#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2012-05-02

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] <TopherBrink> they dont know about the secret debian image full of perfectly working hardware accelerated software
[0:00] <TopherBrink> shhh
[0:02] <flaushy> lol
[0:04] * chandoo (~chandoo@ool-ad032250.dyn.optonline.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:05] <des2> More people here might have had raspberry pie than have Raspberry Pis.
[0:05] * TopherBrink drinks from his official golden "Has Pi" stein
[0:06] * Tomtiger11 (~tomtiger1@ Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[0:07] <plugwash> Hexxeh, there are some issues with different linker paths between different distros, I dunno what environment dom built his binary in
[0:07] <plugwash> but I think as long as the executable has a correct dynamic linker path things should be ok
[0:07] * Tomtiger11 (~tomtiger1@ has joined #raspberrypi
[0:07] * PiBot sets mode +v Tomtiger11
[0:07] <Hexxeh> plugwash: bash: ./tvservice: No such file or directory
[0:07] <Hexxeh> i get a similar error on any of the hardfp binaries
[0:08] * imnichol (~ian@ has joined #raspberrypi
[0:08] * PiBot sets mode +v imnichol
[0:09] <plugwash> can you tell me exactly what you are doing with exactly what binaries?
[0:10] <Hexxeh> well i'm trying to add the VC libs/bins to the raspbian image i built
[0:10] <plugwash> ah they are shipping binaries as well
[0:10] <plugwash> ?
[0:10] <Hexxeh> just tried to run tvservice as a test, and get that error
[0:10] <Hexxeh> yeah
[0:10] * esotera_ (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[0:10] <Hexxeh> some services that are required for 3d etc
[0:10] <plugwash> as a temporary hack try creating a symlink from ld-linux.so.3 to ld-linux-armhf.so.3
[0:10] <Hexxeh> and a few diagnostic tools
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[0:11] * PiBot sets mode +v Matthew
[0:12] <Hexxeh> strace here plugwash: http://pastebin.com/ACnXkhjr
[0:12] * Matthew is now known as Guest92735
[0:13] <Hexxeh> hmm, symlinking it worked
[0:13] <Hexxeh> odd. thanks for the tip!
[0:13] <plugwash> not odd at all, just requires insider knowlege ;)
[0:14] * Tomtiger11 (~tomtiger1@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:17] <plugwash> upstream gcc is currently using "/lib/ld-linux.so.3" for both hardfloat and softfloat dynamic loaders meaning hardfloat and softfloat stuff can't coexist on the same system
[0:18] * IT_Sean (~IT_Sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[0:18] <Hexxeh> still having problems getting the vcfiled service running
[0:18] <Hexxeh> i wonder if the hardfp libs are actually tested
[0:19] <plugwash> Debian was using "/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/ld-linux.so.3" as the dynamic loader for armhf but other distros didn't like that so they changed to "/lib/ld-linux-armhf.so.3". Hopefully this new path should be pushed upstream soon.
[0:19] <Hexxeh> any downsides to the workaround you suggested?
[0:20] <plugwash> main downside is it means you won't be able to use multiarch to install armel packages
[0:20] <plugwash> but multiarch is kinda experimental at the moment anyway
[0:20] <Hexxeh> ah, that's not so bad
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[0:27] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit (Quit: The real world is just a crappy game... The ideal world can only be found within a game. Such was my believe. But if an ideal can be found within a crappy game, there may be an ideal route in the real world... for me to discover)
[0:27] <Hexxeh> nope, seeing 233442518: vchiq_lib: Very incompatible VCHIQ library - cannot retrieve driver version whatever i do with these libs
[0:29] <Hexxeh> ah, got it. was convinced i'd updated the kernel.img, must've made a very subtle typo
[0:29] * katnegermis (~katnegerm@ip2.c648.frb194.cust.comxnet.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[0:32] <plugwash> so is it working now?
[0:32] <Hexxeh> yep
[0:33] <plugwash> :)
[0:33] <Hexxeh> putting all the changes into the image, i'll redownload and test then add a new link
[0:35] <plugwash> Am I correct in thinking that everything in this image other than the kernel and the GPU related blobs are from our repo?
[0:35] <Hexxeh> yeah
[0:36] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:36] * PiBot sets mode +v prebz_
[0:36] <plugwash> what kernel are you shipping? one you built yourself? one taken from a foundation image?
[0:37] <Hexxeh> https://github.com/Hexxeh/rpi-firmware
[0:37] <Hexxeh> basically the ones from the raspberrypi/firmware github
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[1:03] * essen (u3040@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vaeqzjvlgiqvsevb) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * mozzwald (~www.mozzw@c-71-239-236-121.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * gallais (~clb11207@cafe.cis.strath.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * Bryanstein (~Bryanstei@shellium/admin/bryanstein) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * ajtag (~ajtag@cpc2-lee210-2-0-cust9.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * teso (teso@gateway/shell/sundance.i-rpg.net/x-trxucwtkzrficdik) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * R` (~RHA@ip7.j-k.kund.riksnet.nu) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * fakker (fakker@cpc13-hitc6-2-0-cust129.9-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:03] * vexorg (~vexorg@h216-18-7-221.gtconnect.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * pistacik__ (~root@ip-78-102-138-17.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * Anppa (~attuomin@scoville.pc.hiit.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * duckinator (~nick@botters/staff/duckinator) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * _av500_ (~av500@lgf.archos.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * Kolin (~Kolin@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * asm_ is now known as asm
[1:04] <NucWin> mv ./bot /dev/null
[1:04] <Crenn-NAS> Guest23952: Like yourself?
[1:04] <Guest23952> Crenn-NAS: Nope
[1:04] <Guest23952> Crenn-NAS: I just joined..
[1:04] * Kabaka (kabaka@botters/kabaka) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:04] <Thorn_> gotta admit autovoice is silly
[1:04] * SebastianFlyte (~sebf@pool-173-66-218-199.washdc.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[1:04] * phantomcircuit (~phantomci@ Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[1:04] <Crenn-NAS> It's silly until +m happens
[1:04] <NucWin> only useful if you are forcing people to login to services to talk
[1:04] * Guest88889 (~oldtopman@184-96-230-96.hlrn.qwest.net) Quit (Changing host)
[1:04] * Guest88889 (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:04] * SebastianFlyte (~sebf@pool-173-66-218-199.washdc.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:04] * Guest21339 (~jeroen@positron.soleus.nu) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:04] * Guest88889 is now known as lansiir
[1:05] * ukscone1 (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[1:06] <Crenn-NAS> NucWin: I don't know....
[1:06] * ukscone (~Russell@cpe-68-173-234-162.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:06] * jonmasters_ (~jcm@edison.jonmasters.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:07] * r00t|home (~r00t@port-83-236-58-48.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:07] <NucWin> is the bot python?
[1:07] * Kabaka (kabaka@botters/kabaka) Quit (Read error: Connection timed out)
[1:07] * phantomcircuit_ (~phantomci@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:08] <Crenn-NAS> If it isn't, it should be
[1:08] * Guest92735 (~Matthew@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[1:08] * shirro (~shirro@ppp102-6.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:08] * shirro (~shirro@ppp102-6.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Changing host)
[1:08] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:08] * Jaska__ (~quassel@dsl-olubrasgw1-fe49fb00-218.dhcp.inet.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:08] * Kabaka (kabaka@botters/kabaka) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:09] * kloeri (~kloeri@freenode/staff/exherbo.kloeri) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:10] * kloeri (~kloeri@freenode/staff/exherbo.kloeri) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:11] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[1:12] * curahack (~michel@sub-190-88-78ip130.rev.onenet.an) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:14] * zgreg (greg@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[1:14] * a5m0_ is now known as a5m0
[1:14] * a5m0 (~a5m0@cpe-173-175-206-85.tx.res.rr.com) Quit (Changing host)
[1:14] * a5m0 (~a5m0@unaffiliated/a5m0) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:15] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[1:15] * CcSsNET (~ccssnet@c-98-216-141-157.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[1:16] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:17] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@unaffiliated/hopsy) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[1:17] * Guest23952 (5ec4af64@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[1:20] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@nat/mozilla/x-tumxpxehqbkqakor) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:23] * koaschten_ (~koaschten@31-16-2-45-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:23] * CcSsNET (~ccssnet@c-98-216-141-157.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:24] * unknownbliss1 (~unknownbl@phpbb/website/Unknown-Bliss) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] * Guest70864 (~pc@cpc4-wake8-2-0-cust927.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] * d3p1 (~pc@unaffiliated/d3p1) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[1:25] * RITRedbeard__ (Yoss@t410.student.rit.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] * RITRedbeard__ (Yoss@t410.student.rit.edu) Quit (Client Quit)
[1:25] <blarson__> I just got an email that my pi should be sent the week of June 18. Order placed Feb 29. (Newark)
[1:25] <SpeedEvil> :)
[1:25] * friggle_ (~friggle@li60-24.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] * MrW (~MrW@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:25] * Charlie (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * memcpy_ (~memcpy@mxcell.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * DoubleV (doublev@warhead.gonecritical.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * shizzledizzle (~jkfresh@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * Charlie is now known as Guest50608
[1:26] * Hydrazine_ (~Hydrazine@5571f60d.ftth.concepts.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:26] * DoubleV is now known as Guest53107
[1:27] * decadance_ (~decadance@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:27] * bikcmp_ (~jason@94-23-15-88.ip4.rev.irondust.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:27] * aarch_ is now known as aarch
[1:28] * ebarch (~ebarch@li328-71.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:28] * bikcmp_ is now known as Guest87022
[1:28] * Mazon_ (~Mazon@ has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:28] * tpresenc1 (~presence@www.uncipher.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:28] * cjdavis_ (~cjdavis@vps04.thedavislabs.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:28] * Guest70864 is now known as d3p1
[1:28] * d3p1 (~pc@cpc4-wake8-2-0-cust927.17-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Changing host)
[1:28] * d3p1 (~pc@unaffiliated/d3p1) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:28] * n17ikh_ (~peter@c-174-56-150-44.hsd1.sc.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:29] * n17ikh (~peter@c-174-56-150-44.hsd1.sc.comcast.net) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[1:29] * n17ikh_ is now known as n17ikh
[1:29] * JonSeals_ (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:29] * folays_ (folays@hyrule.folays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:29] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:29] * markus__ (~markus@h-35-127.a336.priv.bahnhof.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:30] * mervaka_ (~mervaka@mervaka.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:31] <Hexxeh> anyone with a pi around to test a new image? http://distribution.hexxeh.net/raspbian/raspbian-r2.zip
[1:31] <Hexxeh> added the VC libs/binaries and a new kernel
[1:32] <Crenn-NAS> Sadly mine isn't delivered until end of this month
[1:32] <Crenn-NAS> blarson__: Ouch, I ordered mine on the 1st of March and getting it Week of 29th May
[1:32] <Crenn-NAS> What time zone are you in?
[1:33] * D34TH (D34TH@unaffiliated/d34th) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * koaschten (~koaschten@31-16-2-45-dynip.superkabel.de) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * Mavy-bnc (mavfree@ Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * unknownbliss (~unknownbl@phpbb/website/Unknown-Bliss) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * poptire (~quassel@ Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * tpresence (~presence@www.uncipher.com) Quit (*.net *.split)
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[1:33] * shizzled1zzle (~jkfresh@ Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * Mazon (~Mazon@ Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * friggle (~friggle@li60-24.members.linode.com) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * markus (~markus@h-35-127.a336.priv.bahnhof.se) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * folays (folays@hyrule.folays.net) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * bikcmp (~jason@april-fools/winner/thesecondest) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * cjdavis (~cjdavis@vps04.thedavislabs.com) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * memcpy (~memcpy@mxcell.org) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * fragalot (~thomas@gentoo/user/FamousToaster) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * mervaka (~mervaka@mervaka.co.uk) Quit (*.net *.split)
[1:33] * JonSeals_ is now known as JonSeals
[1:33] * Mazon_ is now known as Mazon
[1:34] <ecto2> i ordered march 7th and i havent heard shit
[1:35] <Ben64> well i ordered feb 29 and i got an email today saying i won't get it until at least june 18th
[1:35] * roman3x (~roman3x@bband-dyn167.95-103-144.t-com.sk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:36] <ReggieUK> my dad ordered on the day sometime in teh afternoon and I'll be getting mine teh week starting 21/05 :)
[1:36] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:37] * wjoe_ (~joe@lc8n.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:38] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Quit: Quit)
[1:39] <Crenn-NAS> blarson__, ecto2 and Ben64, where are you guys located
[1:40] <Ben64> california, usa
[1:40] * chod (~chod@toy-town.demon.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[1:42] <ecto2> sea of tranquility, moon
[1:42] * darrell (~darrell@173-45-224-130.slicehost.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:42] * Commander1024_ (~Commander@ip-109-91-120-118.unitymediagroup.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:42] <Ben64> lies
[1:42] * Mavy-bnc (mavfree@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:42] * stereohead-away (~stereohea@fiber-087-195-245-144.solcon.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:43] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:43] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-178.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:43] * oberling_ (~oberling@brln-4d0c1a1c.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:43] * wjoe (~joe@lc8n.com) Quit (Quit: Disconnecting from stoned server.)
[1:43] * davros (~davros@66-189-124-24.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:43] * Commander1024 (~Commander@ip-109-91-120-118.unitymediagroup.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:43] * L337hium (~ed@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:43] * Da|Mummy (~veki@cpe-76-190-200-98.neo.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:43] * stereohez (~stereohea@fiber-087-195-245-144.solcon.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:43] * L337hium (~ed@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:43] * oberling (~oberling@brln-4d0c1a1c.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:43] * philh (~phil@cpc1-oxfd13-0-0-cust605.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:44] <Crenn-NAS> ecto2: No wonder why you haven't heard back from them!
[1:44] * HobGoblin (~jaa@yatima.uukgoblin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:44] * davros (~davros@66-189-124-24.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:44] * HobGoblin is now known as Guest55285
[1:44] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@189-83-174-222.user.veloxzone.com.br) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[1:44] * ngilles (~nicolas@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:44] * Da|Mummy (~veki@cpe-76-190-200-98.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:44] * DaQatz (~DB@c-50-136-49-102.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:45] * UnderSampled1 (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-178.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:45] * Guest11300 (~KaiNeR@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:45] * imnichol (~ian@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] * pulser_ (~pulser@villainrom.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] * wirre_ (~wirre@h-205-235.a146.priv.bahnhof.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] * tntexplo1ivesltd (~tntexplos@segfault.net.nz) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] * Thorn__ (~thorn@osirion.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] * shigawir1 (~davidb@faith.oztechninja.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] * Imtek_ (~Imtek@gangsta.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] <blarson__> Crenn-NAS: Oregon
[1:47] * philh (~phil@cpc1-oxfd13-0-0-cust605.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * RaYmAn_ (rayman@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * cornet_ (~nathan@2001:41c8:1:4ec3::2) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * flaushy_ (~flaushy@euve10332.vserver.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * andatche_ (~andatche@2001:470:91db:2:9073:f93b:bbac:e895) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * CuriosTiger (stian@kenworth.bigrig.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * Conic_ (dillon@c-75-69-38-59.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * barend_ (~root@ks25111.kimsufi.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * Mez_ (~mez@ubuntu/member/mez) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] * alexsdut1on (~alex@comma.splice.org.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] <Hexxeh> anyone tried the raspbian r2 image?
[1:47] * ashH_ (~Ash@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * urs_ (urs@nerdbox2.nerd2nerd.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * trench_ (trench@your.place.no) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * a5m0 (~a5m0@unaffiliated/a5m0) Quit (Read error: No route to host)
[1:48] * Elfish_ (amba@fuplz.co.cc) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * hpham (~hpham@fwdweb.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * swattor (~swat@bitfolk.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * Dagger3 (~dagger@sawako.haruhi.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * basso_ (~quassel@pc5103.stdby.hin.no) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] * Guest69534 (linlin@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:49] * rm___ (~rm@fsf/member/rm) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:49] * mrdragon1 (~em@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:49] * mjorgensen_ (quassel@nat/nokia/x-jgalxvydzjqxutre) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:49] * mjorgensen_ (quassel@nat/nokia/x-jgalxvydzjqxutre) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:50] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@nat/mozilla/x-tumxpxehqbkqakor) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[1:51] * TTSDA_ (~Cookies@bl7-186-151.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] * nem (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] * m0spf_ (~steve@2001:ba8:1f1:f12e::2) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] * mmattice_ (mmattice@unaffiliated/mmattice) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] * nelson_ (~nelson@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] * convolut- (convolutio@i.love.tiltshellz.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:52] * mphi (~phi@2001:41d0:1:4718:7a20::1) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[1:52] * andatche (~andatche@2001:470:91db:2:80fa:9791:dad1:bb70) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[1:52] * Elfish (amba@2a01:4f8:100:90a1:abc:abc:abc:abc) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[1:52] * KaiNeR (~KaiNeR@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[1:52] * Pulser (~pulser@VillainROM/staff/Pulser) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[1:52] * m0spf (~steve@2001:ba8:1f1:f12e::2) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[1:52] * Dagger2 (~dagger@sawako.haruhi.eu) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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[1:52] * 13WAAWHI4 (~phi@2001:41d0:1:4718:7a20::1) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:52] * rm___ is now known as rm
[1:52] * Elfish_ is now known as Elfish
[1:52] * cjoe (~customerj@fibhost-66-7-177.fibernet.hu) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:53] * Delboy_ (~Kombajn@234-28.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[1:56] * Purgox (~v2@2a02:2308::216:3eff:feba:39f8) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:56] <mozzwald> Hexxeh: I've already invested too much time in r1 :)
[1:56] <Crenn-NAS> Right, so when it was the 29th in your locations, it was possibly the 1st for me
[1:56] * lansiir is now known as oldtopman
[1:57] <Hexxeh> mozzwald: interested in quake3? :P
[1:57] <Hexxeh> compiling hardfp binaries for r2 :)
[1:57] * ngilles (~nicolas@ Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:57] <mozzwald> hm. that could be fun I guess
[1:57] <Crenn-NAS> Hexxeh: Hardware Floating Point? :D
[1:57] <Hexxeh> yes
[1:57] <Hexxeh> i've no idea how much difference if any it'll make
[1:57] * ngilles (~nicolas@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:58] <Hexxeh> but i've got the timedemo thing from the press image to try as a benchmark
[1:58] * itamarjp (~itamar@fedora/itamarjp) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:58] * mpthompson (~IceChat77@c-50-131-39-81.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:00] * curahack (~michel@sub-190-88-78ip130.rev.onenet.an) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[2:00] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[2:01] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@nat/mozilla/x-hqbxqsuaarbhszza) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:01] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:01] <Crenn-NAS> Let me know how it goes
[2:01] <mpthompson> I haven't seen many people talk here about the Fedora distribution for RPi. Seems most are using Debian. Is that the case?
[2:01] <Crenn-NAS> I will be planning to do FP ops on the RPi at a later time
[2:01] <Hexxeh> mpthompson: Yeah
[2:01] <Crenn-NAS> mpthompson: I plan to use Debian and Arch myself
[2:02] <mkopack> Well, the Fedora build has been put on the back burner as the recommended release until the guys working on it get some issues resolved
[2:02] <Hexxeh> mpthompson: Originally Fedora seemed to be the recommended distro, but it's seemingly riddled with issues, and so now Debian is the recommended distro
[2:02] <Hexxeh> The press image is Debian iirc
[2:02] <mkopack> they're also trying to get it updated to the most recent version of Fedora rather than the older build they had been basing it off of
[2:02] <Hexxeh> mpthompson: Good job with Raspbian, btw!
[2:02] <mkopack> Debian is also the default distro used by broad com itself
[2:03] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:04] <shirro> informal polls at various linux confs over the years suggest that a lot more people use Debian than any of the distro counts would suggest.
[2:05] <Crenn-NAS> Aka linux nerds use Debian?
[2:05] <shirro> I still haven't done a debootstrap of raspbian. How much is there now? beuild-essential?
[2:05] * stephenl (~stephen@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:05] <Hexxeh> shirro: i've posted a ready-made image fwiw
[2:06] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:07] <plugwash> build-essential has been in for ages, we should have gtk within the next few days
[2:07] <Hexxeh> plugwash: any idea about git?
[2:07] <Hexxeh> plugwash: and readelf
[2:07] <shirro> plugwash: brilliant. that will be great.
[2:07] <Hexxeh> i need those before i can add rpi-updater
[2:07] <shirro> readelf is in binutils - about the first thing you build
[2:07] * Moonlit (~moonlit@unaffiliated/moonlit) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[2:07] <Hexxeh> doesn't appear to be on my image...
[2:08] <plugwash> do you have binutils installed on your image?
[2:08] <Hexxeh> uh, i'm an idiot, disregard that. must've screwed things up on an earlier image when i looked for it, it's present in r2
[2:08] <Hexxeh> git is missing though, how much is blocking that?
[2:08] * tntexplo1ivesltd is now known as tntexplosivesltd
[2:08] <shirro> git doesn't have a lot of dependencies
[2:08] <Hexxeh> quake3 is almost built btw
[2:09] <shirro> unless debian pulls in gtk
[2:09] <tntexplosivesltd> hmm
[2:09] <plugwash> I dealt with git recently, it's in the private repo now, should be in the public mirror the next time mpthompson rsyncs it
[2:09] <shirro> is anyone porting quake2 - I saw it mentioned
[2:09] * tntexplosivesltd (~tntexplos@segfault.net.nz) has left #raspberrypi
[2:09] * tntexplosivesltd (~tntexplos@segfault.net.nz) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:09] <Hexxeh> plugwash: awesome
[2:10] <tntexplosivesltd> aww still no voice :-(
[2:10] <plugwash> tntexplosivesltd, the bot committed suicide
[2:10] <SpeedEvil> tntexplosivesltd: Just be patient, you'll be voiced eventually.
[2:10] <tntexplosivesltd> lol
[2:10] <jaxdahl> i'm moving and need to change the shipping address on my rpi order on element14, anyone know how do to that properly w/o losing my order?
[2:11] <tntexplosivesltd> ring them up?
[2:11] <shirro> jaxdahl: you should be able to change the delivery details in the website. but yeah, if in doubt ring
[2:11] <plugwash> specifically it tried to voice everyone who rejoined after a netsplit and got killed for excess flood
[2:11] <tntexplosivesltd> hahahaha
[2:12] <shirro> whats it running on? an arduino? that really shouldn't kill anything
[2:12] <plugwash> shirro, it was killed by the irc server
[2:13] <plugwash> whoever wrote it presumablly doesn't know how to write an irc bot in a way that doesn't get it killed by the flood control code in pretty much every irc server
[2:13] <shirro> oh, ok. check some rate limiting in there
[2:13] <tntexplosivesltd> heh
[2:14] <tntexplosivesltd> just add a pause ;-)
[2:14] <SpeedEvil> Or just kill it.
[2:14] <danieldaniel> rapberry pi, y u break
[2:14] <mozzwald> plugwash: are wireless tools building?
[2:14] <danieldaniel> now I have nothing to do
[2:14] <tntexplosivesltd> SpeedEvil: that too
[2:14] * andatche_ (~andatche@2001:470:91db:2:9073:f93b:bbac:e895) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[2:15] <tntexplosivesltd> it should voice reg'd people
[2:15] * neciO (~juan@d51A445FA.access.telenet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:15] * danieldaniel solders open my trinitite light source
[2:15] <danieldaniel> whats all this green gas
[2:15] <tntexplosivesltd> instead of everyone
[2:15] * passstab (~coplon@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:16] * andatche (~andatche@2001:470:91db:2:9073:f93b:bbac:e895) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:16] * a5m0 (~Arc@unaffiliated/a5m0) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:17] <danieldaniel> why is my radon gas alarm going off
[2:17] <danieldaniel> WTF
[2:17] <mkopack> Battery needs to be changed?
[2:17] <mkopack> Or you have Radon?
[2:17] <Crenn-NAS> danieldaniel: Where is the solder blob?
[2:17] <Hexxeh> doh, libSDL in the quake3 repo is softfp, time to rebuild SDL from source
[2:17] <danieldaniel> Crenn-NAS: what?
[2:17] <danieldaniel> You mean on the rpi?
[2:17] <Crenn-NAS> Yeah
[2:18] <danieldaniel> already in the dump
[2:18] <Crenn-NAS> Awwr
[2:18] <danieldaniel> it was somewhere in the middle though
[2:18] <danieldaniel> from memory
[2:18] <Crenn-NAS> Top side or bottom side?
[2:18] <danieldaniel> top
[2:18] <Crenn-NAS> Eeep
[2:19] <tntexplosivesltd> solder blob?
[2:19] <danieldaniel> long story
[2:19] <tntexplosivesltd> heh
[2:19] <danieldaniel> i sorta burnt my hand and dropped the iron
[2:19] <danieldaniel> and then somehow flinched and threw the pi
[2:20] <danieldaniel> it was horrible
[2:20] <danieldaniel> When I plugged it in, it made a hissing noise
[2:20] <tntexplosivesltd> trying to do what
[2:20] <IT_Sean> did danieldaniel kill a raspi?
[2:20] <danieldaniel> solder a wire onto it
[2:20] <shirro> I haven't soldered directly onto a computer since I was a teenager. It is a pity the Pi doesn't have a built in prototyping area.
[2:20] <danieldaniel> IT_Sean: It baked
[2:21] * IT_Sean facepalms
[2:21] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: There isn't enough room for a built in prototyping area
[2:21] <danieldaniel> i'm 99% sure I was the first one
[2:21] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: Not yet. wait until they get more stuff integrated in future versions.
[2:21] <IT_Sean> congrats, danieldaniel, you are the very first to annouance that they have killed a batch 1 raspi
[2:22] <tntexplosivesltd> you monster
[2:22] <danieldaniel> IT_Sean: :(
[2:22] <asm> lol
[2:22] <shirro> I am hoping to kill mine with overclocking but I want to get my spare first
[2:22] <tntexplosivesltd> what was the wire for?
[2:22] <danieldaniel> tntexplosivesltd: long story, again
[2:22] <IT_Sean> What were you soldering to?
[2:22] <IT_Sean> GPIO?
[2:22] <danieldaniel> yeah
[2:22] <danieldaniel> And I dropped the iron
[2:22] <Hexxeh> why on earth were you soldering directly to the board...
[2:22] <IT_Sean> erft.
[2:23] * Guest87022 (~jason@94-23-15-88.ip4.rev.irondust.net) Quit (Changing host)
[2:23] * Guest87022 (~jason@april-fools/winner/thesecondest) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:23] <Crenn-NAS> I'm hoping I don't fry any of the Pis I buy, but will probably accidently while testing my Pi Topping
[2:23] <danieldaniel> Hexxeh: Because.
[2:23] <tntexplosivesltd> there's a header...
[2:23] <IT_Sean> why were you soldering directoly to the board...
[2:23] <IT_Sean> ?
[2:23] <jaxdahl> Okay, contacted newark live customer support on the web
[2:23] <danieldaniel> cause
[2:23] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: They are priced to be destroyed. Especially the model A
[2:23] <jaxdahl> they were able to update my shipping address but said i had to call the cc dept to update my billing
[2:23] <danieldaniel> i'm stupid
[2:23] <IT_Sean> it's just dumb.
[2:23] <IT_Sean> Yup.
[2:23] <IT_Sean> agreed.
[2:23] <n17ikh> jaxdahl: that's good news.. I'll likely have to do the same
[2:23] <danieldaniel> D:
[2:23] <Crenn-NAS> Some people don't have prototyping wires
[2:23] <n17ikh> I'm moving out of this place.. never though it'd be june before I got the rpi
[2:24] <shirro> Has anyone dared overvolt theirs yet?
[2:24] * Guest87022 is now known as bikcmp
[2:24] <danieldaniel> shirro: Almost
[2:24] <Crenn-NAS> n17ikh: They didn't think it would be this popular
[2:24] <danieldaniel> if I got through the soldering, that was next
[2:25] * IT_Sean hooks danieldaniel's pi up to mains voltage to see how fast it goes.
[2:25] <tntexplosivesltd> overvolt via the gpio?
[2:25] <IT_Sean> ooooh... smoke.
[2:25] <danieldaniel> XD
[2:25] <tntexplosivesltd> erm...
[2:25] <IT_Sean> http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/01/intel-mini-computer-core-i5-powered-nuc/
[2:25] * farmboy (~quassel@cpc15-cmbg14-2-0-cust146.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[2:25] <IT_Sean> ^^^
[2:25] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: I need the Ethernet, although I might be reconsidering that depending how cheap USB Ethernet adapters are after finding out about the USB 'hub' on the Model B
[2:25] <tntexplosivesltd> or different?
[2:26] <shirro> If overvolting reduced the life to a year - that would still be pretty good for a $35 computer. Is it likely to kill it in months?
[2:26] <danieldaniel> IT_Sean: Buy it for me pl0x
[2:26] <IT_Sean> No.
[2:26] <danieldaniel> :(
[2:26] <Crenn-NAS> tntexplosivesltd: I don't think the 1.8v rail is broken out to the GPIO from memory
[2:27] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: I think the 1.8 is generated in the SoC and stays there
[2:27] <tntexplosivesltd> no, that's my point
[2:27] <plugwash> mozzwald, no and they aren't in needs-build either, probabblly waiting for some dependency to become available
[2:27] <tntexplosivesltd> you can't overvolt
[2:27] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: The 1.8v rail is also external I believe
[2:27] <shirro> tntexplosivesltd: it is in the config.txt
[2:28] <tntexplosivesltd> ah, okay
[2:28] <tntexplosivesltd> sw configurable
[2:28] <tntexplosivesltd> cool
[2:28] <plugwash> wireless-tools is pretty low on my priority list, getting X and LXDE installable is more important IMO
[2:28] <Crenn-NAS> As you should be able to disable the internal 1.8v regulator, but I'm not 100% sure on that
[2:28] <shirro> you can overvolt and increase speed of arm core, mem, gpu, video accel etc
[2:28] <IT_Sean> Aye, you can overvolt the raspi, but it does void the warrenty.
[2:28] <Crenn-NAS> That feature is available in the Cortex-M3/M4 line
[2:28] <Hexxeh> yeah, burns an efuse so they can tell you've done it
[2:29] <shirro> I have run mine at 800Mhz from day one. I need to void warranty to go higher - and no backup Pi :-(
[2:29] * IT_Sean plans to push his to 1GHz, if he can
[2:29] <danieldaniel> shirro: warranty?
[2:29] <danieldaniel> wut?
[2:29] <Hexxeh> shirro: don't think doing the arm_freq burns a fuse?
[2:29] <shirro> And double the GPU Mhz if it will take it.
[2:30] <IT_Sean> No... you can overlcock without voiding the warrenty
[2:30] <Hexxeh> arm_freq=800 is default on the arch image, so they've kinda shot themselves in the foot if they're burning an efuse on arm_freq usage
[2:30] <IT_Sean> but overVOLTing will void it
[2:30] <Crenn-NAS> I plan to try to do my applications at 700MHz, pushing it to 800MHz only if I can't work around the CPU/GPU limits
[2:30] <shirro> Hexxeh: no, just the overvolt. but you can't go high without voltage
[2:30] <Hexxeh> ah, yeah, that makes sense IT_Sean
[2:30] <danieldaniel> WHAT WARRANTY
[2:30] <tntexplosivesltd> i wonder how far you can o/c without changing the voltage
[2:30] <IT_Sean> danieldaniel, you probably voided it by soldering to the board, like a dillweed.
[2:30] <IT_Sean> tntexplosivesltd, ~900, iirc
[2:30] <danieldaniel> If there was a chance of an FING WARRANTY
[2:30] <danieldaniel> I would have sent it in!
[2:31] <IT_Sean> well... you still can
[2:31] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: yes, apps should try and work well at 700. But if you want to develop natively rather than cross-compile the extra speed is nice
[2:31] <danieldaniel> Its at the dump now
[2:31] <danieldaniel> WOW
[2:31] <IT_Sean> you tossed it!?
[2:31] <mpthompson> I built the wireless-tools package a few hours ago manually to solve a dependency issue. It should be in there soon.
[2:31] <IT_Sean> wow... you are a dillweed.
[2:31] <Hexxeh> you soldered, you totally killed your warranty you idiot...
[2:32] <shirro> I think the warranty has a clause that specifically excludes soldering iron accidents. The solder blog might be a bit obvious.
[2:32] <danieldaniel> oh
[2:32] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: I'm hoping I can set up a little file server to act as a remote compile for the Pi
[2:32] <Hexxeh> mpthompson: would you find ssh access to a pi running raspbian useful at all?
[2:32] <Hexxeh> mpthompson: i've got a spare i can dedicate for your use if you'd find it useful
[2:33] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: I like distcc. It fits my mental model better than scratchbox or other cross compile methods.
[2:33] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: I'm not too familiar with linux. I know enough to get into trouble xD
[2:33] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[2:33] * IT_Sean changes topic to ''
[2:33] <IT_Sean> Oooooh crap
[2:33] <mpthompson> Hexxeh, thanks for the offer, but I'm too busy babysitting the build queue to have much use for a Pi at the moment. I'll get back to you if that chagnes.
[2:33] <danieldaniel> IT_Sean: did yours blow up?
[2:33] * danieldaniel hopes
[2:34] <Hexxeh> mpthompson: no worries, let me know :)
[2:34] <tntexplosivesltd> IT_Sean: LOL
[2:34] <mpthompson> BTW, I got a message from Newark/Element 14 my Pi will be in the mail soon.
[2:34] * IT_Sean changes topic to 'Welcome to the unofficial RaspberryPi channel. #raspberrypi, more fun than a spreadsheet, and tastier than chocolate bacon. danieldaniel is officially the first person to kill a raspi.'
[2:34] <Crenn-NAS> I still say that people in here are being a bit harsh to danieldaniel :/
[2:34] <mkopack> mpthompson: when did you get?
[2:34] <mpthompson> Hopefully I'll have one or two within the week.
[2:34] <danieldaniel> LOL
[2:35] <mkopack> Mine looks like May 29th batch shipment out
[2:35] * IT_Sean has been waiting for MONTHS to be able to do that.
[2:35] <mpthompson> mkopack: Earlier today.
[2:35] <mkopack> No, I mean, when did they say it should get sent out
[2:35] <Crenn-NAS> IT_Sean: Half ops? ;D
[2:35] <ReggieUK> how did you manage to kill your pi danieldaniel?
[2:35] <mpthompson> Oh, you are right. It says May 29th on mine as well.
[2:35] <IT_Sean> Crenn-NAS, asking for Ops is the #1 way ot gurantee you will never get Ops.
[2:35] <danieldaniel> ReggieUK: Ask someone else
[2:36] <IT_Sean> ReggieUK, he soldered directly to the board, and buggered up
[2:36] <ReggieUK> I'm asking you
[2:36] <danieldaniel> I'm depressed atm
[2:36] <Crenn-NAS> IT_Sean: That's why I'm only asking for half ops xD
[2:36] <ReggieUK> picture, shoe on head or gtfo!
[2:36] * lordcirth (~lordcirth@69-196-188-16.dsl.teksavvy.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:36] <danieldaniel> I threw it out...
[2:36] <IT_Sean> Crenn-NAS, asking for any sort of Ops is the #1 way ot gurantee you will never get it.
[2:36] <mpthompson> I'm also expecting to get another Pi soon through a backchannel, but I'm not sure when I'll get that.
[2:36] <Crenn-NAS> IT_Sean: Voice ops? ;P
[2:36] <bikcmp> Crenn-NAS: fun fact
[2:36] <bikcmp> Crenn-NAS: freenode doesn't have hop.
[2:36] <IT_Sean> danieldaniel, how long did you have it before you killed it?
[2:36] <danieldaniel> IT_Sean: less than a week
[2:36] <ReggieUK> so, how did danieldaniel kill his pi?
[2:36] <bikcmp> hahahahahahhahahahahahahha
[2:36] <Crenn-NAS> bikcmp: Learn something new every day!
[2:36] <bikcmp> HAHAHAHAHA
[2:37] <mpthompson> The guys taking soldering irons to their Pis are pretty brave. No way to replace the dead ones yet.
[2:37] <danieldaniel> FUUUUUU
[2:37] <bikcmp> you threw it out?
[2:37] <IT_Sean> ReggieUK, by soldering directly to the board, then dropping the soldering iron and dinging the board.
[2:37] <bikcmp> how the hell do you do that
[2:37] <IT_Sean> He said it fizzlpop'd when he plugged it in
[2:37] <bikcmp> oh
[2:37] <mkopack> Doh!
[2:37] <danieldaniel> fizzlpop'd?
[2:37] <mkopack> WHY would you solder directly to the board??? EVER?
[2:37] <ReggieUK> oh good, as long as there isn't an error on the actual board that they didn't find during testing then that's ok :D
[2:38] <Crenn-NAS> mkopack: No prototyping wires
[2:38] <mkopack> Then WAIT
[2:38] <IT_Sean> 'cause he's a dumbarse
[2:38] <ReggieUK> mkopack, might be trying to get at the i2s pins?
[2:38] <jaxdahl> danieldaniel, you gotta provide pictures at least
[2:38] <danieldaniel> jaxdahl: I threw it out...
[2:39] <IT_Sean> he already tossed it
[2:39] <ReggieUK> go and get it
[2:39] <jaxdahl> ^&
[2:39] <danieldaniel> ReggieUK: The garbage got picked up today
[2:39] <danieldaniel> Also
[2:39] <danieldaniel> it would have been really dirty
[2:39] <danieldaniel> something spilled in there
[2:39] <Hexxeh> danieldaniel: you realise somebody would probably have bought the broken board off of you, right?
[2:39] <Hexxeh> lots of case makers want them to design cases...
[2:39] <jaxdahl> dude. rub one out BEFORE you work on it
[2:39] <danieldaniel> Hexxeh: no...
[2:39] <danieldaniel> oh
[2:39] <ReggieUK> lol a bit of dirt vs pride of possibly getting it back to life?
[2:39] <mkopack> lol @ jaxdahl
[2:39] <mpthompson> danieldaniel, only you can now answer the paramount question regarding a Pi, "does it blend?"
[2:40] <danieldaniel> ReggieUK: I mean it would have been broken
[2:40] <danieldaniel> well
[2:40] <danieldaniel> more broken
[2:40] <danieldaniel> mpthompson: It will blend when it sets on fire, yes
[2:40] <danieldaniel> But I unplugged it before that could happen
[2:41] * itamarjp (~itamar@fedora/itamarjp) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[2:42] <mpthompson> Oh well, I burned out a 2.5" hard drive last week by putting 12v to it. And that cost twice as much as the Pi. But Amazon has 1000's of drives.
[2:42] <jaxdahl> i wonder how many people are going to kill things by mixing 3.3 and 5v
[2:42] <lordcirth> Anyone want me to do anything with a 20GB HDD?
[2:42] <shirro> danieldaniel: should have ebayed it. some sucker would have bought it for $200
[2:42] <danieldaniel> lordcirth: Water + cesium
[2:43] <danieldaniel> shirro: I doubt it
[2:43] <danieldaniel> Oh wow
[2:43] <danieldaniel> I should have blown up the raspi
[2:43] <danieldaniel> that would have been fun!
[2:43] <danieldaniel> and a good video
[2:43] <mpthompson> Would have been a youtube sensation.
[2:43] <danieldaniel> i would have made my money back in ads
[2:43] <danieldaniel> LOL
[2:43] <shirro> Should have put the $35 computer in a $35 blender and found out which would win
[2:44] <danieldaniel> wait
[2:44] <lordcirth> danieldaniel: Send me cesium and I'll do it.
[2:44] <danieldaniel> shirro: I wonder if its outside
[2:44] <danieldaniel> lordcirth: unitednuclear.com
[2:44] <danieldaniel> lordcirth: Will you actually/
[2:44] <danieldaniel> aww, they're sold out atm
[2:44] <danieldaniel> http://unitednuclear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=87&products_id=114
[2:45] <danieldaniel> if I burned my raspberry pi
[2:45] <danieldaniel> how many of you would post it on reddit?
[2:46] <shirro> danieldaniel: only if there are tits or cats or both
[2:46] <tntexplosivesltd> you want karma?
[2:46] <danieldaniel> tntexplosivesltd: I want youtube money
[2:46] <danieldaniel> shirro: o.o
[2:46] <danieldaniel> I'll put my cat in the background
[2:47] <danieldaniel> and i'll get those rubber tits from my health teacher
[2:47] <danieldaniel> Would it oh
[2:47] * mkopack (~mkopack@c-24-98-202-47.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: mkopack)
[2:47] <danieldaniel> wow
[2:47] <danieldaniel> I just realized something
[2:47] * danieldaniel puts raspberry pi under model rocket
[2:48] <tntexplosivesltd> remember what I said last night
[2:48] * phirsch (~smuxi@xdsl-89-0-170-156.netcologne.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:48] <tntexplosivesltd> language
[2:49] <mpthompson> I got pulled away before I could look at the questions about Raspbian above. Lots more interesting stuff is now building or will be building shortly. I'm trying to slowly get all the X11 stuff going.
[2:49] <shirro> I am surprised nobody has launched a Pi yet. I thought after that Pirate Bay post it was a certainty
[2:49] <danieldaniel> shirro: literally launched?
[2:49] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:49] <IT_Sean> It's only a matter of time
[2:49] <danieldaniel> I guess ill strap it to a model rocket
[2:49] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: When I get more, they'll be going in a UAV to do video processing :D
[2:49] <danieldaniel> under it
[2:50] <danieldaniel> would it blow up?
[2:50] <shirro> danieldaniel: I was thinking more balloon than rocket for an edge of space picture or something. I have seen mentions. I guess these things take awhile to organise
[2:50] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@nat/mozilla/x-hqbxqsuaarbhszza) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[2:50] <danieldaniel> shirro: But a balloon wouldn't blow up...
[2:50] <SpeedEvil> shirro: #highaltitude
[2:50] <SpeedEvil> danieldaniel: It does!
[2:51] <SpeedEvil> danieldaniel: Well - for values of blow up that include inflate and pop.
[2:51] <shirro> yeah, the ballon keeps expanding as the air pressure outside drops. until POP
[2:51] <danieldaniel> hmm
[2:51] <danieldaniel> I already have the rocket though
[2:51] <danieldaniel> how much are balloons?
[2:51] <danieldaniel> and where can I get them?
[2:52] * nem (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[2:52] <shirro> Ring the FAA and ask them
[2:52] <danieldaniel> lol
[2:52] * nem (~nemrod@unaffiliated/nemrod) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:52] <ecto2> http://hackaday.com/2009/09/13/pictures-from-space-for-150/
[2:52] <Ben64> pics from a balloon have been done
[2:53] <SpeedEvil> danieldaniel: Around $100, and the same for helium
[2:53] <SpeedEvil> danieldaniel: To lift a kilo to 33km+
[2:53] <danieldaniel> should I do it?
[2:53] <ecto2> YES Go do It NOW!
[2:54] <danieldaniel> i don't have a balloon though
[2:54] <danieldaniel> I have to order it
[2:54] <mpthompson> SpaceX is launching the Falcon 9 soon to the ISS. Tell them it would be great PR to put a Pi on board for the astronauts at the station.
[2:54] * inter|logger (~inter|log@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[2:54] <danieldaniel> lmao
[2:54] <SpeedEvil> mpthompson: Cunning - I like it
[2:54] <ecto2> better attach an hdmi tv to your payload so you can use the raspberry pi's hdmi output in space!
[2:54] <danieldaniel> LOLOL
[2:55] <shirro> mpthompson: and when it blows up who are they going to blame
[2:55] <danieldaniel> would http://www.scientificsonline.com/professional-weather-balloon.html work?
[2:56] <mpthompson> well, only announce the Pi on board after it is safely in orbit.
[2:56] <danieldaniel> http://blogs.howstuffworks.com/2010/10/13/diy-how-to-launch-a-weather-balloon-into-space/
[2:56] <lordcirth> Ya, get a Pi with Lubuntu on TV on the ISS. good PR all 'round
[2:57] <danieldaniel> yeah
[2:57] <IT_Sean> http://www.engadget.com/2012/04/26/adafruit-wants-to-help-you-hack-your-raspberry-pi/
[2:57] <danieldaniel> I'm gonna do that
[2:57] <danieldaniel> Seriously
[2:57] <danieldaniel> if someone can find me a link to where to buy it
[2:58] <lordcirth> danieldaniel: Send me cesuim anytime.
[2:58] <danieldaniel> Someone find me a link
[2:58] <danieldaniel> I'll do it
[2:58] <ecto2> http://www.adafruit.com/ ?
[2:58] * inter|logger (~inter|log@ has joined #raspberrypi
[2:58] <danieldaniel> no seely
[2:58] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[2:58] <lordcirth> danieldaniel: For a balloon or a Pi?
[2:58] <danieldaniel> balloon
[2:58] <ecto2> she'd be so much hotter if she lost the slut shrapnel in her mouth
[2:58] <shirro> danieldaniel: just ffs don't put anything radioactive up in the sky or you will end up in a secret detention centre with electrodes on your nuts
[2:58] <danieldaniel> lol
[2:58] <danieldaniel> shirro: LOL
[2:59] <danieldaniel> shirro: Only a pi
[2:59] <danieldaniel> with a camera and GPS
[2:59] <IT_Sean> and up your bum
[2:59] <ecto2> https://www.adafruit.com/products/801
[2:59] <IT_Sean> and in a few other places
[2:59] <danieldaniel> i'm not gonna get it
[2:59] <danieldaniel> like
[2:59] <danieldaniel> the balloon when it comes down
[2:59] <danieldaniel> is it possible for the camera to transmit it?
[2:59] <danieldaniel> pictures?
[2:59] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[2:59] <SpeedEvil> danieldaniel: We use - over on #highaltitude - 433MHz transmitters at 50bps - to transmit a GPS position.
[3:00] <IT_Sean> anything is possible
[3:00] <danieldaniel> SpeedEvil: and a camera
[3:00] <SpeedEvil> danieldaniel: We then have a live tracker to receive this signal, and display it for people to drive to. Camera is incidental and unconnected
[3:00] <SpeedEvil> To the recovery payload and GPS
[3:00] <ecto2> think its more sane to record video for later retrieval
[3:00] <shirro> I know for sure these guys have access to a Pi. I imagine it takes time to integrate it with camera, power etc. http://vimeo.com/19064597
[3:00] <SpeedEvil> Trying to get video or pictures down is _hard_
[3:00] <ecto2> the big thing is tracking it so you can get your toys back
[3:01] <danieldaniel> ecto2: I would use cheap stuff
[3:01] <SpeedEvil> However - we're now at the point where >90% of 'sane' launches come back.
[3:01] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:01] <danieldaniel> How far away though?
[3:01] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[3:01] <ecto2> can only get so cheap with a gps/transmitter/video camera
[3:01] <danieldaniel> oh wow
[3:02] <shirro> You probably don't want to launch it near the coast though
[3:02] <ecto2> still pretty pricey
[3:02] <danieldaniel> I just realized I blew up my GPS...
[3:02] * lordcirth (~lordcirth@69-196-188-16.dsl.teksavvy.com) Quit (Quit: stuff due tonight)
[3:02] <danieldaniel> Like a day ago
[3:02] <danieldaniel> it didn't transmit, actually
[3:02] <ecto2> my cat is outside in the rain with his gps logger i hope they both make it home safe
[3:02] <ecto2> since cats are hydrophobic for the most part it shouldnt be an issue
[3:03] * Syliss (~Syliss@ has joined #raspberrypi
[3:05] <shirro> I must admit the only reason I would get a cat is to borgify it. It seems like an interesting platform for that sort of thing. I get fined if I let the dog wander around but a cat can go anywhere.
[3:05] * lars_t_h (~lars_t_h@002128249044.mbb.telenor.dk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[3:06] * abhatnag (~abhatnag@ has joined #raspberrypi
[3:06] <mpthompson> ecto2: http://www.instructables.com/id/Teach-a-cat-how-to-swim/
[3:07] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:10] <shirro> I would have thick long sleeves and a full face helmet on before I tried that.
[3:11] * abhatnag (~abhatnag@ has left #raspberrypi
[3:11] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-178.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[3:11] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-178.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:12] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: Cat claws can go through thick long sleeves, you might need long sleeved leather jackets >.>
[3:13] <Hexxeh> got quake3 running hardfp
[3:13] * bugzy (~bugzy@adsl-99-125-70-181.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:13] <Hexxeh> hard to tell just by playing if there's much of a performance improvement
[3:13] <shirro> any difference in framerate?
[3:13] <Hexxeh> gonna run the timedemo now
[3:14] <Hexxeh> owwww
[3:14] <Hexxeh> just got a shock off my pi
[3:15] <danieldaniel> lol
[3:15] <Hexxeh> i swear there's a part of one of the edges where if you touch it you get a jolt
[3:15] <danieldaniel> BOOM
[3:15] <Hexxeh> nah, it's something to do with the HDMI port i think
[3:15] <mpthompson> Does quake3 have floating point operations?
[3:15] * uen (~uen@p5DCB243A.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[3:16] <shirro> Hexxeh: that is to be expected. All these double insulated power supplies these days float. They don't have a rail tied to earth. They can be many thousands of volts
[3:16] <Hexxeh> i guess it's not a problem once it's in a case
[3:19] * plugwash (~plugwash@2001:5c0:1400:a::317) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:20] <Hexxeh> i wonder why the binaries for some of the tech demos given to the press aren't being made public?
[3:21] <Hexxeh> at least, not as far as i've seen
[3:22] <SpeedEvil> Rights ?
[3:23] <Hexxeh> no idea
[3:23] <Hexxeh> as a side not, the quake3 on the press image just gives a black screen for me
[3:23] <Hexxeh> *note
[3:24] <SpeedEvil> You need to find the night vision goggles
[3:25] * DaQatz (~DB@c-50-136-49-102.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:25] <shirro> timedemo results?
[3:26] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:28] <Hexxeh> shirro: having trouble running quake 3 on the normal image now
[3:29] * uen (~uen@p5DCB20C7.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:34] * trench_ is now known as trench
[3:34] * trench (trench@your.place.no) Quit (Changing host)
[3:34] * trench (trench@unaffiliated/trench) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:35] * Conic_ (dillon@c-75-69-38-59.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[3:35] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:35] * Conic (dillon@c-75-69-38-59.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:36] * JeremyF (ad4c9a32@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[3:37] <JeremyF> just looking at the description of the channel but did danieldaniel actually kill his pi?
[3:38] * mikey_w (~mike@c-71-63-115-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:39] <Crenn-NAS> JeremyF: Yes
[3:40] <Crenn-NAS> Accidently
[3:40] <JeremyF> is it for sale?
[3:40] <JeremyF> actually
[3:40] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:40] <shirro> JeremyF: status of pi is not verified by third party or pictures. But if anyone can kill a pi...
[3:40] <Crenn-NAS> He threw it out
[3:40] <JeremyF> :(
[3:41] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: Does that mean I should see how easy it is to kill a Pi?
[3:42] <shirro> If you are going to do it at least document it and get some ad revenue
[3:42] * JeremyF (ad4c9a32@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[3:42] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: But of course
[3:42] <Crenn-NAS> And after I do something useful with it >.>
[3:43] <shirro> I am aiming to kill mine slowly. Too much I want to play with
[3:43] * Guest39732 (~mike@c-71-63-115-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[3:43] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:44] <shirro> I wish someone could dump everything there is to know about opengl into my head. Would save me some time.
[3:46] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:47] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:48] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: I'm having to learn the same thing, because I have a small team (2 people) starting to design a City Building game that improves where SimCity fails
[3:48] <DaQatz> Ah at the "being fun" part?
[3:49] * wej (~j@ Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[3:49] <Crenn-NAS> DaQatz: Hehe, I enjoy playing SimCity ;P
[3:49] <Hexxeh> anyone got quake3 handy? could do with a softfp timedemo
[3:49] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[3:50] <Crenn-NAS> Mainly that there is no instant buildings and no public transport planning
[3:50] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: nice. there is so much to learn if you come to it with no opengl knowledge. I am finding it really hard to debug when things don't work and I am really at the hello world stage.
[3:51] <DaQatz> Some of the newer sim city games were pretty complexe.
[3:51] * Onlyodin (~came@connected.by.excess.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:51] <Crenn-NAS> DaQatz: Sim City 4 was the last Maxis Sim City game ;P
[3:51] <DaQatz> Well, I only ever dabbled in the first or second game on my Amiga.
[3:52] <DaQatz> But I do remeber my brother even having to plumbing
[3:52] <Crenn-NAS> There is Cities XL and a few other city building games, but they're not as good
[3:53] <Crenn-NAS> Bottle necks of the transport system make it very frustrating ;P
[3:53] * DaQatz nods.
[3:54] <SpeedEvil> Openstreetmap.com - the ultimate citybuilding game
[3:54] <Crenn-NAS> Essentially what I want to do is to combine a game called Cities in Motion, which is entirely building a public transport system, and SimCity
[3:54] * wej (~j@ has joined #raspberrypi
[3:54] <SpeedEvil> Add sewers, water too!
[3:54] <jaxdahl> i ordered feb 29, mine is june 18 according to the email but my order history hasn't been updated
[3:54] <Crenn-NAS> SpeedEvil: Nope
[3:54] <Crenn-NAS> SpeedEvil: Sim City has water ;P
[3:55] <Crenn-NAS> jaxdahl: My order doesn't have an expected date
[3:55] <jaxdahl> Crenn-NAS, too bad maxis is owned by EA
[3:55] <SpeedEvil> Crenn-NAS: Piped water?
[3:55] <Crenn-NAS> jaxdahl: Agreed
[3:55] <DaQatz> Should also have gas, and internet.
[3:55] <Crenn-NAS> SpeedEvil: Yes
[3:56] <shirro> Rotting copper wires, fibre rollouts, mobile phone towers...
[3:56] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: You're in SA right?
[3:57] <shirro> Yeah.
[3:57] <Crenn-NAS> DaQatz: The concept of having Internet is being considered
[3:57] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: Pro or Anti NBN
[3:58] <Crenn-NAS> Just curious
[3:58] <shirro> Pro faster internet by any means
[3:58] <Crenn-NAS> Even FTTN?
[3:58] <shirro> Any means. But prefer the best.
[3:59] <shirro> Fibre rollout here starts in 2015 if my some miracle the luddites don't get elected
[3:59] * jamesglanville (~james@host-92-27-55-215.static.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:59] * the_real_crimper (~the_real_@cpe-98-154-91-166.socal.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:00] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: Same here, I'm preparing for the morons to get in though :(
[4:00] <Crenn-NAS> News Ltd will garentee that
[4:03] * jamesglanville (~james@host-92-27-55-215.static.as13285.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[4:06] <ecto2> government owned/controlled internet? nothanx
[4:07] -kloeri- [Global Notice] Hi all. We're experiencing some technical problems and as a side-effect of that services email is currently down. This means that registering nicks and sending password reset emails won't currently work. The mails will be queued up but it's unknown when they'll be delivered. Thank you for using freenode.
[4:07] <ecto2> i'd rather have psk31
[4:07] <Crenn-NAS> ecto2: Government owned, but not controlled
[4:07] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:08] <ecto2> they just spy on you with it then
[4:08] <ecto2> since they "control" the hubs
[4:08] <ecto2> :P
[4:09] <shirro> I am in a very safe liberal seat. Only my senate vote counts. I expect the local member would love to get faster Internet for his electorate but he would give it up to get into government. I actually emailed him and suggested they make Turnbull opposition spokesman for communications after last election thinking he might help them develop policy but they just used him as attack dog :-(
[4:11] <Hexxeh> argh, where the hell is q3dm6.bsp
[4:12] <ecto2> quake 3 deathmatch map 6 .bsp (map file)
[4:12] <ecto2> oh where
[4:12] <ecto2> i thats you said what
[4:14] * oberling (~oberling@brln-4db9d4dd.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:16] * wkl (~Conan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[4:17] * wkl (~Conan@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[4:17] * oberling_ (~oberling@brln-4d0c1a1c.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[4:18] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: Hoping Abbott gets hit by a bus. There is no reason lib policy has to be anti-intellectual and anti-technology. It is just crap leadership from a very negative idiot. Their core demographic, small business, would benefit a lot from the nbn. And if they win a landslide they can tell Murdoch to go get fcked.
[4:18] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: I emailed my electorate representative to tell him he shouldn't vote for Rudd
[4:18] * EiN_ (~einstein@ Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[4:18] * wkl (~Conan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[4:18] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: Not going to happen though
[4:18] <Crenn-NAS> Frankly, I don't like the prospects for both sides
[4:20] * EiNSTeiN_ (~einstein@unaffiliated/einstein/x-615171) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:23] * namfonos (~boris@108-194-22-242.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:24] * Compy (~Compy@c-98-251-52-68.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) Quit ()
[4:25] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@c-67-180-20-19.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:25] <shirro> Crenn-NAS: Could be dire for the greens as well though. They could easily follow the democrats. Disagree with some of their policy but Ludlum is fantastic.
[4:27] * convolut- (convolutio@i.love.tiltshellz.org) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[4:27] <Crenn-NAS> I like Ludlum and I do disagree with them sometimes
[4:30] <ecto2> two sides
[4:30] <ecto2> same coin
[4:31] <shirro> Don't want us to end up like the uk under 24hr surveillance and filtered Internet or like the US which is on the edge of fascism. At least the libs are anti-filter. Catholic ALP right are very much in love with the nanny state.
[4:32] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Quit: Ik ga weg)
[4:33] <ReggieUK> langueage shirro!
[4:33] <ReggieUK> :)
[4:34] <ReggieUK> I agree on what you said about murdoch though
[4:34] <RITRedbeard> evenin'
[4:34] <ReggieUK> he can do that :D
[4:34] <ReggieUK> hi
[4:34] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:36] <shirro> As a South Australian, birthplace of News Ltd, I want to apologise to the entire world. If we had only known what we were unleashing we would have had Murdoch in a barrel of acid years ago.
[4:37] <ReggieUK> appreciated
[4:40] * convolution (convolutio@i.love.tiltshellz.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:40] * stephenl (~stephenl@174-27-132-109.slkc.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:43] <Crenn-NAS> shirro: The filter idea needs to die in a fire
[4:43] <Crenn-NAS> Rabbit too
[4:44] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:45] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:46] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:46] * cjbaird (~cjb@ppp121-45-175-149.lns20.syd6.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:47] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:49] <cjbaird> "Plates"? .. No, you don't want the Maker????? Cancer overpricing everything...
[4:50] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[4:50] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:51] <ReggieUK> is that about the adafruit pi board?
[4:51] <ReggieUK> it's a bit lame that that's the best they can come up with
[4:52] * jamesglanville (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Client Quit)
[4:52] * jamesglanville1 (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:53] <cjbaird> It brings traffic to their advertising blog, which all that matters... >_>
[4:53] * stephenl (~stephenl@c-67-166-113-196.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:53] * mrdragon1 is now known as mrdragons
[4:55] <cjbaird> "Shields", "
[4:55] <shirro> It seems a bit of a clumsy device for hardware hacking though. Will many people do that vs use an Arduino?
[4:57] * Milos|Netbook (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:59] * FZombie (~STN@c-71-202-59-211.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:59] * FZombie (~STN@c-71-202-59-211.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Changing host)
[4:59] * FZombie (~STN@pdpc/supporter/student/GPLGeek) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:00] <cjbaird> "Shields", "BoosterPack", "Backpacks", "Carrier", and now "Plates"... What's wrong with the actual name "breakout board"? ... Oh wait, this is to appeal to the crowd who want them called "sketches", rather than "programs"..
[5:00] <Crenn-NAS> Still say it should be Pi Toppings
[5:00] * passstab (~coplon@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:02] <cjbaird> The classic alternate name used to be 'daughter board', but I expect some Grrrl objected to the Systematic Sexism In the Computer Industry...
[5:04] <mrdragons> I don't see how that would be sexist
[5:05] <shirro> mrdragons: it isn't sexist but it is using gender specific language and society has moved away from that so much it starts to look strange.
[5:06] * jamesglanville1 (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[5:06] <cjbaird> "Gender specific pronouns" were a big thing amoung the Andrea Dorkwin followers a decade or so ago..
[5:08] <cjbaird> Sites like http://aetherlumina.com/gnp/ that're on the 'sexist language reform' agenda
[5:08] <shirro> and there is systematic sexism in the computer industry which is pretty much an established fact :-(
[5:08] * mikey_w (~mike@c-71-63-115-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:08] * mike_ (~mike@c-71-63-115-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:09] <mrdragons> "Sexist language reform"? Wtf?
[5:09] * mike_ is now known as Guest64405
[5:11] <shirro> I am pleased nobody has abolished male and female connectors because it would make things very confusing.
[5:12] * anon9002 (~anon@KYM5298.rh.psu.edu) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[5:13] <ecto2> heh
[5:13] <shirro> "So is that a transgender usb or an intersex or androgenous or..."
[5:14] * Guest35386 is now known as wizkid057
[5:14] * phantoneD (~destroy@a95-92-89-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:15] <shirro> The new "sensitive" thing to do is replace M/F with a text box or not ask it at all. That would make ordering from Farnell really complicated.
[5:15] <cjbaird> "What if we standardize what to call 'positive' and 'negative' headers?" "That would imply that the part that gets inserted into is the 'negative'!!"
[5:16] <mrdragons> Does it really matter though? It's not like we're going to get rid of genders, unless we want to spontaniously stop reproducing
[5:17] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56d9.bb.sky.com) Quit ()
[5:17] <ecto2> politically correct cable id like to see the real stats on sexyually today
[5:17] <cjbaird> Biological analogues are acceptible elsewhere ('brain', 'lungs of the Earth', etc.)
[5:18] * phantoxeD (~destroy@a95-92-89-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[5:19] <shirro> mrdragons: it matters when genders are used as the default way to refer to something so it suggests it is off limits to the other gender. which is why common use of language has changed. what would be crazy is if it overflowed into other areas due to an inability to use gender in language as a result.
[5:21] * jamesglanville (~james@ has joined #raspberrypi
[5:22] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Quit: Ik ga weg)
[5:26] * koaschten_ (~koaschten@31-16-2-45-dynip.superkabel.de) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[5:32] * tpresenc1 is now known as tpresence
[5:32] * arthurdent (~arthurden@ has joined #raspberrypi
[5:32] <arthurdent> what kind of wifi card do i want?
[5:42] * phantomcircuit_ is now known as phantomcircuit
[5:43] <ecto2> up to you
[5:43] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ Quit (Quit: night)
[5:44] <arthurdent> there aren't any that work better than others?
[5:47] * eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[5:48] <ecto2> not really
[5:48] <ecto2> they all sort of have to conform to the wireless standards
[5:48] <ShiftPlusOne> Got a strange marketing call from element14 O_o
[5:48] <ShiftPlusOne> is everyone getting those?
[5:48] <ecto2> asterisk answers my phone and routes them to music on hold indefinately
[5:48] <ecto2> 8D
[5:49] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[5:49] <ecto2> also use Zapateller()
[5:49] <ShiftPlusOne> is it like annoying elevator music?
[5:49] <ecto2> worse
[5:49] * politoed (~theorem@a94-132-176-42.cpe.netcabo.pt) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[5:49] <ecto2> lady gaga XD
[5:49] * politoed (~theorem@a94-132-176-42.cpe.netcabo.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:49] <ShiftPlusOne> oh dear
[5:49] <ecto2> and bud light comercials
[5:49] <ecto2> so its not all that bad
[5:50] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[5:50] <ecto2> i hear people actually like lady gaga though
[5:51] * KrisW (~kris@cpc7-swin14-2-0-cust99.3-1.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[5:53] * KrisW (~kris@cpc7-swin14-2-0-cust99.3-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:53] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) Quit (Quit: oldtopman has left the house)
[5:54] * Milos (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:55] <ShiftPlusOne> "Dear Serge, Thank you for your time on the phone today."
[5:55] <ShiftPlusOne> Am I going to get love letters now... wtf
[5:55] <Crenn-NAS> Your name is Serge?
[5:55] <ShiftPlusOne> Well, it would have to be.
[5:56] <Crenn-NAS> I've never met anyone named Serge :(
[5:56] <ShiftPlusOne> Don't worry, Serges are overrated.
[5:57] * fiftyonefifty (~fiftyonef@ Quit (Quit: This here's FiftyOneFifty on the side. We gone, bye bye)
[5:58] * jamesglanville1 (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:58] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-178.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[5:59] * jamesglanville (~james@ Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[6:05] <arthurdent> don't wifi cards have to have drivers compiled for arm and stuff?
[6:05] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj1993) Quit (Quit: kcj)
[6:05] <ShiftPlusOne> arthurdent, yeah, most of them seem too have either kernel drivers, or open drivers with closed firmware.
[6:07] <ShiftPlusOne> I haven't had trouble with the ralink and atheros chips. For my ralink one, the provided driver and firmware didn't work, so I had to download from their website, cross-compile and install it, but then it worked fine.
[6:08] * Milos|Netbook (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[6:09] <mozzwald> my ralink rt2500 works
[6:13] <arthurdent> cool
[6:13] <arthurdent> mozzwald: how much trouble did you have setting it up? i can compile and stuff, i'm just not looking to make this hard on myself :P
[6:17] <mozzwald> plugged it in and was detected fine. used wpa_supplicant to connect. only problem wa I had to "iwconfig power off" before running wpa_supplicant or it wouldn't work
[6:17] <mozzwald> s/wa/was
[6:17] <mozzwald> er, "iwconfig wlan0 power off"
[6:18] <arthurdent> eight
[6:18] <arthurdent> right*
[6:18] <DaQatz> ShiftPlusOne, Just always use a new name when talking to a client.
[6:24] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@189-83-155-159.user.veloxzone.com.br) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:37] * jamesglanville1 (~james@global-2-74.nat.csx.cam.ac.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[6:45] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[6:46] * mukti (~eric@pool-71-251-130-72.cmdnnj.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:46] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:47] * stephenl (~stephenl@c-67-166-113-196.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[6:49] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[6:49] <mukti> Has anyone heard anything from farnell export regarding shipments of first day pre-orders?
[7:01] <Crenn-NAS> element14, but yes
[7:02] <ShiftPlusOne> nuh he's asking specifically the export site, which is farnell, not element14
[7:03] <RITRedbeard> here is a less common question
[7:03] <RITRedbeard> Is RS/Farnell/Element 14 order by on as as needed basis
[7:03] <RITRedbeard> or is the next or after next order gonna be huge?
[7:03] <RITRedbeard> like a million units
[7:03] <RITRedbeard> so we don't have to play pre-order silly games
[7:04] <RITRedbeard> also farnell/rs/element14 would be RETARDED to not think that they couldn't move 1 mill units
[7:04] <ShiftPlusOne> I don't think they can produce that many that quickly
[7:04] <RITRedbeard> it will be trivial
[7:04] * Gallomimia (~Gallo@S0106602ad08026fc.ca.shawcable.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:04] <RITRedbeard> can't they get a short term loan or something?
[7:04] <ShiftPlusOne> It will probably just be continuous production based on demand
[7:04] <RITRedbeard> ugh
[7:05] <ShiftPlusOne> but yeah, just speculating.
[7:05] <RITRedbeard> okay how about I put aside my contempt and let bygones be bygones
[7:05] <RITRedbeard> can they at least accept donations?
[7:05] <Ben64> they're all being produced by one small factory iirc
[7:05] <RITRedbeard> I will donate if that means it helps them make more units faster
[7:05] <RITRedbeard> it's selling like hot cakes
[7:05] <ShiftPlusOne> Yeah, I don't think it's a matter of money anymore, just how fast the factory can produce them.
[7:05] <RITRedbeard> does distributer ever front manfac. money?
[7:05] <RITRedbeard> I mean
[7:06] <Crenn-NAS> RITRedbeard: Considering they have around 150000 Pis ordered and expect to fulfil all orders before Junly, that's fairly impressive
[7:06] <RITRedbeard> wouldn't be in these guys best interest to make sure the product keeps flying off digital shelves/warehouses
[7:06] * RITRedbeard shrugs
[7:06] <RITRedbeard> Amazon could have done it better.
[7:07] <RITRedbeard> :)
[7:07] <Ben64> yep
[7:07] <Crenn-NAS> RITRedbeard: Yes and no
[7:07] <namfonos> my monitor is 1680x1050 but the rpi will only give me 1584x954. anyone how to fix this
[7:07] <Ben64> instead they chose two UK based companies :|
[7:07] <RITRedbeard> amazon is international!
[7:07] <RITRedbeard> c'mon
[7:07] <namfonos> i seem to remember something about some conf file
[7:07] <namfonos> somewhere
[7:07] <namfonos> on the card
[7:07] <ShiftPlusOne> amazon is far from international
[7:07] * RITRedbeard shrugs
[7:07] <Ben64> and farnell couldn't figure out how much to charge for it
[7:07] <RITRedbeard> They're international to me!
[7:07] <RITRedbeard> colorado to upstate NY to south jersey!
[7:08] <RITRedbeard> hot, damn!
[7:08] <Ben64> some sites were saying $60 + another $40 for shipping
[7:08] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah.... that's all of the nations covered.
[7:08] <Ben64> it was madness
[7:10] <RITRedbeard> I was being facetious, obviously :P
[7:10] <RITRedbeard> why does RPF want to stick to UK retailers?
[7:10] <RITRedbeard> I mean is it a national pride thing or ?
[7:10] <RITRedbeard> tax law?
[7:10] <RITRedbeard> corporate law?
[7:10] <Crenn-NAS> It's more related to their aim
[7:10] <ShiftPlusOne> well farnell screws over international customers the least, so I am not complaining.
[7:11] <RITRedbeard> unless RS/Farnell/element14 have direct ties with schools or education system?
[7:11] <namfonos> screen resolution?? anyone?
[7:11] <RITRedbeard> but they seem to be exactly like any other electronic distributor
[7:11] <ShiftPlusOne> namfonos, config.txt
[7:11] <RITRedbeard> namfonos,
[7:11] <ShiftPlusOne> hdmi_mode=16
[7:11] <ShiftPlusOne> disable_overscan=1
[7:11] <RITRedbeard> find / config.txt
[7:11] <namfonos> ya where is it
[7:12] <RITRedbeard> maybe an -R in there
[7:12] <RITRedbeard> man find
[7:12] <ShiftPlusOne> check /boot
[7:12] <ShiftPlusOne> if you see the kernel there, but no config.txt, create it.
[7:12] <ShiftPlusOne> RITRedbeard, * find / -iname config.txt
[7:12] <RITRedbeard> ^ that's the trick
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> that too
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> isn't this on the faq?
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> or eLinux wiki?
[7:13] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, but who reads those
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> :|
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> if this place turns into like
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> #ubuntu
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> I swear...
[7:13] <RITRedbeard> I'll lose it.
[7:14] <Ben64> rs and farnell seem too big for r-pi
[7:14] <ShiftPlusOne> rather #ubuntu than ##c++
[7:14] <ShiftPlusOne> a happy medium would be nice
[7:14] <Ben64> i think they normally deal in orders of hundreds/thousands per customer
[7:14] <shirro> There is someone on the raspi forums trying to meet up with furries! What next, bronnies?
[7:14] <ShiftPlusOne> Ben64, they deal with all spectrum of orders. But yeah, they have many industry clients.
[7:14] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:15] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:15] <Ben64> the launch on feb 29th was just crazy
[7:15] <Ben64> its like they don't know what they're doing
[7:15] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, it was rushed.
[7:15] <RITRedbeard> yeah... I agree Ben64 but
[7:15] <RITRedbeard> let us not have the nth iteration of this argument, please :)
[7:16] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[7:16] <RITRedbeard> eben lied, children died/went without porn and leave it at that
[7:16] <Ben64> i gotta say something until July
[7:16] <RITRedbeard> oh
[7:16] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[7:16] <RITRedbeard> I did a major amount of bitching but I wanted to do some stuff before school started up
[7:16] <Ben64> ordered launch day, won't get till end of June
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> that's crummy
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> but
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> there are some things you can still do without Pi while anticipating it
[7:17] <Ben64> like play with computers that exist
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> I think it's unfair and I was really sore
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> but
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> honestly if I had a pi when they made me stay up till 5-6 AM EST
[7:17] <RITRedbeard> the next week
[7:18] <namfonos> so how much of the sd card can the rpi see?
[7:18] <RITRedbeard> I would be lost in what I would want to use it for
[7:18] <RITRedbeard> like for instance
[7:18] <mozzwald> namfonos: all of it
[7:18] <namfonos> i have a 16gb card but it seems only 1.2GB is available
[7:18] <ShiftPlusOne> namfonos, that's not right
[7:18] <RITRedbeard> i'm trying to recycle/do ARM style netbooks/ultraportable stuff
[7:18] <RITRedbeard> and
[7:18] <ShiftPlusOne> you didn't resize the partition
[7:18] <namfonos> thats how the image got written to it
[7:18] <Ben64> namfonos: you probably ... what ShiftPlusOne said
[7:18] <RITRedbeard> I now have an idea of battery but I have no idea about what I'm going to do about display
[7:19] <RITRedbeard> and nobody has solution, commerical or otherwise yet
[7:19] <ShiftPlusOne> slap it back into your normal computer, run gparted on it and resize it to the full size
[7:19] <Ben64> RITRedbeard: yeah i still haven't heard any confirmed info about that
[7:19] <Ben64> i'd love to make it into a mini laptop
[7:19] <namfonos> so fdisk?
[7:19] <Ben64> gparted/parted/fdisk/partition magic (lol)
[7:19] <ShiftPlusOne> Does fdisk do resizing without screwing up the files?
[7:19] <RITRedbeard> P.S: good link (these guys are devving simple low power LVDS converters for RPi, Beagles, Pandas, etc)
[7:21] <RITRedbeard> erm
[7:21] <RITRedbeard> hold on, I have a lot of bookmarks!
[7:22] * Gallomimia (~Gallo@S0106602ad08026fc.ca.shawcable.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[7:22] <shirro> RITRedbeard: Just get a Motorola Lapdock. hdmi display. usb keyboard.
[7:23] <RITRedbeard> http://www.chalk-elec.com/
[7:23] <RITRedbeard> Motorola Lapdock?
[7:23] <Ben64> shirro: that looks pretty awesome
[7:23] <RITRedbeard> !g Motorola Lapdock
[7:24] <RITRedbeard> damn sean
[7:24] <Ben64> but expensive
[7:24] <shirro> ATT was giving them away for $50 at one stage. I am outside USA so no help for me
[7:25] * Gallomimia (~Gallo@S0106602ad08026fc.ca.shawcable.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:25] * fragalot_ is now known as fragalot
[7:25] * fragalot (~thomas@andimiller.net) Quit (Changing host)
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[7:25] <shirro> Hard bit is getting a female micro or mini hdmi
[7:26] <cjbaird> Just enable 'remote login' in GDM, and use another Linux box to xdmcp in..
[7:26] <RITRedbeard> 1366 x 768 ?
[7:26] * phirsch (~smuxi@xdsl-89-0-170-156.netcologne.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[7:26] <RITRedbeard> what panel type?
[7:27] <RITRedbeard> IPS? TN?
[7:28] <RITRedbeard> not saying anything bad
[7:28] <shirro> RITRedbeard: yeah 1366 x 768, 14". Don't know what is inside. Just know it connects to the phone with a hdmi and usb and people have connected one to a playstation on youtube. i was thinking of using one to convert a Pi to a laptop but I can't get one cheap enough. If I see someone disposing of one I am grabbing it
[7:28] <RITRedbeard> this is actually cool
[7:29] <RITRedbeard> it says 10.1"???
[7:29] <RITRedbeard> or diff version?
[7:29] <RITRedbeard> very cool product
[7:29] <shirro> Shit yes. There is a 100 series and 500 series. I just did a quick google to refresh my memory
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> I think 10.1 is
[7:30] <tntexplosivesltd> !w
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> I would buy that
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> that's exactly
[7:30] <tntexplosivesltd> ygh lol
[7:30] <tntexplosivesltd> * ugh
[7:30] <shirro> Way ahead of its time. I don't think many people know about them
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> genius stop gap
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> yes
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> it is
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> I'm basically doing the same thing
[7:30] <RITRedbeard> but more modular
[7:30] * phirsch (~smuxi@xdsl-89-0-88-228.netcologne.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:30] * phirsch (~smuxi@xdsl-89-0-88-228.netcologne.de) Quit (Excess Flood)
[7:31] * mukti (~eric@pool-71-251-130-72.cmdnnj.east.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[7:31] <shirro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On8e6kuqeF0
[7:32] * phirsch (~smuxi@xdsl-89-0-88-228.netcologne.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:33] <tntexplosivesltd> that lapdock is pretty cool
[7:35] <shirro> Even better when they were going out cheap http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2011/12/lapdock.png
[7:37] <shirro> I am guessing the usb probably can't power a Raspberry Pi. I suspect an Altrix phone has much lower power requirements. So you would still have to strap a battery pack on I guess unless it can be modded somehow.
[7:37] * mukti (~eric@pool-71-251-130-72.cmdnnj.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:39] * mukti (~eric@pool-71-251-130-72.cmdnnj.east.verizon.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[7:41] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
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[7:43] * RaYmAn_ is now known as RaYmAn
[7:48] <RITRedbeard> motorola lapdock a lil expensive though I say
[7:48] <RITRedbeard> but excellent if you're not a penny pincher
[7:49] <Ben64> but might not work with pi
[7:49] <tntexplosivesltd> wehysat?
[7:49] <tntexplosivesltd> * whysat?
[7:50] * kivether (~lombeting@cust-127-93.on4.ontelecoms.gr) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[7:50] <shirro> It looks like the prices have come down a bit on ebay. I last looked back in February. Stuff like the saleaday special must have knocked the market around a bit. If I could pick one up for $50 in a discount sale or second hand I would give it a go. The connector is the tricky bit though I guess I could crack the case and use the soldering iron
[7:50] <Ben64> its made for the motorola atrix
[7:50] <RITRedbeard> whats the interface method?
[7:50] <tntexplosivesltd> Ben64: so? The HDMI is standard
[7:50] <tntexplosivesltd> so that at least might work
[7:51] <Ben64> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCxTTrTZSSM
[7:52] <tntexplosivesltd> I question his hardware
[7:52] <tntexplosivesltd> =P
[7:52] <tntexplosivesltd> the PS3 one above works fine
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[7:52] <Ben64> ps3 one?
[7:52] <ecto2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUAhas1DRw8
[7:52] <tntexplosivesltd> 17:30 < shirro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On8e6kuqeF0
[7:52] * farmboy (~quassel@cpc15-cmbg14-2-0-cust146.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:53] <Ben64> looks like he's trying to snap off the connector
[7:54] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah lol
[7:54] <tntexplosivesltd> a bit ham-fisted
[7:54] <Ben64> but yeah, that would be awesome to have for pi
[7:54] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah =D
[7:54] <Ben64> or make something similar
[7:55] <Ben64> theres supposedly screens that can be hooked up to the r-pi
[7:55] <shirro> It plugs into the usb port and hdmi port on the phone I believe. I am guessing the usb appears as a hub so you can get mouse and pointer. I don't know much more. I thought there would be a cheap clamshell keyboard/lcd out of china but haven't found anything
[7:55] <tntexplosivesltd> that's what we were trying with a TDMS to LVDS chip and an old laptop LCD panel
[7:55] <Ben64> without hdmi?
[7:56] <tntexplosivesltd> no, TDMS is HDMI
[7:56] <tntexplosivesltd> well, HDMI carries TDMS
[7:56] <Ben64> S2: DSI interface. 15-pin surface mounted flat flex connector, providing two data lanes, one clock lane, 3.3V and GND.
[7:56] <Ben64> i heard screens could be attached there
[7:56] <tntexplosivesltd> hmm
[7:56] <tntexplosivesltd> who has a DSI connector though?
[7:57] <Ben64> iphone 4
[7:57] <tntexplosivesltd> for the LCD panel itself?
[7:58] <Ben64> that's what i've heard
[7:58] <Ben64> with dsi wouldn't need any chips to make it work
[7:58] <tntexplosivesltd> hmm, though expensive
[7:58] <Ben64> but i still don't have it all confirmed
[7:58] <Ben64> expensive?
[7:58] <tntexplosivesltd> for a replacement LCD screen for an iPhone
[7:58] <Ben64> ~$30
[7:58] <tntexplosivesltd> o.O
[7:58] <tntexplosivesltd> really?
[7:59] <tntexplosivesltd> doubt it
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[7:59] <Ben64> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-apple-iphone-3gs-replacement-touch-screen-lcd-screen-modules-37188
[7:59] <Ben64> oh that one is 3GS
[7:59] <tntexplosivesltd> holy crap
[8:00] <tntexplosivesltd> I stand corrected
[8:00] <Ben64> also heard nokia n900 lcd could work
[8:00] <Ben64> i'm just waiting for someone to actually do it before i plan anything
[8:00] <tntexplosivesltd> I guess if you don't care about a small screen then that's perfect
[8:01] <Ben64> well it could have touch screen too
[8:01] * Etac_Sufbo (~aaa@n058153242100.netvigator.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:01] <tntexplosivesltd> yeah, but not through DSI
[8:01] <ecto2> way to be an explorer
[8:01] <Ben64> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/original-replacement-lcd-screen-for-ipad-2-121461?item=2
[8:01] <Ben64> $60 for ipad2 lcd :)
[8:01] <ecto2> "wont go there till somone else goes first " ;)
[8:01] <Ben64> i don't even have my pi yet
[8:02] <ecto2> hey i dont want to hear it
[8:02] <tntexplosivesltd> to get the touch working you'd need a seperate board =(
[8:02] <ecto2> shipping to the moon takes forever!
[8:02] <ecto2> and isnt cheap!
[8:02] <Ben64> if i did you bet i'd be taking apart all my old phones
[8:02] * JonSeals (~Jon@99-158-225-217.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) has left #raspberrypi
[8:02] * kivether (~lombeting@cust-127-93.on4.ontelecoms.gr) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:03] <Ben64> over $4000 per pound to ship to the moon
[8:03] <tntexplosivesltd> and no-one ever goes there =(
[8:03] <tntexplosivesltd> can't wait for spacex
[8:05] * iccanobif (iccanobif@host231-148-dynamic.58-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:10] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@c-67-180-20-19.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[8:13] * imnichol (~ian@ Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[8:20] <mozzwald> http://1saleaday.com/wireless/
[8:21] * LWK_mac (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[8:21] <mozzwald> $59 for lapdock
[8:21] <Ben64> O_o
[8:21] <RITRedbeard> do
[8:21] <RITRedbeard> dude
[8:21] <RITRedbeard> this has to be a scam
[8:22] <RITRedbeard> or whatever
[8:22] <RITRedbeard> the wireless keyboard rig itself with port extention is worth that much
[8:23] <supersat> wtf... requires a tethering plan?!
[8:23] <Ben64> probably not a scam
[8:23] <RITRedbeard> like one of those bid sites?
[8:23] <RITRedbeard> yeah I don't know
[8:23] <RITRedbeard> that's sketchy to me
[8:24] <Ben64> i vote legit
[8:25] <Ben64> a lot of places have it for similar prices
[8:25] <RITRedbeard> iphone $1
[8:26] <supersat> welp, i just bought one
[8:26] * Syliss (~Syliss@ Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[8:26] <Ben64> http://www.all4cellular.com/product/motorola-atrix-4g-laptop-dock-hdmi-upgrade-kit.html
[8:27] <Ben64> i'd buy it, but it might go down in price in the next 2 months
[8:27] * amithkk (u4289@2buntu/writers/amithkk) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:28] <mpthompson> Anyone around who knows much about configuring exim4 to send messages between local Linux systems?
[8:28] <shirro> "Whilst this laptop dock was initially manufactured for the ATRIX 4G, we have included the necessary adapter for you to be able to use this dock with the ATRIX 2, PHOTON 4G, and the DROID RAZR and RASPBERRY PI." - no just made the last bit up :-)
[8:28] * Guest11300 is now known as KaiNeR
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[8:47] * iccanobif (iccanobif@host231-148-dynamic.58-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit ()
[8:49] <RITRedbeard> anyone else into head mounted displays?
[8:50] <ShiftPlusOne> "ScienceDaily (May 1, 2012) ? Great tits are more likely to join defensive mobs with birds in nearby nests that are 'familiar neighbours' rather than new arrivals, Oxford University research has found." Well that's a misleading way to start an article =/
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[9:02] <ahven> Congratulations! You have been selected to receive a free issue of Linux Journal!
[9:02] <ahven> this is like, the 5th in row?
[9:02] <ahven> seems the subscriber rate is quite low
[9:02] <ShiftPlusOne> Why don't I get a freee issue of the LInux Journal? =(
[9:03] <ahven> there :P
[9:03] <ShiftPlusOne> hurray
[9:03] <ShiftPlusOne> thanks
[9:05] <markus__> ahven: i wonder how you do that?
[9:06] <ahven> markus__: I haven't been a subscriber in the past, and sadly, won't be in the future
[9:06] <ahven> the content is mediocre for my taste
[9:06] <markus__> =) i wouldn't know so i have to trust you
[9:07] <markus__> i read blogs but i don't like taking my computer to the bathroom
[9:08] <ShiftPlusOne> the content seems 'ok'.... not "shut up and take my money" 'ok', but, "sure, i'll skim through a free edition" 'ok'
[9:08] * stuk_gen (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:12] <ahven> 2-3 articles in totals that have my interest, and that has been about the same with the previous releases
[9:13] <ShiftPlusOne> The Lua and C/Python parallel programming ones seemed worthwhile
[9:14] * diplo (~diplo@cpc2-trow1-0-0-cust1447.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:15] * khildin (~khildin@ip-83-134-214-171.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:17] <ahven> ok, that one too, but more into assembler at the moment :)
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[9:50] * inter|logger (~inter|log@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[9:53] <jaxdahl> newark is awesome, i had a live chat with them earlier. left some comments in the survey afterwards and the rep followed that up with more info to help me out
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[9:59] * plugwash (~plugwash@2001:5c0:1400:a::6b9) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:59] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, farnell seems to be going all out on their customer relations, especially with people who've got their pi's
[10:00] <ShiftPlusOne> jaxdahl, was the 'more info' a link to the raspberry pi community page?
[10:01] <cjbaird> The person at Farnell who recommened using the RaspberryPi to drive customers to their store can probably expect a biigg xmas bonus this year. :)
[10:01] * davros (~davros@66-189-124-24.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[10:02] <cjbaird> I'd known of them for ~10 years, but never bothered because I had the impression they only deal with trade/business customers. Now I know differently, and since ordering the RPi, I've already sent approx $700 their way in other orders... :)
[10:02] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[10:04] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:05] <cjbaird> I'm always finding stuff that's /cheaper/ than the 'boutique' online electronics stores.. MSP430 Launchpad boards, for example. AU$5 instead of $10.
[10:07] * s[x] (~sx]@60-241-151-10.tpgi.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:09] * fakker (fakker@cpc13-hitc6-2-0-cust129.9-2.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[10:09] <shirro> I always thought they were kind of expensive but it turns out they aren't compared with other local places. A lot pricier than getting stuff from overseas but then postage and delays. And they have a big range. I wish they had more sparkfun type stuff though.
[10:10] <shirro> I put a FDTI cable in my cart and haven't gone back because I am not sure what to get to make up the order to free postage.
[10:13] * the_real_crimper (~the_real_@cpe-98-154-91-166.socal.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[10:15] <Hourd> shirro: whats your project?
[10:18] * kivether (~lombeting@cust-127-93.on4.ontelecoms.gr) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[10:21] <fALSO> statys on raspberry pi ?
[10:21] <fALSO> status
[10:21] <fALSO> any news?
[10:21] <fALSO> working sound drivers? working 2d drivers on X ?
[10:21] * davros (~davros@66-189-124-24.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:22] <ShiftPlusOne> twitter and the main page are a better source of news than irc
[10:23] <mjr> "working alsa drivers? working accelerated X driver?" would probably be a better formulation not to leave nitpicking points for people such as me
[10:24] <shirro> Hourd: I guess I am mainly interested in software at the moment which is part of the problem. I want to play with the gpio later but not just yet. The serial cable is handy for debugging if i lock things up.
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[10:28] * mpthompson (~IceChat77@c-50-131-39-81.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: There's nothing dirtier then a giant ball of oil)
[10:30] <RaTTuS|BIG> !w
[10:31] <RaTTuS|BIG> morning
[10:31] * ashH_ (~Ash@ Quit (Quit: leaving)
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[10:31] <shirro> something like a bus pirate or a cheap logic analyzer would be good but not the sort of thing Element 14 are going to sell
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[10:35] * Jak_o_Shadows (~Fake@unaffiliated/jak-o-shadows/x-0479135) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[10:35] * s[x] (~sx]@60-241-151-10.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:39] <ashH> hope folks don't think this is a dumb Q, but what setup are you using for cross-compiling for the Pi (if indeed you are, at all)...?
[10:39] * slartsa (~slartsa@vps-2498-1.tilaa.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:42] <Davespice> I've found a potential show stopper in my build of transport tycoon :/
[10:43] <Davespice> destroying train track costs several hundred million per square... ?! Must be some kind of arithmetic issue
[10:43] <ShiftPlusOne> ashH, I quite like scratchbox2 with Sourcery G++ Lite.
[10:44] * hughg (~textual@ has joined #raspberrypi
[10:44] <ashH> ShiftPlusOne: thanks for the reply... not used to building for embedded systems and that kind of thing, though i'm fairly familiar with gcc chains etc, so i'm still trying to find my way with a good setup for pi dev
[10:44] <ashH> i do have a pi here but obviously compiling on a fast pc is preferable :)
[10:45] <ShiftPlusOne> ashH, You can set it up yourself http://pastebin.com/4Jp1WPTb. Or download the dev VM http://www.element14.com/community/groups/raspberry-pi?view=overview#downloadcenter
[10:45] <ashH> tbh i think there could be slightly better docs in this area on the pi site - i'm a very experienced dev, just not in this particular area, so i feel like i'm kinda wasting a bit of time working it out :)
[10:46] <ashH> oh cool, that VM link isn't one i'd found yet, thanks a lot
[10:47] <ShiftPlusOne> no worries, but it's just debian with scratchbox2 set up, as far as I know. There may be a few extras, but I don't see the point of having so many levels of emulation.
[10:48] <ShiftPlusOne> *ubuntu
[10:48] <ashH> i see pi have a github repo with x-compile tools, but again - zero documentation
[10:49] <ashH> i'm pretty familiar with *nix but don't ordinarly dev under it, so again - kinda feel like i'm losing valuable time :)
[10:49] <ashH> will get there in the end i'm sure
[10:50] <ShiftPlusOne> I'd just go through the steps on that pastebin. It will take you about 10 minutes and you'll be set.
[10:50] <ashH> cool, cheers
[10:50] <ShiftPlusOne> assuming nothing goes wrong... which I wouldn't
[10:52] <ShiftPlusOne> I am considering switching from codesourcery's toolchain to the official one though. Yeah, I'll give that a go.
[10:53] <a_c_r_> ShiftPlusOne: thanks for pasting that VM link
[10:53] <ShiftPlusOne> no worries
[10:53] <ShiftPlusOne> I think there's also a torrent if anyone wants that
[10:54] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) Quit ()
[10:54] <a_c_r_> whoa... 8gb in 13 hrs.
[10:54] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah... hence the steps to do it yourself
[10:54] <ashH> a_c_r_: yeah, i see the same thing :)
[10:54] <ashH> guess i can see where some of my day is going ;)
[10:55] * gambler (~Adium@pi2160.physik.uni-erlangen.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:55] <ashH> right, time for a meeting - thanks ShiftPlusOne for the help
[10:55] <ashH> much appreciated
[10:55] <ShiftPlusOne> no worries
[10:56] <a_c_r_> well, i'm off to sleep. I'll let it run over night
[10:58] <ShiftPlusOne> 'night
[10:59] * s[x] (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:07] * kentra (~daniko@85-89-4.216.3p.ntebredband.no) Quit (Quit: leaving)
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[11:08] * s[x] (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:09] <ShiftPlusOne> any idea what the difference between linux-x86 and x86-linux64-cross-arm-linux-hardfp is (under 'tools' in github)?
[11:12] * friggle_ is now known as friggle
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[11:19] <tntexplosivesltd> Davespice: lol??
[11:19] <Davespice> tntexplosivesltd: hello?
[11:19] <tntexplosivesltd> 20:42 <+Davespice> destroying train track costs several hundred million per square... ?! Must be some kind of arithmetic issue
[11:19] <tntexplosivesltd> =D
[11:19] * techman2 (~gj@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:19] <tntexplosivesltd> that's... weird
[11:19] <Davespice> yeah, its annoying, it means you end up with a lot of messy track!
[11:20] <tntexplosivesltd> hang on, I have TTD
[11:20] <Davespice> I might need to roll the code back to a stable point and rebuild it, either that or some kind of variable type roll over problem
[11:20] <tntexplosivesltd> might check to see if that's how it always works
[11:20] <tntexplosivesltd> unless that us definitely a bug
[11:20] <tntexplosivesltd> * is
[11:21] <Davespice> well... no, I tried it on the windows version and you get a bit of income for it usually
[11:21] <tntexplosivesltd> jej
[11:21] <tntexplosivesltd> * heh
[11:21] <Davespice> do you have a Pi you can try it out on?
[11:22] <tntexplosivesltd> nah
[11:22] <Davespice> anyway, I plan to contact the developers and ask them what I should do about that, I'm just worried its something to do with how a float or long value type is handled on the Arm compiler
[11:22] <Davespice> destroying road is okay though, that works fine
[11:24] * phantoxe (~destroy@a95-92-89-24.cpe.netcabo.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:25] <ShiftPlusOne> maybe take a look at the relevant code and compare how it differs between the road and train track
[11:27] <Davespice> good idea
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[11:56] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Changing host)
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[11:57] <Hexxeh> fwiw there are known working arm versions of openttd
[11:57] <Hexxeh> the mistake you probably made was building trunk
[11:57] <Hexxeh> also, don't PM unless it has to be private, my client sucks with PM windows
[11:57] <Davespice> Hexxeh: yeah I feel you're right
[11:57] <shirro> ShiftPlusOne: linux-x86 is an x86 32 bit cross compiler for arm soft-float and x86-linux64-cross-arm-linux-hardfp is a x86 64bit cross compiler for arm hardfloat abi
[11:57] <RaTTuS|BIG> http://www.tothepoint.co.uk/more/fun/shoot_the_serif/ ,- hahah
[11:58] <ShiftPlusOne> makes sense, thanks
[11:58] <Davespice> Hexxeh: okay sorry, I'll abvoid doing that, I just didn't want the message to be lost in your logs
[11:58] <Hexxeh> it highlights mentions in channels
[11:58] * eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@ has joined #raspberrypi
[11:58] <Hexxeh> so i can see all mentions in all channels while i've been afk
[11:58] * eebrah is now known as Guest89604
[11:59] * RaTTuS|BIG knows the openttd and opendune peoples
[11:59] <Hexxeh> using IRCCloud (https://irccloud.com) fwiw
[11:59] <Davespice> okay cool, so do you know if they have a branch for ARM then?
[11:59] <Hexxeh> they don't, but they don't need it
[11:59] <Hexxeh> roll back to a release branch and build that
[11:59] <Davespice> okay, right, that is what I thought I needed to do
[12:00] <Davespice> is that just "svn update *date*"
[12:00] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:01] <Davespice> or I can pull from http://svn.openttd.org/branches/1.2/ ?
[12:01] <Davespice> 1.2 is the latest I think... <scratch>
[12:02] * Guest89604 (~Ibrahim_K@ Quit (Client Quit)
[12:02] * Commander1024_ is now known as Commander1024
[12:04] * Commander1024 (~Commander@ip-109-91-120-118.unitymediagroup.de) Quit (Quit: Bye bye)
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[12:11] <cjbaird> Something I just thought of about the Intel NUC-- it's actually a nice thing by Intel to announce it /after/ the RaspberryPi as shipped.. A company like Microsoft would've intentionally made a vaporware anouncement about a product to screw up the competitor's pre-orders.
[12:11] * lars_t_h (~lars_t_h@002128029050.mbb.telenor.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:11] <cjbaird> (Intel have learnt from what they did with OLPC?)
[12:12] <ShiftPlusOne> hm, after changing to the official toolchain, I am getting "libSDL.so: undefined reference to `__fdelt_chk@GLIBC_2.15'"
[12:12] * rm (~rm@fsf/member/rm) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
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[12:17] * Onlyodin (~came@connected.by.excess.net.au) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
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[12:26] <Davespice> we've all just got new chairs at the office
[12:26] * Davespice spins
[12:26] * s[x] (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:27] <Gadget-Work> Possibly of interest for RPi owners in the UK
[12:28] <Gadget-Work> http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_categoryId_237503_productId_241769_langId_-1?msg=&_$ja=tsid:35532|kw:60612&cm_mmc=Affiliates-_-AffiliateWindow-_-60612-_-n/a&awc=1672_1335948804_62b80dfb91a4b80c8b15a30069f79968&_$ja=tsid:35532|kw:47868&cm_mmc=Affiliates-_-AffiliateWindow-_-47868-_-n%2fa&awc=1672_1335954243_31fd859129f7b23c8f26ca89468405f2
[12:28] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:30] <Hexxeh> anyone who wanted VGA on their Pi? here you go: http://www.kanexlive.com/atvpro
[12:30] <Davespice> could be cheaper than buying a new monitor...
[12:30] <markus__> i think rca is way cooler :)
[12:31] * Cheery (~cheery@a88-113-48-33.elisa-laajakaista.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:31] * venerable13 (~Usuario@ has left #raspberrypi
[12:31] <Davespice> Gadget-Work: that is a cool little screen...
[12:32] * rm (rm@fsf/member/rm) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[12:32] * umbrella (~umbrella@unaffiliated/umbrella) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[12:32] <Davespice> now just need to run the Pi from the 12 volt supply :)
[12:33] <ShiftPlusOne> plenty of car cigarette ligher -> usb adapters available
[12:33] <Davespice> could also use a blackberry phone charger, they might work okay
[12:33] <Davespice> do they output enough current though?
[12:33] <dmsuse> you can cut the voltage down with just 1 resistor can't you?
[12:33] <shirro> My car usb has a "fast charge" socket that might
[12:34] * Forca (~hendricks@209-254-225-82.ip.mcleodusa.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:34] <ShiftPlusOne> hm
[12:34] * EiNSTeiN_ (~einstein@unaffiliated/einstein/x-615171) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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[12:34] <Davespice> I'm just wondering if it only gives 500 mA or something, which wouldn't be enough for the Pi to boot
[12:34] <mjr> "fast charge" things probably do
[12:34] <shirro> Not sure how to get my wide screen tv out to the car to test it :-)
[12:35] <Davespice> haha
[12:35] <markus__> RaspberryPi - powered by petrol
[12:38] <dmsuse> shirro: just install sshd
[12:38] <shirro> I have a little switch mode power supply board in an old mini-itx case. Not sure what the input voltage is though. I think it could handle a bramble.
[12:39] <shirro> Yep it is 12v input. Nice.
[12:39] * sajmon is now known as sajimon
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[12:40] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:44] * Xark (~chatzilla@cpe-50-113-123-229.san.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[12:48] <Davespice> Gadget-Work: I'm going to buy one of those, my nephew works in Halfords and can get a staff discount on top :)
[12:48] <Gadget-Work> Nice.
[12:49] <Gadget-Work> XBMC in your car :)
[12:50] <Davespice> it says Screen Resolution: (320 * 240)-(480 * 234) - sounds a bit low actually...
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[12:52] <ShiftPlusOne> my pi is booting up with crappy resolution even with hdmi_mode=16 =(
[12:53] <Veryevil> what resolution?
[12:53] <ShiftPlusOne> are there some kernel parameters to pass as well?
[12:53] <Davespice> ShiftPlusOne: are you using disable_overscan=1 ?
[12:53] <ShiftPlusOne> Davespice, yes
[12:53] <shirro> This DC-DC psu has input rated at 54W. I reckon I could get a few Pi on the 5v rail. And a desktop hard drive on the 12v. Must remember not to throw it out.
[12:53] <Veryevil> sure its not config.txt.txt
[12:53] <ShiftPlusOne> Veryevil, very sure.
[12:54] <ShiftPlusOne> not a windows user
[12:54] * Slippern (slippern@server02.hjemmeserver.info) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:54] <ShiftPlusOne> and when I do use windows, that's the first thing I change.
[12:54] <Davespice> yeah, I normally turn that option off too
[12:54] <Veryevil> someone on here did it
[12:54] <shirro> The sad thing is the via cpu in there that I haven't turned on for years is probably still a lot faster than the Pi
[12:55] <ShiftPlusOne> Veryevil, no idea, but it's 4:3 streteched to widescreen.
[12:55] <Davespice> Veryevil: it was me, that option had been left on on my work pc
[12:56] <ShiftPlusOne> btw, this is archlinux. it boots properly with debian.
[12:57] <Davespice> aha...
[12:57] * alexsdut1on is now known as alexsdutton
[12:58] * Slippern (slippern@server02.hjemmeserver.info) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[12:58] <SocksG> Hello, alexsdutton.
[12:59] <SocksG> alexsdutton: Do you have a Raspberry Pi?
[12:59] * hughg (~textual@ Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[13:02] <alexsdutton> SocksG: not yet. managed to get on the RS waiting list at around ~10AM on launch day; still waiting to order. registered with Farnell a few days later; ordered, but no message to say they've paired me up with an actual device yet
[13:02] <alexsdutton> also, hello :)
[13:02] <SocksG> :) Hello
[13:03] <steve_rox> wonder if they will increase production to meet demand soon :-P
[13:03] <SocksG> (sorry, for anyone else on the channel, alexsdutton and I are collegues)
[13:03] <SocksG> (ish)
[13:03] <alexsdutton> charming :P
[13:04] <alexsdutton> and I considered you a friend! *sniffle*
[13:04] <SocksG> I'll go with that
[13:04] <SocksG> It's just I never see you!
[13:05] <alexsdutton> well, given the current quarantine???
[13:05] * nem is now known as nemrod
[13:08] <alexsdutton> I'm tempted to think that there may be a lot of people who have registered with both suppliers but who only want one, and that the conversion rates on "you can order now" messages will be rather lower than 100% in the long run
[13:10] <SocksG> The real power of the device I think will only be unlocked when they are available on next-day-delivery
[13:10] <drazyl> alexsdutton - but then there are people who also want more than 2
[13:12] * Lord_DeathMatch (~Lord_Deat@CPE-124-183-127-239.lns15.ken.bigpond.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:12] <alexsdutton> drazyl: are you allowed to order multiple times when you've been let through that far?
[13:12] <drazyl> alexsdutton - not yet as far as I know
[13:13] <shirro> alexsdutton: there are people who will happily test at least one to destruction (they can be overclocked after all)
[13:13] <Davespice> Hexxeh: when you get a moment, can you confirm if you get the track refund bug that I am getting in Open TTD (just want to check as I have spoken to one of their devs who think it might be an ARM compiler issue)
[13:14] <Hexxeh> i'd need to compile it all again, probably won't get chance until tomorrow
[13:14] * pulser_ (~pulser@villainrom.co.uk) Quit (Changing host)
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[13:14] <Davespice> okay cool, could you let me know when you've tried it then?
[13:15] <shirro> Davespice: unlikely to be an arm compiler issue. more likely a non-portable code issue
[13:15] <Davespice> I should always be in the channel here
[13:15] <tzarc> finally I get some time to play with my pi
[13:15] <Davespice> I've had this from one of their developers; "
[13:15] <Davespice> OpenTTD does not use floating point, so no need to look into that, but I'd start by verifying whether the int sizes are really what they claim to be, and the reported big/little endian-ness of the machine."
[13:15] <Hexxeh> ARM can be either big or little endian
[13:16] <Davespice> well... I am going to try a rebuild from the 1.2 release branch and if that doesn't fix the issue then we'll have to investigate this further, but he did say that the track refund code hasn't been touched in ages
[13:17] <shirro> But everything on the Pi is little endian.That is what the el on debian armel port means
[13:17] <shirro> Which is the same as Intel
[13:17] <Davespice> shirro: thats interesting to know
[13:17] <Hexxeh> and if i remember rightly, the openttd configure script correctly says little endian
[13:18] <tzarc> not ALLLL intel is only LE, ia64 does both
[13:18] * joink_ is now known as joink
[13:19] <tzarc> (and if I never have to see ia64 again, it'll be too soon :P)
[13:23] * solarbaby (~solarbaby@ Quit (Quit: leaving)
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[13:30] <ShiftPlusOne> got the screen resolution thing sorted... needed hdmi_drive=hdmi
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[13:36] <Davespice> ShiftPlusOne: 2 :)
[13:36] * urs_ is now known as urs
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[13:41] * Lord_DeathMatch is now known as Lord_DM-eating
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[13:49] <ShiftPlusOne> now to get SDL sorted, and I am happy
[13:49] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
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[13:54] <ShiftPlusOne> damn ebay sellers. Won a bid for a usb wifi thing for $1. Got a message saying they don't have any in stock. Obviously bs, they just didn't want to give it for $1.
[13:54] <r00t|home> post negative feedback, done
[13:54] <Hydrazine> ^
[13:54] <drazyl> report it
[13:55] <tntexplosivesltd> they have to sell it
[13:55] <tntexplosivesltd> it's a logal obligation
[13:55] <r00t|home> *legal
[13:55] <tntexplosivesltd> * legal
[13:55] <IT_Sean> they are obligated, via ebay policy, to sell it
[13:55] <tntexplosivesltd> ninja'd
[13:55] <IT_Sean> contact ebay
[13:55] <IT_Sean> report it
[13:55] <ShiftPlusOne> sure, but they can say it's a mistake and they were sold out, but didn't know.
[13:55] <r00t|home> or just go to your court and/or lawyer and have them laugh at you ;)
[13:56] <ShiftPlusOne> but if they relist it any time soon then, that's another story.
[13:56] <ShiftPlusOne> and they ID
[13:56] <tntexplosivesltd> ShiftPlusOne: then they have to send you one when they come back in stock
[13:56] <ShiftPlusOne> *DID
[13:56] <IT_Sean> contact ebay... they have to give you the product advertised at the closing price. Even if that means they need to go to Best Buy, buy one for $50, then send it to you for $1.
[13:56] <ShiftPlusOne> well... there's the new listing right there >=/
[13:56] <ShiftPlusOne> with the same dongle
[13:57] <ShiftPlusOne> dispute time
[13:57] <IT_Sean> contact ebay NOW. Send them the links to BOTH listings. Open a formal complaint.
[13:57] <ShiftPlusOne> yup, I am just getting all the info together
[13:57] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:58] <Davespice> Hexxeh: I think I've found where the issue is going to be in the code
[13:58] <tntexplosivesltd> interesting
[13:58] <Davespice> its in src/rail_cmd.cpp; CommandCost CmdRemoveSingleRail
[13:59] <Davespice> or it's in src/rail.h; static inline Money RailClearCost (which CmdRemoveSingleRail calls into)
[14:01] <ShiftPlusOne> is there a way to see when a listing was added?
[14:01] <tntexplosivesltd> how long does a usual auction run for?
[14:02] <ShiftPlusOne> no idea
[14:02] <ShiftPlusOne> I don't think there is a 'usual'
[14:02] <tntexplosivesltd> really?
[14:02] <tntexplosivesltd> on our system (trademe) it's normally 1 week
[14:02] <ShiftPlusOne> ah well
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[14:04] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:05] * nemo (nemo@c-68-50-78-21.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:05] <nemo> Hey dudes.
[14:05] * flaushy_ is now known as flaushy
[14:05] <nemo> http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/hec.aspx
[14:05] <nemo> Is this possible w/ the Pi?
[14:06] <tntexplosivesltd> I don't think so
[14:06] <Hydrazine> don't think so
[14:06] <tntexplosivesltd> lol
[14:06] <nemo> I had this silly idea of a Pi built into a game controller to play Quake III, w/ just one cable out for HDMI and Ether
[14:06] <nemo> aww
[14:06] <tntexplosivesltd> just use wifi
[14:06] <IT_Sean> No. The HDMI on the Pi lacks networking
[14:06] <nemo> tntexplosivesltd: yeah, wifi USB dongle
[14:06] <nemo> ah well
[14:06] <IT_Sean> either use WiFi, or use the ethernet jack.
[14:07] <nemo> no big deal. was just silliness, and to cut down on cables.
[14:07] <nemo> can tape the cables together :)
[14:07] <Hydrazine> hehe
[14:07] <nemo> btw.
[14:08] <nemo> since I'm here... anyone in the US gotten a shipping notice for their Pi yet?
[14:08] <nemo> wondering if they forgot about me
[14:08] <nemo> there was a lot of confusion that day after all
[14:08] <IT_Sean> When did you order?
[14:08] <nemo> IT_Sean: launch day
[14:08] <cheets__> Mmmm pi.
[14:08] <nemo> IT_Sean: well. I tried for 2 hours after launch before giving up
[14:08] <nemo> IT_Sean: then did it first thing in the morning
[14:09] <IT_Sean> you should receive it shortly. Who'd you order from?
[14:09] <IT_Sean> Oh, so, the 2nd day.
[14:09] <nemo> IT_Sean: huh?
[14:09] <IT_Sean> Yeah, you aren't in the first batch.
[14:09] <nemo> IT_Sean: no. within like, oh, 6-8 hours of launch
[14:09] <nemo> I got a notice saying that I'd be receiving it in a few weeks
[14:09] <nemo> but it has been a lot longer than that
[14:09] <IT_Sean> YEah, you aren't in the first batch, then.
[14:09] <nemo> m'k
[14:09] <nemo> IT_Sean: stupid sites crashing :(
[14:09] <nemo> I was there within 30 seconds of opening
[14:09] * Lord_DM-eating is now known as Lord_DeathMatch
[14:10] <nemo> and I kept trying for the next couple of hours
[14:10] * nemo sighs
[14:10] <nemo> I did have to sleep eventually
[14:10] <dmsuse> i can't beieve its taking so long, the chinese are obviously overpaid and underworked :P
[14:10] <nemo> dmsuse: heh. my experience w/ the Pandora is the chinese take looong holidays
[14:10] <nemo> dmsuse: the order was repeatedly pushed back due to some random chinese holiday or another at the case factory
[14:11] <nemo> harvest festival, new year's...
[14:11] <dmsuse> lol
[14:11] * eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[14:11] <nemo> dmsuse: but the screwups w/ the launch are not manufacturing's fault, or really Raspberry Pi's fault.
[14:11] <tzarc> just blame the government
[14:11] <tzarc> it's always a safe bet
[14:12] <nemo> dmsuse: actually, the thing that disappointed me the most about them not allowing me to order with them, even with, say, an e-mail or something simple like that, was that I couldn't do the buy one, donate one thing...
[14:12] <IT_Sean> stupid chinese. tell 'em to celebrate new years on 1 January like everyone else.
[14:12] <dmsuse> nemo: did you register at both farnell and the other 1?
[14:12] <nemo> tzarc: in this case it *is* a pretty safe bet apparently (both the taxes on UK production and the EU regulations) :)
[14:12] <tzarc> or do what I did and get an asian gf, then celebrate two new years' per year?
[14:12] <tzarc> I know :)
[14:12] <nemo> dmsuse: I tried.
[14:13] <nemo> dmsuse: although only one of the two was actually letting me order when I tried
[14:13] <Guest54866> tzarc, smart!
[14:13] <nemo> the other was just a notice
[14:13] <nemo> dmsuse: anyway. I did manage to get a credit card number taken, and get a "will ship by" thing
[14:13] <tntexplosivesltd> ugh bed time
[14:13] * Guest54866 is now known as fakker
[14:13] <tntexplosivesltd> night all
[14:13] <dmsuse> nemo: lol congrats :P
[14:13] * acperkins (~acperkins@pdpc/supporter/student/acperkins) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:14] <Davespice> Hexxeh: this could be the offending line... although not 100% sure > return max(_price[PR_CLEAR_RAIL], -RailBuildCost(railtype) * 3 / 4);
[14:14] <nemo> I *am* surprised they went w/ the incompetent distributors. I guess it will save on shipping hopefully, assuming that isn't lost in their own profit margins.
[14:14] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:14] <nemo> seems shipping a few thousand items is well within the ability of a few people. Etsy folks do it all the time :)
[14:14] <nemo> and then I could have done that donation thing!
[14:14] <nemo> ah well :-/
[14:15] <nemo> anyway. IT_Sean says "next batch" soo, guess I should expect it to be a while longer
[14:15] <nemo> odd that "within 6-8 hours of launch" = "2nd day" :-p
[14:15] <nemo> i.e. "ordered as soon as the sites started working again"
[14:16] <IT_Sean> If you are in the 2nd batch, you should receive it soon. If you are after the 2nd batch, it'll be a few more months.
[14:16] <nemo> oh cool
[14:16] <nemo> IT_Sean: would they have sent me a letter by now? I really am worried given how it was all mucked up that they might have lost the order
[14:16] <cheets__> when is the next sale?
[14:17] <nemo> you know, is funny. even the grocery clerk at my local grocery store ordered a Pi
[14:17] <IT_Sean> cheets__: you can join the queue by registering interest with either reseller. Once your slot opens up, you will be emailed with an oppurtunity to purchase.
[14:17] <nemo> he brings it up every time I go to that register
[14:18] <IT_Sean> nemo: if your pi is paid for, then the next letter you will receive is the shipment notification, when it actually shipps.
[14:18] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[14:18] <nemo> 'k. here's hoping
[14:18] <nemo> IT_Sean: is a race to see which one I will get first, the Pandora or the Pi :)
[14:19] <nemo> the Pandora of course is Two Months??? away from delivery
[14:20] * MystX (~MystX@49-50-247-177.a.hd.net.nz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[14:22] * s[x] (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[14:22] <dmsuse> nemo: how much is the pandora?
[14:23] * s[x] (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:23] <nemo> dmsuse: a lot... :-/
[14:23] <nemo> well.
[14:24] <nemo> it was a much more reasponable price 3?? years ago
[14:24] <nemo> reasonable
[14:24] * nemo digs up his old order sheet
[14:24] <nemo> and it *is* a nice package. was actually planning to use it more for portable FOSS computing
[14:24] <dmsuse> you have been waiting 3 years for it!?
[14:24] <nemo> dmsuse: :(
[14:25] <nemo> dmsuse: that's the Two Months joke
[14:25] * hughg (~textual@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:25] <nemo> dmsuse: it was supposed to be arriving in about Two Months when I ordered it
[14:25] <nemo> this kept getting pushed back for one reason or another
[14:25] * rodrigo_golive (quassel@nat/indt/x-idizyqzjbdmcijkn) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:25] * dmsuse laughs hysterically
[14:25] <nemo> dmsuse: they didn't really have a lot of experience and there were many problems.
[14:25] * acperkins (~acperkins@pdpc/supporter/student/acperkins) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[14:26] <nemo> dmsuse: the factory had delays in making the moulds, then they went on holiday, then they went on another holiday. the US board manufacturer screwed up... there were some design and quality issues
[14:26] <ShiftPlusOne> I got my pandora for $300 US, which was $500 AUD at the time. Well I didn't get a pandora, I ordered one.... still waiting.
[14:26] <nemo> dmsuse: they are finally producing them now after switching to a german board manufacturer and getting some rescue funding
[14:26] <dmsuse> 300 :O
[14:26] <ShiftPlusOne> Though the US dollar lost so much value, that if I get the $300 refund, I am loosing $200 AUD, which sucks
[14:26] <nemo> dmsuse: I could be pushed up in the queue if I paid for the new upgrade...
[14:26] <ShiftPlusOne> *losing
[14:26] <nemo> dmsuse: But, that kind of irritates me. I know they need the cash and it is a FOSS project
[14:26] <dmsuse> i would have cancelled my order years ago :P
[14:26] <nemo> but dammit, I gave them an interest free loan for over 3 years
[14:27] <nemo> why is my reward to be asked to give them more money, and people who paid just last month getting their delivery first
[14:27] <nemo> at a reasonable interest rate, just slightly over inflation, I've already paid for their upgrade
[14:27] <dmsuse> that's not right
[14:28] <ShiftPlusOne> that's your reward for buying early
[14:28] <ShiftPlusOne> getting it last
[14:28] <nemo> dmsuse: I paid $385.98
[14:28] <dmsuse> ouch
[14:28] <tntexplosivesltd> ha, the pandora looks like a z2
[14:29] * tsdedst (~tsdedst@bl15-100-241.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:29] <ShiftPlusOne> nemo, probably the $330 + shipping.
[14:29] <ShiftPlusOne> though that looks like a bit much
[14:29] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: well. also the battery and power adapter.
[14:29] <ShiftPlusOne> .... tv out cable as well maybe
[14:29] <nemo> which they charge extra for
[14:29] <nemo> and $20 shipping
[14:29] <ShiftPlusOne> nemo, nope... that's and EXTRA battery you bought
[14:29] <ShiftPlusOne> *an
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> "Just to clear something up before I send the money... The Pandora is $330, does that include the battery and adaptor?"
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> "Hi,
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> Yes it does. Can you let me know what you are ordering so I can give
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> your an order number for reference?
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> Thanks
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> Debs"
[14:30] <ShiftPlusOne> my bad
[14:30] <nemo> USD PRICE Pandora $330 Accessories: TV OUT $19.99 CARRY CASE $19.99 BATTERY $28.99 Power Adaptor $7.99 Stylus $7.00 Dev Fund $20
[14:30] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: I know
[14:30] <nemo> oh. wait
[14:30] <nemo> *extra adapter* too?
[14:30] <nemo> grrr
[14:30] <nemo> that's not how it was represented...
[14:31] <ShiftPlusOne> I didn't even pay for shipping >.>
[14:31] * nemo sighs.
[14:31] <ShiftPlusOne> but they didn't notice, so it's all good
[14:31] <nemo> Air Mail shipping $19 UPS 24/48 hr shipping $45
[14:31] <nemo> gotta giggle about 24h shipping for something that's been nigh on 4 years delayed
[14:31] <nemo> (from the very first announce)
[14:32] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[14:32] * GabrialDestruir (~GabrialDe@pool-71-254-135-241.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[14:34] * eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:34] * eebrah is now known as Guest35687
[14:35] * GabrialDestruir (~GabrialDe@pool-71-254-135-241.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:36] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:37] <flaushy> amazing
[14:39] * mrcan-afk (~mrcan@unaffiliated/mrcan) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:39] * mrcan-afk (~mrcan@unaffiliated/mrcan) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[14:39] * mrcan (~mrcan@unaffiliated/mrcan) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:41] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:42] * Ahks (~ahks@99-161-190-135.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[14:45] <ShiftPlusOne> surprised at how usable pi is even without accelerated X drivers.
[14:46] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56aa.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:47] <Davespice> ShiftPlusOne: I thought that too, its quite alright over VNC too
[14:48] <ShiftPlusOne> VNC.... not so much for me.
[14:48] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: -bgr233 -quality 0
[14:48] <IT_Sean> Virtual Naughty Computing?
[14:48] <Davespice> yeah it doesn't look as crisp as there are compression artifacts and all
[14:48] <nemo> hm. unless you are on a local network
[14:48] <nemo> then you should optimise for processor
[14:48] <ShiftPlusOne> on a local network, yes.
[14:49] <nemo> someone here was actually using VNC to resize their game screen
[14:49] <nemo> they had a link to the script they were using
[14:49] <Davespice> I've done it over a ssh tunnel as well and that is okay
[14:49] <nemo> oh. wait. no. that was the pandora people
[14:49] <nemo> Davespice: over ssh I just use -Y :)
[14:49] <nemo> even works w/ glxgears :D
[14:49] <nemo> or nxclient ofc
[14:52] * Guest35687 (~Ibrahim_K@ Quit (Quit: baadaye! people)
[14:53] <ShiftPlusOne> have you actually used NX with pi?
[14:54] * capiscuas (~capiscuas@ppp-58-8-165-216.revip2.asianet.co.th) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:54] <Caver> FreeNX?
[14:55] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: I don't have a pi :(
[14:55] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: I plan to try once I get one :D
[14:55] * capiscuas (~capiscuas@ppp-58-8-165-216.revip2.asianet.co.th) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[14:55] <nemo> don't see why it *wouldn't* work
[14:55] <ShiftPlusOne> ah ok
[14:55] <Caver> yeah sadly I don't think FreeNX can work as it uses some x86 binary blobs
[14:56] <Caver> says me hoping I'm wrong
[14:56] <nemo> ???
[14:56] <nemo> Caver: why? it is FOSS
[14:56] <nemo> distros should be able to build as needed
[14:56] <Caver> The core libraries for NX are provided by NoMachine under the GPL. FreeNX is a GPL implementation of the NX Server and NX Client Components.
[14:57] <nemo> oh
[14:57] <nemo> Caver: got it confused with google's
[14:57] <nemo> NeatX
[14:57] <nemo> yeah. the nomachine one is not FOSS
[14:57] <nemo> there are definitely neatx arm packages
[14:57] <Caver> cool
[14:59] * jgarrett (~jgarrett@ has joined #raspberrypi
[14:59] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: WRT VNC, if you are on a fast local network, then I'd definitely experiment w/ just using Raw or CopyRect or RRE for encoding, and just using full colour
[14:59] <Caver> also try xrdp
[14:59] <nemo> ShiftPlusOne: cost of processing the image is probably a bigger issue than your bandwidth
[15:00] <Caver> rdp having the nice advantage every windows machine has a client for it too
[15:00] <ShiftPlusOne> thanks, I'll give it a go.
[15:00] <nemo> Caver: hm. never tried xrdp
[15:00] <nemo> Caver: how does it compare to nx?
[15:00] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:00] <Caver> speed wise?
[15:00] <nemo> functionality
[15:00] <Caver> bandwidth wise?
[15:00] <nemo> but ok, speed too
[15:01] <Caver> it's a bit crude, as as far as I can tell it uses vnc and translates that to RDP, but works brilliently as a rdesktop over a slow ish adsl connection
[15:01] <Caver> much nicer than vnc IMHO
[15:02] <nemo> ah
[15:02] <nemo> ok. that's not much of an improvement
[15:02] <nemo> welll
[15:02] <nemo> it *is* nice that you get the remote screen
[15:02] <Caver> neatx I think is defo worth a good go
[15:02] <nemo> I'm confused that that would offer better performance than vnc's own encoding (jpeg, partial screen updates, bgr233)
[15:02] <Caver> I was playing with freenx ages ago, and it was a total pain just on ubuntu
[15:03] <nemo> so seems the only advantage is avoiding needing to use the java client under windows, or installing one
[15:03] <Caver> realistically - try it
[15:03] <Caver> it's a apt-get job!
[15:03] <nemo> Caver: I might :)
[15:03] * yegz (~blah@ has joined #raspberrypi
[15:03] <nemo> Caver: I do know that w/ max compression on xtightvnc I was able to play a MMORPG from home over the internet :)
[15:03] <nemo> and my connection is not *that* good
[15:03] <nemo> now, I didn't do any really complex raids
[15:04] <nemo> but I was able to do basic fighting and shopping and such
[15:04] <Caver> ahahah
[15:04] <nemo> neatx is nice 'cause it is all native, like RDP. but of course you don't access the remote display. same inconvenience as RDP sometimes
[15:05] <Caver> *sniffs* is that burning Pi I smell?
[15:05] <nemo> hehe
[15:05] <nemo> I assume the pi's heat dissipation is probably pretty good, given how low power it is :)
[15:05] <ReggieUK> is danieldaniel here?
[15:05] * phoque (~nils@nrbg-4dbfa109.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:05] <Caver> lol it's max power usage means it doesn't have to be
[15:05] <Caver> 3.5W isn't a awful lot
[15:05] <nemo> right. that's what I mean
[15:06] <Caver> though if you want to encase it you might have to be a little careful
[15:06] * UnderSampled (~UnderSamp@cpe-174-097-224-178.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:06] <Caver> I used my IR thermomiter on mine and could bearly see a difference even though I'd been compiling for an hour on it
[15:07] <nemo> *sigh*
[15:07] <nemo> Caver: so you managed to get your order in before the sites died, I take it
[15:07] <IT_Sean> a non-voerclocked raspi should barely get above room temperature
[15:07] <IT_Sean> *non-overclocked
[15:07] <nemo> IT_Sean: even if encased?
[15:07] <nemo> (checking what Caver said)
[15:07] <IT_Sean> nemo, that depends on the case, of course.
[15:07] <Caver> heheh actually after they came back up
[15:07] <IT_Sean> THe laws of physics still apply, even if it does only cost $35
[15:07] <nemo> IT_Sean: let's say one of those cheep plastic ones that have been showing up on thingiverse
[15:08] <nemo> IT_Sean: basically a plastic shell w/ output ports
[15:08] <nemo> cheap
[15:08] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@unaffiliated/hopsy) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:08] <Caver> I got mine at 8:08am (GMT)
[15:08] <Caver> oh I mean as in if you wanted to resin encase it
[15:08] <IT_Sean> nemo: let me head over to my test rack of raspis, with examples of every case ever thought of, and i'll let you know. :|
[15:08] <nemo> Caver: ah. I'd given up and fallen asleep
[15:08] <nemo> Caver: I suppose if I had stayed up another hour...
[15:08] * Hopsy (~Hopsy@unaffiliated/hopsy) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:09] <nemo> IT_Sean: oh come on. just estimate. but fine. lemme dig up a picture
[15:09] <nemo> http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:16104
[15:09] <nemo> http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:18358
[15:09] <IT_Sean> fine.. here is my guess: The raspi, in the case you are imagining in your head, will reach eleventy billion degrees, and melt a hole all the way ot the earths core.
[15:09] <nemo> http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:19978
[15:09] <IT_Sean> I have no way of knowing how that case will cool, now do i?
[15:09] <Caver> the 1st as it's got openings ... that will be fine
[15:10] <Hydrazine> IT_Sean: china syndrome?
[15:10] <Veryevil> My Non-Overclocked Pi Runs about 48 Deg C
[15:10] <nemo> IT_Sean: ... there's pictures there, showing clearance and everything :-/
[15:10] <nemo> this isn't "imagine in your head
[15:10] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:10] <nemo> "
[15:10] <Caver> Veryevil, *really*
[15:10] <Veryevil> yep
[15:10] * nemo sighs. oh whatever. be that way.
[15:10] <Veryevil> Have IR thermo
[15:10] <Caver> hmm mine's not got more than 35c so far!!
[15:10] <Caver> ditto
[15:10] <nemo> http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:21818
[15:10] <Caver> this was the main SoC?
[15:10] <IT_Sean> nemo, fine. tell me, exactly, how you want me to calculate the heat buildup of a computer which i have never held, when installed i na case which i have also never held... ?
[15:10] <Veryevil> yeah
[15:11] <ReggieUK> I wonder what temp flaushy's got up to yesterday?
[15:11] <nemo> IT_Sean: oh. I thought you were one of the devs
[15:11] <IT_Sean> No.
[15:11] <Veryevil> I should have my second one tomorrow / friday as it was shipped today
[15:11] <Caver> ignore IT_Sean he just lives here :P
[15:11] <IT_Sean> This is the Unofficial channel. there are no Foundation people here.
[15:11] <Veryevil> will test its temp
[15:11] <ReggieUK> IT_Sean, channeling! get to it, I want a report on my desk by the morning!
[15:11] <Caver> mind you ... Veryevil how warm if your room?
[15:12] <nemo> figured the nick was implying some kind of official function, w/ the underscore and all. that and your responses earlier 'bout shipping.
[15:12] * IT_Sean takes a crap in a box, labels it "report" and puts it on ReggieUK's desk.
[15:12] <nemo> eh. n/m
[15:12] <UnderSampled> http://runawaybrainz.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/audio-crystal-cmoy-freeform-headphone.html
[15:12] * yegz (~blah@ has left #raspberrypi
[15:12] <ReggieUK> Caver, it's about 17c in here
[15:12] <UnderSampled> make a case like that
[15:12] <Veryevil> not that warm im in derby
[15:13] <ReggieUK> erp, make that 16c
[15:13] <Caver> hehe just checking you didn't live in a desert state!
[15:13] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[15:13] <ReggieUK> there is a drought on
[15:13] <nemo> ReggieUK: UK is in drought?
[15:14] <Caver> yup!
[15:14] <Veryevil> yeah
[15:14] <nemo> fun
[15:14] <Veryevil> its not stopped raining since they annouced it
[15:14] <nemo> lol
[15:14] <Veryevil> pi
[15:14] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[15:14] <ReggieUK> dry pi
[15:14] <Caver> no honestly ... there have been floods
[15:14] <ReggieUK> indeed
[15:15] <nemo> floods? what the...
[15:15] <nemo> that would imply oversaturated soggy ground
[15:15] <nemo> or else you guys are in Arizona and it is running over baked clay
[15:15] <UnderSampled> england is never dry
[15:15] <nemo> yeaaaah. but how could you even announce a drought if the ground was saturated...
[15:15] <nemo> that's just silly
[15:15] <GabrialDestruir> I think farnell finally took money for my pi
[15:16] <UnderSampled> nemo: have you been to Seattle?
[15:16] <nemo> UnderSampled: yep
[15:16] * Slippern (slippern@server02.hjemmeserver.info) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:16] <UnderSampled> if it stopped raining there any time that wasn't between july and august, it would count as a drought
[15:16] <GabrialDestruir> apparently shipping is only 2.16? lol
[15:17] <ReggieUK> the drought was announced before the flooding
[15:17] <ReggieUK> the ground is very dry
[15:17] <nemo> UnderSampled: hm. so drought in some technical sense. not in the sense of "ok everyone, stop watering gardens and filling pools, and we might ask you to cut down on showers too"
[15:17] <nemo> ReggieUK: if it is flooding the ground couldn't be that dry...
[15:17] <ReggieUK> so the water doesn't soak through the top layer into the ground water
[15:17] <nemo> hm
[15:17] <ReggieUK> eh? of course it could
[15:17] <nemo> ReggieUK: depends on the kind of ground
[15:17] <nemo> 09:13 < nemo> that would imply oversaturated soggy ground
[15:17] <nemo> 09:14 < nemo> or else you guys are in Arizona and it is running over baked clay
[15:18] <esotera> groundwater's been really low for the last few years
[15:18] <ReggieUK> well, just going on a hunch, I suspect that anywhere that has flooded has the wrong type of ground, what do you reckon?
[15:18] <ecto2> oh no!! global climate drying!
[15:18] <nemo> maybe big cities
[15:18] <nemo> ReggieUK: cities get flash floods easy. all that concrete and asphalt
[15:19] <nemo> drove past an ally over here last year that would have made an awesome class 3 rapid
[15:19] <nemo> alley
[15:19] <ReggieUK> http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/may/01/warnings-floodwater-rise-southern-england?newsfeed=true
[15:19] <ReggieUK> looks like a town to me
[15:19] <nemo> yeep
[15:20] <Caver> well it was
[15:20] * wjoe_ (~joe@lc8n.com) has left #raspberrypi
[15:21] <Veryevil> PI running st 45 deg C today. Just fired it up
[15:21] <nemo> hm. so, is like maybe a metre or so of topsoil is saturated, and you are still in "drought" 'cause it hasn't percolated down
[15:21] <nemo> Veryevil: wow. that's kinda hot
[15:21] <Caver> hmmm
[15:22] <Caver> will have to remeasure mine when I get home
[15:22] <GabrialDestruir> 45C?
[15:22] <GabrialDestruir> That seems extremely hot
[15:22] <ecto2> 113F
[15:22] <nemo> Veryevil: you sure that isn't 45F? :)
[15:22] <nemo> since you just fired it up
[15:22] <Veryevil> yep
[15:23] <Veryevil> been on about 5 mins
[15:23] <nemo> Veryevil: were you leaving it out in the sun or something?
[15:23] <Veryevil> no its on my desk
[15:23] <Caver> well a better question ... which distrobution?
[15:23] <nemo> lol
[15:23] <Veryevil> deb
[15:23] <Caver> 45C you ought to be able to feel warm with your finger
[15:23] <GabrialDestruir> So... what, we'll have to run fans to keep it cool?
[15:23] <nemo> Caver: you said you could barely measure a difference after an hour of compilation
[15:23] <nemo> Caver: seems distro shouldn't matter
[15:24] <Caver> might depending if your running X and what binary blob version you've got
[15:24] <Caver> there is a GPU as well remember
[15:25] <nemo> Veryevil: 5 minutes of playing quake?
[15:25] * barend_ (~root@ks25111.kimsufi.com) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[15:25] <GabrialDestruir> A less efficient distro could make it run hotter...
[15:25] <GabrialDestruir> theoretically
[15:25] <Veryevil> no running x
[15:25] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: but Caver said 17??C - 45??C is a *lot* hotter to be blaming the distro
[15:25] <Veryevil> latest deb image
[15:26] <nemo> oh speaking of F vs C
[15:26] <GabrialDestruir> Oh yea...
[15:26] <GabrialDestruir> that's a huge difference....
[15:26] <nemo> friend told me an amusing story of visiting a coworker's home, and the son's computer was just howling. like a prop engine.
[15:26] <nemo> he had cooling fans packed in everywhere.
[15:26] <nemo> like half a dozen extra ones besides the built in ones
[15:27] <Veryevil> trying to get ambient temp. think its 23 deg C
[15:27] <nemo> friend asks him why. kid says. "to keep the system from overheating. I can barely keep this box under 70??C (or somesuch, I'd have to check chat history for exact figure)
[15:28] <Caver> if could be I'd missed the chip and measured the board temp by mistake
[15:28] <nemo> friend checks BIOS info. it is reporting 70??F
[15:28] * Mavy is now known as Mavy-bnc
[15:29] <Veryevil> my PI seems to be about 22 deg C above ambient when 100%
[15:29] <nemo> kid was cooling the PC to almost room temperature
[15:29] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:29] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:29] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:29] <Caver> lol isn't 70F = 21C or so?
[15:29] <nemo> Caver: yeps.
[15:30] <tzarc> mmmm a bootable kernel... that's a start
[15:30] <Veryevil> voltage regs are at 40
[15:30] <nemo> Caver: my guess is the kid had no idea about C vs F (US upbringing) and was looking at discussions online that were in C
[15:31] <GabrialDestruir> lmao
[15:31] <Caver> ahahah oh well ... a lesson about assumptions being the mother of all fuckups
[15:31] <GabrialDestruir> I should take offense.... I'm one of those with "US upbringing" and I can tell the difference.
[15:31] <nemo> ah. found the chat history.
[15:32] <nemo> I'm gonna snip this out, just for kicks
[15:32] <nemo> but let me tell you something funny. I was at my little sister's house. her oldest son has a computer, and it's tremendously loud. I told him there was something wrong with his computer, it's too loud. He said, "Well, it has 12 fans." So I asked him why he needs 12 fans. He said, "Even with 12 fans I can barely keep the core temperature down to 70."
[15:33] * ShiftPlusOne (~shift@unaffiliated/shiftplusone) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[15:33] <nemo> "once again imperial bites the unaware. and of course his measuring tool was thoughtfully converting, the stupid thing that it was."
[15:33] * AdrianG (~amphetami@unaffiliated/amphetamine) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:33] <GabrialDestruir> Hmm.... HW Monitor says I only have 2 HDD
[15:33] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: you using palimpsest?
[15:34] <nemo> (palimpsest is so awesome)
[15:34] <GabrialDestruir> nope CPUID Hardware Monitor
[15:34] <GabrialDestruir> Ohs .-. there's the third one. xD
[15:35] <nemo> so. sister, not coworker, and I thoughtfully halved the kid's fan count. I guess 12 fans seemed too unbelievable.
[15:35] <GabrialDestruir> It was hiding it off the bottom of the screen.
[15:35] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: WRT US upbringing, that apparently puts you ahead of NASA programmers
[15:36] <ngilles> nemo: 12 vans does seem like overkill :D
[15:36] <GabrialDestruir> lmao
[15:36] <ngilles> fans*
[15:36] <GabrialDestruir> Everyone knows you only need a boxfan
[15:36] <ngilles> My gf had her cpu hitting 100C this weekend .... I was like "wtf, that's hot!"
[15:36] <GabrialDestruir> bolt that to the side and turn it on high >.>
[15:36] <SpeedEvil> Hawt
[15:37] <nemo> everyone knows you just leave the sides off and let everyone suffer from EM and blow the dust off periodically.
[15:37] <SpeedEvil> [2450369.430065] thinkpad_acpi: THERMAL EMERGENCY: a sensor reports something is extremely hot!
[15:37] <SpeedEvil> [2450369.431962] thinkpad_acpi: temperatures (Celsius): 90 51 N/A 78 40 N/A 35 N/A 49 55 N/A N/A N/A N/A N/A N/A
[15:37] <GabrialDestruir> 100C? I'm guessing AMD?
[15:37] <ngilles> I opend up the box to find 4-5 years of dust + cat hair accumulated on the CPU heatsink, it was like a damn mat on it :D
[15:37] <nemo> s/EM/RFI/
[15:38] <Caver> yup pet fur is the worst for that
[15:38] <nemo> I need to use better abbreviations
[15:38] <ngilles> GabrialDestruir: nope, Intel Core 2 Quad :p but as I said, with a nice mat of dust+cat hair so no actual air flow in the cpu heat sink :D
[15:38] <Caver> yay for cool running pi's and no fans :D
[15:38] <GabrialDestruir> Surprised the damn thing didn't fry. o.o
[15:38] * cheets__ (www@acridian-2-pt.tunnel.tserv12.mia1.ipv6.he.net) Quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout))
[15:38] <nemo> Caver: well for you, not for Veryevil apparently
[15:38] <ngilles> cleaned that up, and I was getting a stable 33-35C .. slight difference eh :)
[15:38] <Veryevil> ha ha
[15:38] <Caver> meh 45C isn't *that* hot
[15:38] <Veryevil> will compare it with my second one tomorrow / friday
[15:38] <Caver> 2nd one!!!
[15:38] <Veryevil> yep
[15:39] <Veryevil> 2 Slices of PI for me
[15:39] <GabrialDestruir> My desktop runs 45C idling....
[15:39] <Caver> who have you been providing sexual favors too?
[15:39] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[15:39] <nemo> Veryevil: hm. on your desk. maybe sun was shining on it through the window?
[15:39] <Veryevil> nope
[15:39] <GabrialDestruir> I don't think the Pi should be running that hot...
[15:39] <nemo> Veryevil: and what's the internal temperature?
[15:39] <Caver> ROFTL @ sun shine
[15:39] <Veryevil> anout 23 dec C
[15:39] <Veryevil> about*
[15:39] <nemo> Caver: black stuff can get pretty hot if it is in the sun long enough
[15:39] <Caver> this is england ... in the summer aahhahahahah *sunshine* bahahahaha
[15:39] <nemo> ah
[15:39] <ngilles> aaah, all these people talking about Pis they already have :'(
[15:39] <nemo> ngilles: yes, I know, I feel your pain
[15:40] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:40] * BCMM (~ben@unaffiliated/bcmm) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:40] <nemo> ngilles: just because when the stores stopped dying they happened to be awake :-/
[15:40] <GabrialDestruir> Well apparently Farnell took the money for m ine.
[15:40] <GabrialDestruir> mine*
[15:40] <Veryevil> I will be lending my Second PI to Plug Wash to help with the Debian Hard Floating Point release
[15:40] <GabrialDestruir> so I should be seeing it in like a week or two?
[15:40] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: hm. I should check my credit card history
[15:40] <Caver> yay
[15:40] <ngilles> if I'm lucky, I'll be getting mine around xmas ? :D
[15:40] <nemo> Veryevil: your *second* pi??
[15:40] <Veryevil> yep
[15:40] <GabrialDestruir> At least, I could only assume it's farnell, I haven't used that bank account for anything else
[15:40] <Veryevil> ONe from RS serial number 55
[15:41] <GabrialDestruir> and the cost is 37 and change.
[15:41] <Veryevil> ONe from Farnell
[15:41] <nemo> :-/
[15:41] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:41] <nemo> Veryevil: how about you send your 2nd one to me?
[15:41] <ecto2> noshit
[15:41] <nemo> Veryevil: I can build a hedgewars package for it
[15:41] <nemo> Veryevil: assuming there isn't one already
[15:42] <Veryevil> its going to Plug wash for Debian Hard Float
[15:42] <GabrialDestruir> apparently my pi is processing
[15:42] * wkl (~conan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[15:43] <tzarc> mine is too
[15:43] <tzarc> EXECUTABLE CODE
[15:43] <GabrialDestruir> Did the drivers thing for X11 get sorted out?
[15:43] <Caver> not yet
[15:43] <GabrialDestruir> That sucks.
[15:44] <GabrialDestruir> Pi, runs Transport Tycoon, doesn't run Minecraft.
[15:44] <GabrialDestruir> xD
[15:44] * Caver quietly hopes it never runs minecraft
[15:45] <GabrialDestruir> I suppose theoretically it could run minecraft... it'd just do it really badly
[15:45] <GabrialDestruir> Minecraft apparently needs 1GB ram
[15:45] <nemo> yep
[15:45] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: wellll
[15:46] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: you used to be able to run it in about half that
[15:46] <nemo> if you didn't push it too hard
[15:46] * fiftyonefifty (~fiftyonef@ has joined #raspberrypi
[15:46] <nemo> and were prepared to restart periodically
[15:46] <esotera> what about something like minetest?
[15:46] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: but, you know, the OS needs memory too :)
[15:46] <Caver> lol and the GPU ...
[15:46] * meshuga- (fn@ Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[15:46] <GabrialDestruir> Exactly. lol
[15:47] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:48] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:48] <GabrialDestruir> I suppose if you could desolder the current memory for a new memory lmao
[15:51] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:55] * DDave| (~DDave@2001:638:208:fd5f:f979:ce21:594a:58c0) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:55] <tzarc> nope, ram and cpu are bonded
[15:55] * kevc (~kev@kerouac.projectcolo.org.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:56] <GabrialDestruir> I wonder, could run ram through like the GPIO or something?
[15:56] <GabrialDestruir> Ramboard add-on? >.>
[15:56] * hjubal (~hjubal@unaffiliated/hjubal) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:57] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: through GPIO? :D :D
[15:57] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: USB would probably be saner.
[15:57] <tzarc> not that simple :P
[15:57] <nemo> marignally
[15:58] <GabrialDestruir> Yes, USB probably would be saner, but the only option I could really imagine for USB is swapspace
[15:58] <GabrialDestruir> I have no understanding of GPIO so I get to ask the stupid questions to see if it's possible :p
[15:58] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[15:59] <GabrialDestruir> Anywho, college time, bbl.
[15:59] <Caver> lol no ... think you can do about 1MHz through gpio at best
[15:59] <ngilles> a USB mass storage device backed by RAM chips used as swapspace
[16:00] <ngilles> sounds plausible
[16:00] <nemo> oh. speaking of that
[16:00] <nemo> USB2 only I suppose?
[16:00] <WASDx> yes
[16:00] <nemo> (well... 1/2)
[16:01] <nemo> ok. sooo, ~30MiB/s
[16:01] <nemo> yeah. no point in using ram chips
[16:02] <nemo> if it was USB3, sure :)
[16:02] <ngilles> that's a good point...
[16:02] <shirro> I wish someone would right up some specs on this GPU so we knew what its strengths and weaknesses are
[16:02] <shirro> write even
[16:03] <ngilles> though I hear NAND still fails much quicker than we'd like :D
[16:03] <nemo> ngilles: eh. who cares. thumb drives are cheap
[16:03] <shirro> I keep looking at the USB OTG on my 1GB arm board with its SATA and thinking SWAP
[16:03] <ngilles> cheap thumb drives are slow
[16:04] <nemo> ngilles: ... USB2
[16:04] <nemo> hm
[16:04] <nemo> ok
[16:04] <nemo> n/m. you mean write speed I guess
[16:04] <nemo> ngilles: eh. use a laptop HD over USB :)
[16:04] * dal9000 (~dal@unaffiliated/dal9k) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:04] <nemo> disc that is
[16:04] <shirro> usb sata sdd
[16:05] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has left #raspberrypi
[16:05] <shirro> at which point it is no longer a $35 computer
[16:06] * MrKipper (~kyle@jm-g26bpc1.bi.umist.ac.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:07] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:07] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:08] <nemo> shirro: really, you'd be better off just buying a really huge SD card :)
[16:08] <nemo> same price caveat
[16:08] <nemo> shirro: but then, it isn't a $35 computer anyway, w/ SD cost
[16:09] <shirro> some people have suggested the sd card on the Pi performs much worse than usb. I haven't done any benchmarks yet
[16:09] <Caver> if you want a faster ARM board, why not just buy a panda or one of those?
[16:10] <ngilles> because the $35 price point is just that attractive
[16:10] <nemo> Caver: this all grew out of the "running minecraft on the pi" silliness ;)
[16:10] <shirro> I think working within the limits of the Pi is half the fun though. Ofcourse the other half is doing crazy things to remove the limits.
[16:10] <kevc> anyone know if the h.264 playback on the pi pretty stable?
[16:10] * Linkas (~lukas@ Quit (Quit: leaving)
[16:10] <shirro> kevc: what I have seen looks great.
[16:10] * UsernameDenied__ (~DDave@2001:638:208:fd5f:949b:edb3:910d:c857) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:10] * beardface (a7cebd06@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[16:10] <shirro> I haven't watched a full movie though
[16:10] <Caver> kevc, have a look on youtube for the xbmc demo's and make your own mind up :)
[16:10] * jthunder (~jthunder@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:11] * Matthew (~Matthew@cpc3-farn4-0-0-cust594.6-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:11] <beardface> using this for xbmc seems like a waste
[16:11] <beardface> that is what roku is for
[16:11] <kevc> Caver: I was wondering how well the youtube videos translated to reality
[16:11] <beardface> and roku is smaller
[16:11] * Matthew is now known as Guest81354
[16:12] <shirro> I have only used omxplayer, not xbmc but it handled every xvid and h264 I through at it (which is a pretty limited collection compared to most people and most not full HD)
[16:12] <Caver> well seemed great to me, playing a 720p film
[16:12] <Caver> I don't have any 1080i ones
[16:12] <kevc> cool, I guess my only problem now is where to buy a pi :(
[16:12] <GabrialDestruir> Roku is like.... 80 bucks isn't it?
[16:12] <GabrialDestruir> Pi is 35
[16:13] <kevc> beardface: this isn't for a media centre, but thanks for the suggestion
[16:13] <shirro> Nice case, software that works, Angry Birds...
[16:13] * ReggieUK wonders whether the bootcode is retrievable from a roku.....
[16:13] <beardface> kk, sorry
[16:13] <beardface> ReggieUK that would be too cool
[16:13] <beardface> a pi that can boot into linux, or piku :)
[16:13] <ReggieUK> Ican't be the only person that thought about it
[16:14] <beardface> hm, i smell a new media centric os for pi... "PIKU"
[16:14] <ReggieUK> now of course I don't expect the pi to boot as a roku from it
[16:14] <ReggieUK> just to open up the onboard 'licensed' stuff
[16:14] * DDave| (~DDave@2001:638:208:fd5f:f979:ce21:594a:58c0) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[16:14] <shirro> They might do some weird encrypted drm thing.
[16:14] * UsernameDenied__ (~DDave@2001:638:208:fd5f:949b:edb3:910d:c857) Quit (Client Quit)
[16:15] <GabrialDestruir> Probably.
[16:15] <ReggieUK> indeed
[16:15] <beardface> yeah; i'd love if there was a way for the pi to do netflix easily
[16:15] <beardface> but again... if you already have a roku, it is a bit of a waste
[16:15] <Caver> who knows
[16:15] <ngilles> I'd love netflix or netflix like service to flourish in Europe
[16:15] <ReggieUK> of course but the kind of person that would do that kind of thing wouldn't care :D It'd be a challenge
[16:15] <GabrialDestruir> I don't have a roku, so if I can setup my Pi as a media center, that'd be kind of awesome.
[16:16] <shirro> have learnt to live without netflix living in Australia. Actually just couldn't be stuffed turning my tunnel back on.
[16:16] <Caver> can't see netflix liking the idea of an open board ...
[16:16] <ReggieUK> Caver, indeed which is why the pi chip is locked down as far as codecs are concerned
[16:16] <Caver> ?
[16:16] <GabrialDestruir> Well technically it's a PC, the issue is you'd need Linux support for netflix.
[16:16] <ReggieUK> which would also be why we only get partial datasheets
[16:16] <ngilles> shirro: well, I don't know what it's like in australia, being an english speaking country, but it's really bad in most of europe if you want access to "original version" content
[16:17] <Caver> no thats because the foundation didn't want to pay for them!
[16:17] <GabrialDestruir> Which as far as I know, netflix has no intention of providing.
[16:17] <ReggieUK> instead of a full on set of ins and outs
[16:17] <shirro> ngilles: we probably get less than you. and what we do get we sometimes pay twice as much as US
[16:17] <ReggieUK> bcm have done the pi a favour but they won't let it eat into their bottom line for other manufacturers
[16:17] <ReggieUK> so we're getting as much info (or as little) as is possible from broadcom without having to sign an nda
[16:18] <Caver> I thoguht it was the cost of licences
[16:18] <Caver> not BCM being shitty
[16:18] <GabrialDestruir> I'm sure if the foundation wanted full specs they could get them.
[16:18] <shirro> I just want to know what the videocore can do
[16:18] <ngilles> shirro: you mean you also get crappy dubs in the local language, about X years later ?
[16:18] <Veryevil> the foundation will have the full specs
[16:19] <Veryevil> THey cannot release them though as they had to sign an NDA to get them
[16:19] <GabrialDestruir> But the reason we don't have things like mpg decoding or w/e, is that there was a licensing cost.
[16:19] <shirro> ngilles: of all the good european and japanese movies - yes
[16:19] <ReggieUK> well, yes, it is cost of licenses but the only way to get those licenses is to order 10k + units, which means you would be a mfr/oem and would sign an nda
[16:19] <Caver> http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/592
[16:19] <shirro> ngilles: the us hardly makes any good movies anymore. all comic books and remakes of other countries movies
[16:19] <Caver> lol
[16:20] <ngilles> shirro: that's true, there are a couple of good ones though
[16:20] <Caver> think this is heading rapidly into off topic
[16:20] <ngilles> shirro: still, this is all content that is a bitch to acquire, especially through legal means!
[16:20] <GabrialDestruir> I think somewhere it was rumored that the foundation might release an aftermarket codec pack or something
[16:20] <GabrialDestruir> for an additional cost
[16:20] <Caver> nah
[16:21] <shirro> at least we don't have tpb banned
[16:21] <ngilles> we don't even have anything similar to HULU or other stuff like that
[16:21] <Caver> who's "we"?
[16:21] <ngilles> yeah, we don't either (in france) yet ... although we have silly HADOPI law
[16:21] <ngilles> easily circumvented by most ip blocklists
[16:22] <hotwings> shirro - prometheus?
[16:22] <GabrialDestruir> Liz said they would be looking into additional codec packs
[16:22] <Caver> link?
[16:22] <ngilles> Caver: france, and most rest of europe as far as I am concerned, although the UK (and Ireland?) seems better place in this respect... but hey I can't even get access to BBC stuff
[16:22] <shirro> no hulu, netflix, spotify (or any of the other radio/music services), itunes is 2x price. half of amazons kindle books are missing. So whenever people talk about netflix players on the Pi - I couldn't care less. Netflix can fo to hell
[16:22] <GabrialDestruir> Same page
[16:23] <GabrialDestruir> It was in the comments
[16:23] <Caver> well yeah thats because they like to acutally sell it :)
[16:23] <Caver> we paid for it already
[16:23] <GabrialDestruir> "Would it be possible to purchase extra codecs separately ? Like having a firmware update. I???ve seen it on some tablets (Archos), the device is shipped with some default codecs, and if you want others you need to purchase codecs separately."
[16:23] <GabrialDestruir> "This is an option we???re looking at exploring. If we do decide to go down that road, it won???t be for a few months; administratively, it???s hard to manage, we???d need to see a clear benefit for the charity, and it???ll require another round of talking to the MPEG LA (and another round of form filling; the back and forth took about a month last time)."
[16:23] <Caver> (bbc content)
[16:24] * meshuga- (fn@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:24] <hotwings> "we'd need to see a clear benefit for the charity" <-- that is quite possibly the most ignorant thing ive heard
[16:24] <ngilles> Caver: but I don't even get that option to buy stuff from the bbc here
[16:25] <GabrialDestruir> I think, if/when they ever get out of backorders, codec packs could be the next thing.
[16:25] <ngilles> besides I should be allowed a couple of years of free download from the BBC from those 4 years of tv license I paid while at uni while not ever watching TV :D
[16:25] * cornet_ is now known as cornet
[16:26] <GabrialDestruir> But I think before that ever happens, they'll want to make sure they aren't thousands upon thousands of orders behind.
[16:26] * Lord_DeathMatch (~Lord_Deat@CPE-124-183-127-239.lns15.ken.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Quit: adi??s, amigos!)
[16:26] * chandoo (~chandoo@ool-ad032250.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:26] * passstab (~coplon@c-68-80-37-73.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:27] <hotwings> codec packs could be another revenue stream for the foundation. bringing in the extra money would most certainly benefit the foundation, and expanding the capability of their product would most certainly improve customer satisfaction
[16:27] * KaiNeR (~KaiNeR@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[16:27] <shirro> xvid and h264 will do just fine until the media industry decides they want to sell content to people. Though mpeg2 would be handy as our stupid government (australia) stuck us with old standards
[16:27] <GabrialDestruir> I think most things are h264 these days.
[16:27] * KaiNeR (~KaiNeR@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:27] <hotwings> h264 isnt going anywhere anytime soon
[16:27] <ngilles> well, the SD DVB standard is to use MPEG2, and sadly it seems lots of channels are sticking to that :(
[16:28] <shirro> GabrialDestruir: not broadcast tv here :-( but most everything that counts other wise yes. and old stuff in xvid plays well on the Pi
[16:28] <ngilles> france has only a couple channles in "HD", and not even everywhere :(
[16:28] * Etac_Sufbo (~aaa@n058153242100.netvigator.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:28] <hotwings> providers have poured tons of money into transitioning mpeg2 streams over to h264.. theyre not about to start over again and take on yet another huge investment when theres absolutely no reason to do so, and no need to do so
[16:28] <ReggieUK> UK has hd channels but mostly on satellite
[16:29] <ReggieUK> terristrial digital is luck of the draw
[16:29] <shirro> ngilles: a lot of ours is HD. I think some of it is badly compressed though.
[16:29] <Caver> I gather "soon" BBC is meant to be doing a iplayer but for abroad :)
[16:29] <ReggieUK> you will get one (bbc hd)
[16:29] <Caver> still for BBC abroad in europe - big satellite dish is a winner
[16:29] <GabrialDestruir> I can't imagine streaming tv through it would work very well, but that would be an interesting project, something I definitely want to try.
[16:29] * fabrice1 (~fabrice@c-67-180-20-19.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:29] <Caver> or friend in the tv, with sky and a slingbox
[16:29] <shirro> Caver: the BBC do a paid ipad app - it isn't all current stuff though
[16:30] <ngilles> shirro: yeah, I've noticed that too, Italy has pretty pool DVB practices, sticking 20 million channels in a single multiplex, making them so blocky that they are worse than their old analog
[16:30] <Caver> lovely!
[16:30] <ngilles> poor*
[16:31] <markus__> and all are owned by one guy?
[16:31] <GabrialDestruir> I personally, want to see something like Hulu on mine, that and youtube videos.
[16:31] <ngilles> markus__: used too, he's not the boss of the RAI channles anymore :p
[16:31] <GabrialDestruir> Then I could replace the desktop I'm using for that stuff.
[16:31] <shirro> Youtube will be ok, except for the content not available to mobile
[16:32] <shirro> Which is mostly crap music industry stuff you are better off avoiding anyway
[16:32] <GabrialDestruir> Ugh... Mobile youtube sucks
[16:32] <GabrialDestruir> .-.
[16:32] <ngilles> GabrialDestruir: yeah, I'm putting my expections for xbmc on Pi rather hi, it would be nice to be able to power it straight from one of my TVs USB ports directly, having it hidden, and use CEC to controle it :-)
[16:33] <shirro> GabrialDestruir: By mobile I mean html5. Some of the "protected" content is flash only.
[16:33] <Caver> heheh yeah
[16:33] <Caver> well CEC isn't there *yet*
[16:33] <GabrialDestruir> From my experience, a lot of stuff doesn't work html5 that well.
[16:34] <ngilles> Caver: I have a pulse-cec thingy
[16:34] <Caver> aha
[16:34] <ngilles> which could be used as a stop gap meausre
[16:34] <GabrialDestruir> It'd be nice if we could get Adobe to release a Pi Flash
[16:34] <nemo> lol
[16:35] <hotwings> itd be nice if flash would just die completely
[16:35] <cjbaird> ..everyone who wants this 'educational' computer to be their perfect plug-and-play media centres is just saying "Hey, RaspberryPi Foundation! You only need to fulfill my consumer needs! Yes, it's perfectly fine for me to leech off a Charity..."
[16:35] <Caver> try gnash 1st
[16:35] <GabrialDestruir> That too....
[16:35] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: it isn't like you need it for youtube or anything
[16:35] <GabrialDestruir> but for it to die completely something better would need to replace it.
[16:35] <Caver> cjbaird, well said
[16:35] <hotwings> cjbaird - how exactly is purchasing a product 'leeching off a charity'?
[16:36] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: the only flash feature not in HTML5 is microphone/camera - and that's now in the WebRTC spec, and is in dev builds of firefox and chrome
[16:36] <nemo> GabrialDestruir: actually, Adobe is very thoughtfully helping to kill off Flash
[16:36] <nemo> by halting mobile support and charging devs extra for accelerated rendering (you know, what you get for free in browsers)
[16:37] <GabrialDestruir> Well, yea, but a lot of sites aren't making the changes over to HTML5 because they've got this degree in flash or the sites in flash already, and they don't want to completely rebuild it.
[16:38] <markus__> I don't want flash. Let's just leave it alone and let it die.
[16:38] <hotwings> the foundation 1) has posted videos running xbmc/using the rpi as a media center, 2) has NOT posted videos showing how the device can be applied as an aid to help kids or education. thats pretty telling
[16:38] <ngilles> hotwings: that's not true, they showed a vid of Eben with class of kids!
[16:38] <ecto2> heh
[16:38] <markus__> hotwings: kids can use it as a media center
[16:39] <ecto2> to pirate media
[16:39] <Caver> hotwings, bahahah yes they have
[16:39] <markus__> ecto2: and other things as well
[16:39] <ecto2> need xbmc +rtorrent
[16:39] <hotwings> aside of that, for the foundation to be successful, they need people to buy their product(s). what a person does with an rpi is completely irrelevent & unrelated to what the foundation does to push their own "educational" agenda
[16:39] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:39] <GabrialDestruir> I'm sorry, if they truly didn't want it to be more then an "educational aid" then they wouldn't of released it publically.
[16:39] <GabrialDestruir> They would of sold directly to schools or something.
[16:39] <ngilles> indeed
[16:39] <Caver> which is fine until people start bitching all the time about extra licences
[16:40] <ecto2> im pretty pissed about that too
[16:40] * wkl (~conan@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[16:40] <ngilles> Caver: at which point, when they have the time, they will arange to sell the "extra codec pack"s to make a little more cash for the foundation to further their educational goals
[16:40] <ReggieUK> GabrialDestruir, the idea of releasing it publically was to get tinkerers and hobbyists onboard to thrash out bugs and get the OS ship shape
[16:41] <hotwings> the rpi is a product for sale. customers wanting support & options is a part of bringing a product to market
[16:41] <ReggieUK> to build a community to support the educational side of things when it goes live
[16:41] <shirro> hotwings: +1 - the olpc made a huge mistake by being exclusive although the XO sucked for other reasons as well. Electronics is all about quantity.
[16:41] <cjbaird> hotwings: how is wanting RPiFoundation to get every video codec for your Media Centre needs helping their goals? ("we'd need to see a clear benefit for the charity")
[16:41] <ngilles> shirro: didn't they have a pay 2 get 1 system ?
[16:41] <shirro> ngilles: not for long
[16:42] <ReggieUK> cjbaird, because it could bring in revenue to the foundation
[16:42] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@189-83-155-159.user.veloxzone.com.br) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[16:42] <GabrialDestruir> Well there is that, Reggie, but when you go showing things like XBMC running on it, you're going to get people who want it for a Media Centre without the "educational aspect"
[16:42] <ngilles> cjbaird: they sell it to you for more than the license costs them: done
[16:42] <hotwings> cjbaird - ALL revenue the foundation gets their hands on is of benefit as it 1) enables the foundation to continue to exist, and 2) enables the foundation to work towards their goals
[16:42] <ReggieUK> would you be happy paying ??10 for ??5 worth of licenses?
[16:42] <markus__> GabrialDestruir: what's the problem?
[16:42] <ReggieUK> if it got you what you wanted?
[16:43] <shirro> In the long run XBMC will be a plus. For the first lot of developers trying to get boards it is a pain.
[16:43] <Caver> I suspect that ... Broadcom would say ... sure we can sell you licences, but you'll have to buy them for *all* devices shipped, as we know they'll just be pirated back if you don't
[16:43] <GabrialDestruir> Eh, sure why not? The extra isn't really going to be that bad or any worse, than any other cash I'm going to drop into the Pi for other projects.
[16:44] <shirro> Broadcom won't want a pissed off Roku going to another company for the Roku3 because Broadcom undercut them with a non-profit educational computer
[16:44] <Caver> lol I'm not sure there is *that* much loyalty in the electronics world anyway
[16:44] <ngilles> cjbaird: I am quite fond of the educational goals set forth by the Rpi foundation, and my personal goals for the pi isn't only to have XBMC, I can envision a multitude of embedded projects hwere the Pi would be much better suited than arduino's and the likes
[16:45] <hotwings> i also fail to see how tinkering with an rpi as a media playback device is somehow illegitmate in some peoples mind, or somehow any different than tinkering with one to get it to do something else
[16:45] * wkl (~conan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:45] <Caver> I've not problem with tinkering
[16:45] <hotwings> as i said, how people use rpi is NOT important. what is is whether or not people are buying the product.
[16:45] <shirro> I aim to combine xbmc and education and put one on the big screen in my wifes classroom
[16:46] <Caver> cool
[16:46] <GabrialDestruir> I don't think there's a problem, and I don't think Codecs will be a problem either, it's just a matter of what'll happen with it.
[16:46] <cjbaird> there's s difference between tinkering, and bothering RPiF to get moar codecs
[16:46] <Caver> however people moaning about lack of every codec under the sun don't I think understand how they are licenced
[16:47] * mkopack (~mkopack@184-210-66-198.pools.spcsdns.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:47] <shirro> It is sad but Apple have trained me to live without flash and with limited codecs. I am very happy to transcode anything that doesn't have hardware support
[16:47] <ngilles> and that's besides the fact that divx + h.264 cover 90% (or more?) of your needs
[16:47] <hotwings> cjbaird - i think youre missing the point that theyre running a business. theyve release a product intended for public consumption. they need to support that product and address their customers needs & wants, not criticize them
[16:47] <Caver> a not for profit business with speciphic aims
[16:47] <GabrialDestruir> I agree with hotwings there, and on that note I'm off.
[16:47] * Knack (~WWW@ Quit ()
[16:48] <hotwings> cjbaird - if the foundation is smart, they'll turn customer wants into additional ways to generate revenue
[16:48] <mkopack> hey gang
[16:48] <Caver> hi mkopack
[16:48] <Caver> hotwings, ?
[16:48] <hotwings> caver - "non-profit" only means the profit is reinvested into the company
[16:48] <Caver> I know
[16:48] * GabrialDestruir (~GabrialDe@pool-71-254-135-241.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:49] <mkopack> Well, after getting my email from Newark yesterday saying that mine will go out in the week of May 29, checking the order status now shows July 9! LOL, I swear they have no idea
[16:49] <Caver> just saying perhaps *your* not the customer
[16:49] <mkopack> Hey Caver
[16:49] <Caver> :)
[16:49] * unknownbliss1 is now known as unknownbliss
[16:49] <shirro> mkopack: The telephone people seem really nice though. They rang me to see if I got my Pi.
[16:50] <Caver> but I go back to my original point ... I'm fairly sure BCM wold say ... only if you licence them for *all* devices sold
[16:50] <shirro> Caver: I agree. It will be all or nothing and the foundation will not get a say in that
[16:51] <hotwings> Caver - what makes you fairly sure about that? is there any time its happened happened that you can referenc?
[16:51] * s[x]_ (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:51] <hotwings> predicting what other people will do based on nothing more than your own imagination typically doesnt wind up to be very accurate... just sayin'
[16:51] <Caver> http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/592
[16:51] <shirro> these SoC people aren't set up to sell stuff to individuals. Their whole business model is against it.
[16:51] * s[x] (~sx]@ppp59-167-157-96.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[16:52] <Caver> it gets mentioned in the comments
[16:52] <Caver> they have to keep of a log of every device
[16:52] <Caver> and buy (the licences in blocks of ... can't remember but it was a big number)
[16:52] <mkopack> 100K IIRC
[16:52] <Caver> yup sounds about right
[16:53] <SpeedEvil> Unless it's possible to tie to a given device, BCM would argue about 'warez'
[16:53] <hotwings> people can say anything they want, im asking if theres any tangible evidence to support the idea that would happen
[16:53] * Simooon (~simon@h196.natout.aau.dk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[16:53] <Caver> well if you don't accept Liz's comments
[16:53] <Caver> then get lost ... !
[16:53] <Caver> as your making straw men arguments
[16:54] <shirro> nobody has shown me a codec anyone really NEEDS that is missing yet. There is one "nice to have" that I can see which is mpeg2.
[16:54] <hotwings> liz is not the authority on what happens.. she doesnt even have much business experience. im saying show me real world evidence or let broadcom speak for themselves on the matter. otherwise, stop pretending you know what theyll do
[16:55] <Caver> nope
[16:55] <Caver> how about you stop it?
[16:55] <Caver> everytime I talk to you on here, your at it
[16:55] <ReggieUK> ahahaha, great response :D
[16:55] <ReggieUK> you smell, no YOU smell!!
[16:55] <Caver> you smell double worse
[16:55] <ReggieUK> you smell worse than your mom
[16:55] <Caver> I make a perfectly reasonable argument, with references
[16:55] <ReggieUK> and she smells really bad
[16:56] <hotwings> Caver - youre the one making assumptions and acting like you know what the future holds ..
[16:56] <hotwings> and youre asking i stop questioning your imagination? lol ok
[16:56] <Caver> yup ... based on evidence
[16:56] <Caver> I've yet to see yours
[16:56] <Matt> I agree that mpeg2 would be very nice to have
[16:56] <Caver> come on ... where's your counter argument?
[16:56] <Matt> but that's partly because I have a lot of mpeg2 media :)
[16:56] <hotwings> Caver - what kind of evidence do you expect when i say "let broadcom speak for themselves on the matter"
[16:57] <shirro> hotwings: sorry but your argument is like the anti-global warming people. show you a mountain of the best evidence we have and you are just saying "but how do you really know". We don't know for sure. But the evidence suggests....
[16:57] <cjbaird> "If The RaspberryPi Fundation were _really_ serious, they'd file for IPO!" ... -_- Sorry, the "If I get filthy Rich, it helps everyone!" idea was disproven during the Eighties. (Reaganomics..)
[16:57] <Caver> shirro, well said!
[16:58] <hotwings> shirro - thats insane... im saying quit assuming and pretending you know what broadcom will do, and let broadcom speak for themselves... yet im the crazy one? .........wow, just wow
[16:58] <Caver> well tell you what .... *you* go and ring them
[16:58] <Caver> and tell us what they say
[16:59] * cjbaird (~cjb@ppp121-45-175-149.lns20.syd6.internode.on.net) has left #raspberrypi
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[16:59] * si (~si@cpc5-wolv6-0-0-cust122.wolv.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[17:00] <hotwings> Caver - if i did that, you would probably still give in to your imagination and argument that theyll probably change their mind or something stupid like that
[17:00] <Caver> ok
[17:00] * Caver 1, hotwings 0
[17:00] <hotwings> if youre willing to believe your own assumptions rather than wait for the truth, youre not exactly keeping an open mind.
[17:00] <Caver> my mind is open
[17:00] <Caver> but has its own idea's
[17:01] <hotwings> [07:48:57] <Caver> but I go back to my original point ... I'm fairly sure BCM wold say ... only if you licence them for *all* devices sold
[17:01] <hotwings> what sounds more open-minded to you? "im fairly sure" or "lets see what broadcom has to say"
[17:02] * yang2 (yang@jazz.linuxshell.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:02] <SpeedEvil> Broadcom do not talk to the general public.
[17:02] <Caver> I'm happy with my statement
[17:02] <Caver> fairly sure != sure
[17:02] <Caver> or certain
[17:02] <Caver> or close minded
[17:02] <SpeedEvil> This is based on many peoples trying to get datsheets, or quotes, or anything out of them.
[17:03] <SpeedEvil> They are utterly uninterested in talking to you unless you look likely to buy 100K chips.
[17:03] <dmsuse> the hell is broadcom ?
[17:03] <Caver> broadcom make the System on a Chip used in the Pi
[17:03] <SpeedEvil> The SOC provider for the Pi.
[17:03] <dmsuse> :o
[17:03] <hotwings> Caver - you didnt answer my question.. what sounds more open-minded to you? "im fairly sure" or "lets see what broadcom has to say"
[17:03] <shirro> They pay Eben's salary
[17:03] <Caver> also true
[17:04] <Caver> hotwings, your making straw men again ... you said that way later than I made that statement
[17:04] <Caver> you do *know* what a straw man is?
[17:04] <Caver> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
[17:04] * the_real_crimper (~the_real_@cpe-98-154-91-166.socal.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:05] <shirro> What do people think of the GPU performance on the Pi? Has anyone been playing with opengl?
[17:05] <fALSO> where?
[17:05] <fALSO> on framebuffer ?
[17:05] <Caver> no there is full open gl es seperate to the framebuffer
[17:05] <fALSO> yap, that doesnt work on X
[17:06] <shirro> Well it is on broadcom's proprietary dispmanx thing. But call it framebuffer if you like. It isn't X
[17:06] <fALSO> because there is not X driver, for 2d or 2d
[17:06] <hotwings> Caver - its a simple question, why wont you answer it? is it because youre not man enough to concede that "lets see what broadcom has to say" is keeping more of an open-mind that "im fairly sure"?... cmon, we're adults here. you can answer a simple question cant you?
[17:06] <Caver> the Qt stuff works with it
[17:06] <Caver> hotwings, I'm plenty man
[17:06] <Caver> and I'm sticking with my assertion
[17:06] <hotwings> ok, then for the third time: what sounds more open-minded to you? "im fairly sure" or "lets see what broadcom has to say"
[17:06] <Caver> it's like an opinion
[17:07] <hotwings> there are only two choices.. pick one
[17:07] <Caver> neither
[17:07] <Caver> they don't compare!
[17:07] <Caver> ergo straw man
[17:07] * drazyl (~drazyl@ Quit (Excess Flood)
[17:07] <shirro> X doesn't do 3D anyway. It passes it through if it is indirect rendering or you go direct to the 3d card if it is direct. The current EGL just can't write into an X windows buffer. But you can do an overlay the same size if you write a little code
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[17:07] <fALSO> the qt stuff works on it- ON framebuffer
[17:08] <hotwings> the fact that you cant answer a simple question is telling enough.. youre obviously not confident in your own assumptions because you wont even back what you said yourself earlier today. that says it all. end of story
[17:08] <Caver> ok
[17:08] <hotwings> Caver - i just saw your pm.. will reply there
[17:09] <shirro> And you could copy stuff over to X it just would be very inefficient (like X in general)
[17:15] <shirro> The framerate on some webgl shader demos I have copied over are interesting. They are slow but are running at much higher res than the canvas in my browser. I wonder if there is some sweet spot, resolution, bpp etc for best performance.
[17:16] <fALSO> they will be slow until X is correctly supported
[17:16] * thz_nmr|bnc is now known as thz_nmr
[17:16] <fALSO> and Im not sure that webgl at least in chrome uses opengl ES
[17:16] <fALSO> i doubt it
[17:16] <shirro> No you dick. I ported shaders from webgl to opelgl
[17:17] <fALSO> ???
[17:18] <shirro> webgl is a subset of opengl es. you can copy and paste the shaders if you spend the time to write a little test bed to run them. I will get like a 3rd the framerate but at 10 times the resolution. And I a not sure if that is good or bad.
[17:19] * the_real_crimper (~the_real_@cpe-98-154-91-166.socal.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[17:19] <fALSO> youre trying to run webgl demos on framebuffer ?
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[17:19] <fALSO> "ported" them somehow ?
[17:20] <fALSO> dont those khronos group have some kind of demos, with source?
[17:20] <shirro> They are mostly meaningless demos so I am sure games can be made to run faster. The ones I have tried so far tend to have a lot of trig functions.
[17:21] <SpeedEvil> So do many games.
[17:21] <fALSO> there are a few docs explaining how to port opengl to opengl es
[17:21] <fALSO> but the show only the basic stuff
[17:22] <nemo> there's a lot more webgl out there than the khronos demos
[17:22] <nemo> check webgl.com and planet-webgl.org
[17:22] <nemo> one of our GSoC projects is porting our game to HTML5
[17:22] <nemo> but not for running on the pi :D
[17:22] * Guest64405 (~mike@c-71-63-115-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:22] <nemo> gonna use emscripten
[17:22] * mikey_w (~mike@c-71-63-115-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:23] <fALSO> well shirro
[17:23] <fALSO> a "nice" way to learn
[17:23] <shirro> Something that runs at 60fps in ShaderToy on the macbook in a canvas on that is like 512x384 is running at under 20fps in full HD. Is that good or bad?
[17:23] <fALSO> is to download the "Raspberry pi" version of quake 3
[17:23] <fALSO> and the original one
[17:23] <fALSO> and compare the opengl parts
[17:24] <fALSO> because the raspberry pi ppl didnt give ANY documentation
[17:24] <nemo> the Pi supports GLES2
[17:24] <nemo> so you're probably better off grabbing a FAQ on that
[17:24] <nemo> vendor extensions aside
[17:25] <nemo> vendor extensions you can always get from a query
[17:25] <nemo> or just running glxinfo :)
[17:25] * yang2 (yang@jazz.linuxshell.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:26] <shirro> nemo: thanks will links check out. Have been looking at http://www.iquilezles.org/apps/shadertoy/ and http://glsl.heroku.com/ amongst others. Is easy just to play with fragment shaders for a laugh. I will do some geometry stuff later.
[17:26] <nemo> there are a lot of those out there for sure
[17:26] <mkopack> Wow have the mighty fallen??? 2011Q1 - RIM WW Smartphone market share: 23.8% 2012Q1 - 8.2%
[17:26] <shirro> nemo: no glxinfo. you would have to write some code to query the extentions
[17:26] <fALSO> i dont think that ppl will like that much to play without any sound
[17:26] <nemo> shirro: no one has ported glxinfo yet? really?
[17:26] <nemo> shirro: of all the distros that are already on pi?
[17:26] <mkopack> Sorry, that was Nokia, not RIM
[17:26] <nemo> huh...
[17:26] <shirro> there is no glx
[17:27] <nemo> oh
[17:27] <mkopack> Rim went from 13.6% to 6.7% in the same times
[17:27] <nemo> shirro: that's interesting. hey. does Firefox run on the pi?
[17:27] <shirro> yes. it is a normal linux machine for the most part. Firefox and Chromium run. But don't open too many tabs
[17:27] <fALSO> it can run, very slowly
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[17:28] <nemo> shirro: could you tell me what about:support says in the Graphics section?
[17:28] <nemo> (just curious)
[17:28] <nemo> shirro: I guess Firefox would be a better choice on the Pi, due to being a lot better at memory usage :)
[17:28] <fALSO> nemo, there arent any drivers for X
[17:28] <raynerd> Anyone in here from UK and order through Farnells with an email telling you that delivery commence this past week wc. 28 April ?
[17:28] <shirro> nemo: I would have to get out of my comfy chair and walk across the room and start X
[17:28] <fALSO> so everything in X will be ultra-slow, like 1989 slow
[17:29] <shirro> fALSO: correct
[17:29] <fALSO> lets see if at least someone manages to do a 2d driver for X
[17:29] <fALSO> but its taking a while
[17:29] <fALSO> i expected that at least a working sound driver would be available by now
[17:30] <mkopack> raynerd: when did you get that email?
[17:31] <shirro> nobody is sure on how best to accelerate X yet. The alternatives are DMA and optimised ARM asm, OpenGL and dispmanx (which should be able to do some of the porter-duff stuff I think but is probably to inflexible).
[17:31] <raynerd> I got it about a week ago, around the 26th...saying it would be delivered wc 28th... but nothing yet!!
[17:31] <mkopack> Ah
[17:32] <raynerd> and full order status still says "back list"
[17:33] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:34] <raynerd> OUCH !!! :-(
[17:34] <nemo> oh. I got my e-mail too
[17:34] <nemo> says July 18 :-/
[17:34] <nemo> ah well
[17:34] <raynerd> yes SUCKS !! just re-read it for a whole week I`ve been getting all excited...balls! :-p
[17:34] <hotwings> mkopack - We're excited to inform you that your Raspberry Pi will be delivered in an upcoming shipment beginning the week of June 18th. We will have your firm delivery date, after manufacturer confirmations are made, on Newark.com.
[17:35] <passstab> hey nemo
[17:35] <hotwings> thats for one of my orders, not sure which one
[17:35] <nemo> hiya passstab
[17:35] <mkopack> hot: Yeah, I only have gotten the email for my first order so far??? Nothing yet for the second. I wonder if they've put in some stuff to check for multiple orders and block the additionals
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[17:36] * Veryevil (~Veryevil@ Quit ()
[17:36] <mkopack> Or at least move them to the end of the line
[17:36] * Kyzz (~quassel@cpe-24-166-81-109.neo.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:36] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56aa.bb.sky.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[17:36] <nemo> mkopack: what, they saw through your different name, CC and mailing address?
[17:36] * gambler (~Adium@pi2160.physik.uni-erlangen.de) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[17:36] <mkopack> hehe actually, I didn't do ANY of that :)
[17:36] <nemo> you are apparently insufficiently sneaky
[17:37] <nemo> I'm less sneaky in that I only ordered one out of some silly sense of honesty and fairplay
[17:37] <mkopack> Well, I'll give it another day or two...
[17:37] <mkopack> Not a big deal. as long as I get one I'll be fine for a while
[17:38] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56aa.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:41] <flaushy> i irdered 3 on launchdad, farnell let me and it was well after 9 am, so i figured it would be ok. I think i only get one tho
[17:41] <flaushy> 3 as in one order
[17:41] <mkopack> We'll see
[17:41] <Caver> erk
[17:42] <Caver> they can use that to cancle the order
[17:42] <mkopack> Ah, I did my 2 as independent orders
[17:42] <flaushy> if they do, it is ok
[17:42] <flaushy> if i get one and 2 in 4 months it is ok as well
[17:42] <flaushy> if i get 3, 2 go to ppl in my hackerspaces
[17:43] <flaushy> but we will see
[17:45] <Caver> well at some point manufacturing will catch up with demand :)
[17:46] * neciO (~juan@d51A445FA.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:46] <flaushy> right :)
[17:46] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:46] <flaushy> and i guess it will be soon
[17:46] * flaushy waves at pandora folks
[17:46] <hotwings> mkopack - if they do, they better use the order i placed from the link they sent when i 'expressed interest' cuz that should be higher on the list :)
[17:47] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:47] <mkopack> Yeah, except it *seems* like they're processing the "expressed interest" AFTER they process all the currently open actual "orders"
[17:48] <hotwings> i get that sense too.. basically expressing interest feels like it was pointless
[17:49] <Caver> random question has *anyone* here heard of getting a Pi delivered from RS yet?
[17:49] <Caver> everyone I've spoken too was farnell
[17:50] <flaushy> i think mine is from rs
[17:50] <flaushy> lemme check
[17:50] <flaushy> ah crap he aint online
[17:51] <RaTTuS|BIG> yes people have had RS delvieries
[17:51] <Caver> nods
[17:51] <Caver> good!
[17:51] * beardface (a7cebd06@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[18:00] <Cheery> hi all
[18:01] <Cheery> or..
[18:01] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[18:01] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:01] <Cheery> hi *
[18:01] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:01] <Cheery> anyone knows whether rpi would boot with other /boot filesystems than W95 FAT32?
[18:02] <Caver> mmm am fairly sure fat16 woudl work
[18:02] <Caver> but nothing else
[18:02] <fALSO> the fat driver surely is in the firmware
[18:02] <fALSO> you cant use any other FS for that
[18:03] <Cheery> in rpi qemu emulator parameters.. what does these two lines mean?
[18:03] <Cheery> -serial stdio -redir tcp:2222::22 \
[18:03] <Cheery> -usb -usbdevice host:0403:6001
[18:03] <Cheery> -usb -usbdevice host:0403:6001
[18:03] <Cheery> oh.. and why -kernel zImage ?
[18:03] * mkopack (~mkopack@184-210-66-198.pools.spcsdns.net) Quit (Read error: No route to host)
[18:03] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:03] <fALSO> cant you use google and find the docs ?
[18:03] * mkopack (~mkopack@184-210-66-198.pools.spcsdns.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:04] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD28970.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:04] <Cheery> fALSO: yes.. but thought you might know off-hand them.
[18:04] <fALSO> you dint even said the emulator... are we magicians ?
[18:04] <ReggieUK> -kernel zImage because they want to use a zImage, instead of uImage or flat binary
[18:05] <Cheery> ReggieUK: that configuration they have is called with that name?
[18:05] <ReggieUK> -usb -usbdevice host:0403:6001 is the VID/PID of a ftdi usb device
[18:05] <Cheery> fALSO: I didn't think we are.. but I thought we are quite close of that. ;)
[18:06] <ReggieUK> and the -serial stuff is probably redirecting serial console via tcp/ip
[18:06] <fALSO> :-P
[18:06] <Cheery> host:vendor_id:product_id
[18:06] <Cheery> that's the syntax for -usbdevice in that part.
[18:07] <ReggieUK> VID/PID = vendor id/product id
[18:08] <Cheery> that is enough to locate where in address space the USB is in, even?
[18:08] <ReggieUK> not sure I understand your question
[18:08] <Caver> lsusb might help
[18:08] <ReggieUK> indeed
[18:08] <ReggieUK> still not sure what he's getting at though....
[18:09] <Cheery> well I thought ARM as a platform has all devices memory mapped somewhere into address space.
[18:09] <Cheery> when the system boots up
[18:09] <ReggieUK> depends on how the kernel is setup
[18:09] * mhcerri (Marcelo@nat/ibm/x-slocgeyghtnufkwf) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:09] <ReggieUK> as to when and where those things might be mapped
[18:09] <Cheery> and that you need to configure where to find them from.
[18:09] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7)
[18:11] <ReggieUK> what sort of context/level are you talking about?
[18:11] * prebz (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:11] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:11] <Cheery> would really need to get better with my communication.. :/
[18:12] <Cheery> ReggieUK: I'm wondering how the kernel finds the address where that USB host is mapped to.
[18:12] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ Quit (Client Quit)
[18:12] <Cheery> and how it comes that it is sufficient to just tell the vendor id of such device?
[18:12] <Cheery> ...when emulating the device
[18:13] <ReggieUK> you'd possibly have some assembler that does initial board setup (ram speed, timings etc) then platform drivers would pretty much deal with the 'on chip' specifics, along with amount of ram avaiable for specific areas etc.
[18:13] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:13] <Cheery> now I did not understood. :)
[18:14] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[18:14] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Bye)
[18:14] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:14] * prebz_ (~prebz@c83-248-137-170.bredband.comhem.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:14] * esotera (~jamie@94-193-222-75.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:15] <Cheery> oh nevermind. perhaps there is a CPUID or some other such which identifies whether it's emulator or real thing.
[18:15] <Cheery> or then ARM system has some way to configure peripherals
[18:15] <ReggieUK> I'm not sure on specifics for q-emu but it will register it's interest in a device, the VID/PID of devices is a universal thing, so unless you've got 2 devices on there it's probably a relatively easy way to find it
[18:16] <ReggieUK> well
[18:16] <FZombie> yay I "might have my pi by xmas" they really shouldn't joke about making me wait that long.
[18:16] <ReggieUK> things like virtualbox install their own driver for things like usb
[18:16] <Caver> as long as you don't stipulate by which xmas :)
[18:16] <Cheery> xmas 2203
[18:16] <ReggieUK> so in my windows host box, when I have virtualbox running, my ftdi device shows up in device manager as a 'virtualbox usb device'
[18:17] <ReggieUK> so I would assume that it loads a 'dummy' usb passthrough driver of some kind that then allows the linux virtual machine to talk to it
[18:17] <Cheery> oh wait.. I should've typed "xmas 2097" for intertextual reference and +karma
[18:18] * Caver (~Caver@nat1.nipltd.com) Quit (Quit: home time)
[18:18] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:20] <Cheery> ReggieUK: bit odd.. but might be like you say.
[18:20] * anon9002 (~anon@KYM5298.rh.psu.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:21] * nivi (~nivi@ Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[18:21] <ReggieUK> not that odd
[18:21] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:21] <FZombie> I've never had a problem with virtualbox using usb devices, my ftdi com port adapter works fine
[18:21] <FZombie> i never did anything, just plugged it in and used
[18:22] * IT_Sean bangs his head against his desk a few times
[18:22] <Cheery> you neither probably.. should. unless you are developing something.
[18:22] * mpthompson (~IceChat77@c-50-131-39-81.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:22] <IT_Sean> somebody please... make the stoopid go away.
[18:22] <ReggieUK> FZombie, I don't have any issues with ftdi either
[18:22] <ReggieUK> it's just the way they work
[18:22] <ReggieUK> IT_Sean, which stoopid?
[18:22] <ReggieUK> or virtualbox, or usb
[18:22] <IT_Sean> ReggieUK: dumb users. make them stop calling.
[18:22] <Cheery> now I'm offended
[18:23] <ReggieUK> Cheery, why? Did you call IT_Sean?
[18:23] <Cheery> call? oh.
[18:23] <IT_Sean> I've had this one user who has racked up about 14 hours in my companies help chat, asking the dumbest questions, over the past five days.
[18:23] <drazyl> can you not bill them?
[18:23] <IT_Sean> sorry Cheery. I work tech support.
[18:23] <ReggieUK> next time he calls, put on a fake voice and say you had to have 5 days off because of the stress of spending 14hours in help chat for one user
[18:23] <Cheery> oh...
[18:23] <nemo> sounds like you need a new job
[18:23] <IT_Sean> My average help chat session time :5 minutes. My average help chat sessions with Dumbuser: 30 minutes.
[18:24] <IT_Sean> I love my job, i just can't stand this one dumbarse
[18:24] <nemo> I take longer than 5 minutes w/ ISP tech support, but that's due to having to spend a lot of time lying about doing stuff
[18:24] <IT_Sean> EVERYTHING he has asked me so far is answered in the manual.
[18:24] <nemo> most of it Windows-related
[18:25] <ReggieUK> dumbarses, the universal nemesis of IT techs
[18:25] <nemo> it does no good to mention the hours of ping logs I collected over months showing the intermittent outtages that seemed temperature related
[18:25] <ReggieUK> teach him/her how to use a manual
[18:25] <drazyl> try the following response:
[18:25] <nemo> so you have to lie to the tech support until they escalate it :-/
[18:25] <drazyl> "hold on while I look that up"
[18:25] <drazyl> then go and make a tea
[18:25] * warddr (~warddr@Wikipedia/Warddr) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:25] <IT_Sean> ReggieUK: i emailed it to him. ...twice. ...and posted him a printed copy, with the good bits highlighted.
[18:26] <drazyl> make them wait 10-20mins each time having already pointed out you are just looking it up, they should eventually realise it is quicker to look it up themself
[18:26] <ReggieUK> talk to his line manager then
[18:26] <ReggieUK> it's the only way forward
[18:26] * felgru (~felgru@xdsl-87-78-170-137.netcologne.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:26] <ReggieUK> you'd have loved my last job
[18:26] <drazyl> (resorted to doing this years back when working for a big us oil company and people had just been given the latest wp and lotus 123)
[18:26] <ReggieUK> listening to IT techs do phone support then picking apart how they could've done it better :D
[18:27] <Cheery> LOL
[18:27] <drazyl> after getting fed up with all the "how do i make text bold" kind of calls
[18:27] <ReggieUK> so I actually got to talk to their line managers about their performance
[18:28] * jprvita|afk is now known as jprvita
[18:28] <Cheery> IT_Sean: Why are you required to answer it if it's described in manual?
[18:28] <IT_Sean> so, you were the evil QA guy, spying on us techs, to make sure we didn't tell the users to flip their PSU volt swithc from 220 to 110 to "get more power to the memory" :p
[18:28] <IT_Sean> ?
[18:28] <IT_Sean> Cheery: yup.
[18:28] <IT_Sean> I am.
[18:28] <Cheery> but why?
[18:28] <ReggieUK> IT_Sean, yup
[18:28] <IT_Sean> because that is my job.
[18:29] <ReggieUK> the rest of the company called our department 'the dark side'
[18:29] <IT_Sean> would you actually report me for telling a user that, Reg?
[18:29] <ReggieUK> depends how well I knew you and how seriously the user took you
[18:29] <Cheery> I'm bit happy those PSU volt switches are history
[18:29] <nemo> IT_Sean: that is a great idea, and works even better in the US
[18:30] * stephenl (~stephenl@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:30] <ReggieUK> and I probably wouldn't report you as such in a bad way, just mark you down for giving incorrect information to a user and have a word with you about it
[18:30] <ReggieUK> everything I did was about your performance
[18:30] <ReggieUK> and as bonuses are performance related, it's in your interests to not say stupid things to clients :)
[18:30] <IT_Sean> Ahh.. So... "have a word later" = 'have a pint down the pub after work and laugh about it'?
[18:30] <IT_Sean> oooooh... i see.
[18:31] <ReggieUK> nope, = bring it up in our 1 to 1 session about your performance and how we could help you to improve :)
[18:31] <IT_Sean> Ah, but, it would be in your best interest to not report me, less you find your PC suddenly explodes when you switch it on one morning.
[18:31] <Cheery> hmm
[18:31] <nemo> Someone has been reading too much BOFH archives
[18:31] <ReggieUK> they called us the dark side but we were totally misunderstood
[18:32] * mmattice_ is now known as mmattice
[18:32] <ReggieUK> we were there to make sure that we were quality assured, which means getting everyone to perform to a consistently good level, so we were there to make sure standards don't slip and that people improved, improving your performance = more money
[18:32] <Cheery> from some odd reason I'd be on the correct website to wonder about building a bootdisk image.
[18:33] <IT_Sean> nemo: I could have inspired the BOFH archives... I used to put Really Big Capacitors in all the sockets in the tehc labs at school, so when they switched the master breaker on in the morning, all the tech benches would go BANG
[18:33] <Hydrazine> o.0
[18:33] <Hydrazine> nasty
[18:33] <Cheery> ^^
[18:33] * raynerd (~raynerd@host86-150-7-194.range86-150.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[18:34] * Laogeodritt (~Laogeodri@wikipedia/Laogeodritt) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:34] <IT_Sean> To be fair... i only did it the once. But you COULD hear it in the next building over.
[18:34] <ReggieUK> IT_Sean, the only time I'd really raise a flag would be if something inappropriate happened during a call
[18:34] <ReggieUK> like the tech swearing
[18:34] <IT_Sean> ahh
[18:34] <ReggieUK> or 45 minutes on a personal call
[18:35] * IT_Sean makes a mental note to stop swearing at the customers
[18:35] <Cheery> wouldn't be good tech support person then. :P
[18:35] <IT_Sean> it takes a special kind.
[18:35] * IT_Sean manages to keep each support call, chat, or email professional and accurate, and save the swearing for after.
[18:36] * nemo (nemo@c-68-50-78-21.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has left #raspberrypi
[18:37] <ReggieUK> indeed, I was the same doing tech support
[18:37] * Cheery was annoyed up to being ready to bite someone this morning.
[18:37] <ReggieUK> nothing to stop you thinking all of those words during a call, just don't utter them until after the phone is down
[18:37] <IT_Sean> Aye.
[18:38] <ReggieUK> just like in real life :D
[18:38] <Davespice> you guys must have the patience of a saint
[18:38] <IT_Sean> heh
[18:38] <Cheery> were installing a perl script into my irssi
[18:38] <IT_Sean> Davespice: my record call length is three hours.
[18:38] <Davespice> holy hell!
[18:38] <IT_Sean> Afterwords, i had to go outside and take walk.
[18:38] <IT_Sean> *a walk
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[18:39] <IT_Sean> i do not have the patients of a saint. just the need to not get fired :p
[18:39] * nrltd (foobar@ Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[18:39] <ReggieUK> yeah, not sure if it's patience of a saint or desire to have money in pocket
[18:39] <Davespice> haha
[18:39] <IT_Sean> I support a line of encrypted OOB applainces. So, my tech calls are not your average "it won't do" calls.
[18:39] * diplo (~diplo@cpc2-trow1-0-0-cust1447.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[18:39] <Cheery> I hope you don't have to install script for sasl authentification so you can get into freenode.net any near morning.
[18:40] <IT_Sean> Cheery: there are several clients that support SASL right out of the box, and you only need it if you are connecting via a cell network
[18:40] * IT_Sean does use SASL, as he is connecting to freenode over 3G on his iPad.
[18:40] <ReggieUK> I'd say our tech support wasn't that run of the mill either
[18:40] <Cheery> IT_Sean: yes.. yes.. but...
[18:41] <IT_Sean> but?
[18:41] <IT_Sean> no butts, Cheery
[18:41] * decadance_ is now known as decadance
[18:41] * BeholdMyGlory (~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[18:41] * Behold (~behold@d83-183-64-117.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:41] <Cheery> IT_Sean: freenode.net techs were banishing some trolls and had to force sasl for an IP block, that includes my IP.
[18:42] * chandoo (~chandoo@ool-ad032250.dyn.optonline.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[18:42] <ReggieUK> we'd do everything that a home user could possibly ask you from software and hardware installation and usage, broadband troubleshooting, drifting into inhouse software dev as well as 3rd party bespoke software beta testing
[18:43] * eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:44] <ReggieUK> along with writing knowledge base articles, how tos etc.
[18:44] <IT_Sean> cheery, contact freenode staff... they will sort you out
[18:44] <Cheery> IT_Sean: I were in contact already.. though I decided I might keep the SASL
[18:44] * IT_Sean is also responsible for, besides support, for writing all the manuals, and doing all the device testing.
[18:44] <Cheery> IT_Sean: it took half hour of my attention anyway to get that annoying script to run.
[18:46] <IT_Sean> not my fault.
[18:46] <Cheery> yes.
[18:46] <IT_Sean> no.
[18:46] <IT_Sean> it isn't.
[18:46] <Cheery> I mean that yes, it's not your fault.
[18:46] <IT_Sean> ah... :p
[18:46] <Cheery> lol
[18:47] <Cheery> anyway it just made me angry today.
[18:47] * iccanobif (iccanobif@host28-127-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:48] * ecto2 (~rakata@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[18:49] <Cheery> I think about making a script that constructs a raspberry pi compatible SD card image, which it fills up straight out.
[18:49] <IT_Sean> go for it.
[18:49] <Cheery> http://elinux.org/RPi_Advanced_Setup seems to tell all I need.
[18:50] <Cheery> except setup of loopback device.. not sure whether it can be done without root account though.
[18:50] <[TH]exfi1eme> cool
[18:50] <Cheery> It shouldn't be hard anyway.. I guess I'll first try doing one manually and gather all the steps that way.
[18:51] * IT_Sean flicks a serial loopback plug at Cheery
[18:51] <Cheery> hmhmmm... mkcard.txt? that ought do this already
[18:52] <Cheery> not finding that
[18:52] <Kyzz> How much should the RPi's be shipped? I thought they negotiated a lower price than 63$~???
[18:52] <Cheery> IT_Sean: not understanding the action.
[18:53] <IT_Sean> Cheery: a serial loopback plug is a plug that is used to test serial ports. :p
[18:53] <IT_Sean> t'was a joke.
[18:55] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@189-12-26-147.user.veloxzone.com.br) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:57] * lachs_ (~lachs@ Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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[18:58] * stuk_gen (~quassel@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:04] * _sundar_ (~sundar@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:05] <mkopack> Kyzz: Was that your post on the forums?
[19:06] * shirro (~shirro@pdpc/supporter/active/shirro) Quit (Quit: shirro)
[19:06] <mkopack> And its probably because of the shipping internationally
[19:06] * eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@ Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[19:06] * capiscuas (~capiscuas@ppp-58-8-246-120.revip2.asianet.co.th) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:06] * MOUS (~mous@152.138-67-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:18] <Kyzz> mokpack: Nope I didn't post on the forums , but it seems a bit high :P
[19:19] * capiscuas (~capiscuas@ppp-58-8-246-120.revip2.asianet.co.th) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[19:19] <mkopack> Somebody else was posting the same thing
[19:19] <mkopack> I assume you ordered directly from Farnell Export?
[19:19] <mkopack> and you're in the USA?
[19:20] <Kyzz> Yup from Farnell and I'm from the USA
[19:20] <Kyzz> I remember seeing a post about it on the Raspberry Pi's foundation's Twitter about how expensive it is. They replied that it shouldn't be that much
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[19:30] <mkopack> Well, the table that they posted showed prices based on you ordering from your local country, not from Export Farnell.
[19:30] <mkopack> If you ordered from Newark, it would have only been about $42 total
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[19:45] <OneFix_Work> Does the rPi foundation plan on giving away development kits for projects? I understand the cost of the rPi is low enough that most projects wouldn't need donations.
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[19:48] <OneFix_Work> Specifically what I was thinking about are the organizations that recycle old PCs for needy kids. It would seem to me that an entire rPi kit could be built fairly cheaply...which brings me to another question...has anyone looked into making laptop "dock" for the rPi?
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[19:50] <mkopack> OneFix - there are usb-based universal Laptop "docks" that you can get that should work with the RPi
[19:51] <mkopack> Targus and other companies make them
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[19:56] <mjr> Fedora apparently advertises plug'n'play support with Plugable docks in Fedora 17: http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/multi-seat.html
[19:56] <mjr> they're somewhat redundant though, offering also displaylink video (and ethernet, and audio, though the audio might not be so redundant for some)
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[20:00] <mjr> though one could make a multi-seat pi with one user on the internal GPU and one on the Plugable with that ;)
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[20:18] <mkopack> I can't even imagine how god awful slow that would be mjr
[20:18] <mkopack> Pi BARELY has the horsepower to deal with a single X instance, and you want 2 people logged into it each running their own X desktop ?? No thanks
[20:19] <hotwings> eww, yeah
[20:19] <mkopack> At $35, no reason not to give everyone their own
[20:20] <hotwings> then again, maybe young tribal african kids wouldnt mind all that lag... better than not having a pc from their perspective?
[20:20] <mkopack> Eh, they'd be better off with a OLPC
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[20:21] <mkopack> By the time you get a kb, mouse, SD card, and display, and figure out a way to power everything you're up to OLPC land and it's more portable
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[20:23] <mjr> I was mostly thinking hack value. But considering a Plugable _is_ on the order of double the price of a Pi, yes, own Pis for everyone (at least when the production catches up ;)
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[20:30] <Hattara-pilvi> Do we have a list anywhere with information on the real pixel size of the HDMI port output modes. Like 1080p is 1920x1080, but what is the REAL ammount of pixels in say 576p?
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[20:36] <smw> Hattara-pilvi, 720 x 576
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[20:37] <Hattara-pilvi> smw: Yo don't ha????en to have list of those all?
[20:37] <smw> Hattara-pilvi, nope... sorry
[20:38] <smw> Hattara-pilvi, NNNNp is the number of vertical lines
[20:39] <smw> Hattara-pilvi, then you use the aspect ratio to find the horizontal
[20:39] <smw> Hattara-pilvi, the aspect ratio for 576p is whatever PAL uses
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[20:40] <Hattara-pilvi> smw: But this for the HDMI output, which aspect ratio is defined by the ammount or pixels in the resolution
[20:41] <Hattara-pilvi> smw: For the analog output that would be true but for the HDMI....
[20:41] <smw> eh?
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[20:47] <Hattara-pilvi> smw: analog output with PAL. 4:3 == 768:576. 16:9 == 1024:576. Just like you said. The aspect ratio defines the final pixel resolution and this is tru for the nalaog output. But with HDMI you cannot change the aspectratio. It is digital and so outputs image at spesific pixel resolution which defines the aspectratio 1080p doesnt exist in 4:3 aspectratio... and so on
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[20:52] <Cheery> getting back on this.
[20:52] <Cheery> was messing up with politics
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[20:53] <zgreg> just so you know: PAL doesn't have a definite number of pixels per line
[20:53] <zgreg> it's an analog signal and the horizontal resolution is limited by video bandwidth only
[20:54] <zgreg> in any case the output quality of the pi's composite out will be shit
[20:57] <Hattara-pilvi> Originally I wanted to know the real pixel resolutions of the HDMI output modes. Like how many pixels do I have horizontally and how many vertically on 288p
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[20:58] <zgreg> hm, I don't get it. HDMI resolutions are well defined.
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[20:59] <benzeman> Hi! :) When I run dpkg --get-selections, some packages are marked as deinstall. How do I clear them off the list (as they have been uninstalled using apt-get uninstall *)? Thanks!
[21:00] <Hattara-pilvi> zgreg: I just simply cant find a list anywhere :'(
[21:03] <mkopack> Hattara-pilvi: what's there to understand?
[21:03] <mkopack> If it's 288p that means there's 288 vertical lines
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[21:03] <Hattara-pilvi> benzeman: Ubuntu people might know better (But I've heard tht they are not so nice...) try debian channel ^_^
[21:04] <Hattara-pilvi> mkopack: Sure 288 vertical....but how many horizontal that is the question
[21:04] <mkopack> I thought the config.txt file on the pi had the list of different HDMI modes...
[21:04] <mkopack> WTF you using that is 288p ???
[21:05] <Hattara-pilvi> mkopack: It does, but it doesent tell the resolutions....
[21:06] <Hattara-pilvi> mkopack: No I'm not using nor will I. But I'm writing an app, gui editor for the config.txt file, and that information would be nice to have
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[21:08] <zgreg> PAL with double-scan progressive timings is 288p
[21:08] <piney0> isn't it a ratio of 16x9 or 16x10? so 288 / (9 or 10) * 16 would give the other figure?
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[21:09] <Cheery> http://elinux.org/RPi_Advanced_Setup
[21:09] <Cheery> why does it request me to calculate cylinders?
[21:09] <zgreg> piney0: generally, no
[21:10] <mkopack> Hattara-pilvi: Here you go: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEA-861#CEA-861-E
[21:10] <mkopack> There's a table in there
[21:10] <mkopack> Those names correspond to the HDMI modes in config.txt
[21:10] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: It is to optimize the erase blocks, this makes the sdcard fat parition perfrom faster
[21:10] <mkopack> And has the Horizontal x Vertical resolutions
[21:11] <mkopack> About 3/4 the way down the page
[21:11] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: oh okay
[21:11] <Hattara-pilvi> mkopack: THANK YOU. Finally what I was after ^_^ heres a *cookie* for you :) hopy you like it
[21:11] <mkopack> Cross reference with the config.txt spec here http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/config-txt?value=config.txt&type=1&include=1&search=3
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[21:12] <Hattara-pilvi> mkopack: I've alredy got that information entered in and spliited to several list XD what was missing was the fact that what is the real resolution....
[21:13] <mkopack> right, I just mean you'll need to look up the mode name in config.txt and then find the corresponding one in that table I gave you
[21:15] <zgreg> Hattara-pilvi: those aren't square pixels though (unlike you said earlier)
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[21:31] <Cheery> when I do "mkfs.msdos -F 32 template.img -n LABEL"
[21:31] <Cheery> it will destroy my template.img according to fdisk
[21:31] <danieldaniel> is it worth it to get my Pi out of the garbage
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[21:33] <Cheery> danieldaniel: huah?
[21:33] <Cheery> thrown one into garbage can already?
[21:34] <IT_Sean> danieldaniel: i thought it was carted off to the dump already
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[21:35] <Cheery> gah this is so much pain in the you know where, that I'll forget it for now and look on something else. :/
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[21:39] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Doing that will use the whole .img file and creates a full disk filesystem, instead of creating the filesystem within a partition
[21:40] <Cheery> so what's the point of fdisk then?
[21:40] <IT_Sean> to f your disk?
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[21:40] <Cheery> lol
[21:41] <Cheery> IT_Sean: almost looks like that though
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[21:41] <IT_Sean> i mean, coem on. it's CALLED "fdisk" what do you THINK it's for!?
[21:41] <Cheery> fdisk is sort of cool.. but really pain.
[21:41] <IT_Sean> It is there to f your disk!
[21:42] <Cheery> but yeah. why should I f my disk if mkfs.msdos does it for me?
[21:42] <Matt> yeah, fdisk is an intresting name, given it's sole purpose is to partition disks
[21:43] <Matt> right. that makes sense - it's from "fixed disk"
[21:43] <IT_Sean> i am guessing the f stands for 'format'
[21:43] <IT_Sean> oooh
[21:43] <IT_Sean> nevermind
[21:43] <Cheery> sort of lost there and I guess I should just know what each thing is doing and do what I want instead of follow instructions
[21:43] <IT_Sean> I like my theory better. It f's your disk.
[21:44] <Matt> IT_Sean: that's quite accurate if you make a mistake with it :)
[21:44] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: mkfs only creates the filesystem, but fdisk/cfdisk/parted/gdisk/gfdisk modify the partition map in there. You can cganhe the size of the boot partition, create a separate root partitions for differend distributions and mayby even use one partition fot /home
[21:44] <IT_Sean> matt: exactly.
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[21:45] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Where did you pull that template.img out from?
[21:45] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: well.. yeah. though I thought that partition for /home -thing was already very linux specific things.
[21:45] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: dd if=/dev/zero.. so in fact I pulled it from my a
[21:46] <Cheery> :)
[21:46] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: It more of a UNIX spesific thing... exist commonly in Solaris and all of the BSD variants
[21:46] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: What page?
[21:47] <Cheery> umm... I'll try find it if it's important
[21:47] <Cheery> http://wiki.osdev.org/Loopback_Device
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[21:47] <Cheery> actually I used command: dd if=/dev/zero of=template.img bs=1048576 count=64
[21:48] <Cheery> didn't follow that from the rest of part.
[21:48] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheere: oh the template.img was your own.... n
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[21:49] <Cheery> could follow though.. it shouldn't be so complex anyway
[21:49] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheere: What is that you are actually trying to do? A custom sized image of RPi system?
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[21:50] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: yes. I just want a blanko image, which I can put into rpi with a custom kernel.img
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[21:50] <Cheery> ..once I'll get the d rpi card for real. :)
[21:50] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Well you must 1st mount that .img file to a /dev/loopX device so you can partiition and prepare it
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[21:51] <Cheery> why is it so important?
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[21:51] <Cheery> can't these things work on non-loopback things like files?
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[21:52] <Cheery> from mkfs manual: filesys is either the device name (e.g. /dev/hda1,
[21:52] <Cheery> /dev/sdb2), or a regular file that shall contain the file system.
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[21:53] <Matt> it depends on your mkfs
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[21:53] <Matt> mke2fs can, but you need to pass it -f
[21:53] <Matt> otherwise it'll tell you that you're not working on a device
[21:54] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Becouse mkfs can only handle one "block" if yougive filename.img as a "block" for it, it will use the whole size of that file and start writing information on the 1st bit of the file. Harddrivers/sdcard/usbstick... on the other hand contain extra information called MBR before the actul filesystem data. If you moun tthat file to a loop back device you can partition it and the partiton becomes a "block" ad so the MBR
[21:56] <Cheery> hm.
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[21:57] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: MBR contains the information of the starting point of a filesystem. RPi reads the MBR and checks the starting point of the 1st partition. Then it goes forward on the sdcard data to the point, where the 1st partition, out boot partition is. Then it assumes this partition is formated as FAT filesystem volume and tryes to find the boot files from there.
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[21:57] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: I know.
[21:57] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: So if you don't create partitions, but instead make the whole .img file one filesystem, the RPi cant use it.
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[21:58] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: but I don't understand why I need to put it into loopback just to format things properly
[21:58] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Also you won't be able to install linux in FAT
[21:58] <Matt> Cheery: you need a partition table
[21:58] <Matt> Cheery: mke2fs doesn't know anything about partition tables :)
[21:59] <Cheery> but it couldn't work on mountpoint then? it needs a loopback?
[21:59] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Well becouse loopback device maps the partition starting points into /dev/sdXY devices. Just like your HDD connected to sata port 1 is /dev/sda in linux, and /dev/sda1 is the 1st parition with kernel and boot files in it and /dev/sda2 has the actual linux root partiton with all the files in it
[22:00] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: you cannot format a mounted device
[22:00] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: that is a safety mechanism right
[22:00] <Cheery> ?
[22:00] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Yeah
[22:01] <mjr> wait, can loopback files contain partitions? news to me
[22:01] <Hattara-pilvi> +mjr: yep
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[22:01] <Matt> Cheery: you can only mount filesystems - that where loopback comes in
[22:01] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: so if I losetup, I can select partition as well?
[22:01] <Matt> mjr: they can
[22:01] <mjr> (well, it's not news that you can give an offset manually if you like, but is there some more transparent method?)
[22:01] <Hattara-pilvi> +mjr: instead of mount -oloop you have to use losetup
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[22:02] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: Yeah
[22:02] <Cheery> and the route is to dd zero file, fdisk it, then loopback the created file and mkfs a loopN ?
[22:02] <Cheery> that's it?
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[22:02] <Cheery> though I still have to get the fdisk params correct
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[22:03] <Cheery> I see the IBM boot sector isn't anything hard..
[22:03] <Cheery> could I just encode the correct rows with python or something?
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[22:03] <Cheery> so that I could entirely omit fdisk
[22:04] <Cheery> hm..
[22:04] <Cheery> it's just a file
[22:04] <Cheery> I can
[22:04] <Cheery> and I guess I'll do.
[22:04] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@5aca56aa.bb.sky.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:04] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: You don't hav to do that cylinder coubnting and stuff, you can just create 2 partitions one 100mb for boot and second anysize
[22:05] <Cheery> isn't 100mb quite alot?
[22:05] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: then just mmkdisfs -F32 /dev/loop0p1
[22:05] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: depends on your distro
[22:06] <Cheery> I... see?
[22:06] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: ArchLinux will over write kernel on upgrade, but others just create a new file with new name and leave the old one to take space
[22:06] <Cheery> couldn't I also just count how much that stuff requires and give it that much space + 10% extra?
[22:07] <Cheery> hmm
[22:07] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheere 30Mb is absolute minimum in any case
[22:07] <Cheery> though if I'd straight out do 128M partition there.. it could be modified easier
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[22:07] <Cheery> maybe it's better to make it too large rather than too small
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[22:08] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: the ArchLinux image boot partiton has 38mb of stuff in it
[22:08] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: but I can replace fdisk with some python bytebanging right?
[22:08] <Cheery> well..
[22:08] <Cheery> dd&&fdisk
[22:08] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: just use fdisk or cfdisk if fdisk is too hard
[22:09] <Cheery> well yes.. but I'd like to automate this whole process
[22:09] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: It'l be musch more easyesr than studing the whole MBR structure and writing thousand lines of python to put ecverything in thjeir right place
[22:09] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: well I have already studied it
[22:09] <Cheery> :)
[22:10] <Cheery> and it might not be impossible for me to bang them all in place.
[22:10] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: just use fdisk
[22:10] <Cheery> also I can always check with fdisk -lu
[22:10] <plugwash> Hexxeh, you arround?
[22:11] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: I think you can pass commands to fdisk from command line....
[22:11] * Hattara-pilvi is angry for not being allowed to listen to music....
[22:11] * IT_Sean applies mains voltage to a random telephone extension from the central PBX
[22:12] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: we both should read man fdisk :)
[22:13] * zleap (~zleap@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:13] <Cheery> sfdisk is the thing I want. ^^
[22:14] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: I'll work it out tomorrow.
[22:14] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: https://fedorahosted.org/pyparted/
[22:14] <Hattara-pilvi> use libparted from python
[22:14] <Hattara-pilvi> this will ensure are proper MBR
[22:14] <Matt> sfdisk is handy
[22:14] <Hattara-pilvi> Cheery: But you still have to set it to a loop dev
[22:14] <Matt> I use that a fair bit
[22:15] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: true enough
[22:16] <Cheery> now I'm looking at this: http://www.frambozenbier.org/index.php/tutorials/authors/mark-tranter/19331-tutorial-python-space-invader
[22:18] <Cheery> Hattara-pilvi: I think there shouldn't be much issues as that sfdisk seems to be what I need.. and in extreme I can do this on a script. :)
[22:28] * mkopack (~mkopack@184-210-66-198.pools.spcsdns.net) Quit (Quit: mkopack)
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[22:48] <Cheery> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forum/general-discussion/raspi-space-invader-pdf-and-source-code/page-2/#p72706
[22:49] * johnthebear (~Johnthebe@13-166-177.client.wireless.msu.edu) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:50] * Compy (~Compy@ Quit ()
[22:50] * Conic (dillon@c-75-69-38-59.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:52] <Cheery> http://yro.slashdot.org/story/12/05/02/1354238/german-court-grants-motorola-xbox-and-windows-7-sales-ban
[22:52] <Cheery> yaaa hahaa
[22:52] <Cheery> mutual patent destruction
[22:53] * Forca (~hendricks@209-254-225-82.ip.mcleodusa.net) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[22:54] <Hexxeh> plugwash: yeah
[22:58] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: going home)
[22:58] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8-dev)
[22:59] <a_c_r_> Hexxeh: playing with your raspbian build... pretty cool. thanks.
[22:59] <Hattara-pilvi> I hope I wont become a shop assistant of any electronics shop or end up in the electronics section of some super market. Guestomer: "Excuse me, I'd be intered on the new Samsung Bravia x56B Internet enabled TV, Could you show it to me?" Me "I'm verry sorry mister, but we are not allowed to sell that model anymore, s it breaks some patents." Guestomer: "Oh.... well, my son also wanted the new Xbox 980 as Xmas present, could
[23:00] <a_c_r_> Hmmm... looks like a new black market could develop.
[23:00] <Hattara-pilvi> I wonder how many producs will get a sale ban before something is done to solve these ridicilous patent lawsuits
[23:04] <plugwash> Hexxeh, I tried to add your image download to the elinux wiki but when I follow the link I created it doesn't work, there seems to be some kind of reffer check
[23:04] <Hexxeh> plugwash: yeah, it's on the same server as my chromeos images, so it'll trip the hotlink protection
[23:04] <plugwash> if it's to limit bandwidth I understand and I suggest we try and get the image moved onto the raspbian server
[23:04] <Hexxeh> nah, it's not
[23:04] <Hexxeh> what's the elinux wiki domain? i'll whitelist it
[23:05] <Hexxeh> it's because scummy sites tried to hotlink my chrome images
[23:05] <plugwash> elinux.org
[23:05] <Hexxeh> try now
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[23:06] <plugwash> thanks
[23:07] <Hexxeh> no worries
[23:07] <Hexxeh> bandwidth isn't an issue at all
[23:07] <Hexxeh> twin gigabit, no limits
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> you lucky bastard.
[23:08] <plugwash> eek that must cost a bomb
[23:08] <Hexxeh> i'm happy to mirror downloads for other projects, btw.
[23:09] <normod> yeah!
[23:09] <normod> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFd5Cci_pE4
[23:09] <normod> thats Hexxeh
[23:11] <a_c_r_> Hexxeh: where are the chromeos images? could be fun to play with...
[23:12] <Hexxeh> a_c_r_: not for raspberry pi (yet)
[23:12] <a_c_r_> Hexxeh: doh.
[23:12] <a_c_r_> Hexxeh: that would be impressive at this stage!
[23:12] <Hexxeh> i do have raspi images
[23:12] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[23:12] <Hexxeh> but they're slow, since there's no x11 accel
[23:13] * ChrisLenz (~ChrisLenz@c-24-14-224-41.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:13] <plugwash> btw afaict we have pretty much untied the knots in raspbian
[23:13] * stephenl (~stephenl@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:13] <plugwash> should now be mostly a matter of waiting for the autobuilders to do their stuff
[23:13] <Hexxeh> awesome
[23:14] * zleap (~zleap@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[23:14] <Hydrazine> yay
[23:15] * zleap (~zleap@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:15] <a_c_r_> Hexxeh: any idea if X acceleration is possible w/o a binary blob?
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[23:17] <Cheery> should get to sleep. .)
[23:17] <Cheery> I guess I'll go
[23:17] <Cheery> see you tomorrow
[23:17] * Linkas (~lukas@ Quit (Quit: leaving)
[23:18] <Cheery> I think I'll work on an another project tomorrow.. but might as well get that sfdisk thing right and do the loopback device thing.
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[23:27] <Cheery> so now I have /dev/loop0 losetuped
[23:27] <Cheery> how do I pick a partition?
[23:27] * P4R4N01D (~johndoe@189-12-26-147.user.veloxzone.com.br) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[23:28] <mozzwald> Cheery: http://russelldavis.org/2010/11/03/mounting-a-raw-disk-image/
[23:30] <Cheery> you mean there's no shortcut?
[23:31] <ReggieUK> yeah, the shortcut is learning to do it for yourself
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[23:34] <Cheery> ReggieUK: oh. no problem
[23:35] <Cheery> it's rather easy to gather that info, likely.
[23:35] <Cheery> unless sfdisk gives it directly
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[23:40] <Cheery> oh
[23:41] <Cheery> sfdisk -d gives a dump.
[23:42] <Cheery> maybe I'll just write that util tomorrow.
[23:43] <Cheery> it's lot simpler than this crazy dump I get.
[23:43] <Matt> sfdisk -d gives a nice human readable dump tho
[23:43] <Matt> that's also readable by sfdisk
[23:43] * lemtzas (lemtzas@D-173-250-139-225.dhcp4.washington.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:43] <Cheery> yea
[23:43] <Cheery> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_boot_record
[23:43] <Matt> it's handy when cloning disks
[23:43] <Cheery> here's all I need to know
[23:44] <Cheery> :)
[23:44] <Matt> I've been known to do sfdisk -d /dev/sda | sfdisk /dev/sdb
[23:44] <Cheery> ^^
[23:44] <Cheery> that's nice
[23:44] * Matt nods
[23:44] <Matt> especially on boxes using software raid
[23:44] <Matt> where you've got more than one md raid partition on the disk
[23:45] <Cheery> as it's just one SD card I'm playing with.. It's okay for me to encode this data directly in.
[23:45] <Cheery> tomorrow going to do just direct decoder/encoder for python
[23:45] <Matt> pull out failed disk, drop in new disk, rescan the bus, use the above sfdisk command to partition it, then mdadm --add
[23:46] <Cheery> read(0x200)+decode will give me dump.
[23:46] <Cheery> encode+write will give me MBR. :)
[23:47] * kwerk_ (~livion@2600:1008:b006:57c2:0:1c:68a:c101) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:47] <Cheery> oh and since I'm working on files.. I can just count size of each partition and append amount of zeros after.
[23:48] <Cheery> then losetup+mkfs+mount+cp+umount+losetup-d
[23:48] <Cheery> although probably making that losetup bit nicer. :/
[23:49] * lemtzas (lemtzas@D-173-250-139-225.dhcp4.washington.edu) has left #raspberrypi
[23:50] <Cheery> this way I can make a small convenience software, which will make a file image with four partitions of choice + commands used to create them.
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[23:51] * jgarrett (~jgarrett@ Quit (Quit: jgarrett)
[23:52] <OneFix_Work> BTW, anyone trying to port NetBSD to the rPi?
[23:52] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[23:53] <Matt> now there's an intresting thought
[23:54] * Syliss (~Syliss@ Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[23:56] <Cheery> seems a lot I could also just mkfs a zero file and catenate those into one single disk image. :/
[23:56] <Cheery> would it work?
[23:56] <a_c_r_> Attempt one at loading root from usb = fail
[23:56] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:57] <Cheery> IT_Sean: would it work if I'd mkfs files filled with zeroes, and then catenate them into a filesystem?
[23:57] <Cheery> or dd
[23:57] <IT_Sean> what?
[23:58] * Soul_Est (~nolanhayn@ has joined #raspberrypi
[23:58] <hotwings> i bought a container of tang from costco the other day i forgot how completely AWESOME this stuff is
[23:58] <IT_Sean> Isn't Tang an astronaut in the chinese space program?
[23:58] <Cheery> well.. make a file full of zeroes.. mkfs that file... dd it into filesystem image.
[23:58] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:58] <IT_Sean> why would you dd a file full of zeros?
[23:59] <Cheery> IT_Sean: heh. I'd mkfs that file first. so that it'd contain filesystem tree
[23:59] <mkopack> hotwings: MAn, I could use some 'tang right about now ;) LOL
[23:59] <mkopack> I wISH they sold THAT in the grocery store around here!
[23:59] * IT_Sean has no idea what Cheery is trying to acomplish
[23:59] <Cheery> IT_Sean: a working SD card image. :)
[23:59] <hotwings> mkopack - i had Hooters chicken strips the other day.. half hot, half lemon pepper :D

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