#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2013-05-13

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] <ozzzy> so... what's the opinion here.... I have a device we sell with an FTDI chip in it that I can redirect just fine and access from a win7 machine.... I also have 3 usb-serial adapters (2 prolific and one ftdi) that each work perfectly with the pi 'locally' but I can't get any of them to redirect properly with ser2net
[0:03] * phillw (~phillw@ubuntu/member/phillw) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:04] * zleap (~psutton@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:04] * Delboy (~openwrt@2001:b68:fc00:8b08::1) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[0:08] * zoktar (~zoktar@unaffiliated/zoktar) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:09] <Schalla> ozzzy: no clue.
[0:09] <sandman> Thoughts on prelink?
[0:10] * featheredfrog (~mhofer@cpe-67-250-125-135.hvc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:10] * featheredfrog (~mhofer@cpe-67-250-125-135.hvc.res.rr.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[0:11] * icecandy (~icecandy@unaffiliated/icecandy) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[0:12] * hotsyk (~hotsyk@ Quit ()
[0:13] * redsoups (~redsups@h-149-217.a336.priv.bahnhof.se) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:13] * Dreamingpup is now known as KwisA
[0:15] * taza_ (~zap@unaffiliated/taza) Quit (Quit: No longer here)
[0:16] * icecandy (~icecandy@unaffiliated/icecandy) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[0:17] * phillw (~phillw@ubuntu/member/phillw) has left #raspberrypi
[0:19] * user82 (~user82@unaffiliated/user82) Quit (Quit: Verlassend)
[0:20] * phantoxeD (~destroy@a95-92-84-28.cpe.netcabo.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:20] * wicket64 (~wicket@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[0:21] * MarquessDeBonBon (GentileBen@cpc5-lutn10-2-0-cust681.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit ()
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[0:22] * Alfihar_ (~Yuuka@home.siberios.com) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
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[0:23] * sparqz (~sparqz@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[0:25] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:25] * Delboy (~openwrt@2001:b68:fc00:8b08::1) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:25] * g2nightmare (187f53e9@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[0:26] * MichaelC1 is now known as MichaelC
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[0:31] * sjaak_trekhaak (~sjaak@52495090.cm-4-2b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
[0:32] * bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:35] * KiltedPi (Nbane@host-78-151-126-203.as13285.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[0:36] * KiltedPi (Nbane@host-78-151-126-203.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:38] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) Quit (Quit: Sto andando via)
[0:38] * teepee (~teepee@p508447BD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[0:38] * teepee (~teepee@p50845B0E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:38] * owen_ (~owen@ Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
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[0:41] * ahven (~kala@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[0:46] * piney0 (~piney@unaffiliated/piney0) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[0:46] * MilkyTunes (~ekodan@unaffiliated/ekodan) Quit (Quit: I quit)
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[0:46] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-25-243.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:50] * DenBeiren (~Denbeiren@ptrb-178-51-70-25.mobistar.be) has left #raspberrypi
[0:50] * [mad]Berry (~mad]Berry@unaffiliated/madberry) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:51] * IT_Sean (~user@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: off)
[0:51] * [mad]Berry (~mad]Berry@unaffiliated/madberry) has left #raspberrypi
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[0:52] <harris> hi
[0:52] <ozzzy> howdy
[0:52] <harris> i have a old logetech webcam how can i set it up
[0:52] * dreamreal (~jottinge@redhat/dreamreal) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[0:53] <ozzzy> depends if there are drivers for it
[0:53] <harris> i dont know the model
[0:54] * Armand (~martin@87-194-165-154.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:56] * KameSense (~KameSense@AMontpellier-654-1-76-211.w90-0.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[0:57] <hot2trot> how can I boot into another desktop manager besides LXDE? I'm using standard raspbian
[0:59] <Bushmills> start them manually. first X with an X terminal, where you enter name of the window manager or desktop environment
[1:00] <Bushmills> i assume you don't want to run two window managers at the same time. although possible, limited RAM would suggest to avoid that
[1:00] * Syliss (~Home@adsl-108-82-207-38.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:02] <hybr1d8> have a look at /etc/X11/default-display-manager to change the login manager
[1:02] <hybr1d8> If you want to change the login session type then there should be the option to set that at the login screen
[1:02] * zleap (~psutton@dsl-217-155-46-222.zen.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:04] * Alfihar (~Yuuka@home.siberios.com) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[1:05] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) Quit (Excess Flood)
[1:06] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:07] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-230-26.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:09] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-230-26.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[1:09] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-230-26.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:10] * KwisA is now known as Dreamingpup
[1:12] * sphenxes01 (~sphenxes@91-119-139-205.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:13] * tzarc_ is now known as tzarc
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[1:15] * MarkDude (~MT@fedora/MarkDude) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:15] * nils_2_ (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:15] * DenBeiren1 (~Denbeiren@ptrb-178-51-219-134.mobistar.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:18] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:18] * sandman (~pi@cpe-107-10-67-189.new.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[1:18] * sphenxes01 (~sphenxes@91-119-139-205.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[1:19] * hybr1d8 (~cjd@ Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[1:19] * Syliss (~Home@adsl-108-82-207-38.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[1:20] * sphenxes01 (~sphenxes@91-119-116-235.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:21] * Schalla (~Schalla@p57B55F92.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit ()
[1:22] * nils_2_ is now known as nils_2
[1:22] * Geniack (~Geniack@unaffiliated/geniack) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[1:22] * Geniack_ (~Geniack@unaffiliated/geniack) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:24] * piney0 (~piney@unaffiliated/piney0) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] * sphenxes01 (~sphenxes@91-119-116-235.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[1:31] * nicdev (user@2600:3c03::f03c:91ff:fedf:4986) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:32] * jaegeri (~gfgf@host-109-204-164-124.tp-fne.tampereenpuhelin.net) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[1:32] * xCP23x (~xCP23x@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[1:34] <hot2trot> what is a good gui program I can use to format a hard drive in LXDE, will gparted work?
[1:35] <Mikelevel> yes
[1:36] <hot2trot> Mikelevel: thank you
[1:36] <harris> hi
[1:36] * Nemo7 (~nemo@unaffiliated/nemo7) Quit (Quit: it really tied the room together)
[1:39] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:40] <harris> anyone on
[1:41] <BurtyB> no
[1:43] <Bushmills> are you?
[1:43] * AndrevS (~andre_bk@2001:980:55e0:1:20f:eaff:fe58:28f8) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:44] <linkxs> can't you see this channel is empty?
[1:45] * chod wanders about
[1:46] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:50] <Bushmills> ondemand governor keeps an almost idling CPU on its low clock down to about 35 MHz
[1:50] * jakeri (~gfgf@host-109-204-164-124.tp-fne.tampereenpuhelin.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:54] <Bushmills> yes. 30 MHz is a bit too low - idle CPU is considered too busy to keep it on 30 MHz all the time, and governor runs it on high speed for about 30% of the time then
[1:55] <Bushmills> so 40.. 50 MHz clock may be a practical lower limit for min_freq
[1:56] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[1:57] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:58] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) Quit (Quit: Mikelevel)
[2:01] * Yen (~Yen@ip-81-11-235-15.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[2:02] * hays (~quassel@unaffiliated/hays) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[2:04] * KiltedPi (Nbane@host-78-151-126-203.as13285.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[2:04] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:08] * Yen (~Yen@ip-81-11-244-67.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:08] * KiltedPi (Nbane@host-78-151-126-203.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[2:28] * chod (~chod@toy-town.demon.co.uk) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:31] * jimerickson (~jimericks@unaffiliated/jimerickson) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[2:31] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[2:34] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[2:37] * tinti (~tinti@pdpc/supporter/student/tinti) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:37] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:40] * KameSense (~KameSense@AMontpellier-654-1-35-145.w92-143.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:41] * Serano (~serano@rooty.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:46] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[2:50] * harris (~harris@unaffiliated/harris) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
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[2:54] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[2:59] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:01] * EastLight (~t@ Quit ()
[3:06] * Torikun (~Torikun@76-220-9-159.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[3:08] <Bushmills> mostly idle, sometimes a bit of ntp, some openvpn keep alive chitchat, and 2 mpd clients talking, but no audio is actually played: http://scarydevilmonastery.net/snap/1368407053033628805d.png - stays rather stable on low freq, sampled over about one hour.
[3:16] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[3:25] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[3:29] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[3:31] * \\Mr_C\\ (mrc@adsl-98-89-38-213.mgm.bellsouth.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:31] * heathkid|2 is now known as heathkid
[3:32] * bizarro_1 (~bizarro_1@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[3:38] * edman007_ is now known as edman007
[3:38] * IT_Sean (~user@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:40] * Dreamingpup (~KwisA@delprado.demon.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[3:43] * hydroxygen (~nunya@unaffiliated/zor/x-4290728) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[3:44] * KiltedPi (Nbane@host-78-151-126-203.as13285.net) Quit ()
[3:46] * hot2trot (~hot2trot@2002:48c7:31ba:0:ac5d:a714:4ea9:608a) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:53] * IT_Sean (~user@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: orf)
[3:55] * RyanD (~rdavies@ip68-100-116-235.dc.dc.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:57] * Thra11 (~Thra11@ Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[3:59] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-25-243.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
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[4:20] * joat (~joat@ip70-160-199-29.hr.hr.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[4:27] * jef79m (~jef79m@202-159-136-72.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:27] * zarate (~xeba@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[4:27] * slug (~Nuno@209-6-193-216.c3-0.smr-ubr2.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[4:28] * tinti (~tinti@pdpc/supporter/student/tinti) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[4:28] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[4:28] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-25-243.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[4:32] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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[4:33] * NullMoogleCable (~NullMoogl@cpe-66-66-94-57.rochester.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:42] * ShiftPlusOne (~Shift@unaffiliated/shiftplusone) Quit (*.net *.split)
[4:42] * drb27 (~pi@ Quit (*.net *.split)
[4:45] * ReggieUK (ReggieUK@ Quit ()
[4:47] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) Quit (*.net *.split)
[4:47] * DenBeiren1 (~Denbeiren@ptrb-178-51-219-134.mobistar.be) Quit (*.net *.split)
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[4:51] * drb27 (~pi@ Quit (*.net *.split)
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[4:59] * sandman (~nobody@cpe-107-10-67-189.new.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:59] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) Quit (Quit: enque)
[5:01] * MidnighToker (~Toker@unaffiliated/midnightoker) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[5:01] * jef79m (~jef79m@202-159-136-72.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:06] * Bochi (~bochi@ppp-46-244-215-24.dynamic.mnet-online.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:06] * ngc0202 (~ngc0202@unaffiliated/ngc0202) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[5:13] * tebruno99 (~tebruno99@pdpc/supporter/student/crweb) Quit (Quit: ["naveoss.com"])
[5:17] * sandman (~nobody@cpe-107-10-67-189.new.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[5:22] * drama247365 (drama24736@ppp232-185.static.internode.on.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[5:23] * TheSeven (~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
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[5:40] * Cy-Gor (~Brian@cpe-70-124-70-140.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[5:48] * spavis (~spavis@24-107-225-154.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
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[7:34] <TheSnide> Bushmills: the goto 50NHz, is stock or did you config something extra ?
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[8:15] <bernardoct> Hi guys!
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[8:16] <bernardoct> I just installed raspbian in and SD card but when I try to boot the system for the first time I get that message of respawning to fast
[8:16] <bernardoct> None of the answers on forums that I checked solved my problem
[8:17] <bernardoct> Does anybody there knows what to do?
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[8:45] <johnc-> woo, my pi project is alive! http://i.imgur.com/3cDk418.png
[8:46] <johnc-> plugging it into my home automation framework! http://i.imgur.com/Xguju7h.jpg
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[9:55] <gordonDrogon> morning Pi Peeps.
[9:57] <knoppies> hello gordonDrogon
[9:57] <Bushmills> TheSnide: other then setting arm_freq_min (and arm_freq), there's nothing custom about the device
[9:57] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccyRegeane_Away
[9:58] <mike_t> johnc- woo, my pi project is alive! http://i.imgur.com/3cDk418.png // what platform?
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[10:05] <TheSnide> Bushmills: on raspi_config ?
[10:05] * idstam (~johan@c-657a72d5.027-359-73746f23.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:06] <Bushmills> or by wriring to /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_min_freq
[10:06] <Bushmills> writing
[10:06] <TheSnide> oh, it is writable ?! :)
[10:07] <Bushmills> that's where i reduced clock to find the bottom
[10:07] <Bushmills> rebooting all the time is so windows-like
[10:08] <knoppies> Bushmills, I know what you mean.
[10:08] <TheSnide> Bushmills: at least it's way faster :)
[10:08] <Bushmills> you may have to set cpuinfo_min_freq in config.txt before
[10:08] * TheSnide rebooted when he tripped on the usb :-(
[10:09] <ExeciN> ^ that can't be good
[10:09] <Bushmills> arm_freq_min it's called there
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[10:11] <TheSnide> Bushmills: now, is the /proc/stat correct when freq fiddling ?
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[10:11] <Bushmills> the stats collecting script is http://scarydevilmonastery.net/freqs
[10:11] <Bushmills> (wasn't it you calling me bashmills :D )
[10:12] <TheSnide> Bushmills: yup. you got me convert to /bin/sh btw :)
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[10:14] <Bushmills> using sh instead of bash would make that script considerably more complex, i think
[10:15] <Bushmills> for example, using output of a command as array index is something sh has no equivalent for, afaik
[10:15] * psil (~krwlisp@c-83-233-75-9.cust.bredband2.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:17] <Bushmills> ah, no. that's easy with sh too
[10:17] <Bushmills> though a bit more messy
[10:18] <TheSnide> Bushmills: i even made a array an hash lib for sh :)
[10:19] <Bushmills> array -> /tmp/dir. array element -> /tmp/dir/file.
[10:19] <Bushmills> at least if your /tmp resides in RAM
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[10:22] <Bushmills> i ought to reimplement that threaded code virtual engine in sh, using dir based arrays, just for the heck of it (or as showcase, depending on how one wants to read this)
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[10:23] <Bushmills> the need of arrays is the primary reason that it's bash-based
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[10:40] <TheSnide> Bushmills: yep, that's the way i did it.
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[10:52] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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[10:58] <Haxxa> hello
[10:59] <linkxs> that's a creative entrance
[10:59] <Haxxa> indeed
[10:59] <Haxxa> So any people gamers in here?
[11:00] <[Saint]> what's a people gamer? :)
[11:00] <Nik05> playing with people? (sex?)
[11:00] <Haxxa> well I am looking for opinions on what I should use inconjuction with my mamepi setup
[11:01] <Haxxa> no sex this time
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[11:01] <Haxxa> I want a wireless controller that also has a bit of old school feel to it
[11:01] <Haxxa> just to play some snes and stuff
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[11:14] <KOPRajs> hi
[11:14] <KOPRajs> how do you determine the size when you create an image of SD card (say 8GB) for Raspberry?
[11:14] <KOPRajs> I wanted to copy from one 8GB SD card to another 8GB SD using win32diskimager and I've found out the second one not being big enough
[11:14] <KOPRajs> so it seems that every SD card is a bit different
[11:15] <Triffid_Hunter> KOPRajs: yep. shrink the filesystem first, then the partition, then move it across. raspi-config has a feature where it can then expand the partition and filesystem out to the size of the disk
[11:15] <ShiftPlusOne> or copy the files directly, without dd.
[11:16] <ShiftPlusOne> ah, sorry, didn't notice you were a windows user. That would make it trickier.
[11:16] <KOPRajs> I am actually Linux user
[11:17] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[11:17] <nid0> then you can do it either Triffid_Hunter'a or ShiftPlusOne's way
[11:17] <KOPRajs> but I need to create an image which can be then easilly deployed to SD cards in Windows
[11:17] <KOPRajs> (not by myself)
[11:17] <nid0> then do it Triffid_Hunter's way
[11:18] <nid0> just shrink your existing image down to however much space you're actually using
[11:18] <ShiftPlusOne> Shrink it down to whatever size you need, then dd to the point where the last partition ends, I guess.
[11:19] <KOPRajs> well the question is a bit more complicated... it seems that even 2 identical SD cards have different properties
[11:19] <KOPRajs> fdisk reports different first sector
[11:19] <KOPRajs> and different geometry?
[11:19] <SpeedEvil> SD cards do not have quite uniform sizes
[11:19] <KOPRajs> can I simply ignore this?
[11:19] <SpeedEvil> the geometry is quite imaginary and irrelevant
[11:19] <nid0> that doesnt matter, all you're doing is shrinking your current image
[11:20] <Triffid_Hunter> KOPRajs: your image will contain the partition table
[11:20] <KOPRajs> so the partition table has the fake geometry in itself?
[11:20] <KOPRajs> what about marked bad sectors or such?
[11:21] <Triffid_Hunter> KOPRajs: the SD card's translation table handles htat
[11:21] <SpeedEvil> there are no bad sectors in SD cards
[11:22] <SpeedEvil> once you start getting blocks that don't reliably read, the SD card is broken
[11:22] <SpeedEvil> and various things may happen from it locking up on accessing those sectors, to the SD card not powering up.
[11:23] <SpeedEvil> a SD card with errors is not like an old school HD with errors, it's rarely if ever useful to have bad blocks on the filesystem for them.
[11:23] * owen_ (~owen@ Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[11:27] <KOPRajs> OK, so I simply shrink the image a bit and then I copy it to whatever SD card using the win32diskimager with the new partition table and fake geometry
[11:28] <ShiftPlusOne> Does win32diskimager allow you to set how much you want to copy?
[11:28] <ShiftPlusOne> If not, it will still try to copy the whole card, regardless of what's in the partition table.
[11:29] <KOPRajs> but I can make the smaller image using dd
[11:29] <ShiftPlusOne> yup
[11:29] <KOPRajs> I believe win32diskimager does not use any special image format
[11:29] <KOPRajs> well I hope
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[13:03] <linkxs> http://linkxs.org/freezing-a-raspberry-pi-in-liquid-nitrogen/
[13:03] <linkxs> [Saint]: ^ finally wrote that up
[13:04] <jelly1> linkxs: your blog is a bit slow
[13:04] <jelly1> is it on a pi :P
[13:04] <linkxs> no
[13:04] <linkxs> i host from home
[13:05] <TheSnide> jelly1: i guess it's gotten slashdotted from here :)
[13:05] <jelly1> haha
[13:05] <TheSnide> jelly1: never post an link with a catchy url :)
[13:05] <Triffid_Hunter> I hosted from home for ages.. got a rackspace box now, is good
[13:06] * Mr_Sheesh_AFK (Mr_Sheesh@unaffiliated/mr-sheesh/x-0757054) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:06] * Mr_Sheesh (Mr_Sheesh@unaffiliated/mr-sheesh/x-0757054) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[13:06] * Mr_Sheesh_AFK is now known as Mr_Sheesh
[13:07] <TheSnide> Triffid_Hunter: hosting prices went down like nothing :)
[13:07] * cccyRegeane_Away is now known as cccyRegeaneWolfe
[13:07] <TheSnide> Triffid_Hunter: if only the home connection went that way too...
[13:07] * jelly1 has 40/4
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[13:08] <TheSnide> linkxs: i guess having 10 2MiB images in your post doesn't help, either.
[13:09] <linkxs> yeah, that's def not gonna speed it up
[13:09] <Triffid_Hunter> TheSnide: yeah I'm paying $11/mo for my virtual server, and peanuts for data
[13:10] * spacebug^ (~spacebug@h22n5-sde-d2.ias.bredband.telia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[13:10] <TheSnide> linkxs: what a waste : 2 448px ?? 3 264px (scaled to 625px ?? 833px) :)
[13:10] <linkxs> screw it it's wordpress
[13:10] <linkxs> also it's 4am
[13:10] <linkxs> don't expect me to think straight
[13:11] <TheSnide> linkxs: :-D
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[13:11] <TheSnide> hehe seems that WP + 4AM == ouch
[13:12] * KOPRajs (52638852@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[13:12] <TheSnide> linkxs: but but but.... really nice post :)
[13:12] <linkxs> thanks!
[13:13] <TheSnide> btw, the eth0 seems very sensitive indeed
[13:13] <linkxs> TheSnide: yeah, permalinks decided not to work (i mess with WP a lot, and things rarely break in it, so i was surprised)
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[13:13] <linkxs> yeah, according to the FAQ on raspberrypi.org it's rated >0C
[13:13] <linkxs> lemme find that..
[13:14] <linkxs> "LAN9512 is specified by the manufacturers being qualified from 0??C to 70??C, while the AP is qualified from -40??C to 85??C"
[13:14] <gordonDrogon> linkxs, you should resize that photo - it's huge!
[13:14] <linkxs> fine fine, lemme go do that
[13:14] <TheSnide> linkxs: now, with liquid nitro... it's _overclock_ time !! :)
[13:14] <linkxs> damn, forgot to mention i over clocked it midway!
[13:15] <linkxs> oh well, that's for next time
[13:15] * grantsmith (~grantsmit@unaffiliated/grantsmith) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:15] <linkxs> it didn't change much so i won't be able to say mjuch about that anyway
[13:15] <gordonDrogon> will save you a lot of bandwidth - I've been taking online photos to 1280 wide or high & 75% JPG quality. yields an image of about 100-250K usually.
[13:17] <TheSnide> gordonDrogon: specially since it"s "2448px ?? 3264px (scaled to 625px ?? 833px)"
[13:18] <gordonDrogon> yea, firefox is a bit of a sluggard at dynamically resizing stuff too.
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[13:21] <TheSnide> what's that www.raspberrypi.com/license-keys ?
[13:24] * MidnighToker (~Toker@unaffiliated/midnightoker) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:25] <mike_t> TheSnide, This keys enables to encode/decode MPEG-2/VC-1 video in hardware.
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[13:26] <linkxs> aw man WP has weird things with thumbnails and i don't feel like doing actual work
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[13:33] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccyRegeane_Away
[13:33] <TheSnide> mike_t: yeap, just googled my way to knowledge :)
[13:34] <TheSnide> mike_t: i just didn't know that the RPi came with licensing thingies
[13:36] <Triffid_Hunter> TheSnide: it's in the (closed) firmware. keys go in /boot/config.txt if you want to unlock relevant codec on the vpu
[13:36] <mike_t> TheJH, H264 enables by default. MPEG-2/VC-1 - you can buy
[13:37] <TheSnide> i guess only MPEG2 is really needed
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[13:44] * wpjtqwv is now known as stromovous
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[13:46] <steve_rox> damn this server is hell to connect to
[13:47] <stromovous> yep it is
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[13:47] <steve_rox> very close to giveing up
[13:47] <nid0> it is?
[13:47] <Triffid_Hunter> steve_rox: freenode is being ddosed, I think they're doing quite well
[13:47] <Triffid_Hunter> usually it's extremely stable
[13:48] <steve_rox> the fact you have to ident to get into this room stops me
[13:48] <stromovous> who the hell would ddos freenode?!
[13:48] <Triffid_Hunter> steve_rox: ident? nope
[13:48] <steve_rox> this room enforces regged users only
[13:49] <steve_rox> so you have to ident
[13:49] <Triffid_Hunter> oh with nickserv? yeah
[13:49] <stromovous> is that bad?
[13:49] <stromovous> I dont think so
[13:49] <steve_rox> server says theres no such username when i tryed
[13:49] <Triffid_Hunter> thought you meant ident, the service that runs on port 113 and tells servers who the local user is making a connection
[13:49] <TheSnide> Triffid_Hunter: why do ppl ddos such things... that's beyond me
[13:50] <Triffid_Hunter> stromovous: not at all, keeps the spam and trolls down a bit
[13:50] <TheSnide> stromovous: oh, same thought.
[13:50] <Triffid_Hunter> TheSnide: kids being petty
[13:50] <TheSnide> Triffid_Hunter: just ddos the kids.
[13:50] <TheSnide> :)
[13:50] <Triffid_Hunter> TheSnide: more fun is taking over the botnet
[13:51] <linkxs> gordonDrogon: wow, that took me FOREVER
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[13:54] <gordonDrogon> ?
[13:54] <gordonDrogon> I get image, geed into gimp, resize, save as, then use wordpress to upload to the site..
[13:54] <gordonDrogon> *feed into gimp..
[13:55] <gordonDrogon> I'm not using anything too clever on my own sites (that I'm aware of!)
[13:55] * [Saint] (~saint@rockbox/user/saint) has joined #raspberrypi
[13:55] <stromovous> I guess it's very Raspberry related
[13:56] <gordonDrogon> my site? Hm. My last posting was: https://projects.drogon.net/sourdough-with-unbleached-flour/
[13:56] <gordonDrogon> ;-)
[13:56] <gordonDrogon> although it typically is Pi heavy :)
[13:56] <gordonDrogon> I've been away for a few weeks, so not had time to put anything new up, sadly.
[13:57] <linkxs> gordonDrogon: well, my issue was that i thought that thumbnail processing was built into wordpress, so i spent a good chunk of time figuring out how i'd do that
[13:57] <linkxs> but i ended up just resizing them over ssh and doing it all by hand. oh well.
[13:58] <SpeedEvil> gordonDrogon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bBX8j_3eHI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
[13:58] <SpeedEvil> cookie machine
[13:59] <linkxs> gordonDrogon: i love bread.
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[14:01] <stromovous> gordonDrogon: you keep chickens?
[14:01] * clonak1 (~clonak@ Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[14:02] * ynot (~tony@pool-173-71-108-23.cmdnnj.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:03] * elgrecoF- is now known as elgrecoFL
[14:04] <gordonDrogon> stromovous, yes, I have 3 chicks.
[14:05] <BlueMint> gordonDrogon, I love your site. Thank you
[14:05] <[Saint]> We recently moved house, and our back neighbor has a dozen or so huge egg layers.
[14:05] <gordonDrogon> SpeedEvil, intersting, but I like to make stuff by hand :)
[14:05] <[Saint]> They answer every time we go out and call the cats. :)
[14:05] <gordonDrogon> [Saint], best kind :)
[14:06] <[Saint]> "Here kitty, kitty, kitty...puss puss puss!"; "Bokkkkkk, bok bok bok bok!"
[14:07] * Datalink|Elsewhe (~Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:07] <[Saint]> The cats were quite intrigued by these new massive ground birds for a while, but they quickly found out that this new prey was quite capable of defending itself.
[14:07] <gordonDrogon> yea, my chicks rush to the fence when they hear the garden gate opening...
[14:07] <[Saint]> Now, they watch from a distance :)
[14:07] * Turing_i (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:07] <gordonDrogon> demanding more weeds be thrown at them - which is good as the rest of the garden is overrun with dandelions right now.
[14:07] <gordonDrogon> Oh yes - chickens can fight off a domestic cat without much issue :)
[14:08] <[Saint]> Indeed. We occasionally get one of them jumping the fence and scratching around in our yard.
[14:08] * Mr_Sheesh_AFK (Mr_Sheesh@unaffiliated/mr-sheesh/x-0757054) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:08] <gordonDrogon> the grass is always greener ...
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[14:08] <[Saint]> They've picked all the weeds out from between the paving stones. Its great :)
[14:08] * Mr_Sheesh_AFK is now known as Mr_Sheesh
[14:08] <gordonDrogon> until they start digging stuff up and eating stuff you don't want them to eat )-:
[14:09] <ShiftPlusOne> Hm, I would've though a cat could easily take on some chickens O_o
[14:09] <[Saint]> Fortunately, there's none of that yet. We've only been here a week - but now we have a large back yard a garden is definitely in order.
[14:09] <gordonDrogon> I have lots of strawberries that they're not getting their beaks into!!!
[14:09] <[Saint]> Coming into Winter now, though. A bit late for planting.
[14:09] <[Saint]> ShiftPlusOne: The cats thought so too ;)
[14:10] <[Saint]> Chickens are actually pretty grumpy buggers. ANd they can look after themselves.
[14:10] <gordonDrogon> chicken claws are sharp and long. beaks too.
[14:11] <[Saint]> Even just puffing up their breasts and flapping around a bit is enough to make the cats think twice about it.
[14:11] * Jcktrue (~jcktrue.d@unaffiliated/jcktrue/x-390518) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:11] <gordonDrogon> so a cat suddenly faced with something that suddenly gets about 3x bigger (wings out) and comes at them with claws and a beak soon backs down...
[14:11] <[Saint]> their wings, even when clipped, make them seem far larger than a domestic cat.
[14:11] <[Saint]> heh - snap.
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[14:13] <gordonDrogon> yes - it's usually only the primary flight feathers you clip off - from one wing only.
[14:14] <[Saint]> I think these ones have both wings done (seems to be common around here), but they're still plenty capable of flapping up, onto, and over the fence on occasions :)
[14:14] <Firehopper> lol I remember walking up to a canda goose once as a kid.. :)
[14:15] <[Saint]> Heh, geese aren't friendly ;)
[14:15] <Firehopper> I found that out :)
[14:15] * hotsyk (~hotsyk@ Quit ()
[14:15] <Firehopper> needless to say, I needed clean pants after :)
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[14:16] <gordonDrogon> if you only do one wing, then when they try to flap, they fall over or go in a spiral...
[14:16] <[Saint]> Ahhhh.
[14:16] <gordonDrogon> do both wings and they just try harder...
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[14:16] <[Saint]> :)
[14:17] <stromovous> must be good workout
[14:17] <gordonDrogon> they're not noted for their abiltiy to fly - more like powered jumps!
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[14:17] <Triffid_Hunter> I've seen plenty of chickens fly up trees when there's goannas and snakes around
[14:18] <Triffid_Hunter> they can't keep it up though, power to weight ratio doesn't favour them
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[14:19] <gordonDrogon> must be lean chickens... guinea fowl and peacocks can do the power assisted leap/fly into tree thing a bit easier.
[14:21] <BlueMint> Some of them can like oduble jump...
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[14:33] <Darkwell> hello anyone of you been running postfix with courier imap-ssl ?
[14:36] <Triffid_Hunter> Darkwell: yes, but I set it up so long ago I couldn't tell you much about it
[14:36] <Darkwell> on your raspberry pi ?
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[14:37] <Darkwell> i want to run postfix with tls and courier-imap-ssl and use virtual users for it
[14:37] <Darkwell> meaning all users are non existing on the raspberry pi
[14:38] <Darkwell> the problem i seem to see is that most example using this are using webserver solutions etc, while my need is jsut to hav evirtual email accounts that one can sync via imap
[14:39] <Darkwell> nothing big and special and no fanciness with webserver stuff
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[14:42] <nid0> what problem are you having with doing so
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[14:44] <nid0> a v straightforward guide you can follow for setting it all up pretty much exactly as you seem to want it is at
[14:44] <nid0> http://www.howtoforge.com/virtual_postfix_mysql_quota_courier
[14:44] <nid0> the guide assumes having apache installed to run phpmyadmin, you can obviously just make database changes manually though
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[15:16] <Darkwell> would be perfect if one could replace mysql with sqlite
[15:17] <Darkwell> also dont want to ahyve php at all.. ;) its a bad language
[15:18] <gordonDrogon> if it's that bad, why are there so many people using it?
[15:18] * herdingcat (~huli@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[15:19] <Darkwell> lots of bad people
[15:19] <Darkwell> or ppl with bad knowledge ? =)
[15:20] <Darkwell> i prefer python
[15:20] <ShiftPlusOne> A lot of php bashing around these here parts. I haven't used it much, but from what little experience I've had with it, it certainly didnt strike me as particularly bad. O_o
[15:20] <Darkwell> php shoudlnt be used
[15:21] <overrider> it gets better and better actually
[15:21] * overrider walks away, slowly
[15:21] <gordonDrogon> I've written thousands of lines of PHP.
[15:21] <gordonDrogon> I know it's weak points, but it's not bad.
[15:21] <Darkwell> lol
[15:21] <Darkwell> how many lines in other languages ?
[15:21] <overrider> gordonDrogon: agreed
[15:22] <overrider> Hundreds of thousands in C
[15:22] <IT_Sean> PHP = Pretty Horrible Programming. Right?
[15:22] <gordonDrogon> millions in C, assembler, basic, imp, perl, and my others I've written myself.
[15:22] <overrider> Anyhow, its mood. Everybody as he likes
[15:22] <Triffid_Hunter> ShiftPlusOne: tnx.nl/php.html
[15:23] <gordonDrogon> aflpl was a good one - A Fairy Light Programming Language :)
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[15:23] <IT_Sean> Never 'erd of that one.
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[15:24] <gordonDrogon> that's 'cos I invented it for one particular project 25 years ago :)
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[15:24] <IT_Sean> I see. :p
[15:24] <gordonDrogon> the interpreter was written in C though.
[15:24] <IT_Sean> I had a feeling you were making it up.
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[15:25] <gordonDrogon> Hm. I did a lot in Pascal oneceuponatime too.
[15:25] <gordonDrogon> never really got into Ada or Modula 2 though.
[15:25] <gordonDrogon> little bit of logo, but mostly the turtle interpreter. (wrote my own there too - in Apple II BASIC)
[15:25] <gordonDrogon> it was so slow )-:
[15:26] <Darkwell> i thought perl was mor or less dead now
[15:26] <Darkwell> lol
[15:27] <Triffid_Hunter> Darkwell: nope still widely used.. slashdot and a few other big sites run on perl last time I checked
[15:27] <gordonDrogon> Heh. forgot BCPL too. Spent years on that on a network of BBC Micros
[15:27] <Darkwell> i think perl is getting less and less usage by time
[15:28] <gordonDrogon> I tried to get into prolog once as it seemed "fashionable". Failed.
[15:28] <gordonDrogon> I've written some Perl, but never really liked it.
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[15:29] <Darkwell> prolog solves a very precise domain of problems , hend prolog name..
[15:29] <Darkwell> hend/hence
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[15:29] <gordonDrogon> I never had a use for it at the time - it was more a passing curiosity.
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[15:34] <ShiftPlusOne> Triffid_Hunter, those don't really seem like reasons not to use php. It does what it says on the tin. All languages have their quirks after all. I will look into perl next time I poke around though.
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[15:35] <gordonDrogon> ShiftPlusOne, those sort of pages exist for every programming language out there.. for every enthusiast, you'll find someone anti for a whole host of reasons ..
[15:35] <gordonDrogon> for me a progrmaming language is just another tool, and I find PHP a relatively easy and quick one to use.
[15:35] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, the various c vs c++ pages out there crossed my mind while reading that
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[15:36] <gordonDrogon> I don't use any of the OO stuff in PHP though - probably because I'm not a fan of OOp and I prefer C and C-Like things.
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[15:37] <Darkwell> anyhows if php was a good language then google should run it on its servers
[15:37] <dreamreal> gordonDrogon: did you not say that wiringpi 2.6 had mcp3002 support?
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[15:40] <gordonDrogon> dreamreal, it has (written in C ;-)
[15:40] <dreamreal> hmm
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[15:41] <gordonDrogon> maybe it's in 2.7.
[15:41] <gordonDrogon> it is a beta afterall :)
[15:41] <gordonDrogon> let me check..
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[15:42] * Simon` is now known as Simon-
[15:43] <gordonDrogon> maybe its time to just push it out properly now ...
[15:44] * dreamreal hands gordonDrogon git tags :)
[15:44] * Mr_Sheesh_AFK (Mr_Sheesh@unaffiliated/mr-sheesh/x-0757054) has joined #raspberrypi
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[15:50] <gordonDrogon> Hm. just found something that's not compilnig cleanly.
[15:50] <ShiftPlusOne> heh, that's not much of an argument at all.
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[15:56] <dreamreal> gordonDrogon: anything I can help with?
[15:56] * evilsk4ter (~evilsk4te@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[15:56] * Storm is now known as Guest18140
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[16:00] <gordonDrogon> no - it's a fix in some of the gertboard handling code.
[16:00] * 45PAACH2G (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) Quit (Ping timeout: 259 seconds)
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[16:01] * _h0c1n_ is now known as h0cin
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[16:01] * ChanServ sets mode +o ReggieUK
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[16:04] * Vazde (vazde@dea.fi) Quit (Write error: Broken pipe)
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[16:05] <dreamreal> gordonDrogon: what does wiringPiSPIDataRW return? (the docs don't say)
[16:06] * ManiacTwister (~Twister@2a01:4f8:150:6084::1337) has joined #raspberrypi
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[16:14] <gordonDrogon> dreamreal, it reurns the result of the ioctl that does the transfer - usually 0.
[16:14] <dreamreal> ah, okay, thank you
[16:14] <gordonDrogon> if it's not 0, then you should consult errno.
[16:15] * dreamreal is poring through the datasheet on the mcp3002 :/
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[16:20] <gordonDrogon> http://unicorn.drogon.net/mcp3002.[ch] if you want to drop it into wiringPi :)
[16:21] * daswort (~daswort@ubuntuusers/wikiteam/daswort) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:21] <gordonDrogon> it's the same chip as is on the Gertboard.
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[16:21] <gordonDrogon> lunchtime now.
[16:22] * DrJ (~a@unaffiliated/bacon) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:22] <dreamreal> gordonDrogon: typo: mcp3002.c refers to the mcp2003 :)
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[17:11] * Scriven (~nevirsc@S01060026f3c70320.vc.shawcable.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[17:12] * Milos (~Milos@pdpc/supporter/student/milos) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
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[17:14] * quaisi (~simon@host-92-21-79-210.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:16] <johnc-> ah, somebody said my name overnight but it's scrolled too far off my page
[17:17] * esing (~esing@unaffiliated/esing) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:17] <ShiftPlusOne> now we'll never know D=
[17:17] <ShiftPlusOne> It was about the pictures you posted
[17:17] <ShiftPlusOne> I think someone asked what platform you were using or something like that
[17:18] <ShiftPlusOne> There we go
[17:18] <ShiftPlusOne> Nikon D5100
[17:18] <ShiftPlusOne> <mike_t> johnc- woo, my pi project is alive! http://i.imgur.com/3cDk418.png // what platform?
[17:18] <ShiftPlusOne> (wrong paste)
[17:18] * Milos_ is now known as Milos
[17:19] <johnc-> it's mono/.NET running on my pi (connected to other computers on my network :)
[17:20] <ShiftPlusOne> well, he's gone now.
[17:20] <johnc-> it's still interesting !
[17:20] <jelly1> xbmc 1.0
[17:20] <jelly1> sadly mono :P
[17:20] * stepcut (~stepcut@c-24-12-184-84.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:20] <johnc-> hehe, it's kinda like xbmc yeah but verrrry different
[17:21] <johnc-> video = one small part
[17:21] <johnc-> what's wrong with mono? I love it :)
[17:21] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:21] <IT_Sean> It's only half as good as stereo!
[17:22] <IT_Sean> And only 1.5th as good as 5.1 surround!!!
[17:22] <IT_Sean> *1/5th
[17:22] <johnc-> silly man
[17:22] <IT_Sean> ??
[17:23] <johnc-> mono = .NET for everything
[17:23] <johnc-> think Java but good
[17:23] <ShiftPlusOne> so, don't think java.
[17:23] <IT_Sean> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhh. I see.
[17:23] <IT_Sean> Nevermind then
[17:24] <johnc-> in essence it's the same principle, in practice it's much better than Java
[17:24] <johnc-> write once, run anywhere
[17:24] <TheSnide> johnc-: does MonoGame run on the Pi ?
[17:24] * MichaelC1 is now known as MichaelC
[17:25] <johnc-> TheSnide: if you could get OpenTK to run on the pi then I'd imagine so
[17:25] <TheSnide> _that_ would be an awesome gamedev learning tool
[17:25] <jelly1> I'd rather think C++ then mono :P
[17:25] <jelly1> s/think/use/g
[17:25] <johnc-> c++ is a horrific language to work in though
[17:25] <jelly1> or C
[17:26] <johnc-> C is quite nice
[17:26] <TheSnide> monogame is quite nice on noobs
[17:26] <johnc-> aye
[17:26] <jelly1> but the best is python imo :p
[17:26] * nailora (~nailor@static.88-198-23-102.clients.your-server.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:26] <johnc-> XNA was actually quite decent, could really have used more love from MS
[17:26] <jelly1> isn't it dumped already?
[17:27] <TheSnide> johnc-: yup. the only issue i can think of is the cumbersome way to make networked games.
[17:27] <johnc-> sadly, MS won't be improving on it or maintaining it
[17:27] <TheSnide> johnc-: as, dedicated server is a PITA to do.
[17:27] <jelly1> lol
[17:27] <TheSnide> johnc-: MonoGame is quite a decent port.
[17:28] <nailora> can i make raspbian boot to the graphical desktop without logging in automatically? just boot to the session manager (if that is the right name)? i mean just as normal desktop linuxes (ubuntu, debian, ...) do?
[17:28] <TheSnide> yet, it has questionable requirements
[17:28] <jelly1> nailora: install lxdm or such
[17:28] <jelly1> nailora: your google term would be a 'login manager'
[17:28] <TheSnide> like, very recent OpenGL version.
[17:28] <Bushmills> "desktop without logging in"? who's the user running that desktop?
[17:28] <ShiftPlusOne> No D fans? D=
[17:28] * Jck_true (~jcktrue.d@unaffiliated/jcktrue/x-390518) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:28] <TheSnide> ShiftPlusOne: D ? as the language ?
[17:29] <ShiftPlusOne> yup
[17:29] <jelly1> ShiftPlusOne: no one!
[17:29] <TheSnide> ShiftPlusOne: well...
[17:29] <jelly1> ShiftPlusOne: we are all rust fans now :p
[17:30] <mgottschlag> D would be an interesting language... if the compilers were better
[17:30] <johnc-> sorry, C# is too nice to me to use much else
[17:30] <johnc-> same code running on pi is used on my android phone so I can decide what videos to watch from my phone
[17:35] <TheSnide> johnc-: http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=1225&start=25
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[17:35] <TheSov> is there any way to optimize the the pi for use as samba server?
[17:36] <Triffid_Hunter> TheSov: don't think it takes much optimisation, just install samba and fire it up
[17:36] <johnc-> TheSnide: seems about right
[17:36] <johnc-> can't wait for hf support in mono
[17:37] * klm[_] (milkman@unaffiliated/klm-/x-7727058) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:37] <TheSov> sigh, the thing is corrupting data when i get multiple writes going
[17:37] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:39] <TheSnide> jelly1: beside i tend to agree with a post on said forum "I'm also thinking that C# is a dramatically more sensible language for them to learn than Python"
[17:39] <johnc-> who is "them"?
[17:40] * jelly1 woudl still go for python, cross platform, tons of libs and a sane upstream
[17:40] <nailora> jelly1: thanks. jelly1: Bushmills: http://askubuntu.com/a/150125 was what i was looking for
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[17:41] <johnc-> scripting languages also tend to have a much lower barrier for new users
[17:41] <TheSnide> jelly1: screw python. go Perl.
[17:41] <jelly1> lol already know perl
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[17:42] <TheSnide> would also fit the "cross platform, tons of libs and a sane upstream"
[17:42] <TheSnide> :)
[17:42] <jelly1> haha
[17:43] <jelly1> perl is fun too
[17:44] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccyRegeane_Away
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[17:45] <trijntje> Hi all, what is the recommended way to create a backup of the sd card to restor if it should get corrupted?
[17:45] <sraue> hiho, ShiftPlusOne... or anyone you maybe know who is the berryboot guy
[17:46] <TheSnide> trijntje: dd
[17:46] * sparqz (~sparqz@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[17:46] <TheSnide> trijntje: ie, the same way you wrote your sd card in the 1st place, just reversed.
[17:46] <ShiftPlusOne> sraue, no idea, sorry. I haven't seen him here, but he seems to go by maxnet on github.
[17:47] <trijntje> TheSnide, if I insert the sd card it registers as two devices instead of one: mmcblk0p1 and mmcblk0p2
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[17:48] <johnc-> hmm, I wonder how xbmc gets notifications to appear above the video
[17:48] <nid0> trijntje: dd mmcblk0, the p1 and p2 refer to individual partitions
[17:49] <ShiftPlusOne> sraue, just checked the forum and his account seems to be gone.
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[17:50] <trijntje> nid0, thanks, I wasn't able to find the device name
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[17:51] <sraue> ShiftPlusOne, ok, thanks, i will see if i find him...
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[18:10] <TheSnide> seems that the pi is _very_ sensitive to bad sd
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[18:24] <Megaf1> folks, any of you using your rpi as NAS?
[18:24] * Megaf1 is now known as Megaf_
[18:24] * Megaf_ is now known as _Megaf
[18:25] <troulouliou_dev> _Megaf, yes
[18:26] <_Megaf> I'm thinking in using mine as a NAS
[18:26] <_Megaf> so, I will buy two 1TB laptop SATA drives, and plug them on a powered usb hub
[18:26] <_Megaf> and use them in software RAID 1
[18:27] <_Megaf> what do you think about this solution?
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[18:31] <troulouliou_dev> _Megaf, if you are planning to use nas only it should be ok
[18:32] * izdubar is now known as MarkDude
[18:32] <_Megaf> yep, NAS only, and the disks would be only for NAS files storage, the system itself will be on the sd card
[18:32] <_Megaf> with no services running but the essential ones
[18:32] <_Megaf> I actually have this working already, but with not disks yet, using a 16 GB usb key for testing
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[18:33] <troulouliou_dev> _Megaf, mine is serving NAS / used as git server / downloading torrent through deluged; i have no Raid but it works perfectly since several months
[18:33] <_Megaf> cool
[18:33] <_Megaf> and what about clock speed? stock or underclock?
[18:34] <troulouliou_dev> _Megaf, if you plan to stream to a htpc hd vid ; then more then 1 connection can lead to some lag
[18:34] <troulouliou_dev> _Megaf, medium for overclocking
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[18:42] <johnc-> I'm not sure I understand the appeal of rpi as a NAS
[18:42] <johnc-> if you're going to use usb disks then just plug them into whatever device you already have, surely
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[18:44] <IT_Sean> johnc-: If you want them accessible, simultaneously, to multiple machines, via the network, a NAS is a pretty good option. Not sure i'd use a Pi for the job, though.
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[18:45] <johnc-> IT_Sean: I get the NAS thing, I have a 4TB RAID 6 in my linux box, I just don't get the USB drive via pi thing
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[18:46] <IT_Sean> I agree, it's less than ideal, but, for just shuffling files about, it's not a half bad option.
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[18:46] <johnc-> heh, people buying pis and wondering what to do with them is my bet - it IS a cool little thing :)
[18:47] <and`> hi, my old rpi was showing a red power light, I thought it was broken and replaced it with a new one, but even the new one keeps having a power red light, I've then bought a new power supply, pulled it in and the rpi keeps not booting, what might be wrong?
[18:47] <IT_Sean> and`: Did you properly write the OS image to the SD?
[18:47] <and`> the SD card is correctly formatted et all, my pc mounts it correctly
[18:47] <IT_Sean> The Power LED is supposed to be red. It is not a multi-color LED.
[18:48] <IT_Sean> Do you get any video at all?
[18:48] <and`> IT_Sean, correct, but no other lights are appearing, let me check the video now, one second
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[18:48] <IT_Sean> Does the ACT LED blink at all?
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[18:51] <and`> IT_Sean, no, no video at all and no ACT LED blinking at all
[18:51] <and`> IT_Sean, just the power one, nothing else
[18:51] <IT_Sean> What's the rating on your PSU?
[18:52] <and`> IT_Sean, http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/904582P6240008.jpg
[18:52] <and`> IT_Sean, it's a 5V, 900mA
[18:52] <IT_Sean> That should do it.
[18:52] <and`> the old way is an 5V, 1200mA
[18:52] <and`> s/way/one
[18:52] <IT_Sean> I'd say your SD card isn't done correctly,.
[18:52] <ShiftPlusOne> and`, that is an SD card issue. Have you tried other cards? Other brands?
[18:53] * _Megaf (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/megaf) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[18:53] <and`> unfortunately I have no SD cards handy at home, the card that is currently inserted worked for around 6-7 months without a problem
[18:53] <and`> one day it suddenly rebooted the Pi and took in the red light on the power
[18:53] <and`> maybe the SD card got corrupted?
[18:54] <IT_Sean> could be.
[18:54] <ShiftPlusOne> have you tried re-writting the disk image?
[18:54] <and`> yeah, today
[18:54] <and`> twice
[18:54] * esing (~esing@unaffiliated/esing) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:55] <ShiftPlusOne> then corruption would not be a problem. The pi does not see the card as far as I can tell
[18:55] <ShiftPlusOne> maybe dust in the connector, maybe a bad card, maybe an incompatible card, maybe the firmware is messed up... could be a lot of things.
[18:56] <and`> both the old and the new rpi are currently behaving the same, so I'm sure it can't be dust in the connector, neither an incompatible card (it worked for 6-7 months with no problems and it was suggested on the RS website as 'working' for the rpi)
[18:56] <IT_Sean> Have you got another Pi to try the card in?
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[18:56] <and`> yes
[18:56] <IT_Sean> And it fails in both?
[18:56] <and`> yes, exactly
[18:56] <IT_Sean> It's the card.
[18:57] <ShiftPlusOne> I don't think the 6 to 7 month thing means much.... other than that it's old and is more likely to be bad.
[18:57] <and`> I should definitely buy a new card and pull it in
[18:57] <and`> the power supply isn't the problem, tried with two different supplies and the result is the same
[18:58] <and`> no other items are attached to the pi, so smth is up with the card
[18:58] <ShiftPlusOne> or what's on it
[18:59] <ShiftPlusOne> I have seen people here say that the disk image seems to write correctly, without any errors, but result in an unusable card. A different sd reader/writer fixed the problem for them.
[18:59] <ShiftPlusOne> but yeah, my bet is on the card being bad
[18:59] * IT_Sean adds a fiver to that bet
[19:00] <johnc-> oh IT_Sean is a brit?
[19:01] * and` goes to the shop
[19:01] <IT_Sean> johnc-: Irish... And i live in the states.
[19:01] <and`> bbl
[19:01] <johnc-> IT_Sean: cool, I'm English and live in the states :)
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[19:14] <m0nk3yjoe> hello everyone
[19:14] <m0nk3yjoe> If I am using DD to flash my image on Ubuntu to I need to unmount the flash drive before I do this?
[19:14] <arcanescu> cool im not english and i stil llive in the states
[19:15] <ShiftPlusOne> m0nk3yjoe, yes, absolutely.
[19:17] <m0nk3yjoe> silly question... why?
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[19:19] <ShiftPlusOne> m0nk3yjoe, if you have a mounted filesystem and you start messing with the data in the way that dd does, you could have unpredictable results.
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[19:19] <m0nk3yjoe> should I sync before unmount too?
[19:19] <ShiftPlusOne> Probably not, but I am paranoid and do it anyway.
[19:20] <ladoga> no...you're going to overwrite it anyway
[19:20] * clonak3 (~clonak@ Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[19:20] <ShiftPlusOne> Ah, I thought you meant sync after dd'ing, my mistake.
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[19:21] <ShiftPlusOne> yeah, doesn't matter what you do before dd'ing, as long as it's not mounted.
[19:21] <rymate1234> aw shiiii
[19:21] <rymate1234> knocked my raspberry pi on the flooe
[19:21] <rymate1234> *floow
[19:21] <rymate1234> *floor
[19:21] <rymate1234> power cable came out
[19:22] <rymate1234> lets see how much corruption
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[19:23] <m0nk3yjoe> ShiftPlusOne, I'm sayin after DDing
[19:23] <rymate1234> huh
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[19:23] <rymate1234> no corruption
[19:23] <m0nk3yjoe> http://n00blab.com/how-to-create-raspberry-pi-sd-card/ is this correct?
[19:24] <rymate1234> yup
[19:24] <johnc-> I need to put my pi into a case and strap it to my TV
[19:24] <rymate1234> by the looks of it
[19:24] <ShiftPlusOne> m0nk3yjoe, after dding, it shouldn't be mounted, so " sync before unmount" doesn't make much sense. Either way, you're overthinking it. The command sin that article are correct, yes.
[19:24] <m0nk3yjoe> ShiftPlusOne, Ok thanks
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[20:02] <_Trullo> how do I get javascript working on a raspberry pi?
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[20:05] <ShiftPlusOne> midori doesn't support javascript by default? O_o
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[20:14] <rymate1234> I feel like making a web browser for the rpi
[20:14] <rymate1234> that renders with opengles
[20:14] <rymate1234> would that be possible?
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[20:19] <SpeedEvil> did someone highlight me?
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[20:25] <Elspuddy> hello
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[20:33] <TheSnide> SpeedEvil: dunno before. but now yes /me feels evil
[20:34] <TheSnide> rymate1234: better have X11 working with accelerated hw
[20:34] <TheSnide> rymate1234: that way you have everything fast
[20:36] <sandman> Well, I wonder how long it will be before we have that.
[20:36] <sandman> Accelerated X, I mean.
[20:37] <rymate1234> but that won't help much
[20:39] <_Trullo> http://qassoom.me/techie/2012/12/09/raspberry-pi-digital-clock/ trying to get that to work, but nothing.. just a blank screen :(
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[20:46] <gordonDrogon> well thats wiringPi vs. pushed...
[20:47] <TheSnide> sandman: iirc there were a link to exa here before
[20:47] <gordonDrogon> _Trullo, didn't you post yesterday about that? that's one hugely complex way to make the Pi into a clock.
[20:48] <sandman> exa?
[20:48] <sandman> You mean Simon's?
[20:48] <gordonDrogon> if you have X running, then sudo apt-get install xdaliclock && ./xdaliclock &
[20:48] <TheSnide> gordonDrogon: specially since clocks are cheapo :)
[20:48] <TheSnide> sandman: nah, ext X accel
[20:48] <gordonDrogon> even the original xclock is a nice little clock.
[20:49] <TheSnide> (or something like that"
[20:49] * shuxx (55aa303d@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/session) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:49] <shuxx> Hi all
[20:49] <sandman> Well. I see no reason why you couldn't use the Pi as your main PC, if we could get some decent acceleration going.
[20:49] <sandman> The only thing holding it up, as far as I can tell, really is the ability for the X server and related programs to run speedily. The overclocking bit helps a little, but not a while lot.
[20:50] <sandman> whole*
[20:50] <rymate1234> I just managed to get wayland/weston working on the Pi
[20:50] <[Saint]> in 1023 1GHz does not a PC make.
[20:50] <TheSnide> sandman: that's what i was thinking. as i also have a p2-500 as main PC :)
[20:50] <[Saint]> errr, 2013 even.
[20:50] <rymate1234> (alternate GUI stack)
[20:50] <rymate1234> didn't run too badly
[20:51] <sandman> TheSnide: Well, I have a much more powerful PC as my main, but I'd rather use the RPi as my main for a lot of reasons. The least among them is that it has no moving parts, makes no noise whatsoever (I dislike noisy computers), and has very low power consumption.
[20:51] <sandman> I have a powerful Alienware PC which I will happily _give_ away if I could just get the RPi to work comfortably.
[20:51] <shuxx> Who use A psps screen for raspberry ?
[20:51] <TheSnide> sandman: hehe
[20:51] <[Saint]> there's a lot more boards out there much more well suited than the rpi for a PC repolacement.
[20:52] <johnc-> ^^
[20:52] <[Saint]> Look at one of the Geodes for example.
[20:52] <sandman> 1GHz? No, I'd run stock 700MHz for stability.
[20:52] <TheSnide> [Saint]: but they dont have a raspberry drawn on them.
[20:52] <[Saint]> So, basically....a cellpohone :)
[20:52] * Macer (mace@scientiam.org) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:52] <Macer> how odd.. i installed raspbian yesterday
[20:53] <Macer> waiting like hours... go to boot it again.. and it doesn't boot? :-/
[20:53] <johnc-> rpi = an out of date cellphone :P
[20:53] * Macer facepalm
[20:53] <johnc-> sd card fail?
[20:53] <sandman> For the record, using proper priority levels, I've setup one of my RPi's to act as a superserver; Samba, FTP/SSH, webserver, terminal server (xrdp (though this doesn't perform too well, will likely replace this with NX)), mumble server which is in active use, and a whole lot more.
[20:53] <IT_Sean> It's actually more like an out of date set top box, as that is what that SoC is intended for.
[20:53] <[Saint]> johnc-: well, i8ndeed, a cellphone from 2008 or so :)
[20:53] <sandman> It's also hooked up to a USB hub, has numerous external drives hooked up, and it generally sits @ only ~5% CPU utilization, almost never caps out, and that's at stock 700 MHz.
[20:54] <sandman> I also browse on it using dillo, which works fine.
[20:54] * [Saint] cannot type with a kitten on the keyboard
[20:54] <IT_Sean> [Saint]: rm -rf /kitten
[20:54] <johnc-> IT_Sean: hooray, I'm using it for that purpose!
[20:54] <rymate1234> My pi is a print server!
[20:54] <TheSnide> [Saint]: train the kitten to type for you
[20:54] <sandman> For example, there are 7 people connected to my superserver pi atm, and it's only using 10% CPU
[20:54] <Macer> heh
[20:54] <rymate1234> and occasionally I run shit on it
[20:54] * IT_Sean prefers his solution
[20:54] <Macer> rymate1234: really?
[20:54] <rymate1234> Macer, yup
[20:54] <Macer> this day and age most printers have that stuff built in :)
[20:55] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[20:55] <sandman> I see no reason why one couldn't use the RPi as a main PC. I'd also like to add that the 3D performance is better than we fully understand, yet.
[20:55] <rymate1234> Macer, mine doesn't!
[20:55] * rymate1234 was kicked from #raspberrypi by IT_Sean
[20:55] * rymate1234 (~rymate@znc.rymate.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:55] <johnc-> IT_Sean: what solution is that?
[20:55] <rymate1234> wat
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[20:55] <rymate1234> oh
[20:55] * Macer kicks his pi
[20:55] <rymate1234> I said a swear
[20:55] * IT_Sean nods
[20:56] <Macer> my grand experiement of using the pi as a desktop seems to be taking a turn for the worse :)
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[20:56] <sandman> Macer: Why? I use it sort of as a desktop.
[20:56] <rymate1234> Macer, just wait until wayland becomes more mature
[20:56] <sandman> Agreed.
[20:56] <rymate1234> wayland seems to work well
[20:56] <Macer> sandman: because i installed raspbian yesterday.. and now it didn't boot
[20:56] <Macer> so i am re-installing
[20:56] <Macer> weird
[20:56] <rymate1234> just that weston only has a terminal at the moment
[20:56] <sandman> Macer: Well, surely you backed up?
[20:56] <Macer> no idea what happened there.. SD looked intact
[20:57] <Macer> sandman: it was a fresh install.. i'm just re-installing
[20:57] <Macer> i didn't use it at all.. just installed raspbian and turned it off
[20:57] <sandman> When you say reinstall, you mean... reflash the image?
[20:57] <[Saint]> If you expect the rpi to be a ccapable desktop replacement, you either have a warped idea of what a desktop is capable of, or are just plain delusional ;)
[20:57] <sandman> [Saint]: How so?
[20:57] <Macer> [Saint]: or i just don't have massive desktop requirements ;)
[20:58] <[Saint]> sandman: it works out at less than a 16th the power of my desktop.
[20:58] * Macer isn't going to assume he will be playing call of duty on the pi
[20:59] <Macer> but right now i have an 8 year old 300W full tower that i use as a workstation.. it's loud and bulky
[20:59] <Macer> the pi i can hang on the wall :)
[20:59] <Macer> with a usb hub next to it
[20:59] <[Saint]> right, indeed. I'll take that as "warped idea of what a PC is capable of" then. :)
[20:59] <Macer> lol
[20:59] * Orion___ (~Orion_@ Quit (Quit: ~ Trillian Astra - www.trillian.im ~)
[20:59] <Macer> i guess ;) i still would like to try it out to see what it can do
[20:59] <sandman> [Saint]: Less than that for my current desktop. But the RPi is still more viable as a desktop than my Alienware by far.
[20:59] <sandman> The Alienware has proprietary junk in it with no hope of community support, it sucks power, makes tons of noise, and is full of distractions resulting from the closed-nature of its design.
[20:59] <sandman> My RPi is quiet, cool to the touch, requires almost no power, and largely Just Works. There are a few things that don't, but at least it doesn't choke up and break for no apparent reason.
[20:59] <Macer> at the very least it's like a stronger version of my N900 and i get along wtih that just fine
[20:59] <Macer> only thing is that maemo apps don't really have much by way of printer support
[20:59] <[Saint]> The n900 actually kicks its ass.
[21:00] <sandman> I would say the RPi makes a far more effective main PC than your run of the mill desktop PC.
[21:00] <sandman> [Saint]: I disagree. The n900 costs far more.
[21:00] <rymate1234> I disagree
[21:00] <[Saint]> Who was talking about cost?
[21:00] <sandman> Cost factors into "kick ass" factor.
[21:00] <rymate1234> The Pi is a lot less powerful than a netbook
[21:01] <rymate1234> you're not going to get a good experience out of $35
[21:01] <sandman> If an n900 cost $350, for example, and the RPi costs $35, that means you could buy 10x RPi's instead of one n900
[21:01] <sandman> And cluster them together. That'd be the equivelant of 7 GHz of computational power.
[21:01] <sandman> 7GHz will crush whatever the n900 has to offer.
[21:01] <Macer> hm
[21:01] <sandman> So there's your ass-kicking factor.
[21:01] <[Saint]> Except for the fact that an n900 is nowhere near that price now..
[21:01] <Macer> this sure does seem to be taking a long time to make an ext3 filesystem
[21:01] <taza> And also, clustering? That's preeetty silly.
[21:01] <sandman> Even if it's only 3x more costly, it still loses.
[21:02] <sandman> [Saint]: I'm starting to think you're the one with a warped/delusional idea of what a desktop is =)
[21:02] <taza> sandman: Go somewhere else to troll.
[21:02] <rymate1234> by clustering, you basically remove the low power and small size of the RPi
[21:02] <[Saint]> Forgive me for keeping up with modern hardware.
[21:02] <[Saint]> Have fun in the past. :)
[21:02] <sandman> Troll? lol
[21:02] <Macer> ok i think this thing is broken
[21:03] <sandman> [Saint]: I have a gaming Alienware PC as well. I just don't herald it as some holy grail as you do.
[21:03] <Macer> it's been stuck formatting this sd for far longer than it should
[21:03] <TheSnide> [Saint]: well, i'm mostly using my 2011 phone for my day tasks. it just lacks a big screen, a keyb and a mouse.
[21:03] <[Saint]> No, I'm completely serious. The rpi is great - but it has no place as a desktop replacement if you actually want to do anything other than simple web browsing or some trivial hosting.
[21:03] <Macer> and the debug console doesn't really say much :-/
[21:03] <sandman> And no, I'm not trolling. Observer: http://www.huntrods.com/teaching/raspberrypi.html
[21:03] <sandman> RPi supercomputing.
[21:04] <[Saint]> There's a lot more boards out there that are far more suited as desktop replacements.
[21:04] <sandman> It's no joke. At a $35 price point, it mops the floor up with the likes of the n900 as well as "desktop" PC's. Not trolling.
[21:04] <TheSnide> sandman: well, supercomputing with Pi is ... almost trolling :)
[21:04] <sandman> Just that it's not an out-of-the-box easy setup.
[21:04] <Macer> huh?
[21:04] <Macer> n900 isn't a desktop tho :) it's a phone haha
[21:05] <rymate1234> sandman, if a Pi is so good, why isn't everyone using them as desktops?
[21:05] <rymate1234> why is everyone using
[21:05] <rymate1234> uh
[21:05] <IT_Sean> It's not just a phone... It's the chuck norris of phones!
[21:05] <rymate1234> actual computers
[21:05] <[Saint]> I have a wee bit of experience with rpi clusters, and, while possible...it is ridiculously impractical.
[21:05] * datagutt (~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt) Quit (Quit: kthxbai)
[21:05] <nid0> the chuck norris of phones but with a crummy keyboard
[21:05] <TheSnide> [Saint]: i came to rpi not because it's the most suited to task, but because huge number of devices means huge support for anything
[21:05] <sandman> rymate1234: Lack of 3D accelerated X, fully optimized software, and general lack of ease regarding setting up what I was just talking about.
[21:06] <sandman> It will be in time, though, I think.
[21:06] <rymate1234> precisely
[21:06] <rymate1234> and it probably isn't going to
[21:06] <sandman> rymate1234: RPi _is_ an actual computer.
[21:06] <IT_Sean> sandman: it's a dev board, not a chromebook. If you want something idiotproof, the raspi is not for you
[21:06] <Macer> hm. i am starting to suspect that maybe this SD is bad? :-/
[21:06] <Macer> wow. it's brand new
[21:06] <sandman> Well, good thing I don't want that =)
[21:06] <IT_Sean> Okay then!
[21:06] <rymate1234> sandman, linux is a small portion of the market
[21:06] <rymate1234> and the raspberry pi is a small portion of linux
[21:06] <IT_Sean> small, but growing, rymate1234
[21:06] <IT_Sean> on both counts
[21:07] <rymate1234> IT_Sean, I know!
[21:07] <Macer> maybe when the fs got trashed when i was using the pi as a server the sd somehow managed to break
[21:07] <sandman> Macer: Did you OC?
[21:07] * [Saint] assures Macer that the sdcard almost certainly isn't "broken"
[21:07] <Macer> rymate1234: tbh the success of the pi seems more so in the fact that it can run xbmc distros than "linux"
[21:07] <Macer> which is what a LOT of the sales are for
[21:07] <Macer> runs it quite well too tbh :)
[21:07] <[Saint]> trashed os != "broken sdcard".
[21:07] <IT_Sean> I fully admit to using mine as an xbmc rig
[21:07] <[Saint]> It is basically impossible to kill an sdcard with normal use.
[21:08] <sandman> Me too.
[21:08] <Macer> [Saint]: yeah but there was still no reason for it break to begin with
[21:08] <TheSnide> sandman: i do bet on "too many devs with too much free time" for the rpi to be a good plateform soonish
[21:08] <IT_Sean> it is epically good for that
[21:08] <Macer> let me start over (again) something isn't working here
[21:08] <sandman> Along with a ton of other things. I'd say my primary use of it is as a fileserver.
[21:08] <sandman> TheSnide: Agreed =)
[21:09] <Macer> well i'm just saying that the xbmc distros are based off linux .. openelec is probably the best and took a more embedded approach which works great for the pi
[21:09] <sandman> Yeah but can't you just take Raspbian, and install all that stuff? That's what I did.
[21:09] <Macer> but no. the pi is no powerhouse in computing power :) the soc just happens to be great for playing awesome video heh
[21:09] <gordonDrogon> ugh. and as soon as I push it out, I find a bug. Bother.
[21:09] <sandman> Macer: What about its ability to decode 1080p video flawlessly?
[21:09] * chod looks in
[21:09] <Macer> sandman: you can but why bother if you're going to have it hooked up to a tv all day? lol.. just pay another $35 and get another one
[21:09] <TheSnide> Macer: to be fair, the cpu is quite decent. the io does suck.
[21:09] <Macer> that is the point. they're cheap.
[21:10] <sandman> Macer: Because I've xrdp setup on it, too
[21:10] <Macer> TheSnide: i guess. it's 700MHz capable of being overclocked to 1GHz single core with 512MB?
[21:10] <Macer> it's actually crap in terms of what arm soc can do nowadays ;)
[21:10] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:10] <Macer> but the gpu decodes awesome 1080p h264 heh
[21:10] <rymate1234> I wish I had the 512MB pi
[21:11] * IT_Sean has a 512 raspi, running OpenElec
[21:11] <sandman> Macer: You said it =) Now if we could just get the GPU-accelerated X
[21:11] <Macer> it is decent .. but a piece of me is wishing there was a REAL arm based laptop/desktop to use
[21:11] <chod> not noticved much difference
[21:11] <sandman> Macer: Well, build one =)
[21:11] <Macer> sandman: well. i thought they were using layman?
[21:11] <rymate1234> Macer, some chromebooks are ARM
[21:11] * _h0c1n_ (~h0cin@unaffiliated/h0cin) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:11] <Macer> rymate1234: yeah i heard. some people install debian on them :) but the battery life sucks
[21:11] <sandman> Why not look at those cluster computing samples. Buy a desktop PC case, stuff 20 RPi's in it, and go nuts.
[21:11] <Macer> or ubuntu.. can't remember
[21:12] * ldav15 (~ldavis@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:12] <rymate1234> sandman, when's the last time you saw a cluster compatible Xorg
[21:12] <rymate1234> hint - not possible afaik
[21:12] <Macer> 20pis = $800.. can they mine bitcoins? :-P
[21:12] * MartyMacFly (~Marty@p4FDCC86E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:12] * yofel_ (~quassel@ubuntu/member/yofel) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:12] <Macer> lol
[21:13] <IT_Sean> Macer: you could spend several lifetimes bitcoin mining with one or more pis and still not manage to pay for the electricty they use, let alone the hardware
[21:13] <Macer> IT_Sean: i was joking ;)
[21:13] <[Saint]> Indeed.
[21:13] <sandman> IT_Sean: How do the folks using their GPUs do it?
[21:13] * loffa (~loffa@81-224-56-252-no238.tbcn.telia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:13] <[Saint]> It'd never pay for itself, let alone the electricity.
[21:13] * NiklosKoda (~Niklos@88-191-158-211.rev.dedibox.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:13] <sandman> Are GPU's able to outperform the cost/watt ratio and pay for themselves?
[21:13] <Macer> is there something that i can use to block test an SD in an x86 mint box?
[21:13] <johnc-> they are what we call "fanatics"
[21:14] <[Saint]> sandman: they have GPUs that take a fat dump on the rpi.
[21:14] <[Saint]> that's how. :)
[21:14] <IT_Sean> ^ that.
[21:14] <sandman> Yeah but what about the GPU on the RPi
[21:14] <Bushmills> there's a device which may. low power AND high performance
[21:14] <[Saint]> sandman: what about it? "it sucks".
[21:14] <[Saint]> ..basically.
[21:14] <rymate1234> sandman, Powerful GPU's have OpenCL
[21:14] <Macer> [Saint]: just shove it in the corner of the office
[21:14] <Macer> lol
[21:14] <rymate1234> the raspberry pi one doesn't have enough power
[21:14] <rymate1234> at all
[21:15] * KindOne- (KindOne@colchester-lug/silly-fool/donut) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:15] * Kabaka (kabaka@botters/kabaka) Quit (Excess Flood)
[21:15] * h0cin (~h0cin@unaffiliated/h0cin) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:15] * yofel (~quassel@ubuntu/member/yofel) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:15] * troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:16] * na85 (astra@genuine.advantage.wind0ws.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:16] <[Saint]> the guys mining bitcoins on GPU often have quad-crossfire setup AMD 79** series GPUs running at full tit.
[21:16] * KindOne (KindOne@colchester-lug/silly-fool/donut) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:16] <[Saint]> a raspi cluster doesn't even come close to *one* of those GPUs.
[21:16] <taza> BitCoins is now done with ASICs.
[21:16] <[Saint]> Let alone 2 or more.
[21:16] * klm[_] (milkman@unaffiliated/klm-/x-7727058) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:16] * jelly1 (~jelly12ge@archlinux/trusteduser/jelly1) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:16] <taza> Also, BitCoins? They haven't been worth the electricity they take to mine for years
[21:16] * yofel_ is now known as yofel
[21:16] <[Saint]> taza: .....errrrrr.
[21:17] <[Saint]> That is quite untrue.
[21:17] <[Saint]> terribly so.
[21:17] <taza> It is entirely true.
[21:17] * KindOne- is now known as KindOne
[21:17] <[Saint]> It is just that Average joe with his 10 year old PC doesn't have a chance anymore.
[21:17] <Bushmills> "Up to 96 billion operations per second Instantaneous power ranges from 14 microwatts to 650 milliwatts."
[21:17] <[Saint]> Get a modern system, then, sure.
[21:17] * na85 (astra@genuine.advantage.wind0ws.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:17] <gordonDrogon> bitcoin mining using custom hardware: http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/05/butterfly_live/
[21:18] <ladoga> Macer: stick it into some other linux device (unmounted) and run badblocks -n -v /dev/mmcblk0
[21:18] * jelly1 (~jelly12ge@archlinux/trusteduser/jelly1) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:18] <[Saint]> If bitcoin mining couldn;t pay for itself - virtually no one would be doing it. Simple fact.
[21:18] <gordonDrogon> it's FPGAs rather than ASICs, but the effect is the same...
[21:18] <ParkerR> gordonDrogon, Heh a while back their site was having issues
[21:18] <taza> [Saint]: You're underestimating the stupidity of the average idiot.
[21:18] <[Saint]> Fact is, if you have the hardware, it certainly can pay for itself. IFF you have the hardware.
[21:18] <ParkerR> Didnt know they were still around
[21:19] <Macer> oh
[21:19] * n3hxs (~ed@pool-108-16-94-10.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:19] <taza> [Saint]: How about actual facts: You are wrong.
[21:19] <Macer> ladoga: ah ok
[21:19] <[Saint]> Ok taza have fun in delusional land.
[21:19] <ladoga> Macer: that will too wear out sd card..so don't run it too often
[21:19] <[Saint]> Say hi to the Space Pope for me.
[21:19] <ParkerR> gordonDrogon, Aww they got rid of the ~$150 flat one
[21:19] <ParkerR> :(
[21:19] <TheSnide> whatls the diff betweem openelec and xbmc ?
[21:20] <taza> The price of bitcoins, even with custom boards, is far below the electricity. Even if it were to rise a great deal, it'd still never make up for the hardware.
[21:20] <ladoga> sd cards are crap :)
[21:20] <Macer> ladoga: well.... does it just do 1 pass?
[21:20] <gordonDrogon> I wonder if the folks at butterfly labs will make more money selling these 'miners' than actually using them to mine BC's themselves... It's an intersting business concept :)
[21:20] <Macer> actually i think i know where i messed up
[21:20] <Macer> where are the instructions to use a linux box to install the img onto the sd?
[21:20] <ParkerR> The one they used to have is on the left https://forums.butterflylabs.com/content/attachments/400d1358119514-2013-01-11_044a.jpg.html
[21:21] <Macer> is it just a dd if=xxxxx.img of=/dev/xxx bs=4096
[21:21] <Macer> ?
[21:21] <ladoga> that's what i did
[21:21] <ParkerR> Macer, Dont even have to have the bs
[21:21] * geordie (~pi@S0106001124ed524e.vc.shawcable.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:21] <ladoga> wasn't aware of instructions
[21:21] * CounterPillow (~fratti@unaffiliated/counterpillow) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:22] <Macer> ladoga: yeah there are instructions in a pdf on the raspberrypi.org page for the raspbian img
[21:22] <ladoga> so just dd:d it to the card and then i think i resized the partition
[21:22] <Macer> but they're for windows only?
[21:22] <Macer> ladoga: doesn't the first boot allow you to resize?
[21:22] <Macer> or do you have to do it manually?
[21:22] <ParkerR> It does
[21:22] <IT_Sean> The initial boot should let you resize the partition
[21:22] <ParkerR> Or you can run raspi-config after
[21:22] <IT_Sean> ^
[21:23] <Macer> ok
[21:23] * CounterPillow (~fratti@unaffiliated/counterpillow) has left #raspberrypi
[21:23] <taza> gordonDrogon: The only people making money out of BitCoin are drug dealers, infrastructure operators and scammers.
[21:23] <Macer> well.. let me wait on this sd to write heh
[21:23] <ladoga> taza: and me
[21:23] <taza> The outcome will always be zero-sum.
[21:24] <ladoga> value bounces up and down so much it's quite easy to make some pocket money with it
[21:24] * tanuva (~tanuva@dslb-178-007-147-104.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:24] <taza> Or lose.
[21:24] <IT_Sean> It's probably easier to loose than to make.
[21:24] <ladoga> buy low sell high
[21:24] <Dagger2> bitcoin is a payment network. you make money from it in much the same way you make money from paypal
[21:24] <IT_Sean> Does it vary that much?
[21:24] <taza> What's "low" and "high" for entirely worthless hashes?
[21:25] <Dagger2> aka get people to send you money with it
[21:25] <Macer> taza: i thought you can order pizzas with bitcoins nowadays :)
[21:25] <Macer> taza: a lot of datacenters seem to accept them too
[21:25] * Megaf1 (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/megaf) Quit (Quit: Megaf1)
[21:25] <Macer> for their drug dealing!
[21:25] <taza> Macer: Funnily, you could, but then those restaurants went bankrupt
[21:25] <ladoga> last month it's been jumping 20 usd down and up per day
[21:25] <Macer> papa johns?
[21:25] <Macer> lol
[21:25] <ladoga> only stabilizing a bit since last week
[21:25] <Dagger2> (though you can also speculate on the exchange rate, and it pays for mining, but those are beside the main point of bitcoin)
[21:25] <Macer> ladoga: the USD does that a lot too
[21:25] <Macer> you just don't see it as much
[21:26] * Macer points at gas prices and buying power loss on a daily basis vs taxing
[21:26] <IT_Sean> ladoga: for a typical 9 hour day, that's about $2 per hour. So... a lot less than minimum wage.
[21:26] <taza> Oh, I remember when the USD dropped 66% in a day.
[21:26] <Macer> it's all the same.. massive reduction in an individual's buying power
[21:26] <taza> Oh, wait.
[21:26] <ladoga> IT_Sean: yes it's true...depends of the size of investment ofcourse
[21:26] <IT_Sean> Right
[21:27] <Macer> taza: the mexican peso was worth more than the USD in 2008
[21:27] <ladoga> i've just played with it during breaks at work
[21:27] <IT_Sean> But, for "pocket money" it's not worh it to.
[21:27] <taza> Macer: So? Look at their stability, then look at BitCoin.
[21:27] <ladoga> got few 100 bucks profits last month
[21:27] <Macer> the canadian$ is worth more than the USD now.. it used to be 2:1 that is a 100% reduction in global buying power for the USD in comparison to CAD
[21:27] <ladoga> about 20%
[21:27] * clonak3 (~clonak@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[21:28] <ladoga> of my initial investment
[21:28] <Macer> taza: i don't know... currency itself is incredibly volatile.. you just don't see it as obviously as btc
[21:28] <taza> Macer: Look at the major currencies.
[21:28] <taza> You are 100% wrong.
[21:28] <Macer> you just say "wow.. gas is $4.25.. it was $4.00 yesterday"
[21:28] <Macer> :)
[21:28] <taza> A-grade wrong, certified wrong.
[21:28] * ebarch (~ebarch@ has joined #raspberrypi
[21:28] <Macer> potato chips were $1.30 for a bag.. now they're $2
[21:28] <taza> The buying power goes down... in a stable fashion.
[21:28] * pretty_function (~sigBART@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:29] <taza> That's because the system is designed to have the buying power go down because it's better for everyone who's not hoarding their money.
[21:29] <Macer> taza: oh? so a $0.20 change at the pump overnight is a "stable fashion" ?
[21:29] <Macer> heh
[21:29] <Macer> maybe mentally stable.. incredibly volatile still if you ask me
[21:29] <taza> This is also literally Economics 101.
[21:29] <Macer> a better example would be volatility of gold vs btc
[21:29] <ladoga> but i'm not very optimistic about bitcoins future
[21:30] <taza> Inflation is designed into the system for a reason.
[21:30] <ladoga> it will crash sooner or later and not recover
[21:31] <Macer> gold can change $100+/- in an hour
[21:32] <Macer> taza: yeah .. to create an arbitrary number to show "growth"
[21:32] <taza> Macer: Yeah, good job on the dollar values over percentages over time period, real helpful.
[21:32] <taza> No, to get people to SPEND their money.
[21:32] <johnc-> send your gold to cash 4 gold, I'll give you my address and I'll pay you for your gold
[21:32] <Macer> to spend their lower valued money?
[21:32] <Macer> lol
[21:32] <Macer> wow.. so now you sold the same amount of good but required twice the energy just to sell it
[21:32] <taza> Yes, because your money is worth less now than last year, and it'll be worth less next year.
[21:33] <Macer> the expectation of exponential growth with finite resources.. and people wonder why we're doomed
[21:33] <taza> Therefore holding onto the money is not a solid plan, so you spend or invest the money, thus keeping the economy healthier.
[21:33] <Macer> and it isn't even real growth. it's simply a numbers game
[21:33] <Dagger2> most currencies are inflationary to get people to spend money
[21:33] <Dagger2> with deflationary currences, your money is worth more the longer you hold onto it
[21:33] * Scriven (~nevirsc@S01060026f3c70320.vc.shawcable.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:33] <Macer> Dagger2: but they're not promoting any REAL growth... it's just can kicking... more paper/energy for transactions required for less goods and services
[21:33] <ladoga> Macer: yeah just monopoly (the game) money
[21:33] <Dagger2> this is bad, because people starve to death because they refuse to buy food with their money, because their money will be able to buy more food tomorrow
[21:33] <Macer> and the real reason for inflation isn't really the planning
[21:33] <ladoga> not backed by anything concrete
[21:33] <Macer> it is political inability to raise taxes
[21:33] <Dagger2> ...wait, hang on a sec, huh? that doesn't sound right...
[21:33] <Macer> so you are just taxed with inflation vs an actual tax
[21:33] <Macer> because inflation feels better than saying you're getting taxed :)
[21:33] <taza> Macer: This is literally designed into the system and it isn't some kind of secret evil plan, if you took university-level economics you'd be told that without any lying involved.
[21:33] * thesov (~TheSov@50-76-75-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:34] * MarquessDeBonBon is now known as SirCrispinTheJew
[21:34] <taza> Okay, that stopped making any kind of sense.
[21:34] <Macer> it's a cliche arguement ;)
[21:34] <taza> This is all documented. Educate yourself instead of calling it a conspiracy. The system's manipulated... and the people manipulating it have quite clearly documented both how and why they're doing it.
[21:34] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) Quit (Excess Flood)
[21:35] <Macer> i'll do that ;)
[21:35] <Macer> hopefully i will survive in this dog eat dog world
[21:35] <Macer> lol
[21:35] <taza> You can't separate money from the economy it is in, money has no inherent worth.
[21:36] <taza> An inflationary economy is significantly stabler than a deflationary economy.
[21:36] <Macer> sure you can.. this was shown by the elimination of the gold standard .. but whatever. like i said. it is a cliche arguement
[21:36] <johnc-> s/money/currency
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[21:36] * Commander1024 (~Commander@Commander1024-2-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:36] <Macer> currrency is just an arbitrary number
[21:36] <Dagger2> bitcoin isn't really intended as a full economy anyway
[21:36] <Dagger2> it's just a payment network
[21:36] <Dagger2> you use it to send money to people
[21:36] <taza> BitCoin is a proof of concept. A broken, buggy proof of concept, long abandoned by its creator.
[21:36] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:37] <Macer> taza: just like earlier when our good president wanted to eliminate paper money altogether lol
[21:37] * and` (~and@debian/developer/and) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[21:37] <Macer> and give everybody debitlike cards
[21:37] * Delboy (~openwrt@2001:b68:fc00:8b08::1) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:37] <Dagger2> it serves the same purpose as paypal, and you don't see people arguing about how much or little sense an economy built using paypal would be
[21:37] <Macer> the value of currency is completely arbitrary.. simply numbers on paper
[21:37] <taza> Macer: Paper money would literally just be worthless paper without the economy backing it.
[21:37] <ladoga> Macer: that has already happened here. everyone uses credit/debit cards
[21:37] <Dagger2> personally I'd say that bitcoin has been a pretty danm successful proof of concept
[21:38] <Dagger2> it's here and it works
[21:38] <Dagger2> damn*
[21:38] <Macer> sure... tanks have value
[21:38] <ladoga> and visa takes slice of every transaction you do
[21:38] <Macer> icbms as well.. so there is something backing the paper
[21:38] <Macer> i get into arguements all the time about this sort of stuff... like the fact free trade is simply buying peace on the backs of your citizens under the guise that more goods will be exported
[21:38] * Macer looks at how many services jobs there are here vs industrial/manufacturing jobs
[21:39] <Macer> glad that worked out :)
[21:39] <Macer> blah. anyways.. my dd is done. goign to boot this pi again
[21:39] <taza> What would you do with the manufactured goods?
[21:40] <taza> "Must have worthless things because they're shiny."
[21:40] <Macer> like a pi? :)
[21:40] * DenBeiren (~Denbeiren@ptrb-178-51-219-134.mobistar.be) has left #raspberrypi
[21:40] <IT_Sean> yes. like a pi.
[21:41] <taza> A mag-pi if you will.
[21:41] <Macer> you would do what was done for a very long time... protect your local economy then export keeping wages/salaries high domestically and forcing goods pricing to remain constant through the use of tariffs while maintaining a good source of government revenue through the global import taxing
[21:42] <taza> I now want to make that. "A perfect, timeless computer." A Raspberry Pi, encased in solid gold, sold for $1000+triple the worth of the gold.
[21:42] <Macer> instead of inflating your money, supporting your govt with debt, and relying on income tax to kick the can
[21:42] <ladoga> depends how that stuff is manufactured. I somewhat miss western/local produced goods.
[21:42] <Macer> a lot of people do
[21:42] <taza> Macer: For what outcome?
[21:42] * ladoga looks at my IBM keyboard from 1986
[21:43] <ladoga> still as good as new
[21:43] <taza> The same outcome as in the Goode Olden Times, dying of smallpox painfully?
[21:43] * troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:43] <taza> Or alternatively, so high on laudanum you can't feel it?
[21:43] <ladoga> also my bike is 30 years old..finnish made
[21:43] <Macer> taza: continued domestic prosperity through manipulation of your OWN economy
[21:43] <Macer> free trade is just a cash grab
[21:43] * m0nk3yjoe (~m0nk3yjoe@pool-71-174-177-65.bstnma.east.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[21:44] <ladoga> destroyed many newer bikes...those things were made to last
[21:44] <Macer> like sub prime lending :-P
[21:44] <Macer> ladoga: the same can be seen with electronics
[21:44] <taza> Continued domestic prosperity through isolationism and xenophobia.
[21:44] <ladoga> today cosumer good are made to be destroyed when the warranty runs out
[21:44] <ladoga> designed lifespan of 2 years
[21:44] <Macer> taza: seems to wrok for china :-P
[21:44] <Macer> taza: how much of the US debt does china own?
[21:44] <taza> ladoga: To be fair, today's consumer goods have the price to match
[21:45] <Macer> not to mention their harsh control over their yuan to protect their overpopulated economy
[21:45] <ladoga> i'd rather pay more and buy less frequently
[21:45] <ladoga> it's better for environment too
[21:45] <taza> But how much more?
[21:45] <Macer> restricting its export so other people can drive it into the dirt heh
[21:45] <Macer> this same arguement was used by thatcher during the Euro cash grab
[21:46] <taza> It usually isn't better for the environment - the cheaply made goods can be recycled and generally stress the environment less to make.
[21:46] <ladoga> than tossing out electronics after one or two years of use
[21:46] <Macer> i bet GB economists are feeling blessed that thatcher wouldn't convert to the EU/Euro
[21:46] <taza> ladoga: Two words: Landfill mining.
[21:46] <johnc-> people toss out electronics?
[21:46] * johnc- looks around his office/lab
[21:46] <Macer> lol
[21:47] <thesov> has anyone here used the pi as a microcontroller?
[21:47] <gordonDrogon> johnc-, I suspect I'm in the same boat :)
[21:47] <johnc-> I even keep my old phones so I can do testing on them
[21:48] <gordonDrogon> actually, I did throw something out recently - the circuit board for an old (30+ year old) XY plotter. I still have the mechanics and the steppers as they're still good :) The control board had a Z80 on it...
[21:48] <taza> ladoga: So, cheaply made goods? Not that stressful for the environment... IF they're recycled.
[21:48] <taza> I know, huge if.
[21:49] <thesov> im just wondering what the max current a gpio pin and put out, also, how fast is the gpio bandwidth per pin
[21:49] <gordonDrogon> max current - well it depends, but stick to 16mA.
[21:50] <ladoga> recycling in china mostly means dumping the waste in some remove village where locals rip the valuable parts off by hand and burn the rest
[21:50] <ladoga> remote*
[21:50] <thesov> ok
[21:50] <gordonDrogon> thesov, it's 8mA by default to maintain a logic 1, but you can pull 16mA without any issues.
[21:50] * rvl (john.doe@d54C2B710.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:50] <gordonDrogon> I've pulled double that, but I really do not recommend it at all.
[21:50] <thesov> 16 ma is a little low but thats not bad i can work optocouplers
[21:51] <thesov> what about bandwidth per pin is that pretty good?
[21:51] <gordonDrogon> try to stick to < 16mA. There is also not much spare on the 3.3v supply - 50mA total is suggested, however: http://unicorn.drogon.net/17leds.jpg
[21:51] <thesov> 404
[21:51] <gordonDrogon> thesov, the gpio clock speed is ~20MHz, so the max. you can poke it in software is 20M /sec. So 10MHz max. square wave in software.
[21:52] * MarkDude (~MT@fedora/MarkDude) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:52] <gordonDrogon> http://unicorn.drogon.net/pi17leds.jpg
[21:52] <thesov> ahh nice thats not bad at all
[21:52] <thesov> 20mhz is very good
[21:52] <gordonDrogon> however there will be a LOT of jitter
[21:52] <gordonDrogon> especially if running Linux.
[21:52] <thesov> certainly beats a arduino at 9.6k
[21:52] <gordonDrogon> less-so with bare-metal.
[21:53] <thesov> eh?
[21:53] <gordonDrogon> but the dram refresh via the gpu will stall you every now and then.
[21:53] <gordonDrogon> it's not a good microcontroller, but you can "get away" with a lot.
[21:54] <gordonDrogon> especially if you use I2C &| SPI peripherals too.
[21:55] <ladoga> taza: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=pLwVycO7V-k#t=591s
[21:55] <ladoga> ofcourse that's only one extreme. it can be done better:)
[21:56] <taza> I'm horribly surprised China doesn't respect the environment.
[21:56] <Macer> ok.. i'm in X
[21:56] <taza> Check how it's done in a technologically advanced Western country. Like, say, Finland.
[21:56] <Macer> where is the place to configure resolution to 1080p for the desktop?
[21:57] <Macer> unable to get monitor information
[21:57] <Macer> great
[21:57] <ladoga> it's not done here anymore :) basically all factories have shipped to china. probably recycling waste too
[21:57] <gordonDrogon> oddly enough I found that china has banned the use of flour bleach/whiteners ...
[21:57] <taza> ladoga: You'd be wrong.
[21:58] <gordonDrogon> so white breat in china is sort of yellow/grey...
[21:58] <Macer> so is there a way change the resolution of this?
[21:58] <tinti> Is anyone working on voice recognition on Pi?
[21:58] <taza> ladoga: They do some manufacturing and most recycling locally.
[21:58] <gordonDrogon> tinti, yes - google raspberry pi voice recognition and look for a chap called arthur ...
[21:59] <ladoga> i hope so..i work at manufaturing :)
[21:59] <tinti> gordonDrogon: thanks I have tried pocketsphinx
[21:59] <taza> Why is the recycling done locally? Because the materials are actually cheaper to harvest from garbage than to manufacture.
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[21:59] * revele (john.doe@d54C2B710.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:00] <Macer> hm
[22:00] <Macer> tvservice says i'm running 1920x1080
[22:00] <Macer> but the desktop is flat
[22:00] <Macer> it doesn't fit
[22:01] * xCP23x (~xCP23x@ Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[22:01] * rvl (john.doe@d54C2B710.access.telenet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[22:02] <[Saint]> Macer: adjust the windowing in raspi.config
[22:04] * steve_rox (~steve@82-69-127-162.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:05] <Macer> i actually canged it in config.txt and that didn't help either heh
[22:05] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:06] <Macer> i don't see anything that says "windowing" the only thing i do see is overscan
[22:06] <Macer> which i'm guessing will adjust the fb
[22:07] <Macer> hm
[22:07] <Macer> how odd
[22:07] <pksato> disable overscan, and set fb resolution to same as display.
[22:07] <johnc-> http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=43655
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[22:09] * AeroNotix (~xeno@abok233.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:09] <Macer> pksato: i tried that ;)
[22:09] <Macer> it still isn't filling the entire screen
[22:10] <pksato> wrong resulution?
[22:10] <pepee> I can buy a bunch of "RPi's model A" from feb/2013, are these rev 2?
[22:10] * Yachtsman (~Yachtsman@173-115-216-249.pools.spcsdns.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:11] <linkxs> pepee: i believe there's a command you can run that will show you what revision it is. Ask the seller to do that
[22:11] <IT_Sean> pepee: do they have mounting holes?
[22:11] <pepee> linkxs, I don't have one, I asked the seller and they are not sure...
[22:11] <pksato> model A use rev 2 board.
[22:11] <Macer> pksato: don't know.. i just edited the config.txt manually
[22:11] <pepee> IT_Sean, no idea :/
[22:11] * kcj (~casey@unaffiliated/kcj) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[22:12] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[22:13] <pepee> how much mem can the OS use from the model A?
[22:13] <gordonDrogon> pepee, all Model A's are Rev 2 boards...
[22:13] <Macer> pksato: ah ok. that did it
[22:13] <Macer> how odd.. why didn't that work in raspi-config
[22:13] <Macer> it's working now
[22:13] * ech0s7 (~ech0s7@host104-154-dynamic.55-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:13] <gordonDrogon> the Model A's have the same 256MB of RAM that the early B's had.
[22:14] <gordonDrogon> GPU needs min. 16MB, the rest is avalable to the OS and applications.
[22:14] <Macer> so.. where is the pkg manager?
[22:14] <Macer> or do i just go and use apt?
[22:14] <pepee> ah, k, that's what I wanted to know, thanks people
[22:15] <NullMoogleCable> http://wtfmoogle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/stackofpi.jpg
[22:15] <Macer> does youtube work? lol
[22:16] <Macer> guess not
[22:16] <Macer> heh
[22:16] <Macer> lets see what awesomeness the "pi store" has
[22:17] <Bushmills> Macer: apt-get install aptitude
[22:17] <Macer> Bushmills: so there isn't a ui manager? no big deal. apt is fine
[22:17] <Bushmills> easier to browse available packages than apt-cache search
[22:17] * indarios (~dan@ has joined #raspberrypi
[22:17] <Macer> yeah. :) thanks. was just curious if there was a pkg manager
[22:17] <Macer> in X
[22:17] <Bushmills> text is text, whether it's written in a gui program or in a console program
[22:18] <Macer> what is this xfce?
[22:18] * Yachtsman (~Yachtsman@173-115-216-249.pools.spcsdns.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[22:18] <Bushmills> apt-cache show xfce4
[22:18] <Macer> i was asking about the default raspbian wm
[22:18] <Macer> looks like xfce
[22:18] <Bushmills> hm, not very descriptive.
[22:19] <Macer> no big deal.. let me build kde4 for it!
[22:19] <Macer> weeee!!
[22:20] <Macer> raspberry pi x86 emulator hahha
[22:21] <NullMoogleCable> yup Macer
[22:21] <Macer> i don't get why you need a pi store acct when you can just use apt
[22:22] <Bushmills> it may be for those asking for a GUI to install packages :)
[22:22] <Macer> yeah but it makes you make an acct
[22:22] <NullMoogleCable> http://wtfmoogle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/stackofpi.jpg
[22:22] <Macer> heh
[22:22] <NullMoogleCable> x86 emulatore :-D
[22:23] <Macer> wow there's a libreoffice
[22:23] <Macer> wonder if that sucks
[22:23] * Macer will look for cups next
[22:23] <Macer> if i can get the scanner to work i'm sold :)
[22:24] <Macer> figure it's just a matter of sane working
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[22:34] <Slash_Fury> Hey guys :)
[22:36] <featheredfrog> we gonna turn it on
[22:36] * AndrevS (~andrevs@2001:610:1108:5011:225:b3ff:fec0:41e1) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[22:36] <Slash_Fury> I'm having a strange problem. I'm using a wireless adapter with the rt2800usb driver. My wlan0 interface is up with a static IP and I can ping/ssh to it, but I can only do this when my wired connection is also up. if eth0 goes down, I can't reach wlan0 anymore.
[22:37] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[22:37] * suehle (~rsuehle@fedora/suehle) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:37] <IT_Sean> That's strange.
[22:37] <Slash_Fury> IT_Sean: You're tellin' me! haha
[22:37] <Slash_Fury> I don't suppose you might have any ideas, would you?
[22:37] * m8 (~mor@unaffiliated/m8) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:38] <Macer> anybody run kde4 on their pi?
[22:38] <IT_Sean> Sorry... i have nothing to offer beyond "That's strange."
[22:38] <Dagger2> pastebin `ifconfig` and `ip r`
[22:38] <Bushmills> Slash_Fury: how do you know that any traffic is router through wifi, and not all through eth?
[22:38] <Macer> oh wait. there isn't any 3d accel for X is there?
[22:39] <Bushmills> s/router/routed/
[22:40] <Bushmills> Macer: are you sure you picked the right board for your purposes?
[22:40] <Slash_Fury> Just a moment :)
[22:41] <jelly1> Macer: no
[22:42] * deep13 (~deep13@c-71-56-122-103.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[22:43] <Slash_Fury> Yeah, this is strange, haha
[22:44] <Slash_Fury> http://pastebin.com/zM5BEUr2
[22:44] <Slash_Fury> Strange that I don't see any packets on that wlan0 interface.
[22:44] <Dagger2> default route is out eth0
[22:44] <Dagger2> all your traffic will go out of it provided that route is there
[22:44] <Bushmills> how about putting wlan in a different subnet
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[22:45] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:46] <Dagger2> won't help much, you'd still need to remove the default route on eth0 before any traffic went out wlan0
[22:46] <johnc-> your wlan isn't working at all, not just when the eth0 is plugged in
[22:46] <Macer> Bushmills: just curious if someone tried it ;)
[22:46] <Bushmills> in case wlan is in a different subnet, there'll probably be a router for that subnet through wlan interface
[22:47] <Bushmills> that takes precedence over default route
[22:47] <Bushmills> a route
[22:47] * _h0c1n_ is now known as h0cin
[22:47] * dan2k3k4 (~dan2k3k4@unaffiliated/dan2k3k4) has joined #raspberrypi
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[22:47] <Bushmills> must have typed "router" so often that my fingers type that automatically as soon as a word starts with "rout"
[22:49] <Slash_Fury> Hm
[22:49] <finnw> interesting discussion on #bitcoin about colocating RPis and encasing them in resin to guard against tampering. http://bitcoinstats.com/irc/bitcoin/logs/2013/05/13#l7430915
[22:50] <Slash_Fury> I removed all routes to eth0 and applied a default route to wlan0, but as soon as my route to eth0 disappeared, traffic on wlan0 still died.
[22:50] <Slash_Fury> (well, it ifconfig was saying 0 rx/tx packets, so it probably never started)
[22:50] * troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:50] <Dagger2> Bushmills: there can only be one winning default route though
[22:50] <Bushmills> there'll be a net route through wlan, not a second default route
[22:51] <Bushmills> btw, adding two and routes beats default route
[22:51] * peol (~andree@unaffiliated/peol) Quit (Quit: Be back later)
[22:52] <Macer> trying to install cups now :)
[22:52] <Macer> lol
[22:52] <Dagger2> you can also just add a default route with a higher (lower) metric, of course
[22:52] <SpeedEvil> finnw: encapsulating in noncompliant resin risks destroying the pi
[22:52] <Macer> wow if i can get the scanner to work then this will be awesome
[22:52] <Macer> that's really all i need
[22:52] <SpeedEvil> due to the resin shrinking when it sets, and pulling the chips off
[22:53] <Bushmills> those /1 routes come in handy if you want to remove them again, and fall back to your (previous and new) default route
[22:53] * Yen (~Yen@ip-81-11-244-67.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[22:53] <finnw> Yes I have heard of that
[22:53] <Slash_Fury> Even with traffic being routed through the eth0 interface, I would still expect to see packets hitting my wlan0 interface if I ping its ip, correct?
[22:54] <Bushmills> ping it from where?
[22:54] <Slash_Fury> My desktop on the LAN
[22:55] <Bushmills> depends on routes. if route for that subnet goes to eth, wlan won't see that traffic. depends also on switch, or how your desktop is connected, and when you pinged before
[22:55] <Bushmills> where's the AP?
[22:56] <Bushmills> does it receive packets, or will eth receive them instead?
[22:56] <Bushmills> wlan and eth are in the same subnet, after all
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> Slash_Fury: you can also do stuff like route add wlan0
[22:57] <Bushmills> that's a condition which doesn't make troubleshooting easy, because routing more complex than need to be
[22:57] <Bushmills> well, you found out already.
[22:57] <Slash_Fury> Actually, SpeedEvil: if I do that and then ping, I get Destination Host Unreachable.
[22:58] <Bushmills> oh, google isn't connecting to your wlan?
[22:58] <Bushmills> sue them
[22:58] <Slash_Fury> lol
[23:00] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: off)
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[23:25] -mrmist- [Global Notice] Sadly the DDoS attacks are still ongoing and that it is affecting major parts of our infrastructure resulting in timeouts and loss of some service (at least, but not limited to webchat, support ticket system and hidden tor service). A special thank you to our sponsors, whom we love so much. ???
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[23:36] <Macer> wow
[23:36] <Macer> my pi
[23:37] <Macer> cups actually works lol
[23:37] <Armand> 2 Pis, 1 CUP ?
[23:37] * Armand hides..
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[23:43] * acfrazier (~acfrazier@opensn0w/developer/acfrazier) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[23:45] * AeroNotix (~xeno@abok233.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) Quit (Quit: Uploading hax.....)
[23:45] <Macer> Armand: hahahahaha!
[23:45] <Macer> nice
[23:46] <Macer> wow.. no transparent term tho :-/
[23:46] <Macer> wonder what kind of browsers are available.. midori seems a bit lame
[23:46] <Macer> wonder if opera is in the mix somewhere heh
[23:46] * tinti (~tinti@pdpc/supporter/student/tinti) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:47] <gordonDrogon> Macer, run xfce4 - xterms can be transparent on moves, etc.
[23:47] * sparqz (~sparqz@sjs-mh-wifi-1-1-lc-int.sjsu.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:48] <gordonDrogon> and there is a version of chrome browser.
[23:48] * owen_ (~owen@ has joined #raspberrypi
[23:48] <Macer> oh is there?
[23:48] <Macer> chromium?
[23:49] <Macer> i was hoping for opera ifi can find it
[23:49] <Macer> doesn't seem so tho
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These logs were automatically created by RaspberryPiBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.