#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2014-03-10

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[15:55] -orwell.freenode.net- *** Looking up your hostname...
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[15:55] * RaspberryPiBot (~PircBot@unaffiliated/datagutt/bot/databot) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:55] * Topic is 'Unofficial RaspberryPi IRC channel but "Blessed" by the Foundation as the ONE channel. Logs @ http://srv.datagutt1.com <> Channel Rules: http://tiny.cc/h7za1w <> Getting help on IRC: http://tiny.cc/p9za1w <>'
[15:55] * Set by ShiftPlusOne!~Shift@unaffiliated/shiftplusone on Sun Aug 04 19:59:52 CEST 2013
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[16:12] <beaky> can i power the pi from the +5V pins
[16:12] <beaky> ont he gpio
[16:13] <IT_Sean> The 5v pin is common to the power input, so, yes. It is possible to power the pi from it.
[16:13] * jlf` is now known as jlf
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[16:30] * t_dot_zilla (~vipkilla@unaffiliated/t-dot-zilla/x-2830497) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:30] <t_dot_zilla> hi
[16:30] * Nenor (~Nenor@ip4-95-82-183-100.cust.nbox.cz) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[16:30] <t_dot_zilla> i have an external 2.5 inch hd that uses USB to power it (it has two USB plugs on one end for extra power)
[16:31] <t_dot_zilla> my question is, would the raspberrypi be able to power this device by plugging it into both USB ports on the pi?
[16:34] <justaguy> t_dot_zilla: depends on the power use of that HDD
[16:34] <justaguy> most do, some doesn't
[16:35] <t_dot_zilla> well... it us an IDE/ATA drive
[16:35] <t_dot_zilla> i've been told it uses around 750mU
[16:36] <t_dot_zilla> i have a USB power with external power but my problem is that this hub is USB 1.1
[16:36] <t_dot_zilla> so the drive is slow
[16:36] <t_dot_zilla> guess i need to buy a USB hub that is 2.0 :/
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[16:54] * lazy_prince is now known as killer_prince
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[16:55] <higuita> t_dot_zilla: you can connect one usb connect to the rpi and the power usb connect to the usb 1.1
[16:55] * markovh (zncuser@unaffiliated/markovh) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:56] * nStensen (~not@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[16:57] <higuita> the disk will take power from the usb (with luck, you can also power the rpi from the same hub (also connect the usb to the rpi)
[16:57] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[16:58] <beaky> why do people bother buying dedicated NAS that costs several hundred pounds when you can get a pi with TB storage and install samba on it to get one for under 30 quid
[16:59] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:59] <[SLB]> unfortunately, the pi and linux is not for everyone yet
[17:00] <IT_Sean> beaky: performance
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[17:04] <beaky> pi gives a lot of bang for the buck; the cheapest nas cost like 100 quid
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[17:04] <BCMM> beaky: the wired ethernet port shares a single U S Bus's bandwidth with the USB ports
[17:04] <BCMM> all data going between the disk and the network has to travel *both ways* over that single bus, competing for bandwidth with itself
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[17:10] <higuita> beaky: if you want performance and failover, a NAS might be easier and safer than a rpi with several disk connected... but always with freenas or openfiler or omv
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[17:23] <beaky> isn't the ethernet on the pi dedicated hardware?
[17:23] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:24] <beaky> seeing as it has an onboard PHY/MAC
[17:24] <beaky> oh wait its the USB hub itself...
[17:25] <beaky> must be cheaper than having onboard PHY!
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[17:28] <Jusii> has someone used this USB wifi dongle with RPi? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Raspberry-Pi-Wi-Fi-adapter-dongle-Ralink-RT5370-RTL8188CUS-with-external-antenna-/161015226711
[17:28] <sobel> indeed
[17:28] <sobel> beaky: everything is done to cut cost
[17:29] <Jusii> Tenda w311u+ with external antenna has some supply problems, need to find another with ext antenna _connector_ that works without a hub
[17:29] * joobcode (~joobcode@slk-cuswifi.sleek.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:29] <sobel> Jusii: i have good luck with my HornetTek adapter. ralink drive of some flavor.
[17:30] <sobel> it's got an antenna connector but i leave the stock antenna in it
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[17:30] <Jusii> ah, thanks
[17:30] <Jusii> will look that one too
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[17:32] <t_dot_zilla> higuita: the pi will take power from the USB hub?
[17:32] <Jusii> sobel: and you run it without a hub?
[17:33] <Jusii> sobel: this? http://www.hornettek.com/wireless-networking/hornettek-wireless-n150-usb-adapter-ht-s801n.html
[17:33] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff/UltimateMacUser1) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
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[17:33] <sobel> Jusii: no, i use it with a hub. i am a little paranoid about wifi adapters wanting power.
[17:33] <Joost> Guys, how bad would it be for my SD card to write IRC logs to it?
[17:34] <Joost> Should I write them to ram and get a cronjob to write them to SD every hour or so?
[17:34] <sobel> Jusii: that is the adapter
[17:35] <Jusii> ok, thanks
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[17:52] <nandTron> newbie question, a: Is there any magic to selecting which Linux distro to use for Raspberry Pi? I'm trying to firstly emulate a Raspberry Pi environment -- alternate to that I can't seem to get a new source code checkout to work for chromium os, this morning
[17:52] <nandTron> mosty wondering how the initial distro selection/install goes, if there's anything special added for raspberry pi or if it's just like a typical linux install
[17:52] <nandTron> mostly at a dusty keyboard otherwise lol
[17:53] * BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[17:53] <Azusa> Use Raspian, its available on their website.
[17:53] <nandTron> Azusa: thx
[17:53] <Azusa> There are other OS's mentioned there as well.
[17:54] <nandTron> "optimized for the aspberry pi hardware" there it is
[17:54] <nandTron> Azusa: I'll start with Raspian. bit of a UML/SysML geek LOL, just trying to get an idea for how the metamodel works with RPi I suppose
[17:55] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:56] <Azusa> I haven't really tried the others, but Raspian and Raspbmc have been fine for me on the pi.
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[17:57] * killer_prince is now known as lazy_prince
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[17:59] * nils2 is now known as nils_2
[18:00] <nandTron> Azusa: will take a lok at raspbmc also - looking at it like a domain of toolchain components, at this time. I understand there are a few such components in the FOSS domain, lol, it's kind of nice compared to the old commercial toolkit catalogs of yore
[18:00] * joobcode (~joobcode@slk-cuswifi.sleek.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:02] <nandTron> raspbmc = media center, oh? Good for folk music too, I'm sure, lol?
[18:03] <nandTron> JackD in a SoC design catered for multimedia applications - there could be something in that, I think. AC3 code licensing might be another thing
[18:03] <nandTron> Arduino for MIDI show control, that too
[18:03] <sraue> raspbmc is a distro based on raspbian with included XBMC (this is the mediacenter)
[18:03] <Azusa> nandTron: Raspbmc is Xbmc optimized for the pi so I'm not really sure how useful it will be for you.
[18:03] <nandTron> sraue: XBMC, ahh I've heard of this
[18:04] <nandTron> Azusa: Oh it's quite, I think, LOL. Will take a look at XBMC I suppose -- been meaning to get around to that for a while, lol
[18:04] <sraue> Azusa, "Raspbmc is Xbmc optimized for the pi" <--- thats not true, XBMC is not created or optimized from the raspbmc project, the work was done by the XBMC devs
[18:05] * pksato (~PEBKAC@unaffiliated/pksato) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:05] <nandTron> iirc: OS is optimized for Pi. XBMC is, I presume, an extension of Libc?
[18:06] <sney> xbmc is xbox media centre.
[18:06] <sraue> OS is raspbian with included XBMC from xbmc.org
[18:06] <nandTron> ...in that big POSIX/X-Open domain that one Redmond company would seem to have given short shrift to. Too broad perhaps...
[18:07] <nandTron> There's the whole "user experience" thing too. I for one am glad to see that there's a Raspberry Pi developer community focused about the possible multimedia applications of the Raspberry Pi platform
[18:07] <Azusa> sraue: Oh, I thought that was the case.
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[18:08] <higuita> t_dot_zilla: IIRC, rpi can be power via the usb connector. first rpi version had something that disabled that, but newer version do work
[18:08] <nandTron> Modularity! /folds up signboard
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[18:09] <Peasant65> hi ! Does someone here has a little html/css knowledge ?
[18:09] <nandTron> snev: ahh xbox, I've heard of it lol.
[18:09] <nandTron> Peasant65: in some regards
[18:09] <Peasant65> I have a (probably real dumb) problem
[18:09] * Nenor (~Nenor@ip4-95-82-183-100.cust.nbox.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:13] <t_dot_zilla> higuita: do you have to tell the PI to get power from one of the USB adapters?
[18:13] * michael_lee (~michael_l@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:15] <mgottschlag> t_dot_zilla: no
[18:16] <mgottschlag> there's just a direct wire between the 5V USB line and (except for a fuse) the 5V input at the microusb
[18:18] <higuita> t_dot_zilla: your usb hub should be able to do ~750mA (IIRC) to the rpi to work (but most of the time the rpi used a lot less than that... but if unstable, its the first thing to check)
[18:18] * Azusa (~Moonboot@ Quit (Quit: Bye)
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[18:21] <t_dot_zilla> unstable? and how do you check?
[18:22] <t_dot_zilla> my friends rpi was randomly locking up, he thought it might be a power issue. but i tested same powersupply on my pi which works fine
[18:22] * MadeAllUp (~gen@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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[18:26] <nandTron> In trying to get an idea of how the Raspbery Pi SoC is designed, I wonder, does the "GPU" denoted at http://elinux.org/RPi_config.txt mean Graphics Processing Unit?
[18:27] <nandTron> I could understand if some of the OS features may be offloaded to the GPU as the GPU being a microprocessor, assuming that I've rea that acronym correctly
[18:27] <nandTron> just trying to understand how it's modular, I suppose, LOL
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[18:30] * Madatnek (~Madatnek@c213-100-101-174.cust.tele2.se) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[18:31] <Poison[BLX]> nandTron: yeah, the VideoCore side of it (which is a huge percentage of the hardware in the chip) is the GPU, as you suspected. The issue with offloading general purpose code to it's mostly in a) access to it (currently it's only accessible through a black-box type firmware 'blob' from the rest of the system) and b) re-writing code to actually be viable to run on a gpu at all.
[18:32] <mgottschlag> also, the gpu processor is actually realtime capable, which helps with some tasks
[18:32] <mgottschlag> well, the operating system on it is
[18:32] <mgottschlag> I mean, that is why some parts are in the blob even if they wouldn't need to be
[18:33] <nandTron> mgottschlag, Poison[BLX]: i c
[18:33] <mgottschlag> also, if you want to do some reverse engineering, we have beginner jobs :p
[18:34] * malcom2O73 is now known as malcom2073
[18:34] <nandTron> Poison[BLX]: It might be a long shot but I'm trying to view it for how it may be analogous to the design of an old Lisp Machine, MIT CADR, historically in what may have bee a pre-VLSI epoch
[18:34] <Poison[BLX]> "a)" there in my remarks is hopefully going to be fixed in the relatively near future, as that's very close to some hardware broadcom recently opened up the docs and source for (around the end of Feb, big post from Eben about it on the foundation site)
[18:34] <nandTron> I understand that the RPi SoC design would have its own design constraints however
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[18:35] <nandTron> mgottschlag: realtime capability - it might sound like "low hanging fruit" I'm afraid but I've read of that with regards to low-latency multimedia applications primarily, like with JackD and so on
[18:35] <Poison[BLX]> 'relatively near future' is entirely dependent on how tempting the people capable of the task are at porting Quake3 over and getting the code sorted out for the $10k bounty
[18:35] * Madatnek (~Madatnek@c213-100-101-174.cust.tele2.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:35] <nandTron> Poison[BLX]: Quake 3 LOL I've heard of it. I could be interested in porting Descent II on a holidy lol
[18:36] <nandTron> retro gaming fun
[18:36] <Poison[BLX]> nandTron: yeah, but Descent isn't, if I recall opened up source-wise like ID's engine, which is why that's the 'goal' proposed by the bounty the foundation put up :)
[18:36] <nandTron> Personally, I'm interested in RPi for its extensibility w.r.t Arduino, trying to not get too blue sky about it but I've heard of a couple of asteroid mining companies around...
[18:37] <mgottschlag> also, this is not about porting quake, but about porting the 3D driver
[18:37] <Poison[BLX]> ^
[18:37] <Poison[BLX]> exactly.
[18:37] <nandTron> Poison[BLX]: I c
[18:37] <Poison[BLX]> quake just makes a great test case.
[18:38] <nandTron> Blue sky: I wonder if the Quake engine could be used for designing a simulation environment cf. the emerging NewSpace industry? and it not flip any red flags to the security folks cf. Virgin Galactic can't fly folks from China?
[18:39] <nandTron> There's Valve's source engine too?
[18:40] <nandTron> Will keep that idea boxed I suppopse - the legal concerns in regards to NewSpace technologies, I'm afraid might seem to require a sort of corporate model about the same
[18:40] <nandTron> wot
[18:40] <Poison[BLX]> as mentioned, it's not about the engine, it's about the VideoCore driver, which is, either way, the first step.
[18:41] <nandTron> video drive, ok
[18:41] <nandTron> video drive*r* ok
[18:42] <nandTron> so if one was to develp a SysML model of the RPi SoC platform, I understand now that the GPU would be a prominent feature in that SysML PC model
[18:43] <nandTron> I'm not so far along in courses at DeVry that I could feel comfortable with digging in with C coding, as yet. I'm familiar with some of those UML Model-based software engineering things, though, trying to get some sort of a concrete view about the platform lol
[18:44] <Poison[BLX]> once it's in a working form, hacking it to expose more of the hardware directly to userspace (preferably via an actual opencl or similar API I would think) should allow a lot more code to be developed to run on the GPU, offloading the job from the underpowered arm. Without the VideoCore side of it, all you have is an underpowered armv6 chip with a rather tiny portion of its capabilities exposed to the end user (such as the few digital only GPIO's
[18:45] <Poison[BLX]> as it stands, it works *great*, as evidenced by the pi being able to output 1080p video without hesitation while many chips that're actually faster and newer on the arm side struggling with smooth 720p ;)
[18:45] <nandTron> userspace, ok
[18:45] <Poison[BLX]> it's just not programmer friendly on the code-side to *use* the chip for other tasks than what's specifically exposed already.
[18:46] <nandTron> Poison[BLX]: With regars to refactoring an old Lisp Machine design, I think it could be interesting to study how the GPU implements HDMI. Is there a schematic for the item and/or a project for the driver?
[18:47] * pwh (~pwh@ Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[18:47] <nandTron> that LispM design afaik is public domain now, but I'm really not trying to take the traf0data approach to computing LOL
[18:47] <mgottschlag> no, hdmi output is not documented
[18:48] <nandTron> they ripped off CP/M and later became Microsoft - such history in computing...
[18:48] * gadgetoid (~gadgetoid@ has joined #raspberrypi
[18:48] <nandTron> mgottschlag: I see. Probably a proprietary standard, what with the DRM stuff I guess?
[18:48] <mgottschlag> apart from that, I don't think much of what you say makes sense, at least I cannot imagine how comparing a lisp machine with the pi makes any sense :)
[18:48] <mgottschlag> no
[18:48] <mgottschlag> hdmi is documented
[18:48] <mgottschlag> the chip on the pi however is not
[18:49] <nandTron> mgottschlag: modularty in the schematic. I can only view it from the point of view of a prospective SysML block diagram presently
[18:49] <nandTron> mgottschlag: for that LispM design to be applicable today, it would need to be refactored for moder peripheral bussses, modern video technology, etc.
[18:49] <nandTron> mgottschlag: oh, I'd thought it was an open core design
[18:49] <mgottschlag> then you want to compare it with a modern CPU for which VHDL is available
[18:49] <mgottschlag> no
[18:49] <nandTron> the Pi microprocessor, ok
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[18:50] <mgottschlag> your best bet might actually be openrisc
[18:50] <nandTron> mgottschlag: thx
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[19:14] <nandTron> If this may not be a "Too far out" kind of question, I wonder, has anyone had any experience in intereacting with Broadcom? Referencing the Wikipedia article about the RPi platform, I read that it uses a Broadcom BCM2835 SoC microprocessor. Being quite the neophyte in such a domain, just trying to get a better view of it lol
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[19:15] <IT_Sean> define "a better view"
[19:15] <IT_Sean> you aren't going to get the dirty secrets behind the SoC
[19:15] <nandTron> IT_Sean: A model-based view, referencing SysML, ostensibly "in mind" and then in Modelio LOL
[19:16] <IT_Sean> You really aren't going to get much. The SoC is very much closed source.
[19:16] <SpeedEvil> The redacted datasheet provided so far - and the GPU source - is all there is
[19:17] <SpeedEvil> Broadcom is entirely uninterested in talking to people who are not willing to buy several million chips
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[19:17] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: I see. Return on investment, I suppose
[19:18] <nandTron> It would seem that Broadcom produces some pretty good quality hardware though?
[19:18] * BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:18] <SpeedEvil> Not especially great, no.
[19:18] * taza (~zap@unaffiliated/taza) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:18] <nandTron> Trying to not go too far with entrepeneurial business planning -- I'm guessing that there's could to be a challenge in bridging between open and proprietary models, in some endeavors
[19:18] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: I c
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> Simple answer.
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> Avoid broadcom.
[19:19] <nandTron> LoL
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> There are some manufacturers who are more open.
[19:19] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: I wonder what's the narrative as for how their SoC design was selected for RPi originally?
[19:20] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: I'm guessing that any manufacturers around OpenRISC would be among those more open
[19:20] <SpeedEvil> 'Oh - they make those down the corridor
[19:20] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: LOL I c
[19:20] * nitdega_ (~nitdega@adsl-74-177-45-85.mem.bellsouth.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:20] <SpeedEvil> The founder is employed by broadcom. Case closed.
[19:20] <SpeedEvil> And no - openrisc devices do not meaningfully exist
[19:20] <nandTron> Well I wish Broadcom much goodwill then. If their hardware is stury enough to fly in a cuebsat, it could be a part of someone's asteroid mining plans one day
[19:21] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: Oh
[19:21] <SpeedEvil> err - no
[19:21] <SpeedEvil> Random consumer stuff will 'work' in space.
[19:21] <SpeedEvil> It's just reliability thats an issue
[19:21] * linuxstb (~linuxstb@unaffiliated/linuxstb) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:22] <nandTron> SpeedEvil: Hrmm. I wonder if I should check about who manufactured Voyagers I and II? I'm sure it's been some decades albeit, they've had mad uptime though LOL
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> From memory, intersil
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RCA_1802
[19:23] <SpeedEvil> Or not
[19:23] * nitdega (nitdega@2602:306:2423:4fc1:1811:d9df:9808:a5aa) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[19:23] <nandTron> NSSDC NMC does not reference manufacturers, will take a look though - http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/nmc/spacecraftDisplay.do?id=1977-076A
[19:23] * MadeAllUp (~gen@ Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[19:24] <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voyager_program
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[19:25] * Peasant65 (5355b4c9@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[19:26] <nandTron> Lol 8-track digital
[19:26] * Nenor (~Nenor@ip4-95-82-183-100.cust.nbox.cz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[19:27] <nandTron> Well I guess the technology transfer portal would be where to find that much more info - pardon this w0t thread lol
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[19:29] <nandTron> Erm FWIW Google indicateds that NASA JPL was the manufacturer of Voyager 2. That's accurate I think...?
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[19:33] <[SLB]> hm, why via eth i can access my pi thru the lan ip, whilst via wifi (and same lan ip) i have to access my pi thru the wan ip?
[19:34] <[SLB]> route listing is also the same for both cases
[19:34] <girafe> raspberry pi !
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[19:47] <SpeedEvil> one route is generally preferred for any fgiven IP address
[19:48] <[SLB]> hm, the pi reaches the internet in both ways, it's just me from the desktop machine that can't access the pi on the lan address
[19:49] <[SLB]> +when it uses wifi
[19:49] <[SLB]> i'm not sure what should i look into
[19:49] <[SLB]> i can't even ping its lan ip when it uses wifi
[19:50] <[SLB]> it's a static ip
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[19:56] <Hurst> Hey can anyone give me a hand with the FM transmitter code, for some reason when i run it i just get a solid tone no music
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[20:13] <[SLB]> hme, it seemed like i had to manually ifdown eth0 to have it work
[20:13] <[SLB]> though, the route gateway for wlan and eth have of course different metrics
[20:13] <[SLB]> any reason why if i start it with only wifi connected, i also get the eth entries in route listing?
[20:14] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:14] <[SLB]> i think i've read something somewhere about autoenabling eth even if there's no cable
[20:14] <[SLB]> i can't remember...
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[20:29] <Technicus> Hello, I have rasbian running and the keys are mapped in different places, how can I change them to match my keyboard?
[20:30] <atouk> raspi-config
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[20:39] <Technicus> How do I cure the poblem: "XServer appears to lack required GLX support"?
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[21:00] <Technicus> How can I get the camera to be recognized as a video device?
[21:01] * IT_Sean introduces Technicus to Google
[21:03] * Technicus is wondering what the purpose of IRC is for if everyones response to questions is responded with a snarky lame remark directing people to Google.
[21:04] * Armand (~martin@ Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[21:04] * m8 (~m@unaffiliated/m8) Quit (Quit: Sto andando via)
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[21:04] * Bozza (~Bozza@unaffiliated/bozza) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[21:07] <mgottschlag> Technicus: the thing is, we'd need to google as well
[21:07] <mgottschlag> now, if you had shown us what you have tried, and error messages which popped up along the way
[21:07] <mgottschlag> that would be a totally different situation :)
[21:08] <mgottschlag> because then suddenly it's a question where a good answer depends on experience/expertise, and not on being able to look it up in the manual
[21:08] <Technicus> mgottschlag: I know . . . but what is wrong with just asking questions, and maybe someone has experience with this already . . . besides, I like interacting with people.
[21:09] * nitdega (nitdega@2602:306:2423:3b81:7c62:6425:18c8:9319) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:09] <mgottschlag> if anybody had done this already, they would have answered even after IT_Sean's response
[21:10] <Technicus> It's not a big deal anyway.
[21:10] <Technicus> I'm just messing around.
[21:11] * kwrazi (~kwrazi@220-245-146-175.static.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[21:22] <t_dot_zilla> does anybody else here run the pi's root filesystem on an external hd?
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[22:04] <Technicus> How is this problem cured: < http://fpaste.org/84097/13944851/ >.
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[22:05] <beaky> is it safe to overclock the pi
[22:05] <beaky> or will i regret it someday
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[22:07] <Nefarious___> Has anyone using node.js on Arch encountered any problems with protobuf? (Not node-protobuf) Node-gyp rebuild keeps failing >.<
[22:08] <CyberAssassin> What are you using the Pi for that you want to overclock it beaky?
[22:08] <ppq> beaky, along comes (statistically) a higher risk of data corruption on the sd card
[22:08] <Technicus> Is there a way to get the GLX support on a Raspberry PI?
[22:09] <ppq> so if you write a lot you probably shouldn't overclock
[22:09] <beaky> ok i overclocked my pi to turbo
[22:10] <beaky> wow its fast
[22:10] <beaky> i approve of overclocking
[22:10] <quench> whatever speed you get will be soured by random SD card errors
[22:10] <beaky> now compiling will take half a day rather than a week
[22:10] <beaky> wow random sd card errors are that much of an issue?
[22:10] <beaky> lets see how far i get
[22:11] <beaky> BogoMIPS : 2.00
[22:11] <beaky> aww cmon!
[22:11] <CyberAssassin> Is there a way to make the SD Card just hold the MBR and boot from a HDD?
[22:11] <ppq> sure, it's best to make your own experiences
[22:11] <quench> might have got better with recent updates, but for me overclocking past "medium" always completely hosed the install.
[22:11] <beaky> why is there white smoke coming out of my pi
[22:11] <CyberAssassin> You let out the magic smoke. :P
[22:11] <ppq> CyberAssassin, yes, google for "raspberry pi usb root install"
[22:12] <ShadowJK> Filesystems are usually the first things that get toasted on any device you overclock too hard
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[22:13] <CyberAssassin> ppq: Would that route ensure the filesystem safety of the pi while overclocked?
[22:13] <beaky> ok i disabled overclocking
[22:13] <ppq> CyberAssassin, no
[22:13] <beaky> i dont want to ruin my precious files
[22:14] <ShadowJK> If it also overclocks the sd bus, the timings will be off in the sdcard driver, I'd imagine
[22:14] <beaky> the gains from overclocking the pi to turbo are pretty meh :(
[22:14] <beaky> maybe if i switch to beaglebon black i get better performance?
[22:14] <quench> the Pi uses an excruciatingly old processor
[22:14] <ppq> the only thing i experienced after overclocking was unexpected behaviour
[22:15] <CyberAssassin> that was weird.
[22:15] <CyberAssassin> I'm not sure which board I want to go with. BeagleBone Black or Raspberry Pi
[22:15] <ShadowJK> the BBB processor, at the same MHz as the rPi processor, is probably 2-3 times faster
[22:16] <quench> the beaglebone is faster but not a speed demon by any means. if you want a decent processor you need a CubieTruck or a Udoo
[22:16] <ppq> yes, depends on what exactly you need
[22:16] <quench> same sort of embedded linux board, but more memory and dual/quad ARM cores
[22:16] <CyberAssassin> I want to build tunnel server and a internet radio broadcaster.
[22:16] <beaky> compiling on the pi makes me really appreciate my intel core i5
[22:16] <beaky> i can compile gentoo in seconds with that thing
[22:17] <ShadowJK> The level of pain of getting an OS running and usable on these boards is minimal with rpi, increases with BBB, and gets pretty high with cubie/udoo/sunxi/allwinner
[22:17] <beaky> should the pain curve be the inverse?
[22:17] <beaky> seeing as the pi uses an outdated arm ISA
[22:17] <quench> ShadowJK: I agree. the Pi is easiest and the best supported, I had nightmares getting my Cubieboards to boot properly
[22:17] * sphenxes01 (~sphenxes@91-119-207-6.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[22:17] <ppq> beaky, you can cross-compile your raspi sources on your i5
[22:18] <ShadowJK> beaky; well if pi was both slow and unsupported, nobody would use it
[22:18] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@91-119-207-6.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[22:18] <beaky> i wonder why the pi is the most popular of all the boards
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[22:18] <quench> ShadowJK: the Cubieboard 2 has some weird power issues too. very touchy about it's supply, and it's incredibly easy to get it to hang if your power is not up to scratch.
[22:18] <Nefarious___> Nobody uses node.js on arch?
[22:19] <beaky> Nefarious___: i use it on debian
[22:19] <beaky> it is awesome
[22:19] <ShadowJK> quench; i didn't think it was possible to do it worse than rpi :)
[22:19] <beaky> l
[22:19] <quench> beaky: the community, undoubtably. if you want to do anything on a Cubieboard you have to work it out yourself
[22:19] <ShadowJK> Initially rpi had cost advantage, but this isn't really true anymore
[22:19] <Nefarious___> beaky: i use it on my debian laptop and it works fine, just arch is messing with me heh
[22:20] <beaky> Nefarious___: node on my arch desktop is alright
[22:20] <beaky> i wont compile node on my pi again
[22:20] <Nefarious___> beaky: could you try to install a package to test something?
[22:20] <beaky> ok
[22:20] <quench> ShadowJK: eh, you'd be surprised. it took me quite a while to find a clean enough supply to actually use both of my CPU cores without it panicking. needs to be very stable and able to keep up with the spikes in current when the Cubie unleashes the full 1.2Ghz clock.
[22:20] <beaky> i grew a beard during the time it took me to compile node
[22:20] * jiuweigui (~jiuweigui@unaffiliated/jiuweigui) Quit (Quit: ...)
[22:20] <ShadowJK> But for sure, in the period of time it was cheapest, it gained huge popularity and through that gained its high level of support
[22:20] <Nefarious___> Heg
[22:21] <Nefarious___> protobuf
[22:21] <Nefarious___> Heh*
[22:21] <CyberAssassin> So if someone wanted to build a Tunnel Server(1 project) and a Internet Radio Broadcaster(1 project) which board would you choose? BBB or RPi?
[22:21] <ShadowJK> I like the olimex designs, they have onboard smps usually, so they generally accept a wide range of voltage supply
[22:22] <quench> CyberAssassin: BBB/Cubie, why settle for slow?
[22:22] <ShadowJK> I'd probably consider using a cubox or similar for tunnel server project
[22:22] <ShadowJK> iirc it has native dual gigabit ethernet
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[22:23] <quench> wish there was a proper index of all these devices, I'd never even heard of the cubox before
[22:23] <ShadowJK> But yeah, usb ethernets like rpi would definitely score low for me :)
[22:23] <CyberAssassin> ^^
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[22:23] <ShadowJK> Currently have a sheevaplug as vpn box
[22:24] <ShadowJK> single gigabit ethernet, 1.2GHz armv5 cpu
[22:24] <quench> Cubox seems to be similar in spec to the Cubieboard 2, probably uses the same processor
[22:24] <ShadowJK> cubox is a Marvell SoC, cubieboard is Allwinner
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[22:24] <quench> ouch that cubox is expensive
[22:25] <ppq> my next ARM system will be a Udoo Quad
[22:26] <ppq> i like the approach to combine full-featured PC and microcontroller
[22:26] <ShadowJK> It's not like you need more than 400-600Mhz at most for vpn server
[22:26] <beaky> i wonder why they went for failmega328 instead of a 32-bit microcontroller
[22:26] <ShadowJK> but having proper I/O is crucial :)
[22:27] <CyberAssassin> The Cubieboard 2 looks decent.
[22:28] <quench> it works fine for me, I like having SATA. highly recommend finding a PSP1 charger to power it, they work the best in my experience
[22:28] <quench> $5 on eBay for a 5v @ 2A supply with the right plug, much happier than that with some chinese junk
[22:29] <Nefarious___> beaky: did it work?
[22:29] <quench> there's also a new model, CubieTruck which is apparently a lot better
[22:29] <ShadowJK> I wish rpi hadn't used 5V microusb
[22:29] <beaky> eeyes i am now doing node-gyp rebuild
[22:29] <Nefarious___> Hm
[22:29] <quench> ShadowJK: yep.
[22:30] <ShadowJK> Those powersupplies intended to charge phones are supposed to drop voltage when load increases.. Probably why you have to get ludicrously oversized ones to ensure rpi runs reliably
[22:30] <quench> haha, have you ever opened one up? you'll see why
[22:30] <CyberAssassin> Wow
[22:30] <quench> death traps, the lot of them
[22:30] <CyberAssassin> Cubox looks amazing.
[22:30] <Poison[BLX]> ShadowJK: I wish it *had* thrown in an ftdi chip and exposed the uart on the microusb ;)
[22:30] <Nefarious___> beaky: Thanks a lot, seems like its just me then. >.<
[22:31] <Martin`> hmm tested wipi, it is just a slow device :P
[22:31] <ShadowJK> Sure, but even "proper" ones designed according to spec are supposed to drop voltage when load increases
[22:31] <Martin`> over 200ms with wipi, connected to airport express in client mode, 20ms
[22:31] <CyberAssassin> Why is it that the RPi is so popular but probably the slowest on the market?
[22:31] <ShadowJK> it's in the USB "dumb" charging spec :)
[22:32] <quench> ShadowJK: that doesn't sound right. they drop voltage because they're unregulated with no feedback loop. why on earth would they be specced to drop?
[22:32] <beaky> CyberAssassin: marketing
[22:32] <ShadowJK> CyberAssassin; cost, support, just works
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[22:32] <CyberAssassin> Any issues with getting the Cubox to just work?
[22:32] <ShadowJK> quench; that's how the phone is supposed to figure out how much current it can use :)
[22:33] <quench> ShadowJK: could have sworn they were meant to do that with pullup resistors on the data lines
[22:34] <ShadowJK> quench; the D+/D- are shorted together to indicate "charger", the charger (i.e. powersupply) must lower voltage when load increases
[22:35] <quench> ShadowJK: bizarre. definitely not what these chinese supplies are doing though, they're just badly made death traps.
[22:35] <ShadowJK> Otherwise if you had, say, a psu capable of .5A connected to phone that can use 2A, the psu would enter overload condition, shut down, phone would stop taking power, psu would reset, phone would overload psu again
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[23:00] <sudormrf> hey guys, do any of you know of something like the raspberry pi that has gigE?
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[23:02] <pksato> sudormrf: gigE to use less that 1% of bw?
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[23:02] <sudormrf> pksato: what is bw?
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[23:04] <pksato> band width.
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[23:04] <raynerd> If I have a script with a variable x and then in the code I simply say x = x + 1 then close the script. Is there any way to store the variable so it picks up where I left off in terms of storing the variavle
[23:04] <sudormrf> pksato: in which case, I don't understand your question.
[23:04] <sudormrf> why the 1%?
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[23:05] <seanmarcia> raynerd Yes.
[23:05] <seanmarcia> raynerd You can write your value to a database of some sort.
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[23:06] <raynerd> humm, I guess that requires a lot of extra code?
[23:06] <seanmarcia> For a project I'm working on, I save everything to csv files rather than use a database.
[23:06] <pksato> gigE is a 1giga bits per second ethernet. most common application and hardware can not really handle this speed rate.
[23:06] <seanmarcia> What language are you using?
[23:06] * rcombs (~rcombs@rcombs.me) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[23:06] <raynerd> I just want to take a picture every time the code runs but every 20 pictures, I want it to start back at image 1
[23:06] <raynerd> python - and I`m not very good!
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[23:07] <pksato> raynerd: short answer is no.
[23:08] <raynerd> :-( grr
[23:08] <pksato> If need to use result on other programa, need to use some type of IPC.
[23:08] <sudormrf> pksato: that doesn't make sense. sorry man. there is plenty of hardware out there that can support this. unless you are strictly limiting what you are referring to being the ARM world
[23:10] <pksato> not limited to ARM.
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[23:10] <raynerd> anyone by any weird chance used PYWWS on here?
[23:11] <sudormrf> pksato: then I completely disagree with your statement. when working with a LAN there is plenty that takes advantage of that speed.
[23:11] <seanmarcia> raynerd I think there is an easier way to do it. What I would probably do is use the os library and then use the mtime fuction in there to find the most recently edited file. (If there is no file, save it as picture1.png) I'd get the picture number of the most recently edited picture and save the next picture as +1 that. If that number is greater than > 20 save it as picture 1.
[23:11] <seanmarcia> Hopefully the logic there made sense.
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[23:12] <seanmarcia> Then you don't need a database or anything like that.
[23:12] <seanmarcia> I'm sure there are smarter people here with a more elegant way of doing it.
[23:14] <raynerd> sounds like a good solution but a bit above me... some googling needed!
[23:14] <pksato> raynerd: cant not do all on python?
[23:14] <raynerd> huh?
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[23:16] <raynerd> pksato - I don`t understand sorry
[23:16] <pksato> a loop on some code to take photos and every 20 shots, return to firt file name.
[23:16] <pksato> first
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[23:17] <raynerd> pkato - I can`t loop, the file has to close and reopen
[23:17] * rc0mbs is now known as rcombs
[23:18] <pksato> what file?
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[23:18] <raynerd> the script I`m running that takes the image. I can`t use a loop.
[23:19] <raynerd> I thought that is what you were suggesting. That I could do.
[23:19] <pksato> What you really want to do?
[23:19] <pksato> why not?
[23:20] <pksato> that script?
[23:20] <pksato> this script accept a argument as file name?
[23:20] <raynerd> It is for a weather station
[23:20] <raynerd> PYWWS... every hour it runs in cron. I want to pull this camera script into it so it takes a photo as well.
[23:21] <raynerd> but I only want to take say 20-40 photos before it starts overwriting
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[23:22] <pksato> when take a photo, its automatic named?
[23:22] <pksato> cron is some type of loop. :)
[23:22] <raynerd> I can name it...
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[23:24] <pksato> why not 24 photos? (every hour)
[23:24] <raynerd> lol, at the moment I can`t do anything :-)
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[23:25] <raynerd> to be honest, I`d probably go with 48, 2 days worth
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[23:25] <pksato> for 24 you can use a hour from date to name file.
[23:26] <raynerd> ?
[23:26] <pksato> date "+%Photo%H.jpg"
[23:27] <pksato> date "+Photo%H.jpg"
[23:27] * chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[23:28] <pksato> http://pastebin.com/Dezv1CUd
[23:28] <pksato> like this script, that can be called from cron.
[23:29] <raynerd> thanks!
[23:29] <raynerd> how will that know how to overwrite old ones?
[23:29] * Tykling (tykling@gibfest.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:30] <pksato> delete file before take photo.
[23:30] <pksato> if take photo can not overwrite.
[23:30] <raynerd> pksato :-S
[23:31] <pksato> or, write a index to control file. if is 20, return to 1.
[23:32] <raynerd> pksato - if it was in one file I could do that... however because the file will close, I don`t understand how to hold the index
[23:32] * iBooyaa (~iBooyaa@ has joined #raspberrypi
[23:35] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-25-243.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[23:36] * githogori (~githogori@c-69-181-109-63.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
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[23:37] * lupinedk is now known as Lupinedk
[23:40] <pksato> raynerd: http://pastebin.com/KM1GpU9Z
[23:40] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[23:40] <raynerd> pksato ! Thank
[23:41] <seanmarcia> raynerd Here is what I was talking about: http://pastebin.com/YVh3RdkX
[23:41] <pksato> as example. need to make adjustaments to you situation. like absolute paths to control file and photos.
[23:42] <raynerd> yes, I`m just reading through it now
[23:42] * an0ma1y (~anomaly@unaffiliated/an0ma1y) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[23:42] <seanmarcia> er
[23:42] <seanmarcia> http://pastebin.com/LLxJjPay
[23:42] <seanmarcia> With print statements removed ;)
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[23:43] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:43] <pksato> lots way to solve... If explain the problem correctly.
[23:44] * santoscrew (~bunk@d107066.upc-d.chello.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:44] * pksato (~PEBKAC@unaffiliated/pksato) Quit (Quit: Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair)
[23:45] * [SkG] (~Esqueje@unaffiliated/skg/x-897332) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:46] * danald (~danald@f052204032.adsl.alicedsl.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:48] * timatron (~tschwartz@cpe-76-168-57-133.socal.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: timatron)
[23:48] * heNNa- (~heNNa-@95-88-156-136-dynip.superkabel.de) Quit (Quit: ByeBye)
[23:48] * iBooyaa (~iBooyaa@ Quit (Quit: doh!)
[23:49] * heNNa- (~heNNa-@95-88-156-136-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #raspberrypi
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[23:51] <jacksinsomnia> anyone have any thoughts on the best way to do Apple Airplay with a pi? I have Shairport setup on Raspbian but the airplay receiver disappears after a while and i have to restart shairport and i can't figure out why
[23:54] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[23:54] <raynerd> anyone remind me how to use find to explore more than just my home directory. I want to search my entire pi. "find / pywws-hourly.py doesnt find anything but I know this file is on my pi!
[23:55] * picca (~picca@ Quit (Quit: Lingo - http://www.lingoirc.com)
[23:56] <quench> find -name pywws-hourly.py
[23:56] * antiPosix (470b1398@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[23:57] * SgrA (~sgra@unaffiliated/sgra) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:57] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable167.12-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:58] <antiPosix> I'm brand new to the rpi scene. I got my pi today and put noobs on a 16GB class 10 and booted it up and chose raspian and raspbmc as the OSes to install
[23:58] <antiPosix> it went through its paces and came up with XBMC which I tailored to my needs. Now I'd like to know how to get to the other OS I installed, raspbian?
[23:59] * Nenor_ (~Nenor@ip4-95-82-183-100.cust.nbox.cz) Quit ()

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