:38] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:38] * PiBot sets mode +v shirro
[2:38] * PiBot sets mode +v shirro
[2:39] <ukscone> i did let slip my 3 favourite poisoning methods to him though so now i'll need to think of somenew ones
[2:39] <ukscone> no he likes that lecturer but he did squeal to the wife that she better get a food taster
[2:40] * vectory_ (~damon@unaffiliated/vectory) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:40] * PiBot sets mode +v vectory_
[2:40] <piofcube> yeah... you got to be carefull what you do with certain common plants and the water that's left in the vase after you dump the flowers ;-)
[2:40] <Mookman288> no miniature 2port usb hubs =(
[2:40] <Mookman288> too afraid to make my own
[2:40] <ukscone> cigerette butts in water are quite handy
[2:41] <piofcube> yeah but the smell LOL
[2:41] <ukscone> nicotine is handy for killing people er sorry i mean killing bugs on your roses
[2:42] <piofcube> 1 drop of pure nicotine will kill very quickly even if dripped onto the skin
[2:42] <ukscone> i suppose i really shouldn't admit that i do have about 3 gig of pdf's on poisons andpoisoning.....
[2:42] <ukscone> at least not online anyway :)
[2:42] <piofcube> good job you didn't just admit to it then ;-)
[2:43] * vectory (~damon@unaffiliated/vectory) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:43] <ukscone> yup and it's not as if i have admitted to thinking of many ways to commit murder
[2:45] <piofcube> I have a copy of a real old book for kids and chemistry... Forgot the title but is has loads of stuff in it which would freak out the three letter organisations if it were published today... I think it was published in 1930 or something LOL
[2:45] * JonSeals_ (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:45] * PiBot sets mode +v JonSeals_
[2:45] <ukscone> yeah
[2:45] <Flea86> piofcube: nicotine is really *that* deadly? eeek!
[2:45] <ukscone> the chemistry sets we used to get in the 70s were great
[2:45] <ukscone> lots of cool chemicals that
[2:45] <ukscone> you could make yourself very ill from
[2:46] <Flea86> lol
[2:46] <ukscone> now they are lucky to incl. water in the chemistry sets
[2:46] <Da|Mummy> as thc as a variable
[2:46] <piofcube> Flea86: People used to put a few drops on a little burner and run out of their greenhouse... A few days later they would return and find everything living in there no longer... erm.. alive.
[2:46] <ukscone> Flea86: yeah pure nicotine is extremely poisonous
[2:46] <ukscone> tiny tiny amounts kill
[2:47] <Da|Mummy> so is adreneline
[2:47] <Flea86> ukscone: Yikes! :S
[2:47] <ukscone> there is enough in a pack of 20 cigs that if you soaked them overnight in wateer you would have enough to kill quite a few pwople
[2:47] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:47] * JonSeals_ is now known as JonSeals
[2:47] <Da|Mummy> your saliva has a pain killer 3 times stronger than morphine
[2:48] <piofcube> especially first thing in the morning... or so I was told...
[2:48] <ukscone> i told you all that i was discussing this with the kid -- i lied i wasn't really i was just working out how to stop all the whiners about the rx/farnell f*** ups on the 29th :)
[2:49] <DataSpree> lol
[2:51] <piofcube> There was a big hoax... must have been about 15 years ago... Those "pass this onto all your friends" emails saying that many envelopes at a certain stationary shop had been laced with nicotine... Lots of people were too scared to lick their own envelopes for some reason LOL
[2:51] * Simon- (simon@proxima.lp0.eu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:51] <mkopack> Oh dear LORD I hate having to use GDB from the command line!
[2:51] * Simon- (simon@proxima.lp0.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:51] * PiBot sets mode +v Simon-
[2:52] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:52] * PiBot sets mode +v Laogeodritt
[2:52] <DataSpree> mkopack: how do you normally use it?
[2:52] <mkopack> I DON'T??? I usually do all my work in Netbeans or Eclipse and use it's debugger
[2:52] <mkopack> but I can't do that for this F'ing class
[2:52] * hotwings (hd@secksy.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:53] <mkopack> they're making us use GDB, and I'm getting pissed of trying to find this bug they want us to find and fix using it
[2:53] <mkopack> I REALLY REALLY hate this class. It's like CS for dummies??? and the prof is an idiot
[2:53] * hotwings (hd@secksy.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:53] * PiBot sets mode +v hotwings
[2:53] <mkopack> they're MAKING me take it because it's been so long since I was an undergrad, but this really is stupid shit
[2:54] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[2:54] <SpeedEvil> mkopack: You've investigated testing out?
[2:55] <mkopack> ?
[2:55] <mkopack> Eh, they wouldn't let me. and I need the credits anyhow
[2:55] <mkopack> and it's a relatively easy class, it's just the labs getting annoying - here go do this mindless stupid thing that really doesn't teach you anything
[2:56] * kyzz (18a6516d@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[2:57] <ukscone> http://imakethin.gs/blog/?p=2640 lol
[2:58] * jardiamj (~jardiamj@rdbk.p5-136.molalla.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:58] * PiBot sets mode +v jardiamj
[3:01] * kyzz (18a6516d@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[3:01] * PiBot sets mode +v kyzz
[3:02] <GabrialDestruir> Apparently that newark raspberry pi faq is wrong
[3:03] <GabrialDestruir> What should I do if I ordered from Farnell element in Europe and I???m based in Australia or the US? A.If you have pre-ordered and want to change your order, please contact the customer service department in your country. This will allow us to provide you with the best service possible.
[3:03] <GabrialDestruir> I just called newark, and got told they can't do anything about farnell orders
[3:03] <GabrialDestruir> Can't even track it
[3:04] <mkopack> Gabr: Then I guess that's the best they can do...
[3:04] <mrdragons> mkopack: I have to take tons of classes like that in high school. :\
[3:04] <mkopack> Why did you order from the UK site if you're int he US?
[3:04] <GabrialDestruir> lol
[3:04] <GabrialDestruir> Cause I ordered in the first 2 hours from export.farnelll
[3:04] <GabrialDestruir> farnell*
[3:04] <mkopack> Well, 2 options:
[3:04] * evert (~evert@xvm-30-94.ghst.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:04] * PiBot sets mode +v evert
[3:05] <mkopack> 1) keep your UK order, and pay the shipping, or, 2) cancel it and order from Newark
[3:05] <mkopack> (and go to the end of the line)
[3:05] <GabrialDestruir> Can't cancel .-.
[3:05] * Syliss (~Syliss@adsl-108-201-91-124.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[3:06] <rvalles> still waiting to hear from RS
[3:06] <rvalles> besides the automatic mail this weekend, that is.
[3:06] <Matt_T> me too :(
[3:07] <rvalles> once I know about rs, I'll simulate a purchase and compare with farnell (which is pretty bad for spain)
[3:07] <rvalles> and go with whatever is cheaper
[3:07] <mkopack> yeah, I doubt I'm going to bother ordering from RS when they give me the option to. No point since I have 2 orders open with Newark, and I also registered interest with RS's us branch...
[3:07] <rvalles> it feels like it'll take forever either way.
[3:08] <Matt_T> i hope rs open up purchase soon, i never preordered from Newark
[3:08] <kyzz> does anyone here use quassel?
[3:08] <GabrialDestruir> I find it funny, how I have no real way to contact farnell without spending a ton of money on calling apparently
[3:08] <rvalles> GabrialDestruir: a ton of money?
[3:09] <rvalles> if calling is the only option, at least use voip
[3:09] <GabrialDestruir> Calling their UK number apparently is the only way to contact someone
[3:09] <GabrialDestruir> I don't know any voip that allows free UK calling, so I'd still be spending money on it.
[3:09] <rvalles> eg: evil skype
[3:09] <rvalles> spending money? sure
[3:09] <rvalles> but at least not a fortune
[3:10] <GabrialDestruir> and all my experience with any sort of CS is they're either absolutely worthless, or you've got to spend 30+ minutes on the phone to get anything done.
[3:13] * Matt_T (~Adium@cpc2-donc11-2-0-cust430.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[3:13] <GabrialDestruir> I guess I'll just keep maling farnell the same email every 3 days until they either respond or my pi arrives....
[3:15] * SpeedEvil wonders if there would be a market for a $0.50 solution to send a letter into the UK.
[3:15] <GabrialDestruir> Well isn't the current postage to UK like a dollar or something?
[3:16] <SpeedEvil> yeah - I mean a simple form - type the letter, type the address, upload a graphical signature if desired, and it goes.
[3:16] <GabrialDestruir> lol
[3:16] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@ Quit (Quit: pizthewiz)
[3:17] <GabrialDestruir> You could probably make a killing...
[3:17] <piofcube> There are service like this but usually cater to mass mailers with loads of output per month
[3:17] * pdp7 (~pdp7@asciipr0n.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:17] <GabrialDestruir> But I think the only time anyone uses Postal to UK though is when they want an actual written out letter in their handwriting or something
[3:18] <GabrialDestruir> Most people use email these days I think.
[3:18] <SpeedEvil> UK firms that won't accept email sanely, or government departments that don't do it at all.
[3:18] <SpeedEvil> My local council will readily accept email.
[3:18] <SpeedEvil> Central government - not so much.
[3:23] * Kevin_ (~Kevin@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:23] * PiBot sets mode +v Kevin_
[3:23] <Kevin_> Hmm
[3:23] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@ has joined #raspberrypi
[3:23] * PiBot sets mode +v pizthewiz
[3:23] * KeP (potnhbug@nat/u-szeged/x-nznppxkwtcdipkrq) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[3:24] * JonSeals_ (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:24] * PiBot sets mode +v JonSeals_
[3:25] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) Quit (Quit: shirro)
[3:26] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[3:26] * JonSeals_ is now known as JonSeals
[3:35] <Lycanthropist> Further to notification from our supplier we write to advise that the expected delivery of items listed in bold has
[3:35] <Lycanthropist> been amended.
[3:35] <Lycanthropist> W/C 14/05/2012
[3:35] <elmo40> may? wow. that's far away
[3:35] <jojo> me too
[3:41] * swiley (~swiley@167.sub-75-192-196.myvzw.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[3:41] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@ Quit (Quit: pizthewiz)
[3:42] <Lycanthropist> was april the day i did it
[3:42] <Lycanthropist> so i guess they are a month behind already
[3:42] <Lycanthropist> lol
[3:49] <ewan> yeah, my ETA is May as well
[3:51] * Syliss (~Syliss@adsl-108-201-91-124.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:51] * PiBot sets mode +v Syliss
[3:52] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:52] * PiBot sets mode +v prebz_
[3:53] <SpeedEvil> I I have an un-checked-out basket on farnell.
[3:53] <SpeedEvil> Says 56 days
[3:55] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[3:58] * Syliss (~Syliss@adsl-108-201-91-124.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[4:05] * des2 (~des2@pool-96-232-71-147.nycmny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:05] * PiBot sets mode +v des2
[4:05] * Flea86 (~Flea86@c114-76-82-206.thoms3.vic.optusnet.com.au) Quit (Quit: Station breakdown)
[4:10] * bnmorgan (~bnmorgan@host-216-119-188-115.vista-express.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:10] * PiBot sets mode +v bnmorgan
[4:11] <bnmorgan> g'morning
[4:11] * dattaway (~dattaway@adsl-66-143-35-238.dsl.ksc2mo.swbell.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[4:12] <bnmorgan> trying to make the SD for the incoming pi, and having no luck, even with the tutorial
[4:12] <mkopack> what os you trying to do it from?
[4:13] <bnmorgan> win7-64
[4:13] * no-name- (~no-name@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[4:14] <bnmorgan> argh. brb
[4:14] * rpiloose (~luser@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:18] <bnmorgan> back
[4:19] <bnmorgan> is it ok to paste in the error i get?
[4:19] <bnmorgan> http://pastebin.com/igjnN3gr
[4:20] <kyzz> What OS or distro are you all running atm?
[4:20] <squimmy> you're not specifying the of, by the looks of it
[4:21] <squimmy> hmm. where the tutorial you're using?
[4:21] <Dagger2> "of=\\?\Device\HarddiskVolume5" (is that path right?)
[4:21] <bnmorgan> http://pastebin.com/ph6PMPnv
[4:21] <bnmorgan> "f" is my sd card
[4:21] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[4:22] * SebastianFlyte (~sebf@pool-173-66-213-213.washdc.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:22] * PiBot sets mode +v SebastianFlyte
[4:22] <bnmorgan> here's the tutorial
[4:22] <bnmorgan> http://youtu.be/f3sr9Nwt3IY
[4:22] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: mkopack)
[4:22] <squimmy> cheers
[4:23] <DataSpree> what does dd.exe --list --filter=removable show?
[4:23] <squimmy> it stops it showing non-removable drives
[4:24] <squimmy> e.g. your harddrive
[4:24] <bnmorgan> very little
[4:24] <bnmorgan> C:\debian6-17-02-2012>dd.exe --list --filter=removable
[4:24] <bnmorgan> rawwrite dd for windows version 0.6beta3.
[4:24] <bnmorgan> Written by John Newbigin <jn@it.swin.edu.au>
[4:24] <bnmorgan> This program is covered by terms of the GPL Version 2.
[4:24] <bnmorgan> NT Block Device Objects
[4:24] <bnmorgan> C:\debian6-17-02-2012>
[4:25] <squimmy> your sd card is visible in like windows explorer or whatever, right?
[4:25] <bnmorgan> would it matter that my sd card is a microsd in an sd adapter?
[4:25] <squimmy> it shouldn't
[4:25] <bnmorgan> not after i did the clean thing like he showed in the tutorial
[4:25] <bnmorgan> it shows but won't display anything.
[4:25] <squimmy> ok
[4:25] <bnmorgan> should i format it?
[4:26] <squimmy> just a sec
[4:26] <Dagger2> I'm surprised that writing it to \\.\f: is the right thing to do... since that's a *partition*, not the entire device, and the image has a partition table in it and thus has to be written to the device and not a partition on the device
[4:27] * decadance (~decadance@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:27] <bnmorgan> maybe i need ot get and try it with an external reader instead of the built in?
[4:27] <Dagger2> yet I seem to remember activity here that suggested it was correct... does running dd as Administrator make it display any different/extra devices?
[4:27] <squimmy> in my experience, internal ones are usually better...
[4:27] <bnmorgan> best i can tell it is running as admin
[4:27] <DataSpree> try out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Win32DiskImager
[4:28] <DataSpree> that's what a broadcom employee in the forums said he used when dealing with windows machines
[4:28] <Dagger2> to be honest I'd just run dd from a Linux install, but I'm guessing that's not the sort of advice you're looking for
[4:29] <squimmy> yeah, i've always done it though linux. it's dead easy if you just use a liveCD
[4:29] <bnmorgan> i have exactly zero linux experience so far.
[4:29] <bnmorgan> : D
[4:29] <bnmorgan> jumping in feet first.
[4:29] <squimmy> haha awesome.
[4:29] <squimmy> hmm
[4:30] <bnmorgan> nearest i have to linux i think is android
[4:30] <squimmy> bnmorgan: so, you can see your sd card in explorer, you just can't open it, right?
[4:31] <bnmorgan> correct
[4:31] <bnmorgan> appears that win32diskimager is working it.
[4:32] * oberling_ (~oberling@brln-4dbc64f5.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:32] * PiBot sets mode +v oberling_
[4:32] <squimmy> awesome
[4:32] <DataSpree> sweet
[4:32] <bnmorgan> now, whether or not it's doing it properly is another cookie.
[4:32] <DataSpree> heh
[4:32] <des2> bnmorgan consider playing with linux in a Virtual Machine under windows
[4:32] <bnmorgan> 3.75mb/s
[4:33] <bnmorgan> what's the chances that i could get THIS linux running VM?
[4:33] * dattaway (~dattaway@adsl-66-143-35-238.dsl.ksc2mo.swbell.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:33] * PiBot sets mode +v dattaway
[4:33] <bnmorgan> i have err...vmware player it hink?
[4:34] <squimmy> doesn't look like vmware player does arm
[4:35] <squimmy> but what I'm reading here is over a year old
[4:35] <Dagger2> it still doesn't
[4:35] * oberling (~oberling@brln-4dbc7e41.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[4:35] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:35] <bnmorgan> i'm in way over my head on vm stuff anyway. i know just enough to really break stuff
[4:36] <squimmy> don't worry about vm. pi should be fine to learn on
[4:36] <des2> I'd qait trying to mak an SD image then
[4:36] <squimmy> worst-case scenario you break your linux install and just reimage the SD card :D
[4:37] <des2> SHortly after the Pi is out int he wild I'm sure there'll be easy tutorials for what you are trying to do.
[4:37] <des2> Let other people be the guinea pigs
[4:37] <squimmy> des2: what's he trying to do?
[4:38] <squimmy> bnmorgan: what're you trying to do?
[4:38] <des2> [22:11] <+bnmorgan> trying to make the SD for the incoming pi, and having no luck, even with the tutorial
[4:38] <squimmy> oh. that's all :[
[4:39] <bnmorgan> sorry, got distracted by a ferret.
[4:39] <des2> Also any image you make now will have to be redone as people release new versions of the OS for pi.
[4:39] <bnmorgan> win32diskimager is at 99%
[4:40] <des2> As the ones being released are still works in progress
[4:40] <bnmorgan> well, at least i'll theoretically know how to do it.
[4:40] <squimmy> Win32DiskImager is pretty good
[4:40] <bnmorgan> well, it must have done SOMETHING
[4:40] <des2> Someone might release a program for Windows for example that makes it really easy and does it correctly.
[4:41] <bnmorgan> the disk is openable now, and has a bunch of elf files and bin files and image kernels and popcorn kernels and more elfs.
[4:41] <squimmy> bnmorgan: sounds good!
[4:42] <bnmorgan> it's a mite smaller than the card, but i haven't hit that second tutorial yet to resize it. will do that tomorrow, it's almost 2200h here, and i've been up since 0400
[4:42] <bnmorgan> much obliged for all the help. i'm sure i'll be back and need more.
[4:42] <squimmy> :)
[4:43] <passstab> hmm maybe the rpi will at least get people into foss
[4:43] <passstab> if not computing
[4:43] <squimmy> passstab: I know! i'm pretty excited about it
[4:44] <des2> I just people aren't turned off when they find out how slow it is.
[4:44] <des2> ^hope
[4:45] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@fedora/CodeBlock) Quit (Excess Flood)
[4:45] <passstab> if they think they are buying a full-on computer
[4:45] <passstab> there too dumb anyways
[4:45] <des2> Well the press hasn't helped with the hype
[4:46] <passstab> no they haven't
[4:46] <squimmy> also lxde isn't the prettiest thing
[4:47] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:47] * PiBot sets mode +v smw
[4:47] <squimmy> but it is basically the best thing around for a home server. you don't need a lot of power to run httpd and samba
[4:47] <des2> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2012/mar/05/raspberry-pi-demand?newsfeed=true
[4:47] <passstab> are either u.s distributers still taking orders?
[4:48] <des2> http://www.alliedelec.com/search/productdetail.aspx?SKU=70229569
[4:49] <des2> Allied seems to be still
[4:49] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca5695.bb.sky.com) Quit ()
[4:49] <des2> Newark seems to have gone to 'express interest'.
[4:49] * vectory_ (~damon@unaffiliated/vectory) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:49] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@c-67-188-110-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:49] * PiBot sets mode +v pizthewiz
[4:50] * neoinr (~robin@flp.st) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:50] * PiBot sets mode +v neoinr
[4:51] * CodeBlock (~CodeBlock@ec2-107-22-199-66.compute-1.amazonaws.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:51] * PiBot sets mode +v CodeBlock
[4:52] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[4:52] * danieldaniel (~danieldan@unaffiliated/danieldaniel) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[4:53] * danieldaniel (~danieldan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[4:53] * PiBot sets mode +v danieldaniel
[4:54] * danieldaniel is now known as Guest38316
[4:56] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:56] * PiBot sets mode +v smw
[4:59] * neoinr (~robin@flp.st) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:00] * Guest38316 (~danieldan@ Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[5:01] * passstab (~v@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[5:01] * neoinr (~robin@flp.st) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:01] * PiBot sets mode +v neoinr
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[5:02] * PiBot sets mode +v danieldaniel_
[5:02] * passstab (~v@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:02] * PiBot sets mode +v passstab
[5:02] * neoinr (~robin@flp.st) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:04] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[5:04] * smw_ (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:04] * PiBot sets mode +v smw_
[5:05] * beardface (18d98b2a@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[5:05] * PiBot sets mode +v beardface
[5:05] <beardface> Starting to print up cases / raspberry pi models if anyone wants them: http://rpicases.blogspot.com/
[5:07] * danieldaniel_ (~danieldan@ Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[5:07] * danieldaniel_ (~danieldan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[5:07] * PiBot sets mode +v danieldaniel_
[5:09] <des2> Is there a bigger picture available ?
[5:09] <des2> I only see the really tiny pic in the upper right
[5:10] <des2> oops. Never mind. It gets giant when you right click on it.
[5:10] <beardface> :)
[5:11] <Mookman288> Is there a thread started on possibly setting up rechargable li-ion cylindrical cells?
[5:11] <Mookman288> They're incredibly cheap.
[5:12] <beardface> des2: here is a pic with the case: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/846109/3d/2012-03-05%2021.55.14.jpg
[5:13] <beardface> the parts look a little better when cleaned up, that is right off the printer
[5:13] <beardface> and had an issue with that case
[5:13] <magn3ts> wat is that??
[5:13] <magn3ts> omg
[5:13] <magn3ts> yes
[5:13] <magn3ts> sex
[5:14] <magn3ts> is that your own 3d printer?
[5:14] <magn3ts> sex on top of sex
[5:14] <beardface> yes
[5:14] <DaQatz> beardface, looks nice.
[5:14] <beardface> i like this pic b/c it gives you an idea of the scale: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/846109/3d/2012-03-05%2021.54.09.jpg
[5:14] <beardface> this thing is TINY
[5:14] <DaQatz> I probably make my own case.
[5:14] <beardface> hard to print well :) but it works great for fitting into case
[5:14] <beardface> dimensionally, it is dead on
[5:14] <magn3ts> yeah, I've had my eye on the Rpi for a while
[5:14] <magn3ts> gonna get my father to shut up about him trying to transcode to shitty DLNA impl on samsung lcd's.
[5:15] <DataSpree> do you have any pictures of of the case with both halves closed?
[5:15] * danieldaniel_ (~danieldan@ Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[5:16] * danieldaniel_ (~danieldan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[5:16] * PiBot sets mode +v danieldaniel_
[5:16] <beardface> on min... i really should reprint my sample case, this one warped b/c my print bed got way too hot
[5:16] <magn3ts> ugh, once again, I'm in the wrong damn irc room
[5:16] <DaQatz> ?
[5:17] <DaQatz> !channel
[5:17] <PiBot> DaQatz: #raspberrypi #raspberrypi-dev #raspberrypi-bots #raspberrypi-owners
[5:17] <DataSpree> beardface: is your print bed heated? do you ever use pc fans pointed at it during print jobs?
[5:18] <beardface> print bed is heated
[5:18] <beardface> i typically have the fan turn on automatically ont he 3rd layer
[5:18] <des2> He posted a picture of his print farm earlier and I did see a fan
[5:19] <passstab> just bought mine :)
[5:19] <curahack> WTFFF - Expected Ship Date 03 Apr 2012
[5:20] <curahack> the thing was like end this month a few days ago
[5:21] <des2> curahack you aren't the first with a bouncing date.
[5:21] <des2> Seems the rule rather than the exception.
[5:22] <beardface> Print Farm: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/846109/2012-03-02%2014.00.20.jpg
[5:22] <rm> curahack, some have 30 apr
[5:22] <rm> so be happy
[5:23] <beardface> 3D printed case (first one... rought :) ), with 3d printed pcb model inside: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/846109/3d/2012-03-05%2022.21.13.jpg
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[5:23] * PiBot sets mode +v toxical
[5:24] <rm> ugh
[5:24] <rm> I can make a better one from cardboard and duct tape
[5:24] <rm> does all printed stuff look like this
[5:25] <passstab> rm -rf ./rm
[5:26] <DataSpree> beardface: what size nozzle do you use?
[5:26] <passstab> the physical revolution is coming whether you like it or not
[5:26] <beardface> lol
[5:27] <beardface> .5mm, .2mm layers
[5:27] <beardface> the other printer prints with .35mm
[5:27] <beardface> but its busy making prusa parts
[5:27] <passstab> DataSpree : TWSS
[5:27] <beardface> rm, no everything doesn't look like that
[5:28] <DataSpree> lol
[5:28] * passstab (~v@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:29] <des2> The physical revolution will be here when 3D printers can print themselves.
[5:29] <beardface> the future is here. :)
[5:29] <beardface> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/846109/2012-03-02%2014.00.20.jpg
[5:29] <beardface> middle printer made the other two
[5:29] <curahack> cool!!!
[5:29] <des2> Didn't make the metal rods did it ?
[5:29] * Tachyon (~tachyon@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[5:30] <rm> yep exactly my question :)
[5:30] <beardface> :) true.
[5:31] <des2> I know they can make part of themselves but when they can make themselves 100% that's a tipping point.
[5:31] <rm> including all the PCBs and ASICs involved
[5:32] <des2> Hey let's not get crazy...
[5:32] <beardface> anyway, my plan for the rpi is to use it as a pc for the printers
[5:32] * Milos (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:32] * PiBot sets mode +v Milos
[5:32] <rm> if you can't make one 100.00% by yourself and have to involve a factory, it'll be more cost-effective to just build the whole thing at a factory
[5:32] <GabrialDestruir> When a 3D printer cant start printing other 3D printers.... I think you have more issues to worry about....
[5:33] <GabrialDestruir> Like when that 3D printer starts printing off little android bots with AI capabilities
[5:33] <GabrialDestruir> >.>
[5:34] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:34] * PiBot sets mode +v Tachyon
[5:36] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:36] * PiBot sets mode +v mkopack
[5:37] <mkopack> Nice, so we have definitive answer on the dsi/csi connector issue.l.
[5:37] <mkopack> Gert checked with Eben and they ARE on the production boards!
[5:38] <DataSpree> awesome. what about drivers though? I thought the GPU's firmware was not enabled to use them yet?
[5:38] <SpeedEvil> I assume that means footprint - not actual connector?
[5:39] <mkopack> Actual connector
[5:39] <mkopack> Connector on board
[5:39] <SpeedEvil> Oh.
[5:40] * roman3x_ (~roman3x@bband-dyn214.178-40-117.t-com.sk) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[5:40] <des2> Where are the 10,000 PIs ?
[5:40] <des2> Are they in UK yet ?
[5:40] * peepsalot (~Sir@99-179-7-44.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[5:41] * toxical (~francisco@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[5:42] * PiBot sets mode +v shirro
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[5:42] * PiBot sets mode +v toxical
[5:45] * danieldaniel_ (~danieldan@ Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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[5:49] * PiBot sets mode +v danieldaniel
[5:49] * danieldaniel is now known as Guest38484
[5:49] <mkopack> Des doesn't sound like it
[5:51] <des2> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-case-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-made-of-3mm-thick-acrylic-by-Laser-Co2-/360439728388
[5:52] <curahack> looks cool
[5:53] * peepsalot (~Sir@99-179-7-44.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:53] * PiBot sets mode +v peepsalot
[5:53] <GabrialDestruir> That's pretty awesome...
[5:55] <GabrialDestruir> as long as it doesn't fall appart, could make an awesome little case
[5:56] <rm> yep awesome
[5:56] <rm> as long as it does indeed snap together properly
[5:56] <rm> and actually fits the R Pi, lol
[5:57] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[5:57] <des2> A week after the Pi is being received I expect 100's of those type things to be on ebay
[5:57] <rm> also it's unclear if the plastic is rather transparent, or is it blurred/milky
[5:57] <rm> and if it will lose transparency over time
[5:58] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[5:58] <SpeedEvil> Acrylic will not lose transparency over time unless exposed to UV
[6:00] <des2> It's acrylic so it should be fine over time.
[6:01] <des2> A lot of people use it for aquariums.
[6:01] <GabrialDestruir> It'd make an interesting case...
[6:02] <des2> I'd prefer the cheapest blackest vented box.
[6:02] <GabrialDestruir> I wonder though if the raspberry has holes in it though.... cause if so that seems like a little much for the cooling.
[6:02] <SpeedEvil> vented?
[6:02] <SpeedEvil> It's 2.5W
[6:03] <des2> The B is 3.5 watts.
[6:03] <SpeedEvil> Even an unvented case isn't going to have a delta-t of >20C or so
[6:03] <GabrialDestruir> Well in one of the pictures it looks like all the raspi holes for the raspberry are punched out
[6:04] <GabrialDestruir> in two of them actually....
[6:04] <GabrialDestruir> Which just seems really excessive for pi cooling
[6:04] <des2> Yeah I think they are lasered out.
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[6:04] * PiBot sets mode +v codesnow
[6:05] <GabrialDestruir> Also it leads to the unfortunate fact that it'll allow huge amounts of dust in
[6:09] <des2> That's why I prefer the epoxy-block Pi
[6:10] <SpeedEvil> Potting in epoxy is a bad idea, and risks ripping parts off the board when temperature changes
[6:10] * Guest38484 (~danieldan@ Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[6:11] <GabrialDestruir> You could epoxy the case parts, and not the board >.>
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[6:13] * PiBot sets mode +v Syliss
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[6:14] * PiBot sets mode +v smw
[6:14] * androidbruce (~androidbr@ Quit (Read error: No route to host)
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[6:15] * PiBot sets mode +v danieldaniel_
[6:17] <des2> Yeah I don't thing there will really be a PiPuck.
[6:17] <GabrialDestruir> PiPuck? >.>
[6:18] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[6:18] <des2> Solid black mass.
[6:18] <des2> With connectors.
[6:18] * curahack (~michel@sub-190-88-65ip211.rev.onenet.an) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[6:22] <Ben64> nimh batteries are cool with being hooked up in parallel, right?
[6:22] <des2> sometimes.
[6:22] <Ben64> elaborate?
[6:23] * Maroni (~user@178-165-206-025.dyn.orange.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:23] * PiBot sets mode +v Maroni
[6:24] <des2> Same cells ?
[6:24] <Ben64> yeah
[6:25] <kyzz> Anyone here use Quassel?
[6:25] <Ben64> i'm making a mintyboost type thing, but i want to use more than 2 batteries to give it more efficiency and life
[6:29] <des2> Will you be charging the pack with the batteries in parallel ?
[6:30] <des2> Or just putting already charged batteries together in parallel ?
[6:31] <des2> And is it a pure parallel design or a series-parallel ? (cells in series and parallel) ?
[6:32] <oldtopman> Ben64: Reclargables?
[6:32] <oldtopman> And an actual mintyboost or something you're making yourself?
[6:33] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:33] * PiBot sets mode +v Tachyon
[6:35] * Kyzz_ (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:35] * PiBot sets mode +v Kyzz_
[6:38] <Kyzz_> Hello
[6:38] * z1l0g (~jgw@ has joined #raspberrypi
[6:38] * PiBot sets mode +v z1l0g
[6:39] * Kyzz_ (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[6:39] * PiBot sets mode +v Kyzz_
[6:39] <des2> Hi Kyzz
[6:39] <Kyzz_> just testing a new client
[6:41] * kyzz (18a6516d@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[6:41] * Kyzz_ is now known as kyzz
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[6:44] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[6:46] <Ben64> des2: series-parallel
[6:47] <Ben64> i was thinking 8 batteries, putting out ~4.8v at double amperage would be pretty good
[6:47] <des2> So you'll have say 4 NiMH in series then connect several of the series strings in parallel ?
[6:47] <Ben64> the normal mintyboost design is 2 batteries in series, giving 3v
[6:48] * kyzz (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) has left #raspberrypi
[6:48] <Ben64> but when stepped up to 5v, it takes a lot more current
[6:48] * kyzz (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:48] * PiBot sets mode +v kyzz
[6:48] <des2> The problem occurs when you try to charge NiMH in parallel.
[6:48] <des2> Which doesn't work well.
[6:48] <des2> If you can charge the series strings individually that's ok.
[6:49] <Ben64> yeah i wouldn't charge them like that
[6:49] <Ben64> just for when i want to take my pi on the go
[6:50] <Ben64> and i guess it'd make a pretty awesome cell phone charger too
[6:50] <kyzz> I'm off to bed goodnight all
[6:53] * mcinerney (~jsmith@peter.mcinerney.id.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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[7:08] <piofcube> Just got an email from Farnell... shipping date moved from 23rd April to 14th May
[7:10] <a5m0> mine moved from may 5 to may 11, but i didn't get an email, just from checking my order status
[7:10] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[7:11] <jojo> i see you can not get to the product page now even by clicking the line in your existing order
[7:11] <Da|Mummy> ive yet to get any shipping estimate
[7:12] <piofcube> I guess at least it does mean they are checking with the factory at some point
[7:13] <des2> I guess they are adjusting the delivery dates based on the capacity of the factory
[7:13] <des2> Among the 100,000 or so orders
[7:13] <piofcube> yeah
[7:13] <piofcube> or so...
[7:13] <unkle_george__> Anybody here got the Qemu emulator to run yet? http://www.cnx-software.com/2012/02/18/raspberry-pi-releases-1st-sd-card-image-debian-how-to-use-it-in-the-emulator/
[7:14] <DaQatz> Yeah I can run deb in it fine.
[7:14] <unkle_george__> Seems the CPU isn't in the 0.14.1 qemu that's on Ubuntu
[7:14] <DaQatz> You probably need a newer version.
[7:16] <jojo> try with arm1136-r2 first
[7:18] <DaQatz> I wonder how hard it would be to make a build farm out of pi's.
[7:18] <jojo> also see http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/official-image-and-qemu
[7:19] <jojo> there is an alarming number of different qemu bugs around
[7:19] <DaQatz> yes there are
[7:19] <des2> I don't think they're powerful enough to milk cows DaQatz.
[7:20] <DaQatz> des2, cow milking can be done completely maniacally.
[7:20] <DaQatz> trust me. I grew up on a dairy farm.
[7:20] <des2> heh
[7:21] <DaQatz> Oh and pasteurized homogenized milk tastes rotted next to fresh raw.
[7:21] <DaQatz> Took me years after the farm closed to be able to drink milk again
[7:22] <des2> Is it the pasteurization or the homogenization ?
[7:23] <DaQatz> well pasteurization cooks it chnaging the flavor a lot.
[7:23] <DaQatz> And homogenization well does the same.
[7:23] <DaQatz> Then it sits in bottle for god knows how long before you get it.
[7:27] <des2> I onlylike the kind from chocolate coaws anyway...
[7:27] <unkle_george__> Just pulled Qemu git HEAD and it doesn't compile... LOL, yeah. I need 0.15 have 0.14
[7:28] <DaQatz> Chocolate cows are only good for milk. While the milk is awesome the beef leaves a lot to be desired.
[7:29] * Da|Mummy (~Veki@cpe-76-190-200-98.neo.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[7:44] * PiBot sets mode +v scanf
[7:44] <scanf> where can i buy a raspberry pi?
[7:45] <scanf> not waitlists
[7:46] <des2> As the 10,000 apparently haven.t made it through UK custons yet nowehre apparently.
[7:52] * Faperdaper (~Faperdape@dhcp-077-250-027-109.chello.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:52] * PiBot sets mode +v Faperdaper
[7:55] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
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[8:00] * PiBot sets mode +v MystX
[8:00] * Mavy-bnc is now known as Mavy
[8:03] <DaQatz> You know the human body is so inefficient. For example right now I have to pee, and I'm also thirsty.
[8:03] <hbro> lol
[8:03] <hbro> waste of energy that could be internally recycled
[8:04] <Mavy> SO your body is not inefficient, you are ;)
[8:04] <DaQatz> Mavy, External loop backs are also inefficient.
[8:05] <DaQatz> Why plug your audio out into the mic?
[8:05] <Mavy> external looping allows for extra cooling of the liqiud resulting in a more refreshing drink ;)
[8:05] <Mavy> THats just silly, why would you do that :P
[8:06] * rpiloose (~luser@ has joined #raspberrypi
[8:06] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[8:06] <DaQatz> Mavy, I seen hardware that required it.
[8:06] <DaQatz> just a similar example.
[8:06] <Mavy> :P
[8:07] <DaQatz> Had an old ati tv card, had to plug it's audio out into the sounds cards mic. Other wise you would have no sound. Lucky the board ALSO had a mic input.
[8:08] <DaQatz> Still took an external loop.
[8:08] <DaQatz> Which was analog. and degraded the quality.
[8:08] <DaQatz> Well I guess you could also have gotten an extra set of speakers.
[8:10] <swp_> grrr @Farnell
[8:11] <des2> People in the Space Staion drink their pee - well after it has been passed through a machine anyway.
[8:12] <DaQatz> If it's filtered right it's not issue.
[8:12] <DaQatz> After yout pure spring water was someone elses pee 100 years ago.
[8:12] <rm> that's how most TV tuner cards operated up until recently
[8:12] <DaQatz> Nature is the ultimate filter aye?
[8:13] <des2> You had to pee in them ?
[8:13] * TC14 (~tc14@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[8:13] * jumpkick (~jumpkick@206-248-184-10.dsl.teksavvy.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:13] * PiBot sets mode +v jumpkick
[8:13] <jumpkick> anyone know where I can find the arch linux distro kernel already extracted?
[8:14] <Ben64> why
[8:14] <jumpkick> I want to boot qemu
[8:14] <DaQatz> What os you running?
[8:15] <jumpkick> Host: Ubuntu Guest: ARCH
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[8:15] * PiBot sets mode +v TC14
[8:15] <DaQatz> Well then.
[8:16] <jumpkick> I wish the Debian versatile kernel would boot on QEMU...
[8:16] <DaQatz> extract the image.
[8:16] <DaQatz> then dd if=arch_image.img of=part1 skip=1 count=195311
[8:16] <DaQatz> and part1 will be the boot partition
[8:17] <DaQatz> mount -o loop part1 /Anywhere
[8:17] <DaQatz> Grab the kernel
[8:17] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[8:17] <jojo> that is pointless
[8:17] <jumpkick> DaQatz: lemme try that
[8:18] <DaQatz> jojo how so?
[8:18] <jojo> for one thing, mount -oloop,offset=512 will work on the .img
[8:18] <jojo> so no need to extract the partition first
[8:18] <DaQatz> Ah I guess
[8:18] <jojo> secondly, the Pi kernel will not boot in qemu
[8:18] <DaQatz> I personally do not like images I don't want changed
[8:19] <DaQatz> to mount*
[8:19] <jojo> mount -roloop,offset=512
[8:20] <DaQatz> Yeah guess that would work.
[8:24] <jojo> debian vmlinuz-2.6.32-5-versatile does work in qemu
[8:24] <jumpkick> lol??? well that's a fail??? copied out kernel.img can't get QEMU to boot it
[8:24] <jumpkick> jojo: it does!
[8:24] <DaQatz> <jojo> secondly, the Pi kernel will not boot in qemu
[8:24] <jumpkick> ?
[8:24] * Spikey (~chatzilla@cpc23-slam6-2-0-cust241.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:24] * PiBot sets mode +v Spikey
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[8:25] * PiBot sets mode +v Kostic
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[8:25] * PiBot sets mode +v Tachyon
[8:25] <jumpkick> I just tried vmlinuz-3.2.0-1-versatile and it doesn't work w/ QEMU that's for sure??? unrecognized cpu-type with arm11mpcore
[8:25] * Kostic (~Kostic@net24-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) Quit (Client Quit)
[8:26] <jumpkick> if you pull the cpu type out, then it says uncompressing kernel and just dies there without booting
[8:26] <jumpkick> DaQatz: The Pi Kernel does boot in QEMU
[8:27] <DaQatz> That's what I was just told.
[8:27] <jumpkick> you need to use trunk from Git for QEMU
[8:28] <DaQatz> I really want the hardware so I can experiment.
[8:28] <jumpkick> Problem with the damn Pi kernel is it's module bare
[8:28] <jojo> i can not find vmlinuz-3.2.0-1-versatile on ftp.debian
[8:29] <jumpkick> jojo: testing
[8:29] <jumpkick> it won't boot anyway
[8:29] <jojo> you say it will not boot; i was going to investigate why
[8:30] <jumpkick> @jojo -> http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/linux-image-3.2.0-1-versatile fail with unrecognized processor type
[8:30] <jumpkick> if you could get qemu to boot it you'd be my hero...
[8:30] <jojo> "The Linux kernel 3.2 and modules for use on Versatile systems (PB, AB, Qemu)."
[8:30] <jumpkick> I'm trying to get usb passthrough working so I can test with a a usb thermometer
[8:31] <jojo> certainly sounds like it should work in qemu...
[8:34] <magn3ts> any chance I could use an rfid reader with the raspberry pi?
[8:34] <des2> http://www.cnx-software.com/2012/02/18/raspberry-pi-releases-1st-sd-card-image-debian-how-to-use-it-in-the-emulator/
[8:34] <magn3ts> and control a tiny motor? I want to unlcok my dorm room door
[8:34] <des2> magn3ts just buy an arduino...
[8:35] <magn3ts> des2: I was going to before I learned about rasppi
[8:35] <des2> In fact I believe I've seen that exact arduino project
[8:35] <des2> rfid door opening
[8:35] <magn3ts> it's only one thing I wanted to do with it, and I'd rather not buy both :)
[8:35] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[8:35] <magn3ts> the raspPi offers a lot of fun options to
[8:36] <magn3ts> too*
[8:36] <magn3ts> network requested door opening
[8:36] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[8:36] <des2> http://arduino.cc/blog/2010/05/21/really-cheap-rfid-door-opener/
[8:36] <des2> heh
[8:36] <magn3ts> I know, I've seen half a dozen of those ;)
[8:36] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) Quit (Quit: shirro)
[8:37] <magn3ts> actually....
[8:37] <magn3ts> This is perfect.
[8:37] * shirro (~shirro@ppp102-6.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:37] * shirro (~shirro@ppp102-6.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Changing host)
[8:37] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:37] * PiBot sets mode +v shirro
[8:37] * PiBot sets mode +v shirro
[8:37] <des2> Motor controlling on the arduino will be easier than on the pi
[8:37] <des2> But something like the Gertboard is what you need
[8:37] * Spikey (~chatzilla@cpc23-slam6-2-0-cust241.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[8:37] <magn3ts> Tiny linux kernel (no libc even necessary), + golang webserver = nothing sticking out the door and no need for my rfid badge, I just need my phone
[8:38] <jumpkick> jojo: http://pastebin.ca/2124786 -> this boots for me
[8:38] <des2> Of course the Gertboard costs more than a shipped chinese arduino clone ($19)
[8:38] <magn3ts> I know, I promise ;)
[8:39] <magn3ts> I think I'm probably going to grab an arduino for the summer project(s) as well
[8:40] <jojo> zImage_3.1.9 is the kernel i would have recommended if you had asked for one
[8:41] <jojo> i still can not find out where to download debian 3.2.0-1-versatile
[8:41] <des2> http://www.ebay.com/itm/EKitsZone-UNO-ATMEGA328-ATMEGA8U2-Compatible-Arduino-UNO-/290656044777?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43ac7346e9
[8:42] <magn3ts> I want networking
[8:42] <magn3ts> and high level language ;)
[8:42] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:42] * PiBot sets mode +v Tachyon
[8:43] <des2> Some of us consdider C to be high-level ;-)
[8:43] <magn3ts> you're a braver manlier man than I ;)
[8:43] <des2> heh
[8:44] <jumpkick> jojo: http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/linux-image-3.2.0-1-versatile -> scroll down to Architecture: armel, click the link, pick a mirror
[8:45] <Iota> Farnell delayed untill 14th of May.
[8:45] <Iota> Not sure I'll even be in the same house by then.
[8:45] * TheOpenSourcerer (~alord@81-178-65-1.dsl.pipex.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:45] * PiBot sets mode +v TheOpenSourcerer
[8:46] <PaulFertser> How arduino is any better than stm32 boards? ;)
[8:46] * stuk_gen (~stuk_gen@ has joined #raspberrypi
[8:46] * PiBot sets mode +v stuk_gen
[8:47] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc4-york2-0-0-cust51.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[8:47] <des2> It's ubiquitouser
[8:47] <jojo> now, how do i extract the files from a .deb (on fedora x86-64)
[8:47] <Mavy> jojo alien?
[8:48] <des2> http://www.g-loaded.eu/2008/01/28/how-to-extract-rpm-or-deb-packages/
[8:50] <jumpkick> mmm???. qemu -cpu arm926 kernel panics with debian 3.2.0-1-versatile, least it uncompresses though
[8:51] <jumpkick> -> http://pastebin.ca/2124787
[8:51] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:51] * PiBot sets mode +v koaschten
[8:53] * garma (~NJ@cpc6-sotn11-2-0-cust198.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:53] * PiBot sets mode +v garma
[8:54] <des2> magn3ts checkout this cheap breakout board for the Pi: http://shop.ciseco.co.uk/slice-of-pi/
[8:54] <magn3ts> cool
[8:55] <jojo> vmlinuz-3.2.0-1-versatile boot logo is BGR inverted in qemu, where vmlinuz-2.6.32-5-versatile was fine
[8:56] <jumpkick> updated the qemu boot instructions with who to get console debug info into the serial line http://pastebin.ca/2124788
[8:56] <jumpkick> I'm wondering if I need to provide a ramdisk for vmlinuz-3.2.0-1-versatile
[8:56] <jumpkick> ?
[8:57] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[8:57] <jumpkick> jojo: can I see your append?
[8:57] * jumpkick is sleeeepy
[8:58] <jojo> you need to build an initrd with ext4.ko and maybe a few others
[8:59] * khildin (~khildin@ip-80-236-227-45.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:59] * PiBot sets mode +v khildin
[8:59] * zamabe (~zamabe@unaffiliated/zamabe) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:59] * PiBot sets mode +v zamabe
[8:59] * no-name- (~no-name@ has joined #raspberrypi
[8:59] * PiBot sets mode +v no-name-
[8:59] * gabriel9 (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[8:59] * PiBot sets mode +v gabriel9
[8:59] <jumpkick> jojo: got a command line for that handy?
[9:00] <jumpkick> if not, no worries, I'll just go to sleep and dig one up tomorrow
[9:02] * gabriel9 is now known as gabriel9|work
[9:02] * HighJumpKick (d1fc1068@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[9:02] * PiBot sets mode +v HighJumpKick
[9:03] * jzaw (~jzaw@macbook.dzki.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:03] * PiBot sets mode +v jzaw
[9:03] * HighJumpKick (d1fc1068@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Client Quit)
[9:06] * wej (~j@m2.mullvad.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[9:06] * jardiamj (~jardiamj@rdbk.p5-136.molalla.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[9:06] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:06] * PiBot sets mode +v iMatttt
[9:08] <jojo> jumpkick: update-initramfs -c -k 3.2.0-1-versatile i think
[9:08] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[9:08] <jumpkick> jojo thx
[9:11] * wej (~j@m2.mullvad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:11] * PiBot sets mode +v wej
[9:16] * ru55377 (~rthicking@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:16] * PiBot sets mode +v ru55377
[9:17] * wej (~j@m2.mullvad.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[9:18] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:18] * PiBot sets mode +v M0GHY
[9:18] <Mowee> Morning o/
[9:21] * siulas (~siulas@ Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[9:22] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:22] * zamabe (~zamabe@unaffiliated/zamabe) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[9:26] * khildin (~khildin@ip-80-236-227-45.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[9:26] * wej (~j@m2.mullvad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:26] * PiBot sets mode +v wej
[9:32] <jojo> 3.2.0-1-versatile is working with debian6-17-02-2012 and archlinuxarm-01-03-2012
[9:32] <lennard> ugh, farnell set my shipping date to week 20
[9:33] <dwery> lennard: you lucky one!
[9:33] <lennard> how is that lucky? :P
[9:33] <dwery> week 21 here :D
[9:34] <Mavy> week 16 here :D
[9:34] <Mavy> :P
[9:34] * MystX (~MystX@49-50-247-177.a.hd.net.nz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[9:36] * dwery looks at Mavy with anger
[9:36] <dwery> :D
[9:36] <Mavy> If all goes well, i should be getting the rpi a new phone and a new tablet in the same week :)
[9:37] <des2> Which has the more powerful cpu and most memory - the phone or the Pi ?
[9:38] * codesnow (~snow@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:38] * PiBot sets mode +v codesnow
[9:38] <Mavy> the phone :P
[9:38] * Kostic (~Kostic@net24-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:38] * PiBot sets mode +v Kostic
[9:39] * paul_- (~paul@c122-107-114-210.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:39] * PiBot sets mode +v paul_-
[9:40] * brougham (brougham@wintermute.brougham.info) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[9:41] * Syliss (~Syliss@adsl-108-201-91-124.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[9:42] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[9:42] <des2> Clearly Phones just need to come with USB connectors to connect keybards and mice.
[9:43] <Kostic> Who do I need to kill to acquire one RasPi box?
[9:43] <des2> Apparently Mavy.
[9:43] * codesnow (~snow@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[9:43] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:43] * PiBot sets mode +v cosh
[9:43] <des2> He's week 16
[9:43] * Mavy runs and hides /o
[9:44] <Kostic> Uh, is there any information about the second batch?
[9:44] * brougham (brougham@wintermute.brougham.info) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:44] * PiBot sets mode +v brougham
[9:46] <des2> I don't think there's a 'second batch' so much as continouus production
[9:46] <des2> Say maybe 20,000/per week
[9:46] <Kostic> Yes. :D
[9:46] <des2> Which is why people are getting spread out dates
[9:47] <dwery> do we have stats on the number of orders?
[9:47] <des2> No, but I would guess at leadt 100,000.
[9:48] <des2> A lot more 'expressions of interest' apparently
[9:48] <des2> But a lot of people expressed interest in multiple palces
[9:48] <Kostic> Will the Foundation introduce one new company wich will cover the Balkan region? I am not very happy with the list of countries on elinux site...
[9:49] <Kostic> *which
[9:49] <dwery> RS did not gave feedback on the interest, so I guess farnell is getting most of the orders
[9:49] <Ben64> can't you get one from export.farnell
[9:50] <des2> Yeah Kostic clearly there are issues with the alleged 'worldwide coverage'
[9:50] <rm> you "can" get from export.farnell.com
[9:50] <rm> but the only shipping method will be UPS
[9:50] <rm> and that'll be hideously expensive
[9:51] <Henchman21> i get my imports delivered by usps
[9:51] <rm> USPS != UPS
[9:51] <Kostic> So I will have to pay something like two RasPies to get one RasPi box... Damn. I'll have to chechk export.farnell. I think that there are no income taxes for merchandise whose price is bellow 65 euros.
[9:52] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[9:52] <rm> Kostic, wait some months
[9:52] <Kostic> rm, easy to say.
[9:52] <rm> they will lift the "one per person" restriction
[9:52] <Henchman21> that should level the prices all around
[9:52] <rm> and then you'll be able to get 5-10 RPis (to resell locally maybe?) and the shipping cost will not be that bad
[9:52] <rm> per board
[9:52] <Henchman21> group orders
[9:53] <rm> Kostic, I feel the RPi foundation doesn't care about me
[9:53] <rm> so I am not ordering one for 47 Euro
[9:53] <rm> even though I can
[9:53] <Henchman21> thats a lot
[9:53] <rm> what was promised is $35 + 'reasonable delivery fee', which is I checked with Royal Mail, 2 GBP (3 USD)
[9:54] <rm> and 47 Euro is about $62
[9:54] <Henchman21> wait for the model a
[9:54] <Kostic> ??k, I will wait... Have to go. See you guys. rm, ???? ??????????????. :D
[9:54] * paul_- (~paul@c122-107-114-210.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[9:54] <rm> :)
[9:54] <rm> ???? ????????????????
[9:55] <Kostic> ??????, ???????????????????? ???? ??????????????.
[9:55] * Kostic (~Kostic@net24-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has left #raspberrypi
[9:55] <mjr> ????????????????
[9:55] <dwery> rm: I'm paying 47 eur too including VAT and 9 EUR for the shipping
[9:55] <dwery> it looks reasonable to me.
[9:56] <rm> you are paying to the intermediaries more than the board itself...
[9:56] * roteiro (~roteiro@dslb-178-004-231-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:56] * PiBot sets mode +v roteiro
[9:56] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:56] * PiBot sets mode +v sraue
[9:57] <dwery> rm: do you have VAT there?
[9:57] <AidyFS> ?2 is a little on the cheap side for delivery
[9:57] <rm> we have local VAT, but Farnell does not charge VAT
[9:58] <rm> I am in Russia, i.e. outside of EU, i.e. no EU VAT charged
[9:58] <AidyFS> ... particularly as far as russia.
[9:58] * garma (~NJ@cpc6-sotn11-2-0-cust198.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[9:58] <dwery> rm: right. so most of your price comes from shipping I guess
[9:58] <rm> AidyFS, http://www.royalmail.com/delivery/delivery-options-international/airmail/prices
[9:58] <rm> Prices to Europe (includes EU countries, Eastern Europe and Russia)
[9:59] <rm> 141 - 160[gram] ??1.93
[9:59] <dwery> electronics distributors only ship with couriers
[9:59] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[9:59] <AidyFS> right, but plus packaging? And presumably you'd want that sent via some sort of tracked method?
[10:00] <rm> dwery, and my dog only eats caviar for breakfast, so?:)
[10:00] <dwery> if you were a distributor, you won't ship with any other method too ;)
[10:00] * BCMM (~ben@unaffiliated/bcmm) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:00] * PiBot sets mode +v BCMM
[10:01] <AidyFS> "reasonable" and "cheapest" aren't the same thing :)
[10:01] <dwery> how much they quoted for shipping?
[10:01] <rm> 20 euro shipping, and here's the best part: it's flat rate for up to 10 KG
[10:02] <dwery> ups or fedex?
[10:02] <rm> no idea
[10:02] <dwery> if you consider that within most EU it is 9 EUR I guess that shipping to Russia it's a bit higher
[10:02] <rm> in fact, the Farnell website says "shipping is 20 Euro regardless of the shipping method"
[10:03] <rm> don't know how's that possible
[10:03] <rm> in any case, shipping 200 gram should cost less than shipping 10 KG, but it doesn't
[10:03] <dwery> even if you don't pay VAT, the company that does an export from EU to russia pays some fees in order to have the export documentation handled
[10:03] <rm> or I should be allowed to order 10 KG of raspberry Pi, which I'm not
[10:04] <rm> 10 KG shipped by courier with tracking etc, for 20 Euro, is a great deal
[10:04] <rm> no argument here
[10:04] <rm> but for a 27 Euro 200 gram device to pay 20 euro for shipping, is ridiculous
[10:05] <dwery> I think that other fees plays a role here, rather than simple shipping
[10:05] <rm> it's listed as Shipping fee
[10:05] * oberling_ is now known as oberling
[10:05] <dwery> it always is
[10:05] <dwery> but you should read as shipping + handling + export
[10:06] <rm> also remember how Chinese and HongKong shops are willing to ship you even $1 widgets for free
[10:06] <rm> or $200 tablets
[10:06] <dwery> and you'r eluck it is not considered as a GPS device :D
[10:06] <rm> why does it have to be more complex in Europe? :)
[10:06] <dwery> lucky*
[10:06] <dwery> because we have rules ;)
[10:06] <rm> you mean the customs...
[10:07] * Kostic (~Kostic@net24-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:07] * PiBot sets mode +v Kostic
[10:07] <dwery> I buy from dealextreme too.. it takes from 1 to two months...
[10:07] <b00zi> hehe
[10:07] <Kostic> Hi, again. Farnell doesn't list my country but RS Components do. But, what to write in the company box? "home"?
[10:07] <des2> Dealextreme takes so long to ship I stipped ordering from them.
[10:08] * zamabe (~zamabe@unaffiliated/zamabe) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:08] * PiBot sets mode +v zamabe
[10:08] <b00zi> took about two weeks for me dwery
[10:08] <rm> Kostic, I put "-" there
[10:08] <dwery> b00zi: it's pretty random
[10:08] <Kostic> I wrote "home"...
[10:08] <dwery> anyway, yes, in EU it's complicated
[10:09] <Kostic> What about the screen? Is the N900 LCD screen a good solution or?
[10:10] * AidyFS still gets the "register here for interest" on rs
[10:12] * Kostic (~Kostic@net24-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[10:13] <rm> AidyFS, you can create an account with RS
[10:13] <rm> I suppose that's what he was doing
[10:14] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:14] * PiBot sets mode +v Cemial
[10:15] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) Quit ()
[10:16] * paul_- (~paul@123-243-25-153.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:17] * Lord_DeathMatch (Lord_Death@CPE-60-229-48-229.lns7.ken.bigpond.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:18] * wej (~j@m2.mullvad.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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[10:23] * no-name- (~no-name@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[10:25] * PiBot sets mode +v no-name-
[10:27] * MrWatson (~MrW@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:28] * MikeJ1971 (~MikeJ1971@dhcp-13.ilrt.bris.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:35] * kyzz (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[10:35] * Kevin_ (~Kevin@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
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[10:38] * DDave| (~DDave@krsn-4d0b8f01.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Client Quit)
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[10:47] * lars_t_h (~lars_t_h@002128121047.mbb.telenor.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:47] * Kyzz (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:47] * PiBot sets mode +v Kyzz
[10:49] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:49] * PiBot sets mode +v h0llywood1
[10:50] <h0llywood1> Hi all
[10:50] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ has joined #raspberrypi
[10:50] * PiBot sets mode +v M0GHY
[10:50] <Hourd> hello there
[10:50] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:50] * PiBot sets mode +v LWK_mac
[10:51] <h0llywood1> Anyone received the PDF from farnell?
[10:51] <dwery> sure ;)
[10:51] <urs> I just got a phonecall from farnell germany.
[10:51] <urs> they want me to confirm that I'm actually a student.
[10:52] <h0llywood1> They said 24h for shipping
[10:52] <ahven> math quiz over the phone? :)
[10:52] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:52] * PiBot sets mode +v cosh
[10:53] <dwery> h0llywood1: sure, starting from the shipping date
[10:53] <h0llywood1> Dwery: ehe I know :(
[10:53] <zgreg> urs: so, are you a student? :)
[10:53] <urs> yep.
[10:54] <zgreg> well, well
[10:54] <urs> I'll just mail them a scanned copy of my student ID
[10:54] <zgreg> same here if they ask
[10:54] <dwery> downloaded from google images?
[10:54] <h0llywood1> Any news about that?
[10:54] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@c-67-188-110-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: pizthewiz)
[10:55] <h0llywood1> (About the shipping date)
[10:55] <zgreg> but I really wonder, again, why the foundation has chosen those two distributors that do not "like" individuals
[10:55] <dwery> no distributor likes individuals ;)
[10:55] <dwery> h0llywood1: mid may
[10:55] <zgreg> there are a few in germany
[10:56] <zgreg> internationally, it might be worse
[10:56] <dwery> probably not of the size of farnell or rs
[10:56] <zgreg> but still, it was pretty clear that raspberry pi will be mostly interesting for individuals
[10:56] <h0llywood1> Whaat? I thought they will start shipping this month
[10:56] <dwery> I think they are giving out the cash necessary to purchase the boards upfront
[10:56] <dwery> h0llywood1: no date on your pdf?
[10:56] <zgreg> they should have made some kind of special deal, to allow individuals to order the pi
[10:56] <h0llywood1> Nope
[10:57] <dwery> h0llywood1: strange, i have it on mine
[10:57] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[10:57] <h0llywood1> Ok i'm reading it again
[10:58] <dwery> h0llywood1: last column
[10:58] <zgreg> urs: do you have any due date for your order?
[10:59] * DJW|Home (djwillis@cpc1-bath5-2-0-cust122.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[10:59] <h0llywood1> Week 21
[10:59] <zgreg> urs: my status still is "auftragsnummer generiert". I wonder what's going on...
[11:00] <urs> zgreg: nope, not yet
[11:00] * canton7 (~canton7@li299-15.members.linode.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:01] <h0llywood1> Middle may for me too :(
[11:01] * canton7 (~canton7@li299-15.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:01] * PiBot sets mode +v canton7
[11:01] <zgreg> h0llywood1: when did you order?
[11:01] <scanf> no USA availability?
[11:01] <h0llywood1> Yesterday
[11:01] * [1]des2 (~des2@pool-71-190-46-150.nycmny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:01] * PiBot sets mode +v [1]des2
[11:01] <zgreg> oh, ok
[11:01] <zgreg> well, I guess that's expected
[11:02] <zgreg> I ordered on the launcg morning, though, and I hope I will get my pi earlier than may...
[11:03] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[11:04] * des2 (~des2@pool-96-232-71-147.nycmny.east.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[11:04] * [1]des2 is now known as des2
[11:05] * calibwam_ is now known as calibwam
[11:07] <rob_> have people been getting their delivery dates pushed back?
[11:08] * khildin (~khildin@ip-80-236-227-45.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:08] * PiBot sets mode +v khildin
[11:08] <rob_> mine is supposed to arrive next monday but people i know have said theirs have been postponed by several months
[11:08] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:08] * PiBot sets mode +v M0GHY
[11:08] <lennard> well, I didn't actually have a date before, so technically it isnt 'pushed back'
[11:08] <weuxel> rob_: dont even have a delivery date
[11:08] <rob_> are you UK based?
[11:09] <weuxel> no
[11:09] * no-name- (~no-name@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[11:10] <[deXter]> rob_, Yep, a mate's was supposed to be delivered in April now it's May.
[11:10] <rob_> aye, same with me except now it's been pushed back again to march
[11:10] * no-name- (~no-name@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:10] * PiBot sets mode +v no-name-
[11:10] <[deXter]> O.o
[11:10] <rob_> he ordered 2 hours after me on release day!
[11:11] <Davespice> I've heard about this push back, I haven't received the email though (my delivery date was 12th of March though)
[11:11] <Davespice> I might log in and see what it says about the order a mo
[11:11] <rob_> ultimate blueballing
[11:11] <shirro> None of these dates are likely to be real. Aus e14 doesn't give dates. I got my order in the first 12 minutes, She'll be right mate. No wukkin furries.
[11:12] <rob_> well, will have to wait until monday
[11:13] <Davespice> yeah, online the order page doesn't show an expected delivery date
[11:13] <Davespice> it only shows it on the PDFs they send in their emails
[11:13] * DJWillis (djwillis@cpc1-bath5-2-0-cust122.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:13] * PiBot sets mode +v DJWillis
[11:14] <shirro> They probably put the date out on the order page to 66 days to slow demand a bit so they could take a smoko and knock off for drinks
[11:14] <Davespice> yeah <shrug> they haven't done themselves any favors there
[11:15] <Davespice> their name is sort of being dragged through the mud over it all
[11:15] <rob_> they should have waited until the boards were at the distributors
[11:16] <rob_> all this faffing about is just annoying
[11:16] <shirro> At least they had boards built when they launched. Other great British computer companies like Sinclair would have been still designing it.
[11:18] <des2> ha ha. Good one shrro.
[11:18] <Davespice> :) fair point
[11:18] <RaYmAn> rob_: only aa minor percentage of users would have gotten boards sooner then ;) (well, 10k, but still.)
[11:19] <rob_> they were just too excited with themselves to not tell everyone
[11:22] * paul_- (~paul@123-243-25-153.static.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[11:23] <RaTTuS|BIG> mine has been push back now
[11:25] <Ben64> nobody is ever getting one
[11:26] <dwery> we're all doomed!
[11:26] <dwery> (the maya told us)
[11:26] <Mavy> grrr they better not push mine back :o
[11:26] * Lord_DeathMatch echoes "doomed!"
[11:26] <Mavy> They will not mess up my perfect week planning!
[11:27] <shirro> This would be a great time to drop the brice of Beagles. They could make a killing.
[11:28] <swp_> I'd just like an explanation from the Foundation / Farnell about what is actually happening
[11:29] <shirro> Liz tweeted that she might have breakdowns by region to publish tomorrow
[11:29] <des2> The real doomed are the Chinese workers that are going to have to do 23 hour days to get these out.
[11:29] <shirro> Of sales I imagine. Not arrivals
[11:30] <Davespice> RaYmAn: I think I might be in the minority, but my order was put in at about 8 am on launch day, 2 hours after launch
[11:30] <Davespice> so who knows <shrug>
[11:30] <shirro> des2: They are queued up by the thousands for the luxury of being our slave labourers. When they tell their kids they won't believe it.
[11:31] <des2> I wonder how many Cotton Candy's are preordered: http://store.cstick.com/
[11:32] <Hourd> Davespice: your delivery is 12th march? and you ordered at 8am?
[11:32] <Davespice> that is what the PDF says, I ordered through the Farnell Export site though, maybe that made a difference?
[11:32] <Davespice> it says W/C 12th March (so anytime that week it could mean)
[11:33] <Hourd> hmmm i ordered through uk site well before 8am and my date is in may
[11:33] <Hourd> meh
[11:33] * Davespice shrugs
[11:33] <Davespice> maybe they haven't send me an email yet then
[11:34] * rob_ (~rob@dust.cx) has left #raspberrypi
[11:34] <zgreg> des2: that thing seems quite overpriced
[11:35] <zgreg> des2: it's basically a beagleboard with less peripherals and connectivity, yet more expensive...
[11:35] <Hourd> it seems pretty random
[11:35] <zgreg> err, pandaboard
[11:35] <KaiNeR> i just ordered my raspberry pi from farnell, yey
[11:36] <KaiNeR> the price was higher that i previously thought like but not by much
[11:36] <shirro> My order was completed at 6:12 GMT. No delivery estimate given. Don't care too much since nobody else has got one either.
[11:36] <KaiNeR> my delivery is estimated the 20th
[11:36] <Ben64> of june?
[11:36] <des2> zgreg I suppose the question is how much of a premium you'd pay for smallness and novelty.
[11:36] <KaiNeR> i read previously the price was going to be ??21 but farewell charged m3 ??33
[11:37] <swp_> Original price was always plus delivery and taxes
[11:37] <KaiNeR> i wonder if they include anything else with the price been that, i.e like an SD card or usb hub
[11:37] * techman2 (~gj@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:37] * PiBot sets mode +v techman2
[11:37] <Ben64> nope
[11:37] <KaiNeR> oh well :)
[11:38] <KaiNeR> it still a cracking deal at that price anyways
[11:38] <swp_> ??21 + ??5 +VAT = ~??32
[11:38] <KaiNeR> ok
[11:38] <shirro> I want a free tshirt. "I ordered a Raspberry Pi from Farnell and all I got was this fucking shirt"
[11:39] <KaiNeR> any recommendation on speedy sd cards
[11:39] <Hourd> one of them will be doing packs, with usb hub, mouse, and wifi dongle
[11:39] <techman2> shirro: har har.
[11:39] <KaiNeR> i'll probably go for one of those
[11:39] <Ben64> can just buy your own accessories, probably cheaper
[11:39] <drazyl> Maybe Eben wants a T Shirt "I produced a cheap popular computer and all I got was f'ing whining"
[11:39] <techman2> shirro: I rang them today, apparently 34k on back order for au/nz
[11:40] <KaiNeR> i've probably got most of them anyway, I just need to find them :)
[11:40] <des2> Wow 34k in au/nz alone ?
[11:40] <KaiNeR> expected shipping date is 20th of this month
[11:40] <Ben64> unlikely
[11:41] <shirro> drazyl: His could read "At least I didn't wast my money on an electric scooter like that other knob"
[11:41] <KaiNeR> i thought as much
[11:41] <drazyl> shirro :)
[11:41] <KaiNeR> i thought it seemed a bit soon
[11:41] <techman2> des2: that was the rough info I gleaned from the sales lady, however that could be asia pacfic. She seemed to think it was au/nz though.
[11:41] <Ben64> people that ordered on launch day go up to May
[11:42] <techman2> I reckon they should go straight to foxconn and tell them to stop wasting their time making icrap and start churning out pis
[11:42] * jeinarsson (~jeinarsso@uppst-kepler.olf.sgsnet.se) has left #raspberrypi
[11:42] <des2> Noew iPad coming out tomorrow.
[11:42] <des2> So Foxcon will be a bit busy
[11:43] <techman2> yeah, everyone will be upgrading from ipad 2.
[11:44] <techman2> hmm..
[11:44] <techman2> whinging in the forum about censorship.
[11:44] * Cemial (~hardcoreB@ip4da2366d.direct-adsl.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[11:44] <Mavy> techman2: is going from crap to crap an upgrade? :P
[11:44] <techman2> Mavy: yes, it's new crap!
[11:44] <techman2> gotta have the latest you know...
[11:44] <Mavy> haha more stinky :P
[11:45] <shirro> The Chinese government is probably building a city to host the RPi production as we speak. They can probably spawn a factory city and move some serfs in from the sticks in under 30 days. Lets ship them some more steel. Yeah China!
[11:45] * toxical (~francisco@ Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[11:45] <techman2> shirro: yay, destroy the Pilbara!
[11:46] <des2> I thought they were still working on a competitor: the Long USB Dongle.
[11:46] <shirro> They can have my backyard for a RPi. Won't have to mow it and weed it then.
[11:46] <techman2> shirro: move to WA, grass is non existent in summer
[11:47] * techman2 looks at dead straw in backyard
[11:47] <shirro> Southern WA gets a fair bit more rain than here I think.
[11:47] <techman2> possibly
[11:47] <techman2> not here though
[11:47] <techman2> winter is wet season.
[11:47] <techman2> summer = dry as hell.
[11:48] * basso (~quassel@pc5103.stdby.hin.no) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[11:48] * calibwam (gombos@flode.pvv.ntnu.no) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[11:49] * basso (~quassel@pc5103.stdby.hin.no) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:49] * PiBot sets mode +v basso
[11:49] <techman2> anyone see the guardian video?
[11:49] <des2> Yes.
[11:50] <des2> Wanted to see how long it took to load the webpage though.
[11:50] <techman2> yeah, nobody has done a decent video yet
[11:50] * calibwam (gombos@flode.pvv.ntnu.no) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:50] * PiBot sets mode +v calibwam
[11:50] <des2> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2012/mar/05/raspberry-pi-demand?newsfeed=true
[11:50] <RaTTuS|BIG> web access seems to be a bit slow .... but it's still early days
[11:50] * AidyFS (aidy@loathe.me.uk) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[11:51] <techman2> there's also no X acceleration.
[11:51] <des2> Also he mentions there are minor proplems but not what the issues are.
[11:51] * Mavy (mavfree@unaffiliated/mavy) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[11:51] * AidyFS (aidy@loathe.me.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:51] * PiBot sets mode +v AidyFS
[11:51] <techman2> Midori seems to be browser of choice
[11:51] * h0llywood1-Ghost (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:51] * PiBot sets mode +v h0llywood1-Ghost
[11:51] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[11:52] <techman2> will be good when they get the new server in for the site and change forum software
[11:52] * calibwam (gombos@flode.pvv.ntnu.no) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[11:55] * aos101 (adam@unaffiliated/aos101) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[11:55] * calibwam (gombos@flode.pvv.ntnu.no) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:55] * PiBot sets mode +v calibwam
[11:55] <techman2> anyone been working on cases?
[11:57] <des2> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-case-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-made-of-3mm-thick-acrylic-by-Laser-Co2-/360439728388
[11:58] * aos101 (adam@unaffiliated/aos101) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:58] * PiBot sets mode +v aos101
[11:58] <techman2> that's pretty cool
[11:59] <techman2> I like the idea of a transparent case
[11:59] * Snowl (~Snowl@119-18-16-45.cust.aussiebb.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:59] * PiBot sets mode +v Snowl
[11:59] <des2> I would prefer a Hockey-puck that you plug into.
[11:59] <techman2> hehe interesting disclaimer
[11:59] * jluisn (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:59] * PiBot sets mode +v jluisn
[11:59] <normod> haha
[11:59] <techman2> "This is the first revision of this case. I'm sure I will have to make some changes."
[12:04] <des2> http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57390964-1/3d-print-your-own-raspberry-pi-case-at-home/
[12:04] <des2> That image is so good it looks real
[12:04] * Guest72184 is now known as alk
[12:04] * CuriosTiger (stian@kenworth.bigrig.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:04] * PiBot sets mode +v CuriosTiger
[12:04] * alk is now known as Guest63148
[12:05] <mjr> Yeah it's a really nice rendering.
[12:05] <mjr> makes one expect too much of the actual product, since printed with most cheaper printers it won't be quite as nice ;)
[12:06] <jamesglanville> argh, got an email from farnell pushing back my estimated delivery date to may from april :(:(:(
[12:06] <mjr> the local city library is planning to put up a 3d printing spot somewhere, presumably they'll have a non-hobbyist printer, probably not too high end though
[12:07] * crackm (~chatzilla@brln-4d0c89fe.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:07] * PiBot sets mode +v crackm
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[12:07] * PiBot sets mode +v Mavy
[12:07] <des2> Really, printing at the library ?
[12:07] <mjr> yeah
[12:07] <techman2> jamesglanville: that sucks, there's a lot of people in the same boat
[12:07] <mjr> hopefully it goes through
[12:08] <shirro> des2: But there will be a sign next to it saying you can't download a car :-(
[12:08] <des2> lol
[12:08] * Xark_ (32717be5@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[12:08] <techman2> lol
[12:08] <techman2> plastic car.
[12:09] <shirro> techman2: have you seen a car these days?
[12:09] <techman2> yeah I know
[12:09] <techman2> they're mostly plastic
[12:09] <jamesd256> Anyone else waiting on the printrbot?
[12:09] <mjr> made of plastic, it's fantastic!
[12:09] <techman2> some cars even have plastic panels
[12:09] <techman2> i.e Nissan X-trail
[12:09] <jamesd256> there is a plastic combustion engine
[12:10] <techman2> toyota use plastic main bolt studs in some of their engines.
[12:10] <techman2> i.e if the engine has to be rebuilt the studs are throwaway
[12:11] <des2> Hey now there's making plastic passenger planes...
[12:11] <techman2> plastic rocker covers are common too
[12:11] <techman2> manifoldas
[12:11] <techman2> manifolds even
[12:11] <techman2> yes true
[12:11] <jamesd256> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_automotive_engine
[12:12] * Xark_ (32717be5@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[12:12] * PiBot sets mode +v Xark_
[12:13] <techman2> I hear they even make plastic bottles these days!
[12:14] <des2> They'll never catch on - you can't hit people over the head with them
[12:14] <techman2> that's what I reckon.
[12:18] <CuriosTiger> jamesd256: Pretty cool, but for the record, that was hardly normal plastic. :P
[12:19] <jamesd256> CuriosTiger: I am going to print one with my printrbot to prove you wrong
[12:20] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj1993) Quit (Quit: Procrast...)
[12:20] * Mavy is now known as Mavy-bnc
[12:20] <techman2> hmmm
[12:21] <techman2> my keyboard cost almost 3x as much as the R-Pi I am going to use it with
[12:22] <normod> yeah it's really hard to get under a $100 like the OLPC
[12:23] <normod> rpi + keyboard + monitor + mouse + power
[12:23] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Are you sure that we have to wait until may?
[12:23] <techman2> I got a monitor for free
[12:24] <jzu> the idea behind the R-Pi is to use scavenged input devices and a TV
[12:24] <techman2> was just the keyboard that cost me
[12:24] <techman2> I wonder if the R-Pi will work ok with PS2 -> USB adapters?
[12:24] * h0llywood1-Ghost is now known as h0llywood1
[12:25] <CuriosTiger> jamesd256: OK. :)
[12:25] <jzu> not all adapters will work, I believe
[12:25] <normod> don't forget the sd-card
[12:25] * CuriosTiger has a few spare keyboards
[12:25] <h0llywood1> I hope they will start shipping this month
[12:25] <techman2> yeah I have to get an SD writer now that my laptop died on me
[12:25] <CuriosTiger> of course, unless you happen to live near me, that probably wouldn't help you much
[12:26] <CuriosTiger> h0llywood1: I thought they did start shipping for the lucky few who got their orders in before the initial run was exhausted?
[12:26] <techman2> I have two PS2 keyboards on my shelf in the spare room
[12:26] <techman2> doing nothing
[12:27] <mjr> techman2, no reason not to. Provided you're talking about actual active adapters.
[12:27] <techman2> mjr: how do you mean active?
[12:27] <mjr> a chip that talks ps2 to the keyboard/mouse and usb to the pi
[12:27] <normod> adapters adapt convertors convert
[12:28] <jzu> some keyboards already have the USB logic
[12:28] <techman2> ahhh
[12:28] <jzu> you can use "passive" adapters
[12:28] <CuriosTiger> techman2: I don't think I have any more PS2 keyboards, but I have seven or eight spare USB ones
[12:28] <jzu> with them
[12:28] <jzu> for a normal PS2 keyboard, you really need an "active" adapter
[12:28] <h0llywood1> Where do they produce rpi? In their basement?
[12:28] <techman2> I plan on using my unicomp buckling spring keyboard with my Pi for some real retro action.
[12:29] <des2> Yeah what jzu said.
[12:29] <techman2> h0llywood1: why do you say that?
[12:30] <des2> There's 2 types of PS/2 to USB. THe cheapest type for the keboards that have PS/2 but already support USB and the more expensive for those that don't.
[12:30] <h0llywood1> A normal production would take just few days for all the board needed
[12:31] <des2> http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-Female-to-PS-2-Male-Keyboard-Mouse-Adapter-9879-/280658836199?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item415891fae7
[12:31] <techman2> h0llywood1: oh you should make some yourself then
[12:31] <des2> That type needs a keyboard with USB ability.
[12:32] <des2> This type will work with any PS/2 keyboard/mouse: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-New-USB-To-PS-2-Cable-Adapter-For-Mouse-Keyboard-/170638285813?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27bad59bf5
[12:32] <h0llywood1> Its not normal that I will get a released product in may... its not a concept
[12:32] <rm> I like how both of those cost the same :)
[12:33] * roteiro (~roteiro@dslb-178-004-231-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[12:34] <techman2> h0llywood1: the distributors have only recently come on board, up until then it was 6 people working on the Pi in their spare time and taking out mortgages on their houses to fund the first run. It's gooing to take some time for production to ramp.
[12:34] <techman2> going*
[12:35] <techman2> be patient, the lead time may come back in yet.
[12:35] <scanf> techman2: mortgaging their houses? thought it was for charity?
[12:35] <h0llywood1> OK but before talking about distribution they should care about production...
[12:35] <scanf> they are paying themselves out of the charity i assume?
[12:35] <techman2> scanf: it is a charity. The money to fund initial production has to come from somewhere though.
[12:36] * ydnab40 (~ydnab40@host217-39-57-206.range217-39.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:36] * PiBot sets mode +v ydnab40
[12:36] * Snowl (~Snowl@119-18-16-45.cust.aussiebb.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[12:36] <CuriosTiger> They're not paying themselves at all. They all have normal jobs in addition to the Raspberry Pi work.
[12:36] <techman2> scanf: they didn't take preorders
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[12:37] * PiBot sets mode +v wiiguy
[12:37] * h0llywood1-Ghost (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:37] * PiBot sets mode +v h0llywood1-Ghost
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[12:37] * PiBot sets mode +v Snowl
[12:38] <jamesd256> what I find amazing is that so many people are critical of the foundations efforts, as if they are like a corporation
[12:39] <techman2> yeah I don't understand it
[12:39] <jamesd256> people have no idea of the sacrifice, genius and good fortune that has got us here
[12:39] <drazyl> it's called ignorance
[12:39] * ydnab40 (~ydnab40@host217-39-57-206.range217-39.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
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[12:39] * PiBot sets mode +v mdavey
[12:39] <CuriosTiger> jamesd256: 8 out of ten people are <insert appropriate profanity here>
[12:39] <jamesd256> I know, the depth of ignorance will always amaze me
[12:39] <techman2> drazyl: add a big dose of entitlement too.
[12:39] * [1]des2 (~des2@pool-96-232-66-251.nycmny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:39] * PiBot sets mode +v [1]des2
[12:40] <h0llywood1-Ghost> If they get paid, they ARE like a corp
[12:40] <drazyl> techman2 true, although it seems the two go hand in hand
[12:40] * no-name- (~no-name@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:40] <drazyl> h0llywood1-Ghost that is a moronic statement
[12:40] <jamesd256> h0llywood1: so in your world view, charity employees should work for nothing
[12:40] <jamesd256> what a completely ignorant and stupid remark
[12:40] <techman2> charities don't exist without money coming in
[12:40] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[12:41] <jamesd256> how should charity workers feed themselves einstein?
[12:41] <jamesd256> doh!
[12:41] <h0llywood1-Ghost> I didn't say that, but they are actually selling
[12:41] <jamesd256> so what?
[12:41] <CuriosTiger> h0llywood1-Ghost: Plenty of other people manufacture embedded systems. Go buy one of those if you don't want to wait.
[12:41] <jamesd256> what do you propose? free raspberry pi's at their expense
[12:41] <drazyl> how about you pay the development costs to date
[12:41] <jamesd256> this is madness, and you have no idea of your own ignorance
[12:42] <[1]des2> Free Pie?! Where??
[12:42] * des2 (~des2@pool-71-190-46-150.nycmny.east.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[12:42] * [1]des2 is now known as des2
[12:42] <CuriosTiger> des2: Try a food festival somewhere. :P
[12:42] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: do you realise they've been working on this for 6 years?
[12:43] <h0llywood1-Ghost> They should have
[12:44] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Waited another year to sell it properly
[12:44] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Just for saying..
[12:44] <drazyl> h0llywood1-Ghost perhaps you could wait another year and come back when you have something to contribute
[12:44] <des2> The problem with computer projects like this is there's always something better coming out so you are tempted to redesign every 6 months and never produce anyhting
[12:44] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: a minute ago you were saying that the boards would take a few days to manufacture at most.
[12:44] <jamesd256> exactly, go away for a year, same result. Why come here to bitch during your year off
[12:45] * roman3x (~roman3x@bband-dyn214.178-40-117.t-com.sk) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:45] * PiBot sets mode +v roman3x
[12:45] <drazyl> or at least be quiet. because the grown ups are talking
[12:45] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: how old are you, btw?
[12:46] <h0llywood1-Ghost> 20.. of course for language problem I can't explain myself
[12:47] <techman2> figures.
[12:47] <h0llywood1-Ghost> But what I meant its that IMHO they shouldn't sell it before they were actually ready
[12:47] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: it's not that simple, if you'd been following the project you'
[12:47] <drazyl> so, they should somehow have funded production of 1,000,000 boards before releasing it?
[12:47] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: it's not that simple, if you'd been following the project you'd understand that.
[12:47] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: when did you hear about the Pi?
[12:48] <techman2> 2 days ago?
[12:48] <shirro> FFS. It is aimed at UK schools. They didn't have to sell it to early adopters. We should all fuck off and get a life.
[12:48] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Something like that
[12:48] <drazyl> shirro +1
[12:49] <drazyl> and what do you think the Pi is for h0llywood1-Ghost?
[12:49] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: what do you want to do with a Pi?
[12:49] * garma (~NJ@host86-166-52-206.range86-166.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:49] * PiBot sets mode +v garma
[12:49] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Nas
[12:49] <jamesd256> lol
[12:49] <drazyl> its crap for that, get something else
[12:49] <techman2> figures again.
[12:49] <drazyl> a cheap NAS box would be good
[12:49] <jamesd256> you just want a cheap nas? lol!
[12:49] <drazyl> for NAS you want GB ether plus at least 2x SATA
[12:50] <drazyl> the pi has none
[12:50] <h0llywood1-Ghost> No I just want to make a nas for learning how to do it
[12:50] <jamesd256> buy a beagle board
[12:50] <drazyl> set up a VM on your PC
[12:50] <shirro> I want a NAS with no i/o that can play quake3
[12:50] <drazyl> shirro :)
[12:50] * erenrich (erenrich@thalia.ugcs.caltech.edu) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[12:50] * PiBot sets mode +v erenrich
[12:51] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: why not get an old PC and play with that?
[12:51] <drazyl> shirro I am intrigued by your project, please add me to your newsletter
[12:51] <shirro> It would really help if it could talk HDMI CEC so I can defrag my disks with my tv remote
[12:51] <techman2> yes, excellent!
[12:51] <des2> I made my NAS with a refurb PC motherboard I bought for $20.
[12:52] <h0llywood1-Ghost> I dindnt have old arm PC sorry
[12:52] <drazyl> you don't need arm
[12:52] <techman2> h0llywood1-Ghost: you don't need ARM.
[12:52] * h0llywood1-Ghost (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:52] <techman2> bah
[12:52] <jamesd256> spooky
[12:52] <techman2> wankers.
[12:52] <Snowl> woah
[12:52] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:52] * PiBot sets mode +v h0llywood1
[12:52] <drazyl> right, now who has a pony I can have
[12:52] <Snowl> that mai waifu guy got arrested for CP 0.0
[12:52] <techman2> Snowl: eh?
[12:53] <Snowl> this guy http://i.imgur.com/oehnB.jpg
[12:53] <jamesd256> anyone see that rig in the metro the guy set up so he can tweet to feed his dog a treat?
[12:53] <jamesd256> there was a board in there, could have been a beagle
[12:53] <drazyl> no, got a link?
[12:53] <swp_> jamesd256, it's a nanode
[12:53] * techman2 goes back to his editor..
[12:53] <jamesd256> i found a link:
[12:53] <jamesd256> http://www.metro.co.uk/weird/892233-man-invents-device-to-feed-dog-using-twitter-messages
[12:54] <jamesd256> swp_: ah ok thanks
[12:54] <drazyl> thats awesome, but possibly a bit cruel
[12:54] <des2> Poor Dog.
[12:54] <des2> Sits there all day
[12:55] <drazyl> dog needs to learn to tweet
[12:55] <jamesd256> I'm not sure how much bounce and scatter you'd get dropping treats from that height
[12:55] <jamesd256> drazyl: lol
[12:55] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:56] <techman2> heh
[12:56] <techman2> I just found our cats had no biscuits left
[12:56] <drazyl> sad cats
[12:56] <techman2> yep
[12:56] <techman2> happy now
[12:57] <techman2> 16 cats take some feeding
[12:57] <drazyl> wow
[12:57] <techman2> I'm joking
[12:57] <techman2> we have two
[12:57] <drazyl> :)
[12:57] <drazyl> 4 here
[12:57] <des2> If you see two there are really lots more!
[12:58] <techman2> one of them is one we rescued. He looks like a vampire. He is black and his fangs stick out just like one.
[12:58] <des2> Video of the dogfeeder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2OkOEffdp0&feature=player_embedded
[13:02] <techman2> cool
[13:02] <techman2> hmm
[13:02] <techman2> pointers can get confusing
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[13:02] * PiBot sets mode +v needtorant
[13:03] <techman2> that nickname doesn't bode well...
[13:04] <techman2> Element 14/Farnell seem to be pretty into supporting the Pi
[13:05] <des2> Yeah they put up a nice website
[13:05] <techman2> yeah I thought so
[13:06] <techman2> and they have a rep actively posting on there
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[13:08] * PiBot sets mode +v jol02
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[13:08] * Mavy (mavfree@ Quit (Changing host)
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[13:08] * PiBot sets mode +v Mavy
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[13:09] * PiBot sets mode +v CasperN
[13:10] <techman2> is it just me or do people always join/part in clusters?
[13:11] <jamesd256> techman2: net splits
[13:11] <jamesd256> it's not a conspiracy
[13:11] * Snowl (~Snowl@119-18-16-45.cust.aussiebb.net) Quit ()
[13:11] * jolo2 (~jolo2@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[13:12] <techman2> so I can take off my tin foil hat now?
[13:12] <jamesd256> I wouldn't just yet
[13:12] <techman2> this client doesn't notify me of splits and it's been a long time since I have IRCed.
[13:12] <jamesd256> i dunno, might not be splits, just threw that in there
[13:12] <techman2> anyone learning any coding atm?
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[13:13] * PiBot sets mode +v Delboy_
[13:13] <techman2> it does make sense, jamesd256
[13:13] <jamesd256> I have been trying to learn to use OpenGL 2.0 with QT
[13:13] <techman2> ah cool
[13:13] <techman2> how's that coming along?
[13:13] <jamesd256> it's a bit of a brain killer, all the matrix algebra I had forgotten about
[13:14] <jamesd256> good mental exercise though
[13:14] <techman2> ouch
[13:14] <techman2> heheh
[13:14] <techman2> yes I imagine it would be laden with that sort of thing.
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[13:16] * PiBot sets mode +v crackm_
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[13:17] <jamesd256> I think I am going to focus on Open GL ES from now on
[13:17] <jamesd256> the future's ARM
[13:17] <jamesd256> who'da thunk it?
[13:18] <techman2> well intel is trying to come down into ARM space and ARM are trying to move into intel's space
[13:19] <zgreg> techman2: and it seems to work for both of them. good for all, I guess
[13:20] <zgreg> did you notice how aggressive ARM has become lately, right *after* intel came out with the atom?
[13:20] <techman2> yeah
[13:20] <techman2> they're having to employ a hefty amount of silicon trickery to keep power use down.
[13:21] <techman2> on both sides.
[13:21] <zgreg> cortex-a8 took many years to get to the market, but the followups have been VERY quick in comparison
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[13:21] <des2> Now that's a netsplit.
[13:22] <techman2> yes, was going to say the same thing
[13:22] <haltdef> I wouldn't mind an omap5 netbook
[13:22] <haltdef> no android nonsense either
[13:22] * needtorant (0233001b@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[13:23] <zgreg> ARM needs to come up with some serious platforms standards before that is going to happen, haltdef
[13:23] <techman2> yeah
[13:23] <techman2> I guess that's one of the reasons Apple bought PA Semi.
[13:23] <haltdef> asus are so painfully close
[13:23] <haltdef> but, android
[13:24] <zgreg> it's a bit WTF that it's still mandatory to use board-specific patched and hacked kernels
[13:24] <techman2> benefit of ARM with tighter control of their hardware.
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[13:24] <techman2> yes, at least x86 is very standard.
[13:24] <techman2> mind you there are only two manufacturers.
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[13:24] * PiBot sets mode +v ironzorg
[13:24] <techman2> sheesh
[13:25] <drazyl> that's because when people say x86 they mean ISA
[13:25] <des2> Bios'es are your friend.
[13:25] <zgreg> techman2: huh?
[13:25] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:25] * PiBot sets mode +v h0llywood1
[13:25] <h0llywood1> Hi all
[13:26] <drazyl> the only reason why x86 "just works" is because the manufacturers are using the same reference platform
[13:26] <techman2> yeah
[13:26] <drazyl> no reason the manufacturers can't make the same decision with arm, nothing to do with the processor core
[13:27] <des2> The problem with Arm is the way it boots and the fact the OS has know so much about the hardware compare to the BIOS oriented PC boards.
[13:28] <techman2> drazyl: there's a lot more of this "we need to protect our IP" crap with a lot of SOC vendors though
[13:28] <zgreg> x86 has plenty of established platform standards
[13:28] <techman2> lots of binary blobs
[13:28] <drazyl> des2 but thats because all x86 boards are basically the same hardware
[13:28] <zgreg> arm simply doesn't have this, it's not a matter of establishing a reference platform/system
[13:29] <drazyl> zgreg that's chicken and egg tho
[13:30] <drazyl> ISA has standard because the machines all started off as clones
[13:30] <PaulFertser> On ARM everything "just works" too when you connect it to USB.
[13:30] <zgreg> sure, sure
[13:30] <drazyl> x86 has not standards, it's just a processor
[13:30] <zgreg> but later on real standards were adopted, such as ACPI
[13:30] <PaulFertser> The necessity for platform data arises when you want something more "embedded", e.g. an SPI-connected flash or soundcard.
[13:31] <techman2> I wonder what would have happened if IBM hadn't opened up their PC design
[13:32] <drazyl> we'd be using something else
[13:32] <drazyl> probably something descended from s100
[13:32] <techman2> yes, I just wonder what alternate path it would have taken
[13:34] <techman2> h0llywood1: what device are you IRCing from?
[13:34] <des2> The same thing that happened when IBM switched to closed microchannel.
[13:35] <SpeedEvil> PaulFertser: /me notes ISA worked fine without embedded data.
[13:35] <SpeedEvil> :)
[13:36] <SpeedEvil> MOAR JUMPERS!
[13:36] <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: but you needed to manually configure interrupt and port range with jumpers
[13:36] <techman2> heheh
[13:36] <techman2> I can't remember the last time I had to change a jumper
[13:36] <drazyl> gave you a better understanding of your machine config
[13:36] <des2> Yeah I don't miss ISA
[13:36] <techman2> I remember having to set bus speed and multipliers using jumpers on old motherboards.
[13:37] <h0llywood1> Galaxy s with cyanogen 9 and And chat
[13:37] <normod> irssiconnectbot on android here
[13:37] <techman2> h0llywood1: wow, isn't that a total pain in the ass?
[13:37] <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: and also if i understand it right, the drivers were really "probing" all the hardware to determine what is there, so you needed to load a driver manually (no lsisa :))
[13:37] <SpeedEvil> PaulFertser: yup.
[13:37] <des2> Plug-n-play was such an improvement.
[13:38] <PaulFertser> des2: i think you do not miss ISA because you never had to design an FPGA-based PCI card ;)
[13:38] * h0llywood1-Ghost (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:38] * PiBot sets mode +v h0llywood1-Ghost
[13:38] <SpeedEvil> Also funnies like probing one driver will assplode another card.
[13:38] <PaulFertser> plug-and-pray it was in fact
[13:38] <techman2> yes
[13:38] <PaulFertser> isapnp was such a pain.
[13:38] * techman2 remembers Windows 95 "plug and play".....
[13:38] <des2> Hey working 50% of the time is better than woking 0 percent.
[13:38] * rpiloose (~luser@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[13:39] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Better than this class :P
[13:39] <techman2> I hate typing a single text message on a touch screen phone let alone trying to IRC on one
[13:39] * h0llywood1 (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[13:40] <techman2> then again I hate typing on a Blackberry even more :P
[13:40] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Touch is better than Bb keyboard
[13:42] <jamesd256> you need a high degree of skill to be as effective on a screen keyboard as a physical one
[13:42] <h0llywood1-Ghost> Haptic feedback is a must
[13:42] <jamesd256> I'm ok, but I 'm better on a hard keyboard
[13:42] * des2 looks up the word haptic
[13:43] <jamesd256> The manufacturers seem to be corralling people away from physical keyboards
[13:43] <drazyl> he was a viking warrior
[13:43] <Lord_DeathMatch> des2 its like a squishy sensor :)
[13:43] <Lord_DeathMatch> i saw a haptic mouse a while back
[13:43] <jamesd256> not sure if it's apple envy, but there has been no flagship grade android phone with a hardward keyboard worth having for ages now
[13:43] <Lord_DeathMatch> you squeeze it
[13:43] <jamesd256> does it squeak?
[13:43] <jamesd256> I had a haptic mouse years ago
[13:44] <drazyl> most people don't want a keyboard they want teh shineyz
[13:44] <des2> I guess that's why some pople love clicky keyboards.
[13:44] <SpeedEvil> techman2: I find I get ~35wpm on my n900, which is bearable
[13:44] <Lord_DeathMatch> des2 i love my bf3 mechanical keyboard <3
[13:44] <Lord_DeathMatch> collectors edition
[13:44] <jamesd256> well, I work with many programmers and systems guys on a daily basis, and many state they would buy a keyboard phone tomorrow if there was a good one
[13:45] <h0llywood1-Ghost> I think that an hardware keyboard is slower
[13:45] <drazyl> jamesd256 yup, but that's a tiny %ge of the market sadly
[13:45] <des2> Perhaps the success of the original IBM PC was due to its clicky keyboard.
[13:45] * stvc (~stvc@ame-bb-dsl5-ws-62.dsl.airstreamcomm.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[13:45] <jamesd256> drazyl: yes. they make more profit on non keyboard phones
[13:45] <jamesd256> less warranty repairs, lower manufacture cost, more mark up
[13:45] <drazyl> des2 I believe the keyboard was designed to be as much like the feel of an ibm selectric as possible
[13:46] <techman2> des2: I am all about the clicky!
[13:46] <des2> Yes I think that's correct drazyl.
[13:46] * techman2 types something just to feel the mechanical goodness...
[13:46] * mjorgensen (quassel@nat/nokia/x-lbndqviifpdjcxqj) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[13:47] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:47] * PiBot sets mode +v IT_Sean
[13:47] <jamesd256> sending sms messages is fine, but try doing any shell scripting or even basic ssh
[13:47] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[13:48] <jamesd256> then you really need hw
[13:48] <des2> (requires flash): http://webwit.nl/input/kbsim/
[13:51] <Lord_DeathMatch> des2 that supposed to have animation?
[13:51] <h0llywood1-Ghost> I also use SSH with touch, its not bad for editing small files or do simple tasks
[13:51] <des2> I don't think it has animation, just the clicking sound.
[13:52] <Lord_DeathMatch> des2: righteo; cool anyway
[13:52] <h0llywood1-Ghost> But I can't deal with swype keyboard
[13:52] <des2> a little too much delay from the keyclick to the sound.
[13:53] * CasperN loves his solar powered k750 keyboard
[13:53] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[13:54] <des2> Do you ever run out of power ?
[13:54] <CasperN> never
[13:54] <des2> Then it is cool.
[13:54] <CasperN> and I live up in the north
[13:55] <Ben64> jamesd256: droid 3, droid 4?
[13:55] <des2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3RSFWvXKBw
[13:56] <CasperN> its a nice keyboard, but ofc there is alot of stuff that can be improved
[13:56] <techman2> another set of simulators: http://www.mrinterface.com/simulators
[13:56] * roteiro (~roteiro@dslb-178-004-231-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:56] * PiBot sets mode +v roteiro
[13:57] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[13:59] <des2> No PCjr keyboard ?
[13:59] * andatche (~andatche@mule.andatche.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:59] * PiBot sets mode +v andatche
[14:00] <techman2> I'd love to try a RealForce.
[14:01] * SeySayux (~SeySayux@libsylph/developer/seysayux) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[14:02] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:02] * PiBot sets mode +v sraue
[14:07] * h0llywood1-Ghost (~h0llywood@unaffiliated/h0llywood1) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[14:07] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:07] * PiBot sets mode +v prebz
[14:08] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:08] * PiBot sets mode +v Spikey
[14:10] <techman2> anyone here typed on one?
[14:11] <jamesd256> Ben64: I should have stated perhaps I'm coming from a uk perspective
[14:11] <jamesd256> Ben64: No UK release of Droid 3 to my knowledge
[14:11] <jamesd256> and Droid 4 is 'if and when' for the UK
[14:11] <Ben64> oh, well d3 is a global phone, so i'm sure there is a way
[14:12] <jamesd256> true
[14:12] <jamesd256> most people opt for a contract though for a multitude of reasons
[14:12] <des2> $235! http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?pid=rf_se02b0
[14:12] <CasperN> looks shitty
[14:12] * SeySayux (~SeySayux@libsylph/developer/seysayux) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:12] * PiBot sets mode +v SeySayux
[14:12] <CasperN> why black on black?
[14:13] <Ben64> who needs printing on their keyboards anyway
[14:13] <des2> "In low lit environments, this keyboard will appear to be blank"
[14:13] <CasperN> my old dad :P
[14:13] <des2> Is that a feature to keep people from using your computer ?
[14:14] <Ben64> i painted my old keyboard's keys all silver
[14:14] <Ben64> it was super effective
[14:14] <CasperN> and why the hell that horrible price for a keyboard?
[14:15] <drazyl> Ben64 super effective or super reflective?
[14:15] * Forca (~hendricks@209-254-225-82.ip.mcleodusa.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:15] * PiBot sets mode +v Forca
[14:15] <Ben64> effective
[14:15] * rpiloose (~luser@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:15] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[14:15] <Ben64> wasn't a chrome silver
[14:16] <CasperN> I can understand if this is expensive, but not the realforce http://www.blackmagic-design.com/media/799694/davinciresolve2.jpg
[14:16] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@bl20-128-250.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:16] * PiBot sets mode +v tsdedst
[14:16] <des2> That's not a keyboard, that's the bridge from the Starship Enterprise.
[14:16] <CasperN> :D
[14:17] <techman2> yeah topre boards are stupidly expensive
[14:17] <techman2> I couldn't spend that much on a keyboard, even though I love to have good keyboards.
[14:18] * victhor (~victhor@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:18] * PiBot sets mode +v victhor
[14:18] * joeka (~joe@dslb-188-104-207-055.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:18] * PiBot sets mode +v joeka
[14:19] <IT_Sean> That keyboard is AWESOME!
[14:19] <IT_Sean> ::WANT::
[14:19] <zgreg> I'm not the only one that finds those "gamer" keyboards ridiculous, right?
[14:19] <CasperN> the DaVinci Resolve?
[14:19] <IT_Sean> Bugger gaming! I want that at work! :p
[14:19] <CasperN> its awsome ;)
[14:20] * aditsu (~aditsu@119247098106.ctinets.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:20] * PiBot sets mode +v aditsu
[14:20] <CasperN> $29,995 :)
[14:20] * IT_Sean wants tha,t as well as a 3rd LCD screen
[14:21] <IT_Sean> oooh... nevermind. Not at that price.
[14:21] <aditsu> hi, does anybody know what's a "RASPBERRY-PI-B-BASIC" at element14?
[14:21] <IT_Sean> That is an abysmally STUPID price to play for a keyboard
[14:21] <IT_Sean> aditsu: sounds like a model B
[14:21] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:21] * PiBot sets mode +v esotera
[14:21] <aditsu> IT_Sean: it's cheaper than model B
[14:22] <IT_Sean> accessory kit?
[14:22] <lennard> I'd expect to have BASIC mean without case, accessory etc.
[14:22] * WASDx (~AINOR@81-229-79-162-no64.business.telia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[14:22] <techman2> aditsu: read the "kit contents"
[14:23] <urs> or maybe it's a BASIC rom. Maybe even c64 compatible.
[14:23] <aditsu> techman2: that's under "similar products"
[14:23] * WASDx (~AINOR@81-229-79-162-no64.business.telia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:23] * PiBot sets mode +v WASDx
[14:23] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca5695.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:23] * PiBot sets mode +v ReggieUK
[14:25] <des2> URL aditsu ?
[14:26] <aditsu> http://hk.element14.com/element14/raspberry-pi-b-basic/raspberry-pi-kit-model-b-basic/dp/2081316
[14:27] <des2> hmmm
[14:27] <urs> "Kit Contents: USB Lead A-Mini B 5 pin, HDMI Lead M-M, USB Lead M-F, 4GB SD Card, Ethernet cable, 3 port USB Hub"
[14:28] <IT_Sean> So... its an accessory kit.
[14:28] <IT_Sean> Which is what i said, innit?
[14:29] <des2> http://hk.element14.com/element14/raspberry-pi-b-plus/raspberry-pi-kit-model-b-plus/dp/2081317
[14:29] <des2> Also the B-plus
[14:30] <aditsu> the only place where it says "Kit Contents" is under "Similar products"
[14:30] <aditsu> it's not clear if it is referring to this product or to another product
[14:30] * KrisW (~kris@cpc7-swin14-2-0-cust99.3-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[14:30] <nuil> 700 parts per second sold?
[14:30] <drazyl> aditsu it is a kit containting the bits listed
[14:30] <nuil> means, 1mio a day
[14:31] <des2> But those kit bits are under Similar Products
[14:31] * KrisW (~kris@cpc7-swin14-2-0-cust99.3-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:31] * PiBot sets mode +v KrisW
[14:31] <drazyl> yes, that section is to search for products similar to the option listed
[14:31] <aditsu> if it is that kit, then their site is very badly designed
[14:31] <drazyl> i.e. find me similar products to these parts of the product Im looking at
[14:31] <drazyl> confusing but true
[14:32] <des2> They have three models, Basic, regular and Plus and it's not clear what accessories come with each. I'd buy the basic.
[14:34] <aditsu> if it's not a raspberry pi (although the name DOES SAY raspberry pi), then I won't buy it
[14:34] <des2> This is element-14 not a chinese clone site.
[14:34] <des2> So I wouldn't worry.
[14:35] <drazyl> it's an accessory kit, not the board itself
[14:36] <aditsu> des2: so you think it is an actual raspberry pi? not accessory kit?
[14:36] <Dagger2> the list under "similar products" is a list of properties of the current product; the idea being that you select the properties you're interested in and then ask to find other products with matching properties
[14:36] <drazyl> hello? is this thing on?
[14:36] <aditsu> drazyl: yes, but I was talking to des2
[14:37] * drazyl taps the mic
[14:37] * medelman (42ee8952@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[14:37] * PiBot sets mode +v medelman
[14:37] <aditsu> as he "wouldn't worry"
[14:37] <Dagger2> so I'm not sure why that's the only place they list the contents, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't include an actual RPi
[14:37] <des2> I'd just call them on the phone and ask them.
[14:37] <des2> They're a real company.
[14:38] <medelman> Does anyone know what is going on with RS and their initial signup list? I signed up in the first minute or so when they went live, but haven't heard anymore since their general notice went out.
[14:38] <aditsu> I'm filling a survey form they emailed me, so I'll include all the messed up things I found
[14:39] <aditsu> medelman: me too
[14:39] <aditsu> well, maybe more like 5 min
[14:39] <andatche> I signed up with farnell for "info" late on wed eve
[14:39] <des2> There's a live chat link on their homepage aditsu.
[14:39] <andatche> got a chance to pre-order yesterday
[14:40] <medelman> hmm. I need to check spam again. I just did last night.
[14:40] <medelman> maybe since i am in U.S. they are ignoring me.?
[14:40] <medelman> lol
[14:40] <aditsu> maybe the first batch of registration for interest went to /dev/null
[14:41] <des2> I did receive a 2nd Email from them medelman with a pre-order link
[14:41] <des2> (I'm in the US also)
[14:41] <medelman> grr
[14:41] <andatche> I'm in the UK
[14:41] <haltdef> I got my email on saturday from them, I'm in the uk
[14:41] <haltdef> though I don't think they asked for country?
[14:41] * joohoo340 (93b12971@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[14:41] * PiBot sets mode +v joohoo340
[14:41] <andatche> thought I was pretty late to the party, was surprised when I got the chance to preorder
[14:42] <andatche> expected delivery isn't until w/e 30/04/12 though
[14:42] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[14:42] <medelman> I must have typed something in wrong. I ordered one through farnell export later that same day. Not sure how much they are going to charge me to ship overseas though.
[14:43] <des2> @nd email came fro,m: newark@newark.chtah.com
[14:43] <medelman> but that one is expected and of april
[14:43] <des2> 2nd
[14:44] <des2> 1st email was from: rsonline@eu.rs-email.com
[14:44] * Kushan (Kushykins@ Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[14:44] <medelman> yeah I got the first one, but search does not reveal one from second source. Oh well.
[14:44] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[14:45] <medelman> Has anyone actually gotten their boards yet?
[14:45] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:45] * PiBot sets mode +v nils_2
[14:45] * Kushykins (Kushykins@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:45] * PiBot sets mode +v Kushykins
[14:45] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:45] * PiBot sets mode +v LWK_mac
[14:46] * Kung (cbd946ee@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[14:46] * PiBot sets mode +v Kung
[14:46] <aditsu> I heard some people are expecting delivery in about 10 days
[14:46] <joohoo340> I have not but i wasn't one of the lucky ones to get my order in on time
[14:47] <Kung> can anyone tell me what a Raspberry Pi B-
[14:47] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@ip6-27-210-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:47] * PiBot sets mode +v Hopsy
[14:47] <Kung> oops
[14:47] <aditsu> let me guess, B-BASIC?
[14:47] <Kung> WTF is a Raspberry Pi B-Plus? http://au.element14.com/element14/raspberry-pi-b-plus/raspberry-pi-kit-model-b-plus/dp/2081317?in_merch=true&MER=i-e1a0-00001047
[14:47] <aditsu> ah, the other one
[14:48] <des2> Element 14 has 3 raspbery PI things
[14:48] <Axman6> Kit Contents: 2 x USB Lead, HDMI Lead, 4GB SD Card/Reader, Ethernet cable, 3- USB Hub, WIFI Dongle, Mouse & K/B
[14:48] <des2> Basic, regular and Plus.
[14:48] <aditsu> Kung: people say it is what it shows under "similar products"
[14:48] <Kung> ah, thanks
[14:48] <aditsu> although it doesn't make any sense :p
[14:49] <rm> not convinced that adds up to $69
[14:49] <Kung> yeah, strange place to put the description ;)
[14:49] <rm> well if mouse and keyboard are good...
[14:49] <Axman6> well, the keyboard they link to costs $30 on its own apparently
[14:49] <Axman6> also, wireless N USB dongle ($15)
[14:49] <rm> oh, wireless kbd and mouse?
[14:49] <rm> okay, better
[14:50] <Axman6> bahahah, $45 for a 4GB SD card?
[14:50] <Axman6> i paid less than that for a 16GB SDHC Class 10 SD card not long ago
[14:51] <Kung> jeez this element14 site is awful
[14:52] <Kung> "What is the primary use for the product you purchase from element14?"
[14:52] <drazyl> world domination!
[14:52] <Kung> ah, the 6 million $ question
[14:52] <Hourd> :P
[14:52] <aditsu> I plan to wash my hair with it :p
[14:53] <drazyl> take two embedded computers into the shower? not me!
[14:53] * Anppa peels potatoes with it
[14:53] <aditsu> (it's a Romanian idiom)
[14:53] * zamabe (~zamabe@unaffiliated/zamabe) Quit (Quit: zamabe)
[14:54] <drazyl> I think it translates
[14:56] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has left #raspberrypi
[14:56] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:56] * PiBot sets mode +v ukscone
[14:56] <joohoo340> has anyone thought about the class of the sd card used on the pi as when I messed with my nook color I found a few places that said that a class 10 is not necessarily the best card for random read/write speeds
[14:56] <joohoo340> like here:: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=12964262
[14:57] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: off)
[14:58] * Kung (cbd946ee@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[14:59] <aditsu> joohoo340: apparently class 6 is better for random access
[14:59] <aditsu> people debated it A LOT in the forums
[14:59] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah class 10 crawls when used for an OS
[15:00] <Dagger2> I found C6 to be roughly the same as C10 for random access (i.e. hopeless), but the reviews I was looking at were from ~8-10 months ago... it's possible there are better C6 cards out now
[15:00] <aditsu> there was also a rumor that the pi has a bios (or something) bug that prevents it from booting from a class 10
[15:01] <haltdef> I've given up on the idea of rootfs on sd
[15:02] <haltdef> will just whack it on a usb hdd
[15:02] <haltdef> I say "just", dunno how much tinkering that'll take :P
[15:03] <joohoo340> depends on if the "bios" allows you to boot off of anything else
[15:03] <drazyl> it doesn't
[15:03] <haltdef> it doesn't, but it doesn't need to
[15:03] <haltdef> the kernel will still be on SD
[15:03] <aditsu> boot != root
[15:03] * drazyl is thinking of an nfs root perhaps
[15:04] <haltdef> 512MB SD fat32 formatted with all of the broadcom stuff and kernel on, kernel rootfs=/dev/sda1
[15:04] <haltdef> the drive I have is entirely usb powered, not sure if that'll work :P
[15:04] <aditsu> I wonder what's the maximum transfer speed on the ethernet port, I understand it's connected to the USB?
[15:04] <haltdef> yea
[15:04] <joohoo340> isnt the advertised speed 100Mbs?
[15:05] <drazyl> it's 10/100 yes
[15:05] <RaYmAn> joohoo340: doesn't necessarily mean the CPU can keep up with 100Mbit :P
[15:05] <joohoo340> ahh
[15:06] * techman2 (~gj@ Quit (Quit: If at first you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried.)
[15:07] <mjr> my guesstimate would be that you should be able to fill the ethernet
[15:07] <mjr> with /dev/zero at least ;)
[15:07] <ddss|mips> friggin a
[15:07] <drazyl> what all of it?
[15:07] * [1]des2 (~des2@pool-96-232-71-249.nycmny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:07] * PiBot sets mode +v [1]des2
[15:07] <drazyl> surely if you fill it with /dev/zero it is, by definition, empty
[15:08] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:08] * PiBot sets mode +v oldtopman
[15:08] <joohoo340> probably a good test would be to try and stream hd video
[15:08] <joohoo340> a lot of vidoe
[15:09] <aditsu> oh, if only somebody ever thought about writing a benchmark tool...
[15:10] * des2 (~des2@pool-96-232-66-251.nycmny.east.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[15:10] * [1]des2 is now known as des2
[15:10] <aditsu> something to measure the network performance.. they could call it netperf.. but yeah, we can only dream...
[15:11] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@ip6-27-210-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) Quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/)
[15:12] <drazyl> aditsu can't be done
[15:13] <aditsu> @_@?
[15:14] <Henchman21> heh
[15:16] <Henchman21> and we wont put it in the apple store for those poeple to find it or have pirate torrents tracking it so windows user wont know about it either
[15:16] * katnegermis (~katnegerm@fw.math.ku.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:16] * PiBot sets mode +v katnegermis
[15:16] <Henchman21> MWAHAHAHA
[15:16] * katnegermis (~katnegerm@fw.math.ku.dk) Quit (Client Quit)
[15:16] <mjr> aditsu, if only anyone speaking would have the equipment to run the benchmark on ;)
[15:17] <aditsu> true, but we were discussing what to use as a benchmark
[15:17] <Henchman21> netcat
[15:18] * jthunder (~jthunder@ Quit (Quit: jthunder)
[15:18] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.element14.com/community/docs/DOC-43262/l/frequently-asked-questions-about-raspberry-pi
[15:18] <SpeedEvil> Does anyone know what's up with the 'chipset' in Farnell?
[15:19] <oldtopman> motherfscker
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[15:19] * oldtopman has a batch 1 rpi
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> 2081347 - product
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> It seems to have gone away
[15:19] <des2> Since theyre in the UK I assumed those were fried potatoes.
[15:21] * khildin (~khildin@ip-80-236-227-45.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[15:21] <aditsu> SpeedEvil: I saw it too on 29, and now it's gone; I'm not sure what it was supposed to be, but some people were interested and tried to order it
[15:22] * align (~inplace@ has joined #raspberrypi
[15:22] * PiBot sets mode +v align
[15:22] * arnd (arnd@nat/ibm/x-hswutwgbosfezoki) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:22] * PiBot sets mode +v arnd
[15:22] <aditsu> I think it said it was made in the US rather than China
[15:23] <aditsu> and it was more expensive
[15:23] <flaushy_> ordered it ^^
[15:23] <flaushy_> it is, afaik, only the chip... no board no nothing
[15:23] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[15:24] <flaushy_> i cancelled the order later in the day :/
[15:24] <flaushy_> and actually it was cheaper (suprise suprise)
[15:25] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:25] * PiBot sets mode +v elmo40
[15:25] <aditsu> hm.. on the HK site it was more expensive
[15:27] <flaushy_> anyhow, i was quite happy to have ordered quite early... alas only the chipset ... so i will see when i get my pi (ordered at 8:20, i guess it will be a long time)
[15:29] * Lemon (~Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:29] * PiBot sets mode +v Lemon
[15:29] <OneFix_Work> What I don't understand is I ordered on the day of the launch and received an estimated ship date of May 10th. One of my colleagues ordered the next day and received a date of April 3rd for one order and May 12th for another (he ordered 2)
[15:30] <OneFix_Work> So, does this mean that I will receive mine LATER than someone else that ordered after me, or will I see mine at the earlier date too
[15:30] <drazyl> no-one knows
[15:30] <aditsu> same site?
[15:30] <flaushy_> i have no idea, on the phone farnell germany told me it would be 2 - 3 weeks
[15:31] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: YEp
[15:31] <Vazde> "First-come, first-served." dictionary says: "Served: To be beaten in a sudden, out of the blue competition."
[15:31] <aditsu> haha
[15:32] * Mavy is now known as Mavy-bnc
[15:33] <des2> It means that all hell broke loose and they were picking orders up off the floor...
[15:33] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@bl20-128-250.dsl.telepac.pt) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:34] <zgreg> flaushy_: same question for you, what does your order status in farnell's web interface say?
[15:35] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:35] <flaushy_> zgreg: Auftragsnummer generiert
[15:36] <flaushy_> zgreg: i do not even have a shipping date in the web interface
[15:36] <zgreg> flaushy_: ok, same here
[15:36] <zgreg> although I ordered quite early
[15:37] <flaushy_> 6:03 chipset, 8:20 pi
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[15:38] <flaushy_> i am wondering whether farnelle .de does handle it differently then other regions, since a lot of ppl seem to have shipping dates
[15:38] <zgreg> I also ordered the chipset first, and only later I noticed it might be the wrong item
[15:38] <zgreg> probably
[15:39] <zgreg> so you called farnell? did they say anything about delivery dates?
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[15:39] <flaushy_> at 8 they said it was about 2 - 3 weeks
[15:39] <flaushy_> i kinda doubt it, but it means they expect alot of units in the next days
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[15:42] <OneFix_Work> HEy, has anyone tried Geany on the rPi?
[15:43] <joeka> flaushy_ I could only register my interest, hope I'll have the chance to buy one soon
[15:43] <joeka> you already ordered one?
[15:43] <OneFix_Work> flaushy_: Where are you?
[15:43] <joeka> germany
[15:43] <BCMM> OneFix_Work: very likely not yet, but i see absolutely no reason it shouldn't work just fine
[15:44] <OneFix_Work> joeka: Try here http://elinux.org/RPi_Buying_Guide#Germany
[15:44] <joeka> flaushy_: have you seen if they offer other payment options than credit card? because I don't have one
[15:44] <beardface> piofcube: did you order the raspberry pi pcb model from me yesterday?
[15:44] <OneFix_Work> BCMM: Well, I know there is the QEMU emulator, I just can't get the network to work on mine
[15:45] <joeka> OneFix_Work: yeah, can't order from Germany at the moment
[15:45] <jojo> http://www.element14.com/community/docs/DOC-43262/l/frequently-asked-questions-about-raspberry-pi
[15:45] <jojo> "A: Sorry! We updated the data in our system so that new customers placing their pre-order would be advised of the delivery date at the end of May or beginning of June. If you originally had an estimated delivery date in March or April, your delivery estimate is still as per the original communication."
[15:45] <OneFix_Work> joeka: Not even from the "Pre-Order" link?
[15:45] <piofcube> beardface: I sure did
[15:45] <joeka> there is none on the German site at the moment
[15:45] <beardface> cool :) going into the mail today
[15:45] <joeka> I can only register my interest
[15:45] <joeka> at both sites
[15:45] <piofcube> beardface: Thanks very much :-)
[15:45] <beardface> i'm very happy with it
[15:46] <joeka> and it's like that since later on the launch day
[15:46] <medelman> At least you got the preorder link :P
[15:46] <piofcube> beardface: Great... I'm sure I will be also.
[15:46] <BCMM> OneFix_Work: basically, well-written, open-source C or C++ linux applications that don't use masses of system resources and don't use some sort of esoteric hardware feature will work on pi for sure
[15:46] <flaushy_> joeka: i used creditcard, so i dont know
[15:46] <flaushy_> OneFix_Work: germany
[15:46] <beardface> If anyone else wants one: http://rpicases.blogspot.com
[15:47] <urs> the farnell people are definitely working on *something* wrt. the orders. I just got a call from them today.
[15:47] <OneFix_Work> flaushy_: Try here http://elinux.org/RPi_Buying_Guide#Germany
[15:47] <urs> Whereas RS Electronics have not shown any activity at all.
[15:47] <BCMM> OneFix_Work: (well-written because it's possible to inadvertently make assumptions about endianness or integer size, but that sort of thing is pretty uncommon now that everything gets tested on both x86 and amd64)
[15:47] <flaushy_> beardface: is it open? i mean can i get the cad files?
[15:48] <flaushy_> OneFix_Work: i have an order at farnell, and am on interest list at rs-online, so i am set
[15:48] <OneFix_Work> BCMM: Yea, I'm just trying to figure out an IDE that can be used that's not as big as Eclipse :)
[15:48] <aditsu> beardface: you actually got a pi delivered to you?
[15:48] <flaushy_> OneFix_Work: but farnell did not send an estimated shipping date
[15:48] <beardface> no, i printed a model on my 3d printer
[15:49] <aditsu> ah ok
[15:49] <beardface> flaushy_ -> I worked from the sketchup file: http://raspberrypi.wikispaces.com/file/detail/RaspberryPi.skp
[15:49] <joeka> OneFix_Work, if I was a douche I would say: just use vim :D
[15:50] <joeka> good that I'm none
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[15:50] <ukscone> joeka: no if you were a d**** you'd say use emacs
[15:50] * Lord_DeathMatch (Lord_Death@CPE-60-229-48-229.lns7.ken.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[15:50] <RaTTuS|BIG> what did they say urs
[15:50] <joeka> ukscone, no then I just would be a douche with bad taste :)
[15:51] <ukscone> and smelly hippie feet
[15:51] <medelman> I'm curious how it will work for someone who ordered from farnell export that live in the U.S.
[15:51] <joeka> probably
[15:51] <urs> RaTTuS|BIG: oh they just wanted confirmation that I'm actually a student, so they can send it to my university address
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[15:51] <flaushy_> beardface: thx
[15:52] <OneFix_Work> joeka: Yea, problem is that the target audience (students) will need something that is a little more hand-holding than VIM :)
[15:52] <WASDx> New article on the site with 0 comments now
[15:52] <WASDx> So I assume i'm the first one to see it :P
[15:52] <flaushy_> OneFix_Work: vim is great ^^
[15:52] * Matt_T (~Adium@cpc2-donc11-2-0-cust430.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[15:52] <joeka> OneFix_Work, do you have some IDEs on your mind? I searched for usable ones a while ago but couldn't find anything I like
[15:52] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: nothing wrong with eclipse, just don't run it on the pi, run the compiled code :)
[15:53] <flaushy_> but yeah, in my hackerspace they are debating about how to use it to teach others as well
[15:53] <OneFix_Work> flaushy_: Yea, I love VIM, but the average kid is going to find it overwhelming
[15:53] <OneFix_Work> joeka: Geany is the only one I know of
[15:53] <des2> When I started as a student we had 'ed' and we loved it....
[15:53] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[15:53] <joeka> OneFix_Work: that's what I wanted to suggest to you as an editor just now :D
[15:54] <joeka> does this count as IDE?
[15:54] <joeka> That's what I use when I don't use vim
[15:55] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: idea?
[15:55] <joeka> and for work I have to use QtCreator sometimes
[15:55] <RaTTuS|BIG> vi - nothing wrong with it
[15:55] <joeka> aditsu, I think he wants students to program on the pi
[15:55] <aditsu> joeka: yeah, I wonder if IDEA would work on it
[15:56] <OneFix_Work> joeka: What we really need is something with a command reference for beginners
[15:56] <joeka> idea?
[15:56] <aditsu> IntelliJ IDEA
[15:56] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: No, IDE (Integrated Development Environment)
[15:56] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[15:56] <joeka> OneFix_Work, doesn't that 1 laptop per child distro have a python IDE for beginners?
[15:56] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: oh you haven't heard of it either
[15:58] <des2> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/gecrit-a-new-python-ide-intended-for-beginners.html
[15:58] <ddss|mips> sexy
[15:58] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: another one is drjava
[15:58] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Yea, that might work, but it's commercial
[15:58] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: IDEA has a free version
[15:59] * Maccer (~Maccer@ Quit (Excess Flood)
[15:59] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Ok, but is there a version compiled for ARM :)
[15:59] <Mookman288> Has anyone setup a circuit diagram for 18650 cells and a voltage regulator?
[15:59] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: it's written in java
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[15:59] * PiBot sets mode +v jthunder
[16:00] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Well, then that takes us back to the same place we were with Eclipse :) Unless it has a significantly smaller footprint.
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[16:03] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: I don't know of any native visual IDE.. that can run on the ARM; some java IDEs should be more lightweight (e.g. drjava claims to be, but I haven't verified)
[16:03] <joeka> OneFix_Work, what programming language do you want to teach?
[16:03] * pitillo (~pitillo@82.Red-81-39-15.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[16:05] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: hmmm I wonder if codeblocks could work.. and oh, idle for python
[16:05] <OneFix_Work> joeka: Well, that's more the point. It would be nice to give students something they could use in a number of languages...Python, Perl, C++, etc
[16:06] <lars_t_h> 1h ago Farnell,Element 14 tweeted this "NO DELAY for @Raspberry_Pi! Mar/Apr delivery estimates still stand, new dates apply to new orders only, sorry! More at http://t.co/0FlDNcEF "
[16:07] <joeka> OneFix_Work, are you going to use any particular DE?
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[16:07] <OneFix_Work> joeka: PHP, Python, Perl and GCC
[16:07] <medelman> My first NAS is being at home today. I'm excited. After my wife's laptop screen was broken, she started to freak out about her data being lost. Obviously they were unrelated, but I think she realized that her data could go poof at anytime.
[16:08] <des2> Perl?! That's child abuse.
[16:08] <OneFix_Work> joeka: Maybe some Java in there :)
[16:08] <medelman> Replaced her laptop screen last night, so now she can start moving stuff off.
[16:08] <b00zi> OneFix_Work i read there is BASIC
[16:08] <medelman> once I get it setup.
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[16:09] * flaushy_ (~nooon@p57900D93.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[16:10] <lars_t_h> OneFix_Work, a Pi needs more memory to run JRE (Java runtime)
[16:10] <OneFix_Work> b00zi: Yea, but BASIC doesn't give enough power anymore ... Python and Perl can be used to hack out easy apps that can control hardware, and Java is cross-platform
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[16:11] <b00zi> whatever happened to C or assembler/machine code?
[16:11] <mkopack> Woohoo! My shipment date moved UP to March 30 (from April 5) from Newark
[16:11] <b00zi> java = the devils tool (seriously)
[16:11] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: How were you notified?
[16:12] <mkopack> Just happened to go and check my order status and saw the date had changed
[16:12] <mkopack> b00zi: Nonsense! Every language has it's merits and it's uses.
[16:12] <lars_t_h> OneFix_Work, Gambas3 looks like a ok BASIC, but i don't like BASIC, I use C for systems programming, and FP (functional Programming languages) for applications
[16:12] <b00zi> mkopack i use sun SPARC hardware
[16:12] <b00zi> i know the difference :P
[16:12] <mkopack> Well, HELL, they MADE Java, it should work fine there!
[16:12] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:13] <b00zi> it runs like shit
[16:13] <lars_t_h> mkopack, so true
[16:13] <mkopack> you must be doing something wrong then
[16:13] <mkopack> Modern Java with a good JITC can run nearly as fast as C/C++
[16:13] <mkopack> It's not the 2 orders of magnitude slower like it used to be in the late 90's
[16:14] <des2> Yes but it's still java
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[16:14] <b00zi> mkopack i'm using circa 1998 hardware
[16:15] <mkopack> Well, WTF do you expect then!??!
[16:15] <b00zi> i see something (old) that loads instantly
[16:15] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Where did you see the date? Mine still just says "Back Order"
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[16:15] <OneFix_Work> Oh, ok...mine says March 30th :)
[16:15] <mkopack> Go into the order details
[16:15] <b00zi> compared to something java that hogs memory
[16:15] <mkopack> Not the summary
[16:15] * pitillo_ is now known as pitillo
[16:15] <des2> I think we finally found a machine the PRI is faster than - b00zi's
[16:15] <mkopack> des: seriously! LOL
[16:16] <mkopack> b00zi: Have you done ANY tuning on the JVM? You CAN set it's min and max memory use you know...
[16:16] <b00zi> des2 don't be a funny guy :D
[16:16] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: They must expect a massive shipment then. But mine says *SHIP* date, not delivery...meaning it should be a week or so for the delivery to make it there
[16:16] * stcuser (~Yogesh@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[16:17] <OneFix_Work> BTW, mine still lists the "Handling Fee"
[16:17] <lars_t_h> Java is a ressource hog, it uses too much RAM (especially on a Pi).
[16:17] <des2> b00zi it's amazing how much slower most software these days seems. I blame GUI bloat.
[16:17] <mkopack> Well, right, it's the ship date
[16:17] <OneFix_Work> lars_t_h: What about GCJ ? :)
[16:17] <OneFix_Work> lars_t_h: Or IBM Java :)
[16:18] <mkopack> Sorry if I confused you there
[16:18] <lars_t_h> OneFix_Work, GCJ - linking with a 26 MB lib? no way
[16:18] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Like I said, they must expect a bunch of them that week
[16:18] <beardface> OH SHIT
[16:18] <beardface> Sorry
[16:18] <beardface> pg13
[16:18] <beardface> OH YES
[16:18] <mkopack> "Expected Ship Date 30 Mar 2012 "
[16:18] <beardface> Expected Ship Date 03 Apr 2012
[16:18] <beardface> Was 11 May
[16:18] <mkopack> Yup
[16:19] <mkopack> My ship date has steadily creeped to the left (which is a LOT better than it creeping to the right!)
[16:19] * lars_t_h had not yet got a shipping date from RS Components
[16:19] <joeka> OneFix_Work, maybe geany is enough for your use, even at the university I always thought IDEs are just too much configuration overhead for programming exercises
[16:19] <b00zi> des2 and OneFix_Work note prstat..
[16:19] <b00zi> http://picpaste.com/pics/java.1331047122.png
[16:20] <mkopack> My second one is still showing May 14
[16:20] <mkopack> joeka: Yeah, for a simple 1-2 class assignment an IDE can often be a lot of hassle??? but for bigger stuff it makes things SOOO much easier
[16:21] <jojo> where are you seeing "Expected Ship Date" ?
[16:21] <mkopack> b00zi: Set the -Xmx size smaller???
[16:21] <mkopack> jojo: In my order details
[16:21] * Lemon (~Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:22] <b00zi> mkopack what?
[16:22] * pitillo (~pitillo@149.Red-88-16-110.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Changing host)
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[16:22] <mkopack> b00zi: by default the JVM will use up to 256MB for the Heap space??? If you're running a really small program though that doesn't create a lot of objects, you can set the -Xmx (max memory size) lower??? like 128M
[16:23] <mkopack> (on the Java command line options)
[16:23] <b00zi> mkopack you are misunderstanding
[16:23] <mkopack> and -Xms will set the starting size...
[16:23] <mkopack> ok..
[16:23] <jojo> so that means stock is allocated for you ?
[16:23] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:23] <b00zi> this is 'native' solaris SPARC
[16:23] <mkopack> right
[16:23] <b00zi> you see the java hog, that is the default
[16:23] <des2> I hope that sendmail is patched with the latest security fixes b00zi...
[16:23] <mkopack> (that's to b00zi )
[16:24] * rpiloose (~luser@ Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[16:24] <b00zi> thge older version is from solaris 8 :)
[16:24] <mkopack> b00zi: Exactly??? I'm telling you you can tune java so it won't use that much unless it's actually NEEDED to run the program
[16:24] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[16:24] <jojo> i can not even see where that info would fit
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[16:24] <mkopack> You must be running some program for the JVM to be active, right?
[16:24] <b00zi> mkopack volume control is quite important
[16:24] <b00zi> even keyboard controls for
[16:25] <b00zi> mkopack no..
[16:25] <mkopack> Or did they write some sort of app fro solaris in java ?
[16:25] <b00zi> jesus
[16:25] <mkopack> (I haven't used Solaris since V5???)
[16:26] * joohoo340 (93b12971@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[16:26] <des2> I'm using OpenSolaris for my fileserver.
[16:26] <mkopack> b00zi: Hey, I'm just trying to help since I do a lot of Java development??? But you need to be clear and explicit with what the problem is???. You're leaving info out and expecting me to fill in the holes...
[16:27] * Faperdaper (~Faperdape@dhcp-077-250-027-109.chello.nl) Quit (Quit: Quit)
[16:27] <b00zi> mkopack you cannot fill any holes
[16:27] <b00zi> it works great in solaris 8
[16:27] <mkopack> Ok, then what's the problem? Why are you complaining about Java?
[16:27] <b00zi> it uses java and runs like shit in solaris 9
[16:27] <mkopack> WHAT uses Java? Your volume control program?
[16:28] <b00zi> erm yeah..
[16:28] <b00zi> see screenshot
[16:28] <mkopack> I did...
[16:28] <b00zi> the lower one with slider
[16:28] <Thorn_> jabba is bad mkay
[16:28] <mkopack> And from what I saw to the "top" output, Java was allocating 166MB and had 20MB actually wired
[16:28] <b00zi> java 136/30MB
[16:28] <mkopack> right?
[16:28] <b00zi> right
[16:28] <mkopack> (ok yeah, something like that, going off memory of the screenshot)
[16:29] <mkopack> And it's running slow? Or you just don't like how much RAM it's using?
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[16:29] <b00zi> note 'audiocontrol'
[16:29] <b00zi> that is the one top left
[16:29] <b00zi> does exactly the same thing
[16:29] <aditsu> did they add a new distributor/manufacturer? I see alliedelec on the site
[16:30] <mkopack> aditsu: Allied is the US branch of RS
[16:30] * Lemon (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:30] * PiBot sets mode +v Lemon
[16:30] <aditsu> oh, why does it need a separate link then?
[16:31] <mkopack> Ok, so your issue here is that the JVM has to be loaded, and that takes up memory, on top of having the memory of the actual Java AudioControl application, right? that's just the way it is, You have a Virtual Machine running when you run Java. It has to be there.
[16:31] <mkopack> Or am I reading this wrong?
[16:31] <des2> Allied is the North American arm of RS electronics (Canada, US, Mexico and some other countries south)
[16:31] <b00zi> mkopack besides raping my RAM it takes 2 or so seconds to load
[16:31] * PaulFertser (paul@paulfertser.info) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[16:31] <b00zi> java is NOT efficient.
[16:32] <mkopack> Well, don't use the java version then...
[16:32] <b00zi> mkopack right
[16:32] <mkopack> If you hate it that much
[16:32] <b00zi> i don't
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[16:32] <b00zi> but i got that from sol 8
[16:32] <b00zi> java is no good
[16:32] <mkopack> Ok, then what I'm saying is there are some options you can change on the Java JVM runtime that can/will make it work faster, and more efficient...
[16:33] <mkopack> Which version of java is that even running?
[16:33] <mkopack> circa 1998 has to be around JDK 1.1 or 1.2
[16:33] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.premierfarnell.com/premier_farnell/publicrelations/newscentre/?type=press&ref=787
[16:33] <b00zi> java version "1.4.2_12"
[16:33] <b00zi> Java(TM) 2 Runtime Environment, Standard Edition (build 1.4.2_12-b03)
[16:33] <b00zi> Java HotSpot(TM) Client VM (build 1.4.2_12-b03, mixed mode)
[16:33] <mkopack> (on a command line just do java -version)
[16:33] <mkopack> Huh, surprised that even works on an OS that old
[16:34] <b00zi> heh
[16:34] <mkopack> But still 1.4 is relatively old. 1.7 is out now
[16:34] <ironzorg> java on an rpi whatwereyouthinking.jpg
[16:34] <b00zi> it's solaris, not linux :)
[16:34] <mkopack> iron: I actually got it installed on the debian image??? but there was like 0 space left on the default 3GB SD image after I installed it
[16:34] <jojo> the newark order status section must be different than farnell
[16:34] <jojo> because there are people quoting "Expected Ship Date" as late as may
[16:35] <aditsu> I am going to run java on the pi, and I'm going to be very happy about it
[16:35] <b00zi> that is ok ^^
[16:35] <jojo> but there is nowhere that text could appear with the farnell layout
[16:35] <mkopack> jojo: if you have an order with Newark, you can open up the details page of that order and it'll show your expected ship date for that order.
[16:35] <mkopack> adit: Likewise!
[16:35] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:35] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[16:35] <b00zi> gcc, glib, linux. easy stuff
[16:36] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:36] <aditsu> my element14 order has no expected shipping date
[16:36] * piofcube cringes at the thought of all those people that don't/can't update java.
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[16:37] <aditsu> they only mentioned in the email that the lead time is end of March
[16:37] <jojo> farnell has "order history" but the layout must be very different. delivery estimates are only sent by email
[16:37] * imnichol (~ian@somsen-129-165.winona.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:37] * PiBot sets mode +v imnichol
[16:37] <mkopack> Ok, current post on the Blog: "We???ve had a lot of people mail us and tweet about this today. If you were expecting a March/April delivery and got an email from Element14/Premier Farnell this morning saying delivery had been pushed back, please don???t despair: it appears to be a mistake. "
[16:37] <des2> lol
[16:38] * dlabbe (~dlabbe@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[16:38] * PiBot sets mode +v passstab
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[16:39] <des2> Clearly these two companies are overwhelmed.
[16:39] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.premierfarnell.com/premier_farnell/publicrelations/newscentre/?type=press&ref=787
[16:40] * Cromulent (~Cromulent@cpc18-reig4-2-0-cust124.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:40] <des2> I'm sure they've both had one order of 100,000 of something but never 100,000 orders for one thing.
[16:40] * Lemon (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:40] * Ocean (~Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:40] * PiBot sets mode +v Ocean
[16:41] <mkopack> des: well, maybe 100,000 resistors or something like that
[16:41] * Ocean is now known as Guest87710
[16:41] <RaTTuS|BIG> but not from 100k people at the same time
[16:41] <des2> yeah that's what I was thinking.
[16:41] <mkopack> Oh, yeah, 1 order of 100K of something year
[16:41] <mkopack> yeah
[16:41] <mkopack> They said something like they got more hits in the first 4 minutes than they typically get in an entire day.
[16:41] <des2> http://www.pinnaclecrc.com/PR_PICTURES/Premier_Farnell/PF492/PF492A_HRES.jpg
[16:42] <des2> Nice Hires pic
[16:42] <mkopack> You guys see the update that Gert confirmed with Eben that the DSI+CSI connectors ARE on the boards?
[16:43] <Mookman288> $5 shipping on a $0.25 voltage regulator, lol!
[16:44] <mkopack> Mook: Lol, yeah, those sorts of sites are NEVER good on buying just a couple small components...
[16:44] * OceanSpray (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[16:44] <Mookman288> Alternatively, I can pay $10 shipping on a $1.25 version of it.
[16:44] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[16:44] <slaeshjag> Mookman288: heh, I remember seeing shipping in the range of $35 for a single QFP packaged chip :)
[16:44] <hotwings> Mookman288 - no radioshack nearby?
[16:44] <mkopack> Unfortunately, it's getting harder and harder to find 1-2 small components like that locally??? most of the local electronics parts suppliers have closed and Fry's selection leaves a lot to be desired (although it's a LOT bigger than Radio Shack's)
[16:44] <RaTTuS|BIG> mkopack - url?
[16:45] <mkopack> RaTT: Saw it in the forums last night.. Let me go find it
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[16:45] * PiBot sets mode +v srw1973
[16:45] <RaTTuS|BIG> just woindering as I get db errors all the time
[16:45] <mkopack> Yeah, likewise, it's rough right now
[16:46] <Mookman288> hotwings: I have one near by, but I dislike them greatly.
[16:46] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:46] * PiBot sets mode +v prebz
[16:46] <mkopack> It was in this thread: http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/rationale-behind-missing-connectors
[16:46] <RaTTuS|BIG> kk - trying to load that one now
[16:46] <mkopack> 2nd page
[16:46] <des2> Error establishing a database connection
[16:46] <mkopack> just reload
[16:47] * Joohoo340_ (93b12971@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[16:48] <joeka> haha I'm seeding the arch linux arm torrent from the r-pi site: the tracker has 823 seeders and 3 leechers
[16:48] <des2> As for GPIO, IIRC that was left unpopulated deliberately because different hobbyists wanted the pins to point in different directions ? up, down, sideways, you name it.
[16:48] <mkopack> joeka: lol, not a lot of demand for Arch huh?
[16:49] <aditsu> poor leechers, they'll get DOSed by all those seeders trying to transfer the data :p
[16:49] <des2> Huge demand, that's why there' s so many seeders....
[16:49] * dnstbr (~dnstbr@rrcs-97-77-70-128.sw.biz.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:49] * PiBot sets mode +v dnstbr
[16:49] <mkopack> There was also a discussion on the forums about getting hw FP on Debian??? sounds like that's going to be a PITA
[16:49] <joeka> mkopack, but if someone wants it, he'll get it fast :D
[16:49] <haltdef> debian armhf is armv7 isn't it
[16:50] <mkopack> Yeah, so they were discussing what would it take to get it working on ARMv6
[16:50] <mkopack> Which is what we have
[16:50] <PaulFertser> Debian armhf: -march=armv7-a -mfloat-abi=hard -mfpu=vfpv3-d16 -mthumb
[16:50] <mkopack> And it sounded like it would take a full recompile of everything and hope nothing breaks along the way
[16:50] <mkopack> Gentoo is going to have to deal with that as well
[16:50] <haltdef> are the packages in the repos armv7 as well? that'd kinda kill off all hope
[16:51] <haltdef> gentoo shouldn't be an issue
[16:51] <aditsu> hm.. about the limit of 1 pi/person, it looks like it's actually 1 pi/person/distributor, so everybody could order 2
[16:51] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@c-67-188-110-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:51] * PiBot sets mode +v pizthewiz
[16:51] <mkopack> (wondering how many weeks it'll take an RPi to compile up Gentoo...)
[16:51] <PaulFertser> But that's not stricly about hw FP, that's about using FPU's registers to pass the parameters for the functions that need double. So hw FP is still used even with Debian armel, just some functions take a bit longer to call.
[16:51] <haltdef> compiling on the pi itself won't be fun though
[16:51] <jojo> same problem with fedora: they support armv5tel and armv7hl, and no plans for an armv6 port just for pi
[16:51] <haltdef> I'll be cross compiling an armv6 hardfloat gentoo if a stage3 doesn't already exist
[16:51] <haltdef> (how hard can it be?)
[16:52] <passstab> i orderd from allied as a guest
[16:52] <des2> But Fedora is the 'official' linux for Pi
[16:52] <passstab> now i don't know how to track it
[16:52] <passstab> i got the order #
[16:52] <joeka> jojo, sure about fedora?
[16:53] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:53] <Henchman21> oficially full of themselves
[16:53] <jojo> http://zenit.senecac.on.ca/wiki/index.php/Raspberry_Pi_Fedora_Remix_17
[16:53] <mkopack> I always really liked the idea of Gentoo - compile for EXACTLY the hardware you have, no extra crap you don't???
[16:53] <passstab> but the site says there is nothing
[16:53] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:53] * PiBot sets mode +v elmo40
[16:53] <haltdef> not really useful on x86 compared to precompiled amd64 but potentially worthwhile on ARM
[16:53] <joeka> jojo, right I mixed it up with something I read about red hat
[16:54] * Calyp (~Calyp@c-4f6606b5-74736162.cust.telenor.se) has joined #raspberrypi
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[16:54] * PiBot sets mode +v Calyp
[16:55] <aditsu> when millions of people have a pi in their hands, you can BET they'll work out how to use the cpu's full capacity efficiently
[16:55] * cjdavis is now known as Ebony
[16:55] <mkopack> Yeah, I hope so!
[16:55] * roman3x (~roman3x@bband-dyn214.178-40-117.t-com.sk) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[16:56] <aditsu> with binary packages available even for gentoo
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[16:56] <b00zi> aditsu no way
[16:56] <b00zi> just another tool/device to use
[16:56] <aditsu> and probably special -march and -mtune for gcc
[16:56] <mjr> compiling every package at install time on the pi would be ... interesting
[16:56] <Mookman288> I'm hoping they come up with a cheap outlet -> rechargable cell -> pi + display system instead.
[16:56] <aditsu> b00zi: you do know gentoo has binary packages, right? just not very many atm
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[16:57] * PiBot sets mode +v earthshine
[16:57] <mjr> and by interesting I mean "horrible"
[16:57] * des2 remembers recompiling all of BSD for his 486 overnight.
[16:57] <shirro> I am setting up a toolchain on several computers and going to run distcc. Just not sure what to compile with it until I get one.
[16:57] <b00zi> aditsu makes no odds to me really about how many packages there are. there is LFS and yes GNU/gcc
[16:59] * victhor (~victhor@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[16:59] <b00zi> this channel will be about 3/4 the size
[16:59] <wej> for distcc you don't need a toolchain on every computer
[16:59] <b00zi> and mostly with people complaining about stuff
[17:00] <aditsu> b00zi: oh, you meant they won't care so much about the pi? I don't think it's "just another device", it's quite revolutionary
[17:00] <stuk_gen> finally i have receive my pi
[17:00] <b00zi> aditsu yes and no
[17:00] <aditsu> if it was a $200 netbook, then I'd probably agree with you
[17:00] <b00zi> people are fickle ^^
[17:01] <PaulFertser> Are you going to do raytracing on pi? Or something other really fpu-intensive with lots of function calls?
[17:01] <joeka> stuk_gen, congrats!
[17:01] <b00zi> lots of hype stuff now
[17:01] <b00zi> yeah it is a GREAT device
[17:01] <aditsu> stuk_gen: pics or gtfo :p
[17:01] <b00zi> but the buyers don't think that maybe
[17:01] <mkopack> Paul: I will be??? Assuming I can get ROS running on it
[17:01] <b00zi> just another toy
[17:01] <stuk_gen> hehe only god have pi i think
[17:01] <stuk_gen> one question is o have receive email sunday from rs
[17:02] <stuk_gen> it say it send one after one in the list
[17:02] <stuk_gen> is it true?
[17:02] <mkopack> stuk: ???
[17:02] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[17:03] <PaulFertser> mkopack: ok, then hf abi convention might make a difference for you. But most people wouldn't notice any potential speed increase i think.
[17:03] * gabriel9|work (~quassel@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:03] <stuk_gen> first-come first-serve basis, in order of when requests were received.
[17:04] <stuk_gen> i don't understand if the request is the first pre order or a new order
[17:04] <mkopack> stuk: THat's what they're saying, yes??? So the order in which the "register interest" forms were submitted
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[17:04] <des2> stuk the second email I got from RS was from Newark
[17:05] <stuk_gen> second?
[17:05] <mkopack> des? Newark != RS..
[17:05] <stuk_gen> uuh
[17:05] <mkopack> Newark is Element 14 = Farnell
[17:05] <shirro> wej: just need gcc, g++ on each yeah? I will have scratchbox and a full toolchain on my main desktop as well.
[17:05] <des2> oops
[17:07] <BCMM> shirro: any idea how much faster scratchbox would be than distcc
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[17:07] * PiBot sets mode +v IT_Sean
[17:07] <BCMM> ?
[17:07] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[17:07] * Ebony is now known as cjdavis
[17:07] <wej> shirro, yeah, only gcc is needed on each node :)
[17:08] <mkopack> Yeah, be nice if I did decide to go Gentoo if there was a way to offload some of the compiling to my Mac pro??? That would only speed things p by about 50 orders of magnitude :)
[17:10] * jthunder (~jthunder@ Quit (Quit: jthunder)
[17:11] <shirro> BCMM: Just getting started. They seem to be able to do some of the same things. Scratchbox is probably more interesting for someone developing an application I would think. I guess distcc has the edge if you have lots of machines and are building a distro. Won't really know until I get experience on hardware.
[17:13] <BCMM> shirro: i wasn't thinking with lots of nodes. i meant, on-device development with the realy work of compilation being pushed to your desktop vs. doing the whole thing on your desktop, but incuring some emulation penalty
[17:13] <BCMM> s/realy/real/
[17:13] <BCMM> the distcc thing means not having to maintain multiple complete environments
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[17:14] <wej> yeah
[17:14] <wej> only the gcc versions must match
[17:15] <BCMM> i think some other parts of the toolchain must too
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[17:15] * PiBot sets mode +v earthshine
[17:15] <Dagger2> you still need a cross-compiler for distcc though, right? those are traditionally a bit of a pain to get going
[17:15] * M0GHY (~peterholl@ Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[17:15] <wej> if you want to cross-compile with distcc, then yes
[17:15] <BCMM> Dagger2: gentoo has a relatively pleasent system for building a cross-toolchain to your specifications
[17:15] <wej> but it really is not that difficult
[17:16] <BCMM> wej: but with such a disparity in CPU power as a pi vs. a modern desktop, i would probably tell it not to do any compilation on the pi
[17:16] <wej> and on the node's you really need the compiler only, nothing else
[17:16] <wej> BCMM, yes, that would be wise, otherwise the pi would slow down the desktop very much
[17:16] <Dagger2> ok, fair enough. I should probably actually try Gentoo one of these days
[17:17] <BCMM> the pi can handle make and linking and any of those irritating little config things some build processes use just to break cross-compiling, and my guess would be it would approximately keep pace with a nice desktop machine doing the actual CC
[17:17] <shirro> BCMM: at the moment I am cross compiling and then running with qemu. I have hardly scratched scratchbox. I am trying to find some good docs.
[17:17] <Dagger2> I usually use Debian, but... for a distro that emphasizes software freedom so strongly, it's amazingly difficult to actually change something in any software provided by apt-get
[17:18] <wej> unfortunately many software projects use the terrible autoconf
[17:18] <wej> which is very slow
[17:18] <BCMM> (ghostscript, for example, builds a native binary that it the executes, during the build process. it really screws with crosscompilation.)
[17:18] <wej> so a configure run on something like the pi can take as long as actually compiling the software on the desktop machine
[17:19] <wej> also autoconf is pretty broken for crosscompiling, but most of the time one can work around that
[17:19] * paul_- (~paul@123-243-25-153.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
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[17:20] <BCMM> anyway, i'm minded to try to install Gentoo, with a desktop as a crosscompiling node, largely because i'm familiar with it, and also because it means a huge library of software available for ARM
[17:21] <joeka> BCMM, crosscompiling node, that works?
[17:21] <BCMM> joeka: i mean, crosscompiling distcc node
[17:21] <BCMM> yes, you can use distcc with a crosscompiler
[17:21] <wej> yes
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[17:21] <BCMM> i did it once to try to put gentoo on an old iMac G3 that somebody threw out
[17:22] <joeka> BCMM, that's interesting, never thought about doing that
[17:22] <BCMM> it actually worked even though i later discovered that it was thrown out because the CPU was cooked
[17:22] <wej> heh
[17:22] <BCMM> joeka: so if i'd just done it all locally, it would have flat out crashed rather than just been slow
[17:22] * smw_ is now known as smw
[17:22] <BCMM> GCC is for some reason a really good test for cpu and memory damage
[17:22] <joeka> :D
[17:22] <slaeshjag> BCMM: Let me guess; Kernel panic due to Floating point exception?
[17:23] <BCMM> slaeshjag: nah, not that broken
[17:23] <slaeshjag> BCMM: Because that's a bug in the kernel
[17:23] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[17:23] <slaeshjag> BCMM: Linux on G3 is pretty buggy
[17:23] <BCMM> slaeshjag: compilation failures start happening long before the kernel regularly breaks
[17:23] <joeka> but I guess I'll go with arch linux arm, because I'm used to arch
[17:23] <BCMM> slaeshjag: no, it was definitely cpu or memory damage
[17:24] <BCMM> GCC actually has an error message for a class of failures that basically only happen one broken hardware
[17:24] * paul_- (~paul@123-243-25-153.static.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[17:24] <slaeshjag> BCMM: I would get all kinds of crashes under heavy load, but OSX ran just fine
[17:24] <BCMM> my guess is thermal damage to the CPU. the iMac G3 probably shouldn't have been fanless
[17:24] <BCMM> form over function there.
[17:24] <slaeshjag> The G3 doesn't get that hot
[17:25] <slaeshjag> A little airflow is enough
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[17:26] <OneFix_Work> BTW, is there a time frame yet for when we can expect to be able to order multiple units with no wait time?
[17:27] <shirro> OneFix_Work: RS and Farnell. That is two.
[17:27] <shirro> Oh, missed the wait time. Who knows?
[17:28] <OneFix_Work> ShaneHudson: I know we can order from them...but as far as I know they are still limiting the amount you can order to 1 unit...
[17:28] <des2> Who knows.
[17:28] <BCMM> OneFix_Work: i would imagine that the foundation and suppliers don't know either
[17:28] <BCMM> when supply catches up with demand, and who can predict the demand?
[17:28] <des2> When the incoming orders drom to < capacity.
[17:29] <kallisti5> shirro: May is the last backorder time I heard from element14
[17:29] <BCMM> the reason this is happening is the foundation being strict about retail price. in any normal gadget release, limited supplies would results in retailers just jacking the price up for a bit
[17:29] <BCMM> until demand lowers to match supply :)
[17:30] <OneFix_Work> BCMM: Yea, I understand that, but I would hope that by the summer they will have the supply chain issues worked out.
[17:30] <des2> Yeah that's what Newegg would do.
[17:30] * Guest87710 (~Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[17:30] <BCMM> OneFix_Work: one would imagine so. if i understand correctly, rs and farnell are licensed to actually manufacture them. they are used to manufacturing insane quantities of things
[17:30] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:31] <BCMM> OneFix_Work: iirc, RS does 10k orders a day normally
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[17:31] <shirro> BCMM: That is very stop/start like congested traffic and can kill a product. Beaglesboards are constantly unavailable and overpriced.
[17:31] <OneFix_Work> BCMM: Someone said that the rPi was being sold at 700 units per minute
[17:32] <andatche> s/minute/second
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[17:32] <OneFix_Work> andatche: Was that really 700 per second?
[17:32] <andatche> so farnell claimed
[17:32] <BCMM> andatche: second?!
[17:32] * Guest87710 (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:32] * PiBot sets mode +v Guest87710
[17:32] <OneFix_Work> wow
[17:32] <BCMM> that seems entirely implausible
[17:32] <OneFix_Work> That's insane
[17:32] <andatche> seems a bit unfeasible to me
[17:33] <aditsu> what is "w/c" in the context of delivery estimates?
[17:33] <wej> i doubt that
[17:33] <andatche> aditsu: week commencing, at a guess
[17:33] * earthshine (~Mike@cpc1-orpi1-0-0-cust99.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:33] * PiBot sets mode +v earthshine
[17:33] <wej> it most likely wasn't even close to 700 per second
[17:33] <aditsu> aha
[17:33] <BCMM> i have seen speculation elsewhere that that was in fact the number of attempts to load the order page, during hte busiest period, or something
[17:33] <BCMM> i mean that's 60 million a day
[17:33] <OneFix_Work> Well, Farnell has several units world-wide, Newark, Element14, etc...so the aggregate of all of those might be 700 per second.
[17:33] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: probably 700 page requests/sec in the first x minutes/hours
[17:34] <andatche> I suspect somebody misread/misquoted
[17:34] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Well, that's page requests...not orders
[17:34] <aditsu> exactly
[17:34] <BCMM> aditsu: now that sounds about right to me
[17:34] <passstab> the rpi does one calculation per sale XD
[17:34] <wej> yeah maybe that was the number of page requests, and that number also was higher than what it would have been, if their servers would not have crashed
[17:35] <andatche> yeah, I suspect the original source is page requests and has been taken out of context by someone
[17:35] <jzu> taking into account all those who were frantically hitting F5...
[17:35] <aditsu> check out https://twitter.com/#!/toby1kenobi/status/177023992656445440
[17:35] <OneFix_Work> wej: Farnell shouldn't have tried to run their website off of a rPi on launch day :)
[17:35] <wej> haha, yeah
[17:36] * cosh (~cosh@gateway/tor-sasl/ryld) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7)
[17:36] <wej> or maybe they should have, instead of running it on an old 386
[17:36] <andatche> looks like farnell at least will be getting regular weekly batches before the end of this month then
[17:36] <OneFix_Work> Kind of like http://www.c64web.com/
[17:36] <andatche> pre-orders seemed to be grouped by week for expected delivery date
[17:36] <wej> :D
[17:37] <slaeshjag> OneFix_Work: Or like this: http://magic-1.org/
[17:37] <mkopack> HAHAH, gotta love it??? A C64 running a web server!
[17:37] <stuk_gen> ooh good news the back order is an error
[17:38] <mkopack> stuk: Yes???
[17:38] <b00zi> mkopack far more impressive..
[17:38] <b00zi> http://zx81-siggi.endoftheinternet.org/index.html
[17:39] <OneFix_Work> wej: Actually, you should be able to cluster a bunch of rPis together for a fairly fast site
[17:40] <b00zi> 700MHz is i nsane fast anyhow..
[17:40] <urs> b00zi: I think we just DOS'd that one
[17:40] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[17:40] <wej> OneFix_Work, yeah, that should be possible
[17:41] <aditsu> wow, how do you even connect a Sinclair to a network?
[17:41] <wej> well those 700 MHz really aren't that fast, it is an ARM11 only after all
[17:41] <b00zi> heh urs lurk much?
[17:41] <petschge> urs lurks everywhere
[17:41] <aditsu> serial port?
[17:42] <wej> probably
[17:42] <wej> for the C64 there are real ethernet adaptors, though
[17:42] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:42] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[17:43] <mkopack> Yeah, plug into the expansion port
[17:43] * passstab (~v@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[17:43] * passstab (~v@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:43] * PiBot sets mode +v passstab
[17:43] <wej> yep
[17:43] <mkopack> (funny to imagine that???)
[17:43] <mkopack> The damn ethernet card probably has more buffer RAM + CPU power than the C64 does!
[17:44] <b00zi> so? as long as it does the job :P
[17:44] <wej> more cpu power maybe, but i think it does not have very much ram, if any at all
[17:45] <wej> those sd card floppy drives for the c64 also have a much faster cpu than the c64's cpu :D
[17:46] * imnichol (~ian@somsen-129-165.winona.edu) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[17:46] <slaeshjag> Isn't the CPU in the floppy drive comparable to the one in the C64 itself?
[17:47] <wej> in the original floppy, yes
[17:47] <mkopack> just about
[17:47] <wej> it is a 6502
[17:47] <mkopack> 1541 -
[17:47] * joukio (~joukio@82-171-18-219.ip.telfort.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[17:47] <mkopack> The machine gun of floppy drives
[17:47] <wej> which is basically the same as the 6510 minus that additional i/o port
[17:47] * mwschib (irc@unaffiliated/mwschib) Quit (Quit: rebooting)
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[17:47] * PiBot sets mode +v cerberos
[17:47] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[17:47] <wej> but i was speaking of those modern sd card floppy drive emulators using an AVR :]
[17:48] * srw1973 (~chatzilla@cpc12-cmbg15-2-0-cust128.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 11.0/20120228210006])
[17:48] <wej> that atmega644 used by those should be a lot faster than the 6510
[17:49] <slaeshjag> A lot
[17:49] * dormant (~dormant@d54C0F66F.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:49] * PiBot sets mode +v dormant
[17:50] <slaeshjag> I think the 6502 maxed out at 4 cycles/instruction. AVR usually reach 1 MIPS/MHz
[17:50] <wej> probably about 40 to 50 times faster when running at 20 MHz
[17:50] * earthshine (~Mike@cpc1-orpi1-0-0-cust99.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection timed out)
[17:50] <slaeshjag> and the AVR have like 32 CPU register and most instructions of the early 8-bit ??CPU's
[17:50] <wej> nah, some instructions on the 6502 ran in less than 4 cycles
[17:50] <des2> Back in the days when it was cycles per instruction not instructions per cycle.
[17:51] <wej> but many instructions indeed took more than that
[17:51] * earthshine (~Mike@cpc1-orpi1-0-0-cust99.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:51] * PiBot sets mode +v earthshine
[17:51] <wej> des2, hehe, yeah :D
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[17:53] * PiBot sets mode +v joohoo340_
[17:55] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@c-67-188-110-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: pizthewiz)
[17:57] <medelman> I contacted farnell export about my order to the u.s. and theysaid the shipping cost will be 25-30 dollars! I think I am going to cancel the order.
[17:58] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
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[17:58] <RaTTuS|BIG> ffs just read the farnell faq bit
[17:58] <stuk_gen> what is the problem about 25$ for spedition?
[17:59] <jamesglanville> i'm curious as to what the demand over time is going to do for raspberry pis, I want one as soon as possible, but can see me getting a new one for every project every so often, but educational uses probably slower
[18:00] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.element14.com/community/docs/DOC-43262/l/frequently-asked-questions-about-raspberry-pi
[18:02] <SpeedEvil> I personally want about 4-6
[18:02] <passstab> how do you track your order?
[18:02] <SpeedEvil> I need at least 2 spares, to allow me to migrate off if things go wrong.
[18:02] <des2> Really at this price point person use will overwhelm educational use
[18:02] <RaTTuS|BIG> passstab eith loginto the site or check the emails they send you
[18:02] <SpeedEvil> One for router/webcam, one for central heating and solar controller, one for general logging use.
[18:03] <jojo> i really want to be able to preorder model a
[18:03] <beardface> im going to be 10 of them and make a belt
[18:03] <beardface> hm, maybe will need 15
[18:03] <beardface> no no, 10
[18:03] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) Quit (Quit: shirro)
[18:03] <beardface> the ultimate utility belt
[18:03] <aditsu> just had an idea: pi wallpaper
[18:04] <aditsu> actually, wall/floor tiling
[18:05] <passstab> i bought as guest
[18:05] <passstab> i looked at the email but the links with the order# failed
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[18:07] * earthshine (~Mike@cpc1-orpi1-0-0-cust99.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection timed out)
[18:08] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[18:10] * PiBot sets mode +v Wolfram74
[18:10] <Wolfram74> is newarks web site still under heavy load or is it just terribly designed?
[18:10] <DaQatz> Yes
[18:10] <joeka> yes
[18:11] <Wolfram74> :/ super
[18:11] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:11] <medelman> Does anyone know the support email addresss for element14 in the U.S?
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[18:16] <des2> element14 in the US is Newark
[18:16] * stuk_gen (~stuk_gen@ Quit (Quit: Sto andando via)
[18:17] <des2> From whom did you order ?
[18:17] <Wolfram74> i believe the thing we are hunting for is who to talk to
[18:17] <Wolfram74> i ordered from newark 14
[18:18] <Wolfram74> but i haven't been debited, and i got an email asking me to place my order, but logging in i still have my order as having been filled out, just in back order, so i'm kind of confused
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[18:18] <des2> http://www.newark.com/jsp/bespoke/bespoke2.jsp?bespokepage=newark/en_US/custsrv/index.jsp
[18:18] <andatche> they won't debit you until the item is ready for shipping, usually
[18:18] <medelman> I originally ordered from farnell export, but they are going to be charging $30 for shipping so I'm trying to figure out if I can transfer my order (and place in queue) to their u.s subsidiary . The FAQ states to contact the respective C.S in your country.
[18:19] <des2> There's the link page
[18:19] <des2> Online chat 'live support' available
[18:21] <hotwings> medelman - customerservice@newark.com
[18:21] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[18:22] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.element14.com/community/docs/DOC-43262/l/frequently-asked-questions-about-raspberry-pi medelman - but the answer is yes ity will be converted - however emailing them will get you the authroitve answer
[18:23] * roteiro (~roteiro@dslb-178-004-231-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
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[18:23] <flaushy> is there a date yet when Model A will be produced?
[18:23] <drazyl> No
[18:24] <des2> THis week they're supposedly testing it in the UK
[18:24] <des2> For Compliance
[18:24] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/device-certification#p49071
[18:26] <SpeedEvil> des2: What?
[18:26] <SpeedEvil> The A?
[18:26] <des2> Yes
[18:26] <des2> They announced this on the website
[18:27] * Spikey (~chatzilla@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[18:27] * Delboy_ (~Kombajn@247-218.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[18:28] <flaushy> ah thx
[18:29] <flaushy> so maybe i will get the A before the B ;)
[18:29] <des2> If the factory is producing all the B's they can I'm not sure how they're gonna be making As
[18:30] <SpeedEvil> Plausibly different factories.
[18:31] <SpeedEvil> With the quoted volumes, I wonder if broadcom has enough stock on hand
[18:31] <andatche> broadcom are used to shipping huge volume, can't see it being an issue
[18:31] * Milos (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[18:32] <haltdef> I'd never considered broadcom running out of chippery :o
[18:32] <RaTTuS|BIG> url? on the A
[18:32] * garma (~NJ@host86-166-52-206.range86-166.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[18:32] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c54cd.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:32] <SpeedEvil> ~100K or so - for example - is not a small order.
[18:33] <beardface> it would take me a year to sort out and send 100k boards
[18:34] * MikeJ1971 (~MikeJ1971@dhcp-13.ilrt.bris.ac.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
[18:34] * arnd (arnd@nat/ibm/x-hswutwgbosfezoki) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[18:35] <des2> The comment on how the A was going to be under compliance testing this weel was in the comments section of rhe responses to the Front page static post when it was up. Who knows where that's disappeared to.
[18:35] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:35] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[18:36] <des2> eben on March 3, 2012 at 12:59 am said:
[18:36] <des2> True. We?re building a run of Model As in the UK next week for qualification purposes, and will try to make them available for pre-order as soon as we know the design is solid.
[18:37] <IT_Sean> kinky.
[18:37] <IT_Sean> Woohoo! my phone arrived! :D
[18:37] <haltdef> nokia 3310! :D
[18:38] <des2> Is it more powerful than the Pi ?
[18:38] * flaushy (~nooon@ Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[18:38] <IT_Sean> Doubtful.. it's not a smartphone. Just a basic, unlocked tri-band, as my personal phone will not work outside the US.
[18:39] <haltdef> my android phone is slower than the pi ????
[18:39] <haltdef> 600mhz ARM11
[18:39] <haltdef> more ram though
[18:39] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[18:39] <IT_Sean> This is a samsung dumbphone
[18:39] <IT_Sean> But, it's cheap, and it'll work
[18:41] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:41] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[18:42] * Guest67478 is now known as noname^^
[18:43] * jluisn (~quassel@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[18:47] <mkopack> Surprised we still haven't heard anything about the Fedora release?
[18:48] <des2> Well they have a bout a week to finalize.
[18:48] <mkopack> They seems to indicate that they were about ready 2 weeks ago, but we haven't heard a peep since??? Maybe they're waiting to get release hardware to test it on?
[18:48] * roman3x (~roman3x@bband-dyn214.178-40-117.t-com.sk) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:48] * PiBot sets mode +v roman3x
[18:50] <des2> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/arm/2012-March/date.html
[18:51] <mkopack> Interesting??? apparently Farnell claims they've already shipped about 400 RPi's out the door
[18:51] <mkopack> And have 35,000 order from people.. (It's unclear if that's UK only??? must be...)
[18:51] <des2> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/arm/2012-March/002852.html
[18:51] <jamesd256> mkopack: yeah, and they're bringing them back in through the back door
[18:52] <jamesd256> the only actually have 10 of them ..well known hollywood trick
[18:53] <des2> So what makes up the 1929 packages we've not built?
[18:53] <des2> - FTBFS on mainline
[18:53] <des2> - ARM exclude arch (inc x86 and PPC packages
[18:53] <des2> - java and associated (fix is coming soon for this)
[18:53] <mkopack> Seems strange that they would have only shipped 400 of them if they got 1/2 of the 10K initial batch to sell...
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[18:53] <mkopack> des: Ok, yeah, you're talking greek to me
[18:53] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:54] <des2> So apparently they haven't build anything with java yet but 'a fix is coming soon'
[18:54] <mkopack> cool
[18:54] <des2> Mainline : 11352
[18:54] <des2> ARM : 9423
[18:54] <des2> Difference : 1929
[18:55] <des2> 9,423 out of 11,352 packages built
[18:55] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:55] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[18:56] <mkopack> they need to get that compiler cranking!
[18:56] <des2> Complete list of packages: http://fedora.roving-it.com/f17-differences.txt
[18:56] * Chinese_soup (~polivka@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[18:56] * PiBot sets mode +v Wolfram74
[18:57] * ragna (~ragna@e180048045.adsl.alicedsl.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[19:01] <des2> I figure the first 10,000 are software development/testing units, in a month most everything will be running for the next batch.
[19:02] * tilly_ (~tilly@75-166-142-223.hlrn.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:04] <conra> someone from poland?
[19:04] <sajimon> <
[19:05] <conra> ?
[19:05] <sajimon> yes?:P
[19:05] <conra> oh
[19:05] * stcuser1 (~Yogesh@ Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[19:05] <conra> kupiles juz? :)
[19:05] <sajimon> come to priv
[19:06] <IT_Sean> English, please.
[19:06] * Wolfram74 (~Wolfram74@dhcpw267c54cd.dynamic.uiowa.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:07] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[19:08] * tilly_ (~tilly@75-166-142-223.hlrn.qwest.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[19:08] <des2> Characters that display on my IRC client please
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[19:08] * PiBot sets mode +v tilly_
[19:08] <sajimon> relax, we'r on priv already
[19:08] * tilly_ (~tilly@75-166-142-223.hlrn.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:09] * Guest87710 (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[19:09] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[19:09] <conra> rpi == raspberry pi?
[19:09] * Lemon (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:09] * PiBot sets mode +v Lemon
[19:10] <hotwings> sure
[19:10] <conra> ok
[19:12] * elmo40 (~Elmo40@CPE002129acb2d3-CM001bd7a89c28.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[19:32] <VeryHF> Hey All! I have been watching Rpi for a couple months now and am looking forward to testing the hw, How long has the Shop been offline?
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[19:33] * PiBot sets mode +v elmo40
[19:33] <kallisti5> are the boot binaries u-boot?
[19:34] <weasel> VeryHF: see the faq "Where can I buy one?" item.
[19:34] <weasel> VeryHF: they don't sell it themselves
[19:34] <kallisti5> VeryHF: your a little out of date on your info
[19:34] <weasel> kallisti5: well, the raspberry webpage is just Bad.
[19:34] <kallisti5> VeryHF: current back order is until may at least.. prob further
[19:34] <kallisti5> weasel: true
[19:35] <VeryHF> Excellent, thanks, I see the links.
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[19:35] <DaQatz> kallisti5, The system is booted by the gpu.
[19:35] <des2> http://elinux.org/RPi_Buying_Guide#Ordering
[19:36] <DaQatz> No uboot is used.
[19:36] <kallisti5> DaQatz: ah.. i just saw a forum post noting to boot u-boot via the 'kernel.img'
[19:36] <DaQatz> You can replace the kernel with uboot.
[19:36] <kallisti5> DaQatz: trying to figure out how to boot a non-linux os
[19:37] <DaQatz> And have that boot the kernel
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[19:38] <kallisti5> DaQatz: is the gpu boot sequence linux-specific?
[19:38] <kallisti5> or could I load anything as long as the arch, etc is right?
[19:38] <DaQatz> Not that I am aware of.
[19:38] <kallisti5> k.
[19:39] * Plankalkuel (~paethon@chello213047250034.tirol.surfer.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[19:39] <DaQatz> Should not be an issue replacing the file the gpu loads to something besides the kernel.
[19:39] <andatche> anyone tried using a gpxe image in place of kernel.img?
[19:39] <andatche> or pie booting at all
[19:39] <andatche> *pxe
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[19:39] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[19:39] <kallisti5> andatche: i'm guessing it has to be ready for the pi's bootloader :)
[19:39] * BCMM (~ben@unaffiliated/bcmm) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[19:40] <kallisti5> I wish there were more docs on the early boot process
[19:40] <kallisti5> everything seems *too* simple :)
[19:40] <andatche> is the boatloader code on github?
[19:40] * andatche looks
[19:40] <kallisti5> oh!
[19:40] <kallisti5> side note!
[19:40] * jthunder (~jthunder@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[19:41] <kallisti5> Eben emailed me, the license for the bootloader is permissive as long as it is used in relation to the Pi.
[19:41] <DaQatz> The gpu starts, loads it's blob from the first partition on the SD card. It that prepares all the hardware. It loads kernel.img from the SD card into memory. Then releases control of the system to the ARM processor.
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[19:41] * PiBot sets mode +v BCMM
[19:41] <andatche> kallisti5: cool, interesting
[19:41] <DaQatz> Mind you that's "Over simplified"
[19:42] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[19:42] <kallisti5> DaQatz: yeah, i'm looking for offsets execution starts at, etc
[19:42] <DaQatz> For the gpu or the arm?
[19:42] <kallisti5> for the arm code
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[19:43] <DaQatz> probably starts at 0
[19:43] <kallisti5> ah. simple enough
[19:43] <andatche> only binaries for the boot stuff on github :(
[19:43] <andatche> kallisti5: any mention of if they had plans to release the code?
[19:43] <DaQatz> kallisti5, Mind you it's guess
[19:43] <kallisti5> Email from Eben on license info: http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/tree/build/jam/board/raspberry_pi/license.txt
[19:43] * TheOpenSourcerer (~alord@81-178-65-1.dsl.pipex.com) has left #raspberrypi
[19:44] <DaQatz> kallisti5, ahh you're looking at haiku too.
[19:44] <jojo> there is definitely evidence that start.elf passes a tagged boot list to the kernel
[19:44] <jojo> like http://www.simtec.co.uk/products/SWLINUX/files/booting_article.html#appendix_tag_reference
[19:44] * pistacik (~pista@ip-213-220-206-109.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:44] <DaQatz> Imo haiku would be great on the pi hardware
[19:44] <kallisti5> I know :D
[19:44] <Kostic> Plan 9...........
[19:44] * kallisti5 is taking notes http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/tree/build/jam/board/raspberry_pi/info.txt
[19:45] <DaQatz> Wait there is a pdf out detailing the how the arm works
[19:45] <DaQatz> Enough to start porting os's with
[19:45] <DaQatz> Let me find it
[19:45] <des2> Has Gnu announced Hurd for the Pi yet ?
[19:45] <kallisti5> sweet :)
[19:45] * Lemon (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[19:45] <kallisti5> we're prob going to use the arm224_start.elf for now... Haiku needs ~70MB for a full system, but that can grow pretty quickly
[19:46] <rm> des2, hurd is i386-only afaik
[19:46] <DaQatz> kallisti5, http://www.raspberrypi.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/BCM2835-ARM-Peripherals.pdf
[19:46] <kallisti5> Our arm port is a little rough though, it needs lots of love to be more generic then only u-boot
[19:46] <kallisti5> DaQatz: thanks, i'll definitely use that :)
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[19:47] * PiBot sets mode +v Lemon
[19:47] <DaQatz> Yes I have been reading over haiku's site.
[19:48] <DaQatz> Glade that alt arch's don't have to stick to the gcc2 "issue" like the x86
[19:48] <DaQatz> glad*
[19:48] <kallisti5> :D
[19:48] <kallisti5> yeah.. /me hates the gcc2 stuff.
[19:49] <DaQatz> If you get it working with a good dev enviro installed. They may well see a nice upsurge in interest in haiku.
[19:49] <DaQatz> Just not on the hardware they expected.
[19:49] <kallisti5> we already have cross tools working for arm.
[19:50] <DaQatz> Nods
[19:50] <kallisti5> there was gumstix work a while ago that kind of faded given the high price
[19:50] <des2> OMG, BeOS!
[19:50] * arnd (~arnd@HSI-KBW-46-223-44-216.hsi.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[19:50] <kallisti5> Since the Pi is *so* flipping cheap... i figure it is going to stick for quite a while :P
[19:51] <kallisti5> more eyes == better port chance :D
[19:51] <kallisti5> des2: indeed
[19:51] <DaQatz> I have cross compiled a basic hardfloat big endian root myself. That way I can boot strap a gentoo stage 1.
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[19:52] <DaQatz> I want to be able to test big endian code.
[19:55] <andatche> hmm, time to disassemble to boot blobs I think
[19:55] <andatche> *thre
[19:55] <andatche> *the, even
[19:55] * dnstbr (~dnstbr@rrcs-97-77-70-128.sw.biz.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[19:56] <DaQatz> oi andatche that'll be a headache
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[19:56] <andatche> not attempted to disassemble arm before
[19:56] <DaQatz> The blob is not arm
[19:57] <DaQatz> It's the gpu
[19:57] <andatche> ah, of course
[19:57] <DaQatz> And it's encrypted.
[19:57] <andatche> eugh
[19:57] <jojo> the blob is not encrypted; it might be signed
[19:58] <des2> Yeah it's not just protected by obscurity buy by security.
[19:58] <DaQatz> It can be done, it's just a headache.
[19:58] <DaQatz> Solder to memory lines and underclocking oh my
[19:58] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[19:58] <des2> CPU in the middle attack ?
[19:58] <andatche> hopefully it'll boot u-boot
[19:58] <DaQatz> It should.
[19:59] <DaQatz> jojo, JamesH said ti was encrypted.
[19:59] <jojo> i know
[20:00] <lars_t_h> des2, "CPU in the middle attack" hehe - just run at 32KHz fx
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[20:00] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[20:00] <jojo> i assume he meant cryptographically signed
[20:00] <jojo> or maybe the roku2 blob is encrypted, but the pi is not
[20:00] <DaQatz> Supposedly both are.
[20:00] <DaQatz> And signed to the device line.
[20:01] <DaQatz> Ie can't run Ruko blob on a pi
[20:01] <DaQatz> or a pi blob on roku
[20:01] <jojo> or i suppose some of the code may be encrypted
[20:01] <jojo> but we do not know the architecture anyway
[20:01] * whyz (~e@h145n7-n-a31.ias.bredband.telia.com) Quit (Quit: bbl)
[20:01] <jojo> there is a ton of plaintext in the blob, anyway
[20:02] <jojo> including the arm linux tagged boot magic numbers i referred to earlier
[20:02] <DaQatz> Hmm
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[20:02] * PiBot sets mode +v fexx
[20:02] <DaQatz> Sounds like it may an "easy" reverse then.
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[20:03] <DaQatz> We shall see.
[20:03] <DaQatz> You know people will try
[20:04] <xlq> Try what? Minecraft?
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[20:04] <GabrialDestruir> I wonder if I should try calling newark again, considering last night they said "Oh we can't do anything about farnell orders"
[20:04] * joeka (~joe@dslb-188-104-207-055.pools.arcor-ip.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:04] <DaQatz> Reverse engineering the blob
[20:04] <xlq> Ah
[20:04] <jojo> assuming the blob is at least signed, then what would be the benefit ?
[20:05] <xlq> Why do you assume the blob is signed?
[20:05] <mkopack> Yeah, and you can bet the GPU will only execute the blob if it's properly signed by Broadcom
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[20:05] <xlq> I haven't heard anything like that.
[20:05] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:05] <xlq> Uh, that's not good.
[20:05] <jojo> both dom and jamesh have suggested that
[20:05] <mkopack> And it would make sense???
[20:06] <mkopack> The GPU can do a lot more (MPEG-2 for instance) than the RPi foundation has paid the licenses to get it to do...
[20:06] <mkopack> The way that gets locked out is in the GPU code, and you protect that by signing it.
[20:06] <xlq> We really ought to be able to at least use it for number crunching.
[20:07] <mkopack> So we *might* be able to crack open the GPU code, and see what makes it tick but the chances of us being able to modify it and resign it so it'll run are a lot slimmer
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[20:08] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[20:08] <mjr> yeah, it's very likely. Bottom line: if you have aspirations to hack the GPU, be prepared to curse Broadcom. Other than that, go for it ;]
[20:10] <jojo> i think if i was going to reverse engineer any chip, i would pick one i could actually buy as well...
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[20:12] <mkopack> MAYBE as the RPi gets more popular they'll be able to afford a license to unlock more of the codec support of the GPU
[20:13] <mkopack> It is, after all, just a file you replace.
[20:13] <RaYmAn> you probably have to pay per-device
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[20:13] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[20:13] <des2> Right they didn't pay the 2-3 bucks for the MPEG-2 license
[20:13] <mkopack> RaY: The way they said the MP2 license was, is that you had to buy like 100,000 of them at a time or something like that.
[20:13] <mkopack> And yeah, 2-3$ per
[20:14] <mkopack> So it just wasn't in the budget for them
[20:14] * slug (~nuno@207-38-144-21.c3-0.avec-ubr2.nyr-avec.ny.cable.rcn.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:14] * PiBot sets mode +v slug
[20:14] <mkopack> They couldn't justify buying 100,000 licenses when they didn't know if they'd even sell that many devices
[20:16] <GabrialDestruir> I claimed more people wanting MPEG-2 could drive them to license it before.
[20:16] <GabrialDestruir> Got told that wasn't it's "purpose" it's for "Education" so it was unlikely
[20:17] <des2> Maybe the Model C will have it....
[20:17] <chris_99> i bet someone will crack it wide open
[20:17] <xlq> They should make a really hackable one and call it the model T.
[20:17] <GabrialDestruir> Assuming of course that it isn't somehow signed it'll most likely be hacked
[20:18] <chris_99> even if it is signed, someone may still crack it
[20:18] <piofcube> One thing that must be considered is even if 100K people asked for mpeg-2... R-Pi would pay for it and then add it to the cost of the R-Pi... then would people complain because the price went up and also, who's to say that 100K people actually wanted it and not just trolling/being sheep? That would put R-Pi foundation severly out of pocket.
[20:19] <GabrialDestruir> They could make it an "aftermarket" codec pack
[20:19] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[20:19] <rm> the whole s/w patent system is corrupt
[20:19] * Dagger2 hopes somebody makes an educational program for the RPi that teaches kids how to (and how not to) use the apostrophe
[20:19] <GabrialDestruir> 3-4 dollars per pack and you'd get a new blob or something
[20:19] <Dagger2> because I don't know what schools are doing at the moment, but it's clearly not working
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[20:19] * PiBot sets mode +v issue-
[20:19] <piofcube> I'm sure someone, somewhere will... For software encoding/decoding that's easy... I already own 5 licences for MP3... software-based
[20:19] <rm> should just have just arsed Broadcom into supporting the damn Theora and WebM
[20:19] * mkopack (~mkopack@99-207-51-241.pools.spcsdns.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
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[20:21] <GabrialDestruir> -sighs-
[20:21] * mdavey (~chatzilla@mail.aminocom.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[20:21] <GabrialDestruir> What a pain in the ass... lol
[20:21] <piofcube> I dunno how difficult it would be to enable the hardware side on the R-Pi chip though
[20:21] * Lemon (~Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[20:24] <GabrialDestruir> You mean using the GPU for like MP3 based stuff?
[20:24] <RaYmAn> even if there is signing etc, the hardest part is reverse engineering all the gpu stuff, not breaking the security
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[20:25] <DaQatz> RaYmAn, Yep
[20:25] <DaQatz> RaYmAn, Gotta GET there first though.
[20:25] <des2> And the pins are so tiny...
[20:26] <piofcube> RaymAn: yeah as I say... I don't know how hard it would be to enable the hardware side... bit like poking around in the dark witha big stick... You might hit the right thing but then again you might not LOL
[20:26] <mkopack> gotta get our hands ON the units first!
[20:26] <RaYmAn> mkopack: nah, you can reverse engineer from the stuff they already released ;)
[20:26] <des2> Some guy was spreading a rumor that 400 had shipped already...
[20:26] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:26] <GabrialDestruir> But having security hinders any actual progression until you get past it?
[20:27] <RaYmAn> GabrialDestruir: do we even know that there IS any security?
[20:27] <mkopack> des: Somebody posted in the forums today
[20:28] <mkopack> That he called Farnell UK today and they said they've shipped out 400 and have orders for another 35,000 right now
[20:28] <GabrialDestruir> I don't think anyone knows anything about it yet.
[20:28] <mkopack> (just the UK site)
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[20:28] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[20:28] <piofcube> From what I read in bits on the forums I think it was a case of broadcom saying... what licenses have you got? Okay... we'll enable this and that to match.
[20:29] <GabrialDestruir> Yea, chances are they won't enable it for individual users though if you just happened to have an mpeg-2 license lying around :p
[20:29] <OneFix_Work> So, I guess the foundation is saying the first rPis should begin arriving sometime next week.
[20:29] <piofcube> hopefully it's as easy as that
[20:29] <mkopack> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/raspberry-pi-begins-deliveries-may-15/page-3 post # 32
[20:30] <RaYmAn> what was the formats they claimed to support again?
[20:30] * earthshine (~Mike@cpc1-orpi1-0-0-cust99.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection timed out)
[20:30] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: That's wrong. Check their website for a more accurate ship date.
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[20:31] * PiBot sets mode +v siulas
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[20:31] * PiBot sets mode +v earthshine
[20:32] <mkopack> OneFix: I know that??? I'm saying look at that one posting #32...
[20:33] <mkopack> The guy said that he was told they had 400 shipped out, and 35,000 customer orders
[20:33] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[20:33] <mkopack> (2nd post on that linked page)
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[20:35] * Lemon (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[20:35] <GabrialDestruir> Bah, having to wait til april 16th sucks .-.
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[20:36] <DaQatz> Yeah
[20:36] <DaQatz> Thems the breaks.
[20:37] <mkopack> hehe, I might not be waiting that long, assuming what Newark has on my order holds??? :)
[20:37] <RaYmAn> lots of stuff to do meanwhile though ;) Disassemble and document everything! :P
[20:37] <DaQatz> But hey the first numbers I had, I would be able to order as early as Oct/Nov 2011
[20:37] <mkopack> but I'll believe it when I see it
[20:37] <DaQatz> So patience is a virtue.
[20:39] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[20:39] <GabrialDestruir> Eh it's hard to tell if they're actually doing anything, because it seems their order page in my account doesn't actually update .-.
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[20:40] <mkopack> Wel, Newark moved my "estimated ship date" twice now??? Originally May 11, then April 4, now March 30.
[20:40] <piofcube> If you can not wait to get a R-Pi and would like to design and build cases etc... contact beardface in here.... I convinced him to use a 3D printer to make a demo model so people can make sure their designs will work with regards to the port placement etc...
[20:41] <GabrialDestruir> Bah you're kidding me...
[20:41] <beardface> not kidding
[20:41] <mkopack> That's what it says???
[20:41] <Simon-> does it cost more to make it out of plastic than the real thing?
[20:41] <mkopack> Whether that actually holds or not we'll have to wait and see..
[20:41] <beardface> no
[20:41] <beardface> selling them for 5 bucks, mostly b/c of the tiem it takes
[20:41] <GabrialDestruir> This sucks.... lol
[20:41] <beardface> rpicases.blogspot.com
[20:42] <beardface> http://rpicases.blogspot.com
[20:42] <piofcube> even after you get an R-Pi... you probs will want to use the real thing and not tie it up in prototyping and stuff... That's why I really wanted one :-)
[20:42] <GabrialDestruir> Od thought.... why exactly would a person want a model pi? >.>
[20:43] <hotwings> $16 for an pri case? ouch
[20:43] <beardface> for a painted case
[20:43] <beardface> 5 for plastic
[20:43] <beardface> i have to paint it by hand, I'm not china
[20:43] <mkopack> beard: How the hell did you get a RPi to put side by side with your printed model in that picture??!?
[20:43] <beardface> mkopack, its called specifications
[20:43] <beardface> the one on the left is printed, and painted
[20:43] <mkopack> Oh. gotchya
[20:44] <GabrialDestruir> lol
[20:44] <mkopack> It was a small pic so I couldn't tell it wasn't real. It looked just like the real thing
[20:44] <hotwings> beardface - your case order button only shows WHITE $16, ORANGE $16... no $5 case option
[20:44] <GabrialDestruir> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/846109/3d/2012-03-05%2021.58.11.jpg
[20:44] <beardface> thats for cases
[20:44] <GabrialDestruir> you can tell it's not real :p
[20:44] <beardface> sorry, thought you meant pcb
[20:44] <beardface> GabrialDestruir, whats your deal buddy
[20:44] <GabrialDestruir> ?
[20:44] <des2> looks like a real one that caught fire
[20:44] <beardface> yeah, cases take me longer to print, and more plastic
[20:45] <GabrialDestruir> I know right? xD
[20:45] <mkopack> lol....
[20:45] <beardface> let me know when you build yourself a 3d printer and make something i can bash
[20:45] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:45] <GabrialDestruir> Uh, I wasn't bashing anything.
[20:46] <hotwings> im just going to either go buy some plexi and make my own case, or wait for the cheap chinese cases (w/free shipping) to show up on ebay
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[20:46] <GabrialDestruir> But when you look at the original you can tell it's not a real one, which was what I was pointing out.
[20:46] <hotwings> no way ill pay 1/2 pi cost for a pi case
[20:46] <GabrialDestruir> as opposed to the shrinked image.
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[20:47] <GabrialDestruir> It's better than some other case options I've seen
[20:47] <GabrialDestruir> 25 on shapeways
[20:47] * earthshine (~Mike@cpc1-orpi1-0-0-cust99.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection timed out)
[20:48] <GabrialDestruir> or around 25 anyways
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[20:48] * fexx (8d2f7b85@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[20:48] <beardface_> hotwings: in that case, you can wait a few months for the army of children in china to drop the price for you
[20:48] <mkopack> I'll probably get one of the guys in the robotics club that has a 3D Printer make one for me, assuming I can find a good plan somewhere online
[20:48] <beardface_> this case takes me an hour to make
[20:48] <beardface_> 16 is fair
[20:49] <mkopack> beard: Oh, I agree, that IS fair
[20:49] <piofcube> shapeways is good but I've also seen many of the prices on sites like that... They've got to pay for their servers etc... but I like to deal with individuals when i can :-)
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[20:49] <beardface_> check your local hackerspaces for 3d printers
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[20:49] <beardface_> most cities have 1 or 2 good hackerspaces
[20:49] * pizthewiz (~pizthewiz@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[20:49] * pizthewiz_ is now known as pizthewiz
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[20:49] * medelman (42ee8952@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[20:50] <GabrialDestruir> Eh, it'd be cheaper for me to order online.
[20:50] <piofcube> something about knowing someone has built it with their own hand... or finished it and they weren't some faceless working in a sweat shop somewhere making 2p a day... (I'm talking in general terms here and not shapeways LOL)
[20:50] <beardface_> shapways is hardly cheap
[20:50] <beardface_> but, they do great quality
[20:51] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[20:51] <GabrialDestruir> 20-25 dollars for a case or even 16 for one of yours, or any of the other options is a lot cheaper than the 100 bucks in gas to go to the local hackerspace in LA
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[20:52] <des2> Yeah there are some pricey things there: http://www.shapeways.com/model/287682/nuke_lamp.html?gid=cg88
[20:52] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) Quit (Quit: kthxbai)
[20:53] <beardface_> here is an rpi case on there: http://www.shapeways.com/model/418055/
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[20:53] <GabrialDestruir> Yeesh, 1,500.
[20:54] <des2> I'm sticking with my lava lamp...
[20:54] <piofcube> The model or call it a template is ideal for me and us because we have many cases to design and probs only 1 R-Pi for a long time (when we get it)... And when we do get it, I'll be needing it for to be used to work on software.
[20:54] <GabrialDestruir> I'd stick to my lava lamp if I had one xD
[20:54] <GabrialDestruir> .-.
[20:55] <mkopack> Gabr: where the hell are you?
[20:55] <GabrialDestruir> How much ventilation does this thing actually need? .-.
[20:55] <piofcube> I broke my lava lamp a couple of months ago when I fell over the table it was on :-(
[20:55] <beardface_> i actually think i'm going to open op an old monitor, and put the rpi inside
[20:55] <beardface_> with bt keyboard and mouse
[20:55] <des2> http://marcoalici.wordpress.com/2012/02/29/me-and-the-raspberrypi-2/
[20:55] <GabrialDestruir> I like to call it bumfuck nowhere :p
[20:56] <beardface_> des2: that guy does fantastic blender renderings
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[20:56] <beardface_> look like real photos
[20:56] <des2> Probably not too Much Gabrial.
[20:56] * stcuser (~Yogesh@ Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[20:56] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[20:56] <mkopack> Gabr: Must be if it's 2 hours to LA and there isn't anything else closer to you!
[20:56] <GabrialDestruir> Okay it's not really no where.... but it's the closest thing to it around here.
[20:57] <piofcube> from the forums... it's debatable if it needs any
[20:57] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[20:57] <beardface_> http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/List_of_Hacker_Spaces
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[20:58] <GabrialDestruir> Does anyone really expect this to thing to put off so much heat that entire sides of the Pi case have to be vented? .-.
[20:58] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:58] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[20:59] <beardface_> Actually this is a better link for US: http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/United_States_of_America
[20:59] <OneFix_Work> GabrialDestruir: Never know what someone's going to try and stick in there :)
[20:59] <GabrialDestruir> Yes I know about that, beardface_, the closest hackerspace is over two hours away.
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[20:59] <beardface_> gotcha
[20:59] <GabrialDestruir> Fair enough.
[21:00] * mkopack wonders who the first person here on the board will be to get an actual RPi....
[21:00] <des2> Not really Gabrial.
[21:00] <des2> Needs minimal ventilation if at all
[21:00] <beardface_> do they get a tour of the factory?
[21:00] <beardface_> where everything is edible?
[21:01] <piofcube> you need to find the golden ticket for that tour
[21:01] <beardface_> oh... :/
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[21:01] <GabrialDestruir> True, and a just pi case should only need minimal venting, but you never know what people will try to cram into the case with it.
[21:02] <beardface_> for instance, a motor controller will put off a lot of heat
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[21:04] <Mookman288> A siri like system on the pi would be pretty cool.
[21:04] * toxical (~francisco@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[21:04] <Mookman288> Who wants to write some AI
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[21:06] <GabrialDestruir> NO! No no no no!
[21:06] <GabrialDestruir> Last thing we need is some 700Mhz AI learning how to expand itself and take over the world
[21:06] <GabrialDestruir> >.>
[21:06] <mrdragons> What if it just takes over a small 3rd world country?
[21:07] <GabrialDestruir> Oh well, then I suppose that'd be fine.
[21:07] <GabrialDestruir> xD
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[21:07] <ReggieUK> GabrialDestruir, we'd be fine, it can only replicate at <10k units a month :D
[21:07] * Matthew is now known as Guest14317
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[21:08] <GabrialDestruir> Actually it'd be kind of cool if you could create an interactive AI that connected with other rPi AIs so you could share information between them and the users and such.
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[21:09] <ReggieUK> sure but it depends on how it would be expected to behave
[21:09] <Mookman288> APi
[21:09] <Mookman288> Ay-pi
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[21:11] <aditsu> hmmm, ever since I ordered the pi, pretty much every single frickin' google ad on every single frickin' website in the world (that uses adsense) is for element14
[21:11] <ReggieUK> it's starting to get obtrusive
[21:11] <OneFix_Work> BTW, anyone else think that a large number of people will be trying to resell their rPis?
[21:11] <ReggieUK> and creepy
[21:11] <mrdragons> OneFix_Work: Yeah, probably once they realize it's not as powerful as they thought
[21:12] <oldtopman> Well, element14 is the only one selling.
[21:12] <ReggieUK> it's like walking down the street and having a chugger hit you up by saying 'I know you like embedded electronics, so we'd like to show you this'
[21:12] <CasperN> then use http://duckduckgo.com/
[21:12] <GabrialDestruir> Eh.
[21:12] <ReggieUK> OneFix_Work, I hope so :)
[21:12] <ReggieUK> cheap pi everywhere
[21:12] <GabrialDestruir> No worse than the Amazon or newegg ads I've been seeing
[21:12] <OneFix_Work> Someone was asking me today where to get one and I recommended that they wait till a bunch of people try selling them on ebay within the next week or two :)
[21:12] <GabrialDestruir> showing exactly what the last thing I searched was on all sites I visit
[21:13] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[21:13] <beardface_> i really wish they would put out the A model
[21:14] <ReggieUK> they have, it's called a model B and a soldering iron/hot air rework station :D
[21:14] <aditsu> it's pretty silly.. I mean, it would be ok if they showed me the ad *before* I went to the site, but if I've already been there, what's the point?
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[21:15] <Mookman288> So that you'll go again
[21:15] <GabrialDestruir> I mean you could probably just go with basic Siri, but it'd be cool if you could do something like take various findings and works of progress and dump it all into like one huge repository where someone could just ask their AI "Is it possible to do this?" and then it could search the repository and be like "JohnDoe was able to do this" and show you the information >.>
[21:15] <aditsu> what for? I don't need no other electronics
[21:16] <Mookman288> They don't know that
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[21:16] <aditsu> ReggieUK: he's probably talking about the $25 one though
[21:16] <Mookman288> GabrialDestruir: Yes!
[21:16] <mkopack> Gabrial: Um, I think that's called "Ask.com" :)
[21:16] <ReggieUK> aditsu, sure :) it wasn't something I really expect most people to even think about, let alone attempt
[21:16] <Mookman288> Arrh-pi, can you show me how to make you do x?
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[21:17] <aditsu> hmm, when I get my pi, I will make a website about it, and host it on it
[21:17] * Tachyon` (hideki@cpc1-york2-0-0-cust905.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Rebooting/Upgrading)
[21:17] <beardface_> aditsu, cool project
[21:17] <beardface_> but how will you blog on your site about creating the server
[21:17] <beardface_> until the server is up
[21:17] <beardface_> your first post will just be "I'm done!"
[21:18] <GabrialDestruir> Yes, but Ask.com doesn't have have a personality or voice capabilities.... or anything.
[21:18] <aditsu> I can post the whole process at once
[21:18] <ReggieUK> unless he does a pre-server blog hosted elsewhere?
[21:18] <mkopack> voice is easy - free voice synth software packages out there
[21:18] <mkopack> tie the two together, should be easy enough to do
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[21:19] <GabrialDestruir> Right... sure you could use ask.com as a basis, but then this global network of AI couldn't really "learn" it'd just be pulling information of the internet.... no better than a google search.
[21:20] <mkopack> You're wanting something more like IBM's Watson....
[21:21] <mkopack> Or something more of a machine learning capability where it learns on an emerging basis...
[21:21] <aditsu> great idea, let's run watson on a pi :D
[21:21] <GabrialDestruir> Not A Pi...
[21:21] <mkopack> that's kinda like the holy grail of AI research and we are NOWHERE NEAR that level of AI
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[21:21] <GabrialDestruir> thousands of Pis
[21:21] <aditsu> it will find the right question it less than 20000000 years :)
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[21:22] <GabrialDestruir> Unless you hosted the main brain on a proper computer.
[21:22] <GabrialDestruir> Then it'd send a request and reply through network
[21:22] <mkopack> Which is really all that SIRI does
[21:22] * khildin (~khildin@ip-80-236-227-45.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Quit: I'm gone, bye bye)
[21:23] <GabrialDestruir> Start with Siri, advance toward watson.... >.>
[21:24] * Tachyon (hideki@cpc1-york2-0-0-cust905.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:24] * PiBot sets mode +v Tachyon
[21:25] <GabrialDestruir> But instead of just pulling from all internet information, it should have it's own database which it can store information and slowly expand that information, much like Google's been doing for a decade now.
[21:25] <GabrialDestruir> Over a decade I think... but still
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[21:25] <OneFix_Work> Well, Siri uses Wolfram Alpha for its results
[21:26] <aditsu> I'd rather start with something like eliza
[21:27] <mkopack> Man, that episode of Big Bang Theory where Raj falls in love with his iPhone because of Siri was hillarious
[21:27] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[21:27] <mkopack> "The voice recognition on that thing is horrible??? watch - "Siri find me a westawant" " I'm sorry Bawwy, I don't understand Find a Westawant???"
[21:28] <mkopack> I nearly cried I was laughing so har
[21:28] <mkopack> d
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[21:30] <aditsu> haha, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5529ghwysM
[21:30] <mkopack> YUP!
[21:30] <GabrialDestruir> I wonder what would become of an "AI" like Siri or even "Eliza" if over 10,000 people were dilligently adding things to it....
[21:31] <GabrialDestruir> or I suppose I should say over 100,000 people
[21:31] <piofcube> Look at any Youtube video and enable the experimental YouTube/Google audio transcription (Cloased Captions) if it wasn't so serious it would be funny...
[21:32] * Tachyon is now known as Tachyon`
[21:32] <mkopack> It's not just a matter of adding information. They've tried things like that in the past???
[21:32] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Everyone (even Google) is using recognition by the same company (Nuance). The only difference is Google sends their uncertain results to their servers to hopefully improve their recognition
[21:32] <ReggieUK> the adds on the tv don't look too hot with that siri guff, like it's kind of right, as long as everyone else is playing along
[21:32] * smw (~smw@unaffiliated/smw) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[21:32] <ReggieUK> but if your brother doesn't have a crapple phone then you're screwed for knowing how close he is
[21:34] <mkopack> aditsu: And Bernadette is friction HOT BTW :)
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[21:35] <GabrialDestruir> Well obviously just adding information isn't going to make an "AI" come to life, but if you could make an adaptive system in which you could slowly add requests, information, commands, etc, by hundreds of people, which people updating various bits of code here and there as needed, I think you'd eventually end up with something better than what a couple dozen "geniuses" at apple come up with.
[21:35] * danieldaniel_ (~danieldan@ Quit (Changing host)
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[21:35] <tero> new blog post
[21:36] <GabrialDestruir> Though, on the flip side, you could also end up with something that's just absolute trash.
[21:36] <aditsu> mkopack: who's that? the blonde guest?
[21:36] * danieldaniel_ is now known as danieldaniel
[21:36] <mkopack> Gabr: And thats' what they ALWAYS end up with when they try??? Seriously. Pick up a copy of Peter Norvig's Intro to AI book...
[21:36] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) Quit (Quit: oldtopman has left the house)
[21:36] <mkopack> aditsu: The little blonde with the glasses on Big Bang Theory
[21:37] <mkopack> (although the woman they got to play "Siri" at the end of that clip was majorly hot as well!)
[21:38] <wcchandler> people who got their orders in on time, when's the expected ship date? has it already been shipped?
[21:38] <aditsu> LOL "the office of Siri"
[21:38] <mkopack> wcc: nobody here has gotten one yet
[21:38] <mkopack> We've all ordered and are waiting
[21:38] <wcchandler> mkopack: thanks
[21:38] <mkopack> I have an expected ship date of March 30 on mine
[21:38] <des2> Someone claimed that Farnell shipped 400 already.
[21:39] <wcchandler> :/
[21:39] <mkopack> wcc: In general, don't get bent out of shape. It'll come when it comes...
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[21:39] <ReggieUK> des2, someone said to me that farnell had 800 pi ready to go on the 29th, so it could well be true
[21:39] <OneFix_Work> wcchandler: I ordered from Newark on launch day and mine is due to ship on March 30th
[21:39] <GabrialDestruir> I have an expected ship date of april 16th -.-
[21:39] <wcchandler> mkopack: that's my concern. I didn't order mine until "really" late launch + 10hrs and my expected ship date is march 13th... the guy who reminded me to order it has an expected ship date of april something
[21:39] <aditsu> oh yeah, where did those first 10k actually go, and when?
[21:39] <mkopack> OneFix: We must be in the same order batch then
[21:40] <GabrialDestruir> and I bought mine two hours after it went on sell from export.farnell
[21:40] <OneFix_Work> wcchandler: Where did you order from?
[21:40] <mkopack> wc: At this point, honestly, I wouldn't consider ANY ship date as set in stone??? The distributors are still working through their mess
[21:40] <wcchandler> newark
[21:40] <ReggieUK> I guess it depends where they build them
[21:41] <ReggieUK> anyone know where farnell/rs do their fabbing?
[21:41] <wcchandler> mkopack: that's kind of what I was thinking that I should consider it anything definite until I get a tracking number
[21:41] <mkopack> It all depends on which regional sites are getting how much product allocated to them and how many orders there are in front of you
[21:41] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[21:41] <OneFix_Work> wcchandler: To see your current ship date, login to Newark, and click the "PO Number" on your order...it should show you the expected ship date there
[21:41] <mkopack> wcchandler: exactly??? Until then it's just wild guesses
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[21:42] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: is it the same for element14?
[21:42] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Dunno. I ordered from the Newark link
[21:42] <mkopack> I have 2 orders - the March 30'th one is the first one that I put in, on the 29th, at like 9am direct link order @ Newark. The second one I did on the 1st, after getting the "you've registered interest, go ahead and click here to order" email from Newark, and that one is showing May 14th.
[21:43] <mkopack> wcchandler: They charge you the $20 extra handling fee?
[21:43] <wcchandler> http://i.imgur.com/HnIAf.png
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[21:43] <wcchandler> OneFix_Work: that's my PO page ^^^^
[21:43] <mkopack> Yeah, you got hit with it too??? I have that on my March 30 order, not on my May 14 one...
[21:43] <Kyzz> It was already stated that the handling fee was a MISTAKE , so yeah
[21:44] <aditsu> no "PO" or "ship date" here :(
[21:44] <wcchandler> I'm fine paying it if it means it ships on march 13th... but if that slips then I might call and ask about it
[21:44] <mkopack> I could see paying it if it's coming out of that initial batch that was sent to the UK, but not for orders coming from subsequent production runs
[21:44] <mkopack> wcchandler: Exactly. same here
[21:44] <aditsu> wcchandler: "snooki wikipedia", nice :)
[21:44] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Mine had the "handling fee" attached. But I have a chat from the day after launch where one of their reps said that if you were charged a "handling fee", it would be removed.
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[21:45] <OneFix_Work> wcchandler: Yea, so that is your ship date.
[21:45] <wcchandler> aditsu: :$ coworkers playing a southpark episode clip
[21:45] <mkopack> One: Yeah, I know??? I'm just going to wait and see. I'm leary to call and ask because I don't want to draw attention to the fact that I have a 2nd order open
[21:45] <OneFix_Work> wcchandler: I would check back there on March 12th to make sure.
[21:46] <mkopack> My date for that first order has moved to the left twice now??? Originally showed May 11, then April 3 and now March 30.
[21:46] <wcchandler> OneFix_Work: yeah, but you got yours ordered fairly early?
[21:46] <mkopack> (and OMG that Snooki spoof on Southpark was HILLARIOUS!)
[21:46] <OneFix_Work> wcchandler: Yea, like about the same time as you...
[21:47] <aditsu> must... watch...
[21:47] <wcchandler> :/ interesting
[21:47] * garma (~NJ@cpc6-sotn11-2-0-cust198.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[21:47] <mkopack> aditsu: It was the Jersey Shore episode??? like 1-2 seasons ago
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[21:48] <aditsu> mkopack: oooh, I think I've seen that
[21:49] * aditsu watches again
[21:49] * freddow (~fred@host-92-7-101-87.as43234.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:50] <fakker> snooki wants smushsmush
[21:51] <mkopack> LOL!
[21:51] <fakker> that one?
[21:51] <mkopack> "It's raping me!!! HELP GUYS!!!!"
[21:51] <mkopack> Yes
[21:51] <align> use condoms
[21:51] <aditsu> oh God..
[21:52] <mkopack> "You're Garbage! Muff Garbage!"
[21:52] <mkopack> (and my boss wonders why I REFUSE to transfer to the main office in NJ)
[21:52] <aditsu> I thought she said muff cabbage
[21:52] <GabrialDestruir> Because Jersey is a horrible place to live?
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[21:52] <mkopack> aditsu: So did I at first.. It's just the accent is so damn hard
[21:53] <fakker> aditsu, me too actually... lol
[21:53] <fakker> cabbage
[21:53] <mkopack> I HATE when they make me go up there for meetings and such??? It's the WORST state EVER to drive in
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[21:54] <mkopack> And they charge you tolls to leave the state, but not to come in!
[21:54] <fakker> at least they know how to make money
[21:54] <fakker> :)
[21:54] <GabrialDestruir> Sheesh....
[21:54] <GabrialDestruir> charging people to leave a state?
[21:54] <fakker> never been though, i'm from laaaaaandaaaaaaaaaan
[21:55] <GabrialDestruir> Next they'll have 50 foot walls topped with barb wire and snipers.
[21:56] <mkopack> Gab: Honestly, we probably should put a wall up around and and shoot those trying to leave! We don't' want them infesting the rest of the country...
[21:56] <mkopack> Ala - Escape from New York...
[21:57] <mkopack> Both Bridges across the river to get from Philly <--> Jersey??? Both charge a toll to cross TO Philly, but no charge to go from Philly-->Jersey
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[21:59] <GabrialDestruir> I want to build a city... where the only way in and out of the city is by train
[21:59] <GabrialDestruir> >.>
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[22:01] <OneFix_Work> GabrialDestruir: I think that was done in Land of the Dead :)
[22:01] <aditsu> oh nooooooooo!!!!
[22:02] <GabrialDestruir> Mind you... my idea for a perfect city, would exist in a gigantic disease proof dome too....
[22:02] <aditsu> you guys know how one US distributor is newark?
[22:02] <GabrialDestruir> So when the Zombie Apoc happens it doesn't get into my city
[22:02] <mkopack> yes
[22:02] <aditsu> Newark is a city in Jersey!!
[22:02] <mkopack> adit: yes
[22:02] <aditsu> ruuuuun!! run while you can!
[22:02] <mkopack> adit: Yup??? HORRIBLE airport BTW
[22:02] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: It's also a city in Ohio
[22:03] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[22:03] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: now don't try to throw a diversion
[22:03] * passstab (~v@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[22:04] <aditsu> OneFix_Work: or are you... *gulp*.. one of THEM?
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[22:06] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Actually, when the Zombie Apocalypse comes, I'd probably rather be one of them than one of the few that were left to fend for themselves...sure it wouldn't be so bad for the first few weeks, but when it gets Walking Dead bad, I mean what hope is there for society at that point...
[22:07] <aditsu> I was talking about the Jersey Apocalypse.. oh, same thing basically
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[22:09] <GabrialDestruir> Actually.... if you could cut one group of humans off and prevent say 10,000 humans from being zombified...
[22:09] * mikey_w (~mike@pool-74-110-218-2.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[22:09] <GabrialDestruir> You could probably revive the human race.
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[22:09] <aditsu> and have like 10 attractive females for each male, to enhance the reproduction rate, right Dr Strangelove?
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[22:10] <GabrialDestruir> Actually it'd have to be a more even number to try to lessen the blow of genetic degradation
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[22:11] <xlq> But how did we all survive before?
[22:11] <xlq> (Before the population was >10,000)
[22:11] * klm[_] (milkman@unaffiliated/klm-/x-7727058) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:11] <GabrialDestruir> Incest.
[22:12] <ReggieUK> or hiding in caves with big sticks just in case
[22:12] <GabrialDestruir> probably a little of both
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[22:12] <aditsu> http://xkcd.com/1003/
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[22:12] <ReggieUK> does incest exist in other species?
[22:12] <GabrialDestruir> Probably....
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> No.
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> In that it's not a taboo.
[22:13] <aditsu> ReggieUK: now that's a great google search to take a screenshot of :)
[22:13] <ReggieUK> not a chance
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> In many species males will be driven away from the females before maturity.
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> Which will tend to reduce things.
[22:13] <GabrialDestruir> Taboo or not, it's still incest, they just have less qualms about it.
[22:14] <ReggieUK> sure but I know there are many species where there's an alpha male in the group
[22:14] * Lemon (Karl@CMU-386785.WV.CC.CMU.EDU) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[22:14] <GabrialDestruir> Well no qualms about it...
[22:14] <ReggieUK> that only gets driven off by a larger/stronger male
[22:15] <ReggieUK> so my reasons for asking are, how does that affect their genetic degradation? Does it speed it up, as we apparently see lots of bad stuff happen through generations of inbreeding
[22:15] <SpeedEvil> It depends.
[22:15] <mjr> what channel was this again?
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[22:15] <SpeedEvil> It is a generally used technique in animal breeding to fix certain genes.
[22:15] <ReggieUK> and also, back to the 10k people to repopulate the world, wouldn't it also matter where that 10k were from?
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[22:16] <ReggieUK> like 10k from chinatown in london might not quite do it? but a spread of 10k across london from various ethnic backgrounds would do the trick through greater genetic diversity?
[22:16] <SpeedEvil> 10k is way over what's needed.
[22:16] <SpeedEvil> Technically - one woman and a bucket.
[22:16] <ReggieUK> and a handful of flies?
[22:17] <mjr> frozen bucket though
[22:17] <mjr> well
[22:17] <mjr> if you're not counting on twins
[22:17] <OneFix_Work> aditsu: Yea, pretty much :) George Carlin used to say he had a shirt that he bought there "Kiss her where it smells, take her to New Jersey"
[22:17] <mkopack> you guys been reading the Georgia Guide Stones or something
[22:17] <mkopack> ?
[22:17] <xlq> lol
[22:17] <GabrialDestruir> 10k is probably over the optimal number for number of humans required to repopulate the planet... but using 10k you could lower if not completely cut how genetic degradation that would eventually be caused by in-breeding.
[22:18] <GabrialDestruir> cut out*
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[22:21] <aditsu> "what about the families of the victims of 9/11? their feelings matter... for another 10 months dammit" ahahaha
[22:22] <OneFix_Work> GabrialDestruir: What a lot of people don't think about is that after the first few months, all of the ready-to-eat food will be gone and people will have to start farming...and farming while World War Z is going on is not going to be fun
[22:23] <xlq> Indeed.
[22:23] <xlq> It's hard enough with skeletons and creepers.
[22:23] <mkopack> Hell how many of us even have a clue HOW to farm?
[22:23] <mkopack> Or preserve food anymore?
[22:24] <xlq> Err, I know a bit about .. plants, and growing :-\
[22:24] * align (~inplace@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:24] <mkopack> My grandparents could??? my mom probably remembers youw (I remember watching them do it together when I was little) but my generation? NO IDEA
[22:24] <GabrialDestruir> Unless that was planned out to begin with, and the farming was already in place :p
[22:24] <ReggieUK> we'll be fine as long as google still works
[22:24] <mkopack> Which is why you load up on the guns and ammo??? With guns and ammo you can TAKE whatever you need :)
[22:25] <ReggieUK> if not, I suggest you start downloading the whole internet, NOW
[22:25] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Exactly...remember that things like refrigeration aren't going to work without power...and at the very least, gasoline would be limited, because the refineries will be closed down
[22:25] <mjr> two words: canned goods
[22:25] <GabrialDestruir> I don't need to download the entire internet....
[22:25] <GabrialDestruir> I just need to invade google when the time comes.
[22:25] <mkopack> Reggie: And keep it in the faraday cage and a generator with a LOT of fuel and/or solar panels and batteries...
[22:25] <aditsu> oh wow, Cartman says "I smell raspberries" in that episode
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[22:25] <GabrialDestruir> >.>
[22:25] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: The problem is, you don't just plant seeds and 3 months later harvest meals...
[22:26] <xlq> No, use bone meal and get it instantly!
[22:26] <ReggieUK> a lot of the 3rd world will cope
[22:26] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: You have to water and keep away the animals (which will now outnumber humans)
[22:26] <xlq> Wait, still thinking about minecraft.
[22:26] <mkopack> Exactly. gotta water, fertilize (most of which is made from petroleum based products these days), deal with insects, weeds, etc.
[22:26] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[22:26] <xlq> Weeding D:
[22:26] <ReggieUK> but you're all thinking about farming outside
[22:26] <ReggieUK> or completely outside
[22:27] <GabrialDestruir> Well.... depending on the type of Z Virus, it could infect the animals too....
[22:27] <mkopack> You guys see that show on Nat Geo about the people preparing for armageddon?
[22:27] <xlq> Right. Let's fill a cave with torches and farm in there.
[22:27] <mkopack> People who stockpile food, etc.
[22:27] <mkopack> survivalists
[22:27] <ReggieUK> poeple have been preparing since the 50s
[22:27] * paul_- (~paul@123-243-25-153.static.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[22:27] <mjr> there's a guy in Finland with a sauna full of sugar
[22:27] <ReggieUK> theres a house round here that's got a nuclear bunker
[22:27] <mjr> gonna trade it when the... something something
[22:27] <xlq> mjr: Aww, how sweet?
[22:27] <mjr> _very_
[22:27] <GabrialDestruir> If the Zombie Appocalypse happens you only need 50,000 dollars
[22:28] <GabrialDestruir> at least I think it's 50,000
[22:28] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-138-253.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[22:28] <mkopack> And a LOT of ammo!
[22:28] <ReggieUK> and I know of an old canadian 2nd world war listening post hidden under a hill near here too
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[22:28] <mkopack> Thing is, the whole Zombie thing is dumb...
[22:28] <mjr> me, I'm pretty much gonna die in the zombie apocalypse, so meh
[22:28] <mkopack> like "The Walking Dead"??? it couldn't happen
[22:28] <mkopack> It would burn itself out in no time...
[22:29] <OneFix_Work> ReggieUK: How are you going to do it all inside? Greenhouses take up a lot more space than farming outside...and they require heating
[22:29] <GabrialDestruir> Only if it was restricted to Humans.
[22:29] <mkopack> They couldn't just keep going on forever without having something to feed on.. and the main source of their food is also the way that it spreads
[22:29] <mkopack> so sooner or later the zombies will die off from lack of feeding
[22:30] <mkopack> (ala 28 Days Later)
[22:30] <GabrialDestruir> Depends on the type of zombie.
[22:30] <haltdef> walking dead zombies eat animals
[22:30] <mkopack> Doesn't matter what kind??? Sooner or later the body of the zombie needs to take in energy or it stops...
[22:30] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Unless it was like Walking Dead where everyone is infected because of some airborne virus
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[22:31] <mkopack> OneFix: Yeah, well, that IS the speculation, isn't it? Although they haven't come out and said it...
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[22:31] <zleap> Hello
[22:31] <mkopack> It'd be interesting to know what the scientist @ CDC whispered into Rick's ear before incinerating himself.
[22:31] <GabrialDestruir> A virus which could somehow infinitely sustain life, could infinitely sustain a zombie if it mutated into killing the person before keeping them alive
[22:32] <ReggieUK> he said 'lol, wtf? BBQ!"
[22:32] <mkopack> Gabrial: Not possible...
[22:32] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: In the comic book, that's exactly what it is...in the comic book, when Shane dies, Rick goes back and digs him up...he's become a walker...Rick shoots him in the head and says "I'm not going to bury you again".
[22:32] <zleap> just updated my flyer from yesterday http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3356122/rasppI/flyer.pdf if anyoneis interested
[22:32] <mkopack> Biology??? You need to have food to supply energy to the cells. It doesn't just suddenly make it's own...
[22:32] <GabrialDestruir> Our own limited understandings of the universe say it's not possible.
[22:32] <GabrialDestruir> Doesn't mean something can't change.
[22:32] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Because in the comic book, Carl shoots Shane after like the 6th book
[22:33] <mkopack> SHOOSH! don't ruin it for me!!!
[22:33] <haltdef> spoilers
[22:33] <ReggieUK> what if they mutate into some kind of solar powered zombie?
[22:33] <mjr> GabrialDestruir, pfft, let's not get into flights of fancy here
[22:33] <GabrialDestruir> Cause if you're going with that "theory" it'd be impossible for any zombie appoc to happen
[22:33] <GabrialDestruir> because a dead body cannot be alive
[22:33] <mjr> solar power isn't enough to operate a human-sized thing
[22:34] <mjr> well, they could accumulate energy for a time and then be active for a short while
[22:34] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Well, in the comic book Dale is still alive and Shane is dead, and we know that's not happening in the TV series
[22:34] <mkopack> yeah, I've only been watching the TV series??? And my understanding is there ARE some differences...
[22:35] <mjr> and the virus would have to put the body in pretty deep sleep mode for the charging...
[22:35] <GabrialDestruir> The bodies dead... can't get much deeper of a sleep mode than that.....
[22:35] <GabrialDestruir> body is*
[22:35] <mkopack> The thing with the 2 dead walker cops in last week's ep that didn't have bite marks certainly leads one to believe they're going to go with the virus explanation
[22:35] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Yea, most recently, Dale's death.
[22:36] <mkopack> Honestly, I figured at some point Shane would kill Dale...
[22:36] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Actually, that's what Jenner whispered to Rick at the end of Season 1
[22:36] <mkopack> And WTF is up with T-Dog? He's like the token Black Guy, and seems to only be used to hold up trees and door frames!
[22:36] <VeryHF> Oh man, now it is just ruined...
[22:37] <mkopack> I don't think he's had a line in an episode in weeks
[22:37] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Something to the effect of "Everyone's Infected"...which explains why when Rich asked him if he found anything, he said "No surprises"
[22:38] <mkopack> yeah that's the speculation I read online....
[22:39] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Not really speculation...because it's pretty much the foundation of the later comic books
[22:39] <mkopack> YAY! "Planned downtime tomorrow while we upgrade the servers" (RPi servers)
[22:39] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Actually, in the comics, Dale is dead too...but in the comic he gets eaten by cannibals
[22:41] <mkopack> Man, I hope this Slice-of-Pi add on board I ordered is going to fit ok???
[22:41] <mkopack> http://shop.ciseco.co.uk/slice-of-pi/
[22:42] * arnd (~arnd@HSI-KBW-46-223-44-216.hsi.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[22:42] <mkopack> can't tell if it's supposed to mount under the RPi or on top??? if it's on top, I hope they made sure to use a GPIO header that is tall enough to make the board clear the CSI socket that it's going to cover.
[22:42] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: On top
[22:43] <mkopack> I guess I'll find out in a couple weeks??? Worst case, I wasted $8
[22:43] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[22:43] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: I'm gonna wait till the GertBoard comes out...way more stuff to play with
[22:43] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Plus, it's going to come pre-assembled :)
[22:44] <GabrialDestruir> I'm waiting for the RTC clock....
[22:44] <GabrialDestruir> er
[22:44] <GabrialDestruir> RTC*
[22:44] <GabrialDestruir> not rtc clock .-.
[22:45] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:45] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[22:46] <mkopack> One: I'm probably going to get one of those eventually too???
[22:46] <mkopack> And yeah, and RTC would be nice??? but that should be easy to do over I2C.
[22:47] <mkopack> I just wanted the Xbee because I have a pair of those so I can use it to talk to my Arduino
[22:47] <mkopack> Rpi+Arduino Uno (or Mega) makes a heck of a powerful combination
[22:47] <mkopack> (relatively speaking)
[22:47] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: BTW, my expectation is that Hershel will go with them to the Prison (which is where they go in the next season if it follows the comic books)...the RV gives out after they leave the farm, which means they can simply use the excuse that Dale isn't around to patch it up anymore
[22:47] <GabrialDestruir> Supposedly according to something I read on the forums or maybe the blog....
[22:47] <mkopack> and STILL cheaper than a BeagleBone
[22:48] <GabrialDestruir> they're suppose to do an expansion board with RTC
[22:49] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Because, the discussions between Hershel and Rick has evolved in the same way that the discussions between Dale and Rick did in the comics
[22:49] <mkopack> OneFix: I just laugh because I live in Atlanta, so I recognize the landmarks and know where they were in places??? and I KNOW that Ft. Benning is only like a 2 hour drive??? they should EASILY be able to scavange enough fuel to make it there???
[22:50] * slug (~nuno@207-38-144-21.c3-0.avec-ubr2.nyr-avec.ny.cable.rcn.com) has left #raspberrypi
[22:50] <mkopack> should have made it there when they experienced the traffic jam on the interstate...
[22:50] <mkopack> So many little side roads to take it isn't funny
[22:50] * issue- (~quassel@88-117-60-225.adsl.highway.telekom.at) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:50] * beardface (a7cebd06@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has left #raspberrypi
[22:50] <strigel> mkopack: help an arduino noob who really wants one: what can you do with an arduino that you can't do with a the pi alone?
[22:50] * VeryHF (~huff@ has left #raspberrypi
[22:50] <mkopack> TONS of NOTHING between ATL and Columbus (Ft. Benning)
[22:51] * fexx (8d2f7b85@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
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[22:51] * PiBot sets mode +v Tomtiger11
[22:51] <mkopack> strigel: Hmm??? well, keep in mind, the Arduino is design SPECIFICALLY for interfacing with circuits??? The Rpi can do it, but is much less robust in terms of electrical tolerances and such...
[22:51] <GabrialDestruir> I'm curious why no one has made a case with some sort of extended GPIO so that the top of the case or whatever has a section in which you can access the GPIO or in the case of expansion boards be attached vi that GPIO slot thing...
[22:51] * rodrigo_golive (quassel@nat/indt/x-oiruoufgywtqutdk) Quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
[22:51] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: Yea, they filmed in GA because of the break they got for filming there...I think they got like 30% of their budget back in cuts and grants
[22:52] * Kostic (~Kostic@net216-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:52] * PiBot sets mode +v Kostic
[22:52] <OneFix_Work> mkopack: The stupid thing is that AMC is now taking the extra $$$ instead of letting them put it back into the budget
[22:52] <strigel> ok
[22:52] <mkopack> strigel: Plus the Arduino has built in Analog to Digital conversion, interrupts, a TON of digital IO pins, and the shields add a bunch of capability
[22:52] <strigel> what can you do with the RPI's GPIO? thought about that?
[22:52] <GabrialDestruir> Supposedly all kinds of stuff.
[22:52] <strigel> A->D yup
[22:52] <mkopack> strigel: You can do a lot of that stuff with GPIO's, but you typically will need to add extra hardware to do it.
[22:53] <mkopack> and the Arduino has buffering and protection on the pins so they're harder to fry if you screw up your circuit
[22:53] <strigel> but wouldn't it be cheaper to add A->D to the RPI via USB or GPIO?
[22:53] <mkopack> strigel: It really just depends on what you want to do, and your level of experience with electronics...
[22:54] <strigel> don't get me wrong, I really want both
[22:54] <strigel> just to hack around with
[22:54] <mkopack> I'm pretty basic digital electronics??? so I don't want to be messing with power/ analog stuff if I can avoid it
[22:54] <mkopack> Arduino lets me mostly stay in the digital world as long as I find stuff to hook up that is 5V.
[22:54] <strigel> They're so cheap, why not
[22:55] <mkopack> I have both an Uno and also picked up a Mega for my Robot (needed the extra digital IO)
[22:55] <strigel> nice
[22:55] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[22:56] <mkopack> the biggest headache with Arduino is the shields when they require use of specific pins??? That can sometimes make it hard to stack shields because you have to be sure they aren't wanting to use the same pins for different things
[22:56] <mkopack> But Arduino is STUPID easy to program (IMO)
[22:56] <mkopack> We don't know yet how it's going to be to do stuff like I2C or even digital read/write to the GPIO on the Rpi yet.
[22:57] <strigel> i2c?
[22:57] <mkopack> I'm sure libraries will come out to do those things in an easy manner, but they don't exist yet
[22:57] <strigel> I'm new to GPIO, found out about em cause of the rpi
[22:57] * Kostic (~Kostic@net216-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs) has left #raspberrypi
[22:57] <mkopack> strigel - look it up on wikipedia.. it's an interfacing standard.
[22:57] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:57] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[22:57] <GabrialDestruir> Just link an RPi to an Arduino and just use the Arduino to do all the GPIO stuff, and then just let the RPi do all the data stuff
[22:59] <strigel> GPIO's are high/low only by definition, yes?
[22:59] * genbattle (~quassel@203-114-137-9.wir.sta.inspire.net.nz) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:59] * PiBot sets mode +v genbattle
[22:59] <DaQatz> http://www.codemercs.com/index.php?id=127&L=1
[23:00] <DaQatz> Also handy for io
[23:01] * Calyp (~Calyp@unaffiliated/calyptratus-tzm) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[23:01] <strigel> DaQuatz: yes, I this is the kind of USB device I had in mind when I asked about the usefulness of the Arduino vs the RPI
[23:01] <strigel> I'm not surprised it exists, thanks for the link
[23:02] <des2> Chinese clone Arduinos are $19. Pretty cheap.
[23:02] <mkopack> strigel: Yes. either Gnd or +V (i forget, are the GPIO's on the RPi 5V or 3.3V ?)
[23:02] <strigel> wow, cheaper than the rpi!
[23:02] <GabrialDestruir> Just combine the two and use the RPi to actively program the Arduino as needed?
[23:02] <strigel> I wonder how much the chinese clone rpi's will be? :)
[23:03] <des2> http://www.ebay.com/itm/EKitsZone-UNO-ATMEGA328-ATMEGA8U2-Compatible-Arduino-UNO-/290656044777
[23:03] <strigel> GabrialDestruir: was thinking more of the RPI itself being the embedded system
[23:03] <mkopack> Use the Arduino to interface with various circuits (sensors, motors, etc.) and push the data from the Arduino to the RPi over USB or XBee or whatever, and then have the Rpi process it, and send commands back to the Arduino to control it.
[23:03] <GabrialDestruir> Yea basically
[23:04] <GabrialDestruir> all the best of the Arduino and the RPi
[23:04] <mkopack> That's one of the reasons I want to get ROS going on the Rpi - there's an ROS-->Arduino bridge.
[23:04] <strigel> mkopack: ok, got that, but what do you think of DaQatz's link as a replacement for the circuit integration features of the Arduino
[23:04] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
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[23:04] * PiBot sets mode +v piless
[23:05] <mkopack> strigel: Sorry, I know nothing about that
[23:05] <DaQatz> Arduino is cheaper though
[23:05] <mkopack> It really all depends on what you want to do...
[23:05] * Vazde (vazde@dea.fi) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[23:05] <strigel> aha, wait, just been to the warrior webstore
[23:05] * kism3t (~kism3t@client-86-25-193-1.bsh-bng-013.adsl.virginmedia.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:05] * PiBot sets mode +v kism3t
[23:05] <mkopack> I could teach a 12 yr old how to do stuff with Arduino.. and there's TONS of books and websites on it...
[23:05] * NIN102 (~NIN@ Quit (Quit: NIN102)
[23:05] <ReggieUK> that's just an arduino uno clone by the looks of it?
[23:05] <strigel> yes it seems 'compatible' arduinos are the cheapo's friend :)
[23:06] <strigel> mkopack: yes, this is a plus, it has momentum
[23:06] * rpiloose (~luser@37-8-173-92.coucou-networks.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:06] * PiBot sets mode +v rpiloose
[23:06] <mkopack> strigel exactly???
[23:07] <mkopack> Reggie: Yup.. it is...
[23:07] <mkopack> Personally, I can drive 2 miles from my house to Frys or Microcenter and pick up an Arduino, for not much more than that chinese knock off, so I'd rather just buy the real deal
[23:07] * stvc (~stvc@ame-bb-dsl5-ws-62.dsl.airstreamcomm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:07] * PiBot sets mode +v stvc
[23:07] <piless> what are the benefits/drawbacks of using an arduino clone over arduino?
[23:07] * taaz (~dlehn@pool-96-240-163-152.ronkva.east.verizon.net) has left #raspberrypi
[23:08] <des2> Cheaperness
[23:08] <mkopack> price
[23:08] <Thorn_> they're arduinonessless
[23:08] <GabrialDestruir> Cheapness.... is both a benefit and a drawback....
[23:08] <DaQatz> http://www.pjrc.com/teensy/
[23:08] <mkopack> As long as they build to the open Arduino design specs, it'll be the same
[23:08] <des2> It's open source hardware design and software. So the clones are really clones.
[23:08] <strigel> cloning an arduino very well is easy for these guys
[23:08] <piless> So, it's essentially the same, but not authorised by the ardiuno company?
[23:08] <mkopack> And there are other options as well - FreeDruino, Boarduino, NetDruino (for you .Net programmers)
[23:09] <strigel> cloning an RPI for less money than the real deal would be harder right now
[23:09] <Thorn_> nerduino
[23:09] <des2> It's identical just not made by the arduino company.
[23:09] <mkopack> Arduino has completely open designs??? anyone can build a clone??? they just can't call it an Arduino.
[23:09] <des2> You can make an identical one just can't put the Arduino name/logo on it.
[23:09] <GabrialDestruir> Clones tend to be cheap... as in break easier...
[23:09] <piless> Would a clone be able to get away with legal obligations like paying for codecs?
[23:10] <des2> Although I have chinese clones with the arduino name on them.
[23:10] <mkopack> There are No codecs on the Arduino??? I don't think you realize what they are
[23:10] <des2> Right.
[23:10] <strigel> I'm all for paying a bit more for the real thing. Second thought, clone + more beer seems good
[23:10] <mkopack> There's NO OS.
[23:10] <piless> mkopack: I was refering to that guy mentioning a raspi clone
[23:10] <mkopack> It's not a general purpose computer
[23:10] <mkopack> Oh
[23:10] <des2> It's a microcontroller.
[23:10] <mkopack> gotchya
[23:11] <des2> Runs at 16 MegaHz not 700.
[23:11] <mjr> if you use the original broadcom soc in a raspi clone, you'll end up with the same restrictions
[23:11] <mjr> and cloning that chip would be really hard and thus expensive
[23:11] <des2> Gonna be really tough to clone the broadcom
[23:11] <des2> More likely they'll make a clone with their own processor
[23:11] <des2> And compete on features.
[23:11] <philh> indeed, a full on clone of raspi is quite unlikely compared to a similar board using another chip
[23:12] <strigel> yes yes, my basic point is that even if people had to buy the ICs from broadcom, and license issues aside, a clone could never be significantly cheaper than the real RPI
[23:12] <xlq> Arduino boards have a "completely open design", as in, use this black-box chip.
[23:12] <des2> But really how cheap can the $25 one get ?
[23:12] <des2> $20 from china ?
[23:12] <strigel> des2: this is my point exactly
[23:12] <strigel> very small point
[23:13] <strigel> clones are only profitable if there is substantial markup in the developed product
[23:13] <des2> Chinese have a better chance competing with an improved design. Say one with 1Gig memory.
[23:13] <mkopack> that or they can get unbelievable bulk discount...
[23:13] <strigel> corporations have to pay for their R&D, while cloners come in and just copy that so get straight to profit
[23:14] <mkopack> Like if Broadcom is charging $5 for the CPU/GPU chip, and the Chinese can find something similar that they can get for $2...
[23:14] <strigel> that's the amazing thing about the RPI, the R&D is basically a freebee
[23:14] <des2> Right 6 years RPI in development.
[23:14] <mkopack> But that's doubtful
[23:14] <piless> But if they changed the soc they would have to recompile the OS right? Which would kind of break compatibility?
[23:14] <mkopack> Not without using something even older/weaker
[23:14] <des2> Won't get binary compatability in a clone
[23:14] * vgrade (~martinbro@cpc2-nrte22-2-0-cust128.8-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit ()
[23:14] <des2> You'll have to recompile anything.
[23:14] <mkopack> The chances of them using something newer design and matching the RPF's price on the broadcom chip are low
[23:15] * dattaway (~dattaway@adsl-66-143-35-238.dsl.ksc2mo.swbell.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[23:15] <strigel> mkopack: this is what I'm saying
[23:15] <Gadget-Mac> Evening all
[23:15] <strigel> the fact that the RPIs price is unrealistically low given the usual R&D budget makes it a poor target for cloners
[23:15] <Gadget-Mac> mkopack: I've passed you Slice of Pi query to the guys making them
[23:16] <mkopack> So unless they manage to source ALL the other parts significantly cheaper (which is possible since it would be chinese-->chinese in high quantities) and can get the board design down to 2 or 4 layer (vs the RPi 's 6) they aren't going to get insanely lower price point.
[23:16] <des2> If there is a Chinese clone I think it's be likely a same idea clone but with more features. Like more memory for $50.
[23:16] <mkopack> Gadget: Thanks man! appreciate it!
[23:16] <strigel> des2: yes agreed
[23:16] <mkopack> agreed des:
[23:16] <piless> mkopack: the whole point of the price is to get them into the hands of as many schoolkids as possible
[23:16] <Gadget-Mac> mkopack: no problem, I'll let you know when I get a response
[23:16] <mkopack> I know
[23:16] <mkopack> Thanks!
[23:16] <strigel> but the rpf are trying to start a revolution, then this will prove they succeeded
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[23:16] * PiBot sets mode +v dattaway
[23:17] <Gadget-Mac> Has anyone seen any open hardware designs for cases yet ?
[23:18] <piless> Gadget-Mac: There's a couple of shape-way designs
[23:18] <strigel> Gadget-Mac: there are a couple on thingiverse now
[23:18] <strigel> and that one done in blender on shape-ways
[23:18] <Gadget-Mac> Got a URL handy ?
[23:18] <strigel> http://www.shapeways.com/blog/archives/1240-3D-Print-a-Case-for-the-Raspberry-Pi.html
[23:19] <piless> Gadget-Mac: http://www.blendernation.com/2012/03/02/raspberry-pi/
[23:19] <Gadget-Mac> Cheers.
[23:20] <des2> Really people are waiting to get PIs to fit cases.
[23:20] <ReggieUK> meh, farnell pushed my delivery date back to may 14th :(
[23:20] <des2> Then you'll see designs released in a frenzy
[23:20] <piless> ReggieUK: Did you read the blog post about the re-released dates?
[23:20] <des2> Did you read the msg that pushed back dates were in error
[23:21] <GabrialDestruir> DOES IT BLEND?!?
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[23:21] * PiBot sets mode +v aeoutside
[23:21] <genbattle> i hope they're doing a run of like 100,000 or something
[23:22] <xlq> As long as it's over 9000.
[23:22] <genbattle> they're probably still trying to schedule a run
[23:22] <strigel> there are some dirt cheap 800x480 panels coming out of china now. I'll be looking to print a media player /tablet case at some stage
[23:22] <piless> genbattle: They decided that 10,000 was enough and they're moving onto the raspberry pi 2
[23:23] <Gadget-Mac> Think I'm going to try and find a laser cutable case :)
[23:23] <strigel> have laser?
[23:23] <GabrialDestruir> They're canceling Pi production
[23:23] <GabrialDestruir> and coming out with pi 2?
[23:23] <GabrialDestruir> with dual core awesomeness?
[23:23] <des2> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-case-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-made-of-3mm-thick-acrylic-by-Laser-Co2-/360439728388
[23:23] <genbattle> piless: i was referring to farnell/rc, not rpi foundation
[23:23] <strigel> the pii? pronounced pii??
[23:23] <strigel> the pii? pronounced pee
[23:23] <des2> Laser cut case on ebay
[23:23] <piless> GabrialDestruir: No, it's still in R & D, you'll have to wait till 2018
[23:24] <lars_t_h> piless, no, they had money to produce more than 10000
[23:24] <GabrialDestruir> lol
[23:24] <lars_t_h> *had not
[23:24] <GabrialDestruir> Figures as much
[23:24] <GabrialDestruir> Hopefully on 2018 we'll at least have like....
[23:24] <piless> lars_t_h: lies
[23:24] <GabrialDestruir> 5Ghz Pi
[23:24] <Gadget-Mac> strigel: Nope, but have access to one at reasonable rates
[23:24] <Gadget-Mac> 
[23:24] <genbattle> it's be nice to have a cortex-based pi with hardware floating point
[23:24] <GabrialDestruir> as opposed to like 1Ghz dated pi
[23:24] <strigel> Gadget-Mac: student? :|
[23:24] * Maccer (~Maccer@ Quit (Excess Flood)
[23:25] <piless> GabrialDestruir: It's not even that
[23:25] <des2> Check out that one on ebay Gadget-Mac
[23:25] <Gadget-Mac> Not student, no, thats was a long time ago :(
[23:25] <lars_t_h> piless, yes it cost nothing to produce, so true
[23:25] <piless> I think there are various workshops in some countries with 3d printers
[23:25] <GabrialDestruir> I think the only thing they need to change
[23:25] <strigel> des2: looks kinda shonky
[23:25] <GabrialDestruir> is the ram and CPU for Pi2
[23:26] <des2> shonky ?
[23:26] <strigel> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=shonky
[23:26] * lars_t_h (~lars_t_h@002128121047.mbb.telenor.dk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[23:26] <piless> I heard that the new one is going to be the size of stamp, rather than the size of a credit card
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[23:26] * PiBot sets mode +v jthunder
[23:26] <mkopack> lol
[23:26] <des2> heh
[23:26] <strigel> definition #2
[23:27] <piless> "A caucasion male or female who can be described as shifty, often seen crawling the back streets, often these specimens can be seen sporting a Burberry baseball cap."
[23:27] <GabrialDestruir> Shimmithy Shocknocker.
[23:27] <des2> The cigarette case one was shonky
[23:27] <strigel> piless: lol
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[23:27] * PiBot sets mode +v Maccer
[23:27] <piless> des2: a cigar box would make an amazing case
[23:28] <Gadget-Mac> laser cut ply could work
[23:28] * Guest14317 (~Matthew@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:28] <piless> Gadget-Mac: Why ply? Go mahogany.
[23:29] <Gadget-Mac> hehe
[23:29] <piless> Class your pi up a bit
[23:29] * dormant (~dormant@d54C3663E.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:29] * PiBot sets mode +v dormant
[23:29] <GabrialDestruir> Screw that...
[23:29] <GabrialDestruir> go with Lignum Vitae
[23:29] <des2> Marble case
[23:29] <GabrialDestruir> >.>
[23:29] <Gadget-Mac> For example: http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/sd-card-boombox-constructed-from-laser-cut-plywood-02-01-2012/
[23:29] <strigel> pimp my pi
[23:30] <des2> The rule is though your case can't cost more than the Pi
[23:30] <strigel> Gadget-Mac: quite like that
[23:30] * Vazde (vazde@dea.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:30] * PiBot sets mode +v Vazde
[23:30] <des2> Cause then you're just showing off.
[23:30] <piless> Have you guys heard about that phone made of wood?
[23:30] <GabrialDestruir> Lignum Vitae is like the worlds densest wood....
[23:30] <GabrialDestruir> lol
[23:30] <strigel> how about an old mobile phone case?
[23:31] <strigel> like one of those 80s ones
[23:31] <piless> strigel: Would it be wide enough?
[23:31] * mdavey (~chatzilla@host217-35-75-188.in-addr.btopenworld.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[23:32] <xlq> piless: Oh? Has Nokia branched out?
[23:32] <strigel> dunno
[23:32] <piless> xlq: No, it's made by a company in the uk, and has a ring flash, it looks really good actually
[23:33] <xlq> It was just a pun :)
[23:33] <strigel> piless: this one looks like it would fit:http://wallpapering-fog.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html
[23:33] <piless> ignore the fact that I'm linking to the daily fail, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2096673/Wood-believe-British-student-creates-smartphone-bamboo.html
[23:34] <piless> I think was at CES but I'm not sure
[23:34] <GabrialDestruir> I'm not sure you can trust anything dailymail has to say.
[23:35] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-0-231-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:35] * PiBot sets mode +v koaschten
[23:35] <piless> GabrialDestruir: It was originally on engadget or something but that was the first one that came up on google and I'm lazy
[23:35] <strigel> "designed the bamboo handset in his own time" gosh must have taken years to solder those IC's to the mother board
[23:35] <strigel> could have said: "stuck some wood to a phone"
[23:35] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8-dev)
[23:36] * Forca (~hendricks@209-254-225-82.ip.mcleodusa.net) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[23:36] * Delboy_1 (~Kombajn@245-35.dsl.iskon.hr) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:36] * PiBot sets mode +v Delboy_1
[23:36] <GabrialDestruir> I wonder how much it'd cost to have someone design a raspi case out of lingum vitae for me >.>
[23:37] <piless> GabrialDestruir: DIY
[23:37] <GabrialDestruir> lignum*
[23:37] * neciO (~juan@94-224-105-31.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:37] * PiBot sets mode +v neciO
[23:38] <GabrialDestruir> I could do it myself.... cept my wood working are lacking... and being the densest wood in the world... I can't imagine it'd be easy to work with regardless....
[23:38] <aditsu> just saw on twitter: "we'll be doing a camera add-on board too"
[23:38] <piless> aditsu: The beta ports had a port for it D:
[23:39] <fragalot> GabrialDestruir: i've made some razor scales out of rosewood before, which is quite hard, but not THAT hard, and all I can say is... f*ck hand tools, lol.
[23:39] <aditsu> piless: I'm pretty sure the final pi has the CSI and DSI ports
[23:39] <piless> aditsu: Are you 100%?
[23:39] <des2> Yes they confirmes the connectors are on the final shipped ones
[23:39] <fragalot> i'm off, gnite all. :)
[23:39] <des2> This was on the forums.
[23:39] <aditsu> piless: well, not 100% yet
[23:40] <aditsu> will take a few more weeks for that
[23:40] <des2> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/rationale-behind-missing-connectors
[23:40] <GabrialDestruir> I think I'd rather take one of these designs shown on like shapeway or whatever....
[23:40] * Delboy_ (~Kombajn@247-218.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[23:40] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:40] * PiBot sets mode +v iMatttt
[23:40] <GabrialDestruir> and contract someone to make me one
[23:41] <des2> Post edit by Gert: Yes there has been a lot of confusion about the CSI/DSI connectors being present or absent. Today (5-March-2012) I have been told that the CSI and DSI connectors ARE in place. Excuse to semtex for post editing his entry but I am only trying avoid the potential of more confusion by answering his question here instead of somewhere on the end of page 2.
[23:41] <zleap> fragalot, just hook up a rasppi to a lathe, do it that way :D
[23:43] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[23:43] <mkopack> Yup, the confirmed it with Eben they are on there
[23:43] <GabrialDestruir> Eh, maybe I'm just weird, but I think it'd be awesome to have a $35 computer surrounded by the worlds most dense wood
[23:43] <des2> Ebony would be nicer I think
[23:45] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[23:45] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:45] * PiBot sets mode +v rikai
[23:46] <GabrialDestruir> Yes, but you don't see a lot of people running around with lignum vitae stuff, so it'd be unique :p
[23:47] <des2> http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/lignumvitaecarversmallet.aspx
[23:48] <GabrialDestruir> lol
[23:50] * xlq (~apropos@89-168-188-63.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[23:50] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Lignum-Vitae-Turning-Blank-Logs-Limited-Stock-/300582163924?pt=UK_Crafts_Other_Crafts_EH&var=&hash=item8bb3e76a5e
[23:50] * s_much (~~butt_hur@li326-154.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:50] * PiBot sets mode +v s_much
[23:50] * piless (5ec43c74@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[23:50] <GabrialDestruir> I think those blanks are a little big for my need
[23:51] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:51] * aeoutside (0cc151da@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[23:51] * iMatttt (~imatttt@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:51] * PiBot sets mode +v iMatttt
[23:52] * KrimZon_2 (~krimzon2@super.duper.reetleet.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:52] * PiBot sets mode +v KrimZon_2
[23:55] * Lord_DeathMatch (~Lord_Deat@CPE-60-229-48-229.lns7.ken.bigpond.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:55] * PiBot sets mode +v Lord_DeathMatch
[23:58] * redukt (redukt@easily.backdoored.unixsluts.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[23:59] <mkopack> Ok, time to head home???
[23:59] <mkopack> later gang!
[23:59] * mkopack (~mkopack@173-133-163-208.pools.spcsdns.net) Quit (Quit: mkopack)
[23:59] <strigel> easily.backdoored.unixsluts.com: now this has to be the greatest domain ever
[23:59] <strigel> nite
[23:59] <GabrialDestruir> lmao
[23:59] <DDave> looooool

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