#raspberrypi IRC Log

Index

IRC Log for 2013-03-30

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] * xCP23x (~xCP23x@2.25.244.254) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[0:00] * GentileBen (GentileBen@cpc20-lutn10-2-0-cust20.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit ()
[0:01] * dansan (~daniel@99-70-244-137.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:02] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD28CE6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: NIN101)
[0:02] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[0:02] <OpenSys> gordonDrogon, found the problem
[0:02] * Armand (~martin@cpc17-haye16-2-0-cust427.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:03] <dansan> Hurray! I got my new toys today! The MCP2210 breakout board and a bunch of used KIS3R33S! Still waiting for my new soldering iron though :(
[0:03] <OpenSys> Temp: 21.6, RH: 66.3%
[0:04] <OpenSys> gordonDrogon, its all new, but makes sense
[0:05] <OpenSys> interferences in SPI channel VS I2C
[0:05] <OpenSys> remove all com wire
[0:05] <OpenSys> remove all com wires
[0:05] <OpenSys> and works
[0:07] * pkrnj (~pkrnj@bas2-montreal47-1279443509.dsl.bell.ca) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[0:08] * phantoxeD (~destroy@a95-92-88-3.cpe.netcabo.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:09] * Kane (~Kane@251.40.197.77.rev.sfr.net) Quit (Quit: Night all o/)
[0:10] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:10] * Weaselweb (~quassel@77-64-181-50.dynamic.primacom.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:10] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) Quit (Client Quit)
[0:10] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:11] <tonyhughes> Just installed Raspberry Asterisk - wow great
[0:11] <tonyhughes> Cant wait for my SPA3102 to arrive so I can trunk my landline
[0:12] <tonyhughes> Ironically, my landline is delivered via SIP, but over my ISPs ATM link, not IP on the DSL connection. I have hacked the router and found all the SIP settings, but impossible to get them working from a device external to the router :(
[0:13] <buzzsaw> my pi is here
[0:13] * gyeben (~gyonkiben@dsl51B61186.pool.t-online.hu) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:13] <Triffid_Hunter> tonyhughes: are they accessible if you put it in bridge mode and then run rp-pppoe on the pi or something like that?
[0:13] <buzzsaw> and it is sexy
[0:15] <tonyhughes> No, as soon as you are on PPPoA, their network physically won't route the private FQDN (or IP) of the voice server.
[0:15] <echelon> ok, how long should this last for the rpi? http://www.amazon.com/dp/B008RZYN8A
[0:16] <tonyhughes> echelon, 1 hour and 57 minutes
[0:16] <echelon> :/
[0:16] <tonyhughes> Educated wild guess
[0:16] <echelon> what can i get that will last me 2 weeks?
[0:17] <tonyhughes> Erring on the side of a buffer
[0:17] <ShiftPlusOne> Why is the educated wild guess to specific?
[0:17] <ShiftPlusOne> *so
[0:17] <buzzsaw> how many amps does the pi take?
[0:17] <tonyhughes> Why is 1h57m any more specific than 2h ? ;-P
[0:17] <Armand> tonyhughes!
[0:17] <tonyhughes> Armand!
[0:18] <ShiftPlusOne> If you're not using USB, you may get up to 4 hours, but I think that's unlikely
[0:18] <Armand> I'm peeved.. I need to source 60 USB ports. :/
[0:18] * stepho (~stephram@ppp59-167-121-22.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:18] <tonyhughes> echelon, this will meet/exceed your needs http://www.tradetested.co.nz/50kva-diesel-silent-industrial-generator-with-battery.html
[0:19] * Caribou| (~Caribou@109.128.144.129) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:19] <tonyhughes> Wait... no... its 12v
[0:19] <tonyhughes> You need 5v
[0:19] <Triffid_Hunter> echelon: rpi uses about 3.5w, let's call it 5w for engineering overhead. 5 watts * 2 weeks is about 6Mj, or 1680Wh. At 12v, that's 140Ah
[0:20] <ShiftPlusOne> echelon, You shouldn't trust these calculations, since it's not really an accurate way to figure these things out, but if you run the pi at 700ma (worst case scenario), then 1860/700=2.65 hours.
[0:20] <Triffid_Hunter> echelon: so a marine deep cycle battery will run it for 2 weeks, get an LM2596 buck converter from ebay :)
[0:20] <ShiftPlusOne> in reality the pi uses maybe about 400-450
[0:20] <ShiftPlusOne> (mA)
[0:21] <echelon> :/
[0:21] <ShiftPlusOne> Triffid_Hunter, why such a roundabout calculation?
[0:21] <Triffid_Hunter> ShiftPlusOne: seems pretty direct to me.. power * time / volts = amp hours
[0:22] <echelon> is there a way to put the rpi into standby mode?
[0:22] <ShiftPlusOne> well, yeah.
[0:22] <Triffid_Hunter> echelon: no
[0:22] <echelon> and have it wake up for a minute then go back to sleep?
[0:22] <echelon> hrm
[0:22] * lupinedk is now known as Lupinedk
[0:22] <Triffid_Hunter> echelon: perhaps you're trying to do something with the rpi that a microcontroller would be better at?
[0:23] <ShiftPlusOne> Triffid_Hunter, I missed the part where he mentioned 2 weeks, so now your answer makes more sense, heh.
[0:23] <echelon> yeah :/
[0:23] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:23] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) Quit ()
[0:23] <Triffid_Hunter> msp430 for example uses the merest trickle of power even when running, and in deep sleep uses less power than a battery's self-discharge rate
[0:23] <echelon> i have an msp430 :)
[0:23] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:23] <echelon> but i need it to use a camera and stuff
[0:23] <Triffid_Hunter> echelon: so if all you're doing is grabbing some sensor data and firing it up a GSM link or something like that, use the msp430
[0:23] <echelon> so linux would have been preferable :/
[0:24] <Triffid_Hunter> camera makes it a bit trickier, stick a solar panel on it
[0:24] <echelon> heh
[0:24] * zleap (~zleap@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[0:24] <echelon> there should be a way to turn off power to the usb right?
[0:25] <Triffid_Hunter> don't think so
[0:25] <Triffid_Hunter> could add it though with a p-fet
[0:26] <Armand> Anyone know a cheap source of surface mount usb ports ?
[0:26] <Armand> I need 60-70.
[0:26] <chithead> some usb hubs have per-port power switching capability
[0:27] * fr0g911 (~jmstick@c-98-199-136-87.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[0:27] <chithead> "lsusb -v" will tell
[0:27] <Triffid_Hunter> lsusb -v causes my rpi to kernel panic
[0:27] <chithead> then connect the usb hub to another computer and run lsusb -v from there
[0:28] <Triffid_Hunter> gets to the broadcom hub in the main chip and kaboom
[0:28] * KiltedPi^ (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:28] <Triffid_Hunter> udevadm info --attribute-walk does the same thing if I point it at a usb device
[0:28] <ShiftPlusOne> Armand, how cheap is cheap? I see you can get 60 on ebay for $25
[0:30] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:30] <Armand> I found 10 for ?10. :/
[0:30] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:31] <ShiftPlusOne> Armand, http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/320790766564
[0:31] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[0:31] <chithead> $0.15/pc http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Connector-USB-Female-USB-A-female-SMD/815118672.html
[0:33] <ShiftPlusOne> 100 order minimum? Still cheaper than the ebay option though
[0:33] <ShiftPlusOne> not by much
[0:33] <ShiftPlusOne> Hmm, if you bump the quantity to 100, the shipping price goes to US $1,100.60
[0:33] <ShiftPlusOne> XD
[0:34] <Armand> Shipping Cost:
[0:34] <ShiftPlusOne> which might be a deal breaker if it's not a mistake
[0:34] <Armand> US $685.14toUnited Kingdom Via Hongkong Post Air Parcel
[0:34] <Armand> O_O
[0:34] <Armand> Well, screw that..
[0:35] <ShiftPlusOne> If you really need cheap, then go through alibaba and try not to get ripped off.
[0:35] <ShiftPlusOne> which may be tricky
[0:35] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) Quit (Quit: Probably closed laptop)
[0:36] * timb_us (~timb_us@pool-72-82-116-111.nrflva.east.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[0:36] * Vlad (~vlad@9.2.3.9.0.7.4.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:37] * Vlad (~vlad@9.2.3.9.0.7.4.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:39] <Armand> This is already great fun.. I need to generate 700W+ on solar, wire up 10 5v regulators and connect 60 buffered USB ports.
[0:39] <Armand> Loads of batteries. ^_^
[0:39] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:43] * KiltedPi^ (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[0:43] * zastaph (zastaph@unaffiliated/zastaph) Quit ()
[0:45] <Armand> The ebay option will cost me ?71..
[0:45] * timb_us (~timb_us@pool-72-82-116-111.nrflva.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:45] <Armand> Mouser will be ?58
[0:45] <ShiftPlusOne> why 71?
[0:46] <Armand> $108 for 60.
[0:46] <Armand> No.... derp
[0:46] <ShiftPlusOne> ... 5pc
[0:46] <Armand> Sorry.
[0:46] <Armand> -_-
[0:46] <ShiftPlusOne> heh
[0:46] <Armand> I did a double shift last night.. brain-dead. :P
[0:47] <Armand> ?14?
[0:47] <Armand> O_O
[0:47] <ShiftPlusOne> sounds closer
[0:47] <Armand> Damn.. lol
[0:48] <ShiftPlusOne> You were off by a little bit the first time.
[0:48] <Armand> Yeah.. needs more coffee.
[0:48] <Triffid_Hunter> frequently if you're getting a bulk lot you can contact the ebay seller and get an even better price
[0:48] <buzzsaw> writing pi image :-)
[0:48] <ShiftPlusOne> true
[0:49] * rideh (~rideh@unaffiliated/rideh) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:49] <Armand> I might give that a go, Triffid_Hunter.. ;)
[0:49] <ShiftPlusOne> but it's not like the chinese sellers have that much of a profit margin.
[0:49] <Triffid_Hunter> ShiftPlusOne: worst case, they say no
[0:49] <Triffid_Hunter> their profit margin is up to them to decide
[0:50] <ShiftPlusOne> yup
[0:50] * gyeben (~gyonkiben@dsl51B61186.pool.t-online.hu) has left #raspberrypi
[0:52] <Armand> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Battery-Deep-Cycle-12V-250Ah-Super-High-Capacity-Solar-Panel-Wind-Power-Storage-/120953165580?pt=AU_Solar&hash=item1c295ed70c
[0:53] <Armand> Holy Fork!
[0:54] * Jevermeister (~Jevermeis@unaffiliated/jever) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:59] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) Quit (Quit: Sto andando via)
[1:03] <Triffid_Hunter> Armand: yikes, expensive!
[1:05] <plugwash> ShiftPlusOne, sure but with many of the cheap ebay deals I bet a lot of what you are paying for is S&H
[1:06] <plugwash> so they can probablly offer a lower price for larger quantities
[1:06] * Geniack (~Geniack@unaffiliated/geniack) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:06] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, as Triffid says, it doesn't hurt to ask.
[1:07] * MichaelC is now known as MichaelC|Sleep
[1:08] * excalibas (5154f047@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.84.240.71) Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[1:08] * Kaboon (kaboon@524A5520.cm-4-3b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit ()
[1:09] * Geniack_ (~Geniack@unaffiliated/geniack) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[1:09] * cpg|away is now known as cpg
[1:10] <Armand> Triffid_Hunter, I'd want 4. :P
[1:12] * linuxstb (~linuxstb@unaffiliated/linuxstb) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:15] * cpg is now known as cpg|away
[1:18] <SpeedEvil> Armand: what are you trying to do? how
[1:19] <SpeedEvil> long a time must this thing work - 1,5, or 15 years!
[1:20] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:20] <Armand> 60 rPi, all on solar. Headless webservers.
[1:20] <Armand> As long as possible.
[1:20] <SpeedEvil> in that case, 700 w is way light
[1:20] <Armand> I was guessing..
[1:21] <SpeedEvil> where are you?
[1:21] <Armand> 720+
[1:21] <Armand> Not in sunny climes.. :/
[1:21] <Armand> London(ish)
[1:21] <SpeedEvil> I'd guess you need more like 6kw, and 30kwh of battery
[1:22] <Armand> Where are you getting 6kw ?
[1:22] * calios (~calios@unaffiliated/calios) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[1:23] <SpeedEvil> you need to size it for the performance in December
[1:23] <SpeedEvil> http://re.jrc.ec.europa.eu/pvgis/apps4/pvest.php
[1:23] <Armand> Which is when it would be the lowest output..
[1:23] <Armand> *derp*
[1:24] <SpeedEvil> London - tick show graphs, calculate
[1:24] <SpeedEvil> the average daily output of 1kw of panels is about 1kw
[1:24] * calios (~calios@unaffiliated/calios) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:24] <SpeedEvil> your charge efficiency into and out of the batteries is perhaps 70% tops
[1:25] <SpeedEvil> you need about 120w*24 =3kWh
[1:25] <Armand> Of course.. I'm being lazy and only thinking optimal conditions. *duh*
[1:25] <SpeedEvil> so, at least 3 kw
[1:25] <SpeedEvil> but, it's not that good.
[1:26] <SpeedEvil> typically, half or more the power might be in a week
[1:26] <SpeedEvil> even with 6kw, if there is a dull week, you're going offline
[1:27] <SpeedEvil> that's before you consider snow on the panels
[1:28] <Armand> Well, I have a plan for that! ^_^
[1:29] <Armand> I'll be using 12v transformers and an automatic switch for backup power.
[1:30] <SpeedEvil> you are just doing this for PR then?
[1:30] <SpeedEvil> the simplest way is to get a small solar panel installation, with feed in tariff, and then offset the price.
[1:30] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit (Quit: I just broke my connection, but no worries, we can rebuild it. We have the technology.)
[1:31] <SpeedEvil> while grid connected
[1:31] * featheredfrog (~mhofer@cpe-67-250-125-135.hvc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:31] <Armand> Nope. I'm hoping the solar will be a constant. I just don't like the idea of losing the whole farm if the batteries go. :/
[1:31] <Armand> Besides, I didn't want to make it simple. :P
[1:33] <SpeedEvil> http://pvoutput.org/aggregate.jsp?p=1&id=4847&sid=3833&t=w&gs=0&v=0&o=date&d=desc
[1:34] <SpeedEvil> look at the outputs for the last four weeks of the year
[1:34] <SpeedEvil> under 0.5kwh/kw
[1:34] <SpeedEvil> meaning you'd need a 12kw panel
[1:35] * int3nz0r (~int3nz0r@86.86.66.141) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[1:35] <SpeedEvil> or a small generator, running intermittently too
[1:35] * linuxstb (~linuxstb@unaffiliated/linuxstb) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:35] <SpeedEvil> off grid gets murderously expensive
[1:36] * DM9377 (~darin@2002:ae64:b867:0:ca3a:35ff:fecc:e5b5) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:38] <Armand> I'm not too worried about the costs, as the project will have to grow to those maximum figures.
[1:39] <Armand> Sure as hell, I'm not building the whole thing in one hit...
[1:39] <SpeedEvil> you're looking at an investment approaching 10k.
[1:39] <Triffid_Hunter> for green energy you'd probably be better off with a woodgas generator than solar panels in london
[1:39] <Triffid_Hunter> if you bury the ash it's carbon negative
[1:39] <SpeedEvil> maybe 5k, if you add am generator running occasionally
[1:40] * DM9377 (~darin@2002:ae64:b867:0:ca3a:35ff:fecc:e5b5) Quit (Client Quit)
[1:41] * ekodan (~ekodan@unaffiliated/ekodan) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:42] * bge (~sticks@86-60-194-238-Dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) Quit (Quit: Fandangooo....)
[1:42] * FR^2 (~fr@krlh-5f71e8a5.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Quit: und weg...)
[1:44] * AndrevS (~andrevs@2001:980:7901:1:225:b3ff:fec0:41e1) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:46] <Armand> Not so keen on using generators.. We're going to have 12c diesel generators anyway. :/
[1:46] * chinoto (~chinoto@c-107-2-85-18.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:47] <chinoto> Has anyone tried VirtualGL yet? I'm installing libjpegturbo right now from source.
[1:47] * ngc0202 (anonymous@unaffiliated/ngc0202) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:48] <SpeedEvil> Armand: do you have grid?
[1:48] <Armand> Mains? Yes, of course.
[1:49] <Armand> I'll be setting this up in a datacenter. :)
[1:51] <Armand> Ohh, it's not for PR, btw.. as you did ask. :P
[1:51] <plugwash> If you are doing a solar setup where you have mains available you'd be mad not to tie it in both to avoid the need for batteries and to benefit from the governments very juicy "feed in tarrifs"
[1:51] <Armand> I'll see..
[1:51] <SpeedEvil> get the panels installed under the feed in tariff, and you need a kilowatt or so or panels
[1:52] <SpeedEvil> is this a centre you own?
[1:52] <Armand> Not personally. O.o
[1:53] <Armand> If it were, I'd say "screw the cost, build it now" :P
[1:53] <featheredfrog> Triffid_Hunter: how is burying wood ash carbon negative? the carbon has burned off as CO2
[1:53] <SpeedEvil> roi on panels bolted to the roof, sized for the peak load, can be fast
[1:53] <[Saint]> Better get some downspout turbines too - I hear they're really efficient ;)
[1:54] <[Saint]> This nice man tried to sell me some out of the back of a van.
[1:54] <SpeedEvil> haha
[1:54] <Armand> I was considing other sources.. as we've got a decent roof-space there.
[1:54] <[Saint]> Oy...
[1:54] <SpeedEvil> as in under 6 years
[1:54] * featheredfrog (~mhofer@cpe-67-250-125-135.hvc.res.rr.com) has left #raspberrypi
[1:54] * [Saint] points out that he was being anything BUT serious.
[1:55] <[Saint]> In most installs, you'd be lucky if they ever paid for themselves in your lifetime.
[1:55] <[Saint]> let alone actually contributed.
[1:56] * Syliss (~Home@adsl-108-198-103-98.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:56] <[Saint]> Numbers suggesting otherwise are almost certainly lies, or, from people living in the amazon basin ;)
[1:56] <SpeedEvil> I think you mean in the amazon river
[1:56] <[Saint]> heh
[1:57] <Armand> I'm thinking it might end up going to New Jersey, although there is also a hint at Texas. O_O
[1:58] <Armand> California is remotely plausible.. it depends on various concerns. :/
[1:58] <[Saint]> Just...be cautious.
[1:59] <Armand> To avoid blowing anything/anyone up would be great. :P
[1:59] <[Saint]> The people selling you this stuff really don't care if you succeed or not. As mentioned earlier, this is amazingly expensive, and error prone.
[1:59] <Armand> Yeah, of course.
[2:00] <Syliss> im in cali
[2:00] <Armand> There's more than a few brains I can bash together now..
[2:00] <Triffid_Hunter> featheredfrog: trees absorb CO2 from the atmosphere to produce the wood. some is left in the ash. thus, after burning the wood and burying the ash, there is slightly less CO2 in the atmosphere
[2:00] <[Saint]> Sweet! there 'ya go...move to Cali and splice of Syliss' grid.
[2:00] <[Saint]> "free power!" :P
[2:00] <Triffid_Hunter> bah he's gone :/
[2:00] <Syliss> lol
[2:00] <Syliss> i live in a shitty area tho
[2:01] * plugwash (~plugwash@cpc7-stkp7-2-0-cust208.10-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has left #raspberrypi
[2:01] <Armand> I don't need to live there. :P
[2:01] <Syliss> i was planning on moving to washington but have to wait
[2:01] <Armand> I might get to visit some DC facilities around New York soon..
[2:03] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[2:04] <buzzsaw> is there some sort of a power button for the pi?
[2:05] <[Saint]> no.
[2:05] <[Saint]> that's pi 101
[2:05] <buzzsaw> okay cus i plug it in and have no display :-)
[2:05] <buzzsaw> [Saint]: i just got it like an hour ago :-)
[2:06] <KiltedPi> Is there a website you can go to online- that will rate how dangerous a computer virus is?
[2:06] * DDave (~DDave@unaffiliated/ddave) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:06] <[Saint]> 'shutdown -h now" is your 'power button' buzzsaw
[2:06] <buzzsaw> got it
[2:06] <KiltedPi> sudo
[2:06] <buzzsaw> but first boot and I have no signal displayed on my tv
[2:06] <chinoto> make me a sandwich
[2:06] <KiltedPi> buzzsaw, some peoples tellies can be the reason-
[2:07] <KiltedPi> If you've exhausted everything, have a look on the forums on raspberry pi
[2:07] <[Saint]> buzzsaw: analogue or digital out?
[2:07] <buzzsaw> hdmi
[2:07] <KiltedPi> I've heard this mentioned before, like four or five times now
[2:07] <KiltedPi> When you get the solution, private message me, I'm collecting 'common' bugs
[2:07] <KiltedPi> :)
[2:08] <KiltedPi> They get a completely black screen
[2:08] <KiltedPi> I have heard mention of altering config.txt
[2:08] <[Saint]> lets not overwhelm the guy shall we.
[2:08] <KiltedPi> for raspbian, but thats only going to be neccessary after checking the obvious stuff
[2:08] <KiltedPi> :/
[2:09] <KiltedPi> Yeah, what lights up on your raspberry buzzsaw?
[2:09] <KiltedPi> there are a few wee lights, like.
[2:09] <KiltedPi> ACT (or OK), PWR, FDX etc.
[2:09] <buzzsaw> ONLY the power :-)
[2:09] <KiltedPi> Ah. you won't see anything on screen buzzsaw
[2:10] <KiltedPi> the lack of ACT/OK light, means the SD card is not accessed
[2:10] <KiltedPi> So! Format it- re-install your OS, (Probably raspbian?)
[2:11] <KiltedPi> What are you on, like, with regards to your main computer? Are you using Windows/Windows 7?
[2:11] <buzzsaw> no its kali and I did a dd from my mac
[2:11] <KiltedPi> Kali? Is that an operating system? I'm not familiar
[2:12] <buzzsaw> its a debian child
[2:12] <KiltedPi> kk
[2:12] <KiltedPi> Should be fine then
[2:12] <KiltedPi> What are you imaging with?
[2:12] <buzzsaw> dd
[2:12] <KiltedPi> I'm completely unfamiliar with mac- anyone can take over from me here? :/
[2:13] <buzzsaw> lol dd is a *nix tool :-)
[2:13] <KiltedPi> Until that ACT/OK light lights up though, you will not see anything on screen.
[2:13] <Triffid_Hunter> buzzsaw: the fat16 partition (should be first partition) is intact? has a config.txt?
[2:13] <Triffid_Hunter> buzzsaw: you did dd to the sd card itself, not one of the partitions on it yes?
[2:14] <buzzsaw> I might go grab one of the kali guys but I did this http://docs.kali.org/armel-armhf/install-kali-linux-arm-raspberry-pi
[2:14] <KiltedPi> Yeah, this is where (If you were on Windows) I would say, 'open up disk manager'
[2:14] <KiltedPi> Re-flashing is your first port of call no matter what
[2:14] <KiltedPi> I know that much! :)
[2:15] <KiltedPi> I don't know what the mac equivalent of diskman is...
[2:16] <KiltedPi> Anyway, I'm fixing my friends laptop at the moment, and its got some amount of virii!
[2:16] <KiltedPi> I wondered if theres a website where you can get your virus rated
[2:17] * KiltedPi is starting a virus collection
[2:17] <KiltedPi> this one is called "Retrogamer_4"
[2:17] <KiltedPi> Its neat.
[2:17] * pkrnj (~pkrnj@bas2-montreal47-1279443509.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:18] <[Saint]> ...and ancient.
[2:18] <KiltedPi> Its pinging the loopback with huge ICMP packets, and then popping up saying "32212 programs are slowing your computer down! Buy our software and-..." etc etc
[2:18] <KiltedPi> I've never seen it before!
[2:18] <KiltedPi> I wish I'd documented them years ago
[2:19] <KiltedPi> Saint, is there anywhere you can view ratings for virii?
[2:20] <[Saint]> Probably, but I tend to at least pretend to stay on-topic here.
[2:20] * Jevermeister (~Jevermeis@unaffiliated/jever) Quit (Quit: /)
[2:20] <KiltedPi> good point.
[2:20] <KiltedPi> I'm just chatting really!
[2:21] <KiltedPi> Well- If anyone knows macs- buzzsaw has a pi related problem
[2:21] * stapper (~quassel@94-226-13-61.access.telenet.be) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:22] <[Saint]> the problem doesn't relate to mac at all.
[2:22] <[Saint]> s/doesn't/shouldn't/
[2:22] <[Saint]> dd is just a tool, it is essentially the same on any environment.
[2:22] <KiltedPi> I don't know how to format an SD card from a mac, or what dd is @_@
[2:23] <KiltedPi> oh kk.
[2:23] <[Saint]> I gathered.
[2:23] <KiltedPi> I'm new too!
[2:23] <KiltedPi> Socrates said you can only gain knowledge about something when you first admit you know absolutely nothing at all about it.
[2:23] <KiltedPi> :/
[2:24] <buzzsaw> okay figured it out
[2:24] <KiltedPi> re-flashed buzzsaw?
[2:24] <KiltedPi> Or changed config.txt or whatever?
[2:24] * JohannesG (~JohannesG@u193-11-163-53.studentnatet.se) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
[2:24] <buzzsaw> I flashed to /dev/disk1s1 but it should have been /dev/disk1
[2:24] <KiltedPi> that would do it!
[2:24] * JohannesG (~JohannesG@u193-11-163-53.studentnatet.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:25] <buzzsaw> KiltedPi: you need to learn some about dd :-)
[2:25] <buzzsaw> its useful :-)
[2:25] * buzzsaw has not used it in a while
[2:25] <[Saint]> useful - and a NIGHTMARE in the hands of beginners.
[2:25] <[Saint]> ...lets not forget that ;)
[2:26] <buzzsaw> :-)
[2:26] <[Saint]> you're always a typo away from nuking your OS.
[2:26] <buzzsaw> thus the reason you need to know how to use dd ;-)
[2:26] <buzzsaw> that way you can restore...
[2:27] <buzzsaw> dd if=/dev/random of=/dev/sdb :-)
[2:28] <[Saint]> Uhhh...lets not do that.
[2:28] <[Saint]> Someone is bound to think c/p'ing that is a good idea.
[2:28] * KiltedPi copies
[2:28] * KiltedPi pastes
[2:28] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) Quit ()
[2:29] <buzzsaw> lol i hope that was a joke...
[2:29] <[Saint]> Anyway - everyone knows you feed n00bs forkbombs instead ;)
[2:29] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:29] <KiltedPi> :)
[2:29] <buzzsaw> KiltedPi: good one ;-)
[2:30] <buzzsaw> [Saint]: depends...
[2:30] <buzzsaw> we had a guy we were heling for like 3 hours... Ends up the dude was like, "I like to break things and blog how to fix them."
[2:30] <buzzsaw> well if you would have not put crap in your repos to install! it would not break...
[2:32] <buzzsaw> KiltedPi: have you ever run this in linux? ':(){ :|:& };:'
[2:32] <buzzsaw> it teaches you a thing or two...
[2:32] <buzzsaw> so yeah thanks for the quick help :-)
[2:32] <[Saint]> *duuuuude*
[2:32] <ShiftPlusOne> buzzsaw, people have been kicked for that, so... a head up... don't do it.
[2:33] <ShiftPlusOne> *heads
[2:33] <[Saint]> lets not do that here. Please.
[2:33] * buzzsaw stops...
[2:33] * IT_Sean "ahem"s
[2:33] * Queeniebee (~Queeniebe@ool-44c5163d.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:33] <[Saint]> As I said, someone *will* c/p that and run it, and you're then responsible for their, and indirectly our, bad days.
[2:33] <[Saint]> So, lets not :)
[2:33] <ShiftPlusOne> Think that will count as a warning then.
[2:33] * buzzsaw -v self
[2:34] <KiltedPi> heh
[2:35] <ShiftPlusOne> ah wait
[2:35] * buzzsaw needs more cdcards...
[2:35] <buzzsaw> sd
[2:36] <KiltedPi> I've a few, but my class 10 is my pride and joy here
[2:37] * [Saint] wonders what he is busy waiting for
[2:37] <buzzsaw> haha every one that I had was only a few hundred meg
[2:37] <[Saint]> ...it better be good.
[2:39] <buzzsaw> haha.... slow process :-s
[2:40] * Mr_P (~gerhard@chello080108255018.3.14.vie.surfer.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[2:40] <buzzsaw> perhaps I need to build a custom image for quicker copy :-)
[2:40] <buzzsaw> strip this baby down to the minimums...
[2:41] * cpg|away is now known as cpg
[2:41] <[Saint]> that's one, needlessly time-consuming way to do it...yes.
[2:41] <[Saint]> alternatively, there's the netinstall.
[2:42] <buzzsaw> well... if this does work the way I want it to do I may have to image a few of them all set up exactly the same way :-)
[2:42] <buzzsaw> so immaging will be the faster way
[2:43] <buzzsaw> plus it will be easier to distribute in a nice tarball for others to image for themself
[2:44] <[Saint]> won't licensing bit you in the ass then?
[2:44] <[Saint]> best not to distribute this.
[2:44] <buzzsaw> how so?
[2:44] <[Saint]> lest source claims take up the rest of your days, forever.
[2:44] * rpitin (~adam@ppp118-209-5-53.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:45] * l2esonance (~l2esonanc@c-50-136-184-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:45] * [Saint] was kicked from #raspberrypi by IT_Sean
[2:46] * robscomputer (~robscompu@nat/yahoo/x-uekhuagyhsrldsmg) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:46] * [Saint] (~saint@rockbox/user/saint) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:47] <[Saint]> Oy...well, that was amusing.
[2:47] <[Saint]> You guys *really* need a list of "thou shalt not" words.
[2:47] <[Saint]> Like, really.
[2:48] <[Saint]> 'cos...its a minefield.
[2:48] <[Saint]> One mans swear is another mans daily use, wouldn't blink an eye.
[2:48] * cyclick (~user@unaffiliated/cyclick) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:48] <buzzsaw> [Saint]: if I stick to opensource and follow licencing it will not be an issue
[2:48] <[Saint]> buzzsaw: sure, but then you'd have to strip out all the firmware.
[2:48] * cyclick (~user@unaffiliated/cyclick) Quit (Client Quit)
[2:51] * buzzsaw (~buzzsaw@unaffiliated/buzzsaw) has left #raspberrypi
[2:51] <Armand> I need to work on the SD image for my project.. :/
[2:52] * ebswift (~ebswift@101.168.37.155) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:52] <Syliss> what web host?
[2:52] * [Saint] feels he needs to point out that he wasn't joking about the clearly defined list of "thou shalt nots"
[2:53] <KiltedPi> I got an official warning too yeah.
[2:53] <Triffid_Hunter> woohoo, was right about dding to partition instead of disk :D
[2:53] <KiltedPi> For swears
[2:53] * vjacob (~vjacob@ip2.c462.amb314.cust.comxnet.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:53] <KiltedPi> Theres kids playing with raspberries tho.
[2:53] <Triffid_Hunter> yeah definitely, the one [Saint] got kicked for is a synonym for donkey here :/
[2:54] * Samma (~Samma@183.62.241.27) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:54] <KiltedPi> I get it
[2:54] <[Saint]> I wasn't using it that way - but I, personally, wouldn't blush saying that in any company.
[2:54] <KiltedPi> Same.
[2:54] <[Saint]> If some do, this needs to be clear.
[2:55] <KiltedPi> Although, My friends eight yr old was right next to me as I typed the swear.
[2:55] <KiltedPi> I'm in Scotland, were we use the 'f' word like a comma!
[2:56] <KiltedPi> :D
[2:56] <Twist-> [Saint]: They won't engage in discussion on this topic.. you pretty much just accept that there's going to be petty, random, tyrannical behavior from the ops here, and get on with your life.
[2:56] <KiltedPi> Yeah, thats what I did Twist
[2:56] <KiltedPi> :/
[2:56] <Twist-> Or you wind up wasting much time being annoyed.
[2:56] <KiltedPi> Used to IRC
[2:56] * chinoto (~chinoto@c-107-2-85-18.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:57] <[Saint]> Well, yes. I was told upon my first warning that this was "SFW" and I've tried (believe me, its hard for me with my colorful vocabulary..." to abide.
[2:57] <[Saint]> Had I been told it is really supposed to be SF Kindergarten" I'd have acted differently.
[2:57] <KiltedPi> [Saint] I know mate. Its hard, when you just literally forget- I think because the subject matter in here is so adult
[2:57] * [Saint] fudged his commas and brackets
[2:58] <KiltedPi> I think if you aren't apologetic, and swear often, you can expect a ban for sure
[2:58] <KiltedPi> But warnings just 'draw a line in the sand'
[2:58] <[Saint]> Twist-: I don't see it as any of those things, I manage my own channels, with my own rules - what I do think it is, is unclear.
[2:58] <KiltedPi> Anyway. boring topic. Lets talk about LIGHTNING DETECTOR circuits
[2:58] <KiltedPi> Mine arrived in the post
[2:59] <KiltedPi> this week
[2:59] <Triffid_Hunter> KiltedPi: lightning detector? ie am radio?
[2:59] <KiltedPi> I've yet to solder it, and connect to it through I2C
[2:59] <KiltedPi> YEP
[2:59] <Twist-> [Saint]: You're looking for a rational thought process again. There isn't one.
[2:59] <[Saint]> "SFW" doesn't mean much - say - if you're a mechanic.
[2:59] <[Saint]> ...or a council worker. etc.
[2:59] <KiltedPi> It detects the unique radio signal emmiting by lightning strikes
[2:59] <KiltedPi> cost me 30 quid for a breakout (already soldered) Integrated circuit compatible with i2C
[3:00] <KiltedPi> I'll keep you all posted.
[3:00] <KiltedPi> natch.
[3:00] * l2esonance (~l2esonanc@c-50-136-184-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: l2esonance)
[3:00] <KiltedPi> Or a scotsman Saint!
[3:00] <[Saint]> My lightning detectors are my cats ;)
[3:00] <KiltedPi> heh
[3:00] <KiltedPi> They are unusually attuned to things like weather aren't they.
[3:00] <KiltedPi> My cat recently passed. :(
[3:01] <KiltedPi> Belle the cat. basically got old.
[3:01] <[Saint]> Yeah - they go nuts during electrical storms. Or, prior to, rather.
[3:01] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[3:01] <Twist-> How does that work? You come home to a small pile of stir fry in the driveway, and conclude that lightning occurred?
[3:01] <[Saint]> Mine do at least.
[3:01] <KiltedPi> She used to run around before them. yep
[3:01] <[Saint]> Twist-: that would be /one/ way ;)
[3:01] <KiltedPi> heh! nope! A particularily 'weird' frequency of radio signal is emmited when ever lightning zstrikes
[3:01] <KiltedPi> This circuit detects the pattern
[3:02] <KiltedPi> And it outputs it in an i2C friendly way, so I can read it on the pi
[3:02] <[Saint]> what kind of distance are we talking here?
[3:02] <KiltedPi> I thought it would be a neat distraction
[3:02] <KiltedPi> 300 kilometres!
[3:02] <[Saint]> wow...
[3:02] <KiltedPi> I think, not sure- that seems alot actually
[3:02] <KiltedPi> one sec- datasheet
[3:03] <KiltedPi> loading: http://www1.futureelectronics.com/doc/AUSTRIAMICROSYSTEMS/AS3935.pdf
[3:03] <KiltedPi> 1 kilometre in fact!
[3:03] <KiltedPi> I misread it-
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[3:05] * grantsmith (~grantsmit@unaffiliated/grantsmith) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[3:06] <[Saint]> I suppose now you'll be aware of the ones you slept through, or failed to notice the large artificial sun outside your window ;)
[3:07] * [Saint] admits he thought 300K was quite a bit more impressive
[3:07] <Triffid_Hunter> can pick them up at 300k with an am radio so I'm failing to see why this chip is interesting
[3:07] <KiltedPi> hah!
[3:08] <KiltedPi> oh
[3:08] <KiltedPi> the radio signals you are getting might not be lightning tho
[3:09] <KiltedPi> You need to differentiate them
[3:09] <KiltedPi> a wee bit of software basically
[3:09] <KiltedPi> theres a specific pattern
[3:09] <KiltedPi> You basically leave it running, and it eliminates background traffic/noise
[3:09] <Triffid_Hunter> tune into a dead band, whenever we see a massive spike it's probably lightning :) can process it if you want to be more selective
[3:10] <KiltedPi> Might not be lightning tho eh?
[3:10] <KiltedPi> I suppose that is what it does as well
[3:10] <KiltedPi> it has a slightly more sophisticated tuner tho
[3:10] * [Saint] makes plans to move near KiltedPi and set up a broadcast station that broadcasts nothing but the signal emitted during a lightning strike
[3:10] <[Saint]> ...for, science!
[3:10] <KiltedPi> designed specifically for lightning
[3:10] <KiltedPi> haha
[3:10] * grantsmith (~grantsmit@unaffiliated/grantsmith) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:11] <KiltedPi> You can generate the signal yep
[3:11] <KiltedPi> It just detects the pattern, and discerns if it fits the profile
[3:11] <KiltedPi> It's EMP we're talking here tho.
[3:11] <KiltedPi> EMF*
[3:12] * IT_Sean recommends [Saint] make that a mobile broadcast station, to keep KiltedPi on his toes
[3:12] <KiltedPi> not a very exact science
[3:12] <KiltedPi> hahahaha
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[3:12] <KiltedPi> You guys are terrible!
[3:12] <KiltedPi> I need to figure out how to generate a fake signal too eventually, but one thing at a time
[3:13] <KiltedPi> so far interfacing with I2C is enough of a challenge
[3:13] <KiltedPi> right! 2am
[3:13] <KiltedPi> crikey.
[3:13] <KiltedPi> time for sleep! nite guys
[3:13] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-89-241-139-13.as13285.net) Quit ()
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[3:39] <buzzsaw> okay yep that fixed the problem.
[3:40] <buzzsaw> pi boots :-) display works (have not tried x yet no usb hub)
[3:40] <buzzsaw> ssh loads fine
[3:40] <buzzsaw> and car works fine in rfmonitor mode :-)
[3:40] * Syliss (~Home@adsl-108-198-103-98.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[3:40] <buzzsaw> s/car/card
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[3:56] * Hydra is now known as Hydra_
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[3:57] * cpg is now known as cpg|away
[3:57] * chinoto (~chinoto@c-107-2-85-18.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[3:59] <echelon> are model A's even on the market?
[3:59] * Hydra_ (~Hydra@AGrenoble-652-1-427-32.w90-42.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- \o/)
[3:59] <chinoto> I think I bought one recently (I don't know the difference)
[4:00] * halfhalo (halfhalo@nasadmin/webteam/halfhalo) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:00] * ka6sox-farfarawa (ka6sox@nasadmin/ka6sox) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:00] <pksato> Model A dont have ethernet and one usb port.
[4:00] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) Quit (Quit: enque)
[4:00] <[Saint]> echelon: yes
[4:00] * Queeniebee (~Queeniebe@ool-44c5163d.dyn.optonline.net) Quit (Quit: Queeniebee)
[4:00] <echelon> where?
[4:01] <Twist-> echelon: there are links to vendors from the raspberrypi.org home page
[4:02] <echelon> element14's buy now button for rpi model A is disabled
[4:02] <[Saint]> they're not the only distributor...
[4:02] <chinoto> anyone know if there's a wrapper/emulator to translate glx to egl?
[4:02] * shoerain (~mortimer@li557-200.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:03] <[Saint]> echelon: here - I did 30 seconds work for you ;)
[4:03] <[Saint]> http://raspberrypi.rsdelivers.com/default.aspx?cl=1
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[4:03] * alexhairyman (~alexhairy@c-174-52-149-118.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[4:04] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:05] * Injunire (~Mitch@64.231.203.165) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:05] <echelon> yeah, and alliedelec doesn't even list model A's
[4:06] <echelon> while model B's are back ordered
[4:06] <Twist-> Huh.. it may be that allied is making all the US boards and doesn't make As
[4:06] <buzzsaw> mcm is shipping b's rightnow
[4:06] <Twist-> http://techcrunch.com/2013/03/26/pi-model-a-asia/
[4:07] <techkid6> some days :/
[4:07] <[Saint]> If you want one, I gave you a perfectly viable link above.
[4:07] * stepho (~stephram@ppp59-167-121-22.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[4:07] <Twist-> [Saint]: you're assuming he's in europe.
[4:08] <[Saint]> No, I'm not.
[4:08] <[Saint]> I'm in NZ - they shipped here.
[4:08] <[Saint]> You can hardly get more remote than NZ :)
[4:08] <buzzsaw> well... ISS would be a bit more remote...
[4:09] <[Saint]> Russia got there in 6 hours! :)
[4:09] <[Saint]> That beats FedEx :P
[4:09] <Twist-> Clearly fedex should begin shipping by rocket.
[4:10] <echelon> i don't understand why there's such demand for a piece of junk
[4:11] <echelon> most people are just dumb i guess
[4:11] * [Saint] doesn't understand the needlesly negative attitude for educational hardware
[4:11] <[Saint]> you're free to not be here.
[4:12] <[Saint]> translation: "I'm all grumpy I can't get one, so I'm gonna throw my toys"
[4:12] <[Saint]> ...beh.
[4:13] <chinoto> echelon: you want it, think it's junk, wonder why other people want it... one of those statements has to be false since they conflict :/
[4:14] * buzzsaw likes his pi so far...
[4:14] * SgrA (~sgra@unaffiliated/sgra) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[4:14] <Twist-> chinoto: today's vocabulary term is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance
[4:14] <buzzsaw> perfect prrice for what I need it to do...
[4:15] * pkrnj (~pkrnj@bas2-montreal47-1279443509.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:16] <chinoto> Twist-: neat O_O
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[4:17] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:18] <RiXtEr> Hi all..
[4:18] <tonyhughes> Hi RiXtEr
[4:18] * raspy_freenode (~raspy_fre@c-75-68-199-187.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:18] * jimerickson (~jimericks@gateway/tor-sasl/jimerickson) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:18] * jimerickson (~jimericks@gateway/tor-sasl/jimerickson) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:19] <tonyhughes> *general rant about digiums skype for asterisk not being available*
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[4:33] <buzzsaw> what are the *safe* voltage ranges for the pi?
[4:34] <pksato> 4.75V to 5.25V
[4:34] * rpitin (~adam@ppp118-209-47-23.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[4:36] <buzzsaw> looks like I am going to have to get a voltage regulator...
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[4:58] * Armand (~martin@cpc17-haye16-2-0-cust427.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: <Armand> I got promoted to stable but failed to propagate, so I was replaced by an inferior package with much lesser features... but that's enough about my ex. :P)
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[5:18] <daveconroy> hey guys
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[5:22] * yoavz (yoavz@yoavz.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[5:23] <daveconroy> i wrote a blog post last night detailing how to get a fully functional LAMP web server
[5:24] <daveconroy> it includes screenshots, and commands
[5:24] <daveconroy> http://www.daveconroy.com/how-to-turn-your-raspberry-pi-into-a-fully-functional-webserver/
[5:24] <daveconroy> hopefully someone here can find it useful
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[6:12] <chinoto> (I know I'm late) Getting AMP up was ridiculously easy on Ubuntu, Linux Mint, and openSUSE, I don't imagine it would be much different on the Raspberry Pi...
[6:14] <Triffid_Hunter> heh just don't expect decent performance from the database running on an SD card
[6:15] <chinoto> yeah :D
[6:15] <[Saint]> people seem to cry about quassel's performance - but it doesn't run bad at all with postgresql
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[6:16] * BlueDreams_ is now known as BlueDreams
[6:16] <chinoto> Probably much better off running AMP on even second hand celeron stuff
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[6:35] <buzzsaw> sqlite should run fine on a pi?
[6:36] <chinoto> buzzsaw: your distro might already be using it for something :P
[6:36] <buzzsaw> my distro?
[6:36] <SwK> buzzsaw: i run freeswitch on pi and that depends heavily on sqlite
[6:37] <buzzsaw> multiple things should be able to run sqlite
[6:37] <chinoto> someone was talking about AMP working, so something that's supposed to be light should definitely work
[6:37] <[Saint]> I don't think you're quite getting to grips with the serious IO penalty from the sdcard
[6:38] <[Saint]> even the fastest sdcard is going to be slower than an average spinning platter.
[6:38] <buzzsaw> switch the database to a usbstick then
[6:38] <SwK> io penalty or not, it still works??? you just might kill your sd card if you are doing to many tuple changes lol
[6:38] * [Saint] didn't say it didn't work
[6:38] <seba-> f8l, i think it works now
[6:38] <chinoto> or get a usb to sata adapter
[6:38] <chinoto> and use a harddrive or ssd
[6:38] <buzzsaw> but if you need to run something with preformance why use a pi :-)
[6:39] <[Saint]> also, I wouldn't expect you'd kill a sdcard. I call shenanigans on those who claim to have done so.
[6:39] <SwK> i was thinking of pulling unaclockeres thing and putting a msata on a usb adapter
[6:39] <[Saint]> you should be able to write back and forth from it for most of your lifetime.
[6:39] <SwK> [Saint]: I have killed flash media
[6:39] * buzzsaw killed a sdcard onceupon a time...
[6:39] <chinoto> it's odd that I'm amazed minecraft is working on the pi
[6:39] <SwK> i've killed everything from CF cards to SD cards
[6:39] <[Saint]> SwK: there's always outliers.
[6:39] <SwK> (even killed an SSD recently)
[6:39] <[Saint]> manufacturing defect one presumes.
[6:40] <[Saint]> SSDs are nowhere near "reliable" yet.
[6:40] <[Saint]> Not even close.
[6:40] <buzzsaw> using a usbstick as swap *badIdea*
[6:40] <chinoto> maybe it's just because of how long it took me to get around to compiling virtualgl and finding it CAN'T work because it uses GLX
[6:40] <SwK> nope just killed them on write cycles
[6:40] <SwK> (i tend to do that tho lol)
[6:40] <Triffid_Hunter> buzzsaw: tell microsoft that
[6:40] <seba-> i have a killed SD card
[6:41] <buzzsaw> yeah I dont use microsoft much...
[6:41] <chinoto> it's nice having dd-wrt, I have a free ethernet port now :)
[6:42] <Triffid_Hunter> my omxplayer is broken currently :/
[6:42] <buzzsaw> ddwrt eww...
[6:42] <seba-> f8l, or not hm lol
[6:42] <buzzsaw> they started doing what they complained about their predocessor doing...
[6:42] <seba-> f8l, always when i tell you it works, it dies
[6:42] <seba-> you have some voodoo
[6:43] <buzzsaw> go for openwrt :-)
[6:43] <Triffid_Hunter> is there a command to update gcc symlinks? I seem to have both 4.6 and 4.7 installed with relevant symlinks pointing to 4.6
[6:44] <seba-> hm
[6:44] <seba-> this is weird
[6:45] <seba-> is it possible that a bad PSU
[6:45] <SwK> openwrt gives me headaches
[6:45] <seba-> would be killing SD cards?
[6:45] <buzzsaw> it could...
[6:45] <buzzsaw> bad psu are bad on all kinds of things...
[6:45] * [Saint] doubts it
[6:45] * Shy (~Shy@pdpc/supporter/bronze/shy) Quit ()
[6:45] <[Saint]> I would expect corruption - death entirely, I doubt.
[6:46] <seba-> [Saint], well i'm having big problems
[6:46] <[Saint]> Are you using quality media?
[6:46] <seba-> [Saint], the raspberry pi worked for like 1 month and then i was getting corruption
[6:46] <[Saint]> People seem to forget this makes a big difference.
[6:47] <[Saint]> ie. don;t go buying the cheapest card you can.
[6:47] <seba-> [Saint], i've bought a sony card now
[6:47] <seba-> it happened after few days
[6:47] <seba-> i think there's something wrong with the raspberry pi
[6:47] <[Saint]> Well, there's your problem - Sony ;P
[6:47] <seba-> or PSU
[6:48] <seba-> [Saint], well i've had silicon power before that
[6:48] <seba-> i don't think the problem is in the SD cards
[6:48] * screwloose (~doc@64-121-21-56.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:49] <[Saint]> Silicon Power isn't exactly known for quality either...
[6:49] <Triffid_Hunter> sandisk are good last time I checked
[6:49] <[Saint]> They can be.
[6:50] <seba-> ok but don't you find it a bit strange
[6:51] <[Saint]> No. No one here has enough information to find anything out of place.
[6:51] * jankyhellface (~jankyhell@173.239.75.186) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:51] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: SD cards need a rock solid 3.3v supply to work properly.. rpi is already very sensitive to power quality
[6:51] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yes, that's why i suspect the PSU, it's a cell phone charger 1A 5V
[6:51] <Triffid_Hunter> I have a 5v 2.5A tablet charger connected directly to the GPIO header, never had a single problem with power
[6:53] <[Saint]> why is it connected directly to the header? o_0
[6:54] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: because I simply don't trust the miniscule pins in the usb-c connector to carry enough power to make the pi reliable.. at least with 0.1" headers I know I can put a couple of amps through and it'll be fine
[6:54] <seba-> hm
[6:54] <seba-> is there a debug mode
[6:54] <seba-> i don't have a monitor
[6:55] <[Saint]> Triffid_Hunter: those traces are perfectly capable of carrying that current.
[6:55] <[Saint]> there's no need for such paranoia.
[6:56] <[Saint]> the GPIO goes to *exactly* the same size trace in the board itself...if anything was going to fail, it would eb the board traces, not the pins in <insert socket here>
[6:56] <[Saint]> tl;dr: no need - its fine.
[6:57] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: not worried about the traces.. it's the contact in the socket that bugs me. I can see how tiny the contact area is, seems like a recipe for hot-spotting to me
[6:57] <[Saint]> Nah.
[6:57] <Triffid_Hunter> also I'm an EE, got many years of experience to back up my dislike for powering things via tiny usb connectors. it's different for usb-A, those are bigger, and it's different for phones and tablets because they have a UPS built in so doesn't matter if the power is flakey sometimes
[6:57] <seba-> what could cause corrupion
[6:58] <seba-> besides bad SD card
[6:58] <[Saint]> think of the abuse your (almost certainly charged over micro-USB) phone gets - and how it behaves.
[6:58] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: momentary imperfect contact in the usb connector caused by vibration or movement
[6:58] <[Saint]> years and years and years of abuse.
[6:58] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, you mean like bad power
[6:58] <[Saint]> then compare that to how carefully one treats the pi.
[6:58] <seba-> that would damage the SD card?
[6:58] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: sub-standard or noisy power supply would do it too
[6:59] <seba-> hm
[6:59] <seba-> this is shitty
[6:59] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: damage? unlikely. but if the power is flakey while it's writing you can guarantee to get corrupted data written into the flash
[6:59] <[Saint]> easy test - grab a multimeter
[6:59] <seba-> well the previous SD card was damaged
[7:00] <[Saint]> what the!?! ...I get kicked for a three letter a word that also refers to a donkey - and that happens...nothing.
[7:00] <[Saint]> lol
[7:00] <[Saint]> lol, and lol hard, dost I.
[7:01] <seba-> hm
[7:02] * seba- (~hel1@cpe-90-157-233-7.static.amis.net) Quit ()
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[7:33] <lyndsysimon_> Alternatively, I could pulse the display. 8 segments = 9 possible states including "off", which means I'd need 4 pins and a bunch of logic gates I don't have.
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[7:34] * lyndsysimon_ is now known as lyndsysimon
[7:36] * craycray (~craycray@c-76-26-90-229.hsd1.wv.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[7:36] * ka6sox is now known as ka6sox-away
[7:36] * MarkDude (~MT@pdpc/supporter/student/markdude) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[7:37] * seba- (~hel1@cpe-90-157-233-7.static.amis.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:37] <seba-> http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=36533&start=25
[7:37] <seba-> this sux
[7:38] * screwloose (~doc@64-121-21-56.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[7:38] <seba-> a lot of people are having problems
[7:38] <seba-> with the SD corruption
[7:38] <[Saint]> seba-: note the difference between that post and your claims?
[7:38] <seba-> [Saint], which is?
[7:39] <[Saint]> you calimed *damage* to the card itself.
[7:39] <[Saint]> *claimed
[7:39] <[Saint]> filesystem corruption - entirely different.
[7:39] <seba-> [Saint], yes, well the previous had damage, i haven't checked this one yet
[7:39] <[Saint]> and totally recoverable.
[7:39] <seba-> [Saint], yeah by reformating
[7:39] <seba-> that sucks
[7:40] <[Saint]> its removable storage - having any data there you care about not backed up is your fault.
[7:40] <seba-> [Saint], no, it sux that i have to reformat frequently
[7:41] <[Saint]> it takes like 30 seconds to do.
[7:41] <seba-> yeah but i have to set up everytime the settings, i'll probably make an image now of the settings
[7:41] <seba-> but still it's idiotic that i have to do this
[7:41] <seba-> something is causing this sorts of crap
[7:41] <seba-> hm
[7:41] <[Saint]> Errr...why would you need to do that?
[7:42] <[Saint]> create an image of a good installation, regularly.
[7:42] <[Saint]> dd it back when you have tyrouble.
[7:42] <[Saint]> you don;t need to set up from a clean install every time.
[7:42] <seba-> yes but i don't like that it causes corruption
[7:42] <seba-> especially so frequently
[7:42] <lyndsysimon> seba-: respectfully, you're working with a $35 computer that's the size of most mice from 15 years ago. We live in amazing times - gotta keep it in perspective :)
[7:42] <seba-> lyndsysimon, so?
[7:43] <seba-> my cell phone doesn't cause so much corruption
[7:43] <seba-> it has also ARM inside
[7:43] <lyndsysimon> seba-: So, if you find a problem, fix it.
[7:43] <seba-> that's what i'm trying to do
[7:43] <seba-> duh
[7:43] <seba-> i'm asking if maybe anyone has a good idea
[7:43] <seba-> on how to fix it
[7:43] <seba-> instead of telling me that it's cheap
[7:43] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: get a 2A supply. connect it to the GPIO port. if you still have SD card corruption, come tell us. if that fixes it, also come tell us :)
[7:43] <lyndsysimon> I didn't say it was cheap, I would point out that it's amazing.
[7:43] <[Saint]> All I see is a very small percentage of people, making claims almost always without any actual eveidence.
[7:43] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yes, i'm thinking of that
[7:44] * stepho (~stephram@ppp59-167-121-22.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:44] <seba-> [Saint], what sorts of evidence do you want
[7:44] <seba-> i don't get it
[7:44] <[Saint]> What I am saying is, there's absolutley no reason to believe that this isn;t user error.
[7:44] <[Saint]> And many reasons to believe it is.
[7:45] <seba-> [Saint], well tell what kind of user error i've made, like give possibilities
[7:45] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: http://triffid-hunter.no-ip.info/101_0059.JPG
[7:46] <[Saint]> improper shutdown, poorly seated card, use of a power supply that cannot provide the desired range...
[7:46] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: if you do that, please be very careful when plugging in the supply.. one wrong pin and your rpi is fried permanently
[7:46] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yes i'm aware of that
[7:46] * [Saint] advises not doing that
[7:46] <seba-> why
[7:46] <[Saint]> There's really no reason to.
[7:46] <[Saint]> Like, at all.
[7:47] <seba-> [Saint], no improper shutdown, i haven't touched it but it could be, but the socket is already a piece of crap, flimsy
[7:47] <Triffid_Hunter> try it anyway, there are several reports of it making a significant difference
[7:47] <seba-> [Saint], a power supply can be the reason, but it's weird that it would be
[7:47] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yes i will
[7:47] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, i'll use a computer PSU
[7:47] <lyndsysimon> FWIW, with my limited experience, I agree. I've not seen anything in the official docs saying it's OK to power the device through the GPIO.
[7:47] <Triffid_Hunter> seba-: rpi is extremely sensitive to power supply quality compared to other equipment.. probably not enough capacitors onboard
[7:48] <chinoto> I need to see my neighbor tomorrow... must obtain legos O_O
[7:48] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yeah
[7:48] <seba-> almost none
[7:48] <[Saint]> Why is it weird that failure to supply a device with its power requirements would cause undesireable results?
[7:48] <seba-> [Saint], it's not weird
[7:48] <[Saint]> I don't think it is weird at all.
[7:48] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: lots of folk with 1A supplies when rpi is rated 700mA max have supply trouble
[7:48] <seba-> yes
[7:48] <[Saint]> seba-: it is or it isn't - which.
[7:49] <[Saint]> you said it is, now you're saying it isn;t.
[7:49] <seba-> [Saint], look RPI is made for kids apparently
[7:49] <Triffid_Hunter> 1A > 0.7A thus requirements are theoretically satisfied, however rpi still won't work properly
[7:49] <seba-> and it should work
[7:49] <[Saint]> make up your mind please :)
[7:49] <lyndsysimon> I'm actually powering mine at the moment from the USB port on my Macbook. That's what, 500mA?
[7:49] <[Saint]> seba-: no - it is made for education.
[7:49] <[Saint]> education != kids
[7:50] <seba-> [Saint], well whatever point is that it doesn't work properly when expected to
[7:50] <[Saint]> Mine does.
[7:50] <lyndsysimon> [Saint]: Yep. I'm 29 years old, and using mine to learn the basics of electrical engineering.
[7:50] <chinoto> kids are primary target of edumacation, the wires in adults have solidified and they are forever stoopid
[7:50] <seba-> [Saint], what kind of power supply do you have
[7:50] <[Saint]> A cheap Samsung 2A wall-wart.
[7:50] <seba-> [Saint], see, that's the point
[7:50] <seba-> i have a 1A and it doesn't
[7:51] <seba-> actually it worked
[7:51] <seba-> but now it doesn't
[7:51] <seba-> it might be the PSU but i don't know
[7:51] <[Saint]> You haven't actually verified your PSU is supplying the stated voltage.
[7:51] <[Saint]> that would be one of the first things to check.
[7:51] * [Saint] actually mentioned this a lot earlier
[7:51] <lyndsysimon> I got my RPi at PyCon. They supplied a power adapter too - it's a 5V/1A
[7:51] <seba-> [Saint], i did, after the polyfuse it's slightly bellow the optimum, but it's reported to work without problems at such voltage
[7:52] <[Saint]> what is "slightly below the optimum" and what else are you attempting to power with it?
[7:53] <seba-> [Saint], i haven't tried anythign else, because it worked
[7:53] <[Saint]> So - no keyboard, no mouse - no wireless dongle - nothing?
[7:53] <Triffid_Hunter> powering via gpio bypasses the polyfuse I suppose
[7:53] <seba-> [Saint], nothing, just ethernet
[7:53] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yes
[7:54] <seba-> i'm installing linux on a second computer
[7:55] <[Saint]> Well - if you're that convinced its not your problem - go through the returns/claims process.
[7:55] <seba-> i'll try to check what's on the SD card
[7:55] <seba-> if there are any logs
[7:55] <seba-> [Saint], i'm not, i just don't know what's wrong
[8:01] * cpg|away is now known as cpg
[8:02] * pkrnj (~pkrnj@bas2-montreal47-1279443509.dsl.bell.ca) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[8:06] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, apparently writing to SD card can take up to 100 mA
[8:06] <Triffid_Hunter> easily, I'm told some cards can take twice that
[8:11] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, yes, so it could be that the power dips or something, but then 0.7A minimum is a lie or it should be a very good 0.7A charger not just a phone charger
[8:12] <[Saint]> For a model B, even if you're not powering anything else - as the docs state - you really want 1A
[8:13] <seba-> [Saint], yes, i have 1 A
[8:14] <seba-> [Saint], an original HTC charger
[8:14] <seba-> it could be that it's not good, i haven't checked on the oscilloscope
[8:16] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[8:18] <seba-> ok i'm on the card
[8:18] <seba-> do you suggest anything to check?
[8:20] * Datalink|Elsewhe (~Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[8:20] <seba-> ok fscking it
[8:20] <seba-> tons of errors
[8:23] * fatpudding (~fatpuddin@82.178.9.46.customer.cdi.no) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[8:24] * Shaan7 (~quassel@kde/shantanu) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[8:26] <seba-> hm
[8:26] <seba-> ok i'll test now if the sd card is still ok
[8:28] * dreamon_ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[8:29] * JanB5 (~jgander@83-93-101-44-dynamic.dk.customer.tdc.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:30] <seba-> http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=19816
[8:30] <seba-> this is weird
[8:31] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, this guy reports that it was just the r.pi which was faulty
[8:31] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, i could do more extensive memtest, but what else could it be? (if it's not the PSU)
[8:33] <seba-> [Saint], do you have any ideas what could i test?
[8:34] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:35] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:37] <owen_> seba-: do uou have a spare sd card?
[8:37] <seba-> owen_, it's a new one, it happened with the old one as well
[8:37] <owen_> ok, eleiminates that
[8:38] <seba-> owen_, it doesn't, it just makes it less likely
[8:38] <owen_> Have you measured your voltages on the pi
[8:39] <owen_> ie, is your power pack genuinelyly putting out 5 v ?
[8:39] <seba-> owen_, yes, they are slightly bellow the optimum, but i've read it should be still ok, i don't recall now exactly how much, around 4.75 V after the polyfuse, so it might be this
[8:39] * Milos (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[8:39] * dc5ala (~dc5ala@stgt-4d039fd8.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:40] * Milos (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:41] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, [Saint], it looks like the SD card is corrupted
[8:42] <[Saint]> I thought that was a given.
[8:42] <seba-> [Saint], yes but why, after 3 days
[8:42] <seba-> it wasn't corrupted on day 1, i've checked
[8:43] <seba-> [Saint], i mean corrupted as in unrecoverably corrupted
[8:44] <seba-> 00:17:07.12 - Completed "Reading and comparing data" for drive G: 3767MB, "Single, Flash Reader, 1.00, ", 512b
[8:44] <seba-> 00:17:07.14 - Tested total 3767.999MB in 0:05:10 with 12.146MB/s
[8:44] <seba-> 00:17:07.14 - Total errors: Read fatal=0, Read recoverable=0; Write fatal=0, Write recoverable=0; Comparsion=7063
[8:45] * ebswift (~ebswift@1.141.26.137) has joined #raspberrypi
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[8:55] <gordonDrogon> morning Bank Holiday Pi Peeps!
[8:55] <Gadgetoid> morning
[8:55] * bortzmeyer (~stephane@2a01:e35:8bd9:8bb0:91f4:1622:9ab4:8385) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:55] <[Saint]> Pffffffffft!
[8:55] <Gadgetoid> Just woke up, feel like I should carefully put the laptop down and walk away
[8:55] <[Saint]> That's old hat - I did that yesterday ;)
[8:55] <[Saint]> re: bank holidays
[8:56] <seba-> any suggestions on how to test SD cards on linux?
[8:57] <gordonDrogon> seba-, the badblocks command?
[8:57] <seba-> gordonDrogon, what does it check?
[8:57] <seba-> just if it can read/write?
[8:58] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[8:58] <gordonDrogon> seba-, don't use the -w option on a live SD card... - yes just read/write and write/read/verify
[8:58] <seba-> ok
[8:58] <gordonDrogon> seba-, read-only test on a Pi: sudo badblocks -s -c 256 /dev/mmcblk0
[8:59] * Milos is now known as edmumble
[8:59] <seba-> gordonDrogon, i'm having problems with SD corruption on the pi
[8:59] <gordonDrogon> many people do.
[8:59] <gordonDrogon> I used to until I stopped overclocking.
[8:59] <seba-> gordonDrogon, i don't overclock
[8:59] * edmumble is now known as Milos
[9:00] <gordonDrogon> or rather until I stopped using the new 'turbo' dynamic OC mode - with the old fixed OC it was OK.
[9:00] <gordonDrogon> it's mostly the card type and the power supply.
[9:00] <Triffid_Hunter> hm, just tried the dynamic gpu/cpu ram thing and it causes my rpi to lock during boot
[9:00] * lyndsysimon (~lyndsysim@afc-adsl-74-50-252-198.natcotech.com) Quit (Quit: lyndsysimon)
[9:00] <seba-> yes, i'm thinking the power supply might be a problem
[9:00] <gordonDrogon> seba-, try powering the Pi off your PC.
[9:00] <[Saint]> Triffid_Hunter: WFM
[9:01] <seba-> gordonDrogon, well i have to buy a new SD card, i think this is not good anymore
[9:01] <seba-> :/
[9:01] <[Saint]> huh - what? Isn't a PC following spec only going to give it 500mA?
[9:01] <seba-> [Saint], no computer is following specs
[9:01] <seba-> excet a few dells
[9:01] <Triffid_Hunter> http://triffid-hunter.no-ip.info/101_0061.JPG <-- stops right here.. I take the cmdline and config options out and put back the fixed split and it's fine
[9:02] <gordonDrogon> 500mA will be enough to boot a Pi with no peripherals, however I've yet to see a PC that obeys the spec...
[9:02] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: 5Vsb perhaps.. the main 5v rail is generally rated >15A
[9:02] <gordonDrogon> I power my Pi's regularly from my PC and Laptops.
[9:02] <Triffid_Hunter> unless you go via the usb port of course..
[9:03] * [Saint] wonders what laptops are these
[9:03] <seba-> could a bad PSU damage the SD card?
[9:03] <gordonDrogon> it costs more for the PC/Mobo makers to put in the correct chips with current sensing/negotiation, etc. so a lot don't.
[9:03] <[Saint]> It shouldn't be giving any more than 500mA unless the device explicitly tells it to.
[9:03] <seba-> i get bad verifies
[9:03] <seba-> read+write is ok, just bad verify
[9:03] <gordonDrogon> seba-, it's unlikely hte card is damaged - you can test for that in a different PC. More likely some data corruption happens to/from the card in the Pi.
[9:04] <seba-> gordonDrogon, i'm checking in a PC now, i'll try in an another
[9:04] <seba-> hm
[9:04] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: most usb ports just have a polyfuse, they don't manage the current at all
[9:05] * [Saint] thanks the E-Lord for guiding him to buy nice HW
[9:05] <[Saint]> you guys are on track to blow stuff up, yo ;)
[9:06] * jol02 (~jolo2@2.210.22.93.rev.sfr.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:06] * JanB5 (~jgander@83-93-101-44-dynamic.dk.customer.tdc.net) Quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
[9:08] <seba-> gordonDrogon, badblocks -w -v /dev/sdc, this is ok ?
[9:08] <seba-> or should i put some extra options
[9:09] <seba-> i want to do read/write/verify
[9:10] <gordonDrogon> seba-, -c 256 might make it a little quicker.
[9:11] <seba-> gordonDrogon, i've tried with a tool on windows, which shows verify errors, but i don't trust windows, i'm trying now on linux
[9:12] <seba-> gordonDrogon, ok, added -c 256 and -s to show progress
[9:13] <owen_> seba-: as long as your card doesn't have a file system on it, -w is ok, otherwise you will erase your data
[9:13] <seba-> owen_, yes, i'm aware of that
[9:15] * JanB5 (~jgander@83-93-101-44-dynamic.dk.customer.tdc.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:19] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, what if i just put an electrolytic cap on the GPIO header
[9:19] <seba-> that could also work
[9:22] <owen_> seba-: I would do that unless there were a series resistor to limit the current
[9:23] * dreamon_ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:23] <na85> i set a root password but apparently forgot it
[9:23] <na85> is there a way to reset it by editing the image?
[9:23] <seba-> owen_, where it's the resistor ? on the GPIO?
[9:23] <Gadgetoid> Just opened up an EL inverter, it looks like it was soldered together by a blind monkey
[9:23] <seba-> hm
[9:23] <na85> i tried re-imaging my sd card but it stil comes with a password set, as though the image isn't being written
[9:24] <seba-> gordonDrogon, [Saint], it seems that SD damage happened, i don't know if the reason is bad SD card or R.PI
[9:24] <seba-> gordonDrogon, [Saint], but it wasn't damaged 3 days ago
[9:24] <[Saint]> filesystem - not the sd.
[9:25] <seba-> [Saint], SD
[9:25] <[Saint]> the sd is fine, the filesystem, isn't.
[9:25] <seba-> [Saint], no, i'm checking with badblocks
[9:25] <Gadgetoid> Haha, they're using a 5 dot LED level meter driver tied to a microphone to switch the various channels on the EL driver
[9:26] * Tabaliah (~michael@protospace/member/Tabaliah) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:26] * Lupinedk is now known as lupinedk
[9:27] * Tabaliah (~michael@protospace/member/Tabaliah) Quit (Client Quit)
[9:27] <[Saint]> na85: I'm not sure what you did - but, if you re-images the card, the root password would not remain.
[9:27] * Tabaliah (~michael@protospace/member/Tabaliah) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:27] <na85> yeah i'm not sure either, [Saint]
[9:27] * wiiguy (~fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:27] <Gadgetoid> This leaves me with a problem, I can't hack a level driver to switch the individual channels, blah
[9:28] <na85> i did it with dd, I can't imagine why the image isn't being written
[9:28] <seba-> [Saint], i get verify errors, R/W works ok
[9:28] <[Saint]> there are ways you can reset the root password if you've forgotten it, but I have a headache and its a little complicated. Ask google.
[9:28] <[Saint]> na85: query something along the lines of "debian+reset root password"
[9:29] <[Saint]> or, figure out where you're going wrong with dd
[9:29] <Triffid_Hunter> na85: mount sd card on your host, then edit /etc/shadow and dump in the relevant hash from your host
[9:30] <Triffid_Hunter> na85: or simply edit /etc/inittab on the rpi's sd card and make it so it doesn't ask for a pass
[9:30] <na85> awesome, thanks Triffid_Hunter
[9:30] <na85> do you know if the hashes are salted at all? i.e. could I just dump in a hash from my local machine?
[9:31] <gordonDrogon> na85, that will work.
[9:31] <na85> ok, many thanks
[9:31] <Gadgetoid> Oh look??? transistors
[9:32] <Gadgetoid> Now I need to short them without electrocuting myself
[9:32] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, what are you hacking?
[9:32] <seba-> gordonDrogon, if it shows any errors, i can throw it away basically
[9:32] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: A sound-activated electroluminescent wire driver
[9:32] <seba-> ?
[9:32] <Gadgetoid> I don't want it to be sound activated, I want it to be Pi activated
[9:32] * Spiffy (~Spiffy@unaffiliated/spiffy) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:33] <Gadgetoid> The circuit looks simple enough that I could just rip the whole thing apart and use the inverter on a breadboard, for ultimate insanity
[9:33] * Playa4Life (~Playa4Lif@95.209.170.244.mobile.3.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:33] * chinoto (~chinoto@c-107-2-85-18.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has left #raspberrypi
[9:33] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, Ah..... right ....
[9:34] <Gadgetoid> Just trying to figure out how it generates A/C, as the big shiny electrocutey wire wrapping thing only steps up the voltage if I'm not mistaken
[9:34] <na85> k wtf, my rpi's /etc/shadow shows no hash for root, but it still asks for a pwd? no wonder it was rejecting the pwd
[9:34] <[Saint]> best component classification ever.
[9:35] * Empty_One (~empty@CPE-72-131-74-201.wi.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[9:35] <Gadgetoid> I suspect it has something to do with the transistor next to it and a couple of capacitors
[9:35] <[Saint]> na85: Ohhhh - heh, yes, that's expected.
[9:35] <na85> :/
[9:35] <na85> learn something every day
[9:35] <[Saint]> thats a slightly confusing way of telling you that there isn;t one set.
[9:35] <Gadgetoid> [Saint]: yeah, nice that they put the "electrocutey" part in as a hazard warning
[9:36] <na85> [Saint]: I thought it was supposed to not ask for one by default?
[9:36] <[Saint]> it won;t let you login directly as root like this, no.
[9:37] <na85> i was trying to su to root
[9:37] <[Saint]> do "sudo su"
[9:37] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, there will be a simple oscillator made from a transistor and the LT coil of the transformer...
[9:37] <na85> sudo doesn't exist
[9:37] <[Saint]> ...what distro is this?
[9:38] <na85> raspbian
[9:38] <[Saint]> it definitely should exist...
[9:38] * na85 shrugs
[9:38] <na85> oh
[9:38] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: Strikes me it might be easier to leave it all on the board and solder some wires to tap into the A/C, which I can then switch with transistors to my hearts desire
[9:38] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, so the HT goes into a circuit with a row of transistors to switch the EL wires on/off?
[9:38] <na85> i bet this is the raspbian fork that has X removed
[9:38] * na85 grumbles
[9:38] * na85 had two images
[9:39] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, ah, they'll be triacs.
[9:39] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: The LED level driver looks like it switches 3 confusingly placed tiny little surface mount transistors
[9:40] <Gadgetoid> It's the KA2284, and it's almost certainly not operating from 100V A/C so that gives me a point to tap in
[9:40] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, so hook into those 3 triacs, or the led level driver before them.
[9:40] <Gadgetoid> This PCB looks like it was made by monkeys, too, it's shoddy as all hell
[9:41] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, that'll be driving the gates of the triacs directly.
[9:41] <gordonDrogon> if the KA2284 is through hole, you should be able to unsolder it easilly and solder in your 3 wires.
[9:42] <Gadgetoid> Found where to tap in, thee's a little resistor before each transistor, just need to find the supply voltage going into the KA2284??? I'd take the input voltage at a pinch, but bad things might happen
[9:42] <gordonDrogon> you just need to trigger the triacs - sticking 3.3v into them might do it...
[9:43] <Gadgetoid> drat, I'm covered in conductive paint again??? that stuff gets around! brb
[9:43] * Caribou| (~Caribou@109.128.144.129) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:43] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: thanks for your help! going to give it a tentative prod
[9:44] <Gadgetoid> I wonder if I've got any transistors in my bits box that will switch 100v ac
[9:44] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, AC remember - you want triacs.
[9:45] <Gadgetoid> Oooh!
[9:46] <Gadgetoid> Good point, didn't grok there was a difference
[9:47] <gordonDrogon> wonder if they work with DC. much easier to switch.
[9:47] <Gadgetoid> Success!
[9:48] <Gadgetoid> Got a tiny spark, too!
[9:48] * cpg is now known as cpg|away
[9:48] <gordonDrogon> er.. I'm sure you don't want sparks..
[9:48] <Gadgetoid> response curve is awful, I wonder if that's the EL wire
[9:48] <seba-> gordonDrogon, read only test shows no errors, but read+write+verify shows
[9:49] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I took the input voltage directly, it didn't like that, but there's a little resistor, presumably a voltage divider setup, after which it works beautifully
[9:49] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@60.Red-80-25-210.staticIP.rima-tde.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:49] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, you're connecting 3.3v to the base of the triac?
[9:49] <gordonDrogon> seba-, maybe the card is bad then...
[9:50] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: More or less, yes, although I'm not sure it's 3.3v
[9:50] <Gadgetoid> Input voltage is 6v
[9:50] <seba-> gordonDrogon, but is it possible that RPi made the damage, 3 days ago it was new and it wasn't damaged, checked
[9:50] <gordonDrogon> take a 3.3v supply from the Pi and give it a go...
[9:51] <gordonDrogon> seba-, I've no idea. I think it's unlikely, but I really don't know.
[9:51] <seba-> oh ok
[9:51] <gordonDrogon> seba-, I think if there were cases of the Pi damaging SD cards (rather than just causing corruption which is cured with a reformat) then there would be posting about it by now ...
[9:52] <Gadgetoid> Found the pin on the driver, will just solder onto the underside and leave it in place
[9:52] <seba-> gordonDrogon, ok, but i doubt people check read+write+verify, but this is the second card it happened
[9:52] <[Saint]> Heh - I already tried that...mind you, at that point OP was adamant that this was the second card that had been caused physical damage, ...without verification ;)
[9:53] <seba-> [Saint], well how should i verify it, reccomend a protocol
[9:53] <[Saint]> you need a control for one. which you don't have currently.
[9:54] <seba-> [Saint], what would be a control in this case?
[9:54] <[Saint]> you need a known good state, and then to prove that a known bad state can be caused with nothing but normal use.
[9:54] <na85> i.e. you need a known-to-be-working card
[9:54] <Gadgetoid> Drat, it's gonna have to come off, every channel is lighting
[9:54] <seba-> but it was a good card
[9:54] <seba-> 3 days ago
[9:54] <seba-> i've checked it
[9:55] * owen_ (~owen@180.200.157.61) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[9:55] <[Saint]> the known good state would be a card that has never touched the pi - or anything - for that matter - and checks to verify this known good state.
[9:55] <seba-> yes
[9:55] <seba-> that's what i did
[9:55] <[Saint]> simple saying "it worked X days ago" is meaningless.
[9:55] <[Saint]> and prone to bias.
[9:55] <seba-> [Saint], it never touched the pi
[9:55] <na85> updating firmware
[9:55] <seba-> and tested write+read+verify
[9:55] * na85 pumps fists
[9:55] <seba-> it was ok
[9:56] * [Saint] gives up
[9:56] <[Saint]> you just keep believeing the problem without proof and we'll call it a day.
[9:56] <seba-> [Saint], what kind of proof
[9:56] <[Saint]> sound good? yep. great.
[9:56] <seba-> should i try it with 1000 SD cards
[9:56] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:57] <[Saint]> It only needs one, but, you need to actually have a control point to start with.
[9:57] <[Saint]> and you haven't, despite claiming so.
[9:57] <seba-> [Saint], well how could i have a control point, tell me
[9:58] <[Saint]> I did.
[9:58] <Gadgetoid> I suspect I'm going to wish I had some desoldering braid right about now
[9:58] * bge (~sticks@86-60-194-238-Dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:58] <na85> [Saint]: i think seba- needs you to break it down a little further :)
[9:58] <seba-> yes
[9:58] <[Saint]> na85: this has been going on for hours - whatever he needs, I can't give him.
[9:58] <na85> ah
[9:58] * zastaph (zastaph@unaffiliated/zastaph) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:58] <seba-> no
[9:58] <seba-> look
[9:59] <gordonDrogon> seba-, if you are sure the Pi is causing the damage then you should post to the forums about it.
[9:59] <na85> ^
[9:59] <[Saint]> with proof.
[9:59] <seba-> gordonDrogon, i'm not sure, how can i be sure?
[9:59] <seba-> yes what kind of proof
[9:59] <seba-> please give me a step by step protocol
[9:59] <seba-> to what constitutes a proof
[9:59] <gordonDrogon> no.
[9:59] <gordonDrogon> you're the one stating it's causing damage. you work out the protocol.
[10:00] <[Saint]> you could try reading what I wrote. start with a card that is in a known good state, verify this state, <passage of time>, verify that the pi caused a known bad state; verify this state.
[10:00] <na85> i would say you'd need 2 identical SD cards, flashed w the same image, use one in the pi until it breaks, then run a diff against the two images
[10:00] <[Saint]> I've written this at least three different ways already.
[10:00] <gordonDrogon> I'm saying its highly unlikely, but I won't rule out the possibility, however as I never see it myself and I don't see reports of others seeing it either, I'm not really in a position to test some theory. (and I don't want to either)
[10:00] <seba-> [Saint], yes, i did that, the only difference was that i didn't use it for sometime without the PI
[10:00] <seba-> i only tested it
[10:01] <[Saint]> No, you didn't. You never verified the card was known good.
[10:01] <seba-> [Saint], yes i did
[10:01] <seba-> wtf
[10:01] <[Saint]> you've simply said "it worked".
[10:01] <[Saint]> which is meaningless.
[10:01] <seba-> [Saint], no
[10:01] <seba-> wtf
[10:01] <[Saint]> you lie. numbers don't.
[10:01] <seba-> WTF
[10:01] <seba-> you're crazy
[10:01] <seba-> i've said a ton of times
[10:01] <seba-> that i did a read+write+verify test
[10:01] <seba-> before putting in a pi for the first time
[10:01] <seba-> and it passed without errors
[10:01] <[Saint]> so - the very first thing you did, before using this card, ever, was run a full set of checks on it?
[10:02] <seba-> yes
[10:02] <[Saint]> please do tell me where you said that happened.
[10:02] <[Saint]> You're trolling mate.
[10:02] <seba-> ?
[10:02] <seba-> WTF
[10:02] <na85> 01:55 < seba-> and tested write+read+verify
[10:03] <na85> 01:55 < seba-> and tested write+read+verify
[10:03] <na85> whoops, twice
[10:03] <[Saint]> that is *after*.
[10:03] <seba-> no
[10:03] <gordonDrogon> seba-, this is a family frienly channel and that phrase isn't tolerated here. consider this warning.
[10:03] <seba-> it was before
[10:03] <seba-> and after
[10:03] * astralab (~astralab@d192-24-207-72.col.wideopenwest.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[10:04] <[Saint]> Ok - whatever, I'm muting you - and my suggestion would be for others to do the same lest they fall into this trap of false claims and repetition.
[10:04] <seba-> ?
[10:04] <seba-> why
[10:04] <seba-> i don't get it
[10:04] * astralab (~astralab@d192-24-207-72.col.wideopenwest.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:06] <na85> is it on-topic to ask about electronics for the gpio pins in here or should I take it to another chan?
[10:06] <gordonDrogon> seba-, post to the troubleshooting section on the rpf forums. post exactly what you did and what you think is happening.
[10:06] <seba-> gordonDrogon, ok
[10:06] <gordonDrogon> na85, as on toping here as anywhere.
[10:06] <na85> :)
[10:07] <[Saint]> well maybe not in #gpiopinsareofftopic
[10:07] <[Saint]> :P
[10:07] <na85> :P
[10:07] <seba-> gordonDrogon, http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=28&sid=d9b6cdd057b2fa4d57735445da97193f
[10:07] <seba-> here?
[10:07] <na85> anyone know if a maxwell bridge would be suitable for measuring soil moisture content via capacitance?
[10:08] <na85> thought my first project with my pi would be to make it water my plants
[10:08] <na85> :D
[10:08] <gordonDrogon> seba-, I don't know, I'm not that intersted.
[10:08] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:08] <[Saint]> blunt.
[10:08] <seba-> na85, it's easier with a A/D, for example with arduino
[10:09] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-203-3.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:09] <gordonDrogon> yea, there are some purely resistive solutions.
[10:09] <na85> seba-: yeah, probably. I have some AVRs sitting in the closet
[10:09] <na85> time to get out the breadboard i guess
[10:09] <gordonDrogon> you can measure capacitance on a Pi directly though - it might make an intersting project.
[10:10] <gordonDrogon> but sticking a resistance probe into the soil connected to an A/D is probably easier.
[10:10] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD29764.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:11] <na85> hmm, measure capacitance on the pi directly by just reading the input frequency of charge/discharge?
[10:11] <na85> or what
[10:13] <gordonDrogon> more or less.
[10:13] <gordonDrogon> same principle as capacitive touch switches.
[10:14] <na85> innnnterestinggg
[10:14] <na85> i'll look into that, thanks
[10:14] <gordonDrogon> not sure how wet soil will work as the dielectric though.
[10:15] <na85> yeah me either
[10:16] <na85> i know that capacitive soil moisture sensors exist
[10:16] * Kaboon (kaboon@524A5520.cm-4-3b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:16] <na85> but tbh i'm concerned about killing the plants with ions building up on one of the plates and changing the soil ph
[10:16] * raspy_freenode (~raspy_fre@c-75-68-199-187.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[10:16] <na85> <.<
[10:16] <na85> >.>
[10:17] * scorphus (~scorphus@CAcert/User/scorphus) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[10:22] <Gadgetoid> I hate desoldering.
[10:23] <[Saint]> its way more fun when you have parts that aren't heat sensitive.
[10:23] * [Saint] has been known to use an oven for this
[10:23] <Gadgetoid> Hahaha, hax!
[10:23] <Gadgetoid> evidently the PCB is heat sensitive
[10:23] <na85> isnt that kind of dangeroups
[10:23] <na85> dangerous
[10:23] <Gadgetoid> but the solder isn't
[10:24] <[Saint]> na85: it could be, if you didn;t know what you were working with - yes.
[10:24] <[Saint]> not for you, but, your oven might get quite a fright.
[10:24] <[Saint]> ...and oven therapy is SO expensive.
[10:24] <na85> lol
[10:24] <na85> i meant
[10:24] <na85> can't you get toxic fumes in your oven and thus into your food
[10:25] <[Saint]> I've been to China, I'm immune to the entire periodic table now.
[10:25] <na85> lol
[10:27] <Gadgetoid> Well, not only have I not succeeded in desoldering it, but it's defiantly still working
[10:27] <Gadgetoid> So I haven't even broken the connections enough to hack it!
[10:27] <Gadgetoid> The damned things so cheap and shoddy I could probably digest it and it'd still work
[10:28] * violet-rpi (~quassel@laptoptina.broker.freenet6.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:28] * GentileBen (GentileBen@cpc20-lutn10-2-0-cust20.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:28] * techman2 (~pi@unaffiliated/techman2) Quit (Quit: ircII EPIC5-1.1.2 -- Are we there yet?)
[10:30] * techman2 (~glen@unaffiliated/techman2) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:30] <gordonDrogon> Hm. water still tastes horrible after last nights drain-off.
[10:30] <Gadgetoid> I think I'm going to have to go on a pilgrimage into town and get some desoldering braid
[10:31] <gordonDrogon> https://projects.drogon.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/water.jpg
[10:32] <[Saint]> Do...do you live on Coronation Street?
[10:32] * [Saint] stares in wonder
[10:33] * troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:33] <seba-> how much time do posts need for approval?
[10:34] * troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) Quit (Client Quit)
[10:34] <gordonDrogon> Fore Street, not coronation street - why?
[10:34] * rpitin (~adam@ppp118-209-32-196.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:34] <[Saint]> it looked so quiant and TV set-sih
[10:35] <gordonDrogon> it's in deepest ruralistan.
[10:35] * techman2 (~glen@unaffiliated/techman2) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[10:35] <[Saint]> DId you notice the half naked guy in the upper window that looks like he's rubbing his nipples?
[10:35] <[Saint]> Good score there, sir.
[10:35] <na85> wat
[10:35] <Gadgetoid> Oh, anyone fancy fact checking: http://pi.gadgetoid.com/pinout/ladder
[10:35] <gordonDrogon> Haha...
[10:37] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, buttons might be the wrong way round, but ...
[10:37] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: Might have to double check that!
[10:38] <[Saint]> that picture hurts my brains (apart from the obvious creepy window guy), none of the buildings are straight.
[10:38] <gordonDrogon> [Saint], there is no creepy window guy - other than your imagination..
[10:39] <[Saint]> the grey brickwork flat - 2nd floor, left window.
[10:39] <gordonDrogon> it's a 6-second exposure.
[10:39] <gordonDrogon> what was in that window was 2 young girls.
[10:40] <[Saint]> that's what they want you to think ;)
[10:40] <gordonDrogon> they're the grandchildren - and thats over the road from my house (the lilac one on the right)
[10:40] <gordonDrogon> however the road itseld does go downhill and round a bend, and it's a fairly wide-angle lens, so it does look a bit odd.
[10:41] * bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:41] <gordonDrogon> it is true to say that there are very few 90? angles in my house though.
[10:41] * Shirakawasuna (~Shirakawa@184-77-202-94.war.clearwire-wmx.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[10:43] <gordonDrogon> I think I need some breakfast.
[10:46] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[10:48] <Gadgetoid> I made myself get breakfast first thing
[10:48] * zproc (~zproc@laf31-6-82-241-3-109.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:48] <Gadgetoid> Woooooo
[10:48] * Weaselweb (~quassel@77.64.181.50) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:49] <Gadgetoid> Now, do I put this driver on a breadbo
[10:49] <Gadgetoid> Whoops! And test to see if it still works
[10:49] * violet-rpi (~quassel@laptoptina.broker.freenet6.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:51] * dc5ala (~dc5ala@stgt-4d039fd8.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[10:52] * dc5ala (~dc5ala@stgt-4d039fd8.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:53] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[10:56] * Shaan7 (~quassel@kde/shantanu) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
[10:56] <Gadgetoid> Hmmm, suddenly nothing works
[11:00] * ebswift (~ebswift@1.141.26.137) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[11:00] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[11:01] * webby__ (~applecrog@ppp121-44-183-217.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:04] * Shaan7 (~quassel@kde/shantanu) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:05] <Gadgetoid> Hmmm, the driver IC must have been tying some grounds together or some madness
[11:06] <Gadgetoid> I need to stop electrocuting myself
[11:06] <Caribou|> :D
[11:06] <Gadgetoid> It's rather unpleasant
[11:06] <Grievre> Yes being dead is quite unpleasant
[11:07] <Caribou|> still you feeling alive for that time
[11:07] <Caribou|> feel*
[11:07] <Gadgetoid> Not sure if I could muster the currant to kill myself
[11:08] <Gadgetoid> Not that I'm terribly sharp on the theory, but if 4 triple A batteries can kill me... The world is a harsh place!
[11:08] <Gadgetoid> Hurts, though.
[11:12] * l2esonance (~l2esonanc@c-50-136-184-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: l2esonance)
[11:13] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:16] <Triffid_Hunter> Gadgetoid: you can't feel 6v unless applied to open wounds..
[11:16] * Hydra (~Hydra@AGrenoble-652-1-427-32.w90-42.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:16] <Triffid_Hunter> Gadgetoid: if you're being zapped, then your power supply is the dodgy sort
[11:16] * violet-rpi (~quassel@laptoptina.broker.freenet6.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:16] <Gadgetoid> Triffid_Hunter: It's stepped up to 100v
[11:17] <Triffid_Hunter> ah yes well that'll do it
[11:17] * [Saint] tries to imagine mustering currants
[11:17] <ShadowJK> tripple aaa should be able to provide enough current stepped up to 100V to be lethal
[11:18] <[Saint]> ...especially currants that can kill a man.
[11:18] <[Saint]> that's dangerous work right there.
[11:18] <ShadowJK> But 100V in itself isn't going to push enough current in most cases
[11:20] <Gadgetoid> Boom!
[11:20] <ShadowJK> except maybe with wet hands etc
[11:21] <Gadgetoid> Clearly the KA2285 was doing something that I didn't predict
[11:21] <Gadgetoid> Logical thing to do seems to be to break out all the low voltage stuff to a breadboard so I don't have to get close to the exciting bits
[11:22] <Jerub> i used to test 9v batteries by licking them, but i've also heard that can kill you.
[11:22] <Gadgetoid> Yeah, if you swallow them!
[11:23] <Gadgetoid> Right going to grab a bundle of wires and make this a little safer
[11:24] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:24] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[11:24] <[Saint]> With all the electrocution going on, I advise you stay away from wires...
[11:25] <Gadgetoid> Haha, I mean I'm going to solder on some wires to the logic stuff, the 100v is switched by triacs
[11:26] * Jevermeister (~Jevermeis@unaffiliated/jever) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:26] <Gadgetoid> Heh, found an H bridge I built out on a breadboard, couldn't get it working properly
[11:26] * KindOne (~KindOne@colchester-lug/silly-fool/donut) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[11:28] <Triffid_Hunter> Gadgetoid: last time I made a h-bridge I grabbed a HIP4082 IC to drive it.. definitely $8 well spent
[11:30] * dreamreal (~jottinge@redhat/dreamreal) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:31] * Shaan7 (~quassel@kde/shantanu) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[11:31] <Gadgetoid> Triffid_Hunter: Looks the trick, I need to get a bunch of stepper motors working which I pulled out of a printer
[11:32] <Triffid_Hunter> Gadgetoid: steppers? oh, go with A4982 those are awesome.. may need a fair few volts to drive printer steppers though
[11:32] <Triffid_Hunter> most printers are designed to run at a fixed speed and drive the motor with ULN2803 or similar
[11:34] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[11:37] * snowrichard (~Richard@206.255.128.20) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:38] <snowrichard> hello
[11:39] * MauveGnome (~MauveGnom@host86-164-71-181.range86-164.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:39] <snowrichard> had my pi for a few days now. finally found out how to play avi files properly. omxplayer -o hdmi file.avi with the file residing on an nfs share works ok
[11:41] <snowrichard> i've got an unofficial wiki started at www.snowgames.in I plan to put up some programming tutorials and links to other resources.
[11:41] * int3nz0r (~int3nz0r@86.86.66.141) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:42] * cellardoor (~cellardoo@unaffiliated/cellardoor) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:43] <cellardoor> Hi Raspberry Pi experts! I've got a 500GB USB portable hard drive I want to use as "big storage" for my Pi. Whenever I plug it in though, the Pi restarts itself and even then doesn't detect the HDD when I run sudo fdisk -l. Tried with a 4GB Memory stick and that works just fine, any idea on what's going on?
[11:43] <Jerub> cellardoor: is the external harddrive independently powered?
[11:44] <Triffid_Hunter> cellardoor: need a powered hub
[11:44] <snowrichard> i would suspect that the hard drive draws too much power for the usb port to supply. Try running it off a powered usb hub
[11:44] <Triffid_Hunter> cellardoor: rpi is very sensitive to power, and even more sensitive to usb devices sucking heaps of power
[11:45] <cellardoor> Jerub: Oh what :( But I've got a power supply shoving in 1.5A tops to the Pi, and the most a USB port can take is 500mA? :( damn. Ah well guess I will just use it elsewhere, thanks :)
[11:45] <Triffid_Hunter> cellardoor: yeah but it has to go through the pi.. pi doesn't like that
[11:45] <Triffid_Hunter> need to bypass the pi
[11:45] <snowrichard> have you got a linux box on your network? you could use NFS mount for extra data space
[11:46] <Jerub> cellardoor: lots of usb harddrives come with independent power, or a cable that has 2 usb connectors, one for power one for data.
[11:46] * Torikun (~Torikun@76-220-9-159.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[11:46] * MauveGnome (~MauveGnom@host86-164-71-181.range86-164.btcentralplus.com) has left #raspberrypi
[11:46] <cellardoor> snowrichard: well sure many, but the whole idea was to make the Pi a low-power-consumption server :(
[11:46] <cellardoor> Jerub: guess I will have to look into that then :)
[11:47] <cellardoor> I have a powered Hub somewhere but it's ancient and possibly even USB 1.0 - will look into it
[11:48] <ShadowJK> cellardoor; usb harddrives without power adapters consume somewhere around 600-900mA, more when they spin up. rPi input power limit is at around 1.1A iirc, and it uses 700 ish itself, leaving 400 available
[11:48] <[Saint]> there *is* no upper limit on input I thought.
[11:48] <[Saint]> though, it doesn't stop people claiming so.
[11:49] <cellardoor> ShadowJK: What was interesting is that the Pi would boot up fine with the drive already plugged in. The drive wouldn't work properly and the light would constantly flicker. Guessing that the Pi was just refusing to give the drive enough power or something? Or perhaps the Pi was just clinging to life itself
[11:49] * OpenSys (~OpenSys@fw.vslinux.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:49] <cellardoor> Either way my uptime of 100 days has gone to 16 hours >.>
[11:49] <OpenSys> morning
[11:49] <[Saint]> 1A - 2A - 5A - all fine.
[11:50] * DenBeiren (~Denbeiren@91.86.47.221) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:50] <[Saint]> the paperwork sent with my units explicitly states this.
[11:50] <cellardoor> [Saint]: mine said similar
[11:51] * Torikun (~Torikun@76-220-9-159.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:51] <Jerub> anyone experimented with something like http://www.amazon.co.uk/TeckNet%C2%AE-12000mAH-External-Mobilephone-Blackberry/dp/B0013KD7U6 as a UPS for a rpi?
[11:52] <[Saint]> many have, yes.
[11:53] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: you can use a supply with whatever current rating you like that's >1A, doesn't mean the pi is gonna let more than about 1A through.. the usb connectors can't handle it for a start :P
[11:53] <[Saint]> Triffid_Hunter: ...exactly, but, that's not the point.
[11:53] <[Saint]> many claim there's some mystical upper limit for PSUs - there isn't.
[11:53] * snowrichard (~Richard@206.255.128.20) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[11:55] <[Saint]> Jerub: as long as it can supply a 5V at ~1A stable - it doesn't matter where it comes from really.
[11:56] <Triffid_Hunter> rpi will still brown out if you pull 500mA from the usb port even if your supply can push 20A
[11:56] <Triffid_Hunter> that's where the power budget comes from
[11:57] <[Saint]> there's a lower limit - yes.
[11:57] <[Saint]> no upper, though.
[11:57] * Nemo7 (~nemo@unaffiliated/nemo7) Quit (Quit: it really tied the room together)
[11:57] * violet-rpi_ (~quassel@2001:5c0:1000:b::aa5b) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:57] <[Saint]> ...was I in some way unclear?
[11:58] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: you're confusing power budget of the pi itself with power supply ability
[11:58] <gordonDrogon> the crux of the Pi is the 700mA polyfuse on the 5v input though.
[11:58] * violet-rpi (~quassel@laptoptina.broker.freenet6.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[11:58] <gordonDrogon> Pi needs 3-400 mA - leaving 3-400mA for USB, etc.
[11:59] <gordonDrogon> so a good beefy PSU is probably more suited to powering a powered hub - which can then feed the Pi and USB peripherals.
[11:59] <[Saint]> Triffid_Hunter: how exactly does one intend on pulling 500mA from a raspi?
[11:59] * bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:59] <[Saint]> even using both ports on a Model B you couldn't manage that :)
[11:59] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: cellardoor is plugging a usb disk drive into it...
[12:00] <[Saint]> Triffid_Hunter: great - but - there's a huge flaw there.
[12:00] <[Saint]> it only supplies 140mA
[12:00] <gordonDrogon> from my own observations, something that "jars" the voltage on the USB will reboot the Pi - so somethings can be plugged at when it's off and powered up, but plug them in while the Pi is running and the Pi will reboot.
[12:01] <Triffid_Hunter> I have some 10u ceramic caps, sounds like I should add a few
[12:01] <gordonDrogon> some people have.
[12:01] <gordonDrogon> put them right under the USB sockets on the Pi.
[12:01] <Triffid_Hunter> I'd be more inclined to hang them on the 3v3 regulator actually
[12:02] <Triffid_Hunter> don't give a crap if the usb power dips, it's the power for the core that I want to keep stable
[12:02] <gordonDrogon> experiment & see what's best :)
[12:02] <gordonDrogon> core power comes from the 5v supply - if that dips then the 3.3v will drop out.
[12:02] <Triffid_Hunter> yeah hence putting the caps on the 3v3 reg
[12:03] <gordonDrogon> personally I'd put them as close to the device that causes the dip - ie. the usb sockets, however - experiment and see.
[12:04] <Triffid_Hunter> don't want sparks in the usb socket if I can help it
[12:05] <gordonDrogon> maybe higher power usb devices could be better designed... but that would cost money...
[12:05] <cellardoor> gordonDrogon: I saw the voltage thing. Hard drive killed it dead. But could boot up with it plugged in
[12:06] <[Saint]> cellardoor: that's really quite phenomenal
[12:06] <[Saint]> ...that shouldn;t work at all.
[12:06] * DenBeiren (~Denbeiren@91.86.47.221) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[12:06] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: why not?
[12:07] <[Saint]> the pi will only supply 140mA via USB, as I said earlier.
[12:07] <gordonDrogon> that's my observation of plugging in high power usb devices - plug them in with the Pi running and it'll reboot the Pi (or just crash it), but plug them in with the Pi off and they're OK.
[12:07] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: that's the model A.. latest one ditched the output polyfuse altogether, has a bigger one at the input
[12:08] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: also, polyfuses are not exactly precise in terms of trip current
[12:08] <gordonDrogon> The 4D displays I've used are like that. I halt the Pi, then plug the display in - which cause them to re-boot without me touching them...
[12:08] <steve_rox> sudden power drop it dont like
[12:08] <gordonDrogon> it's the Rev 1 boards with the USB polyfuses - the 1.1 and the Rev 2 (includes the model A) don't have the usb polyfuses..
[12:09] * DenBeiren (~Denbeiren@91.86.34.167) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:09] <steve_rox> wonder if that means if it shorts the thing is destroyed
[12:09] <gordonDrogon> Even the Rev 1's with the polyfuses (which I have) can cause the Pi to reboot when I plug in a high current display. The polyfuses aren't quite quick enough for the surge of the LED backlight coming on.
[12:10] <gordonDrogon> a usb short - should trip the main 700mA polyfuse...
[12:10] <steve_rox> oh they kept one polly
[12:10] <gordonDrogon> curciously enough, a 3.3v short doesn't always cause the Pi to reboot (as I've found out myself recently) it needs a proper power cycle...
[12:10] <steve_rox> i still got my rev 1 board
[12:10] <rpitin> gordonDrogon: high powered usb devices need to be plugged in via a powered usb hub because they draw too much power?
[12:11] <gordonDrogon> rpitin, if they're going to draw more than 2-300mA then yes. You might get away with a 2-headed USB power lead though - I use that for some 3G+GPS modules I'm testing..
[12:12] <seba-> Triffid_Hunter, ok i'm powering now directly on GPIO like you
[12:12] <rpitin> gordonDrogon: ya, i miss read your sentence, thought you were asking a question, but you were making a statement, my bad.
[12:12] <gordonDrogon> rpitin, no probs :)
[12:13] <gordonDrogon> I think you can still do a lot with the Pi's USB - you just need a little bit of care - it's still a $35 PC though :)
[12:14] <[Saint]> here's something I've been wondering - what color are you guys' VGA-out?
[12:15] <[Saint]> Am I the only person in the world with a black one?
[12:15] <gordonDrogon> there isn't VGA out on the Pi.
[12:15] <[Saint]> blargh - I derped a term.
[12:15] <gordonDrogon> compost video is yellow.
[12:15] <gordonDrogon> :)
[12:15] <[Saint]> composite - yes.
[12:15] <[Saint]> Mine's black.
[12:15] <Triffid_Hunter> seen a few photos of pis with black ones
[12:15] <[Saint]> Awwww...
[12:16] <gordonDrogon> 3.5mm jacks are either black or blue (mostly blue on the Rev 2's from what I've seen)
[12:16] <[Saint]> yeah - the 3.5mm is black, as is the composite.
[12:16] <gordonDrogon> off that they used black on the video out - yellow is a standard colour for it - but maybe they ran out of yellow one day :)
[12:16] <[Saint]> On my other pi(s), they're yellow...but on the one I have here now, its black.
[12:17] <[Saint]> I hadn't seen that before. Got curious.
[12:17] * MoALTz (~no@host86-142-161-119.range86-142.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[12:18] <[Saint]> One other color related thing I found odd was that when I got the 3.5mm->2RCA cable from RS (long story - they gave me a voucer and I couldn't buy another pi with it), they used *black* and red, not red and white.
[12:19] <[Saint]> ...weirdos.
[12:19] * Jx8p (~jx8p@213.246.120.215) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:19] <Gadgetoid> Magic blue smoke
[12:19] <Gadgetoid> But not from the Pi!
[12:19] <Jx8p> don't let the smoke out
[12:20] <[Saint]> It can't be. Pi smoke is kinda greenish. Verified :)
[12:20] <Jx8p> i'm fitting a heatsink to my pi's SOC. since I like my overclocks and don't want to let the smoke out :-)
[12:21] <Gadgetoid> Totally fried my el wire driver
[12:21] <[Saint]> Jx8p: I wouldn't worry about that too much.
[12:22] <[Saint]> It'll turn the OC off if it overtemps.
[12:22] <Jx8p> huh. i suppose that's why overclocking is 'officially allowed'
[12:22] * Playa4Life (~Playa4Lif@95.209.170.244.mobile.3.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[12:22] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: not sure a heatsink will do that much for it.. it's two chips stacked on top of each other, and the thermal conductivity of the plastic is mediocre at best
[12:22] * trijntje (~quassel@ubuntu/member/trijntje) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:22] * JanB5 (~jgander@83-93-101-44-dynamic.dk.customer.tdc.net) Quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
[12:23] <[Saint]> overclocking via raspi-config is allowed.
[12:23] <[Saint]> if you go your own way - you're out in the cold.
[12:24] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:24] <[Saint]> the heat sync alone would do very little without active cooling.
[12:24] <[Saint]> with a large finned sync and active cooling I can hold 1.2GHz stable, but I wouldn't advice it.
[12:25] <[Saint]> *advise too
[12:25] <Jx8p> o shanice, while doing dist-upgrade i got a ton of segmentation faults and dpkg quit
[12:25] <Jx8p> outrageous
[12:25] <Triffid_Hunter> heh doesn't sound like overclocking is going too well
[12:25] <Jx8p> 1.0ghz should be enough for anyone
[12:25] <[Saint]> Snap - was just going to say that :)
[12:26] <[Saint]> dammit - bad timing.
[12:26] <Jx8p> ffff, with 80 packages not fully installed, dpkg will keep segfaulting. I don't understand
[12:26] <[Saint]> Jx8p: just like 640K is enough for anyone? ;)
[12:27] <[Saint]> you sounded quite Gatesesque there.
[12:27] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: segfault = process used memory it hasn't allocated, usually caused by either program fault or memory corruption
[12:27] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, oops!
[12:27] <Gadgetoid> Yup!
[12:28] <Jx8p> my slightly educated guess is perhaps I ran out of memory
[12:28] * bge (~sticks@86-60-194-238-Dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[12:28] * webby__ (~applecrog@ppp121-44-183-217.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[12:28] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, that switcher board is looking more attractive now then ...
[12:28] * MoALTz (~no@host86-142-161-119.range86-142.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:28] * bge (~sticks@86-60-194-238-Dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:28] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: no that generally causes a different error
[12:29] <Jx8p> could it be that i done dist-upgrade and shouldn't have?
[12:29] <[Saint]> No.
[12:29] <Jx8p> dist-upgrade produced a sane report of things it wanted to do, well it did want a load of new packages installed, mostly themes and stuff
[12:29] <gordonDrogon> dist-upgrade ever now & then is generally ok.
[12:30] <Jx8p> hmm, it done it again.
[12:30] * Jx8p restart
[12:31] <[Saint]> dist-upgrade should - in theory at least - always be safe I thought?
[12:31] <rpitin> I've used my RPi to bend space time successfully and generate a time hole to transport a webpage from the 90s to 2013 http://rpitin.no-ip.org/
[12:31] <[Saint]> save for broken packages and deps.
[12:31] <Jx8p> i sincerely hope my 'TURBO' overclock didn't ruin the SD card as raspi-config warns
[12:32] <Jx8p> it takes so long to flash the image to SD <_<
[12:32] <gordonDrogon> dist-upgrade can install new files that an ordinary upgrade can't.
[12:32] <[Saint]> ruin it? no. trash your data? Ohhhh yes - yes, that can certainly happen.
[12:32] <Jx8p> wonder how feasible it is that the overclock ruined the dpkg file, causing the segfault
[12:32] <rpitin> Saint: yeah, was about to say that.
[12:33] <[Saint]> Jx8p: how long is "so long"? ~4 mins or so? 0_o
[12:33] <Jx8p> takes me several hours on my mac
[12:33] <[Saint]> unless you have USB1, in which case, you have my sympathy.
[12:34] <rpitin> The RPi is so cheap, why not just build a cluster to get more juice?
[12:34] <[Saint]> rpitin: many have
[12:34] <[Saint]> our hackerspace record is 52 units
[12:34] * ChampS666 (~ChampS@p54B4D7EA.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:34] <rpitin> Saint: ooh nice!
[12:35] <[Saint]> 'twas a fun day
[12:35] <rpitin> I've got another 3 Pi's in the mail, but thats a long way from 52U
[12:36] <Jx8p> well that's a pest. dpkg is almost certainly Kaput
[12:36] <Jx8p> dpkg --h yields 'Segmentation fault'
[12:36] <rpitin> Time to copy a new iso
[12:36] <rpitin> iso/img
[12:37] <Jx8p> thank the lord i can loopback mount the Raspbian SD image and just copy over the files manually :) using dd on my mac is really, really, slow, it's not even funny how bad it is
[12:38] <[Saint]> rpitin: while the pi itself may be quite cheap - in terms of performance vs cost, a modern desktop wins.
[12:38] <Jx8p> ok, perhaps i can't. os x is only showing me the boot parition of the raspbian image
[12:38] <[Saint]> I recall reading you'd need several hundred thousand of them to get a pi cluster into the list of supercomputers :)
[12:39] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:39] <[Saint]> by the time you've kludged a hundred raspis or so together - you may as well have purchased a modern desktop.
[12:40] <rpitin> Saint: true, but wheres the geekcred in that?
[12:40] <rpitin> :P
[12:40] <Jx8p> can someone upload a copy of their /usr/bin/dpkg for me please? don't want to copy over a new SD :)
[12:40] <[Saint]> Jx8p: your fs is likely toast
[12:41] <[Saint]> save the hassle and replace the whole image.
[12:41] <rpitin> ^
[12:42] * Weaselweb (~quassel@77.64.181.50) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[12:42] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:42] <[Saint]> On the plus side, you found out that warning was there for a reason :)
[12:42] <[Saint]> If that can be taken as a plus.
[12:43] * featheredfrog (~mhofer@cpe-67-250-125-135.hvc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:44] * AdvancedNewbie (~AdvancedN@142.162.111.92) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:44] <Jx8p> well, i hope this time getting wifi operational will be less hassle, having done so once :)
[12:45] <rpitin> Yeah, one of the things I'm really enjoying about the Pi is the low risk factor. It's nice to mess around without having to worry about it
[12:45] <Jx8p> reminds me of my first foray into linux - when trying out fedora, i had to relocate my desktop PC from the spare room to living room and get er plugged into my router to download the necessary packages to get it online
[12:45] <rpitin> Jx8p: wifi should be super simple to get ready if your routers dynamic DHCP
[12:46] <Jx8p> 'tis. does the latest raspbian come with wpa_supplicant out-of-box?
[12:46] <rpitin> yep
[12:46] <Jx8p> :D
[12:47] <rpitin> and if you're feeling super lazy you can just startx and run the wifi config app on desktop
[12:47] <rpitin> if you want a static IP its a little bit of messing around in config files
[12:47] <Jx8p> well, better get on with re-flashing that sd card...being that i'm on OS X, is there a trick to flash the .img to SD card in a way that doesn't take 4 hours? i'm using USB 2.0, i used a dd command last time, though i can't remeber the exact syntax
[12:48] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:49] * mike_t (~mike@pluto.dd.vaz.ru) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:49] <[Saint]> there's no reason for it to take that long.
[12:49] <[Saint]> even on a sloooooooow sdcard.
[12:50] <[Saint]> all your doing is writing ~1.9GB of data
[12:50] <[Saint]> that shouldn't be 4hours work.
[12:53] * Mr_P (~gerhard@chello080108255018.3.14.vie.surfer.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:53] <[Saint]> just tried it here.
[12:54] <[Saint]> finish in 2:12
[12:54] <[Saint]> mm:ss
[12:54] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: might help to set blocksize=4M or so
[12:57] <[Saint]> I don't imagine failing to set the block size would have that great an impact.
[12:57] <[Saint]> an impact, yes. adding multiple hours? no.
[12:57] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: osx is a very strange beast.. if it's deciding to write synchronously for some bizarre reason then blocksize will have a major impact
[12:58] <[Saint]> +~3.9 hours?
[12:58] <[Saint]> that *is* a strange beast indeed.
[12:58] * Hydra_ (~Hydra@AGrenoble-652-1-427-32.w90-42.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:59] <Triffid_Hunter> [Saint]: yeah every single time I try to do anything with OSX it requires multiple hours of maddening frustration and trawling obscure forums
[12:59] <Triffid_Hunter> I really don't understand how anyone can use it
[13:00] * Hydra (~Hydra@AGrenoble-652-1-427-32.w90-42.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[13:00] * Hydra_ is now known as Hydra
[13:01] <[Saint]> Steve told them to. 'Nuff said.
[13:02] <[Saint]> the flashy commercials featuring various hipsters probably help too.
[13:02] * shoerain (~mortimer@li557-200.members.linode.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[13:04] * bizarro_1 (~bizarro_1@80.30.233.198) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:08] <Jx8p> os X doesn't like when I set bs=4M, complains of 'illegal numeric value'
[13:08] <nid0> dont forget all the whizbang amazing new features linux, windows, and pc's in general have had for years
[13:08] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: put 4194304 then if it can't work out basic stuff like that
[13:08] <Jx8p> oh, it doesn't like 4M, 4m works
[13:09] <rpitin> Jx8p: if you need a static IP config for your wifi, I just put up my config here http://rpitin.tumblr.com
[13:09] <Triffid_Hunter> nid0: granted, plenty going the other way too
[13:10] <rpitin> There are a lot of blogs with a range of configs but thats the one that worked for me.
[13:10] * KindOne (~KindOne@colchester-lug/silly-fool/donut) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:11] <Jx8p> setting bs=4m has the progress indicator declaring only 7 minutes until it's written :)
[13:11] * Tenkawa (~Tenkawa@unaffiliated/tenkawa) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:11] <Tenkawa> well... so far so good on slackwarearm on the pi
[13:11] <rpitin> Jx8p: that's better.
[13:12] <Jx8p> a lesson learnt about that 'turbo' overclock
[13:13] <rpitin> Saint: Macs marketing strategy was to successfully make Joe average feel special and part of the technocratic elite (imaginary) by way of purchase choices.
[13:14] <Gadgetoid> Right I've pulled the lovely coil from the PCB, and the transistor next to it??? looks like the ground of the coil is connected to the middle of the transistor, the other two legs loop around through capacitor or some weirdness, and then magic happens
[13:14] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: fwiw, setting blocksize should have only the tiniest impact on performance. if it really makes that much difference, your OS's kernel is turning off write cacheing for that disk for some reason
[13:14] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, Heh... the primary is part of the oscillator.
[13:14] <rpitin> Saint: Their marketing is really very good.
[13:15] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I can't find a good schematic to tell me how on earth it all works
[13:15] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: I'd have a stern chat with it about that if I were you
[13:15] <Tenkawa> blocksize on what?
[13:15] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: if it does that when the disk is mounted, you'll have really slow access to all SD cards for all operations, not just dd
[13:16] <Triffid_Hunter> Tenkawa: Jx8p's OSX machine was writing to SD card in super slo-mo, apparently tweaking dd blocksize gives it the kick in the rear it needed
[13:16] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, if you remove the transformer - and connect the primary from +5v through the coil to the collector of a ulm2803 then you can control the frequency with the GPIO clock oscillator on the Pi ...
[13:16] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, or softTone :)
[13:16] <Tenkawa> yeah... i'm not suprised
[13:16] <Tenkawa> default dd is slower than molasses
[13:16] <Jx8p> we're talking 3 hours and 53 minutes of difference
[13:16] <Tenkawa> you always need to tweak bs=
[13:17] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: That would be cool!
[13:17] <Tenkawa> unless you have specifuc use case to not use it
[13:17] <Tenkawa> er specific
[13:17] <Gadgetoid> Doens't help that the tip of my soldering iron is corroded to the point of blackness, and it doesn't get hot
[13:18] <Tenkawa> Gadgetoid: ouch...
[13:18] <Gadgetoid> Must dig up my spare, going to solder some headers onto the transistor I cut from the PCB and try to re-use it for a fixed frequency
[13:18] <gordonDrogon> the bs= (or ibs=, obso=) in dd is often set to 4K, so it improves efficiency if you can make it bigger, as it will buffer more in memory.
[13:18] <Jx8p> woo, done
[13:18] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: It's got to be over 20 years old and it spend a lot of time in a loft of shed, so I'm not surprised
[13:18] <Triffid_Hunter> I thought default was 512b
[13:18] <Tenkawa> depends on build/os
[13:18] <Gadgetoid> Think it's probably about time I bought a good one, and a bench power supply
[13:18] <rpitin> Jx8p: that sounded easier than expected!
[13:18] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, er - my iron was over 35 years old when it finally expired - it was a quality one though :)
[13:19] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[13:19] <gordonDrogon> http://unicorn.drogon.net/weller.jpg
[13:19] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: Probably better cared for, too!
[13:19] <rpitin> 35 years is good value
[13:20] <Jx8p> now that that's done, time to set up the pi again
[13:20] <Triffid_Hunter> I have a $20 pencil iron that's 20 years old and still working
[13:20] * rpitin (~adam@ppp118-209-32-196.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[13:21] * rpitin (~adam@ppp118-209-32-196.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:21] <Jx8p> alright....this time I will only overclock it somewhat
[13:22] <rpitin> Jx8p: maybe a little bit less than last time1
[13:22] <gordonDrogon> Jx8p, I gave up on overclocking months back. not missed it.
[13:22] <gordonDrogon> right. buns to make!
[13:23] <rpitin> gordonDrogon: om nomnom. Id offer you a custard and raspberry tart, but i ate them all.
[13:23] * DenBeiren (~Denbeiren@91.86.34.167) has left #raspberrypi
[13:24] <Jx8p> i can't not overclock. I love OC'ing my graphics cards. Get some more litecoin mined
[13:24] <Jx8p> using a desk fan to keep it cool of course
[13:24] <rpitin> Jx8p: this looks like it may be useful to you http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=26633
[13:26] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[13:27] <rpitin> Yeah, some good OC discussions in that thread by the looks of it.
[13:28] <rpitin> Jx8p: you'll have your RPi looking like this little monster in no time http://hackadaycom.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/heat-sink-for-your-rpi-e1340725360902.jpg?w=470&h=264
[13:31] * Hans-Martin (~ignore@2001:4dd0:ff00:9100:ddca:4b02:4bcd:f269) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:35] * mike_t (~mike@109.169.175.98) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:37] * herdingcat (~huli@114.249.226.133) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:37] <cellardoor> Jx8p: I saw you mentioned Litecoins and looked them up, are they are seperate system to bitcoins, so you can't send from one system to the other? (i'm guessing so)
[13:39] <Jx8p> cellardoor, yep. you can always exchange them at btc-e or similar places, though
[13:40] * Datalink (~Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:40] <cellardoor> Jx8p: ah cool. Bit random, but can you explain a few things about Bitcoin for me that I can't get my head around. - If I have multiple computers how do I keep all my money 'in one place' or registered to me. and also with this mining.... free money?
[13:42] <Jx8p> your 'wallet' is just an abstraction, really what your wallet is, is just a private key that allows you to spend your bitcoins. so you can just dump your private key and import to another PC. as for mining -- at the moment, yeah, free money :) but you'll need specialist hardware for it soon, rather than just an array of overclocked Radeon 7970s
[13:42] <rpitin> cellardoor: use the same wallet between systems, mining is an exchange of processing power over time (and electricity) for bitcoin
[13:43] <rpitin> not free money!
[13:43] * rideh (~rideh@unaffiliated/rideh) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:43] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[13:43] <Hans-Martin> funny I was just following the #bitcoin channel and switched over here, and something just looked familiar...
[13:44] <rpitin> even if its not your processing power and electricity, its costing someone.
[13:44] * DenBeiren1 (~Denbeiren@91.86.43.53) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:45] <Jx8p> i've already paid off my 7970 from profits. i suppose it's free only relative to "I would be running these machines anyway". although profit? in my case, yes, and i pay a lot for electricity. i have about 2 months to go before my cards are all paid off
[13:45] <cellardoor> Jx8p: Thanks, think I am getting it a bit more now :) haha I have LiteCoin on my netbook at the moment so doubt I will get much from this Mining thing :P
[13:45] * Armand (~martin@cpc17-haye16-2-0-cust427.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:45] <cellardoor> rpitin: thanks for clearing that up too :)
[13:45] * netzvieh (~nerd@landhandel-marschall.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:46] <Armand> So... I bought my 60 USB ports last night.
[13:46] <rpitin> Jx8p: you're donating a % of your processing power, time and electricity in exchange for bitcoin.
[13:46] <rpitin> Jx8p: so not free!
[13:47] <Jx8p> yeah rpitin. i suppose then its a not a question of 'free', but rather, 'do i make a profit from it'
[13:47] <rpitin> Jx8p: Yeah, that's a return on investment.
[13:47] <rpitin> Sorry, my inner businessman is coming out.
[13:47] <rpitin> But its important to know, its still a system, just one of a different nature.
[13:48] <cellardoor> Jx8p: what's the difference between Solo Mining and Pool Mining?
[13:48] <Jx8p> well, so far my RoI is shaping up to be pretty good :) especially when i've got my mining rigs all headless and automated.
[13:48] <rpitin> cellardoor: Mining by yourself vs joining a grid/cloud
[13:49] * Kane (~Kane@251.40.197.77.rev.sfr.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:49] <Jx8p> cellardoor, in solo mining...solo mining is not really a good idea unless you have swathes of computing power. it has unpredictable returns
[13:49] * bortzmeyer (~stephane@2a01:e35:8bd9:8bb0:91f4:1622:9ab4:8385) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[13:49] <rpitin> Not sure of the difference in efficiency vs solo / grid
[13:49] <Kane> o/
[13:49] <rpitin> \0/
[13:50] <Jx8p> i run a pool which charges no fees, thus the pool is equally efficient as solo, but more predictable. payouts are still done per-block-found, but it's the whole pool's power finding them
[13:50] <cellardoor> Jx8p: well since I am a very mobile person with a netbook, I think Pool mining is the way to go... question is which pool to join as I see server and U/N P/W fields
[13:50] <rpitin> Jx8p: they may borrow some of your processing power for their own mining efforts.
[13:50] <cellardoor> This stuff is fascinating :)
[13:50] <rpitin> Not sure on that one, but its a hunch.
[13:51] <Jx8p> since you're here cellardoor i'm going to plug my pool :) http://213.246.120.215:9327/
[13:51] <Jx8p> you can visit that page to get pool stats, or if you want to connect, use that URL as server in the miner, username is your litecoin wallet address, p/w is whatever you want
[13:52] <Triffid_Hunter> cellardoor: last time I checked, bitcoin mining is unlikely to pay off the cost of equipment needed these days
[13:52] <rpitin> Just dont use the same password as your key
[13:52] <cellardoor> Jx8p: okay :)
[13:52] <cellardoor> Triffid_Hunter: Ah but I have SWATHES of computers... they just are not very powerful :P
[13:53] <cellardoor> Jx8p: not working :(
[13:53] <Jx8p> oh, what's it saying? :(
[13:53] <rpitin> cellardoor: you could donate some of that processing power to charity via the World Community Grid, it pays karma and good feelings instead of bitcoins
[13:53] <cellardoor> Jx8p: hromium could not load the web page because 213.246.120.215 took too long to respond
[13:53] * Playa4Life (~Playa4Lif@95.209.170.244.mobile.3.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:53] <cellardoor> rpitin: I already do BOINC for Rosetta@home and SETI@Home, as well as POGS Sky Mapper
[13:53] <Triffid_Hunter> cellardoor: unless you have high end graphics cards or fancy fpga it's unlikely to even pay the cost of electricity consumed
[13:54] <rpitin> cellardoor: ah good :)
[13:54] <Jx8p> cellardoor, did you remember the :9327 at the end?
[13:54] <Jx8p> i use a weird port for various reasons
[13:54] <cellardoor> Triffid_Hunter: not my electricity :P
[13:54] <cellardoor> Jx8p: I silly
[13:54] * bortzmeyer (~stephane@2a01:e35:8bd9:8bb0:91f4:1622:9ab4:8385) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:54] <Jx8p> if you have free electricity, spare machines, and don't mind the heat? mining is the way to go
[13:55] <Jx8p> i wish we had cheaper electricity here. considering we have to get wind-mills all over the landscape
[13:55] <rpitin> I hope you boys are offsetting your CO2 omissions!
[13:55] <Armand> I just hope my employer doesn't object to a max draw of around 700W+ @ 30A :P
[13:55] <Armand> I'm sure it won't be a problem in a DC. ;)
[13:56] <cellardoor> Jx8p: is the LiteCoin pool address the server IP, or with the Port on the end too?
[13:56] <Jx8p> litecoin pool address is http://213.246.120.215:9327/
[13:56] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:56] <Jx8p> just copy-paste the url in, no need to reduce to IP address:port format
[13:56] <rpitin> I wonder what the conversion rate between power consumption of mining bitcoin vs the cost of planing a tree that produces an equal carbon offset
[13:57] <Jx8p> windmills provide all the electricity here :) i think
[13:57] <rpitin> neatherlands?
[13:57] <Jx8p> scotland
[13:57] <rpitin> Ah nice
[13:57] <Jx8p> the highlands, specifically
[13:57] <rpitin> So cheaper on cooling so thats good
[13:58] <rpitin> windmills eat birds, but last time i checked nature was pretty ok with that
[13:59] <cellardoor> Jx8p: I get "Miner failed to start. Make sure you have the minerd executable in teh same directory as LiteCoin-QT"
[13:59] <Armand> rpitin, kamikaze pidgeons.. :P
[13:59] <Jx8p> hmm cellardoor, what are you running?
[13:59] <rpitin> Armand: hehe, and cellardoor under it with a firepit and roasting fork
[14:00] <Armand> Nice... lol
[14:00] <cellardoor> Jx8p: Lubuntu Linux.
[14:03] <Jx8p> hmm. are you using Pooler's CPUminer?
[14:03] <rpitin> Lubuntu can be a bit fiddely, but you can usually get it to run most things.
[14:03] <cellardoor> Jx8p: Probably not, as I don't know what that is
[14:04] <Jx8p> did you just apt-get install litecoin-qt ?
[14:04] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccy_RegeaneWolf
[14:05] <cellardoor> Jx8p: no I downloaded the .tar.gz off the website. Didn't know there was an apt version.
[14:05] <cellardoor> Didn't look first though to be fair
[14:06] <Jx8p> also, would it be perhaps a viable solution to the Pi overclock SD card corruption issues if I moved the ext2 (3/4?) linux / partition to a USB drive, and just leave /boot on the sdcard? cellardoor, try grabbing pooler-cpuminer
[14:07] <cellardoor> Jx8p: is this in the repository, or do I download pooler-cpuminer from the web?
[14:07] <Jx8p> cellardoor, you'll have to download it and possibly compile it
[14:07] <cellardoor> Jx8p: yeah I will compile it
[14:08] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[14:11] <cellardoor> Jx8p: I put the binary in the right place but still erroring :S
[14:12] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-203-3.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[14:14] * SgrA (~sgra@unaffiliated/sgra) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[14:15] * excalibas (~x@a81-84-11-177.cpe.netcabo.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:16] <gordonDrogon> right. dought is rising. what now ...
[14:16] <excalibas> Anyone using moc player? I get an error
[14:17] <excalibas> ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:1401:(_snd_pcm_hw_open) Invalid value for card
[14:17] <Jx8p> cellardoor, same error?
[14:24] <Jx8p> rpitin, you seem knowledgeable, so i will ask you :) how feasible is it for I to put my linux root partition on a USB HD (also making a swap partition as well)?
[14:26] * dreamon_ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[14:27] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-203-3.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:27] * SgrA (~sgra@unaffiliated/sgra) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:31] * JanB5 (~jgander@83-93-101-44-dynamic.dk.customer.tdc.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:31] <Gadgetoid> Well the limited and probably entirely inappropriate set of components I have access to are not resulting in AC
[14:31] * ChampS666 (~ChampS@p54B4D7EA.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[14:31] <Triffid_Hunter> Jx8p: easy enough, just alter the cmdline.txt on your sd card to point at the relevant disk
[14:34] <cellardoor> Jx8p: same error
[14:37] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:37] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Client Quit)
[14:38] <Jx8p> just gonna cp -a -x / over to /media/longuuid, change root in cmdline.txt, and hopefully...that works like magick
[14:38] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:38] <Jx8p> then i'm free to OC without much risk of SD card corruption afaik. cellardoor, letme research that error for a bit
[14:39] <cellardoor> Jx8p: thanks, :)
[14:40] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:40] * int3nz0r (~int3nz0r@86.86.66.141) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[14:40] <Jx8p> you've got litecoin-qt installed right?
[14:40] * Tachyon` (~quassel@cpc1-york2-0-0-cust192.7-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:40] * dc5ala (~dc5ala@stgt-4d039fd8.pool.mediaWays.net) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[14:41] <cellardoor> Jx8p: I'm running it as a binary from the download off the litecoin website
[14:41] <Jx8p> is the minerd executables and libraries in the same place as it?
[14:41] <cellardoor> Jx8p: the download only gave me a minerd executable, but yes it is right next to the litecoin-qt executable
[14:43] * int3nz0r (~int3nz0r@86.86.66.141) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:45] <cellardoor> Jx8p: I can run the minerd executable with parameters and that works fine! Litecoin-QT is just being stupid >.>
[14:49] <kkit> are you seriously using the pi for mining?
[14:50] <cellardoor> kkit: no my Laptop and his pool thing. Only to try it out, never used bitcoin before
[14:50] <kkit> ah, because i was about to suggest that litecoin-qt wasn't the one being stupid in this situation :)
[14:52] * Hydra_ (~Hydra@AGrenoble-652-1-398-145.w82-122.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:53] <cellardoor> kkit: I have a desktop back him with a Radeon 5570 card in it. That's what I will use for this mining stuff if I can actually get it to work/interested :)
[14:53] <kkit> the pi would be terrible at mining bitcoins
[14:54] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[14:55] * Hydra (~Hydra@AGrenoble-652-1-427-32.w90-42.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[14:55] * Hydra_ is now known as Hydra
[14:56] <Jerub> for comparison, 1 minute of bitcoin mining on a normal desktop (100Mh/s) vs. a raspberry pi (0.2Mh/s) means that <3 minutes of mining on a desktop is 24 hours of mining
[14:58] <featheredfrog> Having trouble getting a wifi dongle to do anything. searching for insights
[14:58] <featheredfrog> lsusb: Bus 001 Device 004: ID 148f:5370 Ralink Technology, Corp. RT5370 Wireless Adapter
[14:58] <featheredfrog> lsmod: rt2800usb 14940 0
[14:58] <featheredfrog> rt2800lib 55351 1 rt2800usb
[14:59] <featheredfrog> From Syslog:
[14:59] <featheredfrog> Mar 30 09:08:48 raspberrypi kernel: [ 6.418535] Registered led device: rt2800usb-phy0::assoc
[14:59] <featheredfrog> Mar 30 09:08:48 raspberrypi kernel: [ 6.418649] Registered led device: rt2800usb-phy0::quality
[14:59] <featheredfrog> Mar 30 09:08:48 raspberrypi kernel: [ 6.418924] usbcore: registered new interface driver rt2800usb
[14:59] <featheredfrog> so, what am I doing wrong, ifyouplease?
[15:00] * echelon_ (~echelon@gateway/tor-sasl/harel) has left #raspberrypi
[15:01] <Armand> Wrong 1: Flooding channel.
[15:01] <Armand> ?_?
[15:01] <featheredfrog> flooding? sorry. a better way to "post" relevant information?
[15:02] <Armand> Yes, pastebin
[15:02] <adeus> and that spam only proves that it detected your dongle
[15:03] <featheredfrog> [smacks forehead] doh!
[15:03] <Armand> ^_^
[15:04] <featheredfrog> what other information could be useful. how about the fact that the dongle links up just fine when plugged into the desktop under the pi?
[15:04] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:04] <Jerub> featheredfrog: okay, so how are you configuring the wireless device?
[15:04] <featheredfrog> it shows up in ifconfig (be glad i didn't spam THAT)
[15:04] * Mr_P (~gerhard@chello080108255018.3.14.vie.surfer.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[15:04] <featheredfrog> wpa.config?
[15:05] * WorkGroup (~workgroup@unaffiliated/workgroup) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:06] <adeus> what do you want it to do?
[15:06] <adeus> connect to some wlan?
[15:06] <adeus> with wpa?
[15:06] <featheredfrog> yep. a wap not ten feet away. wpa.config has ssid, key and protocol
[15:06] <featheredfrog> maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree.
[15:07] <AdvancedNewbie> You want to change the wpa_supplicant.conf
[15:07] <Jerub> or jump into X and use NetworkManager
[15:07] <AdvancedNewbie> /etc/wap_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf I believe
[15:07] <AdvancedNewbie> wpa***
[15:08] <AdvancedNewbie> Here's some config examples
[15:08] <AdvancedNewbie> http://elinux.org/images/4/4b/Raspberry_Pi_wireless_adapter.pdf
[15:09] <AdvancedNewbie> If you use the wpa_client app it will config these files for you.
[15:10] <featheredfrog> wpa, not wap. feh!
[15:10] <AdvancedNewbie> Here's a script I use: http://pastebin.com/vBwWFt07
[15:10] <AdvancedNewbie> I add this script as a cronjob using crontab -e
[15:11] <AdvancedNewbie> */2 * * * * /home/pi/scripts/test_network.sh for example...
[15:11] <AdvancedNewbie> This would check every two minutes and reconnect if wlan is lost.
[15:11] <AdvancedNewbie> wlan0, I should say
[15:12] * snowrichard (~Richard@206.255.128.20) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:13] <snowrichard> http://www.snowgames.in
[15:13] <featheredfrog> it's seeking to DHCPDISCOVER, and getting nowhere. :(
[15:13] * shoerain (~mortimer@li557-200.members.linode.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:14] <AdvancedNewbie> try dhclient wlan0
[15:14] <AdvancedNewbie> You might need to setup as manual ip in wpa_supplicant.conf first
[15:15] <featheredfrog> you mean static?
[15:15] <AdvancedNewbie> Yeah.
[15:15] <featheredfrog> i can do that
[15:15] <AdvancedNewbie> Then wpa_supplicant should skip "DHCPDISCOVER"
[15:15] <AdvancedNewbie> then you can dhclient if you want
[15:15] <AdvancedNewbie> Or just remain using the static ip as you've setup.
[15:18] <featheredfrog> thanks for the insights. sorry about the spam.
[15:19] <AdvancedNewbie> Hope that helped... heh
[15:20] <featheredfrog> why can't this be easy like rh-family distros ?
[15:20] <snowrichard> i just plug eth0 into my router, it works
[15:22] * zensiert_ (~Freddy@dslb-188-105-105-009.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:22] <zensiert_> hello
[15:22] <AdvancedNewbie> I automatically connect to a wpa wireless network and reconnect if connection is lost. It works.
[15:22] <AdvancedNewbie> :P
[15:23] <featheredfrog> yeah, but this is going to be a remote weather station, talking to my WAP from a pole outside.
[15:23] * Henesy (~h3n3sy@adsl-75-23-118-193.dsl.peoril.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:23] <zensiert_> can anyone please tell me how i mount my usb hdd? i'm a total newbie to linux systems
[15:23] * raspy_freenode (~raspy_fre@c-75-68-199-187.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:23] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD29764.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[15:23] * snowrichard (~Richard@206.255.128.20) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[15:24] <featheredfrog> solar cells and everything!
[15:24] * Jx8p (~jx8p@213.246.120.215) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[15:24] <featheredfrog> thanks, all, gtg.
[15:24] <AdvancedNewbie> Later.
[15:24] * featheredfrog (~mhofer@cpe-67-250-125-135.hvc.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[15:25] <Henesy> zensiert_, "sudo mount /dev/youhdd/ /directory/to/mount/to"
[15:25] <AdvancedNewbie> Try 'df' to list devices
[15:26] <zensiert_> ah ok, "df" helps
[15:27] <zensiert_> but how can i create a mount point?
[15:27] <AdvancedNewbie> mkdir /directory/to/mount/to
[15:27] <zensiert_> mkdir = make directory?
[15:27] <AdvancedNewbie> Yup
[15:27] <AdvancedNewbie> Make it, then mount to it
[15:28] <zensiert_> i'm german and have slightly trouble with english shortcuts
[15:28] <Henesy> "sudo fdisk -l" also works for listing filesystems/drives
[15:28] <AdvancedNewbie> You probably want to put this in the media or mount directories.
[15:29] <zensiert_> where's thr difference?
[15:29] <zensiert_> or why can't be both in one directory
[15:29] <zensiert_> ?
[15:29] <AdvancedNewbie> media is more for removable devices
[15:29] <AdvancedNewbie> Or sometimes removable media such as cd's
[15:30] <Henesy> /mnt is for temporary stuff whereas /media is more for devices or more permanent things
[15:30] <zensiert_> ok
[15:30] <zensiert_> so my usb hard disk is a "media"?
[15:30] <Henesy> yes
[15:30] * sleetdrop (~sleetdrop@221.221.149.134) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:30] <zensiert_> ok
[15:30] <Henesy> so
[15:31] <Henesy> example:
[15:31] <Henesy> "sudo mkdir /media/DISKNAME && sudo mount /dev/YOURDEVICE /media/DISKNAME"
[15:31] <WorkGroup> Is here an German Channel to?
[15:32] <zensiert_> don't know, sry
[15:32] <zensiert_> found your channel athttp://elinux.org/ELinuxWiki:Irc
[15:33] <zensiert_> what do the to & stand for?
[15:33] <AdvancedNewbie> It's so you can pass two commands at once.
[15:33] <AdvancedNewbie> Well, one after another.
[15:34] <zensiert_> you mean first the mkdir-order and then the mount-order?
[15:34] <zensiert_> command*
[15:34] <AdvancedNewbie> Yeah, left to right
[15:34] <zensiert_> ok
[15:34] <WorkGroup> where can i found testing scripts
[15:36] <AdvancedNewbie> For what?
[15:36] <WorkGroup> network
[15:36] <WorkGroup> and temp
[15:36] <AdvancedNewbie> ...
[15:37] <zensiert_> btw: if you want or it's channel policy we can talk in a qry
[15:37] <zensiert_> don't want to bother anyone
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[15:40] <zensiert_> ok... i figure "mmcblk0" is my flash-card and "sda" is my usb hard drive, right? so i sould type "sudo mkdir /media/sda && sudo mount /dev/mmcblk0 /media/sda", right?
[15:40] * ParkerR (ParkerR@unaffiliated/parkerr) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[15:40] <Henesy> hm
[15:40] <Henesy> not exactly
[15:41] <Henesy> you could
[15:41] <Henesy> is there a specific name you want for your drive in media?
[15:41] <Henesy> I'll give an example regardless from my experience
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[15:42] <Henesy> mmcblk0p2 is my root partition on my pi, I don't need to mount anything there, as it is already done on startup
[15:42] <zensiert_> how about "USB_harddisk"?
[15:42] <Henesy> so i want to mount my flashdrive
[15:42] <Henesy> sure
[15:42] <zensiert_> ok
[15:42] <zensiert_> wait
[15:43] <zensiert_> mmcblk0p2 is already on the pi?
[15:43] <zensiert_> like hardware-based?
[15:43] <Henesy> so what i personally did: "sudo mkdir /media/BACKUPS && sudo mount /dev/sda1 /media/BACKUPS"
[15:43] <Henesy> mmcblk0 is the SD card, which is where the OS is on the pi
[15:43] <Henesy> if your pi is booting into say, raspbian
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[15:43] <Henesy> then it is using the SD card right?
[15:44] <zensiert_> ... you actually created a directory called "BACKUPS"... ok
[15:44] <zensiert_> yep
[15:44] <Henesy> when raspbian boots in a typical setup I believe, mmcblk0p1 is the boot partition and mmcblk0p2 is the root filesystem
[15:45] * LostInInaka (~Unknown@unaffiliated/lostininaka) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:45] <Henesy> and if you have a running system on the pi, then neither of those matter on it, because the pi is already using them
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[15:45] <zensiert_> didn't even know these exist...
[15:45] <zensiert_> ok, got it
[15:45] <Henesy> here's some food for thought
[15:46] <zensiert_> so all i need now is to create a mount point for my drive and mount it?
[15:46] <AdvancedNewbie> Yeah, "mmcblk0p{partition number}"
[15:46] <zensiert_> feed me...
[15:47] <Henesy> on your main computer the first hard drive will typically be called /dev/sda. Since the SD card isn't a scsi drive/hard drive it needs a different name. mmcblk0 is the perfect candidate for whatever reason (someone else could exlain that) and so the SD card is called mmcbl0 instead of /dev/sda. If on your main computer right now you decided to do "fdisk -l" you would more than likely get a /dev/sda or /dev/hda list of resu
[15:47] <Henesy> lts
[15:48] * cccy_RegeaneWolf is now known as cccyRegeaneWolfe
[15:49] <zensiert_> i undestand
[15:49] <Henesy> lovely
[15:49] <zensiert_> although i'm only windows-user... sry
[15:49] <zensiert_> but i'm trying!
[15:49] <Henesy> very good!
[15:49] <zensiert_> thx
[15:49] <Henesy> even in windows
[15:50] <Henesy> think of it like C:\ is /dev/sda1 and D:\ is /dev/sda2
[15:50] <zensiert_> actually i'm typing these commands (and fails) here via putty in w7...
[15:50] <zensiert_> yep
[15:50] * redarrow (~quassel@unaffiliated/redarrow) Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[15:53] * IT_Fone (~ult_ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:53] <IT_Fone> Hello
[15:53] <Henesy> Hallo
[15:53] <AdvancedNewbie> try 'ls /dev/sd*'
[15:54] <zensiert_> it tells mi: /dev/sda /dev/sda1
[15:54] <zensiert_> so what does it tell me...?
[15:54] <ShadowJK> mmc = multimediacard, and old standard for memory cards, same shape as SD. SD is kinda a side development that drowned out the original mmc, so the name stuck.. and blk = block, a block device that apps and filesystems can treat as a harddrive
[15:54] <AdvancedNewbie> That you can mount using /dev/sda1
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[15:55] <zensiert_> which one is my usb hdd?
[15:55] <AdvancedNewbie> They both are.
[15:55] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"])
[15:55] <AdvancedNewbie> The sda is the device and the sda1 is the first partition on that device.
[15:55] <AdvancedNewbie> I believe.
[15:55] <Hans-Martin> yup
[15:55] <zensiert_> now you got me... cunfused
[15:55] <AdvancedNewbie> You want to mount sda1
[15:55] <Hans-Martin> sda includes the partition table
[15:56] <Hans-Martin> sda1 is the first partition
[15:56] <AdvancedNewbie> Right.
[15:56] <Henesy> /dev/sda encompasses the whole family, /dev/sda1 and /dev/sda2 etc are the annoying kids
[15:56] <AdvancedNewbie> sda contains information on how many partitions there are, etc.
[15:56] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Fone
[15:56] <AdvancedNewbie> :)
[15:56] <zensiert_> ok now i think i will remember it... thx
[15:56] <zensiert_> family... lol
[15:57] <AdvancedNewbie> So Henesy's example should work for you ( "sudo mkdir /media/BACKUPS && sudo mount /dev/sda1 /media/BACKUPS" )
[15:57] <AdvancedNewbie> Then just cd /media/BACKUPS
[15:57] <AdvancedNewbie> And you should see the contents of your USB HDD
[15:58] <Henesy> ^yup
[15:58] <AdvancedNewbie> Remember: linux is case-sensitive
[15:58] <Henesy> ^windows is NOT
[15:58] <buzzsaw> and thats *one* of its problems :-)
[15:59] <AdvancedNewbie> Windows, yep.
[15:59] <AdvancedNewbie> ;)
[15:59] <zensiert_> what das case-sensitive mean?
[15:59] <AdvancedNewbie> it means cd /media/BaCkUpS will not work.
[15:59] <Henesy> this leads to complication if you have a dosemu running and you try to cd to a directory that has another directory in the same spot and one is named Folder and the other is named folder. dosemu would only use one, and that would be the one favouring caps i believe
[15:59] <zensiert_> ok
[16:00] <Henesy> zensiert_, learn to use the [tab] button
[16:00] <Henesy> it predicts what you might want to type
[16:00] <Henesy> whenever you might use a * wildcard, try pressing tab
[16:00] <AdvancedNewbie> ^Just type the first few letters and hit [tab]
[16:00] <zensiert_> ok
[16:00] <Henesy> ex: "cd /media/BA[press tab]"
[16:00] * njection (~njection@c-67-189-126-219.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:00] <zensiert_> as i said, noob...
[16:00] <Henesy> it's fine
[16:00] <Henesy> :)
[16:01] <buzzsaw> case sensative means that /aa /aA /Aa/ /AA are all different
[16:01] <AdvancedNewbie> You'll be pro in no time ;)
[16:01] <IT_Fone> Noob is just the first step on the journey to geek
[16:01] <zensiert_> i hope so
[16:01] <AdvancedNewbie> Atleast you're not trolling
[16:01] <AdvancedNewbie> You seem to have a grasp of what's going on
[16:01] <mpmc> We're all doomed! DOOMED! :p
[16:01] <IT_Fone> We don't tolerate trolling here
[16:01] <zensiert_> i'm trying to learn by using the elinux-wikis
[16:01] <AdvancedNewbie> And are asking the appropriate questions.
[16:02] <AdvancedNewbie> Good, good.
[16:02] <zensiert_> but it's kinda hard for me, cause i can't read english propperly
[16:02] * kvarley (~kevin@unaffiliated/kvarley) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:02] <kvarley> Best way to teach young kids web programming? I was thinking HTML -> CSS -> JavaScript then if they're still interested PHP
[16:02] <zensiert_> ok i promise i won't troll, as long as you explain what that means...
[16:03] <AdvancedNewbie> Visual Basic, I'd say
[16:03] <mpmc> Lol, VB.net :p
[16:03] <AdvancedNewbie> Ahh, *web*
[16:03] <AdvancedNewbie> nvm
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[16:03] <kvarley> AdvancedNewbie: I'm not trying to screw the kid up for life
[16:03] <buzzsaw> html is not programming :-)
[16:03] <AdvancedNewbie> lmao
[16:03] <kvarley> buzzsaw: I never said it was
[16:03] <buzzsaw> get them started in something thats good :-)
[16:03] <kvarley> I picked it just because it's easy
[16:03] <AdvancedNewbie> I started with VB. Now I know C++, C#, python, java, PHP, etc.. etc...
[16:03] <zensiert_> gsht hey... what's trolling?
[16:03] <kvarley> And it moves on nicely to JS and PHP and stuff
[16:04] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) Quit (Client Quit)
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[16:04] <buzzsaw> zensiert_: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)
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[16:04] <kvarley> Question is should I be teaching PHP or Python? Python seems to be more future proof
[16:04] <mpmc> I've caught myself writing JS in a PHP script quite a few times :p
[16:04] <zensiert_> ah ok
[16:05] <zensiert_> gnaa, wouldn't do that, it's not polite and stuff
[16:05] <AdvancedNewbie> mpmc, yes - very useful for OnClick=javascript_functions()
[16:05] <AdvancedNewbie> Don't forget the quotes... lol
[16:05] <mpmc> :p
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[16:06] <AdvancedNewbie> I'd say python, because there's no server having to run in the background...
[16:06] <AdvancedNewbie> You have to think how PHP works while programming
[16:07] <AdvancedNewbie> Python is more interpretive.
[16:07] <Henesy> Python all the way
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[16:07] <buzzsaw> one is not more than the other :-)
[16:07] <seba-> huh
[16:07] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:07] <seba-> php5-cli
[16:07] <seba-> lol
[16:07] <AdvancedNewbie> Plus you don't really need to define what variable types
[16:07] <AdvancedNewbie> the*
[16:08] <AdvancedNewbie> Which is good / bad.... You get into C++, you'll be lost
[16:08] <kvarley> Henesy: How do I explain indentation though, that's my concern. I get it but not sure how to explain it
[16:08] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:08] <AdvancedNewbie> Like a folder tree
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[16:09] <AdvancedNewbie> VB was good for me because it programs for you ;)
[16:09] <AdvancedNewbie> Suggestions and pop-downs are a big help...
[16:09] <Jx8p> Visual Basic was a great language. It made programming fun1
[16:10] <zensiert_> hey it works!
[16:10] <AdvancedNewbie> I could write a simple program with an interface and drag and drop all day long, thinking I was 'programming'
[16:10] <AdvancedNewbie> But atleast it got me interested and prepared to learn something more powerful.
[16:11] <Henesy> to show hierarchy?
[16:11] <Henesy> like AdvancedNewbie said
[16:11] <Henesy> a tree
[16:11] <Henesy> Order of operations?
[16:11] <Henesy> in lou of parentheses or in parallel with them you have indentation?
[16:12] <Grievre> "in lieu"
[16:12] <Henesy> Grievre, thanks, I figured it was wrong
[16:12] <zensiert_> ok last question (i hope): do you have some sites for me to get startet with raspberry pi... commands, advices ect?
[16:12] * Playa4Life (~Playa4Lif@95.209.170.244.mobile.3.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:12] <Henesy> what distro are you using?
[16:12] <Henesy> raspbian?
[16:13] <zensiert_> yep
[16:13] <Henesy> Then you can generally look up Debian stuff for it
[16:13] <zensiert_> wheezy
[16:13] <Henesy> "almost" anything Debian is the same
[16:13] <Henesy> ja
[16:13] <Henesy> debian wheezy is unstable branch I believe
[16:13] <zensiert_> ja? Henesy are you german or speak german?
[16:14] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[16:14] <zensiert_> well i picket one a friend of mine adviced to me...
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[16:14] <buzzsaw> yeah wheezy is unstable...
[16:14] <zensiert_> and that was wheezy
[16:14] <buzzsaw> zensiert_: one of the most important and most useful command in *nix is man
[16:14] <zensiert_> ok... well i think i'll see where it takes me
[16:14] <zensiert_> *nix = ?
[16:15] <Henesy> Ich spreche Deutsch nicht so gut :) . Ich wohne im Deutschland in meiner Jugendzeit
[16:15] <buzzsaw> linux, unix, bsd
[16:15] <buzzsaw> go to your cli real quick and type man man
[16:15] <zensiert_> ah ok :-)
[16:15] * violet-rpi_ (~quassel@2001:5c0:1000:b::aa5b) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:16] <buzzsaw> at the top of the man page is the name of the command (short idea of what it does) then you have synopsis (ways of using it)
[16:16] <Henesy> Ich bin in eine Deutsche Klasse jetzt.
[16:16] <zensiert_> i ust typed "man" 1x and got a flood
[16:16] <Henesy> you'll get lots of floods
[16:16] <zensiert_> so thanks, i wont type it twice Oo
[16:16] <Henesy> man pages are usually very large
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[16:16] <buzzsaw> description (in depth what the command does)
[16:16] <Henesy> "man tar" is a particularly fun one
[16:17] <buzzsaw> just loo through it
[16:17] <zensiert_> loo = ?
[16:17] <zensiert_> look... sry
[16:17] <buzzsaw> any time you have a question on how to use a command READ the man page
[16:17] <Henesy> if you don't need the long explanation "command --help" works too
[16:17] <Henesy> for a shorter answer
[16:17] <Henesy> "ls --help"
[16:17] <buzzsaw> Henesy: let him learn man first ;-)
[16:17] <Henesy> fo example
[16:17] <Henesy> buzzsaw, fine :P
[16:17] <zensiert_> Henesy: well don't stop speaking/writing it, languages depend on practising
[16:18] * violet-rpi (~quassel@laptoptina.broker.freenet6.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:18] <buzzsaw> because if your going to teach him ls --help you need to explain pipes and less :-)
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[16:19] <zensiert_> err yes, little steps please
[16:19] <Henesy> zensiert_, I try, aren't a lot of people where I live in the states that speak German (sadly) :\
[16:19] <zensiert_> well i you want we can ... don't know... email or chat here or something
[16:19] <Henesy> it's fine, I'll manage :)
[16:19] <zensiert_> ok
[16:20] <zensiert_> anyways, i've got to go
[16:20] <Henesy> Tsch?s!
[16:20] <zensiert_> thank you all :-) maybe i'll pop in sometimes if i... when i get stuck again
[16:21] <zensiert_> Henesy: with 2 "s"
[16:21] <Henesy> zensiert_, danke
[16:21] <buzzsaw> zensiert_: like I said :-) man pages
[16:21] <buzzsaw> that way if you dont hae access to the internet you can always get help
[16:21] <zensiert_> man, man, man, i'll keep on to it
[16:21] <buzzsaw> btw man stands for manual ;-)
[16:21] <zensiert_> ok, thanks and bye
[16:21] <buzzsaw> man woman wont work...
[16:22] <Henesy> buzzsaw, hehehe
[16:22] * violet-rpi (~quassel@laptoptina.broker.freenet6.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:22] <zensiert_> yeah i figured that one out myself :-)
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[17:03] <excalibas> how can I make alsa work?
[17:03] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:05] <gordonDrogon> I wrote man once.
[17:05] * mentar (~quassel@host109-157-17-52.range109-157.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:06] <gordonDrogon> an intersting project. Write man. To do that you need termcap. Write termcap. To format man pages you need roff. Write roff.
[17:06] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:06] <gordonDrogon> This was for a new Unixy operating system some 24 years ago. What fun.
[17:07] * scorphus (~scorphus@CAcert/User/scorphus) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:07] <gordonDrogon> decided after that that that sort of programming where you just manipulate text didn't really excite me...
[17:08] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:08] <ReggieUK> not a gui man then?
[17:09] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[17:14] <Blueness|> that sounds daunting to do stuff from scratch like that
[17:19] <ReggieUK> I guess it is and it isn't :)
[17:20] * kvarley (~kevin@unaffiliated/kvarley) has left #raspberrypi
[17:20] <ReggieUK> 24 years ago, unixy stuff wouldn't have been anywhere near as complicated or as sprawling and in general, you would break stuff down into smaller easier to manage units
[17:20] <ReggieUK> he would have had to use things like books to refer to as well
[17:21] <buzzsaw> the first computer I ran linux on was a 333mhz with 32mb ram and a 4gig hd (I know big for some) but that is less than what the pi is :-)
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[17:24] <Armand> Need to design more circuit boards. :/
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[17:28] * Gadgetoid is still attempting to generate AC
[17:29] * Gadgetoid discovered his h-bridge works perfectly, and wonders if it can switch at 1000hz
[17:29] <Blueness|> is that for your electroluminescent wire?
[17:29] <Gadgetoid> Blueness|: Yep!
[17:29] <Blueness|> neat
[17:29] <Gadgetoid> I wanted to switch independent channels on and off from the Pi, but I'm going to have to buy some parts for that
[17:30] <Gadgetoid> I totally destroyed a sound activated portable driver
[17:30] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[17:30] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:30] <Gadgetoid> Going to send photos to the kind guy who sent it to me :D
[17:31] <Gadgetoid> I'm also using my own website to reference the Pi's pins!
[17:31] <Gadgetoid> http://pi.gadgetoid.com/pinout does anyone think it's not entirely obvious where Pin 1 actually is?
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[17:31] <AdvancedNewbie> 3V3
[17:31] <kvarley> Has anybody got the Firefox Sync server running on their Pi ?
[17:32] <AdvancedNewbie> It's silk-screened on the Raspberry Pi board as well
[17:33] <Gadgetoid> AdvancedNewbie: Good point, I couldn't see it! my Pi is in an awkward position
[17:33] * DenBeiren1 (~Denbeiren@91.86.43.53) has left #raspberrypi
[17:33] <Gadgetoid> Need to add a note for that on my pinout site then
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[17:34] <AdvancedNewbie> Yeah, still not entirely obvious... But another clue is the square pin (on that image)
[17:34] <AdvancedNewbie> I prefer this one http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/image/data/tutorial/raspberry-pi/gpio-pinout.jpg
[17:34] <kvarley> Is it possible to run a Raspberry Pi image on my PC, make changes then run it on my Pi?
[17:34] <Gadgetoid> Mine's not an image, it's interactive
[17:34] <AdvancedNewbie> It's compiled for an arm processor.
[17:35] <AdvancedNewbie> You'll need a VM
[17:35] <eggy> I seem to always have currption issues after running rpi-config; is this related to overclocking?
[17:35] <kvarley> AdvancedNewbie: qemu will work?
[17:36] <AdvancedNewbie> http://nathancampos.me/post/16661817229/setting-up-a-vm-for-raspberry-pi-development
[17:36] <AdvancedNewbie> Ooooh
[17:36] <AdvancedNewbie> Bad link
[17:37] <AdvancedNewbie> http://xecdesign.com/qemu-emulating-raspberry-pi-the-easy-way/
[17:38] * Syliss (~Home@adsl-108-198-103-98.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:39] <Gadgetoid> Hmmm, nothing happening, I wonder why
[17:39] <Jx8p> the bess way is just to use the pi
[17:40] <AdvancedNewbie> Yup, then you know it works.
[17:40] <AdvancedNewbie> I just ftp files over and run them in ssh
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[17:55] <buzzsaw> AdvancedNewbie: you ghould get out of the habbit of using ftp...
[17:56] <buzzsaw> if you need to send files use scp
[17:56] <AdvancedNewbie> I know.
[17:56] <AdvancedNewbie> Just for development anyways
[17:56] <buzzsaw> ftp leaves your username and password in the open :-)
[17:56] <bact> I just use sftp
[17:56] <buzzsaw> bah to much work...
[17:56] <AdvancedNewbie> I know. Using default username/pass anyways - like I said using for dev
[17:56] <buzzsaw> scp :-)
[17:57] <bact> sftp is zero work at all if ssh works
[17:57] <buzzsaw> AdvancedNewbie: pratice good habbits :-)
[17:57] <AdvancedNewbie> I have to make images of my sd and post and I don't want anything but default username/passwords :P
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[17:57] <AdvancedNewbie> So I'm using the best practice for what I'm doing :P
[17:58] <Gadgetoid> drat!
[17:58] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-203-3.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[18:00] <gordonDrogon> get away from your computer and try something different: https://projects.drogon.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/hotxbuns.jpg
[18:00] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[18:01] <AdvancedNewbie> I'll just use my reflow oven ;)
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[18:01] <gordonDrogon> 200C for 25 minutes :)
[18:01] <AdvancedNewbie> Mmm... Lead biscuits
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[18:02] <AdvancedNewbie> Gotta go though guys, ttyl
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[18:06] <Gadgetoid> Transistors hate me!
[18:06] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: Those look amazing
[18:06] <Gadgetoid> Better than my dratting h-bridge which refuses to be turned on by my Pi
[18:07] <gordonDrogon> why the H bridge for the transformer?
[18:07] <gordonDrogon> if you swap the polarities dynamically, you'll effectiely double the voltage and get 200vac out rather than 100vac ;-)
[18:08] <gordonDrogon> I have a plan to use the 2 relays and 2 other uln outputs on the PiFace to do motor forwards/reverse & speed control...
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[18:08] <Gadgetoid> I have nothing else handy to generate A/C, so it's worth a punt!
[18:08] <gordonDrogon> not even a uln2003?
[18:08] <Gadgetoid> just can't seem to switch the blasted thing, the transistors clearly need more currant than the Pi can supply
[18:09] <Gadgetoid> Might have a uln2003 somewhere, but that's just a transistor array?
[18:09] <seba-> Gadgetoid, what do you want to do?
[18:09] <gordonDrogon> yes. that's all you need - just +5v -> coil -> driver -> 0v
[18:09] <gordonDrogon> and toggle the input at a set frequency.
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[18:09] <gordonDrogon> or +12v input - whatever the original used.
[18:10] <Gadgetoid> It's something odd, like 6v
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[18:10] <gordonDrogon> stick 5v in - it'll give something.
[18:10] * herdingcat (~huli@114.249.226.133) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:10] <Gadgetoid> seba-: I'm trying to generate AC and step it up to 100V to drive some EL wire
[18:10] <Gadgetoid> I have a coil with the right ratio, presumably, to convert 6v to 100v
[18:10] <gordonDrogon> parallel up a few of them if you want more current.
[18:11] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I'll have to fish out a uln2003 then
[18:11] <seba-> Gadgetoid, why don't you generate directly 100 V
[18:11] <pksato> EL wire?
[18:11] <Gadgetoid> Still not sure how to make it work, but can only experiment!
[18:11] <seba-> without the transformer
[18:11] <seba-> :)
[18:11] <gordonDrogon> I suspect the original drove it with a modified swuare wave anyway.
[18:11] <Gadgetoid> seba-: Don't have the parts, I don't think, and only need a very, very low current
[18:12] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: the original used a cluster of caps and resistors to set up a poor mans oscillator
[18:12] <seba-> Gadgetoid, you just need a choke/inductor, a diode and a mosfet/transistor
[18:12] <buzzsaw> okay so I am no electronics guy but I was wondering... What would happen if you run +15v to the hod side and +10v to the ground? Does the 15v transfer to the 10v and give you the same as a 5v?
[18:13] <gordonDrogon> the 'hod side' ?
[18:13] <buzzsaw> s/hod/hot
[18:13] <gordonDrogon> hot side of what?
[18:13] <Armand> yo momma ?
[18:13] <Armand> Sorry..
[18:13] <buzzsaw> anything? by hot I mean posative
[18:13] <seba-> Gadgetoid, if you make the boost converter work in discontinous mode, the efficiency will be quite high and duty cycle low :)
[18:14] <seba-> Gadgetoid, but you would need a zener to set the voltage
[18:14] <Gadgetoid> Going to try a darlington
[18:14] <seba-> Gadgetoid, if otoh you would make a continous mode, which is easier to control, you would need higher duty cycles and it will have a higher consumption
[18:15] <seba-> Gadgetoid, i've generated 1 kV out of 5 V without problems
[18:15] <seba-> Gadgetoid, with discontinous mode of course :)
[18:15] <Grievre> How rare is it for people to build mains->DC power supplies as an unregulated switcher and then a linear regulator? Seems like it combines most of the advantages of a linear supply but without the need for a massive transformer
[18:16] <seba-> Grievre, not really, the best is to have a high frequency transformer, which is small
[18:17] <seba-> Grievre, but gives insulation
[18:17] <gordonDrogon> Grievre, my "bench" PSU is just that. 240-9v transformer than a 7805 :)
[18:17] <Gadgetoid> All this voltage madness!
[18:17] <gordonDrogon> I keep meaning to make something better, but it still works and I can't be bothered..
[18:18] <seba-> Gadgetoid, you can get all parts in a CFL lamp
[18:20] <gordonDrogon> more fun building it :)
[18:20] <Grievre> seba-: Er, how is that not what I described?
[18:20] <Grievre> o.o
[18:21] <seba-> Grievre, i don't know, switchers have various topologies, i thought maybe you were talking about the one we were talking, which is uninsulated
[18:21] <Grievre> Oh wait I'm asking in the wrong channel x.x
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[18:25] <gordonDrogon> I currently have a switched mode PSU in-front of me - looks quite complex and it doesn't work - it's for a ceiling light - produces 11.5v at about 15 amps for small 12v halogen bulbs.
[18:26] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:26] <buzzsaw> switched power supplys make to much noise :-s
[18:26] <gordonDrogon> Hm. the output is AC too.
[18:26] <gordonDrogon> it's compact as it has to go in the ceiling fitting.
[18:26] * buzzsaw can hear lots of switched powersupplys on the radio at times
[18:28] <Gadgetoid> Hmmm, darlington array no workey
[18:29] <gordonDrogon> sure the transfomer is still ok?
[18:29] <gordonDrogon> stick an LED instead.
[18:29] <gordonDrogon> and check the Pi's output too ...
[18:30] <Gadgetoid> Checking with a whole lot of LEDs
[18:31] <gordonDrogon> Hm. I could just buy a 12v toroidal transformer for this lamp and put it in the loft above the lamp and feed 12v down into it...
[18:33] <gordonDrogon> then again after checking the prices, it would be cheaper to buy a new lamp.
[18:34] * troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:35] <troulouliou_dev> hi can i use the uart and gpio pins like classic in/out pins as for the teensy?
[18:35] <troulouliou_dev> sprry uart and spi i mean
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[18:36] <zamba> anyone compiled shine for raspberry?
[18:38] <gordonDrogon> troulouliou_dev, yes.
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[18:38] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, thanks as always :)
[18:38] <gordonDrogon> troulouliou_dev, and the I2C pins too but they have 1.8K pull-ups on the Pi.
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[18:39] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, when set in "inpu" mmode programmaticaly like INPUT_PULLUP on arduino or even in output
[18:39] <gordonDrogon> troulouliou_dev, yes in input mode they're pulled up - you can use them in output mode without too many issues - the Pi will drive the output to 0v.
[18:41] * cpg|away is now known as cpg
[18:42] <Gadgetoid> This is ridiculous, damned transistors don't respond to anything but the input voltage, and if I take their precious resistors away they get hotter than a hot thing on hot day having a picnic on the sun
[18:43] * Syliss (~Home@adsl-108-198-103-98.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[18:44] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, is it the best ruby wrapper for wiringpi ? : https://github.com/WiringPi/WiringPi-Ruby
[18:44] <Gadgetoid> troulouliou_dev: I'm working on a new one, which will be better, but at the moment yes
[18:45] <troulouliou_dev> Gadgetoid, ha ok thanks
[18:45] <gordonDrogon> troulouliou_dev, I think that's the only one :)
[18:46] <Gadgetoid> There's something curiously odd going on with my H-bridge
[18:46] <gordonDrogon> Heh... so here's me googling for replacement transformers, wifey puts 'circular transformer' into amazon and finds them straight away...
[18:46] * cpg is now known as cpg|away
[18:47] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, do ypou plan to set up a small raspbian repo with wiringpi and all those wrappers ?
[18:47] <Gadgetoid> I hooked an LED up to the base and it lit up...
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[18:47] <Gadgetoid> troulouliou_dev: you can "gem install wiringpi" anyway
[18:48] <Gadgetoid> But it would be nice, perhaps, to have it in a repo
[18:48] <troulouliou_dev> Gadgetoid, true :)
[18:49] <Gadgetoid> my h-bridge works, but there's something clearly wrong with it
[18:49] <gordonDrogon> troulouliou_dev, I'm hoping to get wiringPi as a .deb for raspbian.
[18:49] <gordonDrogon> but I don't know about the python/ruby, etc. ones.
[18:49] <troulouliou_dev> i set up my main redmine ssh / git serveur on one of my pi today ; was facing serious ram limitation and needed to switch the swap up to 1 gb
[18:50] <Gadgetoid> Wonder if I've got some diodes orientated the wrong way
[18:50] <ParkerR> Using swap on an SD card is not a great idea
[18:50] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, ok
[18:51] <troulouliou_dev> ParkerR, dphys-swapfile is using /var/swap by default
[18:51] <troulouliou_dev> and /etc/dphys-swapfile contain only the size param
[18:51] <ShadowJK> ParkerR; as long as there isn't active swapin/swapout going on, it's pretty good place to purge use-once type anonymous memory
[18:52] <troulouliou_dev> ParkerR, thanks will switch to external dd
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[18:53] <gordonDrogon> I leave swap on the SD - it's not really an issue for what I do.
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[18:53] <gordonDrogon> I also remove dphys-swapfile as personally I think it's a complete abimination.
[18:54] <gordonDrogon> it does nothing more than to slow down the boot process.
[18:54] <gordonDrogon> It's "easy" I guess.
[18:54] <ShadowJK> does it delete and recreate it on boot?
[18:55] <gordonDrogon> no
[18:55] <gordonDrogon> but it's one more init script to run when there's a perfectly good mechanism already running to mount it from /etc/fstab
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[18:55] <ShadowJK> ah
[18:55] <gordonDrogon> it does create it the very first time though.
[18:55] <gordonDrogon> hence the 'easy' part.
[18:59] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, you switch to a "real" partition
[18:59] <troulouliou_dev> for swap i mean
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[19:04] <Gadgetoid> Surely I shouldn't be seeing a voltage at the base of my H-bridges transistors?
[19:05] <Gadgetoid> Except any that I explicitly put into it
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[19:10] <gordonDrogon> troulouliou_dev, no - I use a swapfile - I just create it & stick it /etc/fstab. job done.
[19:10] <gordonDrogon> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 67108864 Oct 29 20:05 /var/swapfile
[19:11] <gordonDrogon> /var/swapfile swap swap defaults 0 0
[19:11] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:11] <troulouliou_dev> gordonDrogon, i ok
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[19:14] <Gadgetoid> Still don't understand why I'm seeing enough current to light an LED on the base of my transistors
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[19:17] <SpeedEvil> Gadget-Mac: LEDs make visible light on nanoamps of current
[19:17] <SpeedEvil> with a few hundred microamps. modern LEDs will be quite visible in q normally lit environment
[19:19] <Gadgetoid> SpeedEvil: The important thing is that there's enough for me to need a whole hoofing lot of input to switch the transistor
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> what are you trying to switch
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> using what transistor
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> some transisyors require tens of amps of base drive
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[19:19] <Gadgetoid> I have 2 BCL212L PNP and 2 BC548 NPN arranged in an H-bridge configuration
[19:20] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccy_RegeaneWolf
[19:21] <SpeedEvil> driven from the pi?
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[19:21] <Gadgetoid> SpeedEvil: at the moment I'm testing it away from the Pi
[19:21] <SpeedEvil> what voltages connected to?
[19:21] <Gadgetoid> It's running off 6v
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> you will
[19:22] <Gadgetoid> It works fine as long as I drive the transistor from the input voltage, anything else and its unresponsive
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> need a 0-6v swing chip to drive it properly
[19:22] * mike_t (~mike@109.169.175.98) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> do you have a diagram of what you're doing?
[19:23] <Gadgetoid> Attempting to do this: http://www.robotroom.com/BipolarHBridge/BipolarHBridgeSchematic.gif
[19:24] <Gadgetoid> There's always the chance the schematic I'm working from is horribly wrong!
[19:24] <SpeedEvil> you will need to drive at least the PNP transistors through some stage to increase the voltage to the supply volytsgre
[19:25] <SpeedEvil> as otherwise they are permenantly turned on, as 6-3.3 = 2.7 v , which will turn them in
[19:25] <SpeedEvil> on
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[19:27] <Gadgetoid> Interesting, I have the PNP and NPN transistors connected up in pairs at the moment, and tried to use a ULN2008 to drive them
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[19:33] <SpeedEvil> you will need pull up resistors to do that
[19:33] <SpeedEvil> from memory
[19:33] <SpeedEvil> ##electronics
[19:35] <Gadgetoid> Interesting
[19:37] <Gadgetoid> Just discovered that if I decouple the pairs of transistors, it utterly fails to work
[19:38] <Gadgetoid> excepting the obvious fact that not switching the pair on one side will obviously not generate any current across the bridge
[19:38] <Gadgetoid> Now actually wondering if I even need to use two types of transistor
[19:42] <Gadgetoid> Interesting: http://letsmakerobots.com/files/userpics/u1533/Bi-polar_H_bridge_Schematic.jpg
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[19:49] <timb_us> So I'm getting something weird here.
[19:49] * Schabo (~schabo@c-e67de253.6542326--62697410.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:49] <timb_us> If I set gpu_mem over 16 the RPi won't boot.
[19:49] <timb_us> The screen won't even turn on.
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[19:53] * I-Punkt (~Thunderbi@p5DC4BE60.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:57] <I-Punkt> Can i connect a Brother HL-2032 direct to raspi-B configured as a Printserver? May the Printer need too much energy?
[19:58] <timb_us> I don't see why not I-Punkt
[19:58] <bact> I-Punkt: I'm not familiar with any printers which use usb for power
[19:58] * rymate1234 (~rymate@znc.rymate.co.uk) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
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[20:01] <I-Punkt> ok, i cant kill the USB-Port with a Printer? I thought, the Printer need more USB-Energy as possibel
[20:01] <I-Punkt> bad english, sorry
[20:01] <timb_us> No, printers are self powered...
[20:01] <timb_us> You plug it into the wall, don't you?
[20:02] * TheSeven waits for usb-powered laser printers to hit market :P
[20:02] * robscomputer (~robscompu@c-24-130-183-245.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:03] <I-Punkt> sure, self powered by cable. thanks for help. Frohe Ostern ;-)
[20:03] <I-Punkt> raspi ist great - thx, cu
[20:04] * tubadaz (~quassel@pdpc/supporter/student/tubadaz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:04] * Duncan3 (~Duncan@adsl-75-36-200-143.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[20:04] <timb_us> Man this is so weird... If gpu_mem is over 16 this thing just won't boot...
[20:04] <TheSeven> timb_us: broken/missing start.elf?
[20:04] <TheSeven> how does it behave? blink codes?
[20:05] * I-Punkt (~Thunderbi@p5DC4BE60.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Quit: I-Punkt)
[20:05] <timb_us> Nothing on the display, power light comes on and act blinks
[20:05] <timb_us> blink blink -- pause -- blink blink
[20:05] <TheSeven> are you sure that it's two and not three blinks?
[20:06] <timb_us> Let me check
[20:07] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[20:08] <timb_us> Yeah it's three blinks.
[20:08] <TheSeven> ok, so indeed a corrupt/missing start.elf file
[20:09] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:09] <TheSeven> (for gpu_mem=16 start_cd.elf is used instead)
[20:09] <timb_us> Ohhhh
[20:10] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:10] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:10] <timb_us> That might explain why I can't get cma mode to boot as well.
[20:10] <timb_us> Is there a way to force a refresh of /boot with rpi-update?
[20:10] * [deXter] (d3Xt3r@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-piqeoabbblywcrsj) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:11] <AdvancedNewbie> https://github.com/raspberrypi/firmware/blob/master/boot/start.elf
[20:11] <Gadgetoid> Arrararrghh! all I'm getting out of this thing is the smell of cooking transistors
[20:11] <timb_us> That'll work too.
[20:11] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:12] * cpg|away is now known as cpg
[20:12] <timb_us> Bingo.
[20:12] <AdvancedNewbie> Working?
[20:13] <timb_us> Yup!
[20:13] <AdvancedNewbie> Schweet.
[20:13] <timb_us> Okay, now let me try cma mode.
[20:13] <timb_us> Thanks for the help! I learn so much here.
[20:14] <AdvancedNewbie> It was all TheSeven
[20:20] * TheSeven wonders what Gadgetoid did to his board
[20:20] * Gadgetoid starts wondering how the uln2003 could drive the coil directly
[20:21] <Gadgetoid> TheSeven: fortunately it's not the Pi I'm cooking
[20:21] <timb_us> Sweet, cma mode is working too!
[20:22] * zproc (~zproc@laf31-6-82-241-3-109.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:22] <TheSeven> Gadgetoid: what is it then?
[20:23] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:23] <Gadgetoid> TheSeven: An H-Bridge on a breadboard
[20:23] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:24] <TheSeven> I don't think you can build an H bridge with just that darlington array
[20:26] <Gadgetoid> I know that much
[20:26] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:26] <TheSeven> well, unless you go for some terrible hack like this: http://www.mikrocontroller.net/attachment/45358/h_bruecke_nur_mit_ULN.png
[20:27] * cccy_RegeaneWolf is now known as cccyRegeaneWolfe
[20:27] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:27] * Armand is now known as Armand|AFK
[20:29] * craigb (~craigb@178.73.210.224) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:30] * ekodan (~ekodan@unaffiliated/ekodan) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:31] * ebswift (~ebswift@1.141.36.6) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:34] <Gadgetoid> Rebuilt the H-bridge with each side pulled up, pulling one side to ground appears to work
[20:34] <Gadgetoid> I have two LEDs in opposing directions to verify it's working
[20:37] <timb_us> Hey guys, what's the command to run the dock/menu bar in LXDE? For some reason it's not starting by default.
[20:39] <ParkerR> lxpanel
[20:39] <timb_us> Hrmm, saying there's already an instance of it running...
[20:39] <timb_us> Weird.
[20:40] <ParkerR> killall lxpanel
[20:40] <ParkerR> lxpanel
[20:40] <timb_us> Killed it and relaunched.
[20:40] <timb_us> Yeah
[20:40] <timb_us> There it goes.
[20:41] <Gadgetoid> Hmm, all working great but all I've managed to do is displace my problem
[20:42] <timb_us> I wonder why it's not showing up? Clearly it's being launched with X...
[20:46] * Zl2cco (~anonymous@219-89-40-238.dialup.xtra.co.nz) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:48] * zleap (~zleap@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:48] <Gadgetoid> success! I think
[20:49] * korsi (~korsi@adsl-82-141-118-85.kotinet.com) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[20:49] * piney0 (~piney@unaffiliated/piney0) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[20:49] * piney0 (~piney@unaffiliated/piney0) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:52] * Zl2cco (~anonymous@219-89-40-238.dialup.xtra.co.nz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:52] * Zl2cco (~anonymous@219-89-40-238.dialup.xtra.co.nz) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:54] <zleap> gordonDrogon, hello
[20:55] <Gadgetoid> Well, I've got AC
[20:55] <Gadgetoid> But I can't figure out how to connect my coil :D
[20:56] * Zl2cco (~anonymous@219-89-40-238.dialup.xtra.co.nz) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[20:56] <Gadgetoid> it has 4 pins
[20:57] <Gadgetoid> As far as I'm aware the coil needs AC to induce a voltage on the other coil
[21:01] * fiftyonefifty (~fiftyonef@206.248.12.222) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:03] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:04] * nbookham (~nbookham@cpc2-horn3-2-0-cust392.6-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has left #raspberrypi
[21:05] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccy_RegeaneWolf
[21:09] * cccy_RegeaneWolf is now known as cccyRegeaneWolfe
[21:09] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: softTone is fun
[21:10] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[21:11] * ebswift (~ebswift@1.141.36.6) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:11] <zleap> hi gordonDrogon
[21:19] * ebswift (~ebswift@1.135.22.167) has joined #raspberrypi
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[21:25] * Duncan3 (~Duncan@adsl-75-36-206-113.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[21:29] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-iqkqosqqzbfjowru) Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
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[21:35] * Yen (~Yen@ip-83-134-116-157.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:35] * pkrnj (~pkrnj@bas2-montreal47-1279443509.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
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[21:39] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccy_RegeaneWolf
[21:43] * BlueDreams (~matt@24-205-95-34.dhcp.psdn.ca.charter.com) Quit (Quit: BlueDreams)
[21:43] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-oaqlcxokidvmlcxv) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:44] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[21:46] * rolleiflex (~rolleifle@206.71.246.250) Quit (Quit: rolleiflex)
[21:48] * cpg is now known as cpg|away
[21:48] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:49] * bortzmeyer (~stephane@2a01:e35:8bd9:8bb0:91f4:1622:9ab4:8385) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
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[21:54] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-oaqlcxokidvmlcxv) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[21:55] * DocGroove (~DocGroove@5352C6FC.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
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[21:59] * MichaelC (~unknownbl@phpbb/website/Unknown-Bliss) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
[22:00] * MichaelC (~unknownbl@phpbb/website/Unknown-Bliss) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:04] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-grihensysgvtnilv) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:07] * manitou (~manitou@unaffiliated/manitou) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:09] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-grihensysgvtnilv) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[22:09] * JanB5 (~jgander@83-93-101-44-dynamic.dk.customer.tdc.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:10] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-gylkbkkbfryxcvwg) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:13] * rolleiflex (~rolleifle@pool-96-224-11-188.nycmny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:15] * archistic (~kishor@gateway/tor-sasl/kishor) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[22:16] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-gylkbkkbfryxcvwg) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[22:17] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-pissgdzjwezlypeq) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:19] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I used a uln2003 to invert.. think I now have a lot of redundancy
[22:19] * bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:19] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:20] <Gadgetoid> although I appear now to have a DC motor driver that uses only 1 pin
[22:23] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-pissgdzjwezlypeq) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[22:24] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-smnapojnskyqbeiv) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:25] * zleap (~zleap@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[22:29] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-smnapojnskyqbeiv) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[22:29] <Gadgetoid> Drat!
[22:31] * cpg|away is now known as cpg
[22:31] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-rvcrfdblvtjbfcxz) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:32] * DocGroove (~DocGroove@5352C6FC.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Quit: Zzzz???.)
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[22:37] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-rvcrfdblvtjbfcxz) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[22:38] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-qkzibkxtwwmzcwuu) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:39] * Hans-Martin (~ignore@2001:4dd0:ff00:9100:ddca:4b02:4bcd:f269) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[22:49] * Schabo (~schabo@c-e67de253.6542326--62697410.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[22:52] * timb_us (~timb_us@pool-72-82-116-111.nrflva.east.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
[22:52] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:53] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD28540.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: NIN101)
[22:57] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-dvpbvwmsfrmsqzth) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[22:57] * manitou (~manitou@unaffiliated/manitou) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
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[23:02] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[23:04] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:04] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-jlitmlxluyfeuopz) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[23:05] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-clahcarnnvnavvxh) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:06] <Gadgetoid> Seeing a hopeless voltage on the other side of my coi
[23:06] <Gadgetoid> coil*
[23:06] * Kaboon (kaboon@524A5520.cm-4-3b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit ()
[23:07] * Spiffy (~Spiffy@unaffiliated/spiffy) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:08] * Grommet (~grommet@pdpc/supporter/active/grommet) Quit (Quit: make: *** No rule to make target `love'. Stop.)
[23:11] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-clahcarnnvnavvxh) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[23:12] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-ypicpzpewdfsacbo) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:18] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@60.Red-80-25-210.staticIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:18] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-ypicpzpewdfsacbo) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[23:19] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-emvrpfdwvhfpoabh) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:19] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[23:20] <Gadgetoid> Need more current captain!
[23:20] <des2> Voltages can have hope ?
[23:22] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-emvrpfdwvhfpoabh) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:23] <Gadgetoid> HOLY *** IT WORKS!!!
[23:23] <Gadgetoid> I almost swore then!
[23:23] * kirin` (telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-gqcpyoadpptnhten) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:25] * Alin1337 (Alin@94.52.9.181) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:25] <rpitin> So many timeouts, making it hard to backscroll
[23:25] * nils_2_ (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:26] <gordonDrogon> evening all.
[23:26] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: you were right all along, I just didn't fully understand you
[23:26] <gordonDrogon> a-ha :)
[23:27] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I now have EL wire running from my Pi, with softTone controlling the brightness
[23:27] <gordonDrogon> neato! :)
[23:27] <Gadgetoid> Gonna make it pulsate and shoot a video
[23:27] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Quit: Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[23:28] <Gadgetoid> Can drive the frequency up to about 1500, and down to about 100 for a massive range of visible light
[23:28] <rpitin> yes, videos, please do, much easier than making heads and tails of backscroll
[23:29] <des2> We already have a massive range of visible light, we call it the Sun
[23:29] <rpitin> H boards, coils and problem displacement is all backscroll will tell me :(
[23:29] <gordonDrogon> Gadgetoid, yes - the higher the frquency - up to the limit of the transformer, the more efficient it ought to be, so the brighter it will be..
[23:29] <rpitin> des2: trollollol
[23:29] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I think it's two fold- as EL wire also glows brighter at higher frequencies
[23:30] <gordonDrogon> doesn't surprise me.
[23:30] <Gadgetoid> Yeah, it shoots out more photons!
[23:30] <Gadgetoid> Got it pulsating with softTone now
[23:30] <gordonDrogon> the only thing to watch out for is the back emf from the primary coil - the diode in the uln2803 ought to protect it though, so make sure it's connected up.
[23:32] <Gadgetoid> gordonDrogon: I'm driving the coil through an H bridge anyway
[23:32] <gordonDrogon> ah, not the uln. ok.
[23:32] <Gadgetoid> Well, yes, the ULN too
[23:32] <Gadgetoid> It's a bit of a crazy complicated mess
[23:32] * gko (~user@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[23:32] <Gadgetoid> The ULN takes 1 input, inverts it and drives two outputs so they toggle the two sides of the H bridge
[23:33] <Gadgetoid> I don't know how to wire the coil to just the ULN
[23:33] <gordonDrogon> you could write a version of soft-tone that uses 2 outputs in push-pull mode - that will effectively double the voltage through the primary ...
[23:33] <Gadgetoid> Got a pretty strong flow from this, I might hook up some other types of wire, or more wire, and see how it goes
[23:33] <Gadgetoid> glow*
[23:33] <Gadgetoid> Tried to shoot a video, camera says: NO
[23:34] <gordonDrogon> you'd keep the enable high into the H bridge and toggle each drive pin in opposite ways.
[23:34] <rpitin> :(
[23:34] <rpitin> You sir need another raspberry pi with a webcam and motion installed.
[23:34] <gordonDrogon> good luck - I'm off to bed. long night - tired - was out at a dance earlier, just watched Dr Who on iPlayer and the clocks go forward...
[23:34] <rpitin> nighty night
[23:35] <des2> Night Gordon
[23:35] * Firehopper (~Firehoppe@pool-71-175-194-74.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:36] * dunnicli (~dunnicli@cpe-66-91-183-145.hawaii.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:36] <Gadgetoid> Night ngiht!
[23:37] <hays> argh. i seem to have lost my raspberry pi.
[23:38] <rpitin> :O
[23:38] * rolleiflex (~rolleifle@pool-96-224-11-188.nycmny.east.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: rolleiflex)
[23:38] <des2> Lost ?
[23:38] <rpitin> Is it hiding here http://25.media.tumblr.com/3775642101221f7aaec34cf02f80cb46/tumblr_mk5e1g4Tyx1s9r6v2o1_250.jpg ?
[23:38] <hays> well it was on my desk and it seems to be gone now
[23:39] <hays> i think i left it there too long and it got "put away"
[23:39] <des2> Do you have a cat ?
[23:39] <rpitin> or worse yet, a wife?
[23:39] <hays> both!
[23:39] <rpitin> well, you're in trouble
[23:39] <hays> yep
[23:40] <rpitin> check the fridge
[23:40] <des2> The cat took it because you were spending too much time with it
[23:40] <hays> i need to find a picture of the box it was in
[23:40] <des2> (that reason works for wives too)
[23:40] <rpitin> true that
[23:41] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@60.Red-80-25-210.staticIP.rima-tde.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:42] <hays> it must have been this http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&docid=_8yMHm8KWU1ElM&tbnid=YCteiqS2wFxbSM:&ved=0CAUQjBwwADgd&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tristancollins.me%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F06%2Fphoto.jpg&ei=9WlXUfXaG9a64APGx4C4DQ&psig=AFQjCNGjNoyPd9qBirAv0tSbZhdXNLG5wg&ust=1364769653489073
[23:42] <rpitin> Yeah, I would check the bridge
[23:42] <rpitin> fridge*
[23:42] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[23:42] <rpitin> its got a berry on it, so well, she may have put it there
[23:43] <rpitin> in the crisper
[23:43] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:44] * zakora (~NC@tok69-4-82-236-111-173.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:45] <rpitin> You sir need a cat and wife free computer desk/working space
[23:46] <rpitin> Makes it difficult to build projects if they keep getting put down/away
[23:47] <hays> rpitin: yes i do
[23:47] <hays> hopefully they are not on too much backorder right now
[23:47] <Gadgetoid> Weird, my electroluminescent disk seems to change colour slightly
[23:47] <Gadgetoid> It goes from blue to blue green
[23:48] <rpitin> You could try getting a small computer desk or she something and coming to an agreement that all things on that small space need to be left as is
[23:48] <chupacabra> lol
[23:48] <hays> rpitin: for the wife that works, but not the cat :)
[23:48] * zastaph (zastaph@unaffiliated/zastaph) Quit ()
[23:48] <chupacabra> i call mine my pet coon
[23:49] <rpitin> hays: true, but then you could spend some time building a motion detecting water spray cannon
[23:49] * Cykey (~textual@modemcable119.94-162-184.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:49] <chupacabra> what she doesnt mess up she messes on.
[23:49] <rpitin> http://www.trossenrobotics.com/c/robot-turrets.aspx
[23:50] * Gadgetoid basks in the pulsating glow of success
[23:50] * Armand|AFK is now known as Armand
[23:51] <Firehopper> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWVK9Lc-dIk < I dont think a RPI can controll this printer :>
[23:51] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: oh is this an external HDD with some glowey LEDs that you've got running off your PI?
[23:51] <Gadgetoid> rpitin: it's electroluminescent tape and wire
[23:51] * tonyhughes (~tonyhughe@202.137.244.157) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:51] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: oh nice.
[23:52] <Gadgetoid> Looks awesome, was such a chore to get running due to my extremely limited experience with AC
[23:52] * Delboy (~openwrt@141-136-250-112.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[23:52] <rpitin> Sounds like you've worked it out tho, well almost
[23:52] <Gadgetoid> I tried to hack a sound activated controller board, but murdered it
[23:52] <rpitin> minus some of the clunky things you mentioned before
[23:52] <rpitin> hehe
[23:52] <Gadgetoid> Yeah??? darlington array to h-bridge seems a bit over the top
[23:53] <rpitin> still, its a learning experience, no different to anything else really. Got to start somewhere.
[23:53] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@60.Red-80-25-210.staticIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[23:53] * zokeber (~Zokeber@unaffiliated/zokeber) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[23:53] <rpitin> Until the pieces start comping together
[23:53] <rpitin> coming*
[23:54] <Gadgetoid> rpitin: That it is, I've learned so much playing with the Pi and various accessories and then the Arduino, and now I'm brushing up on digital logic design
[23:54] * Jx8p (~jx8p@213.246.120.215) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:54] <hays> it looks like they are backordered maybe one month?
[23:54] <Gadgetoid> I never really studied computing or electronics throughout school/college, and didn't go to university, so this is all new to me and I'm lacking so much basic knowledge
[23:54] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: dont let school hold you back, we have google now
[23:55] <Gadgetoid> Too right!
[23:55] <Gadgetoid> I'm tempted to get some manner of engineering degree, but I think it'd be useless, and I've spent over a decade building a career as a web programmer anyway
[23:55] * averagecase (~anon@dslb-092-072-137-211.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:56] <chupacabra> you are good
[23:56] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: put it this way, I studied graphic arts and media in highschool, took a 12 month break and completed a course in laboratory technology in technical school, did 3 years of biomed at uni, spent 5 years in sales and now run a small web and digital advertising agency.
[23:56] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: so school shmool, it gives you some skills to use to learn how to learn
[23:56] <Gadgetoid> rpitin: Hahaha!
[23:56] <Gadgetoid> What's the agency?
[23:57] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: would rather not say, tinkering with hardware and stuff may scare the wildlife/customers.
[23:57] <Gadgetoid> rpitin: Fair enough! curious customers
[23:57] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: joe average associates that stuff with hacking, and thats evil and bad and stuff right? so yeah.
[23:58] <chupacabra> lol
[23:58] <Gadgetoid> I work for an online marketing agency, so I wanted to know if I'd come across you
[23:58] <Gadgetoid> Haha, if it weren't for "hacking" we wouldn't be able to fix peoples broken-as-hell web servers, or secure ours
[23:58] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: oh doubt it, we keep a low profile. Client portfolio of about 150 people. Taking it slow and steady as our larger competitors bite the dust
[23:58] <Gadgetoid> rpitin: sounds familiar
[23:59] <rpitin> Gadgetoid: Yeah I know that, you know that, but they don't know that.
[23:59] <Gadgetoid> Sometimes I wish I could do this without the clients
[23:59] <Gadgetoid> I say??? as my comments about clients get eternally committed to an IRC log :D

These logs were automatically created by RaspberryPiBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.