#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2013-06-23

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[18:55] -barjavel.freenode.net- *** Looking up your hostname...
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[18:55] * RaspberryPiBot (~PircBot@unaffiliated/datagutt/bot/databot) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:55] * Topic is 'Unofficial RaspberryPi IRC channel but "Blessed" by the Foundation as the ONE channel. Logs @ http://srv.datagutt1.com <> Channel Rules: http://alturl.com/jc97e <>'
[18:55] * Set by IT_Sean!~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1 on Thu Mar 21 17:59:24 CET 2013
[18:56] <yggdrasil> ugh
[18:56] <yggdrasil> must reboot dsl modem, or something.
[18:56] * BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:59] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[19:03] * jankyhellface (~jankyhell@ Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[19:05] * pecorade (~pecorade@host196-253-dynamic.42-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:10] * Retrospect (~Saicho@5ED312C6.cm-7-4a.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit ()
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[19:16] * Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@ Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[19:18] <Scriven> gordonDrogon, Got a ulcd question. Do you think it's worth it to code some sort of HID script to turn it into an actual system keyboard? An idea that's been poking around in my head l8ly, but I have no idea how big a project it is to chew.
[19:18] * divine (~divine@2001:470:8247:1::42) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[19:27] * robscomputer (~robscompu@nat/yahoo/x-caogfkadlndoohsh) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[19:28] * KameSense (~KameSense@AMontpellier-654-1-165-19.w92-145.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
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[19:34] * cccyRegeaneWolfe is now known as cccyRegeane_Away
[19:34] * edwinsage (~muse@172-14-188-107.lightspeed.gdrpmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:51] <edwinsage> Is the firmware for the Pi stored on the board somewhere, or is it on the SD card?
[19:52] <pksato> is on sd
[19:52] <Draylor> pi has just enough to know to look in /boot on the SD card
[19:52] <IT_Sean> ^ that
[19:52] * suehle (~rsuehle@fedora/suehle) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[19:52] <edwinsage> Ok, so I'll have to make sure firmware is kept up to date on each card rather than on each device, then.
[19:53] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:54] <edwinsage> I'm prepping SD cards for an order of Pis that are lost in the mail somewhere.
[19:54] * Exposure (~quassel@524BFBA9.cm-4-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:56] <ShorTie> think i'll order a model a and another model b today
[19:56] * xCP23x (~xCP23x@78-105-36-237.zone3.bethere.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
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[19:59] * sx (~sx@ Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[19:59] <donta> ShorTie: what are you making?
[20:00] <ShorTie> couple things, but a 8 input current sensing board
[20:01] <ShorTie> need a couple more thing for my ultrasonic project too...
[20:02] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:03] * Jevermeister (~Jevermeis@unaffiliated/jever) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:04] <yggdrasil> ugh i should be studying ccna but C is so much more fun right now
[20:04] <flibble> :)
[20:07] <ShorTie> gonna use a ACS758LCB-050B-PFF-T to sense the current with a 2n7000 on each end to comunicate
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[20:07] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[20:07] * zkirill (~zkirill@S01060023beda510e.vn.shawcable.net) Quit (Quit: zkirill)
[20:08] <ShorTie> and feed those into a mcp23s17 to get to the rPi
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[20:26] * cccyRegeane_Away is now known as cccyRegeaneWolfe
[20:28] <JakeSays> ShorTie: whats the current sensing board for?
[20:28] * felipealmeida (~user@mvx-187-16-79-187.mundivox.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[20:49] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Quit: Verlassend)
[20:52] * zombieman (~michael@cpe-24-160-80-170.tampabay.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:52] <zombieman> hello i am having dificulty starting srtarx
[20:52] <ShorTie> keep an eye on my feed lines
[20:52] <zombieman> error in locking authority file /home/pi/.Xauthority
[20:53] <zombieman> were would i start to diagnose this error
[20:53] <AsktonH> zombieman, did the pi crash/lose power during an x session?
[20:53] <ShorTie> log file maybe
[20:54] * Natch (~Natch@c-10cfe155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[20:54] <AsktonH> zombieman, because if you're sure that X isn't running, you can just delete it and it should work again
[20:54] <AsktonH> zombieman, on the console just run (without quotes) "rm ~/.Xauthority"
[20:55] <Bushmills> zombieman: can you write files at all? touch foo
[20:55] * Natch (~Natch@c-10cfe155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:56] <zombieman> i was playing with retoach and it crashed give me a sec ill try
[20:57] * Tickle (~hunter@c-98-253-186-186.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:57] <zombieman> can not remove .xaithority : read-only fuke system
[20:57] <Bushmills> volume may be mounted read only
[20:57] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:57] <zombieman> how would i fix this
[20:58] <Bushmills> reboot may help. alternatively, fsck the volume in another computer
[20:58] <Tickle> Morning
[20:58] <zombieman> trying to reboot
[20:59] <zombieman> it kinda sucks not to have a power butto
[20:59] <zombieman> n* lol
[21:00] <zombieman> i should make a button that would sudo poweroff and sudo reboot then it would be a "real computer" JK
[21:01] <Bushmills> if you say so
[21:01] <zombieman> it was a joke reboot worked lol i rebooted 2 times before with no work
[21:02] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:02] <mpmc> Yes the Pi needs a power button and a few owls that shoot lasers from their eyes :p
[21:02] <Bushmills> output of mount can show you whether the problem prevents you from writing
[21:03] <Bushmills> /dev/root line should say rw, not ro in parenthesises
[21:04] * ka6sox is now known as ka6sox-away
[21:08] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:09] * Skullclown (Seb@d51A43AE8.access.telenet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:11] <Skullclown> is there any way to efficiently detect a certain device on a network? the device would be connected via WiFi but with a random IP address, is there an efficient way to find this device? all I would know in advance is the open port and protocol, not MAC address.
[21:11] * higuita (~higuita@2001:b18:400f:0:a85c:e68c:7b2:67d8) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[21:12] * tombrough (~tom@cpc4-newt3-0-0-cust54.newt.cable.virginmedia.com) has left #raspberrypi
[21:12] <Bushmills> easiest is to have the dhcp server add it to nameserver by the name the device requests the dhcp lease with
[21:12] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:12] <Skullclown> Bushmills: considering we don't have access to the DHCP server either
[21:12] <Bushmills> your network admin has
[21:13] <Skullclown> yes, but the point is to find a way to make a plug-and-play device without need of configuration :)
[21:13] * Alina-malina (Alina-mali@ Quit (Read error: error:1408F119:SSL routines:SSL3_GET_RECORD:decryption failed or bad record mac)
[21:13] <Bushmills> find it using what?
[21:14] <Bushmills> is there another machine in the net you can find it with?
[21:14] * higuita (~higuita@2001:b18:400f:0:6522:c2ad:d8bc:b30f) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:15] <Bushmills> for the device itself, it would have a loopback device, and can find itself easily through it
[21:15] <Skullclown> ideally, I'd be able to find the RPi via mobile app
[21:15] <Skullclown> (phonegap framework if possible)
[21:15] <Skullclown> and the RPi should be able to find other RPis on the network
[21:15] * brainwash_ (~brainwash@unaffiliated/brainwash) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:15] <Bushmills> put a vpn client on rpi. let it connect to a distant vpn server.
[21:16] <Skullclown> they all use the same port and have the same handshake
[21:16] <Skullclown> no access to the internet.
[21:16] <Bushmills> put a dhcp or vpn server on one of those rpis
[21:16] <Skullclown> I could open sockets to every possible IP in the network with a timeout of 1 second but I imagine that's not ideal?
[21:17] <Bushmills> i'd not scan for devices on an unknown network
[21:17] <Skullclown> dhcp or vpn don't fix it either: if they connect to an existing network, the dhcp just gets in the way. and for vpn, you need to know the IP beforehand
[21:17] * Wiisel (~IceChat77@cpc9-seve19-2-0-cust439.13-3.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:17] <Bushmills> well, then there are too many unstated "impossible to ..." to give you any meaningful help
[21:18] * zear (~zear@h196n1-g-kt-a31.ias.bredband.telia.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[21:18] <Bushmills> zeroconf. avahi.
[21:18] * brainwash (~brainwash@unaffiliated/brainwash) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[21:18] * brainwash_ is now known as brainwash
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[21:23] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-754-1-4-35.w86-212.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:23] <edwinsage> Skullclown: What is the actual situation you're trying to find a solution for? Maybe someone could come up with a useful suggestion with some context.
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[21:24] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:25] <Skullclown> edwinsage: plug in RPi, RPi is running node.js + socket.io + express (web UI), mobile device (tablets/phones) has an app that needs to find the device, preferably without any kind of configuration
[21:25] * dansan (~daniel@99-70-244-137.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:26] <edwinsage> Skullclown: Is the Pi connecting to some pre-existing wireless network?
[21:26] <Skullclown> edwinsage: yes
[21:27] * mapee (~User@84-236-88-148.pool.digikabel.hu) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:27] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:27] <edwinsage> If it's always connecting to the same one, I'd just configure it to have a static IP.
[21:27] <edwinsage> If not, how are you telling it what to connect to?
[21:27] * Luke-Jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:28] * mapee (~User@84-236-88-148.pool.digikabel.hu) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[21:29] <Skullclown> edwinsage: there is configuration needed on the RPi to connect to the wifi. however, the app on the mobile device should be able to connect to another wifi network with another RPi on it & automatically work.
[21:30] <edwinsage> Skullclown: What is the end goal you're trying to accomplish?
[21:30] * mapee (~User@84-236-88-148.pool.digikabel.hu) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:31] * zear (~zear@h196n1-g-kt-a31.ias.bredband.telia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:31] <Skullclown> edwinsage: device that's easy to plug in & work with? so I'd only have to configure the RPi once for the wifi and the mobile app works by just launching it
[21:32] * ka6sox-away (ka6sox@nasadmin/ka6sox) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:34] <edwinsage> Skullclown: No, I mean are you trying to make phone-controllable video players in various locations that people can connect to, or are you leaving them set up in multiple locations and just logging into them yourself? I assume you want the Pis to have internet access, which is why you don't just have them broadcast their own networks. What are you trying to use them to do?
[21:34] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:35] * pesticide (~ou818@unaffiliated/ou818) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:35] <edwinsage> Skullclown: Is this a large-scale project, or just a quickie you'd like to use yourself?
[21:36] <edwinsage> Skullclown: And what are the wireless networks you're intending to do this on?
[21:36] * pesticide (~ou818@unaffiliated/ou818) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:36] <Skullclown> edwinsage: large-scale, it's for an additional feature they'd like to add. not a required feature though and not necessarily a recommended one either, because of how it would work. we don't want to sacrifice time but if it only takes a second to scan the network, we want to add the feature.
[21:37] * ka6sox (~ka6sox@nasadmin/ka6sox) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:37] <Skullclown> I can't go into too much detail on the specifics of what it'll do, but the RPi will server a web UI to clients using a mobile device.
[21:37] <Skullclown> serve *
[21:37] * `Winslow (~Winslow@unaffiliated/winslow/x-6891340) Quit (Excess Flood)
[21:38] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:38] <edwinsage> Skullclown: It sounds like the easiest thing to do would be to have the Pis all tell some central location what their IP is and on which network, and then have the app download the list and pick the address that matches the network it's on.
[21:39] * `Winslow (~Winslow@unaffiliated/winslow/x-6891340) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:39] <Bushmills> consider the possibility to let them reply in a specific way when sending a specific request to the network broadcast address
[21:39] <Skullclown> edwinsage: the pis won't have access to the internet though and we don't want to add an additional requirement to the setup
[21:41] <gordonDrogon> UPnP + Avahi ...
[21:41] <Bushmills> was suggested already
[21:42] <gordonDrogon> ah. didn't scroll back enough. ho hum.
[21:42] * halfhalo (halfhalo@nasadmin/webteam/halfhalo) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[21:42] * Thra11 (~Thra11@ has joined #raspberrypi
[21:42] <Skullclown> another suggestion was nmap + ARP sweep, what is your opinion on that?
[21:42] <Bushmills> that was when i dropped essentially out, getting aware that not enough information was provided
[21:42] <Skullclown> 256 IP addresses in ~5s
[21:43] <Bushmills> on a 10.x.x.x/8 :)
[21:43] <gordonDrogon> I use static IP addresses.
[21:43] * user82 (~user82@unaffiliated/user82) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[21:43] <dagerik> how can i scan subnet with nmap for find my pi?
[21:43] <Bushmills> why would you want to?
[21:43] * Luke-Jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:44] <dagerik> Bushmills: im gonna ssh into. dont have ip
[21:44] * KameSense (~KameSense@AMontpellier-654-1-141-144.w90-0.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[21:44] <Bushmills> query the nameserver
[21:44] <gordonDrogon> http://moor.drogon.net/dump/findPi
[21:44] <dagerik> wut
[21:44] <gordonDrogon> is what I write some time back.
[21:45] <Bushmills> or list leases the dhcp server gave out
[21:45] * halfhalo (halfhalo@nasadmin/webteam/halfhalo) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:45] <dagerik> Bushmills: how
[21:45] <Bushmills> cat
[21:45] * sraue (~stephan@xbmc/staff/sraue) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:46] <dagerik> Bushmills: what?
[21:46] <Bushmills> depends
[21:46] * user82 (~user82@unaffiliated/user82) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:46] <dagerik> how do i query the nameserver?
[21:47] <Bushmills> let the client you want to use for connecting to the pi query it
[21:47] <dagerik> client? which program
[21:48] <Bushmills> that's what you should tell, not asl
[21:48] <Bushmills> ask
[21:48] <dagerik> huh?
[21:48] <Bushmills> i can't read your mind. nobody here can
[21:48] <Bushmills> therefore i can't tell you what client you want to connect to your pi with
[21:49] <dagerik> i wanna use ssh
[21:49] <Bushmills> then use ssh
[21:49] <dagerik> i dont have ip or hostname
[21:49] <Bushmills> pi offers its hostname to dhcp server
[21:50] <Bushmills> you can configure pi's hostname, otherwise it uses a default name with a random component
[21:51] <dagerik> great
[21:51] * Aww is now known as EvilAww
[21:52] * skfax_ (~skfax@144.81-166-238.customer.lyse.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:53] <skfax_> What is the IC package used by the BRCM2835 CPU for the Raspberry Pi version B?
[21:53] * MindOfGod (4c15709a@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[21:53] * user82 (~user82@unaffiliated/user82) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[21:54] <gordonDrogon> It's POP/BGA
[21:54] <gordonDrogon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Package_on_package
[21:54] <MindOfGod> I'm getting "Segmentation Fault" when I try to create a chroot environment on a raspberry pi, anyone have any suggestions?
[21:54] <shiftplusone> skfax_, I don't think that there's a specific type other than BGA. If you need to know where the pads are, you can check this image http://www.geek.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/raspi_CPU_GPU.jpg
[21:55] <Olipro> what does capacitor C3 do?
[21:55] <Bushmills> MindOfGod: start by determining what program causes the segfault
[21:55] <Olipro> the (relatively) large one next to the microUSB power input
[21:56] <MindOfGod> Bushmills: I think it's the chroot program itself. debootstrap installs all the necessary packages - but then chroot crashes with a SegFault.
[21:56] <Olipro> I'm guessing it's to clean the voltage input to a stable 5V
[21:57] * KameSense (~KameSense@AMontpellier-654-1-141-144.w90-0.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:57] <Bushmills> specify a different shell. when you've isolated the program causing the segfault, run it under strace
[21:57] <Bushmills> that should give you an idea what happens around where it segfaults
[21:58] <Bushmills> and when you know what, you may get an idea why
[21:58] <skfax_> gordonDrogon, shiftplusone : thank you :-)
[21:58] <edwinsage> Bushmills: Now I'm curious. What would I type in the shell to get a plain-text readout from querying the nameserver?
[21:59] <MindOfGod> I think it might have to do with which architecture I chose to install in the chroot. `uname -a` on my host installation says I'm running a armv6l, and I tried to install a armhf debian wheezy in the chroot.
[21:59] <shiftplusone> np
[21:59] <Bushmills> edwinsage: as nameserver diagnostic, i'd use dig
[22:00] <edwinsage> Bushmills: I was trying dig on Slackware, though there's no package for the Pi. It doesn't seem to be giving me info for the local network, though.
[22:00] <MindOfGod> is that alright? armv6l on host but armhf on master - debian offers armel and armhf - but my host (a xbian installation) says arch is armv6l
[22:00] <Bushmills> dig doesn't give you any local network info. it queries a nameserver, and outputs the reply
[22:01] <yggdrasil> whats going on in here gentlemen?
[22:01] <edwinsage> Bushmills: Then how would you use that to find a Pi on your local network?
[22:02] <yggdrasil> edwinsage: your looking for your pi?
[22:02] <Bushmills> ideally, dhcp server adds name of dhcp-lease-requesting client along with the assigned ip address to a local nameserver
[22:02] <yggdrasil> can you log into your dhcp server ?
[22:02] <Bushmills> then you query nameserver for that name, and amazingly it replies with the ip address
[22:03] <yggdrasil> also, you can download something like... angry ip scanner . and jsut scan the whole network.
[22:03] <edwinsage> yggdrasil: Some previous questions got me curious. My own Pi hase a static IP on my network.
[22:03] <edwinsage> yggdrasil: So I don't actually need to know, but I'm interested in finding this stuff out.
[22:03] <Bushmills> in case of, say, dnsmasq as dhcp server in the net, that doubles as nameserver. both components in one program.
[22:03] * zproc (~zproc@laf31-6-82-241-3-109.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Quit: zproc)
[22:04] <netman87> why dont you guys make your pi have static AND dhcp ip number?
[22:04] <Bushmills> as dnsmasq is a popular dhcp server and nameserver on many home routers, all needed is already there and usually preconfigured to do just that,
[22:05] <MindOfGod> actually, chroot might be an overkill for what I need - basically, to change where a particular set of debian packages get installed (apache on a sd card is woefully slow.). Any easy way to get that done? apart from chrooting.
[22:05] <Bushmills> netman87: because typing a (static) ip address is more effort than typing a (short) host name?
[22:06] <netman87> then you can just add raspberry pi ip to your hosts file
[22:06] <edwinsage> Bushmills: I still don't know what I'd type into my shell, though. What's a command that would get local hostnames on a pretty standard ISP-provided router?
[22:06] <netman87> so you can use address like "raspi"
[22:06] * Bushmills called his raspberry-pi-with-dynamic-address simply "pi"
[22:06] * knob (~knob@adsl-64-237-238-64.prtc.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:06] <edwinsage> *on devices connecting to said router
[22:06] <Bushmills> edwinsage: as i name my pi "pi", i'd enter, for example, ssh pi
[22:07] <netman87> not everyone using their modem/router for dns
[22:08] <netman87> my modem is very bad at that... sometimes it wont tell anymore address
[22:08] <netman87> so im using instead
[22:08] <Bushmills> if one doesn't use a static ip address for raspi, then there will be a dhcp server somewhere
[22:08] <Bushmills> that server isn't there purely because of some obsure magic
[22:08] <netman87> and that dhcp doesnt need to be used for dns.. most routers are not so good
[22:09] <Bushmills> sure, you can setup thing to work differently.
[22:09] <JakeSays> -bash: /usr/bin/sudo: cannot execute binary file
[22:09] <JakeSays> :(
[22:09] <Bushmills> but for ease of getting to a system with dynamic address on your net, you'd want to setup things such that names resolve to ip addresses
[22:10] <Bushmills> you don't have to, of course. it's just something helpful one can or may do
[22:10] <edwinsage> Bushmills: Ah, the one computer I was trying on is configured kinda funky; it was trying to access the specified host by appending the external hostname used to access my network.
[22:11] <Bushmills> JakeSays: you're sure you're not trying to run binaries from/for a different architecture?
[22:11] <JakeSays> Bushmills: not intentionally
[22:11] <JakeSays> i just installed tightvnc and things went south fsat
[22:11] <JakeSays> *fast
[22:11] <Bushmills> the segfault and not able to execute binary file are an indication for that you try to
[22:11] <JakeSays> maybe it installed the armhf version
[22:12] <JakeSays> Bushmills: no segfault, just that error
[22:12] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-754-1-4-35.w86-212.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[22:12] <Bushmills> file /path/to/and/name/of/that/executable should give some details
[22:13] <Bushmills> compare against a good executable
[22:13] <JakeSays> Bushmills: i was doing sudo halt
[22:13] <JakeSays> and now it wont even boot
[22:14] <Bushmills> oh well, time for the spare sd card
[22:14] * Tickle (~hunter@c-98-253-186-186.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:14] <JakeSays> lol yup
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[22:15] * firestrom223 (45b4fb3a@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[22:16] * edwinsage has aquired marginally more knowledge about DHCP servers and local networks!
[22:16] <edwinsage> I should be due for a level up soon.
[22:19] * peol (~andree@unaffiliated/peol) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:19] * AsktonH (~pi@196-215-127-222.dynamic.isadsl.co.za) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[22:19] <skfax_> Anyone know the size of the Raspberry Pi CPU? Some places are saying 10x10 mm, while some say 13x13
[22:21] * BlueDreams (~matt@24-205-95-34.dhcp.psdn.ca.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[22:23] <Bushmills> mine is 13x13 mm is mine
[22:24] * MindOfGod (4c15709a@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit ()
[22:25] <skfax_> Bushmills, cool, thanks
[22:26] * Orion__ (~Orion_@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[22:28] * AeroNotix (~xeno@abod173.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[22:28] <gordonDrogon> skfax_, so you don't have one yet?
[22:28] * zombieman (~michael@cpe-24-160-80-170.tampabay.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:28] <skfax_> gordonDrogon, I do. Just don't have a ruler :P
[22:28] * idstam (~johan@c-657a72d5.027-359-73746f23.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) Quit ()
[22:29] <skfax_> Measuring 12x12 mm from this http://www.pyrosoft.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads//2012/01/DSC_1085.jpg
[22:29] <gordonDrogon> is it that important?
[22:30] * Tickle (~hunter@c-98-253-186-186.hsd1.in.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Tickle)
[22:30] <skfax_> Ordering a heatsink, so wanted to get it fairly accurately
[22:31] <JakeSays> skfax_: mine looks to be 10x10, but my internal ruler is faulty
[22:32] * Tickle (~hunter@c-98-253-186-186.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:32] * zproc (~zproc@laf31-6-82-241-3-109.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:32] * snuffeluffegus (~snuffeluf@ps95204.dreamhost.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:34] <Tickle> Motion keeps crashing on my second pi but works fine on my first one, with the same exact config file
[22:34] * firestrom223 (45b4fb3a@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[22:34] <JakeSays> oh! i found a circuit board with a dual h-bridge motor driver on it
[22:35] <JakeSays> but dang it is small!
[22:36] <JakeSays> not sure how i'd work with its packaging
[22:38] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:38] <ShorTie> very carefully
[22:38] <ShorTie> ssop package ??
[22:39] <JakeSays> "20-Lead Wide-Body SOIC"
[22:39] <mgottschlag> heh, SOIC is huge :D
[22:39] <JakeSays> not to my old eyes :p
[22:39] <gordonDrogon> heatsink on the Pi...
[22:39] <mgottschlag> 1.27mm isn't that difficult to solder, you can do that on perfboard/stripboard actually
[22:40] <mgottschlag> (with the right technique of course)
[22:40] <gordonDrogon> skfax_, what you'll be cooling won't be the CPU - it's the memory chip that's on-top.
[22:40] <JakeSays> mgottschlag: i have neither the perfboard nor the technique
[22:40] <gordonDrogon> skfax_, and the reality is that heatsinks are just not needed on the Pi.
[22:40] <JakeSays> but dang i'd really like to use it
[22:40] <mgottschlag> with stripboard you cut a strip into two halves, place the chip on it and let the surface tension do the rest for you
[22:41] <skfax_> gordonDrogon, The cost of adding one is very small. Since I'm overclocking and taping it to the back of my TV, never to see it again, I might as well throw one on for good measure
[22:42] <JakeSays> would be cool if i could figure out how to re-use the board its mounted on
[22:43] <Bushmills> heatsinks are sooooo out. use heat pipes to transport excess heat
[22:43] <JakeSays> skfax_: just submerse your pi in a mineral oil bath
[22:44] <Bushmills> and don't tell anybody that i told you
[22:44] <skfax_> Bushmills, Heatpipes as sweet, but Farnell doesn't seem to carry any suitable for this task
[22:45] <mgottschlag> JakeSays: http://makezineblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/stripboardsmd.jpg?w=600&h=600
[22:45] <JakeSays> mgottschlag: oh wow
[22:45] <Bushmills> could you convert the TV to a door for a refridgerator?
[22:46] <JakeSays> mgottschlag: i've never seen that technique before
[22:47] <mgottschlag> that works if the chip has 1.27mm pitch because it is just half the normal perfboard/stripboard grid
[22:48] <mgottschlag> if it doesn't, then you need a steady hand and very fine wire, but at that point it stops being fun and starts being annoying
[22:48] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) Quit (Quit: enque)
[22:49] <JakeSays> this is what i need though to drive a bunch of stepper motors i ahve
[22:49] <JakeSays> well, something like this
[22:50] * divine (~divine@2001:470:8247:1::42) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:50] * Spiffy (~Spiffy@unaffiliated/spiffy) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[22:51] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:51] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-754-1-4-35.w86-212.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:51] * girafe (girafe@213-245-58-180.rev.numericable.fr) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:52] * piney0 (~piney@unaffiliated/piney0) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[22:52] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[22:52] <gordonDrogon> that's pretty creating use of stripboard...
[22:53] * mgottschlag (~mgottschl@reactos/tester/phoenix64) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:53] * NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD2AF41.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: NIN101)
[22:54] <gordonDrogon> the only thing I've seen that comes remotely close to that is some stuff Mike Cook did: http://www.thebox.myzen.co.uk/Raspberry/Buffer_Board_files/shapeimage_11.jpg
[22:54] <mgottschlag> <3 smd on perfboard
[22:54] <mgottschlag> 0805 fits great between two rings :)
[22:54] <gordonDrogon> cutting stripboard to put SMT LEDs, etc. in-line.
[22:56] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:56] <gordonDrogon> it never ceases to amaze me how creative some folks are though!
[22:56] <gordonDrogon> and I'm just being boring right now by making some mods. to my BASIC interpreter ...
[22:58] <JakeSays> lol basic interpreter
[22:58] <chod> gordonDrogon: how far from real bbc basic is it
[22:59] * chod should try it really
[22:59] * Firehopper (~Firehoppe@pool-71-175-189-127.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[23:01] * Orion___ (~Orion_@ Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[23:01] <gordonDrogon> chod, bbc basic is just /a/ basic. there are 100's of BASICs out there.
[23:02] * Turingi (~devon@unaffiliated/devon-hillard/x-7250961) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:02] * chod knows
[23:02] * Nemo7 (~nemo@unaffiliated/nemo7) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:02] <gordonDrogon> however it was modeled on bits of bbc and apple basics.
[23:02] <chod> what is your version lbased on?
[23:03] * chod nods
[23:03] <gordonDrogon> example: http://unicorn.drogon.net/snake.rtb
[23:03] <chod> spectrum basic was a bit :-) limited compared to bbc basic
[23:03] <gordonDrogon> all the old 8-bit basics were limited in one way or another - there were trade off's aplenty.
[23:03] * Lupinedk is now known as lupinedk
[23:03] <chod> can it accept 'basic' and work ?
[23:04] <chod> i hope its not tokenised
[23:04] <gordonDrogon> it is tokenised, but you never get to see that.
[23:04] <gordonDrogon> you can use line numbers if you like.
[23:04] <Firehopper> http://www.flickr.com/photos/firehopper/6228040014/ < how about basic for this thing :)
[23:04] <JakeSays> chod: you have something against tokens?
[23:05] <chod> not teally
[23:05] <chod> doh
[23:05] <chod> really
[23:05] <JakeSays> Firehopper: i have one of those!
[23:05] <JakeSays> in my mother's basement
[23:05] <gordonDrogon> it's tokenised mostly to speed up execution.
[23:05] <Firehopper> mines a 24K model. and it still works :)
[23:05] <gordonDrogon> the 'list' command is effectively a de-tokeniser - just like the old basics...
[23:06] <JakeSays> mine's been sitting in the damp basement for 10 years. i doubt it still works
[23:06] <gordonDrogon> so the downside is that the output of the list command isn't quite the same as you typed in - unless you use the editor, or an external editor and no line numbers.
[23:07] * piney0 (~piney@unaffiliated/piney0) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:07] <chod> gpio commands i guess ?
[23:07] <gordonDrogon> DigitalWrite/Read are included :)
[23:08] <chod> yay
[23:08] * Tickle (~hunter@c-98-253-186-186.hsd1.in.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Tickle)
[23:08] <gordonDrogon> https://projects.drogon.net/return-to-basic/
[23:08] <chod> i have seen that, and keep meaing to confuse my self some more :D
[23:08] * gordonDrogon grins.
[23:08] <chod> not read it properly
[23:09] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:09] <chod> call !-4
[23:09] <gordonDrogon> I'm tidying it up a little for what might hopefully be a little commercial project.
[23:09] <gordonDrogon> no call/peek/poke in RTB..
[23:09] <chod> or better randomise usr 1331
[23:10] <chod> can external stuff be called?
[23:10] <gordonDrogon> peek, poke, etc. really were there in the early 8-bit basics to overcome limitations in the size of the interpreter.
[23:11] <gordonDrogon> when you can afford a bit more memory, then you can have a triangle() keyword, rather than plot 85, ... and so on.
[23:11] <gordonDrogon> or colour = green rather than vdu 19, etc, etc,
[23:11] * chod nods
[23:11] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:12] <gordonDrogon> they were great commands, but really condensed multi-purpose keywords to save a bit of expensive rom space...
[23:13] <chod> do you lecture, i would go :D
[23:13] * KiltedPi (~Nbane@host-78-151-122-105.as13285.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:15] <gordonDrogon> I wasn't that enthused by bbc basic though.
[23:15] <gordonDrogon> It was nice and I wrote loads of stuff in it, but I wrote loads more in BCPL...
[23:15] * Tickle (~hunter@c-98-253-186-186.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:15] <chod> it was quite a jump from sinclair basics
[23:16] <gordonDrogon> Oh it was a fantastic jump and I don't think any of the 8-bit systems ever matched it - ever.
[23:16] <gordonDrogon> I owned a bbc micro - and an Apple II.
[23:16] <gordonDrogon> Still have the apple II, but I bought another a while back.
[23:17] <gordonDrogon> my bbc was stolen, but I bought one a while back too.
[23:17] <gordonDrogon> http://unicorn.drogon.net/lode.jpg
[23:17] <gordonDrogon> I ought to fire it up again :)
[23:18] <gordonDrogon> I'm after an Apple II serial card so I can copy off all my old Apple discs and hopefully preserve some of those old programs I wrote.
[23:19] <chod> never knew any one who had an apple
[23:19] <gordonDrogon> they were expensive.
[23:19] <gordonDrogon> I got one 2nd hand.
[23:19] <chod> > a bbc ?
[23:20] <gordonDrogon> no, bought that new - way back. I bought the Apple II 2nd hand.
[23:20] * niddam99 (~maddin@p4FF33D72.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has left #raspberrypi
[23:20] <gordonDrogon> I was studying/working when the Beeb came out. '82.
[23:20] <gordonDrogon> Saw my first apple in 78.
[23:22] <JakeSays> woo! i'm not the oldest one in here
[23:22] <gordonDrogon> actualy hoping to teach some young folks basic in august :)
[23:22] <gordonDrogon> JakeSays, er... :)
[23:23] <chod> heh
[23:23] <chod> 1st machine used here zx81
[23:23] <JakeSays> gordonDrogon: i saw my first apple in 80. lol
[23:23] <gordonDrogon> I know there are folks here older than me :)
[23:25] <chod> ppl at our user group used to program with cards
[23:25] <chod> and tapes
[23:25] <gordonDrogon> that was my first experience.
[23:25] <gordonDrogon> they were mark-sense cards though - you wrote on them in pencil.
[23:25] <gordonDrogon> into an HP desktop basic computer thing.
[23:26] <chod> and one minor error and thats it nothing
[23:26] <gordonDrogon> :)
[23:26] <gordonDrogon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HP_9830
[23:26] <chod> this c stuff is the opposite 4 screens of debug if anyone understands it all ;-)
[23:27] <JakeSays> gordonDrogon: lol "desktop computer"
[23:28] <JakeSays> man, those were the days
[23:28] * tanuva (~tanuva@HSI-KBW-046-005-002-249.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[23:28] <gordonDrogon> Yea - just need a good strong desk :)
[23:28] <chod> i had some cornerstone monitors, they needed good desks
[23:28] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:29] <JakeSays> chod: cornerstone.. those sound familiar - super high resolution?
[23:29] <chod> yes, anything you threw at them multisync efforts
[23:29] * Spiffy (~Spiffy@unaffiliated/spiffy) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:30] <chod> better than these modern panels
[23:30] <JakeSays> many moons ago i worked for a company that sold them for document processing applications
[23:30] <chod> 2048x1536 ?
[23:30] <chod> ish
[23:30] <JakeSays> sounds about right
[23:31] * teepee (~teepee@p4FFFD099.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:31] * teepee (~teepee@p50846F06.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:31] <chod> 'Degause'
[23:31] * skfax_ (~skfax@144.81-166-238.customer.lyse.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:31] <JakeSays> lol yup
[23:31] <chod> click woooooomp booom
[23:31] <JakeSays> i seem to recall they were greyscale
[23:31] <chod> full colour
[23:32] <chod> mine must have been 'modern' :D
[23:32] <JakeSays> this was in '93
[23:33] <JakeSays> ah! finally found some parts i can re-use
[23:33] <chod> i had them on a dual cpu celery box dual video out
[23:33] * enque (~enque@ip70-160-27-9.hr.hr.cox.net) Quit (Quit: enque)
[23:33] <chod> i may still have that box here somewhere
[23:33] <chod> yay its there >
[23:34] <chod> some one may have done it
[23:35] <chod> dual video out using seperate terminals ?
[23:35] <chod> one each output?
[23:36] <chod> Degauss
[23:36] * yoavz (yoavz@yoavz.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[23:36] <chod> that looks bettter
[23:38] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:38] * yoavz (yoavz@yoavz.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:40] <JakeSays> gordonDrogon: hey do you think this could be driven off of the pi's pwm pin? http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lmd18201.pdf
[23:41] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:44] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable237.145-19-135.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:46] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[23:47] * zokeber (~Zokeber@unaffiliated/zokeber) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:48] * Orion__ (~Orion_@ Quit (Quit: ~ Trillian Astra - www.trillian.im ~)
[23:49] * pecorade (~pecorade@host196-253-dynamic.42-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:49] * ukscone (~Adium@cpe-24-193-113-179.nyc.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:50] * ukscone (~Adium@cpe-24-193-113-179.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:51] * knob (~knob@adsl-64-237-238-64.prtc.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[23:52] <ant_thomas> I've just managed to accidentally kill the D17 TVS Diode. I've removed it and ordered a replacement. But the over-voltage came via the USB port rather than microUSB. Is there a chance the rest of the RPi is fried too?
[23:52] * gr4yscale (~gr4yscale@c-24-21-166-2.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:52] <SpeedEvil> Yes.
[23:52] * Spiffy (~Spiffy@unaffiliated/spiffy) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:53] <SpeedEvil> Powering it via usb will tell you
[23:53] <SpeedEvil> Carefully
[23:53] <SpeedEvil> microusb
[23:54] * Hydra (~Hydra@46-65-54-87.zone16.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:54] <ant_thomas> PWR lights up seemingly normally but ACT is extremely dim
[23:55] <Datalink> ugh, my SD reader on my laptop thinks everything os read-only >.<
[23:56] <Tickle> Datalink check the physical switch on the SD card
[23:57] <Datalink> Tickle, I did, on all 4 cards, including my active Pi install, a phone SD card and 2 brand new cards
[23:57] <Tickle> I don't know then sorry.
[23:58] <Firehopper> the sd card reader might have a stuck write protect switch sensor
[23:59] <Datalink> Firehopper, that'd be a short across the pins if it was
[23:59] <Firehopper> meaning its stuck open or closed
[23:59] <Datalink> it's... not mechanical... it's electrical

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