#raspberrypi IRC Log

Index

IRC Log for 2015-02-18

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@i114-181-43-74.s41.a013.ap.plala.or.jp) Quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[0:01] * spangles (~johnmurra@host109-155-40-131.range109-155.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:02] * iamjarvo (~textual@c-69-249-187-177.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:06] * chipmadness (~chipmadne@75-134-183-81.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:06] * abnormal (~abnormal@33.sub-70-209-128.myvzw.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:07] <ShorTie> PigFlu, you got any usb devices attched ??
[0:07] * ix007 (~ix007fn@unaffiliated/ix007) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[0:09] <bint> is it possible to emulate the rapsberry pi on a windows machine? so i could put the sd card into my cardreader on my desktop pc and work on my rpi without switching screens or using ssh?
[0:10] * Bebbzor (~Bebbzor@h21n1-veo-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[0:13] <imbezol> http://xecdesign.com/qemu-emulating-raspberry-pi-the-easy-way/
[0:15] * pragmatism (~pragmatis@wsip-98-173-164-44.sb.sd.cox.net) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
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[0:24] <bint> thank you imbezol
[0:25] <bint> gonna check it out
[0:28] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-228-80.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:28] * hamrove (~hamrove@96-8-209-215.block0.gvtc.com) Quit (Quit: hamrove)
[0:28] <bint> ah well
[0:29] <bint> i tought i might be able to emulate the complete raspberry and work on the sd-card i'd later put back into my raspberry
[0:29] <bint> but it looks like qemu doesn't work like that
[0:31] * hamrove (~hamrove@96-8-209-215.block0.gvtc.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:31] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-553-1-43-235.w92-151.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Quit: Quitte)
[0:31] * manitou (~manitou@unaffiliated/manitou) Quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
[0:31] * Armand (~armand@2a01:9cc0:40:6:25b4:2ddb:5ae:7457) Quit (Quit: My iProduct died in a fire. MUHAHAHA!)
[0:32] <shiftplusone> bint, it does
[0:32] <shiftplusone> you can do usermode emulation
[0:33] <shiftplusone> and chroot into the sd card
[0:33] <shiftplusone> there are a few things you need to do to make it work properly, but you can script them and go from there.
[0:33] * rvalles (~rvalles@unaffiliated/rvalles) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:34] <shiftplusone> disable automatic starting of services when they're installed, disable the optimized mem* routines, copy qemu-user-static in there, and chroot
[0:34] * plugwash (~plugwash@97e3d836.skybroadband.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:36] * ch007m (~chm@ip-83-134-172-95.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[0:36] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) has left #raspberrypi
[0:37] * ukgamer is now known as ukgamer|away
[0:37] <bint> oh ok
[0:37] <bint> so i'll give it a try
[0:37] <bint> thank you
[0:38] * LoneElf (~textual@204.57.64.106) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[0:39] <shiftplusone> np
[0:40] * Bilby looks into Intel NUC systems
[0:40] <Bilby> Hmm. Wonder how cheaply I could build these...
[0:40] <Froolap> ???
[0:41] * Saphyel (~charlie@81.202.153.234.dyn.user.ono.com) Quit (Quit: Steam powered)
[0:41] * spangles (~johnmurra@host109-155-40-131.range109-155.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Quit: spangles)
[0:41] <Bilby> Froolap it's a highly-integrated, low power device with hardware video decoding. Kind of like a RasPi that runs windows
[0:41] <Froolap> heh
[0:42] <Froolap> then it will need to have 80 gig's of ram.
[0:43] <Bilby> hah. most of them can take either 8 or 16 gb
[0:44] * foob- (dicklips@90.217.150.181) Quit ()
[0:45] <Bilby> I just specced out one with 2.4ghz dual core celeron, 8gb ram, 120gb SSD for $280
[0:45] <NGC3982> wat
[0:46] <NGC3982> On what, and where, and how do i get one.
[0:46] <NGC3982> Oh, dual core.
[0:46] <NGC3982> Never mind! \o/
[0:47] * Kostenko (~Kostenko@bl14-205-114.dsl.telepac.pt) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[0:47] <jamesd_> rumors has it that the pi 2 will run windows 10...
[0:47] <NGC3982> "rumors"?
[0:47] <NGC3982> What rumors. Microsoft say "it runs Windows 10".
[0:47] <NGC3982> :D.
[0:48] <plugwash> they haven't actually released anything yet though
[0:48] <plugwash> and while details have been scarce it looks like it will be crippled to at least some degree
[0:48] <Bilby> NGC3982 modern dual core is good compared to the old stuff, and hardware video decoding helps too
[0:49] <nerdboy> anybody build vc-graphics-hardfp recently?
[0:49] <NGC3982> Bilby: That's nice.
[0:50] * jamesd_ remembers when people were happy to have a 70mhz or slower cpu and 32MB of ram as a desktop...
[0:51] <Sonny_Jim> Bah
[0:51] <HoloPed> how do I format the microSD card to put noobs on it ?
[0:51] <Sonny_Jim> Back in my day, we had a potato, and we liked it!
[0:51] <HoloPed> for some reason it won't boot
[0:51] <PovAddict> HoloPed: from what OS?
[0:51] <HoloPed> I tried FAT and FAT32
[0:51] <HoloPed> Windows
[0:53] * n-st (~n-st@2001:470:7272:0:485a:d569:702d:83c9) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:55] * SirLagz (~SirLagz@ppp174-176.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[0:56] * Kostenko (~Kostenko@bl14-205-114.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:57] * cceleri (~cceleri@2604:6000:110d:c012:25c0:b885:a52d:b768) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:58] * aias (~ice@host109-157-99-66.range109-157.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:58] * aias (~ice@host109-157-99-66.range109-157.btcentralplus.com) has left #raspberrypi
[1:00] <Mr_Sheesh> HoloPed - I've used Win32DiskImager to write .img files to my SD cards from XP, works well enough, I haven't used NOOBS yet but I imagine it'd be fine for that too
[1:00] <PovAddict> NOOBS isn't in an .img file
[1:01] <Mr_Sheesh> Aah; what type of file is it in?
[1:01] <Froolap> There's an sd format tool on the pi home page, Use that
[1:01] <PovAddict> it's a zip, you extract its *contents* into the SD card
[1:01] <Froolap> then follow instructions, it worked for me the one time I used it.
[1:02] <Mr_Sheesh> Oh, SDFormatter if you need to format the SD card, you should be able to find that
[1:03] <HoloPed> Froolap, yes the SD format tool. Thats it. Won't work without that.
[1:07] * O3zyPi (~ozzzy@unaffiliated/ozzzy) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:09] * markfletcher (~markfletc@65-79-130-104.c3-0.fld-ubr1.chi-fld.il.cable.rcn.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:09] * Kostenko (~Kostenko@bl14-205-114.dsl.telepac.pt) Quit (Quit: There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence.)
[1:10] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-228-80.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[1:12] * Kostenko (~Kostenko@bl14-205-114.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:18] * utack (~utack@ip9234cb8c.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[1:25] * [Saint] (77e0273c@rockbox/staff/saint) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:25] <WACOMalt> anyone using audacious on pi?
[1:25] <WACOMalt> I get an error unable to set up output format (code 1)
[1:26] * kd7jwc (~nonyabusi@75-175-77-241.ptld.qwest.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[1:28] * plugwash (~plugwash@97e3d836.skybroadband.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:28] <WACOMalt> Hmm, apprently the issue comes from the Mpeg123 plugin, disbling it solved the issue
[1:29] * Bozza_ (~Bozza@unaffiliated/bozza) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[1:33] * Macuser (~textual@unaffiliated/macuser) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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[1:53] * newsham (~chat@udp217044uds.hawaiiantel.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:53] <newsham> hi. i had a booting sdcard, i mounted it, moved some files around and then unmounted it, and now its not booting.
[1:53] <newsham> i went back to replace the files and it still isnt booting
[1:53] <newsham> is there anything "special" about the fatfs and the boot images on the sdcard?
[1:55] <shiftplusone> special in what way? you moved what files around where?
[1:55] * esas (~esas@unaffiliated/esas) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:55] * Macuser (~textual@unaffiliated/macuser) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:56] <newsham> basically: cd /mnt/point; mkdir old; cp * old; cp newfiles .
[1:56] <newsham> then to restore I copied back from old to .
[1:56] <newsham> i have an sdcard that used to boot arch linux, i wanted ot temporarily boot uboot
[1:56] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@177.70.156.237) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[1:58] <shiftplusone> did you umount properly or yank the card out?
[1:58] <newsham> nope
[1:58] <shiftplusone> which?
[1:58] <newsham> i unmounted properly
[1:58] * wcypierre is now known as zz_wcypierre
[1:59] <shiftplusone> can you pastebin the output of find /mnt/point ?
[1:59] * ztaale (~bleh@ti0098a400-1374.bb.online.no) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:00] * markfletcher (~markfletc@65-79-130-104.c3-0.fld-ubr1.chi-fld.il.cable.rcn.com) has left #raspberrypi
[2:00] <newsham> http://pastebin.com/LNx5TdKt
[2:01] * plugwash (~plugwash@97e3d836.skybroadband.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[2:01] <shiftplusone> is this pi 1 or pi 2?
[2:01] * plugwash (~plugwash@97e3d836.skybroadband.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:01] <newsham> hrmm.. repeated again and its booting my linux again
[2:01] <newsham> heh
[2:02] <newsham> this is rpi1 B.
[2:02] <shiftplusone> well.... as long as it's sorted O_o
[2:02] <newsham> i need to get it booting a uboot image that i can access via uart
[2:02] <WACOMalt> will berryboot's backup to USB sd reader create a full install of the backed up OS or will it still be a berryboot install?
[2:03] <newsham> basically i just need to overwrite the kernel.img and config.txt, right?
[2:04] * Tenkawa (~arakeen@unaffiliated/tenkawa) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:04] <Tenkawa> hi all
[2:04] <shiftplusone> not sure about config.txt... it depends.
[2:04] <Tenkawa> whats up?
[2:05] <shiftplusone> not much >.>
[2:05] <newsham> loader.bin and bootcode.bin are stock images that should always be the same?
[2:06] <shiftplusone> loader.bin?
[2:06] <shiftplusone> oh, that's a uboot thing
[2:07] <chipmadness> anyone making something cool?
[2:07] <shiftplusone> when the pi first powers up, it loads bootcode.bin, which loads start.elf, which loads kernel.img
[2:07] * taza (~taza@unaffiliated/taza) Quit ()
[2:07] <newsham> bootcode.bin is the one that runs in the gpu? start.elf is what?
[2:07] <Tenkawa> any reports from much rpi 2 testing?
[2:07] <shiftplusone> both on the gpu
[2:07] <Tenkawa> whats the thoughts so far?
[2:08] <newsham> ok got it. so those i shoul dnever want to replace
[2:08] <Tenkawa> I'm still trying to acquire a few here
[2:08] <shiftplusone> yes. start_x and start_cd are versions of start.elf which may load based on certain conditions (mostly what you specify in config.txt)
[2:08] <shiftplusone> fixup files should also stay where they are
[2:09] <shiftplusone> they correct the memory split or something
[2:09] <Tenkawa> ahh the good ole boot process
[2:10] <[Saint]> chipmadness: nope - makin' coffee, its very hot.
[2:10] <newsham> ok, great, i got uboot in serial now. thanks everyone
[2:10] * newsham (~chat@udp217044uds.hawaiiantel.net) has left #raspberrypi
[2:10] <Tenkawa> [Saint]: sounds pretty cool to me heheheh
[2:10] <shiftplusone> hurray
[2:11] <Tenkawa> I need more coffee
[2:11] * HeroYoojin (~heroyooji@71-91-74-243.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:11] * bint (~bint@84.124.104.92.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch) Quit ()
[2:11] * Tenkawa notes he always needs more
[2:12] * niston hands Tenkawa the cup full of coffeine powder
[2:12] * Tenkawa says thank you and drinks it all
[2:13] <niston> you drink powder? xD
[2:13] <Tenkawa> niston: actually yes
[2:13] <niston> might try with orange juice :P
[2:13] <Tenkawa> instant coffee is effectively a powder
[2:13] * Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) Quit (Quit: ◀▬▬ •••They Must've taken my marbles away••◀▬▬)
[2:13] <niston> true
[2:13] <Tenkawa> I make coffee mixes using that stuff
[2:14] <Tenkawa> chocolate.. milk.. etc
[2:14] <Tenkawa> nice homebrew frappe
[2:15] <Tenkawa> need to figure out a vendor who can get me rpi2's shipped
[2:15] <Tenkawa> supply is just so short right now
[2:15] * shiftplusone frowns at all the coffee slurpers.
[2:16] <shiftplusone> Tea is the one true beverage.
[2:16] <Tenkawa> shiftplusone: I drink even more green and oolong tea
[2:16] <Tenkawa> oolong is my favorite
[2:17] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[2:18] <shiftplusone> Can't have it both ways Tenkawa
[2:18] <Tenkawa> why not?
[2:18] <shiftplusone> You're either with us or against us.... or something.... I don't know.
[2:18] <Tenkawa> hehehheheheh
[2:18] <Tenkawa> indeed
[2:18] <Bilby> np: Under Pressure (Queen)
[2:18] <Bilby> awwwe yeah
[2:19] <Tenkawa> wasnt that david bowie?
[2:19] <Bilby> there's a version with Queen + David Bowie
[2:19] <Tenkawa> ahhhh
[2:19] <Tenkawa> I thought there was however couldnt say for sure
[2:19] <Bilby> it's the one you usually hear.
[2:19] <Bilby> no worries :)
[2:20] <Tenkawa> I was listening to ELP mostly at that time
[2:20] <Bilby> aha
[2:21] <Tenkawa> heheh
[2:21] <Tenkawa> get some Tarkus going...
[2:22] <Tenkawa> or Hoedown would be a good one to play
[2:22] <[Saint]> shiftplusone: y'all been in Pomland too long.
[2:22] <Bilby> lol
[2:23] <Bilby> np: I'm Gonna Be (500 miles) (The Proclaimers)
[2:23] <Bilby> good night for music, my brain is mush anyhow
[2:23] <Tenkawa> haahaa
[2:23] <Tenkawa> nice choice
[2:23] <Tenkawa> who was the group that redid that one pretty successfully?
[2:23] <shiftplusone> [Saint], Pomland!?!
[2:24] <shiftplusone> Does this look like Pomland to you? https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/175702/2015-02-16%2012.25.01.jpg
[2:24] <[Saint]> "Dadadalum dadalum dadalum dadalum da da!"
[2:24] * ironbeard (d8bcef84@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.188.239.132) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:24] <[Saint]> shiftplusone: no, but it obviously wore off on you. ;)
[2:24] * O3zyPi (~ozzzy@unaffiliated/ozzzy) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[2:24] <[Saint]> Tea. Pffffffft!
[2:24] <shiftplusone> heh
[2:24] <[Saint]> Flower water.
[2:25] * Tachyon` is now known as Tach[Zzz]
[2:25] <Bilby> Da da da alala aam da ada
[2:25] <Bilby> Tenkawa i know what you're talking about but i can't remember the cover band
[2:25] <Tenkawa> let me look it up
[2:25] <[Saint]> The influence between aroma and flavor is strong, indeed, but I've never personally been big on drinking something that's pretty much completely devoid of taste, as tea is.
[2:26] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:26] * speeddragon (~speeddrag@217.129.192.97) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:26] <[Saint]> Most of it is bitter tanins, and perceived flavor from aroma. Its a weird thing indeed.
[2:26] <shiftplusone> Sure, but coffee taste like you've brewed a sock
[2:26] <Sonny_Jim> Heresy!
[2:26] <Sonny_Jim> Tea has taste, just not this rotten foreign muck
[2:26] <Sonny_Jim> You want a proper cuppa, something you can stand a spoon up in
[2:26] <shiftplusone> heh
[2:27] <[Saint]> Its mostly aromatics, and yes, indeed, aroma does have a big influence on taste - but tea itself is almost completely tasteless.
[2:27] <Bilby> Tenkawa you're either thinking of Down by Law... or Alvin and the Chipmonks.
[2:27] <[Saint]> If you lose your sense of small, tea becomes hot brown water.
[2:27] <[Saint]> *smell, even
[2:27] <ironbeard> I've seen a few tutorials around about making a bluetooth speaker with a RPi, as well as certain sources saying the sound quality of the board itself isn't that good, but haven't been able to find much information on whether it's noticeably bad in the context of just playing music via bluetooth. I'd like to avoid getting something like the HiFiBerry if possible. Anyone know of sources of information for this?
[2:27] * Scorp1us (~Scorp1us@pool-108-40-14-23.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:27] <Sonny_Jim> If you've lost your sense of smell, pretty much everything taste like water
[2:28] <Bilby> ironbeard it's pretty bad, but try it first maybe with just a test file and some speakers? it's not un-listenable but it ain't great
[2:28] <Scorp1us> Sonny_Jim, My father lost his sense of smell he still does have some taste
[2:28] <chipmadness> Hey guys, im trying to make a robot that looks like Katy Perry, does anyone know how i can implement a raspberry pi?
[2:28] <Bilby> if that's not acceptable you can also try a USB sound card
[2:28] <Tenkawa> Bilby: yeah I thunk its the Alvin one
[2:29] <Bilby> chipmadness I suggest you look into the OSCP - Open Source Cloning Project - they're utilizing Odroid boards, though
[2:29] <shiftplusone> chipmadness, wigs.
[2:29] <ironbeard> Bilby: Yeah, I'm waiting on a B2 in the mail right now, but was hoping to get an A+ for this purpose to save money. It'd mainly be a kitchen/bathroom speaker for morning and cooking, but I guess I'll just have to try it out. Was hoping to basically build a Jawbone for "cheap"
[2:29] <Tenkawa> one of the bands in the article mentioned I remember really well "Midnight Oil"
[2:29] <Scorp1us> Does anyone know how many stream processors the B2 has?
[2:29] <chipmadness> Bilby: I might do Tupac also
[2:30] <Bilby> ironbeard yeah gotcha. try the sound card, if you don't like it try USB. iirc the + boards are "marginally better" so maybe it'll be good for your needs
[2:30] <ozzzy> ironbeard, you can buy a set of wireless speaker for less hassle and cost than making one with a pi
[2:30] <Scorp1us> I want to write some OpenCL code for it. But I don't know if it will be worth it
[2:30] <ironbeard> Bilby: You mean a USB soundcard?
[2:31] <ironbeard> ozzzy: Yeah, I know. Still debating this
[2:31] <Bilby> ironbeard yeah. also check out this video Great Scott did -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGTXczCV30A
[2:31] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:31] <Bilby> he literally did what you're talking about
[2:31] <ironbeard> Bilby: Awesome, haven't seen this yet!
[2:31] <Bilby> but with a dedicated bluetooth usb receiver. looks legit
[2:32] <ironbeard> Huh, cool. Gonna check it out real quick
[2:32] <Bilby> 'kay. GS! is pretty cool, and I like his vague euro accent :P
[2:33] <Tenkawa> time to check on some kernel compiles.. have a good evening all
[2:33] * Tenkawa (~arakeen@unaffiliated/tenkawa) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[2:34] * ppq (~ppq@unaffiliated/ppq) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:34] <[Saint]> "trying to make a robot that looks like Katy Perry"
[2:34] <[Saint]> *gets popcorn
[2:34] <[Saint]> ...dis gun be good.
[2:35] <Bilby> hey, I linked him to OSCP. It's not my fault he wants to use a Raspberry Pi instead of an Odroid
[2:35] <[Saint]> I'm guessing its for...errr..."reasons".
[2:35] <[Saint]> ;)
[2:35] <shiftplusone> Sounds like something Howard Wolowitz might say.
[2:36] <shiftplusone> Bilby, why? does an odroid look more katy perry-like?
[2:37] * [Saint] is willing to bet that there's already Katy Perry RealDolls available.
[2:37] <[Saint]> Cram in a raspi...done!
[2:37] <Bilby> don't ask me, I don't know! I'm assuming something to do with the data buss speeds.
[2:37] <Bilby> [Saint] ... ew. And yet, you're probably right.
[2:37] <shiftplusone> ahem
[2:38] <ironbeard> Bilby: Great video, I like his style. Thanks again
[2:38] * cameronf_ (~cameronfr@i114-181-43-74.s41.a013.ap.plala.or.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:38] <Bilby> ironbeard very welcome! Good luck :)
[2:39] <ozzzy> who is howard wolowitz?
[2:39] <[Saint]> Just checked. Can confirm. Katy Perry dolls are a thing.
[2:39] <[Saint]> I mean...no I didn't.
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[2:45] <niston> eh
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[2:51] <[Saint]> Whoah - I just spent way too much time on that site.
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[4:50] <phire> hmm
[4:51] <phire> is it possible to have multiple dhcp servers on a network
[4:51] <phire> and make it so that some devices only request addresses from the second server somehow
[4:52] <phire> and make the second server only give addresses to those devices which explicitly request addresses from it
[4:52] <shiftplusone> hm? wouldn't it just be a matter of setting /etc/resolv.conf accordingly?
[4:52] * Albori (~Albori@64-251-150-248.fidnet.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:52] <phire> that's dns
[4:52] <shiftplusone> wait...bleh
[4:52] <shiftplusone> sorry
[4:52] <shiftplusone> yeah, brain ticked over as soon as I typed that.
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[4:52] <phire> I can physically or logically segment the network
[4:53] <shiftplusone> perhaps ##networking?
[4:53] <plugwash> phire, I think it's technically possible to run dhcp on a nonstandard port
[4:53] <phire> Don't think there are ports, it's done at the MAC layer
[4:53] <plugwash> so clients using the nonstandard port will only see servers that run on the nonstandard port
[4:54] <plugwash> IIIRC dhcp is UDP based though I belive there are some special tricks to make it work before the machine has an address
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[4:58] <Sonny_Jim> Broadcast address
[4:58] <niston> https://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2131.txt explains it in detail
[4:58] <niston> phire: you want VLANs
[4:58] * Bozza (~Bozza@unaffiliated/bozza) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[4:59] * pklaus (~pklaus@p20030051451A0A0002C008FFFE88220F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[4:59] <phire> niston, yeah
[4:59] <phire> need to get a better switch
[4:59] <niston> ;)
[5:00] <phire> or is it possible to do vlan tagging without a enterprise switch
[5:00] <niston> yeah
[5:00] <niston> setup something like pfSense
[5:01] * Riviera_ (Riviera@2a03:b0c0:1:d0::10:b001) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[5:01] <niston> or... you can also do this with linux I think
[5:01] <plugwash> well if you want to use vlans you really need a switch that support them, that means going a little above the bottom of the barrel stuff
[5:02] <niston> phire: if you're working without VLAN support on the switch, your hosts will have to support it.
[5:02] <clever> oh great, power is out for the 3rd time this week
[5:02] <plugwash> not sure who is the go to brand for switches with vlan support that aren't crazy expensive, I think netgear may have some stuff
[5:02] <phire> but the switch will still switch things correctly?
[5:02] <clever> it died twice before the storm, and once after the storm!
[5:03] <Triffid_Hunter> phire: not really, DHCP is a broadcast protocol that runs before anything is assigned an address, you'd have to do mac address filtering on the dhcp servers, but if you already know the MAC addresses and are prepared to create individual entries, why not just give the devices static IPs?
[5:03] <niston> I have a netgear GS724T
[5:03] <niston> works like a charm
[5:03] <niston> even allows for LAGs
[5:03] <niston> doesn't cost an arm and a leg either
[5:04] * cxxc (~bmxer@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/cxxc) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[5:04] <phire> only $243
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[5:05] * KitB (~quassel@kitb.pw) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:05] <niston> well maybe you could do with less than 24 ports :)
[5:05] <niston> GS108E also has VLAN support
[5:06] <niston> so does GS105E
[5:06] <niston> those are below $50
[5:06] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:06] <niston> the management interface sucks tho
[5:06] <niston> ie they have none, you'll have to use a lame ass windows app to set them up
[5:06] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@103.225.100.51) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:07] <phire> ironically, I have the gs105
[5:07] * JlRd (~jlrd@ip68-110-113-182.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:07] <niston> he he
[5:07] <niston> does that even support gigabit? *g*
[5:07] <phire> it does
[5:08] <phire> it's a reasonably solid (unmanaged) switch
[5:08] <niston> ya I'm pretty satisfied with those netgears
[5:08] <niston> only thing that failed was the cheapo china inc. wallwart power supplies
[5:09] <clever> only thing in my house that has vlan support is an old managed cisco switch, and its 100mbit max
[5:09] <niston> except for one GS105E which had a dead port after about two years
[5:09] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) Quit (Client Quit)
[5:09] <niston> but the wallwarts are really crap
[5:11] <phire> What's really annoying is that the chipset in most switches actually supports managed features
[5:12] <phire> it's just not hooked up to anything
[5:13] <niston> ah sh..
[5:13] <niston> major incident here
[5:13] <niston> ran out of sugar
[5:13] <niston> >=(
[5:13] <niston> and I mean the white stuff to go in my TEA
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[5:14] * baldybadgers (~baldybage@unaffiliated/badgersonmeroof) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[5:14] <phire> http://spritesmods.com/?art=rtl8366sb
[5:14] <niston> phire: those chipsets tend to have I2C for management
[5:14] <clever> phire: yeah ive seen that before, rather then put in a cpu to let you manage it, they just leave the chip on its default config
[5:14] <niston> hook 'em up to your Pi ;D
[5:14] <clever> :D
[5:15] <clever> if you need a lot of managed switches, you can probly program a bare avr to configure it on startup, and just leave an avr in each
[5:16] <niston> on a side note, you can now buy broadcom switch chips @ mouser
[5:16] <clever> add an avr-ISP port for re-config
[5:17] <phire> yeah, not worth it putting a full pi in
[5:17] <DropBear> ack! another week (maybe) for my pi2 to ship
[5:17] * govg (~govg@unaffiliated/govg) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[5:17] <phire> a cheap managed switch would be cheaper than the cost of an unmanaged switch and a pi
[5:17] <clever> phire: depends on if you already have a pi near the switch
[5:17] <clever> and what else your pi can continue to do while managing the switch
[5:17] <niston> phire: true
[5:18] <niston> especially if you go for "smart" switches instead of full managed
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[5:18] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@103.225.100.51) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[5:19] <phire> yes
[5:20] <niston> lol GS105E costs CHF37.90
[5:20] * bigx (~bigx@cam44-2-82-235-243-114.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Quit: Quitte)
[5:20] <niston> thats almost $40
[5:20] <niston> or so
[5:21] <phire> so the config utility is a windows based app?
[5:22] <niston> yup
[5:22] <niston> actually adobe air or something
[5:22] <niston> but wrapped in a .exe
[5:22] * plugwash (~plugwash@97e3d836.skybroadband.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:23] <niston> I figure it could be reverse engineered quite easily
[5:23] <niston> but wasn't worth the trouble to me
[5:23] <clever> i have tried to reverse engineer the firmware updater for my modem once
[5:23] <phire> I figure it communicates via ethernet frames
[5:23] <clever> it uses plain ftp to transfer the files, but the identical name/pw doesnt work when used manualy
[5:23] <niston> phire: either that or UDP
[5:23] <clever> the updater app also does a crap-ton of SNMP before it begins the ftp transfer
[5:23] <niston> the config utility finds connected switches via broadcast
[5:23] <clever> so i'm guessing the SNMP unlocks uploads
[5:24] * baldybadgers (~baldybage@unaffiliated/badgersonmeroof) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:24] <Sonny_Jim> Which interface were you connecting from?
[5:24] * chipmadness (~chipmadne@75-134-183-81.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:24] <Sonny_Jim> Because a lot of them (since the TCNISO guy got done) don't allow any config changes from the ethernet side
[5:25] <Sonny_Jim> In fact I wonder if he's got out of jail yet...
[5:25] <clever> Sonny_Jim: mine worked from the LAN side, but the ISP had changed the firmware, and likely changed the signing keys
[5:25] <niston> cable modems?
[5:25] <clever> the updater app fails every time, so i cant un-brand the modem
[5:26] <clever> dsl modem with built in 'router'
[5:26] <niston> oh
[5:26] <clever> a horid excuse for a router
[5:26] <clever> it cant even forward a single port
[5:26] <niston> lol
[5:26] <niston> "router" yeah
[5:26] <clever> the docs online say it can
[5:26] <clever> but it only has 2 pages now, which simple ask you for the name/pw
[5:26] <clever> in english or french
[5:27] <clever> every url in the docs will 404
[5:27] <niston> sometimes ISPs load "customized" (read: fubar'd) firmware
[5:27] <clever> exactly
[5:27] <clever> luckily, it still functioned as a pppoe modem
[5:27] <clever> so i was able to aim a linux desktop at it, and get full use out of the connection
[5:27] <niston> right
[5:27] <clever> and every time the connection went down, tcpdump showed no reply to the pppoe requests
[5:28] <clever> so we call them up, and they start the script :P
[5:28] <aberrant> I’m going to tear my hair out
[5:28] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:28] <clever> 'did you enter the name/pw again?'
[5:28] <clever> (facepalm)
[5:28] <aberrant> my rpi2 keeps freezing when I’m compiling stuff
[5:28] <niston> hahaha
[5:28] <aberrant> I’ve switched sd cards
[5:28] <aberrant> no luck
[5:28] <clever> niston: we have since upgraded, to fiber-optic modems
[5:28] <clever> and the fiber is too much for that old linux desktop i used as a router
[5:29] <clever> 600kbyte/sec download ate about 60% of the cpu usage
[5:29] <clever> i now have 80mbit download
[5:29] <niston> ouch
[5:29] <clever> way outside of its reach
[5:29] <clever> i think it was a 200mhz pentium, lol
[5:29] <niston> had a similar problem here with my firewall platform
[5:29] <niston> solved it by downgrading the connection *g*
[5:30] <clever> because of that, i have had to stick with the 'customized' router they supplied with the new setup
[5:30] <clever> it has port forwards, but its far from good
[5:30] <phire> smart work around: switch connected to the second network port of my computer
[5:31] <niston> yeah. the "switch to pppoe or pppoa" thing is usually the way to proceed with these "routers"
[5:31] * MarconM (~MarconM@unaffiliated/marconm) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:31] <clever> the byte traffic counters get stuck at 2^31 for half the time
[5:31] * killer_prince is now known as lazy_prince
[5:31] * MarconM (~MarconM@unaffiliated/marconm) has left #raspberrypi
[5:31] <clever> niston: its now 3 seperate boxes
[5:31] * MarconM (~MarconM@unaffiliated/marconm) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:31] <MarconM> wich is the max size the raspberry recognize, would recognize 128gb ?
[5:31] <clever> the 1st is a custom UPS, 120vac in, custom connector out
[5:31] <clever> the 2nd is the fiber box, custom connector+fiber in, telephone+ethernet out
[5:32] <clever> and the 3rd is the customized router, ethernet in, ethernet+75ohm coax out
[5:32] <clever> niston: no pppoe anywhere now, the 2/3 link is 802.1q
[5:32] <niston> ah
[5:32] <niston> GPON?
[5:32] <clever> whats that?
[5:32] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) Quit (Quit: Searching for Waimea)
[5:33] <niston> way of setting up fiber networks
[5:33] <clever> havent heard of that way yet
[5:33] <clever> one VLAN i have is for internet, the router just runs dhcp on it to get a public ip and does normal NAT
[5:33] <clever> a second vlan is for tv service, i suspect it runs dhcp on that for a 10.x.y.z ip, and then gets multicast traffic over it
[5:34] <clever> and there are rumors of a 3rd vlan, to back-door the router
[5:34] <niston> they do the same here
[5:34] <clever> because of the vlan tagging, i cant use any normal router
[5:34] <niston> iptv on seperate vlan
[5:34] * renderful (~renderful@c-73-14-48-169.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:34] <clever> its all on the same lan once it crosses the router
[5:34] <aberrant> ok, trying 5V @ 2A
[5:34] * renderful (~renderful@c-73-14-48-169.hsd1.co.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:35] <aberrant> btw
[5:35] <aberrant> I can confirm a sideband VLAN on comcast routers.
[5:35] <aberrant> 20.0.0.0/8
[5:35] <MarconM> clever: do u know wich is the max size the rasp recognize for sdcard ?
[5:35] <clever> aberrant: i have noticed that my router responds to https on port 443, and it gives a different login page, which wont accept the normal name/pw
[5:35] <niston> multicast has fallen out of fashion for iptv though
[5:35] <clever> MarconM: i havent seen a limit yet
[5:36] <clever> niston: why?, it seems a perfect choice
[5:36] <aberrant> clever: comcast?
[5:36] <niston> well
[5:36] <clever> aberrant: bell/aliant
[5:36] <aberrant> hm
[5:36] <MarconM> clever: 128gb i think it wll
[5:36] * Noldorin (~noldorin@unaffiliated/noldorin) Quit (Quit: –)
[5:36] <niston> everyone sets up PVR services
[5:36] <niston> these days
[5:36] <aberrant> I don’t know what to do with this rpi2 if this new power supply doesn’t work
[5:36] <niston> multicast work with that ¨
[5:36] <clever> niston: this multicast system feeds a PVR
[5:37] <clever> it records the multicast stream to a local hdd, and then streams it within the house via unicast
[5:37] <aberrant> huh. Maybe it IS the power supply
[5:37] <niston> yeah thats not what I meant
[5:37] <aberrant> these new rpi2’s won’t work 5V@1A
[5:37] <niston> its like you can watch the past 3 weeks of TV
[5:37] <niston> on demand
[5:38] <clever> i think i have that also, but whats the point when i already have the show flagged to record localy
[5:38] <niston> and if everyone's watching something else, multicast unfortunately does not longer fit into the picture
[5:38] <DropBear> aberrant it draws <500ma at 5v
[5:38] <aberrant> the 5V@2A PS seems to be holding up
[5:38] <niston> clever: its a major headache for bandwidth planning
[5:38] <aberrant> DropBear: it was freezing on compile
[5:38] <aberrant> DropBear: but with this new 2A PS, it’s working
[5:39] <clever> niston: yeah, i can see how it would be an issue to stream on-demand
[5:39] * botnut (~kernel_st@162-233-77-128.lightspeed.miamfl.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:39] <niston> big ISPs push that on-demand crap
[5:40] <niston> so the small ones get pushed out of market because they cant keep up with their wimpy backbones
[5:40] <niston> its really a slaughterfest
[5:40] <clever> and the UI lags like hell
[5:40] <clever> i would much rather build my own PVR, the hdd in this thing is wimpy
[5:40] <clever> and it has no priority for deleting stuff
[5:41] <clever> i have investigated, and any computer on my LAN can join the multicast group and get flooded with the stream
[5:42] <clever> plain rtp, containing plain mpegts, with normal mp3/aac/h264 content
[5:42] <clever> and the normal encryption that comes along with mpegts!
[5:42] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:42] <niston> so building a PVR shouldn't be a problem
[5:42] <clever> i just need the decryption keys
[5:42] <clever> then i can do pure digital capture with any pc that has ethernet
[5:43] * Hasselsaurus (~broseidon@c-24-3-16-60.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:45] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:45] <clever> but because i lack the keys, i have to get an encoding hd capture system, and take the analog loop-hole
[5:45] <niston> I see that yeah
[5:45] <niston> perhaps they can be pulled from your existing hardware?
[5:45] <clever> in theory, i could possibly even turn the raspberrypi into a DVR
[5:46] <clever> i have 2 STB's, the first one is a dumb unit, no hdd, all it can do on its own is stream live tv
[5:46] <clever> the second is the brains, it has a hdd to record, and can stream to the dumb units
[5:46] <niston> aye.
[5:46] <clever> i yanked the hdd, and poped on a usb adapter, 2 partitions
[5:46] <clever> both fat32
[5:47] <clever> the big partition has about 150 files, each 1gig in size
[5:47] <niston> would seem sort of sloppy to have the keys stored there
[5:47] <clever> max filesize limits
[5:47] <clever> they had to create their own encrypted volume within the fat32 volume
[5:47] <clever> i have found a ton of exe and jpg files on the drive
[5:47] <niston> heh
[5:47] <clever> various config menus, even for features i lack
[5:48] <clever> it seems it can be controlled with an xbox 360 controller
[5:48] <niston> so it runs windows xp embedded or something?
[5:48] <clever> but i lack the receiver
[5:48] <clever> windows CE
[5:48] <niston> yeah
[5:48] <clever> has a CE sticker right on the back
[5:48] <niston> that cancer isn't going away
[5:48] <niston> hah. CE = cancer edition
[5:48] <clever> :D
[5:49] <clever> the odd part, is that the dumb model can boot and decrypt without a hdd
[5:49] <clever> so its either booting from flash, or network
[5:49] <niston> keys probably stored in some flash somewhere
[5:49] <niston> yeah
[5:49] <clever> it does a ton of 'plain-text http' on startup
[5:49] <clever> downloading its own firmware
[5:49] <niston> or.. perhaps they load them off the net on the fly?
[5:49] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[5:49] <clever> thats the whole point of the encryption scheme
[5:50] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) Quit (Quit: Searching for Waimea)
[5:50] <clever> there is a stream within the mpegts, that has the encrypted 'real keys'
[5:50] <clever> that stream is sent to the black box (usualy a card in a reader)
[5:50] <clever> which then spits out the real keys
[5:50] <niston> ah. that would be the CI interface?
[5:50] <clever> yeah
[5:50] <clever> a dedicated encrypted keystream from the mpegts layer is sent to the card
[5:51] <clever> which decrypts the real keys with a 2nd set of keys
[5:51] <clever> so the main encryption for the video can change every minute if they want to
[5:51] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:51] <clever> then bandwidth based attacks like WEP are useless
[5:51] <niston> yeah they started doing that when dreambox became popular I think
[5:51] <clever> same reason WPA and ssh can renegotiate keys
[5:52] <clever> i have also heard stories about satalite companies shipping a 20 part virus down that key channel
[5:52] <aberrant> wow. Definitely the power supply!!!
[5:52] <clever> which then assembled itself and bricked all the fake cards
[5:52] * mike_t (~mike@109.169.167.12) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:52] <niston> yup
[5:52] <niston> heard that too
[5:52] <clever> so the hackers didnt know what it was until it was too late
[5:52] <niston> we have a company here in .ch that makes those encryption things
[5:53] <niston> Kudelski Corp
[5:53] <clever> so that custom stream can do almost anything, though they likely arent using it here
[5:53] <niston> inventor of famous Nagravision
[5:53] * Datalink (Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:53] <niston> member of the Bilderberg elite
[5:53] <niston> xD
[5:53] <clever> i had a look in the box, and i didnt see anything that looks crypoy
[5:53] <clever> so i'm guessing its a softcam, running within windows
[5:56] <niston> seems plausible
[5:56] <clever> the issue is just reverse engineering the winblows end of things
[5:56] <clever> which reminds me, i never ran those exe's thru ida
[5:57] <clever> ah crud, i just fixed the time on the microwave, lol
[5:57] <clever> and they decided to throw another outage my way
[5:58] <niston> lol
[5:58] <niston> where do you live?
[5:58] <clever> NB canada
[5:58] <clever> 3rd outage this week, 2 before the storm, 1 after the storm
[5:58] <niston> such bad utilities there?
[5:58] <clever> doesnt happen very often
[5:59] <botnut> anyone use the pi2 yet?
[5:59] <[Saint]> I suspect several hundred thousand people.
[5:59] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) Quit (Quit: Searching for Waimea)
[6:01] <niston> clever: power outtages are extremely rare around here
[6:01] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:01] <clever> niston: yeah, the last set was in the middle of summer
[6:01] <botnut> saint - duh just curious if anyone in here has
[6:01] <[Saint]> last one I had was during the earthquakes in 2011
[6:01] <niston> I can't remember the last one
[6:02] <[Saint]> botnut: that is what you'd call a lesson in asking direct questions
[6:02] <clever> there was a 2 day long outage in the middle of summer
[6:02] <niston> I remember one more than 20 years afo
[6:02] <niston> *ago
[6:02] <clever> i had to hot-wire the fridge into a car
[6:02] <clever> now i'm having to look into hot-wiring the furnace to the car :P
[6:02] <botnut> saint - alrighty here is a direct question - or questions
[6:02] * hamrove (~hamrove@96-8-209-215.block0.gvtc.com) Quit (Quit: hamrove)
[6:02] <botnut> 1. anyone use the pi2 and run into issues with the chip that causes a freeze of the system when flashed with a certain light - particularly when using IR sensors or Lidars?
[6:03] <botnut> 2. anyone use the pi2 and try running Python 3.4.2 on it?
[6:03] <clever> botnut: #1 is already all over the forum and blog
[6:03] <clever> U16, cover it
[6:03] <[Saint]> its a well known issue.
[6:03] <[Saint]> its Xenonaphobic.
[6:03] <[Saint]> The 3V rail goes nuts.
[6:04] * oxhak (~OxHaK@unaffiliated/oxhak) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[6:04] <niston> botnut: Lidars? are you analyzing air for pollutants?
[6:04] <[Saint]> Put some nail polish or blu-tak over it.
[6:04] <[Saint]> where it == U16
[6:04] <botnut> niston - yes lidars - LIDAR - range finder using lasers
[6:04] <niston> ah
[6:05] * intothev01d (~intothev0@unaffiliated/intothev01d) Quit ()
[6:05] <niston> well don't shine the lazor on U16 and you should be fine
[6:05] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@103.225.100.51) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:06] <botnut> my concern is I've been reading about the pi2 and the issue with camera flash - and it causing it to freeze completely - we just got a batch pi2s in the office and we've tried to get to them to freeze with a flash but nothing yet - we use the pis in robotics quite a bit - therefore - using IR range finders or LIDARs or some other form of sensor that uses light might interfere with it
[6:06] <[Saint]> Its only Xenon flashes that'll do it.
[6:06] <clever> and only at very close range
[6:06] <clever> some laser pointers also do it
[6:06] <[Saint]> right.
[6:07] * drfoo (~drfoo@unaffiliated/drfoo) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[6:07] <[Saint]> Oh? that was bad timing. I wasn't aware lasers could do it too.
[6:07] <botnut> I tried searching the net for info on the specifics of what light exactly would cause it
[6:07] <clever> mostly IR
[6:07] <[Saint]> I know you can make the picam go all sorts of nuts with a laser pointer, though.
[6:07] <botnut> what frequency or range or whatever of light.. some thing we can measure to test to make sure our sensors wont
[6:08] <niston> I think you can make every CCD or CMOS sensor go nuts when you shine your lazors on it
[6:08] * shum (~sdothum@207.112.100.227) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.1.1)
[6:08] <botnut> we use IR (ranger, night vision), Laser (LIDAR) and LED (leddar)
[6:08] <niston> botnut: check the spectrum lines for xenon light
[6:08] <[Saint]> you should be able to get a lot of data on the spectrum of a Xenon flash bulb I would posit.
[6:08] <niston> as clever pointed out, IR is mostly the problem
[6:08] <niston> but: if the Pi is in a case, none of it matters
[6:09] <clever> ive heard that bare silicon is mostly transparent at IR
[6:09] <[Saint]> right.
[6:09] <Xark> botnut: If it is a real concern, just cover up this tiny chip with something opaque (and non-conductive) -> http://i.imgur.com/mAKtA7W.jpg
[6:09] <[Saint]> slam some blu-tak on it, or put it in a case, and there's no issue.
[6:10] <botnut> indeed - we were thinking of just covering up the pi all together to shield it from anything
[6:10] <Datalink> botnut, U16 is a raw part, no plastic covering it, it's photosensitive, like a photoresistor, if you hit it with some non-conductive black paint or a piece of electrical tape or a good enclosure it'll become a non-issue
[6:10] <botnut> as it stands anyway we don't directly point things at it - however the lidar and leddar spin around to range 360 degrees - therefore there might run the chance that something could happen - esp if we tilt as we spin
[6:10] <Datalink> botnut, just buy a black case, you should be fine
[6:10] <niston> black nail polish would work I guess
[6:10] <Datalink> that's my plan for my Pi2 when I get it
[6:11] <[Saint]> it needn't be black.
[6:11] <Xark> niston: Nail polish has some other nasty stuff in it so was "not recommended"
[6:11] <Datalink> conductivity test first
[6:11] <botnut> datalink - makes sense - so our assumptions on my end were accurate - just enclose it and be done with it
[6:11] <niston> Xark: I see
[6:11] <Datalink> botnut, pretty much
[6:12] * mike_t (~mike@109.169.167.12) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[6:12] <botnut> any thoguhts on running python 3.4.2 on it? we ran into issues with the B+ where we had to get it from source and compile just to get it working
[6:12] <botnut> wonder if we are going to have the same issue with the pi2
[6:12] <Xark> botnut: Mostly likely you won't need to do that for Pi2 (as ARMv7 is "standard" unlike ARMv6).
[6:12] <botnut> hrmmmmmm
[6:13] <botnut> suppose il just have to give it a go and see what happens
[6:13] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[6:13] <botnut> but what's odd is the the A and B ran python 3.4.2 without an issue
[6:13] <botnut> then B+ and A+ came out and we screwed the pooch on that one figuring it out
[6:13] <Datalink> botnut, the Pi2 is on ARM7 which is more broadly supported (current gen system) so Python should be easier
[6:13] <Xark> botnut: Should be no diff between B and B+ for Python. Probably something else changed.
[6:14] <Datalink> ARM6 is generally the hardest part of the original pi as far as support in software
[6:14] <botnut> xark- it shouldn't be diff you are right - but it mos def was
[6:14] <botnut> atleast from that perspective
[6:14] <clever> botnut, Datalink: one minor problem, is that rasbian is still using arm6 libs on the pi2
[6:14] <Xark> botnut: Not hardware related, I suspect.
[6:14] <Datalink> botnut, yeah, the only difference is power circuit.
[6:14] <clever> you may not be able to mix arm6 libs and arm7 apps
[6:14] <botnut> oh yeah - we figured it wasn't the hardware - had to be something with libs
[6:15] <botnut> wasn't pleasant having to freaking compile on a pi lol esp python
[6:15] <Datalink> clever, there are a lot of distros that aren't Rasbian that are compiled against ARM7, and that will improve with time, the Pi2 is still pretty new
[6:15] <clever> Datalink: yep, just need to keep that in mind
[6:15] <Datalink> botnut, I compiled kernels on mine...
[6:15] <botnut> only thing I wonder now - is what the hell with windows
[6:15] <botnut> lol why run it on a pi - it will just CRAWL
[6:16] <niston> it won't be "regular" windows
[6:16] <botnut> so like a surface RT feel which sucks
[6:16] <clever> botnut: it may not even have a GUI
[6:16] <Datalink> botnut, MS's doing the same thing they did with the Edison and Galleo probably, just the kernel, and a cmd along with the console support, not a GUI like desktop or RT
[6:16] <botnut> so then its just dos
[6:16] <botnut> lol
[6:16] <niston> btw you can develop with Visual Studio for the Pi right away, even without M$ help
[6:16] <niston> just use mono :)
[6:16] <clever> botnut: you may be better off thinking of it like a arduino env
[6:16] <Datalink> wrong kernel to be DOS
[6:16] <clever> botnut: gpio, network, windows kernel
[6:17] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) Quit (Quit: Searching for Waimea)
[6:17] <botnut> why bother with an ms product here
[6:17] <botnut> works perfectly with python
[6:17] <Datalink> technically it will be the Microsoft NT Kernel, ARM7 compile, which is way under the hood for Windows RT...
[6:17] * Fishy (~fishy@pool-108-3-182-143.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[6:18] <Datalink> botnut, because some people are unconfortable outside the OS they've been trained on
[6:18] <clever> botnut: to let people who know visual studio use it in a tweeting toaster
[6:18] * Froolap (~Froolap@pool-71-180-136-207.tampfl.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/)
[6:18] <botnut> aside that - I don't see a technical reason
[6:18] <Datalink> botnut, that and the Pi's 'blog cred'
[6:18] <Xark> Datalink: I am expecting something like that from MS, however, totally lame-ass if they don't support graphics/HDMI on RPi.
[6:18] <niston> I like Visual Studio
[6:18] <niston> and the fact that CLR datatypes work everwhere
[6:19] <botnut> no doubt vs.net is a bad ass IDE but bloated
[6:19] <botnut> pi is small light nimble - keep it that way
[6:19] <niston> heck. firefox is bloated.
[6:19] <Datalink> Xark, I'm speaking mostly from what I know from the Galleo build of MS's IoT Windows version, it could be different on the Pi
[6:19] <clever> Xark: best you can hope for is maybe graphics support, but no shell i think
[6:19] <Xark> You can use Visual Studio to generate native ARM code now (so no need to waste cycles on C#).
[6:19] <niston> bloatware is everywere these days :)
[6:19] <clever> Xark: so your app has total control of the gui
[6:19] * MarconM (~MarconM@unaffiliated/marconm) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[6:19] <clever> like they have done with my cable box
[6:19] <clever> the custom app handles the entire gui, you would never know it ran windows if you didnt see the windows CE sticker on the back
[6:20] <Xark> clever: Right, I don't expect that. However, they mentioned running "apps" on RPi.
[6:20] <Xark> clever: Yeah, that makes sense.
[6:20] <Xark> Not so much Windows OS as a Windows "embedded target".
[6:20] <clever> yeah
[6:20] <botnut> just don't know.. might be too soon to say anything about windows
[6:21] <Datalink> clever, that's actually pretty typical of CE devices, 10's multiforked, an umbrella term for what was Windows CE, Windows Phone, RT and desktop
[6:21] <botnut> we've deployed hundreds of pis running raspbian as sensor hubs for sensor networks throughout various industries
[6:21] <botnut> the pi with raspbian just keep on trucking without a hiccup
[6:21] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@103.225.100.51) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[6:22] <clever> botnut: i wouldnt trust windows to such a job
[6:22] <botnut> hell no
[6:22] <botnut> esp not a v1 product
[6:22] <botnut> lol
[6:22] <Datalink> I'd still like to know why one of our studio's Pis fried, couldn't get it working with a 'known good' image, literally had to swap the boards out and chuck the dead on, nothing usable.
[6:22] <clever> Datalink: step 1, un-chuck it
[6:23] <botnut> was it battery powered?
[6:23] <Datalink> clever, I used a fresh Noobs on that thing, it didn't even give bootsplash, nor any other info, word from the other person who discovered it died was that it spewed garbage and refused to do anything after.
[6:24] <clever> strange, id check the voltages next
[6:24] <Datalink> botnut, known good charger, ran the thing for 6-8 months, no problem, in spec.
[6:24] <botnut> also check what was connected to the usb ports
[6:24] <botnut> some keybaords / mice make the pi flip out
[6:24] <Datalink> clever, voltage was in spec
[6:24] * TyrfingMjolnir (~Tyrfing@116.89.111.191) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:24] <clever> 3.3v rail as well
[6:24] <Datalink> botnut, we put a USB stick in once a week
[6:24] <niston> " it spewed garbage and refused to do anything after." sounds like someone I know *g*
[6:25] <Datalink> clever, 3,3V~3.4V within spec
[6:25] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:25] <Datalink> it ran a touch high, but within spec despite that, no idea, it lived past waranty though... we're eyeing the Pi2 for an upgrade considering the two where in the same production run
[6:27] <Datalink> a Pi2 and a bit of customization (I'm gonna sit down with it for a solid month and craft the OS for it's role as a messageboard) should be able to play powerpoint loops all day, ideally
[6:27] <Datalink> though I'd also prefer it reading the data from a CSV or other data source so we don't even have to plug anything in, the spot has an ethernet run connected to it
[6:35] <botnut> I haven't actually read you on the details of the pi2 spec yet - but is it still using a bridge through the usb for the ethernet port?
[6:35] <clever> botnut: yep
[6:35] <clever> exact same bridge as the b+
[6:36] <botnut> dang
[6:36] <clever> 4 port usb hub and 100mbit ethernet
[6:36] <botnut> would be slick to have a gigabit port no bridge
[6:36] * oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) Quit (Quit: *pouf*)
[6:36] <niston> botnut: GMII yes
[6:36] <niston> but alas, no way.
[6:37] <botnut> I've been curious about the banana pi vs the rpi
[6:37] <botnut> I tend to stay loyal to rpi but it has interesting specs
[6:37] <clever> i'm actualy planning a product that will be using high bandwidth data and a pi
[6:37] <clever> but i'm going to put the high bandwidth directly off an FPGA, and then make the pi a slave for that
[6:37] <niston> clever: CSI/DSI hax0r :P
[6:37] <clever> niston: SMI is my current target
[6:37] <Datalink> the Pi's ethernet/usb chip is sound
[6:38] <niston> hehe
[6:38] <clever> niston: my plan is to run the SMI to the FPGA, and then configure the pi to treat it as a network card
[6:38] <clever> then the FPGA leads to the MII
[6:38] <niston> that would be clever
[6:38] <niston> (no pun intended)
[6:38] <aberrant> wow
[6:38] <clever> and the FPGA will inject high bandwidth data into the stream, skipping the pi
[6:38] <clever> while still letting the pi do low bandwidth stuff on the same MII
[6:38] <aberrant> Here’s a tip
[6:39] <aberrant> if you get rpi freezing, CHECK YOUR DAMN PS
[6:39] <aberrant> the rpi2 needs 2A @ 5V
[6:39] * niston nods at aberrant
[6:39] <aberrant> for any intensive work
[6:39] <niston> sound advice there
[6:39] <aberrant> since I switched to this new PS, no freezes.
[6:39] <botnut> wonder if there are any gsm usb dongles that can be used with the pi - isntead of a shield
[6:40] <clever> botnut: i have one, let me see if it 'works'
[6:40] <aberrant> I really wish they had put usb3 and an RTC in the new rpi
[6:40] <aberrant> but whatever.
[6:41] <Datalink> aberrant, the 4 core CPU is a power hog, I have to replce the vreg I chose due to using a Pi2 in the design... haven't part hunted for the bigger reg :/
[6:41] <niston> botnut: why should they not work?
[6:41] <Datalink> aberrant, that'd increase the cost, the Pi's mission includes being built to a price
[6:41] <aberrant> Datalink: I’m using my ipad charger - it’s 10W
[6:41] <botnut> not sure haven't tried
[6:41] <botnut> might draw too much
[6:41] <aberrant> when I was using the iphone charger (5W), it didn’t work. Kept freezing.
[6:42] <Datalink> USB3 is still young, and thus the chips that run it are still pricy
[6:42] <Datalink> yeah, that's 2 amp
[6:42] <aberrant> yup
[6:42] <botnut> I wouldn't want usb3 on there
[6:42] <Datalink> the voltage regulator I specced out is rated at 1.5 A, so I hve to replace it
[6:42] <clever> botnut: 404, not found
[6:42] <botnut> messes with my dell i7 laptop
[6:42] <botnut> forget the pi
[6:42] <botnut> clever - really so no go huh?
[6:42] <aberrant> 1.5A would work, no?
[6:42] <clever> botnut: cant find the usb stick
[6:42] <clever> so no way to test it out
[6:43] <clever> and i just noticed, my pi survived a 15 minute power outage
[6:43] <niston> I should have one or two of those USB GSM things, somewhere around here
[6:43] <clever> its not on battery backup...
[6:43] * niston looks around
[6:43] <niston> all I see is empty coke cans
[6:44] <[Saint]> botnut: perhaps you wanna look at the ODROID C1
[6:45] <botnut> ooo that's nice
[6:45] <Datalink> a GPS should be fine on the Pi's UART if you set the UART to match the needs of the GPS and said GPS is 3.3V
[6:45] <botnut> does it run debian?
[6:45] <[Saint]> It does.
[6:46] <[Saint]> there's even an optional eMMC module.
[6:46] <[Saint]> And the sdcard supports UHS-I
[6:46] <botnut> interesting
[6:46] <[Saint]> IOW: a lot quicker storage
[6:46] <[Saint]> all for the same price point.
[6:47] <[Saint]> well, a largely similar price point, I should say.
[6:47] <botnut> so what about powering the pi without the usb port? I've seen people powering it on the gpios... but read its not recommended
[6:47] <clever> botnut: ive ran mine with a 5v lipo boost regulator, right into the 5v header
[6:48] <botnut> really - any issues?
[6:48] <clever> nope
[6:48] <botnut> interesting
[6:48] <clever> and ive read that if you want low power, you can feed 3.3v into BOTH the +5 and +3.3 headers, it must be both (and dont even try to use the usb input when they are connected)
[6:48] <clever> the 3.3v regulator gets upset if the output is higher then the input, but if both in&out are at 3.3v, it cant get upset
[6:48] <clever> the usb wont work, but the rest will
[6:48] * stagnator (~pi@bb220-255-133-195.singnet.com.sg) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[6:48] <botnut> we've been powering with a lipo also but thru the usb port
[6:49] <clever> let me fetch a link
[6:49] <botnut> and those are damn hard to make.. considering its soo small and im not an umpalumpa with tiny hands it's a daunting task to solder that
[6:49] * stagnator (~pi@bb220-255-133-195.singnet.com.sg) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:49] <[-clever-]`ca> botnut: https://www.sparkfun.com/wish_lists/66243
[6:49] <niston> true
[6:50] <clever> using those parts, i was able to run my pi on wifi for a couple hours
[6:50] <clever> with battery level visible over SNMP
[6:50] <botnut> gotcha
[6:50] <botnut> we use a different component that steps down the voltage from the lipo
[6:51] <clever> only issue, the fuel guage board uses VBAT for i2c pullup
[6:51] <botnut> so we run it with a lipo of 11.1v stepped down to something the pi likes
[6:51] <clever> which would damage the pi
[6:51] <botnut> while powering other components without stepping down
[6:51] <clever> so i had to cut a trace, and use the pi 3.3v as pullup
[6:53] <botnut> we just use this
[6:53] <botnut> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008BHB4L8/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
[6:53] <botnut> a buck converter
[6:53] <botnut> tweak the voltage down with a screwdriver direct from just about any lipo and we are done
[6:54] <clever> ah
[6:54] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@122.15.200.115) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:54] <niston> botnut: cheaper alternative w/o trimming here http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__4319__TURNIGY_3A_UBEC_w_Noise_Reduction.html
[6:54] <botnut> yeah I saw those
[6:55] <botnut> but these are 9 bucks for 5 pieces lol
[6:55] <niston> ah
[6:55] <botnut> 2 bucks a pop
[6:55] <niston> yeah cant beat that
[6:56] <[Saint]> I get 'em for about $0.80 in bulk
[6:56] <[Saint]> buckies, that is.
[6:58] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@122.15.200.115) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[7:00] <botnut> https://www.thefanclub.co.za/how-to/how-setup-usb-3g-modem-raspberry-pi-using-usbmodeswitch-and-wvdial
[7:00] <botnut> ha interesting
[7:01] <botnut> wonder what's easier
[7:01] <botnut> the usb gsm or a gsm shield for the pi
[7:03] <botnut> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00INJZSL6/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_2?pf_rd_p=1944687582&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B00F2HDJBI&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=01R9M1J05M32ZFK52PME
[7:04] <TyrfingMjolnir> My first raspberry pi 2 just arived
[7:04] <TyrfingMjolnir> Now what?
[7:04] <TyrfingMjolnir> I would like to install debian Jessie on there
[7:04] <botnut> flash it with a laser
[7:06] <botnut> can standard debian installed on it?
[7:06] <botnut> haven't actually tied that
[7:06] <clever> i believe any standard arm7 os can be used
[7:07] <clever> as long as you use the modified rpi kernel
[7:07] <clever> if you want the gpu accel, you will need to build the userland tools
[7:07] <clever> plain 2d graphics wont need userland, fb0 is in the kernel
[7:09] * Megaf_ (~Megaf@unaffiliated/megaf) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:09] <TyrfingMjolnir> arm7?
[7:09] <TyrfingMjolnir> Can I run iOS on it?
[7:09] <clever> you dont have the source to modify the kernel
[7:10] * Megaf (~Megaf@unaffiliated/megaf) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[7:11] <TyrfingMjolnir> So how do I get started?
[7:11] <TyrfingMjolnir> I would like to be able to log in to my raspberry pi using ssh
[7:11] <clever> do you have another linux system to do the install with?
[7:11] <TyrfingMjolnir> Sure
[7:11] <TyrfingMjolnir> Bodhi Linux and MacOS X
[7:12] * oxhak (~OxHaK@unaffiliated/oxhak) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:12] <botnut> just set up raspbian
[7:12] <botnut> easy peasy
[7:15] <TyrfingMjolnir> Is there raspbian jessie?
[7:16] <botnut> wheezy
[7:16] <botnut> http://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads/
[7:16] <TyrfingMjolnir> http://www.raspbian.org/RaspbianInstaller
[7:17] <TyrfingMjolnir> Is there a way to debootstrap this?
[7:17] <clever> havent tried it with debootstrap yet
[7:18] <TyrfingMjolnir> What is in noobs?
[7:18] <TyrfingMjolnir> Is noobs a raspbian with documentation?
[7:18] <TyrfingMjolnir> Or what's the deal?
[7:19] <clever> noobs is an auto-installer
[7:21] <TyrfingMjolnir> Can I dist-upgrade to jessie?
[7:21] <clever> rasbian is a custom arm6 build, so probly not
[7:24] * dunkel2 (~dunkel2@189.237.57.39) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:24] <dunkel2> hello
[7:25] <mortal> elloes
[7:26] <mortal> just setup up my pi2 as a terminal client
[7:27] <mortal> get pi2 and basic arm debian works
[7:27] <mortal> with the custom install build
[7:27] <mortal> apt-get from debian repos
[7:28] <TyrfingMjolnir> http://www.linux.com/news/software/applications/810295-the-top-11-best-linux-distros-for-2015
[7:29] * r3dsm0k3 (~r3dsm0k3@106.51.133.164) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:29] <dunkel2> im trying to install archlinux on raspberrypi, but i cant get the .img file, i just get a rootfs, have you guys installed archlinux on the pi?
[7:29] * jimvideo (~jimvideo@184-12-233-85.dr01.brny.ca.frontiernet.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[7:31] <TyrfingMjolnir> Raspbian is the undisputed leader on Raspberry Pis, however the recently announced Snappy Core Ubuntu, which runs on the latest Raspberry Pi 2 is a game changer. With their 'Chrome OS'-like updates, a user will never have to worry about keeping their OS updated.
[7:31] * wcypierre is now known as zz_wcypierre
[7:33] * danes (46b056b7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.176.86.183) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:34] <botnut> is ubuntu snappy core similar in any way to ubuntu desktop?
[7:34] <Xark> botnut: Probably in some ways, but in general not made for a desktop. Made for "embedded device".
[7:34] <danes> Hello there. Anyone knows if there has been any project or attempt to use the pi and the toshiba flashair cards? I'd like to use two cameras with flashair cards and connect to the pi with 2 usb dongles to pull data
[7:35] * atomi (~atomi@71-83-179-177.dhcp.lnbh.ca.charter.com) Quit (Quit: brb)
[7:35] <Xark> botnut: See http://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/
[7:35] * Voovode (~Alex@tenatena.static.otenet.gr) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:36] <botnut> intersting
[7:36] <botnut> wonder how it compares in terms of performing against raspbian
[7:37] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:37] * lazy_prince is now known as killer_prince
[7:37] <Xark> botnut: There has been some benchmarks and ARMv7 native compiled code has a small increase typically from what I have seen (say ~20%).
[7:37] <mortal> armv7 debian feels much faster
[7:37] <mortal> maybe xorg and neon has something to do with it
[7:37] <botnut> I figured
[7:37] <mortal> no idea
[7:38] <shiftplusone> armv7 debian is not any faster
[7:38] <botnut> debian seems to run faster imo from what I've seen in other occasions
[7:38] <mortal> armv7 has thumb?
[7:38] <shiftplusone> linaro/ubuntu is
[7:38] <Xark> mortal: It is actually slower at compiling (perhaps compiler has to work harder with NEON etc.). :)
[7:38] <mortal> debian feels faster
[7:38] <mortal> no idea why
[7:38] <shiftplusone> but it isn't
[7:38] <mortal> well..
[7:38] <TyrfingMjolnir> Hmmm
[7:38] <mortal> does raspbian have neon accelerated xorg
[7:38] * abnormal (~abnormal@33.sub-70-209-128.myvzw.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[7:38] <TyrfingMjolnir> raspbian image is armv7?
[7:39] <clever> rasbian is still arm6
[7:39] <clever> backwards compat with the pi1]
[7:39] <botnut> wish steam had more games for linux
[7:39] * atomi (~atomi@71-83-179-177.dhcp.lnbh.ca.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:39] <botnut> COD would be great natively
[7:39] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[7:39] <TyrfingMjolnir> and the ubuntu core is snappy armv7?
[7:39] <shiftplusone> botnut, eh? it has plenty, just not the AAA stuff, which is terrible anyway
[7:39] <botnut> COD would be nice to have
[7:40] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[7:40] * Xark links http://www.mikronauts.com/raspberry-pi/raspberry-pi-2-raspbian-vs-linero-armv6-vs-armv7/
[7:40] * chipmadness (~chipmadne@75-134-183-81.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[7:41] <botnut> which is just silly considering unity allows you to just generate a build for all platforms
[7:41] <Xark> botnut: Unity has a Raspberry Pi target? :)
[7:42] <botnut> no im off topic here completely lol
[7:42] <botnut> random thoughts
[7:42] <botnut> I believe it does ios, win, linux, anrdoid etc etc
[7:42] <Xark> botnut: Very true. COD doesn't use Unity anyways AFAIK. :)
[7:42] <botnut> yep
[7:42] <botnut> im babbling
[7:42] <botnut> lol
[7:43] <botnut> just browsing steam watching the chan - wanting more gams for linux
[7:43] <Xark> I suspect technically Unity could totally target RPi2 with OpenGL ES (virtually the same as Android platforms it supports - sans Android).
[7:43] * Fishy (~fishy@pool-108-15-122-203.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:44] <botnut> well actually
[7:44] <botnut> I believe it might
[7:44] <botnut> if you can use the unity player in linux
[7:44] <botnut> in a browser - which I don't think it does
[7:44] * killer_prince is now known as lazy_prince
[7:45] <clever> it would have to be a linux arm build of the unity player
[7:45] <Xark> botnut: Well, I think all the pieces are there to make a "full" RPi2 target for native Unity games.
[7:45] * bizarro_1 (~bizarro_1@235.Red-88-19-177.staticIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[7:46] <TyrfingMjolnir> http://lucario.info/archive/raspuntu-tjc-2015-02-16.zip
[7:46] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:46] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[7:46] * qubitnerd (~neutrino@unaffiliated/electron/x-8286743) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[7:50] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[7:51] <TyrfingMjolnir> How can I run this one?
[7:52] * cpranzl (~cpranzl@93-82-156-97.adsl.highway.telekom.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:52] <ShorTie> write the image o a sdcard ??
[7:52] <clever> TyrfingMjolnir: what files are in the zip?
[7:53] <ShorTie> s/o/to/
[7:53] * PigFlu (~herp@unaffiliated/pigflu) Quit (Quit: dthdrthdrth)
[7:53] <TyrfingMjolnir> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=98997
[7:53] <TyrfingMjolnir> ShorTie: With dd?
[7:53] <ShorTie> or win32diskimager
[7:54] <TyrfingMjolnir> win32?
[7:54] * ShorTie thinkz, zip file is not the img file you write though
[7:55] <clever> hence why i asked, 'what files are in the zip?'
[7:55] * ShorTie noods, yup
[7:56] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[7:56] <TyrfingMjolnir> Still downloading
[7:56] <TyrfingMjolnir> 22 mins to go
[7:57] <TyrfingMjolnir> 2015-02-16-raspbian-wheezy.zip
[7:57] <TyrfingMjolnir> 2015-02-03-pi-snappy.zip
[7:57] <TyrfingMjolnir> are already in my downloads folder
[7:57] <TyrfingMjolnir> This one: raspuntu-tjc-2015-02-16.zip on its way down
[7:58] <[Saint]> 22 minutes?
[7:58] <[Saint]> ...jeebus.
[7:58] <clever> i know another person in this room that is waiting 4 hours on a .img
[7:58] <[Saint]> I feel very spoiled right now.
[7:59] <clever> i have 80mbit download
[7:59] <clever> i have trouble finding websites that can keep up with me, lol
[7:59] <[Saint]> I just tried the raspi 2 wheezy image for the hell of it and its already done.
[7:59] <clever> let me see how long that ubuntu image woudl take
[8:00] <[Saint]> and, yeah, Google's the only one that I find can push more bits than my pipe can hold.
[8:00] <[Saint]> their servers are nuts.
[8:00] * CustosL1men (~CustosLim@unaffiliated/cust0slim3n) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:00] <clever> seems that lucario has a decent host, i finished it in 24 seconds
[8:00] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[8:01] <[Saint]> aaaaaaaaaaaaand, snappy core is done.
[8:01] <[Saint]> 2:10 all up.
[8:01] <[Saint]> I feel very very spolied.
[8:01] <clever> and you took 4x as long as i did
[8:01] <[Saint]> FSM only knows how long it would have taken if I chose the torrent.
[8:02] <[Saint]> Probably would have taken longer to negotiate peers than grab the file.
[8:02] <clever> lol
[8:03] <shiftplusone> >=/
[8:03] <shiftplusone> 1 hours to go to download raspbian...
[8:03] <TyrfingMjolnir> sudo time dd if=/tmp/pi-snappy.img of=/dev/rdisk1 bs=16384k
[8:03] <clever> TyrfingMjolnir: i prefer to put time before sudo
[8:03] * JlRd (~jlrd@ip68-110-113-182.ph.ph.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[8:04] <clever> there is a time function within bash, that has better output
[8:04] <[Saint]> shiftplusone: that's your penalty for that awesome vista you posted yesterday
[8:04] <TyrfingMjolnir> which one?
[8:04] <clever> but if you put it after sudo, it uses the time program, which doesnt give as much detail
[8:04] <clever> TyrfingMjolnir: just time sudo dd ....
[8:04] <shiftplusone> [Saint], yup =(
[8:04] <TyrfingMjolnir> clever: in which distro?
[8:04] <TyrfingMjolnir> I'm making this image on MacOS X
[8:04] <clever> TyrfingMjolnir: any
[8:05] <[Saint]> any
[8:05] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[8:05] <clever> ah, mac may lack a time built-in, but it will still perform identicaly
[8:05] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:05] <clever> 'time sudo' will try the built-in, then use the normal app
[8:05] <clever> 'sudo time' will force it to run the normal app as root, skipping the built-in
[8:07] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[8:07] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:08] * double-you (~id@95.90.196.156) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:09] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@103.225.100.51) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:09] * ch007m_2 (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:11] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[8:13] * amigojapan (~amigojapa@c119045.net21845.cablenet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:13] * Kirito (~Kirito@pdpc/supporter/student/kirito) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[8:14] <TyrfingMjolnir> 3000000000 bytes transferred in 411.879676 secs (7283681 bytes/sec)
[8:14] <TyrfingMjolnir> I now have a system-boot volume mounted on my desktop
[8:14] <clever> oh yeah, and dd reports time, so time itself isnt needed
[8:14] * CustosL1men is now known as Cust0sL1men
[8:14] <TyrfingMjolnir> This should be bootable?
[8:14] * danes (46b056b7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.176.86.183) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[8:14] <clever> yep
[8:16] <TyrfingMjolnir> Just plug and pray?
[8:16] * swif (U_Mad@85-169-94-149.rev.numericable.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:18] <clever> yep
[8:19] <TyrfingMjolnir> I got 4 raspberries on my top left tv screen now
[8:19] <clever> yay
[8:20] <TyrfingMjolnir> Had to hit a key to proceed
[8:20] <TyrfingMjolnir> and now it says login
[8:22] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@103.225.100.51) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[8:23] * Xethron (~Xethron@unaffiliated/xethron) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:25] * dan2k3k4 (~dan2k3k4@unaffiliated/dan2k3k4) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:29] * Froolap (~Froolap@pool-71-180-136-207.tampfl.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:29] * dan2k3k4k5 (~dan2k3k4@unaffiliated/dan2k3k4) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:30] * blinky42 (~sb@c-76-124-208-67.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[8:31] * ssvb (~ssvb@85-76-73-164-nat.elisa-mobile.fi) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[8:32] * dan2k3k4 (~dan2k3k4@unaffiliated/dan2k3k4) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[8:34] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:35] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable033.54-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[8:36] <TyrfingMjolnir> Hmmm, mouse works, keyboard not
[8:36] * _BigWings_ (~Thunderbi@modemcable033.54-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:38] * ch007m_2 (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[8:39] * Xano (~bart@092-111-222-050.static.chello.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:40] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[8:42] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:42] <TyrfingMjolnir> How come I can click in the login screen, but nothing shows up on the screen when I key in the password?
[8:42] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: rm -rf /)
[8:42] <shiftplusone> because nobody needs to see the password on the screen
[8:42] <TyrfingMjolnir> Ehhh
[8:43] <TyrfingMjolnir> Usually there would be showing balls for each character
[8:43] <TyrfingMjolnir> typed in
[8:43] <shiftplusone> and people would be able to tell how long it is
[8:44] * dunkel2 (~dunkel2@189.237.57.39) Quit (Quit: dunkel2)
[8:44] <Triffid_Hunter> TyrfingMjolnir: simply knowing the length of a password hugely reduces the number of guesses required to crack it
[8:44] <TyrfingMjolnir> That's not the issue here
[8:44] <Triffid_Hunter> TyrfingMjolnir: I like the KDE feature where it shows 3 circles per character rather than one.. would not suggest trying to run kde on a RPi though ;)
[8:44] <TyrfingMjolnir> Hitting enter also does nothing
[8:45] * TyrfingMjolnir likes xfce and e19
[8:45] <niston> hit capslock. does the led light up?
[8:45] <Triffid_Hunter> TyrfingMjolnir: ssh in over the network, see if there's anything in dmesg about the keyboard
[8:45] <TyrfingMjolnir> Also on login prompt says nothing when I type on the keys
[8:46] * ch007m_2 (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:46] * ch007m (~chm@ip-213-49-111-218.dsl.scarlet.be) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[8:48] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:48] <TyrfingMjolnir> I tried 2 distros now snappy pi and this one: http://lucario.info/archive/raspuntu-tjc-2015-02-16.zip
[8:49] <TyrfingMjolnir> Both boot and take me login prompt
[8:49] <TyrfingMjolnir> None of them are accepting keypresses from the keyboard
[8:49] * Bebbzor (~Bebbzor@h21n1-veo-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:49] * swif (U_Mad@85-169-94-149.rev.numericable.fr) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[8:50] * mike_t (~mike@109.169.167.12) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:51] <TyrfingMjolnir> Does the keyboard have to be of a certain low power consumption?
[8:52] * double-you (~id@95.90.196.156) Quit (Quit: double-you)
[8:52] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[8:52] * lawdy (~lawdy@81.128.139.98) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:52] <ShorTie> is the red power light burning steady ??
[8:53] <ShorTie> or is it blinking
[8:53] * Logicwax (~Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:54] * krelo (~krelo@dsl3-209.uninet.ee) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:55] <TyrfingMjolnir> red LED is on
[8:55] <TyrfingMjolnir> no blinking
[8:55] <TyrfingMjolnir> http://www.daskeyboard.com/model-s-ultimate/
[8:55] <niston> gah
[8:56] * Xano (~bart@092-111-222-050.static.chello.nl) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[8:57] * hadifarnoud (~hadifarno@31.59.86.96) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:57] * Xano (~bart@092-111-222-050.static.chello.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:58] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:03] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[9:03] * [SLB] (~slabua@unaffiliated/slabua) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[9:04] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:04] <SpeedEvil> Most of the time I use my keyboard and mouse without looking at them at all even for wierd chars.
[9:04] <SpeedEvil> A significant portion of the time under the blankets - which is ideal to keep fingers warm.
[9:06] * shiftplusone is forced to use an ISO rather than an ANSI keyboard.
[9:06] <shiftplusone> So my typing is all derpy
[9:06] <TyrfingMjolnir> ISO vs ANSI?
[9:06] <TyrfingMjolnir> ISO is the european one with amputated left SHIFT?
[9:07] <ShorTie> l@@ks like a gimmick to reduce production cost and increase the price
[9:07] <shiftplusone> european vs american. One has a long shift key on the left and a long enter on the right. The other has a short shift, an extra key and a tall enter
[9:07] <shiftplusone> there are probably more differences but those are the annoying ones to me
[9:07] <shiftplusone> yeh
[9:08] <TyrfingMjolnir> I really liked the MacBook keyboards that had separate enter and return button
[9:08] <TyrfingMjolnir> enter for submit and return for linebreak
[9:08] <shiftplusone> That sounds.... odd
[9:08] <Xark> TyrfingMjolnir: I do not recall those...
[9:09] <TyrfingMjolnir> MacBook black
[9:09] <TyrfingMjolnir> ... and white
[9:09] <niston> what do you expect from a manufacturer putting the power button on the keyboard?!
[9:09] <shiftplusone> http://deskthority.net/wiki/ANSI_vs_ISO
[9:10] <SpeedEvil> shiftplusone: I bought 3 IBM 'spacesaver' keyboards from canadia as they had the right layout. - large enter, trackpoint - win
[9:10] <TyrfingMjolnir> http://www.thebookyard.com/images/mbbtopc8uk.jpg
[9:10] <TyrfingMjolnir> enter to the left of the right apple key
[9:11] <shiftplusone> SpeedEvil, I'm guessing they're tenkeyless?
[9:11] <SpeedEvil> shiftplusone: yes
[9:11] <shiftplusone> ah, those bug me as well >.>
[9:11] <TyrfingMjolnir> niston: That was actually what I spent most time on the first time I saw a mac
[9:13] <shiftplusone> I bought a logitech keyboard with a US layout, but it ended up being an ISO one with a US keymap, meaning the \ key is in two places and the layout is still something I'm not used to so.... that was a waste of money >.>
[9:13] <niston> haha xD
[9:13] <niston> cost me 15 mins too :P
[9:13] <shiftplusone> SpeedEvil, =/ google says the spacesaver keyboards haven't been in production for 16 years O_o
[9:14] * blinky42 (~sb@c-76-124-208-67.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:14] * AlexYoung29 (~IceChat78@212.49.247.174) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[9:14] * swif (U_Mad@85-169-94-149.rev.numericable.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:16] <SirLagz> shiftplusone: thanks to that link, I finally found out why one of my keyboards has an Alt Gr key lol
[9:16] <shiftplusone> heh
[9:16] <SirLagz> I have a keyboard that's like a mix of ISO and ANSI then
[9:16] <niston> \o
[9:16] <SirLagz> It has the ANSI enter and shift, and the altgr of the ISO keyboard...IIRC
[9:17] <niston> what does alt gr even mean?
[9:17] <SirLagz> makes me wanna dig the keyboard out again and look lol
[9:17] <niston> alt greater?
[9:17] <niston> alt german?
[9:17] <niston> alt grunt?
[9:17] <SirLagz> alt group ?
[9:17] <SpeedEvil> shiftplusone: that's not true
[9:17] <SirLagz> niston: alt graph apparemtly
[9:17] <shiftplusone> http://deskthority.net/wiki/IBM_Space_Saving_Keyboard
[9:18] <niston> ah yes of course!
[9:18] <niston> :D
[9:18] <shiftplusone> I guess not those then
[9:18] <niston> that's why it's for stuff like \ @ # ¢ ¬
[9:18] <SirLagz> I can't do the c symbol on my keybaord lol
[9:18] <niston> try alt gr and 8
[9:18] <niston> might get lucky :D
[9:18] <SirLagz> I don't have an alt gr on my current keyboard :P
[9:19] <niston> no dice then.
[9:19] <SirLagz> haha
[9:19] * JustinZ (~Justin@ppp59-167-92-183.static.internode.on.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:19] <SpeedEvil> http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/controller/e/gbweb/LenovoPortal/en_GB/catalog.workflow:item.detail?hide_menu_area=true&GroupID=460&Code=0B47187
[9:19] <SirLagz> I feel like digging out my old Model M clone keyboard now
[9:19] <niston> you could look up the ansi code for it and use alt-numpad
[9:19] <SirLagz> niston: yeaah no.
[9:19] <niston> haha xD
[9:19] * Logicwax (~Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[9:19] <JustinZ> So, has anyone come across a straight up wayland desktop image for Raspberry Pi?
[9:20] <shiftplusone> hmm.... not sure what to make of that one.
[9:20] <shiftplusone> SpeedEvil, any good?
[9:20] <heller\> anyone familiar with openwrt?
[9:21] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:23] * dan2k3k4k5 (~dan2k3k4@unaffiliated/dan2k3k4) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[9:23] * dan2k3k4 (~dan2k3k4@unaffiliated/dan2k3k4) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:23] <SpeedEvil> shiftplusone: Idon't have that particular model. Mine has PS/2 connectors.
[9:24] <niston> I have used it
[9:24] <niston> came to dislike it
[9:24] <SpeedEvil> I got it as it's got a palmrest - essential for use in bed.
[9:24] <SpeedEvil> Adn has the big enter
[9:24] * Xethron (~Xethron@unaffiliated/xethron) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[9:24] * djsxxx_away is now known as djsxxx
[9:24] <niston> the "open" in it is a joke
[9:24] <shiftplusone> niston, isn't it just a buildroot thingy?
[9:25] * [Saint] (77e0273c@rockbox/staff/saint) Quit (Quit: [Read error: Connection reset by queer])
[9:25] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[9:25] <niston> gah wait I'm a fool
[9:25] <niston> th eone I hate is dd-wrt
[9:25] <niston> die, dd-wrt!
[9:25] <shiftplusone> is dd in it a joke?
[9:25] <niston> heheh :>
[9:25] <shiftplusone> If so, I don't get it. >.>
[9:26] <niston> dd probably stands for double-douchebag or something
[9:26] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:27] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[9:28] <niston> shiftplusone its a wireless router platform
[9:28] <niston> popular with the OLSR crowd
[9:28] * hyperair (~hyperair@ubuntu/member/hyperair) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:31] * Albori (~Albori@64-251-150-248.fidnet.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[9:31] * WLL (~WLL@unaffiliated/wll) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:31] <TyrfingMjolnir> niston: alt gr = alternative graphics
[9:31] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[9:31] * day (~yashi@unaffiliated/day) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:32] <niston> ¢¢¢¢ :)
[9:32] <TyrfingMjolnir> dd is a typo made when flashing the drive
[9:32] <niston> altho the name suggests it should be an A within a circle
[9:33] <TyrfingMjolnir> Stickers are just annoying
[9:35] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:35] <JustinZ> anyone got a wayland DE running on their pi?
[9:36] <Stephini> I never understood why DD-WRT was so popular. I tried it when it was first a thing and everyone was like "OMG TEH AWESOME" caused a clock syncing issue that caused most of the internet to reject connections with me.
[9:37] <niston> what I don't like about it is the arrogance of the devs
[9:37] * felixjet__ (~felixjet@210.Red-79-155-49.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:37] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:38] * Xark (~K@unaffiliated/xark) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:39] * blenny (~blenny@66.172.33.194) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[9:39] <niston> ie "syncing issue?! its all your fault cause you are not teh leet"
[9:39] * Xark (~K@unaffiliated/xark) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:39] <Stephini> I wouldn't know I never interacted with them that I know of. I think I emailed them about my issue but NEVER got a response.
[9:39] <niston> just browse the forums
[9:39] * DimeBag (~llorllale@179.52.253.33) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:39] <niston> you'll see what I'm talking about
[9:39] * llorllale (~llorllale@179.52.253.33) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[9:39] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@c-76-115-7-194.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:40] <Stephini> I think I'll pass. I got a couple lifetimes fill of that kind of snobbishness and elitism in the Lua circles.
[9:40] * SebastianFlyte (~sebf@pool-173-79-110-127.washdc.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[9:40] * almostworking (~almostwor@unaffiliated/almostworking) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[9:40] <niston> ;)
[9:40] * aballier (~alexis@gentoo/developer/aballier) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:40] * felixjet_ (~felixjet@210.Red-79-155-49.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[9:40] * ShorTie (~Idiot@unaffiliated/shortie) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[9:40] <Stephini> I double dog dare you to ever aproach a room or channel full of Lua devs and spell it LUA.
[9:41] * fyrril (~fyrril4@cpe-098-122-071-245.sc.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[9:41] <niston> I only used LUA once, to write a script for the WoW client
[9:41] * almostworking (~almostwor@unaffiliated/almostworking) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:41] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[9:42] <niston> fun little thing, circumvented the "data export" restrictions WoW devs so carefully put in
[9:42] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:42] <niston> by drawing black/white squares on the screen and taking a screenshot of that
[9:43] <Stephini> lolz that's my primary exposure to working with Lua as well. I wrote a few non spectacularly popular mods for the core client a few personal macro scripts but the project I spent the most time on was for private servers rigging up a graphical command interface that was used by pretty much every private server of the time. :P
[9:43] <niston> black meant 0, white meant 1. tadaa! any binary data from inside the client to the outside world.
[9:44] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:45] <SpeedEvil> You're only truly successful if Blizzard sues you.
[9:45] * RaTTuS|BIG (~Rattus.bi@35.152-253-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk) Quit ()
[9:45] <niston> SpeedEvil: never published it, so they wouldn't know.
[9:45] <Stephini> ... ok how the heck am i supposed to compile freetype2 to get the freetype6.dll when the only compiler they packaged with it is for 32bit windows? >.<
[9:45] <niston> then I ditched WoW entirely cuz u know... "wtf am I doing here?"
[9:46] * JlRd (~jlrd@ip68-110-113-182.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:46] <Stephini> I still got the fire in my veins. it's an addiction harder to kick than the booze, tobaco and coke combined.
[9:47] * t0mab (~t0mab@stakhanov.u-strasbg.fr) Quit (Quit: leaving)
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[9:48] * t0mab (~t0mab@stakhanov.u-strasbg.fr) Quit (Client Quit)
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[9:49] * hadifarnoud (~hadifarno@31.59.86.96) Quit ()
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[9:49] * WLL (~WLL@unaffiliated/wll) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[9:49] * JustinZ (~Justin@ppp59-167-92-183.static.internode.on.net) has left #raspberrypi
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[9:54] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) Quit (Quit: Computer gone to sleep)
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[9:57] * Tach[Zzz] is now known as Tachyon`
[9:57] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
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[10:02] * esas (~esas@unaffiliated/esas) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[10:04] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@122.15.200.115) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:13] * Tazmain (~Taz@31.221.54.34) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:13] * instigator (~synthesis@105.228.58.46) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:13] * JlRd (~jlrd@ip68-110-113-182.ph.ph.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[10:13] <Tazmain> hi all, is the rasberrypi 2's audio output stronger than a htc desire hd ? I want to a music player in my car
[10:14] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:14] <instigator> Hello. Where could I find the raspbian download for the raspberry pi? Went to http://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads/ but only saw the Raspbian download, which I presume is for raspberry pi 1
[10:15] <ShorTie> audio power output is very minimal, it needs some form of amplifaction to hear it
[10:15] <instigator> sorry meant looking for raspbian download for raspberry pi 2 (not 1)
[10:15] <ShorTie> it works on either
[10:15] * hadifarnoud (~hadifarno@31.59.86.96) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[10:15] <niston> instigator: some mobile phones have a limiter for the headphones output
[10:15] <ShorTie> hit +more info to see
[10:15] <Tazmain> ShorTie, so its not the same as a laptops audio out? So I will still need a pre-amp or a usb sound carD ?
[10:16] * qubitnerd (~neutrino@unaffiliated/electron/x-8286743) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:16] <niston> dunno about the HTC, but the Pi sure doesn't have that.
[10:16] * MagicalTwix (~Rattus.bi@35.152-253-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:16] * ChanServ sets mode +o MagicalTwix
[10:16] * ChanServ sets mode -o MagicalTwix
[10:16] <niston> err Tazmain not instigator :D
[10:16] <Tazmain> well will the pi's audio out be as strong as a laptop's ?
[10:16] <niston> I suggest you get something like the Pi-DAC though. Don't hurt yourself with PWM audio :D
[10:17] * almostworking (~almostwor@unaffiliated/almostworking) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[10:17] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[10:18] <Tazmain> was hoping i didn't need a dac
[10:19] <niston> you don't need. you want.
[10:19] <niston> it'll work using the Pi's onboard audio out. connect that to the Aux in on your car stereo. but it'll hurt your ears.
[10:20] <Tazmain> lol why will it hurt my ears ?
[10:20] <niston> cus PWM audio is.... uh...
[10:20] <niston> suboptimal
[10:20] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) Quit (Quit: Computer gone to sleep)
[10:21] <Tazmain> ewe square waves
[10:21] <niston> it wont matter of course if your car stereo is trash anyways.
[10:21] <Tazmain> okay so which dac is good ?
[10:21] <niston> Pi-DAC. highly recommended.
[10:21] <Tazmain> I can't seem to find that
[10:22] <niston> try www.iqaudio.com
[10:23] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:23] * krnlyng (~liar@83.175.90.24) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:23] * amigojapan (~amigojapa@c119045.net21845.cablenet.ne.jp) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[10:24] * amigojapan (~amigojapa@c119045.net21845.cablenet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:24] <Tazmain> they a bit pricey
[10:24] <niston> well worth it
[10:25] <Tazmain> just plug and play on the pi ?
[10:25] <niston> mostly
[10:25] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@122.15.200.115) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:25] <niston> I think you have to enable the driver
[10:25] <Tazmain> lol mostly ? does arch have the driver " ?
[10:25] <niston> add some entry to some config file
[10:26] <niston> I dont remember offhand which one it was
[10:26] <niston> but the driver is in raspbian
[10:26] <niston> doubt it for arch, not sure though.
[10:27] <Tazmain> that would be disappointing if its not in arch
[10:27] * kcj (~kcj@unaffiliated/kcj) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[10:28] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@c-76-115-7-194.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[10:29] <qubitnerd> Tazmain: its easy to write packages for arch
[10:30] <Tazmain> well I firstly need to find a place to by a DAC, that seems to be harder to fidn
[10:30] <Tazmain> fidn *
[10:30] <qubitnerd> now might be a good time to learn how to do it
[10:30] <niston> tindie.com
[10:30] <niston> they have it on sale
[10:30] <Tazmain> doubt they ship to South-Africa
[10:31] <niston> could try https://www.hifiberry.com/dac/ then
[10:32] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:32] <Tazmain> is this worth it at all Phantom YoYo PCM2704 USB DAC USB Power ?
[10:32] <niston> USB dac?
[10:32] <niston> not recommended.
[10:33] <niston> not for the Pi at least
[10:33] <Tazmain> its usb powered
[10:33] * UKn0Me (~UKn0Me@CPE-121-215-1-28.lnse1.pie.bigpond.net.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:33] <Tazmain> but the hifiberry says the dac is for pi a/b , what about the pi2 ?
[10:34] <niston> ah I see it now
[10:34] <niston> dunno about it
[10:34] <niston> but still, USB not the route of choice for sound output on Pi
[10:35] <Tazmain> its still rca and 3.5mm jack just gets power from usb as well
[10:35] <niston> the point is how the digital sound data is transferred from Pi to DAC
[10:35] <niston> Pi has a dedicated interface called I2S for this
[10:37] <niston> using it will be beneficial because a) less overhead and CPU load and b) no additional load on the one and only USB channel the Pi has
[10:38] <Tazmain> I guess, unless you using an external sound card right ? Like a studio sound card that has its own timing crystal ?
[10:38] <clever> i2s supplies the timing from the pi
[10:39] <Tazmain> that might be but studio audio card are better than any pc based one
[10:39] <qubitnerd> i saw in the schematics that the RCA tv connector is labelled DAC
[10:39] <niston> video DAC
[10:39] <qubitnerd> can that DAC be hacked ?
[10:39] <niston> yeah
[10:39] <niston> phire I think has done something with it
[10:39] <clever> ali1234 has modified it to output teletext
[10:39] <niston> or yeah
[10:39] <niston> ali1234
[10:39] <clever> EU subtitles over PAL video
[10:40] <niston> phire was the alpha tester :)
[10:40] <Tazmain> well I think considering the shipping issues and back log in SA I will rather use my pi2 for a hardware add block for time being
[10:40] <clever> i did the scope analasys to verify which scan-lines things where on
[10:40] * qubitnerd looks up phires github repos
[10:40] <niston> gah ^^ sorry clever
[10:41] <clever> ive also spotted how NA subtitles are done, entirely different and way dumber protocol
[10:41] * D-Boy (~D-Boy@unaffiliated/cain) Quit (Excess Flood)
[10:41] <clever> i could probly add NA support to the code
[10:42] <qubitnerd> clever: is it possible to use like a generic DAC ?
[10:42] * instigator (~synthesis@105.228.58.46) has left #raspberrypi
[10:42] <clever> qubitnerd: havent figured out enough for that yet
[10:42] <qubitnerd> ah okay
[10:42] <clever> we can freely control the level for each scan-line, and somewhat modify the number and lenght of the scan lines
[10:42] <clever> but something else is inserting v-sync, h-sync and color burst automaticaly
[10:43] <clever> and you would have to encode the audio as grey levels on the display, including interlacing 2 full frames of audio
[10:44] * zz_wcypierre is now known as wcypierre
[10:45] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:49] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) Quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[10:49] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:51] <Tazmain> oh the windows 10 dev license that you get with a pi2 is that just the arm version of windows or also the desktop then ?
[10:51] * D-Boy (~D-Boy@unaffiliated/cain) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:52] <qubitnerd> Tazmain: microsoft isnt all that generous :P
[10:52] <shiftplusone> All the available information is on http://windowsondevices.com/
[10:52] <qubitnerd> i dont now though .. but i suspect ot
[10:53] <shiftplusone> (but of course they're not giving away windows 10 for the desktop for all pi users, that would just be silly)
[10:53] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:53] * ppq (~ppq@unaffiliated/ppq) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:53] <ShorTie> not silly for us .. :)~
[10:54] * ShorTie snickers
[10:54] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[10:54] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[10:54] <Tazmain> but some pi users get a desktop license as well ?
[10:54] <shiftplusone> where are you getting that from?
[10:55] <Tazmain> you said "but of course they're not giving away windows 10 for the desktop for all pi users" implying that some will get it
[10:55] <shiftplusone> not by my interpretation
[10:55] <niston> expecting Metro GUI? orly?
[10:55] <Tazmain> hehe by mine :p
[10:56] <qubitnerd> shiftplusone: it would be if he imagined the stress was on "for all"
[10:56] <qubitnerd> "but of course they're not giving away windows 10 for the desktop FOR ALL pi users"
[10:57] * blaz000- (~blaz000@213.249.204.2) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:57] <qubitnerd> see it now ?
[10:57] <shiftplusone> I saw it when I typed it, but I didn't think people would read into it like that.
[10:57] <qubitnerd> i didnt the first time :P only after Tazmain mentioned it :P
[10:58] <shiftplusone> seems like they have a channel here #windowsondevices
[10:58] <Tazmain> hehe yeah lol, me is hoping for that
[10:58] <Tazmain> well .NET is opensource now
[10:58] <shiftplusone> heh... jumped in there and see Tazmain repeating the same question >_<
[10:58] <Tazmain> yeah that was before I read here oops
[10:59] <qubitnerd> lol
[10:59] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:59] <niston> windows 10 with full GUI on a Pi? imagine the crawl :)
[11:00] <Tazmain> lol you think it would boot ? That is really being optimistic
[11:00] <clever> my best guess is that your basicaly going to get a souped up arduino
[11:00] <clever> gpio, network, disk, on a windows kernel
[11:00] <shiftplusone> I don't see why it wouldn't run with a dispmanx backend
[11:00] <clever> framebuffer if your lucky
[11:00] <qubitnerd> the age of IOT viruses begins
[11:00] <shiftplusone> anyway.... no point speculating until more info comes from MS
[11:01] <Triffid_Hunter> wait, people are actually taking windows on devices seriously?
[11:01] <clever> qubitnerd: soon your toaster will be printing out ransom notes, wire money to them to get it back to normal!
[11:01] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:01] <Triffid_Hunter> I can't fathom taking windows on desktop seriously, let alone on non-desktop devices
[11:02] <clever> Triffid_Hunter: the only reason i still keep a windows machine is to run a few games
[11:02] <qubitnerd> clever: :P
[11:03] <Triffid_Hunter> clever: if it won't work in wine, I simply don't play
[11:03] <clever> Triffid_Hunter: i built wine in 64bit only mode
[11:03] <Triffid_Hunter> more and more titles are cross-platform, and KSP works best on linux
[11:03] * factor (97c1d518@gateway/web/freenode/ip.151.193.213.24) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:03] <clever> then i discovered one of the games needs the .net framework, which is 32bit only under wine
[11:03] <clever> so now i need to recompile wine
[11:03] <Triffid_Hunter> clever: ouch, dotnet40 doesn't work in wine64 last time I checked, big caveat there
[11:04] <clever> exactly
[11:04] <Tazmain> I've been wanting to buy a pi for a year now, but could never figure out what I will do with it
[11:04] <Triffid_Hunter> I make a habit of only buying games that work in wine or have a linux build
[11:04] <factor> Has anyone setup a proxy.pac proxy file to work under Raspian ?
[11:04] * MagicalTwix is now known as RaTTuS|BIG
[11:05] * speeddragon (~speeddrag@193.137.28.200) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:06] <Tazmain> I still dont see what is so great about raspian, its debian right ? Arch so far is the only distro I have seen run on a caculator. The Ti-inspire, which I have as well
[11:06] * pksato (~PEBKAC@unaffiliated/pksato) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:06] <clever> Tazmain: whats special about arch?
[11:07] <Tazmain> can run on a calculator. You set it up from scratch and rolling release
[11:08] <clever> how does it do such a feat?
[11:08] <shiftplusone> ahm.... you can do all that with debian/raspbian.
[11:08] <shiftplusone> linux is linux
[11:08] <Tazmain> I have no seen debian run on it
[11:08] <Triffid_Hunter> Tazmain: gentoo is similar. I use gentoo, haven't tried arch so can't compare them
[11:09] <clever> shiftplusone: exactly
[11:09] * Keanu73 (~Keanu73@unaffiliated/keanu73) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:09] <Tazmain> gentoo is cool as well, but wow will take forever to compile on a pi
[11:09] * hallmdm7 (~hallmdm7@KD182249057229.au-net.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:09] <Tazmain> I know usb audio is bad but what about this http://www.apogeedigital.com/products/groove ? Studio gear
[11:10] <Triffid_Hunter> Tazmain: compiling anything on a pi is a fool's errand, that's what crossdev is for :P
[11:10] <niston> all the gear I've ever seen in real studios was firewire
[11:11] * hallmdm7 (~hallmdm7@KD182249057229.au-net.ne.jp) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:11] <Tazmain> yeah but firewire is dying a slow death lol
[11:11] <clever> Triffid_Hunter: but can a crossdev crosscompiler be used via distcc?
[11:11] <Triffid_Hunter> clever: yes
[11:11] <Tazmain> niston, think that will work ?
[11:11] <clever> Triffid_Hunter: how hard is that to setup?
[11:12] <niston> it could work. but I don't recommend it.
[11:12] <Triffid_Hunter> clever: not hard actually, distcc always uses the full tuple so as long as your cross is in distcc's path it'll find it
[11:12] <clever> Triffid_Hunter: ive also noticed another really painfull bug with distcc
[11:12] <clever> distcc+avahi+ipv6 == breakage
[11:13] <niston> hah. almost done binge watching SoA
[11:13] <clever> when avahi passes the ipv6 addr over, distcc gets confused by the :
[11:13] <clever> niston: SoA?
[11:13] <niston> Sons of Anarchy
[11:13] <clever> ah, havent seen any
[11:13] <niston> its actually pretty good.
[11:14] <clever> shiftplusone: image still downloadin?
[11:14] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:15] <clever> niston: what do you think about running studio quality audio over ethernet?
[11:15] <niston> clever: it's called EtherSound
[11:15] <clever> and the specs dont seem very open
[11:15] <shiftplusone> clever, nope, but I got carried away with something else. Setting up my sd card with the image + minimal buildroot initramfs and USB rootfs. Using the mechanism from NOOBS to switch between them.
[11:15] <clever> heh, i get easily distracted too
[11:16] <niston> clever: you'll have to sign up with their club I think
[11:16] <shiftplusone> and trying to figure out why my router isn't resolving local hosts for me.
[11:16] <clever> niston: thats the kind of thing i'm trying to avoid
[11:16] <shiftplusone> and might go grab some tea and cake >.>
[11:16] <niston> well
[11:16] <niston> I think it could work on the Ethernet layer
[11:16] <niston> just leave IP out of it
[11:16] <niston> (to roll your own)
[11:17] <clever> niston: i was thinking of something based on rtp
[11:17] * ghard (~ghard@2001:980:53f7:1:4510:b4a4:9471:243) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:17] <clever> UDP based obviously
[11:17] * darenasc (~darenasc@200-112-52-90.baf.movistar.cl) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:17] <niston> isn't that too jittery for studio quality?
[11:17] <clever> i dont see udp+rtp having any more overhead then ethernet
[11:17] <clever> just a few bytes more per packet
[11:17] <niston> depends on the stack I guess
[11:18] <niston> I mean the quality
[11:18] <clever> part of the plan is to not vendor-lock the client system
[11:18] <clever> support all the OS's!
[11:18] <niston> noble plan.
[11:18] <clever> ive heard the horror storyes of how much crap you have to turn off in windows just to get the jitter under control
[11:19] <clever> and avahi makes discovering the device trivial
[11:19] <clever> but i can barely get DHCP to work in an FPGA
[11:20] <clever> state engines and massively parallel stuff are hard to force onto such a serialized setup
[11:20] <niston> clever: thinking about implementing it on an FPGA?
[11:20] <clever> the audio capture will go on an FPGA
[11:20] * dan64 (~dan64@dannyadam.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:20] <clever> but the controller will maybe be a raspberry pi
[11:20] <niston> interesting project for sure
[11:21] <clever> basicaly, ethernet MII <-> FPGA <-> rpi
[11:21] <niston> but why not straight Ethernet?
[11:21] <clever> at startup, the FPGA acts as a simple network card, giving the pi network (it can be a model-a or compute module)
[11:21] * factor (97c1d518@gateway/web/freenode/ip.151.193.213.24) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[11:21] <clever> the pi will use dhcp and avahi to advertise itself on the lan
[11:22] <clever> niston: can non-root apps do bare ethernet on mac/linux/ios/android?, probly not
[11:22] * cameronf_ (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:22] <niston> you could do in the FPGA
[11:22] <niston> for the others I think you need raw sockets which require root yes
[11:22] <clever> once the control signals are sent to the pi to enable it, the FPGA is configured on what channels to stream, along with hte ip config
[11:23] * perkan (~neosmo@185.34.93.87) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:23] <clever> the FPGA will inject all the data into the MII, bypassing the pi
[11:23] <clever> and will filter&handle any incoming audio, so the pi is out of the bandwidth loop
[11:23] <niston> so no network stack with nondeterministic latency problems
[11:23] <niston> yeah
[11:24] <niston> sounds like a plan
[11:24] <clever> yeah, all of the high bandwidth and jitter sensitive stuff goes directly to the MII
[11:24] <clever> so the only place you can mess up is the network stack of the master control box
[11:24] <clever> which can be any OS
[11:24] <clever> pick whatever OS and card suits your needs
[11:24] <niston> be sure to send a few prototypes my way ;)
[11:25] <clever> once things are setup more then a total nest of wires, lol
[11:25] <clever> right now ive got an FPGA dev board and a wiznet ethernet module, linked up by 20 or 30 wires
[11:26] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[11:27] <clever> the first stage is ~70mbit of usage on a 100mbit MII
[11:27] <clever> in theory, you could gang 10 of those modules together on a gigabit switch
[11:27] <clever> and then run them into a single gigabit port on the host
[11:28] <clever> the ios/android hosts, are more for testing, to just route a channel right to your hand and listen for any signal
[11:28] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[11:28] <clever> wifi obviously wont be that great
[11:29] <niston> hmm
[11:29] * lawdy (~lawdy@81.128.139.98) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[11:29] <niston> I've cobbled together something that did audio/video over ethernet
[11:29] <niston> also wifi
[11:30] * rodrigograca31 (uid41821@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mefwhhxlrxjwznpg) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:30] <niston> worked remarkably well, better than AirPlay could ever do for sure
[11:30] <clever> heh
[11:30] <clever> my ISP does iptv, and in theory i could run it over wifi
[11:30] <clever> but its UDP, so no retransmit
[11:30] <clever> and id need to use a pi or laptop as the wifi->ethernet link, to un-wireless it
[11:30] <niston> https://niston.wordpress.com/2013/03/16/ip-network-audiovideo/
[11:31] <clever> ever seen what the chromecast can do?
[11:31] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:31] <niston> nope
[11:32] <clever> for support websites/apps (like youtube), it will just take the url, send it directly to the chromecast
[11:32] <clever> and just play it there, skiping your pc entirely
[11:32] <niston> ah
[11:33] <clever> for unsupported things like netflix, it will basicaly stream your monitor in real-time
[11:33] <niston> yeah
[11:33] <clever> so it re-compresses the video, and streams it over
[11:33] <clever> the android/ps3 youtube/netflix app do the same thing
[11:33] <clever> both android apps act as a remote-control for their ps3 counterpart
[11:34] <clever> my isp then went the brain-dead way for their streaming services :P
[11:34] <niston> heh
[11:34] <clever> you must install the IPAD version of 'twonky beam' on an APPLE device
[11:34] <clever> and then it re-streams the data to the cable box
[11:34] <clever> if you turn the ipad screen off, the streaming stops
[11:34] <clever> if you install the android version of 'twonky beam' it cant even see the cable box
[11:35] <clever> if you try to rewind or fastforward, the streaming stops
[11:35] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-553-1-43-235.w92-151.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:35] <niston> that's quite inconvenient
[11:35] <clever> and all the ipad app really does, is a web browser that yoinks all <video> tags out
[11:35] <clever> and it cant access the main browsers cookies
[11:35] <clever> so you must login again, typing your pw into a questional app
[11:36] * cameronf_ (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:36] <clever> when twonky does interface with the STB, the STB itself starts doing https queries
[11:36] <clever> to something in 10.x.y.z
[11:36] <clever> wtf?
[11:36] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:37] <clever> why is the cable box having to query an external server on a private lan when its streaming localy sourced data?
[11:37] <niston> so the NSA can make backups for you ;)
[11:37] <clever> ;)
[11:38] <clever> twonky.tv.fibreop.ca. 900 IN A 10.237.11.6
[11:38] <clever> the domain it does https to, and its ip
[11:38] <clever> it runs ISS
[11:38] * cameronf_ (~cameronfr@125.32.134.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:38] <clever> IIS i mean
[11:39] <RaTTuS|BIG> ha! http://uk.rs-online.com/web/generalDisplay.html?id=promotions/topsellers
[11:39] <niston> hehe
[11:39] <clever> niston: so you might be wondering, how can i even access that machine?
[11:39] <clever> my lan is 192.168.2
[11:39] <niston> NAT?
[11:40] <clever> the 802.1q at the modem layer
[11:40] <clever> one vlan is for 10.x, the other vlan is internet
[11:40] <niston> ah yes
[11:40] <clever> my own lan was 10.0.0.0/25 before i upgraded
[11:40] <clever> it took a month to fix all of the problems switching to 192 caused
[11:41] <niston> IP renumbering is tedious
[11:41] <clever> when i first switched from 192 to 10, i did things in a fun and 'unique' way
[11:41] <clever> i ran both subnets at once
[11:41] <clever> and just changed things one at a time, until 192 stopped being used
[11:41] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@63.222.132.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[11:41] * Keanu73 (~Keanu73@unaffiliated/keanu73) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[11:42] <clever> which reminds me, i had an interesting problem when i first tried to get 10.0.0.1 working
[11:42] <clever> ip conflict
[11:42] <clever> it took a few days to figure out where it came from
[11:42] <clever> niston: any guess?
[11:42] <niston> the iptv vlan?
[11:42] <clever> this was before the iptv
[11:43] <niston> default IP on some gear perhaps`
[11:43] <clever> part a, switching the ip on the managed cisco switch undid the vlan config for some strange reason
[11:43] <niston> oO
[11:43] <clever> it responded to telnet on 10.0.0.1
[11:43] <clever> part b, the 'dumb' pppoe relay, turned out to not be so dumb
[11:44] <clever> and thru a read-only username, i was able to see the SnR on every bucket
[11:44] <clever> so i could measure the line quality
[11:44] * Myrtti (~myrtti@freenode/staff/myrtti) Quit (Ping timeout: 624 seconds)
[11:45] * mike_t (~mike@109.169.167.12) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[11:46] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[11:46] * Myrtti (~myrtti@freenode/staff/myrtti) has joined #raspberrypi
[11:46] <clever> i thought it was a dumb device that could only translate pppoe packets from copper pair to ethernet
[11:48] <clever> and because of that, i ran my router on 10.0.0.3 for years
[11:49] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[11:51] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[11:56] * cccyRegeaneWolfe (~cccyRegea@210.23.18.203) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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[12:01] * Vulcano (~freenode@220.80-202-186.nextgentel.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[12:01] <ShorTie> y 4 you need so many subnets clever ??
[12:02] <Vulcano> can someone help me clean up a directory? I extracted a eggdrop to a wrong directory. Ill take screens of everything.
[12:02] <clever> ShorTie: it was temporary while switching things over
[12:02] <Stephini> gah 3/8 is to snug a hole to fit my button in and have it work but 1/2 is way to loose. >.<
[12:03] <SpeedEvil> In the future, subnets: Light, fridge, ...
[12:03] <ShorTie> rm -rf * works preaty good, BUT make sure you are in the right place !!!
[12:03] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[12:03] <SpeedEvil> Vulcano: work out how to get a text list of files. Convert it to a list you can feed to 'rm' with xargs
[12:03] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:04] <clever> zip or tar?
[12:04] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) Quit (Client Quit)
[12:04] <Vulcano> SpeedEvil, can u help me find out which files to delete? ill make u a screen of everything u need
[12:04] <clever> zip or tar?
[12:04] <Stephini> SpeedEvil couldn't the first part the list be accomplished simply with [ls >> textfile] ?
[12:05] <clever> Stephini: that will find every file that was there to begin with
[12:05] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:05] <SpeedEvil> Stephini: No - if you've extracted it to the wrong directory
[12:05] <clever> which he probly wants to keep
[12:05] <Stephini> clever extract to an empty folder. you get a clean list
[12:05] <SpeedEvil> tar -tzf whatever.tar.gz |xargs rm
[12:05] <SpeedEvil> (do not do that)
[12:05] <clever> to confirm things
[12:05] <clever> i always do xargs echo first
[12:06] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) Quit (Client Quit)
[12:06] <Stephini> if my idea of reextracting to an empty directory is a bad idea i'd genuinly want to know. :P cause that's how i'd do it and wouldn't want to if it's a bad idea. :P
[12:06] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[12:06] <Vulcano> SpeedEvil, so that command will delete everything that was extracted from that tar file?
[12:06] <clever> Stephini: tar -t would do the same thing
[12:07] <SpeedEvil> More or less.
[12:07] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:07] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) Quit (Client Quit)
[12:07] <Vulcano> http://gyazo.com/616390345cdc67caea2bed50cda12c10
[12:08] <Vulcano> can u please tell me more detailed. im really green on this linux
[12:08] <clever> there are so few, you can just delete them by hand
[12:08] <Stephini> clever so basically it's not that my idea is bad. just that there is a more efficient way to get the same result?
[12:08] <clever> Stephini: yeah
[12:09] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:09] <Vulcano> ok, tell me what command I use to remove then I will do it
[12:09] <clever> for example, rm eggInstaller
[12:09] <clever> Vulcano: use rm to delete files
[12:10] <Vulcano> can i use rm to delete folders too?
[12:10] * oxhak (~OxHaK@unaffiliated/oxhak) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:10] <clever> use rm -r to delete folders
[12:10] <Stephini> rm -R will clear a folder with contents i think rmdir if it's empty. no?
[12:10] <ShorTie> nop, need a -rf in there for folders
[12:10] <Stephini> or i guess just rm -r works.
[12:10] <clever> dont need -f for folders
[12:11] <clever> thats only if some nasty person left some read-only things in the way
[12:11] <ShorTie> ok.
[12:11] <Vulcano> ok ill give it a try and report back
[12:11] * Lausi (~Lingo@stud-140.sdu.dk) Quit (Quit: Be back later ...)
[12:12] <Stephini> hey what's the next fraction after 3/8 but before 1/2? 7/16 right?
[12:12] * WLL (~WLL@unaffiliated/wll) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:13] <ShorTie> depends on how acuarite you want
[12:13] <ShorTie> 16,32,64.....
[12:14] <Vulcano> ok guys ive cleaned up the worst. I installed Tcllib earlier, can I now remove all those tcl files in this pic? http://gyazo.com/17eb891f5354d2eda3086245968dc6f4
[12:15] <Stephini> ShorTie, just tryina get a button to fit it's new housing. 3/8 is apparently to snug. if i'm right and it's 7/16 then that sucks cause that's an 8 dollar(no shipping factored) drillbit.
[12:16] <ShorTie> take your calapiers and measure to get correct size needed
[12:16] <pksato> Vulcano: yes, can be deleted these files. But, you done some very wrong or not necessary procedure.
[12:17] * Armand (~armand@2a01:9cc0:40:6:2c0d:954f:ce94:44e0) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:17] <Vulcano> pksato, ?
[12:17] <Vulcano> what i do?
[12:18] <Vulcano> i only removed eggdrop stuff
[12:19] <Vulcano> can someone pls explain?
[12:20] <pksato> you want to remove tcllib? or delete source files?
[12:20] <Vulcano> im just asking if i can remove all those tcllib files without actually removing it
[12:20] <Vulcano> if u understand
[12:21] <Vulcano> i need the functionality, but can i delete those files?
[12:21] <pksato> files on pic can be removed. but it not uninstall tcllib.
[12:21] <Vulcano> so then I will remove all those tcllib files and still have the functionality
[12:21] <Vulcano> sorry if im a little slow
[12:22] <pksato> or tcl
[12:22] <Vulcano> ok
[12:22] <pksato> or other program/lib that installed using source.
[12:22] <Vulcano> ill give it a shot and report back
[12:22] <pksato> some have unistall procedure on Makefile, but not all.
[12:22] <Vulcano> give me a few mins
[12:22] <Vulcano> ok
[12:25] <Vulcano> http://gyazo.com/923b9a521134a32e9ce11993afd32889
[12:25] <Vulcano> pksato,
[12:25] <Vulcano> u think its tidy enough now?
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[12:30] <pksato> Is yours system, you do what you want.
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[12:34] <Vulcano> pksato, u from Pakistan man?
[12:35] * magsilva (~kvirc@189.26.79.142.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[12:36] <Tazmain> l/join #python
[12:36] <Tazmain> o.0
[12:36] <Iota> PYTHON?! Get him!
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[12:37] <Armand> What has python ever done for us?
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[12:47] <Tazmain> why the hate on python ?
[12:49] <Armand> Who said anything about hate? O_o
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[12:52] * darenasc (~darenasc@200-112-52-90.baf.movistar.cl) Quit (Quit: darenasc)
[12:52] <Tazmain> lol then why I am getting tackled then
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[12:56] <Armand> Gits & Shiggles..
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[13:06] <Stephini> It just occurred to me. I will never get murdered.
[13:07] <Stephini> Tazmain, // allows you to send a message that starts with / in all clients i have used.
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[13:14] <Armand> //what you say?
[13:14] <Armand> Hummm
[13:15] <Tazmain> I am lost why am I being told of // ?
[13:15] <shiftplusone> Tazmain, you're not, you're fine.
[13:15] <Stephini> Tazmain, i thought you were trying to tell someone to join python. misread the message.
[13:16] * shiftplusone fails at reading
[13:16] <shiftplusone> thought this was still about python >.>
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[13:18] <Stephini> hey shiftplusone do you know if ther exists an actually working and up to date guide on cross compiling for the pi that is compatible with ubuntu 14.04?
[13:20] <shiftplusone> there's no standard way to cross compile something that works for everything
[13:20] <shiftplusone> there are some... conventions... but... save your sanity. What are you compiling?
[13:20] <Stephini> current project is EmulationStation
[13:22] <ghard> Hi. What would be the optimal gcc flags for Pi 2 re. -march, -mtune, etc? I'm trying to define armv7 but getting a compiler error.
[13:22] <Stephini> Every guide I've tried to follow about setting up cross compiling has run into issues of packages not being available and the like.
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[14:01] <shiftplusone> Stephini, sorry, got distracted. Not familiar with emulationstation. Check if they have their own cross-compiling instructions. Otherwise, I tend to use this https://github.com/bmanojlovic/rpi-cross-compile
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[14:46] <Alina-malina> how realistic to mining bitcoins on raspberi pi solid cluster?
[14:46] * GreyHands (~~@unaffiliated/greyhands) has joined #raspberrypi
[14:46] <clever> youll probly get more per watt on a normal desktop video card
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[14:47] <Alina-malina> heh
[14:47] <shiftplusone> realistic... sure. In any way sensible? hell no.
[14:47] * MrMobius (~Joey@c-68-45-16-225.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[14:47] <ppq> mining bitcoins with raspis doesn't make sense, you will pay more for power than you get out of it in btc
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[14:47] <Alina-malina> hmmm
[14:48] <Alina-malina> so what is the advantage of clustering? where does people use rpi2 clustering to monetize it?
[14:49] <ppq> i don't think people use such a thing to make money at all. or if they do, there are better ways...
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[14:52] <Alina-malina> hmmm strange, i thought that people build rpi farms and monetize it somehow
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[14:52] <nefarious> built* couple of years ago, when the difficulty was lower
[14:53] <nefarious> when it was still profitable to GPU mine
[14:53] <Alina-malina> nefarious, how many rpis would be needed nowadays for mining couple of btc per month?
[14:53] * andre_m (~andre.mei@gw.landkreis.lueneburg.de) Quit ()
[14:53] <shiftplusone> it wasn't profitable even then
[14:53] <shiftplusone> it was just a 'because we can' demo thing.
[14:54] <Alina-malina> but still?
[14:54] <nefarious> shiftplusone, depends whether they were mining on the Pis or using ASICs, and just using the pi as a low power PC
[14:55] <shiftplusone> they were using those cheapish usb miners.... block... erupters?
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[14:55] <nefarious> yeah, they were called block eruptors
[14:56] <nefarious> erupters*
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[14:57] <nefarious> could have easily been profitable in the relatively early days with low power costs
[14:57] <overrider> I used to operate a LPD8806 led lightstrip via the rpi, but now it won't work anymore. I believe i have to load the spi_bcm2708 module but modprobe spi_bcm2708 says it cant insert. Something changed? I am on archlinux and ran pacman -Syu today
[14:58] <Alina-malina> well i was not asking about usb miners, i was talking about complete rpi with python code running on it to mine, also it will still be profitable to mine alter coins, so i need some start to calculate these things
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[15:01] <nefarious> that would be ridiculous, being honest
[15:01] * Voovode (~Alex@tenatena.static.otenet.gr) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[15:03] <Stephini> so i've only soldered 2x before and i'm getting ready to desolder a part from a atx mobo to then solder onto my pi. bloody scared. think it's enough or should i be terrified? :
[15:04] <Bilby> Alina-malina the biggest problem is that the processors on the Pi aren't optimized for that kind of mathematic calculation, so they're going to be very inefficient.
[15:04] <shiftplusone> Stephini, which part?
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[15:04] <Bilby> that
[15:04] <Stephini> i'm trying to get a jumper header so i can install a reset switch.
[15:04] <Alina-malina> Bilby, optipized you meen on hardware level? or software?
[15:04] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:04] <Alina-malina> mean*
[15:05] <Bilby> on a hardware level. The reason video card GPUs are generally used for mining is that their processors are designed to handle the type of floating-point operations necessary
[15:05] <shiftplusone> Alina-malina, people are being gentle when they use words like 'silly', 'inefficient' and 'ridiculous'. It's fine for educational purposes, but you won't make a cent from it.
[15:05] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@122.15.200.115) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[15:06] <nefarious> Bilby, they are not used so much any more
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[15:07] <overrider> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=675658#p675658 is the answer to my own question :-/
[15:07] * GreyHands (~~@unaffiliated/greyhands) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[15:08] <Stephini> man it takes a long time for a shack brand iron to heat up doesn't it?
[15:09] <Bilby> It's a delta of 400-600 degrees fereneheit, it takes a little time ;)
[15:09] * odin_ (~Odin@2a01:348:261:32:211:11ff:fe6b:2483) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[15:09] <Stephini> delta?
[15:10] <nefarious> ∆
[15:10] <Bilby> nefarious oh yes? I never really bought into the mining = profit idea; by the time it was established bitcoin wasn't going to just fall away overnight, there were already people spending $10k on hardware... and even now the market is pretty bloody volitile
[15:10] <Stephini> lolz i know what delta looks like i was wondering context.
[15:10] <Bilby> change in number? am i using that wrong?
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[15:10] <Stephini> ahh i doubt you are using it wrong. i'm notoriously bad at terminology.
[15:10] <nefarious> That's correct, yeah
[15:10] <Bilby> a triangular tract of sediment deposited at the mouth of a river, typically where it diverges into several outlets.
[15:10] <Bilby> nope, I'm using it right.
[15:11] <nefarious> Bilby, companies developed chips they could calculate faster and with many more parallel iterations as well
[15:11] <nefarious> that*
[15:12] <nefarious> Followed by massive difficulty spikes
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[15:14] <Bilby> right, the algorythem has upped because of the number of bitcoins mined already
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[15:14] <Bilby> TBH I think that other than giant shifty groups in asia and hobbyists, mining is about done
[15:14] <Bilby> ... just like in real life! *rimshot*
[15:14] <nefarious> Yep
[15:15] <Bilby> the market needs to stabilize and bitcoin banks need to be more transparent and secure
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[15:17] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:17] <ozzzy> bitcoins are for russian mobsters
[15:17] <tacoexe> @ERROR: max connections (8) reached -- try again later
[15:17] <tacoexe> rsync error:
[15:18] <tacoexe> possible to change sync server?
[15:18] <Stephini> i may be going insane. i swear 5 mins ago there was more radiated heat from the iron than when i checked just now.
[15:18] <Bilby> Stephini hold it near (NOT ON) your lips. Your lips are much more heat-sensitive than your hands
[15:18] * GreyHands (~GreyHands@unaffiliated/greyhands) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:18] * Cust0sL1men (~CustosLim@unaffiliated/cust0slim3n) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[15:19] <Bilby> I usually check to see if it's at-temp by tinning the head with a little soldier. If the solder readily flows onto the tip, it's hot enough
[15:19] <Stephini> the tin(that's how people use it right?) i left on it last time should turn to liquid when it's ready right?
[15:19] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:20] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[15:20] <IT_Sean> Goood morning.
[15:20] * crenn (~Crenn@203-219-254-61.static.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:21] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Excess Flood)
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[15:21] <Bilby> Stephini tinning = act of plating a material in solder material. If you have a significant amount of solder still on your pencil, it may, but often you need some flux on there to get things moving. put a little solder on the end and see if it flows
[15:21] <Bilby> morning IT_Sean
[15:22] <Bilby> tacoexe hmm. checked the man pages yet?
[15:22] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:23] <Bilby> tacoexe looks like there's a 'max connections' parameter --> http://linux.die.net/man/5/rsyncd.conf
[15:23] * GreyHands (~GreyHands@unaffiliated/greyhands) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
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[15:25] <tacoexe> Bilby: i actually pasted into the wrong channel. thanx tho
[15:26] <Bilby> ahaha
[15:26] <tacoexe> the sync server i use in gentoo has a que...
[15:26] <Bilby> no worries ;)
[15:26] <tacoexe> :p
[15:26] <tacoexe> my pi 2 should be here today
[15:26] <tacoexe> SO EXCITED
[15:26] * shum1 (~sdothum@207.112.100.227) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[15:26] <tacoexe> its my first pi...
[15:27] * IT_Sean intercepts tacoexe's mail, steals his Pi2
[15:27] <tacoexe> NO, THATS MY PI
[15:27] <tacoexe> :p
[15:27] <Stephini> Bilby thanx for the info. i'm guessing the flux that's in it like boils of the first time i melt it?
[15:27] <ozzzy> they could have put the reset header pins a BIT farther from the display connector
[15:28] <IT_Sean> tacoexe: Not anymore!
[15:28] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:28] <IT_Sean> Thanks, though. I didn't have one yet. :)
[15:28] * AnTi_MTtr (guest2842@unaffiliated/anti-mttr/x-9384728) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:29] * Bilby replaces tacoexe's stolen pi with a Raspberry Pi
[15:29] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:29] * IT_Sean gives tacoexe an old, 1st gen Model B, with the USB headers desoldered.
[15:29] <Bilby> Stephini most solder is called "flux core" because it has flux within it. flux helps clean the metal surface and then yes, typically it dissipates
[15:30] * O3zyPi (~ozzzy@unaffiliated/ozzzy) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:31] <Bilby> Stephini I sometimes wonder how anyone learned anything before the internet. Watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5Sb21qbpEQ bonus: vintage EEVblog intro
[15:32] <IT_Sean> Before the internet, we had these things called "books". They had information in them, stored in an analog format.
[15:32] <Bilby> haha
[15:32] <IT_Sean> They were not easily transmittable.
[15:32] <Bilby> not as good as watching an excitable australian nerd rant about bad electronics design :D
[15:33] <IT_Sean> and were, by modern standards, quite fragile. Easily damaged by excessive heat, or mositure.
[15:33] * Cust0sL1men (~CustosLim@unaffiliated/cust0slim3n) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:34] * wcypierre is now known as zz_wcypierre
[15:34] <ppq> they do survive ballistic transmissions, though. most modern storage technologies do not
[15:34] <Stephini> Bilby, it'd be easier if my local area had any kind of EE community. :P
[15:34] <Bilby> I feel your pain
[15:35] <Bilby> ppq as well as EM blasts
[15:35] <Bilby> Stephini You can ignore dave's ranting about solder pencils, fwiw. The basic plug-in pencil works fine for beginner use. I keepp one around
[15:35] <Stephini> IT_Sean, i get books and google this or that but there is somethign to be said for an interactive learning experience. finding someone with similar interests to answer questions and demonstrate things. that is where youtube and IRCs are so great. :P
[15:36] * fatalhalt (~fatalhalt@c-71-201-7-76.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[15:38] * GreyHands (~~@unaffiliated/greyhands) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[15:38] * saint-ron (~rons@bb219-74-71-79.singnet.com.sg) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[15:39] <Bilby> ... Dave! Sorry Stephini i didn't realize that entire video was just kvetching about tools lol
[15:39] <Bilby> Part 2 starts the actual tutorial *eyeroll* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYz5nIHH0iY
[15:41] <Stephini> i may just hafta give up till i can buy some new braid. i'm having no luck even wiggling the peice a little to try muscling it out.
[15:41] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
[15:41] <tacoexe> Stephini: irc helped alot of us on our paths
[15:41] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:42] <tacoexe> Stephini: having trouble removing some solder?
[15:44] <Stephini> tacoexe, trying to remove a male jumper header from my motherboard so i can install a reset switch in the pi. have no braid and no desoldering iron so i'm just trying to muscle it out. but it doesn't even seem to be melting even a little. i dunno maybe they use a tougher solder than my shack brand iron can handle.
[15:44] * bigx (~bigx@cam44-2-82-235-243-114.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[15:46] <tacoexe> do you have tinner and rosin?
[15:46] <Stephini> not sure what either of those are. currently for soldering gear i have the iron and a spool of solder.
[15:47] <tacoexe> noob mistake #1
[15:47] <Bilby> haha
[15:47] <tacoexe> put on your slippers and get on down to radio shack
[15:47] <Bilby> Stephini if you have to you can put a little solder on it to get the existing solder to flow, then remove
[15:47] <Stephini> if i had a car and more than 3 cents i totally would. :P
[15:47] <Bilby> how many pins on this header?
[15:47] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[15:47] <tacoexe> if you had tinner the heat from your tip will actually transfer into the solder
[15:47] <Stephini> 4 with a gap
[15:48] * Sonny_Jim (~pi@host86-135-228-210.range86-135.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:48] <Stephini> Bilby there was already solder on my tip from you telling me how to test it. :P
[15:48] <Bilby> right, but no flux
[15:49] <Bilby> clean the tip, and then put it on the pin you're removing for a second or two, and put a little solder there. it should flow the existing solder
[15:49] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) Quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
[15:49] <Stephini> ahh
[15:49] <Bilby> your problem is with no solder braid you'll have to get all 4 pins hot at the same time
[15:51] <Sonny_Jim> Use solder to heat the pin, not the tip
[15:51] <Sonny_Jim> So after cleaning the tip, put a little solder on there
[15:55] <Stephini> ok they moved your advice worked but then when they got flush they got stuck again and there is no pin to heat anymore.
[15:56] <Sonny_Jim> What are you trying to remove?
[15:56] <Stephini> male jumper header from an old motherboard to put on the pi to make a reset button.
[15:57] <Sonny_Jim> Just buy one from maplins
[15:57] <Sonny_Jim> Like 30p
[15:57] <Sonny_Jim> But anyway...
[15:57] <Stephini> -20c weather 3 year old no car and .03 USD. :P
[15:57] <Sonny_Jim> Do you have a desoldering pump or solder braid?
[15:57] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@125.32.134.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) Quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[15:58] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@125.32.134.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:58] <Stephini> no braid no pump thats why i was trying the muscle way.
[15:58] <Sonny_Jim> A pair of pliers?
[15:58] <Stephini> the pliers i was pulling with and a pair that have teeth no vice grips...i think they are in the shed.
[15:58] * cameronfr (~cameronfr@125.32.134.27.ap.yournet.ne.jp) Quit (Client Quit)
[15:59] <Sonny_Jim> like bilby ys, with no way to remove the solder, you'll have to heat all the pins up at once and pull it out with a pair of pliers
[15:59] * MY123 (~MY123@unaffiliated/kill--9-1/x-8776976) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:59] <Sonny_Jim> It's situations like these where you need three hands
[16:00] <Stephini> i had no trouble heating all 4 pins. it's just once they went flush i nolonger had any surface area of the pins to heat.
[16:00] <Bilby> Three hands ++
[16:00] * digen (~digen@unaffiliated/digen) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:01] <Stephini> well atleast i can say i am pretty sure i'm better at soldering after that little endevor. one step closer to applying the reset jumper to my pi without frying it like i did the xbox tranceiver.
[16:01] <Bilby> sad lol
[16:02] * fatalhalt (~fatalhalt@c-71-201-7-76.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:02] <Stephini> ?
[16:03] <Bilby> lol because you're making progress, sad lol because you killed things :)
[16:04] * SiC (~Simon@193.37.225.144) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:06] <Stephini> yeah. pretty sure the issue was my beads were to big so it shorted. i could possibly have just gotten the diode backwords so voltage couldn't flow.
[16:08] * Xano (~bart@092-111-222-050.static.chello.nl) Quit (Quit: Xano)
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[16:09] <Bilby> that's a super-common beginner thing
[16:10] <Bilby> groups like 4-H, Scouts have lost a lot of relevency, I think this is how they could get it back. Have a hackerspace start a Boy Scout / Girl Scout troop there
[16:13] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
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[16:19] <mortal> are pi b cases compatible with pi2
[16:19] <mortal> https://www.modmypi.com/one-nine-design-pi-case-white-model-b-plus?filter_name=pi%202%20case
[16:19] <mortal> like if I get this one will it work
[16:20] * krelo (~krelo@dsl3-209.uninet.ee) Quit (Quit: ZZZzzz…)
[16:20] <Bilby> Generally they are
[16:20] <Bilby> B+ cases
[16:20] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:20] <Bilby> iirc some of the very low-profile cases won't because of the extra chips ?
[16:21] <shiftplusone> mortal, look on the right, in the 'notes' section
[16:21] * darkbasic (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:21] <theugster> I swapped the case from my B+ to the 2 with no issue at all
[16:21] * doerteGone is now known as doerteDev
[16:21] <theugster> It was a generic black case I got at Microcenter
[16:22] <Bilby> I should probably get a case. I have a server sitting as a bare board with a towel over it to block the LEDs. Probably not the best for long-term stability lol
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[16:24] <ozzzy> Bilby, put it back in the box it came in
[16:24] <nefarious> Can't you turn some of the LEDs off?
[16:24] <nefarious> I'm sure I stumbled across something
[16:25] * amigojapan (~amigojapa@c119045.net21845.cablenet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:25] * darkbasic_ (~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:26] <Bilby> ozzzy that's what i do sometimes haha
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[16:27] * darkbasic (~quassel@host37-245-static.119-2-b.business.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:27] <Bilby> nefarious I have no idea... I have the wolfrum board on it right now too, and that has its own lights
[16:27] <theugster> Take a pair of needlenose pliers and rip the LEDs off! ;)
[16:28] <ozzzy> put some standoffs on the board.... punch some holes in the box... put it back in the box
[16:28] <ozzzy> instant case
[16:28] <Bilby> hahaha
[16:28] <CoJaBo> mine lives in an empty box of roofing nails
[16:29] <CoJaBo> perfect spies
[16:29] <CoJaBo> size
[16:29] <DMackey> sounds like you nailed the case
[16:29] <CoJaBo> =D
[16:29] <Bilby> HEYOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
[16:29] <DMackey> lol I just had to
[16:29] <CoJaBo> Really hammered that pun.
[16:29] * Datalink (Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:30] <DMackey> I'm sitting here repairing a bad CPU capacitor Mobo out of an HP. Caps puffed up and blown out
[16:30] <DMackey> 6.3v 1800uf
[16:30] * botnut (~kernel_st@162-233-77-128.lightspeed.miamfl.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[16:30] <Bilby> that's some dedicated nerdery DMackey
[16:31] <DMackey> I've fixed a few.
[16:31] <DMackey> One is an emachine, I use it in my garage.
[16:31] <CoJaBo> i have enough Mobius i just toss em when they leak
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[16:31] <DMackey> $6 to fix WELL worth
[16:31] <CoJaBo> mono s
[16:32] <DMackey> I have a lot of old ones, nothing real useful so I fix what I can when people give them to me IF they are worth fixing
[16:32] <CoJaBo> they're ancient enough they probably ain't worth sex bucks
[16:32] <DMackey> I meant, thats what it cost me for the capacitors
[16:32] <DMackey> it was a 2.2ghz machine
[16:33] <CoJaBo> the last thing i repaved caps on was the TV
[16:33] <DMackey> the ones for the HP here, I think about $3
[16:33] <DMackey> damn, Never did a TV yet.
[16:33] <CoJaBo> $7 in parts at radio shag prices
[16:33] <DMackey> Maybe one day and Arcade machine monitor but not a TV
[16:33] <Stephini> Bilby, when i get better and my daugther joins the scouts i was going to see if the troop would let me teach my limited EE skills.
[16:33] <CoJaBo> the manufacturer wanted $900 for the repair
[16:33] <DMackey> worth a try
[16:34] <DMackey> Stephini
[16:34] <DMackey> Screw the manufacturer, Thats what is soldering iron rangers are for
[16:34] <Stephini> maybe do some beginner programming and shit too.
[16:34] <Bilby> DMackey makes sense to me
[16:35] <CoJaBo> its a rear-projection crt
[16:35] <DMackey> I need to get my RPi back online, I did one of those TOR Wifi Access points from Hackaday or was it adafruit
[16:35] <CoJaBo> still works to this day
[16:35] <Bilby> Stephini not a bad place to start, and hey, you're only a couple steps ahead of them anyhow ;)
[16:35] <DMackey> Nice, well worth your effort for sure
[16:35] <DMackey> Stephini, Learn by doing/teaching
[16:35] * CoJaBo fixed that thong half a dozen times lol
[16:35] <DMackey> I leran more when I try to explain to someone what I've done.
[16:36] <CoJaBo> its down to one working input tho :/
[16:36] <DMackey> ColaBo, well maybe the 6th time is a charm
[16:36] * tegila (~tegila@189.15.66.78) Quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
[16:36] <DMackey> Damn, I can't type this morning
[16:36] <Bilby> DMackey that's absolutely the truth. You learn a lot when you try to teach someone something because they're going to ask a bunch of questions you may not be able to answer lol
[16:37] <Stephini> if i could get each girl in the troup a pi and some of the doodads for projects with them i think that could be really cool. is there any group that helps get free pis to educational groups or would i need to seek a local investor?
[16:37] <Bilby> local is better :)
[16:37] <CoJaBo> its gonna suck when it totally dies tho. i don't want to move the thing ever assassin
[16:37] <CoJaBo> again
[16:38] <Bilby> Pi's are neat, but dpeending on age maybe start with some of those little project kits
[16:38] <DMackey> Well you made it last MUCH longer than any one else would have
[16:38] <DMackey> Five Million Sold! http://www.raspberrypi.org/five-million-sold/
[16:38] <Bilby> I think Pis are better for middle school and up where kids can focus a bit more and maybe want their own computer
[16:38] <CoJaBo> "FOR SALE: House. Appliances and TV included."
[16:39] <DMackey> ROFL
[16:39] * EastLight (~n@90.202.90.115) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:39] <Stephini> Bilby i was kinda thinking at say 5 do basic soldering kits (i saw a group on youtube who use a pizza box to make an operation like game) then like a year after that some programming then maybe a year after that get them each pis to bring all that together. :P
[16:39] <Bilby> sure maybe. talk to parents, talk to leaders, see what other people have done. learn from others' mistakes :D
[16:39] <CoJaBo> DMackey: i saw one in a third-story apartment once. HOW?!
[16:40] <Stephini> lolz bilby my 7 year old has a tablet and a chromebook from school. :P things are different than when we were kids.
[16:40] <CoJaBo> you'd need a fricking crane
[16:40] <Bilby> aaaaand I feel old X|
[16:40] <Stephini> older than me? (30 in june)
[16:40] <Bilby> CoJaBo / DMackey rear projection unit or an HD CRT?
[16:41] <Bilby> 32 in October. Roll me in a ditch.
[16:41] <CoJaBo> rear-projection crt; it is HD
[16:41] <Stephini> i so often feel like the old lady complaining about her lawn. "when i was your age we didn't get computers from the school heck we only got to use them during one class each day and they were so big they took up an entire table"
[16:41] <Bilby> err... so it's a CRT? lol. Yeah those bad boys are heeeeavy
[16:41] <CoJaBo> Stephini: GERROFF MYYY LAN
[16:42] <Bilby> I'm taking my token ring and I'm going home!
[16:42] <Stephini> CoJaBo, exactly
[16:42] <CoJaBo> Bilby: Rear projection one. It has three CRTs.
[16:42] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff) has left #raspberrypi
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[16:42] <IT_Sean> oops
[16:42] <Stephini> lolz did you /hop?
[16:42] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[16:43] <IT_Sean> I did a /buffer close instead of a /buffer clear. WHEE!
[16:43] * Datalink_ (Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:43] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:44] <Bilby> CoJaBo I'm pretty sure none of the CRT projectors were better than 480i
[16:44] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@177.70.157.8) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:45] <CoJaBo> They made lots of em
[16:45] <CoJaBo> Most were 1080i
[16:45] * krnlyng (~liar@83.175.90.24) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[16:46] * HeroYoojin (~heroyooji@71-91-74-243.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:46] <Bilby> Man, I never saw one. Interesting.
[16:49] <Sonny_Jim> The whole "Digital TVs are amazing and CRTs are crap" was mostly lies, with the except of contrast
[16:49] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@177.70.157.8) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[16:49] <Stephini> oo went back to the project and i was able to pull the header free of the pins. didn't expect that. now that i know they aren't locked together some how i can just try to get out one pin at a time. then rethread them and to the soldering.
[16:49] * ttosi (~ttosi@c-24-21-135-194.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:49] <Sonny_Jim> Most LCD panels have much better contrast than CRT, but apart from that they aren't that far apart technically
[16:49] <Bilby> Stephini niiice
[16:50] <Sonny_Jim> (in terms of specs)
[16:50] <Stephini> Sonny_Jim, isn't there also the massive weight of crt technology that blows chunks? :P
[16:50] <Sonny_Jim> Well, depen
[16:50] <Sonny_Jim> *depends
[16:50] <Sonny_Jim> I don't carry a CRT around with me ;-)
[16:50] <Bilby> Sonny_Jim I would say that the best CRTs were on-par with the best LCDs
[16:50] <Bilby> but an avarage LCD was better than an avarage CRT
[16:50] <Sonny_Jim> The thing that got me was digital TV signals vs analogue
[16:50] <Stephini> i can lift my 40 inch tv with a couple fingers and a thumb. it takes a real exertian to move my 25 crt.
[16:51] <Sonny_Jim> I had my friends with their shiny new digi-boxes going "Look, it's so much better" when in 90% of cases it actually looked worse due to compression artifacts
[16:51] <Bilby> I had a sony trinitron computer monitor and a trinitron tv, they were awesome
[16:51] <Bilby> and especially for video games designed to play on tube TVs or with SD I think they look better
[16:52] <Stephini> also figured out why they got stuck when the iron was no longer touching the pins. apparently the space between board and pin is loose enough for some of the solder i used to bleed through and harden on the farside fo the board. :P
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[16:53] <Sonny_Jim> Stephini: Yes, there's a copper 'sleeve' that connects the two sides the board
[16:53] <thescatman_> I think you guys are missing out the big issue with CRTs
[16:53] <thescatman_> SQUEEEEEEEEE
[16:53] <Sonny_Jim> Flyback noise?
[16:54] <Sonny_Jim> Clean all the dust off the back of the tube to stop the corona
[16:54] <Stephini> Sonny_Jim, the lesson was more that solder is way less viscous then i thought it was. With how snug it is I had no idea it could flow through there. I know water can't get through a gap that small.
[16:54] <thescatman_> yus
[16:54] <Stephini> thescatman_, yes i cat even walk through the hall near my daughter's room when she has her crt tv on.
[16:55] <thescatman_> it gives me a migraine within minutes
[16:55] <Stephini> even brand new CRTs give me headaches
[16:55] <quantumfoam> HA
[16:55] <quantumfoam> I got motion working
[16:55] <Stephini> and then there is the weird fact that unlike LCDs. the mute on CRTs isn't silent. you can still hear the program it's just reduced to like 5 volume units.
[16:55] <quantumfoam> mjpg looks like crap
[16:55] <quantumfoam> but it works!
[16:57] <Stephini> hey how exactly do you put a heatsynk on the pi? i have 2 heatsinks i salvaged off of this mobo but it's not like there are mounting holes or anything.
[16:57] <Bilby> Stephini audio control is going to be a function of the logic board in the TV. I've never had that experience, and wouldn't expect to
[16:58] <thescatman_> Stephini: thermal paste?
[16:58] <thescatman_> if you've got any
[16:58] <Sonny_Jim> Don't bother
[16:58] <Stephini> Bilby every single CRT i've ever been near when muted gave that.
[16:58] <Bilby> Stephini you put them on a shelf next to the pi, and say "Man, i'm glad i didn't waste any time putting heat sinks on this device which definitely doesn't need them"
[16:58] <Sonny_Jim> ^
[16:58] <thescatman_> They helped with temps on my pi...
[16:58] <Sonny_Jim> I can only echo Bilbys comment, the Pi does not need a heatsink
[16:58] <Stephini> Bilby, so if you overclock there is no heat concerns atall?
[16:58] <Sonny_Jim> Not for me
[16:59] <theugster> What if he's overclocking to 5GHz? You guys and your assumptions!
[16:59] <Bilby> Mine is overclocked all the way, covered with a tea towel, and has been running for 1+ week with no heat problems
[16:59] <Bilby> theugster then hopefully he's running a liquid nitrogen build :P
[16:59] <thescatman_> I had it at 1.3/1.4, heatsinks dropped the temps around 15-20c iirc
[16:59] <theugster> Indeed!
[16:59] <Sonny_Jim> The Pi will be fine all the way up to 85c
[16:59] <thescatman_> Am actually attempting to make the equivalent of an ln2 pot for the pi 2 atm
[17:00] <Stephini> Bilby, doesn't heat also matter based on what your doing? i mean just because you overclock to a cirtain setting doesn't mean it runs at that setting. that's just the new cap. right?
[17:00] <Bilby> thescatman_ unless the pi is outside normal living environment, the temp drop isn't needed
[17:00] <theugster> Stephini: Arctic Silver (and others I'm sure) sell a thermal paste/adhesive for such things
[17:00] <thescatman_> if they're lying around though, what's the harm?
[17:00] <Sonny_Jim> I mean, it's your Pi, do what you want. But I'm telling you a heatsink is completely uneeded
[17:00] <thescatman_> I mean if it drops it from 90c to 70 that's enough, it got bloody hot at 1.5
[17:01] <Sonny_Jim> thescatman_: Have you ever seen your Pi go over 70c though?
[17:01] <thescatman_> yes...
[17:01] * r3dsm0k3 (~r3dsm0k3@106.51.133.164) Quit (Quit: r3dsm0k3)
[17:01] <Sonny_Jim> I'm impressed
[17:01] * darenasc (~darenasc@mail.formulisa.cl) Quit (Quit: darenasc)
[17:01] <thescatman_> I liked to oc it - it's a £30 computer, why not
[17:01] <thescatman_> this was over a year ago though
[17:04] <Bilby> Stephini that's true. This pi is running a lamp server with a fairly chunky database that I'm doing builds on. So moderate use, say.
[17:04] * nefarious (~nef@unaffiliated/nefarious) Quit (Quit: farewell.)
[17:05] <Sonny_Jim> I run my pi at full overclock, in a case, compiling MAME for 4 days solid
[17:05] <Sonny_Jim> Temp is currently at;
[17:06] <Sonny_Jim> 57c
[17:06] * Delboy (~openwrt@183-75.dsl.iskon.hr) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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[17:07] <heller\> can someone help me with i2c?
[17:08] <heller\> im trying to make this clear for me
[17:09] <heller\> http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/22088c.pdf page 18
[17:10] <thescatman_> Sonny_Jim: what overclock?
[17:11] * fatalhalt (~fatalhalt@c-71-201-7-76.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: fatal halt)
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[17:12] <Sonny_Jim> What ever the turbo settings are
[17:13] <MY123> Sonny_Jim: 1,5GHz at 2,1V VCore here. 81 degrees
[17:13] <Stephini> hey can anyone recomend a good set of head mounted magnifying lenses?
[17:14] <Stephini> inexpensive would be nice too
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[17:16] <Bilby> Sorry... I wear glasses. I have a little lens on my claw arm thing, i've had larger ones too
[17:17] <Bilby> my favorite was the one on a boom arm with a light. very handy.
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[17:19] <Stephini> woot! i have a working reset switch. now i just need to solder it in...later...when my eyes aren't fuzzy and crossed from focusing to close to my face.
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[17:20] <Stephini> for now it's being tensioned in from the bit of solder left on the bottom of the pins and the header plastic on top.
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[17:23] <Stephini> erm. why would a safe shutdown switch need resistors and breadboard to make work? shouldn't a button wired to a gpio pin and current be able to trigger a shutdown script?
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[17:27] <Bilby> I would imagine so... +3.3v to a pin set to Input. What diagram are you working from?
[17:28] <Stephini> hrm he seems to be saying that doing it the way i was thinking would cause to much interference. http://www.raspberry-pi-geek.com/Archive/2013/01/Adding-an-On-Off-switch-to-your-Raspberry-Pi
[17:28] <Bilby> You probably want something to pull the pin low, just initialize the pin with the internal pull-down resistor
[17:28] <pksato> ohh... five million of rpies eating electrons...
[17:29] <Stephini> ... please remember i'm both a pi newb and an ee newb. huhwah? how would i use an internal pulldown?
[17:29] <Bilby> are you building the shutdown swithc or the reset swithc?
[17:29] <Stephini> already did reset now i'm doing shutdown
[17:29] <Bilby> yep, problem is float
[17:30] <Bilby> when you have a logic input pin, it's looking for one of two states - HIGH or LOW
[17:30] <Stephini> k he said the fix was a pulldown you said there is a pulldown on the board that can be used. so i just need to know how to use that and i should be good aslong as i dont set output as he says. right?
[17:31] <Bilby> Yes - look here - http://elinux.org/RPi_Low-level_peripherals#Internal_Pull-Ups_.26_Pull-Downs
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[17:33] <heller\> can someone help me to read MCP3424 via i2c?
[17:33] <Stephini> ahh so it's done in the scripting?
[17:34] <Bilby> yep :)
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[17:34] <Stephini> so i'm guessing that means i dont need to plan for a specific pin then?
[17:35] <Bilby> Doesn't look like it.
[17:35] <Bilby> are you using python?
[17:35] * thescatman_ (0541ebdd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.5.65.235.221) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[17:35] <pksato> heller\: I can not. But, show us more details about you question.
[17:36] <Stephini> i haven't delved into that yet. sofar all i've done in GPIO is plug in an lcd to test it and plug in a pc speaker to try out a keyboard bash script i found.
[17:36] * UKn0Me (~UKn0Me@CPE-121-215-1-28.lnse1.pie.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
[17:36] <Stephini> led*
[17:36] <Tachyon`> anyone know of a UK Pi B2 supplier with sstock for delivery quickly?
[17:36] <heller\> pksato: i want to read MCP3424 ADC with raspberry
[17:37] <heller\> pksato: you got the pdf? sector 5.2 shows some registers
[17:37] <Bilby> Ah, okay. if you're using python, when you set up the GPIO you do this -- GPIO.setup(channel, GPIO.IN, pull_up_down=GPIO.PUD_DOWN)
[17:37] <Bilby> and it sets an internal pull-down resistor
[17:37] * Noldorin (~noldorin@unaffiliated/noldorin) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:38] <Tachyon`> CPC don't say if they have stock or not
[17:38] * Tachyon` growls
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[17:38] <heller\> pksato: or lets go with easier one first http://www.robot-electronics.co.uk/htm/srf08tech.shtml and http://www.instructables.com/id/Raspberry-Pi-I2C-Python/step6/SRF08-Range-Sensor/
[17:39] <Stephini> Bilby, are you limited to how many pins you can do that for?
[17:39] <heller\> according to the srf08 datasheet, it says "ranging mode - result in cm" is decimal: 81 or hex 0x51
[17:39] <Bilby> It doesn't look like it
[17:39] <heller\> on the code, it says "light = bus.read_byte_data(address, 1)"
[17:39] <heller\> where does the 1 come from on the code?
[17:40] <Stephini> oh spiffy. are there any pins i need to set aside for latch and clock for my NES ports? if not then i guess i'll just use whatever pin is next. :P
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[17:41] <Bilby> Not sure on that... just use a pin that has no other function :P
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[17:48] <day> wuhu reichelt shipped my raspberry :3
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[17:49] <Sonny_Jim> You can use pretty much whatever pin you like Stephini, as long as it's GPIO
[17:50] <Sonny_Jim> BTW GordonDrogon has some example code in wiringPi for reading NES joysticks
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[17:50] <Sonny_Jim> https://projects.drogon.net/nes-controller-on-the-raspberry-pi/
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[17:53] <Stephini> ahh i've been on this site before. his diagram makes NO sense to me at all.
[17:53] <Sonny_Jim> Which one?
[17:53] * WLL (~WLL@unaffiliated/wll) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[17:53] <Sonny_Jim> You mean this one?
[17:53] <Stephini> well like the first one for sure is like "wha?"
[17:53] <Sonny_Jim> https://projects.drogon.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/nes-controller-schematic.png
[17:53] <Sonny_Jim> That's because it's a diagram of the internals of the NES controller
[17:53] <Sonny_Jim> Not how you should hook it up
[17:54] <Sonny_Jim> It's there so you can understand how the controller works
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[17:55] <Stephini> i'm guessing those Ts represent the physical buttons then? the left is common ground and the right is where signals cross output on the chip to be turned into a serial signal?
[17:55] <Sonny_Jim> Sure
[17:56] <Sonny_Jim> But in your case you can pretty much ignore it apart from the bit that tells you what colour wire does what
[17:56] <Stephini> to me a diagram showing the actual layout of the circuit makes so much more sense than this flowchart stuff.
[17:56] <Sonny_Jim> ha
[17:56] <Sonny_Jim> It's a schematic
[17:56] <Sonny_Jim> Learn how to read schematics and you'll say the opposite
[17:57] <Sonny_Jim> And it *is* a layout of the circuit, not a flowchart
[17:58] <Stephini> it's more like a flowchart. it's more theoretical like a flowchart. if i have the PCB in front of me it makes sense. but this has all the lines made "orderly" in a way that hurts my head.
[17:59] * djhworld (~djhworld@gatek.mh.bbc.co.uk) Quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[17:59] <Stephini> hrm i swear i backspaced those first 2 sentences revisionally.
[17:59] <Sonny_Jim> Like I said, once you understand what the symbols mean, it's much easier to read that looking at a PCB
[17:59] <Sonny_Jim> *than
[18:00] <Sonny_Jim> Oh the other thing about that NES code is that it doesn't actually interface with the standard Linux joystick driver AFAICS
[18:01] <Sonny_Jim> It'll print something out when you press a button but that's about it
[18:01] <Stephini> ahh so i need to tweak his code to act as either keyboard or joystick.
[18:01] <Sonny_Jim> Well, I'd just use someone elses that does interface with the joystick driver
[18:02] <Sonny_Jim> Like the RetroPie one
[18:02] <Stephini> that'll work as long as the retropie one doens't only work for the retropie adapter chip.
[18:03] <Sonny_Jim> git.drogon.net/wiringPi
[18:03] <Sonny_Jim> Erk wrong link
[18:03] <Sonny_Jim> The chip is only a buffer on the RetroPie
[18:03] <Sonny_Jim> https://github.com/petrockblog/SNESDev-RPi
[18:03] <Sonny_Jim> It'll work fine without it as long as you use the same GPIO pins
[18:04] <Sonny_Jim> Also, a NES controller is exactly the same as a SNES controller, just that it has less buttons
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[18:04] <Sonny_Jim> I've not tried it but I'm 99% sure you could plug a NES controller into a SNES and it would work
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[18:06] <Stephini> from what i understand you are right. i know it's been done the other way around. there are guides to modify the "more comfortable" snes up to the nes by removing the plug end of each.
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[18:07] <Sonny_Jim> tbh I'm surprised Gordons code doesn't interface with the Linux joystick driver
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[18:08] <Stephini> sort of like how DB9 controllers are universal. Gen able to control atari and the like. although they used parralelle so there was a limit with 9 pins. :P
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[18:08] <Stephini> oh hey can i put the latch and clock wire for both controllers on the same pin you think?
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[18:12] <Sonny_Jim> No
[18:12] <Sonny_Jim> Err wait, let me remember how they work again
[18:12] <Sonny_Jim> From memory, the clock can be the same, the latch and data will be different
[18:14] <Sonny_Jim> Nope, sorry. Clock and latch can be the same pin, you need a separate data pin for 2 controllers
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[18:16] <Sonny_Jim> Erk, let me say that a little bit clearer
[18:16] <Sonny_Jim> You'll need one pin for clock, one pin for latch, then a pin for data for each controller
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[18:17] <Sonny_Jim> Sending a latch signal to the controllers tells the 4021 to 'freeze' the input so it can't be changed whilst it's being read
[18:17] <Sonny_Jim> Then you pulse the clock line to the controllers which make them send out data to the data pin
[18:18] <Sonny_Jim> so latch/clock are outputs from the Pi to the controllers, data is input to the Pi from the controllers
[18:18] * djsxxx is now known as djsxxx_away
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[18:19] <Stephini> k that's kinda how i figured it was. minus the freeze and pulse thing. although now that you've said that it makes so much sense.
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[18:31] <cehteh> mhm anyone of you has a ffmpeg spell to reencode something for the rpi?
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[18:33] <thyrth> o/
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[18:33] <thyrth> hello
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[18:34] <thyrth> hi was looking for good OS's for Pi B+ ?
[18:36] <djazz> raspbian
[18:37] <thyrth> Yeah ? hows the desktop envorments?
[18:38] <Tachyon`> xfce
[18:38] <Tachyon`> although you can probably install others
[18:38] * Tachyon` uses xfce on everything so didn't
[18:38] <Sonny_Jim> It all depends on what you wat to use the Pi for
[18:38] <thyrth> Oh? What about i3 or openbox?
[18:38] <djazz> lxde is default on rawpbian
[18:38] <Sonny_Jim> If you don't need a GUI and want a nice stripped down distribution, then I think Arch is probably the best
[18:38] <djazz> raspbian*
[18:39] <Sonny_Jim> If you want to watch videos then the xbmc one
[18:39] <Sonny_Jim> For everything else, there's Raspbian ;-)
[18:39] <thyrth> Is there a good Arch youtube tutorail for Rasberry Pi?
[18:39] <djazz> openelec for media centre (xbmc/kodi)
[18:39] <Sonny_Jim> Ah yeah, forgot about openelec
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[18:40] <ozzzy> http://ozzzy.dyndns.org/images/new_pi_case.jpg <--- nice little cases
[18:40] <Stephini> i've always thought it was odd that there would be linux users who bash how terrible the windows interface is but then use the most windows like desktop environments like kde and xfce.
[18:40] <Sonny_Jim> BTW, the OS is GNU, the kernel is Linux. Raspbian/Openelec/Arch are all *distributions*
[18:40] <Sonny_Jim> /pedant mode off
[18:40] <djazz> thyrth: well.. arch for pi comes preinstalled
[18:40] <djazz> Sonny_Jim: :D
[18:41] * zz_wcypierre is now known as wcypierre
[18:41] <PrinceProspero> Sonny_Jim: t: 5,6]
[18:41] <PrinceProspero> [#raspberrypi]
[18:41] <thyrth> does it? cause I never used the Noobs SD cause I bought my own SD
[18:41] <PrinceProspero> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktta8hbJ-UY
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[18:41] <PrinceProspero> That's a quick tutorial to Arch Linux on the raspi
[18:42] <djazz> flashing arch is way different than other distros for pi
[18:42] <djazz> openelec has its own very nice easy installer
[18:42] <thyrth> Oh?
[18:43] <Sonny_Jim> I think the general consensus is if you don't have any particular preference, start with Rasbian as it's the most supported
[18:43] <djazz> idk about noobs.. only used it one short time
[18:43] <thyrth> I really Want to learn Arch
[18:43] <djazz> all my pi's run arch
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[18:44] <thyrth> hows it running djazz are you running it now ?
[18:44] <djazz> thyrth: you inow, arch for arm isnt official arch
[18:44] <djazz> yes
[18:44] <djazz> know*
[18:44] <thyrth> Yeah I know its not Offical arch ah ah
[18:45] <djazz> i love aur and pacman
[18:45] <djazz> systemd is great too
[18:45] <djazz> boots very fast compared to raspbian
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[18:46] <thyrth> Is there a written tutorail I can follow? for Setting one up?
[18:46] * cave (~various@h081217074129.dyn.cm.kabsi.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:46] <djazz> thyrth: the one on archlinuxarm site is great
[18:46] <djazz> also read their FAQ
[18:48] <thyrth> Link me to there Tutorial ?
[18:48] <djazz> http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv6/raspberry-pi
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[18:50] <thyrth> anything I should before I start djazz ?
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[18:52] <McBride36> i did the arch installation through noobs with my pi hooked up to the internet, seemed fairly straightforward
[18:52] <ShorTie> for curiousity is this a rpiA/B or a rpi2 if you don't mind me asking ??
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[18:52] <djazz> arch is not available for rpi2 yet i think
[18:52] <ShorTie> ok, that is what i was wondering i guess
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[18:53] <djazz> the arch team has no rpi2 devicws yet i think
[18:53] <thyrth> yeah? I did Noobs It was not in Noobs Any more I had to go to the site to get it
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[19:22] <thyrth> djazzz I'm updateing it now what are the steps to get to the gui?
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[19:27] <MY123> djazz: It is officially supported.
[19:27] <MY123> archlinuxarm.org
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[19:29] <thyrth> I'm setting up Arch and I just updated the system by Pacman -Syu what should I do next?
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[19:34] <djazz> MY123: k, i will try it out soon :)
[19:35] <Stephini> ok so it turns out i improperly drilled my mounting board when i tried drawing dots at the holes. how stupid would it be to just drill with the pi on the mounting board?
[19:35] <djazz> thyrth: create a user and install/set up sudo
[19:35] <thyrth> Oko I'll come back when I'm done djazz thanks for helping me out
[19:39] <xxValiumxx> anyone familiar with japanese keyboards?
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[19:42] <thyrth> djazz I can't eddit Visudo ?
[19:42] <thyrth> its a read only
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[19:44] <McBride36> i had that problem
[19:44] <McBride36> you need to remount root
[19:44] <McBride36> thyrth ^
[19:45] <thyrth> How does oen remount root?
[19:45] <thyrth> one
[19:45] <McBride36> wait, are you running it as root?
[19:46] <thyrth> Yeah I am it says I can't change visudo
[19:46] <thyrth> which is weird right?
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[19:47] <McBride36> thyrth, try running mount -o remount,rw /
[19:47] <McBride36> and then try to edit it
[19:47] <thyrth> ok I'll be back if it doesn't ah ah
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[19:48] <Stephini> I can't be the only person who is sick of Adobe Flash can I?
[19:49] <xxValiumxx> Stephini I didnt even know it still existed
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[19:50] <djazz> thyrth: if you know how to use vi, editing shouldnt be too hard
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[19:50] <djazz> or you can do EDITOR=nano visudo
[19:50] <McBride36> djazz, he coudln't even open it i think
[19:50] <Stephini> It's still used by the vast majority of video sites.beyond that i'm not sure but i bet it's still common.
[19:50] <djazz> oh xD
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[19:51] <Stephini> Flash NEEDS to go the way of real player.
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[19:57] <bynarie> u guys think the pi b power supply would work with pi 2?
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[19:57] <Guma> I was wondering if anyone here is using QML on rPI? I am trying to build 5.4.1 from git and I have mtdev installed but ./configure if not picking it. Any suggestions?
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[19:57] <Guma> I am trying to run QML with EGLFS in full screen with multitouch.
[19:58] * MY123 (~MY123@unaffiliated/kill--9-1/x-8776976) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[19:59] <Sonny_Jim> bynarie: I don't see why not, it's the same plug
[19:59] * simiuskong (~simiuskon@2a01:348:99:158:255:215:77:1) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:59] <Sonny_Jim> Guma: I would try asking in the QML channel if it has one
[19:59] <bynarie> Sonny_Jim, i was thinkin the same thing but didnt know about the amps or volatages being different
[20:00] <bynarie> thanks
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[20:03] <Stephini> power supply?
[20:03] <Bilby> np: I Ran (So Far Away) (A Flock Of Seagulls)
[20:03] <Bilby> every time i hear this song I want to 80s dance
[20:03] <heller\> anyone had any current sensor with rpi?
[20:03] <Stephini> I think of GTA
[20:03] <heller\> is acs712 way to go or?
[20:03] <SpeedEvil> heller\: what to sense?
[20:04] <heller\> current
[20:04] * bynarie (znc-admin@unaffiliated/bynarie) Quit (Client Quit)
[20:04] <SpeedEvil> heller\: A fairly sensitive weight balance is needed to detect currants.
[20:04] <SpeedEvil> Or raisens.
[20:04] <heller\> less than 5A
[20:04] * bynarie (bynarie@unaffiliated/bynarie) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:04] <heller\> so acs712-5 would be okay, if nothing better comes to mind
[20:05] <SpeedEvil> heller\: Well - it depends - do you need isolation?
[20:05] <Stephini> hey would it be possible to rig up an "HDD" light using GPIO?
[20:05] <SpeedEvil> And what's the acceptable burden voltage
[20:05] * PrinceProspero (PrincePros@gateway/shell/bnc4free/x-flufssaqqyfmhwsv) Quit (Write error: Connection reset by peer)
[20:05] <heller\> SpeedEvil: not really
[20:05] <heller\> it will be for measuring solar panel/battery
[20:06] <bynarie> what OS is everyone running on their pi 2? im using raspbian
[20:06] <SpeedEvil> TI has some quite nice integrated charge monitors that are intended for batteries thatmay be of use
[20:06] <SpeedEvil> integrating
[20:06] <e^ipi> Stephini: be pretty easy i suspect, just need a userspace thing that reads harddrive stats
[20:06] <e^ipi> or go all out and make it a kernel module
[20:06] <e^ipi> kernel programming isn’t hard people are just wusses
[20:06] * Sonny_Jim grumbles somethign about Raspbian not being an OS, but a distibution
[20:07] <Stephini> well you wouldn't actually do anything hardrive related since there is no hard drive would you?
[20:07] <Sonny_Jim> I get a feeling I'm fighting a losing battle, like the whole hacking/cracking thing a few years ago
[20:07] <heller\> SpeedEvil: well something with analog output will be okay
[20:07] <Stephini> Sonny_Jim, that's gonna drive you nuts isn't it?
[20:07] <heller\> and acs712 has current sensing both ways
[20:07] <bynarie> call it what u want, i was just wondering what everyone suggests
[20:07] <Stephini> lolz hacking/cracking i remember trying to explain that to people
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[20:07] <bynarie> ubuntu core vs raspbian - which is better?
[20:08] <Stephini> I'm gonna try Win10 when i get my pi2.
[20:08] <bynarie> F thaty
[20:08] <bynarie> (no offense)
[20:08] <Stephini> have you tried 10?
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[20:08] <bynarie> Stephini, im a linux only user now... i did try the beta of windows 10 and i hate it..
[20:09] <bynarie> did u like it?
[20:09] * MY123 (~MY123@unaffiliated/kill--9-1/x-8776976) Quit (Client Quit)
[20:09] <Stephini> i'm a gamer so i'm saddly chained to linux till either they get native level execution of windows binaries or gamedevs start actively and effectively supporting or targeting linux.
[20:09] <e^ipi> Stephini: harddrive related? you’d just need to do a thing on IOPS really
[20:09] <bynarie> im not hating on it, its just not my prefernce
[20:10] <Stephini> s/chained to linux/chained to windows
[20:10] <Sonny_Jim> tbh I see little point running Win10 on an Arm system, as there isn't any windows apps that will run on ARM. May as well stick with the large user support/apps base Linux on ARM has
[20:10] * Froolap (~Froolap@pool-71-180-136-207.tampfl.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[20:10] <bynarie> Stephini, yea i agree.. gamers cant really be on linux
[20:10] <Bilby> remember Win10 is not a Gui
[20:10] <e^ipi> choose your OS for your application, not the other way around. </old man>
[20:11] <bynarie> i dont see a point in running windows on pi either
[20:11] <pksato> Win10 have a CLI? :)
[20:11] <pksato> on this context.
[20:12] <bynarie> im sure it has a "command prompt"
[20:12] <Sonny_Jim> From what I can gather, it's basically MS desperately trying to expand from the desktop market, as they've been outdone in both mobile and server markets for some time now
[20:12] <bynarie> but i wouldnt call it CLI
[20:12] <Sonny_Jim> Hell, MS even support Open Source now....
[20:12] <e^ipi> Sonny_Jim: they’re still the only solution for running activedirectory
[20:12] <Sonny_Jim> http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/openness/default.aspx#opensource
[20:13] <Sonny_Jim> How crazy is that?
[20:13] <e^ipi> which if you work for a living, is a mandatory piece of software
[20:13] <Sonny_Jim> Sure, but once you move away from that sector, they have very little penetration anywhere else
[20:13] <pksato> opensource = patent money
[20:13] <Bilby> Even without exchange / directory servers there are plenty of systems that live in the windows server ecosystem
[20:14] <Bilby> and other than the abso-bleeping-lutely rediculous liscencing schemes, it's a pretty nice system to live 'on'
[20:14] <thyrth> Arch looks soo cool I wish I could set it up in a snap ...
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[20:16] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
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[20:27] <bynarie> i cant get this pos rpi2 to boot up.. i used dd to write to the SD
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[20:28] <davanger> i'll take it off your hands for 20�
[20:29] <bynarie> anyone here ever heard of udoo?
[20:29] <Bilby> dang, beat me to it lol
[20:29] <davanger> ;)
[20:29] <bynarie> i prolly just did something wrong
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[20:30] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-553-1-43-235.w92-151.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Quit: Quitte)
[20:30] <Bilby> bynarie using this guide? http://elinux.org/RPi_Easy_SD_Card_Setup#Flashing_the_SD_Card_using_Linux_.28including_on_a_Raspberry_Pi.21.29
[20:31] <bynarie> well i didnt need a guide but i used dd
[20:31] <bynarie> dd if=rasp.img of=sdcard
[20:31] <bynarie> with a bs of 4M
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[20:32] <bynarie> are there different images for the pi1 vs pi2, or same?
[20:32] <IT_Sean> There are different images.
[20:32] <IT_Sean> You need a Pi 2 specific image.
[20:33] <bynarie> oh crap
[20:33] <bynarie> well im on the downloads page
[20:33] <IT_Sean> Oh crap, indeed.
[20:33] <bynarie> i just see a list of distros
[20:33] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[20:33] <IT_Sean> You need an image that specifically says it is for the Pi 2.
[20:33] <Bilby> the raspibian image from the official site is pi2 capable
[20:33] <bynarie> yep
[20:34] <bynarie> it does
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[20:35] <bynarie> dam.. the download server must be full or just slow
[20:36] <Stephini> are there any lights on your computer that you care about aside from the power one for any reason other than asthetics?
[20:36] <bynarie> IT_Sean, thank you for the insight
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[20:44] <bynarie> now im assuming after i image the SD i cant use parted to resize the partition to use the rest of the room
[20:44] <bynarie> ?
[20:44] <bynarie> *can use
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[20:46] <Stephini> raspi-config has an option to resize the partition.
[20:46] <Bilby> ^
[20:46] <Stephini> beyond that i know nothing but others may.
[20:46] * amigojapan (~amigojapa@c119045.net21845.cablenet.ne.jp) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:46] <Bilby> and you can do it manually too... had to on the last one, forgot to expand it and installed a bunch of stuff and ran out of space to install raspi-config D: had to do it manually
[20:47] <Bilby> much easier on raspi-config haha
[20:48] * amigojapan (~amigojapa@c119045.net21845.cablenet.ne.jp) Quit (Client Quit)
[20:48] * jimvideo (~jimvideo@184-12-233-85.dr01.brny.ca.frontiernet.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:48] * SebSemmi (~SebSemmi@p4FF77F3B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:49] * doomlord_1 (~textual@host86-160-0-221.range86-160.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
[20:49] <ShorTie> ah, it isn't hard, just gotta note where partition 2 starts
[20:49] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@177.70.156.134) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[20:50] <Bilby> I was just anxious, several commands and i was like DON'T BRICK IT DON'T BRICK IT
[20:50] <ShorTie> and if you use partprobe you don't even have to reboot
[20:50] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@191.60.11.121) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:51] * MIG- (~mig@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mig-) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[20:52] <bynarie> lol
[20:52] <bynarie> ok thanks
[20:52] * vanila (~vanila@unaffiliated/vanila) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:52] <vanila> Hello
[20:53] <vanila> Is it possible to emulate a raspi, to make a program before I get one?
[20:53] <vanila> (I tried with qemu but I got a segfault)
[20:53] <bynarie> u can prolly cross compile for it.. dunno bout emulation tho
[20:53] <ShorTie> it's like p,d,2,n, , ,startof2, ,w
[20:53] <ShorTie> p gives you startof2
[20:54] <ShorTie> just gotta check that, enter might work there too...
[20:55] * HeroYoojin (~heroyooji@71-91-74-243.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:56] * sidharthr (~home@122.176.12.100) Quit (Quit: sidharthr)
[20:59] * pppingme (~pppingme@unaffiliated/pppingme) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[20:59] * simiuskong (~simiuskon@2a01:348:99:158:255:215:77:1) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:00] * m0rty (~morty@c-2ec3b0d8-74736162.cust.telenor.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:03] * pppingme (~pppingme@unaffiliated/pppingme) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:03] * nimoot (~HomoSapie@unaffiliated/toomin) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[21:04] * zokeber (~zokeber@unaffiliated/zokeber) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:04] * sidharthr (~home@122.176.12.100) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:05] * ctarx (~ctarx@p4FE6D067.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[21:05] * [Saint] (77e0273c@rockbox/staff/saint) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:05] * ctarx (~ctarx@p4FE6D067.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:06] * sidharthr (~home@122.176.12.100) Quit (Client Quit)
[21:07] <WACOMalt> Huzah! I just picked up my Pi2
[21:07] * MIG- (~mig@c-68-63-20-66.hsd1.al.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:07] <vanila> lucky :D
[21:07] <vanila> i want it so bad
[21:08] <vanila> it seems really powerful
[21:08] <WACOMalt> Im amazed its the same price as tbefore
[21:08] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[21:08] <[Saint]> As much as I suspect RPF staff hate me doing this...
[21:08] <[Saint]> Have you checked out the ODROID C1?
[21:08] <WACOMalt> finally got a pi cobbler board too
[21:08] <[Saint]> I mean, the Pi 2 is /OK?...
[21:08] <leio> hopeless GPU situation@c1
[21:08] <[Saint]> s/?///
[21:09] <Syliss> lol
[21:09] <WACOMalt> ????
[21:09] <Syliss> c1 looks okay too
[21:09] <Syliss> i may get one of each
[21:09] <[Saint]> leio: 'cos the rpi's GPU is _soooooooooo_ much better, lol ;)
[21:09] <Syliss> and use my old gen1 pi on my tube tv
[21:09] <[Saint]> Try getting Android on it.
[21:09] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:09] <[Saint]> Oh, wait...not gonna happen. :p
[21:09] <Syliss> not everyone wants android on their pi
[21:09] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:09] <Syliss> i want osx on it
[21:09] <Syliss> lulz
[21:09] <WACOMalt> hmm that looks good too
[21:10] <IT_Sean> Don't hold your breath.
[21:10] <[Saint]> It is.
[21:10] <WACOMalt> GB ethernet
[21:10] <WACOMalt> darn
[21:10] <WACOMalt> now I want that instead lol
[21:10] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:10] <[Saint]> Heh
[21:10] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:10] <[Saint]> I got a fleet of 'em before news of the rpi2 dropped beyond suspicion.
[21:10] <[Saint]> RPF did /better/ this year, but, still didn;t keep it under wraps completely.
[21:11] <[Saint]> Thankfully no one who knew broke the news early this time.
[21:11] <[Saint]> That I saw, at least.
[21:11] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:11] <thyrth> I've been trying to get arch up and running its darn hard
[21:11] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:11] <WACOMalt> are you used to arch?
[21:11] <[Saint]> its really not
[21:11] <WACOMalt> arch is hard
[21:11] <[Saint]> hard, I mean.
[21:11] <WACOMalt> hard to someone new to it
[21:11] <thyrth> Nope i'm used to Linux though ah ah
[21:11] <[Saint]> its no harder than debian.
[21:11] * Crenn-NAS (~Crenn@203-219-254-61.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:11] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:12] * Bilby wonders if he can tutor people on the Pi for monies
[21:12] <WACOMalt> sorry, "using" arch is harder
[21:12] <[Saint]> and Arch's wiki is bloody phenomenal.
[21:12] <WACOMalt> because it takes more setup
[21:12] <WACOMalt> oh I agree
[21:12] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:12] * Giddles (~i@unaffiliated/giddles) Quit (Quit: .)
[21:12] <WACOMalt> just a ton more steps because you choose what you want it to do
[21:12] <[Saint]> If you can't find what you want to find out there...you're Doing It Wrong(TM).
[21:12] <[Saint]> Their wiki is great.
[21:12] * acidjazz (acidjazz@notchill.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:12] <thyrth> There wiki sucks for someone new
[21:12] <leio> [Saint]: not really a fan of running some random old kernels to have anything work; though not intimately familiar with that particular strand of proprietary graphics
[21:12] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:13] <WACOMalt> Their wiki is extremely well documented. but if you're new to linux, its still gonna look like insanity
[21:13] * PigFlu (~herp@unaffiliated/pigflu) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:13] * Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[21:13] <PigFlu> is the red power led supposed to be constantly on?
[21:13] <thyrth> Yeah which is weird cause i've been ruuning UBuntu and other Linux os gui based for ever
[21:13] <IT_Sean> Yes
[21:13] <WACOMalt> PigFlu, yes
[21:14] <WACOMalt> if it turns off ever it means you have low power
[21:14] <[Saint]> leio: are you relatively new to the pi then? Modern kernels without immense pissing around wasn't a thing there either until rather recently.
[21:14] <IT_Sean> PigFlu: the Power LED indicates that the Pi is plugged in to... wait for it... power.
[21:14] <PigFlu> mine is flashing sporadically, could it be a bad usb cable? the power supply is legit
[21:14] <WACOMalt> yes
[21:14] <IT_Sean> [Saint]: Language policy, please.
[21:14] <[Saint]> IT_Sean: really? That's...well. Ok.
[21:14] <[Saint]> Whatevs.
[21:14] <IT_Sean> Thanks :)
[21:14] <IT_Sean> PigFlu: a flashing LED could be a squiffy PSU
[21:14] <[Saint]> I'm intimately aware of the policy, you guys just have vastly different views on what'f family friendly.
[21:15] <[Saint]> ANd its aggrivating as almighty hell.
[21:15] <PigFlu> no, the supply is good, but the cable is from ebay
[21:15] <PigFlu> i better go into town and buy an expensive one i guess ;_;
[21:15] <WACOMalt> PigFlu, test the outputs
[21:15] <WACOMalt> at the supply and the cord
[21:15] <WACOMalt> unless the cord is literally shorting out it seems odd that it'd be the issue
[21:15] <PigFlu> then i have to cut open the cable..
[21:15] <Bilby> PigFlu do you have any charer cords for laptops?
[21:15] <PigFlu> no
[21:16] <WACOMalt> plugs and ports have metal contacts :)
[21:16] * Bilby is using a blackberry micro-usb cord
[21:16] <WACOMalt> no need to cut open
[21:16] <PigFlu> how would i probe the end that is plugged into the usb adapter ._.
[21:16] <WACOMalt> mine is a chromecast power adapter and some asus tablet charge cord
[21:16] <WACOMalt> no issue
[21:16] <WACOMalt> PigFlu, well, you cant, but shouldnt need to
[21:16] <[Saint]> I dunno man. Some cheap USb cables are made from tinsel, or vinegar soaked string.
[21:16] <thyrth> I wish there was a desktop with arch to install a desktop for rasberry pi
[21:16] <[Saint]> They're definitely not all created equally.
[21:16] <WACOMalt> if its cood one the port on the power supply, and bad on the end of the cord
[21:16] <WACOMalt> then its the cord
[21:17] <WACOMalt> if its bad at both, then its the power supply
[21:17] <IT_Sean> WACOMalt: PigFlu: cheap USB cables can cause issues.
[21:17] <PigFlu> i use the same supply and cable to charge my phone every night, so it seems very strange indeed
[21:17] <WACOMalt> (and/or the cord)
[21:17] <IT_Sean> and phones and such are a bit more tolerant of icky power
[21:17] <WACOMalt> IT_Sean, ah, I've never had one cause a drop or anything. I;ve only had them not work, or work
[21:17] <PigFlu> i'll try another cable
[21:18] <PigFlu> however, i only noticed the blinking after 2 days of using the pi.. it didnt seem to affect its operation in any way
[21:18] <IT_Sean> WACOMalt: if the cable can't carry sufficient current, the Pi can drop out under load.
[21:18] <WACOMalt> ODROID-C1, does it have HDMI?
[21:18] <Bilby> that is really, really strange PigFlu
[21:18] <PigFlu> well, it's true
[21:18] <WACOMalt> The Pi is pretty tolerant too. just it lets you know if its icky power
[21:19] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[21:19] <WACOMalt> phones dont tell you
[21:19] <[Saint]> WACOMalt: yes
[21:19] <[Saint]> re: MHDI
[21:19] <WACOMalt> is it micro?
[21:19] <WACOMalt> I dont see a fullsize on the thing
[21:19] <[Saint]> HDMI, rather.
[21:19] <[Saint]> it is, yes.
[21:19] <PigFlu> someone tried charging their iphone with a cable i bought on ebay, and the iphone said it wasnt a legit cable and refused to charge
[21:20] <WACOMalt> gotcha
[21:20] <[Saint]> its also got USB-OTG
[21:20] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:20] <[Saint]> (something the pi needed, IMO)
[21:20] <WACOMalt> PigFlu, some cables are made for 2 amps, some for 1, some for .5
[21:20] <WACOMalt> I think the iphone wants 2
[21:20] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:20] <WACOMalt> anything less and it'll say bad cord
[21:20] <WACOMalt> to my understanding anyways...
[21:20] <bynarie> [Saint], the pi has otg capability?
[21:21] <WACOMalt> no, the ODROID-C1
[21:21] <[Saint]> My Nexus 6 wants 1800mA to actively charge while in use.
[21:21] <[Saint]> Anything less and it'll actively discharge.
[21:21] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:21] <[Saint]> Its nuts.
[21:21] * LoneElf (~textual@204.57.64.106) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[21:21] <WACOMalt> yeeeah
[21:21] <aberrant> what’s the word length for the rpi2?
[21:21] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:21] <WACOMalt> my G3 barely charges on 1A
[21:21] <[Saint]> bynarie: it does not.
[21:21] <bynarie> oh
[21:21] <bynarie> i was gonna say
[21:21] <WACOMalt> Is there a sepparate channel for berryboot?
[21:22] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:22] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:22] <WACOMalt> I need some help migrating my berryboot install and OSes over to Pi2
[21:22] <bynarie> udoo has otg capabilities.. in a way.. with modified shit
[21:22] <[Saint]> The biggest thing, IMO, about the C1 is the fact that it has an (optional) eMMC module, and the sdcard is specced to UHS-I
[21:22] * tombrough (~tom@cpc3-newt3-0-0-cust165.19-3.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:22] <[Saint]> IOW: faster storage, by leagues.
[21:22] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@191.60.11.121) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:22] * donhw (~Son@host-184-167-41-55.jcs-wy.client.bresnan.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:22] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:23] <[Saint]> The Pi 2 is great too, mind. Its just got some things that are IMO fundamentally lacking.
[21:23] <WACOMalt> Yeah I'll probably grab one of those too
[21:23] <bynarie> i just fired my pi 2 up for the first time.. its pretty decent
[21:23] <[Saint]> Even if the ODROID C1 didn't have a lot of other tasty bits, gigE sealed the deal for my use case.
[21:23] <[Saint]> I imagine others don't care about that, though.
[21:23] <WACOMalt> I do. I was looking at Bananapi for that reason
[21:24] <WACOMalt> GB and SATA
[21:24] <WACOMalt> boom, NAS
[21:24] <[Saint]> I wouldn;t get that thing on principle.
[21:24] <WACOMalt> ?
[21:24] <[Saint]> It just rides off the back of the RPF entirely.
[21:24] <[Saint]> Its kinda dirty.
[21:24] <WACOMalt> open source
[21:24] <WACOMalt> it happens, and it's to some degree the point
[21:25] <bynarie> WACOMalt, udoo has sata support, arduino built in and 4x powerful than a pi
[21:25] <bynarie> its a bit pricey for a mini pc tho
[21:25] <[Saint]> Well, yeah, while that's true - its still dirty. They even stole the "*pi" moniker.
[21:25] <[Saint]> They're clearly not trying to distance themselves. At all.
[21:25] <WACOMalt> udoo is also $99 for the cheapest
[21:26] <bynarie> yea
[21:26] <bynarie> thats for the dual core
[21:26] <WACOMalt> Eh, I see it the same as all the other *duino projects
[21:26] <bynarie> i got the quad for 135
[21:26] <WACOMalt> arduino everything, but different form factors and features
[21:26] <[Saint]> anyhoo - check it out: http://www.hardkernel.com/main/products/prdt_info.php?g_code=G141578608433&tab_idx=2
[21:26] <WACOMalt> and they use the "duino" moniker
[21:26] <[Saint]> I already had a few hardkernel boards, they're pretty well made, IMO.
[21:27] <[Saint]> The U1 and U2 are pretty neat.
[21:27] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[21:27] <[Saint]> and I also have the X* boards floating around.
[21:27] <WACOMalt> man I hate microhdmi :/
[21:27] * Cavedude (~Cavedude@unaffiliated/cavedude) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:27] <[Saint]> Actually, I've got _far_ too many SBCs man...I swear if left unattended, they breed.
[21:27] <WACOMalt> I've had so many of those ports get broken on me
[21:27] <[Saint]> ANd if the cousins breed, then you get Bananapis. lol
[21:27] <WACOMalt> Can you give me some of the offspring?
[21:27] <PigFlu> honestly, the red pwr led is blinking frantically, but i'm on the pi right now, over remote desktop, and its not even lagging.. should i be worried?
[21:28] <WACOMalt> :P
[21:28] <WACOMalt> PigFlu, in actuality.. nah
[21:28] <[Saint]> sdcards too man....I swear they breed too.
[21:28] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:28] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-553-1-43-235.w92-151.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:28] <WACOMalt> you "should" be worried in principle, but probably nothing will be wrong
[21:28] <WACOMalt> I wish mine did
[21:28] <WACOMalt> I have far too few SD cards
[21:28] <WACOMalt> had to go buy one with my Pi2 today
[21:28] <[Saint]> you'll be worried if it drops and nukes your filesystem.
[21:29] <[Saint]> So, in principle, yes.
[21:29] <WACOMalt> ^
[21:29] <bynarie> WACOMalt, what u pay for an sd card in general.. 5-10 bucks?
[21:29] <WACOMalt> I got a fast one, 16GB for $13
[21:29] <bynarie> yea
[21:29] * mrueg (~mrueg@gentoo/developer/mrueg) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
[21:29] <WACOMalt> walmart standard
[21:29] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[21:29] <bynarie> motherfuckers here pay 50- 100 for an sd card at best buy.. morons
[21:29] <thyrth> is there an Iso of a Ready with a desktop Arch ?
[21:29] <[Saint]> WACOMalt: I even have a 128MB uSD around here somewhere.
[21:29] <WACOMalt> heh
[21:29] <[Saint]> And a 256MB one.
[21:30] <[Saint]> They're handy for just putting the Arch bootfiles on and doing USB /root on the pi.
[21:30] <[Saint]> Not much else.
[21:30] <bynarie> best buy sells 32gb usb2 flash drives for like 30 bucks
[21:30] <bynarie> thats nutso
[21:30] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:30] <[Saint]> jeez.
[21:30] <[Saint]> expensive.
[21:30] <bynarie> yea
[21:30] <bynarie> no kiddin
[21:30] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:30] <WACOMalt> I need a 128GB USB3 flash drive
[21:31] <[Saint]> Nor for a pi you don't. :)
[21:31] <[Saint]> *not
[21:31] <bynarie> i seen a 128gb usb3 flash for 150 at best buy.. i priced matched it for 35 bucks from amazon
[21:31] * mrueg (~mrueg@gentoo/developer/mrueg) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:31] * pksato (~PEBKAC@unaffiliated/pksato) Quit (Quit: Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair)
[21:31] <[Saint]> yeah - be careful there man.
[21:31] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:31] <[Saint]> DO NOT buy USB anything from an untrusted retailer. EVER>
[21:31] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:31] <bynarie> what best buy? i dont pay those prices?
[21:31] <WACOMalt> Anyone know whats needed to update a berryboot SD and all OSes for Pi2?
[21:31] <WACOMalt> coming from Pi B+
[21:32] <bynarie> oh
[21:32] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:32] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:32] * vanila (~vanila@unaffiliated/vanila) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[21:32] <bynarie> welp, im going back into android mode
[21:33] <[Saint]> It is far too easy to craft a "trojan horse" USB stick. Its not even funny how easy it is. Especially considering Windows will inherently trust anything that presents itself as a USB keyboard.
[21:33] <bynarie> [Saint], thats for sure true
[21:33] <[Saint]> We get "free samples" sent to us at work all the time.
[21:33] <IT_Sean> Yeah, well... Windows... ::eyeroll::
[21:33] <bynarie> thank god i dont use windows anymore
[21:33] <[Saint]> They all go in the shredder.
[21:33] <bynarie> LOL free samples
[21:34] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:34] <[Saint]> They're all really high quality fakes, or masterfully resealed original products. But, of course, we don't trust them in our data center. Not even sandboxed.
[21:34] <[Saint]> They just keep coming. At least one a week.
[21:34] <bynarie> who sends em
[21:34] <[Saint]> Its quite obviously a targeted attack.
[21:34] <bynarie> does it appear to come from a "company"
[21:35] * vt102 (~vt102@h96-60-253-96.cncrtn.dsl.dynamic.tds.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:35] <[Saint]> Anonymous senders, we can't trace 'em. Don't care who's sending 'em really. We can see the area they were postmarked in, they're coming from NZ and AU, in various parts up and down the country, but we suspect that's just to disguise the original origin.
[21:36] * PrinceProspero (PrincePros@gateway/shell/bnc4free/x-teybmdsskfupttwo) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:36] <bynarie> hm
[21:36] * wiiguy (fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) Quit (Quit: I just broke my connection, but no worries, we can rebuild it. We have the technology.)
[21:37] <ali1234> personally i think the fact that any USB device can impersonate any other USB device in order to exploit hypothetical bugs in its drivers is worse than the keyboard hole
[21:37] <[Saint]> Like we'll just go "Oh, hey, sweet - free USB storage! Lets just plug that right in to our definitely, definitely, totally not network segregated and sandboxed machines shall we!"
[21:37] <ali1234> because you are going to notice if the computer starts typing on it's own
[21:37] <bynarie> LoL
[21:37] <Tachyon`> lol
[21:37] <Tachyon`> the USB keyboard hole isn't a hole, it's working as designed
[21:37] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@123.239.60.106) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:37] <[Saint]> ali1234: well, yes and no, it only needs to say its a keyboard to slip through the "trust" chain.
[21:37] <ali1234> where as the attackers only need to find one bug in one driver - ANY USB driver at all - and they can exploit it
[21:37] <[Saint]> It needn't act as one.
[21:38] * WLL (~WLL@unaffiliated/wll) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:38] <[Saint]> It needn't actually do any phantom typing, it just needs to report as a keyboard for the system to trust it automagically, which is...frankly braindead.
[21:38] <ali1234> we need policies for USB either way. "this is the only keyboard that may connect, it may only connect on this port"
[21:38] <[Saint]> But, its how keyboards do.
[21:39] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:39] <ali1234> keyboards can't do anything other than phantom typing... because they are keyboard
[21:39] <ali1234> unless there's a bug in the HID driver, which is quite plausible given how complex it is
[21:39] <[Saint]> We have a very fun "USB" policy here at work. Its called "Sellies No More Gaps"
[21:39] * Tachyon` is now known as Tach[away]
[21:39] <ali1234> but you could say that about any driver
[21:40] <SpeedEvil> ali1234: the fun part of that.
[21:40] <SpeedEvil> ali1234: Serial numbers on USB are optional
[21:40] <ali1234> yes
[21:40] <[Saint]> Well, what they're trying to do is capture keystrokes and then report back, usually over FM bands or BTLE.
[21:40] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Client Quit)
[21:40] <[Saint]> attacker gets one in the system, then does a drive by and tunes into the FM frequency preprogrammed.
[21:40] <[Saint]> Its all very low tech and very hit and miss.
[21:40] <bynarie> tbh, im not a n00b at all, but never heard of flash drive attacks before, but i also dont work in a datacenter
[21:41] <ali1234> SpeedEvil: yes hence why the policy must be per port as well
[21:41] <SpeedEvil> [Saint]: what industry are you in?
[21:41] <ali1234> because if you only have one port that works for a keyboard, and only one keyboard that works with it, you're basically never going to unplug that
[21:41] <[Saint]> I work at DataNZ, a large-ish data center that handles mass data and its processing for a lot of fields.
[21:41] <WACOMalt> I mean, to a layman, how often do you look at that "installing device driver" window and check if it only says "usb storage"?
[21:41] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:42] <ali1234> and i do mean per-port, not per-root hub
[21:42] <Stephini> what happens with that policy if your keyboard breaks down?
[21:42] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:42] <[Saint]> Mostly education sector.
[21:42] <ali1234> Stephini: when you plug in another keyboard it says "are you sure this is REALLY a keyboard?"
[21:42] <bynarie> lol
[21:42] <bynarie> thatd be nice
[21:42] <Stephini> and how would you verify if you have a mouseless work center?
[21:42] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:42] <[Saint]> We've also got one of the NetFLix booster boxes here running a select trial.
[21:42] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[21:42] <Stephini> youd need your old keyboard just to verify the new keyboard.
[21:43] <[Saint]> But its just here. We don't manage it.
[21:43] <ali1234> Stephini: "if this is really a keyboard, type the following words on it: <random words>"
[21:43] * thyrth (~orion@c-75-68-152-20.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[21:43] <ali1234> like what bluetooth does
[21:43] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:43] <ali1234> i dunno, i'm not a user interface designer. but i'm damn sure we can do better than what we have now
[21:44] <Stephini> i guess but either you need that or you need a mouse thing and it needs to detect if you have a mouse or not.
[21:44] <[Saint]> EVen if we managed to get all the gap filler out of the USB terminals on the machines here, we'd still need upper management to come in and activate the device with their keycard to upshift the permissions so it could actually do anything.
[21:45] <[Saint]> and that would be a very firm "no"
[21:45] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[21:45] <RichiH> do i need to buy the mpeg2 codec for the raspi2 as well?
[21:45] <[Saint]> My job is boring as though. Boring boring boring. I don't realistically do anything that a small robot couldn't do.
[21:46] <bynarie> LL
[21:46] <[Saint]> I just hotswap and destroy disks that show the slightest sign of failure all day.
[21:46] <[Saint]> And...reddit.
[21:46] <bynarie> dam that is boring
[21:46] <[Saint]> yep.
[21:46] <[Saint]> The shredder I use is pretty cool though.
[21:46] <[Saint]> Its brutal.
[21:46] <RichiH> [Saint]: who for?
[21:47] <[Saint]> It can chew up three or four disks at a time no sweat.
[21:47] <WACOMalt> aside from shredding, what are other safe ways to dispose of a disk?
[21:47] <WACOMalt> can I throw it in a forge?
[21:48] <[Saint]> you can indeed.
[21:48] <[Saint]> smashing the platter up with a hammer is also a decent option.,
[21:48] <[Saint]> they're fairly brittle.
[21:48] <WACOMalt> I have probably 50 hard drive platters sitting in my barn
[21:48] <WACOMalt> from old parts machines and things
[21:48] <WACOMalt> I always take the platters out because they look cool
[21:49] <[Saint]> yeah - they do.
[21:49] * Aranel (~Aranel@unaffiliated/aranel) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:49] * cybr1d (~cybr1d@unaffiliated/cybr1d) Quit (Quit: Peace)
[21:49] <WACOMalt> I want to get the platters out of this artifact I have
[21:50] * ryankarason (~rak@opensource.cse.ohio-state.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:50] <WACOMalt> https://plus.google.com/photos/109178352293459834699/albums/5475364762731759713
[21:50] <WACOMalt> let me know if that link works
[21:51] <[Saint]> Oooooooooh nice.
[21:51] <WACOMalt> this is a 40MB hard drive I uncovered during a cleanout session at USC
[21:51] <[Saint]> What locale are you in?
[21:51] <WACOMalt> I'm in Ohio, but that was found in California when I lived there
[21:51] <[Saint]> I know a few guys who might want that if its not in too bad a shape.
[21:51] <WACOMalt> its in great shape
[21:51] <WACOMalt> no idea if it'd work though
[21:51] <WACOMalt> apparently this model has a single read head and 12 platters
[21:51] <[Saint]> Ah, right....yeah. I doubt anyone I know wants to ship ~10kg of metal halfway across the globe.
[21:51] <[Saint]> But damn that's pretty.
[21:51] <WACOMalt> the one read head moves between the platters with a complex pulley system
[21:52] <[Saint]> I'd suggest trying to sell it to a vintage PC entusiast.
[21:52] <WACOMalt> brand new this cost $25,000
[21:52] <Bilby> WACOMalt that's shiny
[21:52] <WACOMalt> I got it free, was gonna be tossed
[21:52] <WACOMalt> danke
[21:52] <[Saint]> Yep. I know. They're not uncommon, but people want them for parts because they have a high failure rate.
[21:52] <WACOMalt> ah
[21:52] <WACOMalt> do people still use these? O_o
[21:53] <WACOMalt> if so.... why?
[21:53] * ctarx (~ctarx@p4FE6D067.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[21:53] <[Saint]> I know a few guys that are in the vintage computing scene, you hang out here a bit, so if any of them are actually willing to pay shipping costs+cost on it, I'll let you know.
[21:53] <[Saint]> They don't come up too often.
[21:53] * turtlehat (~dingus@home.b3nny.eu) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:53] <WACOMalt> okeedoke
[21:54] <WACOMalt> I'm "always" on freenode
[21:54] <WACOMalt> even if not in here
[21:54] <WACOMalt> so PM me even if I'm away
[21:54] <WACOMalt> Ok, berryboot installed on Pi2, now to figure out moving over my OSes
[21:54] <[Saint]> Is it OK with you if I share that URL?
[21:55] <[Saint]> Or should I pull the images?
[21:55] <Sonny_Jim> Bah, that's a tiny HDD
[21:55] <Sonny_Jim> Try one of these for size:
[21:55] <Sonny_Jim> http://www.computer-history.info/Page4.dir/pages/PDP.11.dir/images/WinchesterDiskPack.big.jpg
[21:56] * cybr1d (~cybr1d@unaffiliated/cybr1d) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:57] <ozzzy> I had one of those with my PDP11... 5MB
[21:58] * pksato (~PEBKAC@unaffiliated/pksato) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:58] * jazzzu (~jazzzu@D97B7B1C.cm-3-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:59] * Tach[away] is now known as Tachyon`
[22:03] <WACOMalt> [Saint], sure
[22:04] <WACOMalt> eh, thats really no bigger
[22:04] <WACOMalt> and it has a case
[22:04] <[Saint]> WACOMalt: awesome - just checking, didn't want to assume and the like. Cool.
[22:04] * gbaman (~gbaman@dab-ntm1-h-54-9.dab.02.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:04] <WACOMalt> yup, thanks for asking
[22:06] * iamjarvo (~textual@pool-98-115-181-52.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[22:07] * m0rty (~morty@c-2ec3b0d8-74736162.cust.telenor.se) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[22:07] * darenasc (~darenasc@200-28-239-244.baf.movistar.cl) Quit (Quit: darenasc)
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[22:11] * PigFlu (~herp@unaffiliated/pigflu) Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[22:12] * darenasc (~darenasc@mail.formulisa.cl) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[22:13] * iamjarvo (~textual@pool-98-115-181-52.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:14] <WACOMalt> Dang, I suck at soldering, and this Pi cobbler I thought was assembled isnt and requires soldering
[22:14] <WACOMalt> T_T
[22:14] <McBride36> just take your time
[22:15] * hybr1d8 (~cjd@202.92.67.179) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:16] * Stellar_Mind (~stap@123.239.60.106) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[22:16] * fatalhalt (~kyle@c-71-201-7-76.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:18] * m0rty (~morty@collared.club) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[22:19] <Sonny_Jim> Practise on a junk board, watch some Youtube tutorials
[22:19] <IT_Sean> that ^
[22:21] <Sonny_Jim> Two tips, always use solder to transfer heat, not the tip of the iron.
[22:21] * woodyj21 (~woody@pcp140729pcs.unl.edu) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[22:22] <Sonny_Jim> Keep the iron and the surfaces you are soldering 'clean', otherwise impurities can gunk it up
[22:23] * utack_ (~utack@ip9234cb8c.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:23] * utack (~utack@ip9234cb8c.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:24] * doomlord_1 (~textual@host86-184-8-232.range86-184.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:24] <IT_Sean> And if it looks like butt, you need more practice.
[22:24] <IT_Sean> ;)
[22:25] <IT_Sean> And while a cheap iron is fine for learning, at some point you should do yourself a favor and get a really good, temperature controlled iron.
[22:25] <IT_Sean> (in fact, i would recommend learning on a cheap iron, before you get all spendy on a nice one)
[22:26] * Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:26] * gbaman (~gbaman@dab-ntm1-h-54-9.dab.02.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:26] * thescatman_ (0541ebdd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.5.65.235.221) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[22:27] <[Saint]> language policy, please /s
[22:28] * zokeber (~zokeber@unaffiliated/zokeber) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:30] <[Saint]> Oh my.
[22:30] <[Saint]> Kitten just strolled in the door covered head to toe in bidi-bidis.
[22:30] <ali1234> you know the best tip ever for soldering? don't try to use lead free solder
[22:30] <ali1234> *especially* if you don't have a lead-free soldering iron!
[22:30] <[Saint]> Of course, its the one that won't tolerate being brushed or combed in the slightest without putting up a massive figth about it.
[22:31] * iamjarvo (~textual@pool-98-115-181-52.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[22:31] <Bilby> Leaded solder is harder to find now, and i think the lead-free stuff is generally about as good anymore anyhow
[22:31] * \sky (~sky@poweroff.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:31] <ali1234> it has a significantly higher melting point, and if your iron doesn't go hot enough, it will just clog up the tip with nasty tarry stuff
[22:31] <Bilby> [Saint] grab it, dunk it in a pan of peanut butter and drop it with the dogs? they'll clean it quickly enough :D
[22:32] <ali1234> then it won't trasnfer heat properly, and it just gets worse from there
[22:32] <Bilby> sounds like old man complaints to me :P
[22:32] * gbaman (~gbaman@31.205.104.150) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:32] * divine (~divine@2001:470:8247:1::30) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:32] <[Saint]> I'm not sure if "bidibidi" is something easily understood internationally, I just checked and it does seem to be a New Zealand Maori origin word.
[22:32] * wcypierre is now known as zz_wcypierre
[22:32] <[Saint]> Ummmm...."burrs" I think would be the international variant.
[22:32] <Bilby> I assumed some sort of burr or pricker
[22:33] <[Saint]> Tiny little round plant seed things that act like velcro.
[22:33] <[Saint]> She's also covered in grass seeds, uuuuuuugh.
[22:33] <Bilby> yes. burr
[22:33] <Bilby> I like bidibidi though
[22:33] <ali1234> leaded solder is still easy to get hold of: http://www.rapidonline.com/tools-equipment/rapid-solder-wire-60-40-22swg-0-7mm-100g-reel-85-0592
[22:34] <[Saint]> Those ones are particularly annoying, because if you don't get them out they can borrow deep into the flesh, and they've got spines on them that make sure they only go in and don't come out.
[22:34] <Bilby> :O ouch
[22:34] <[Saint]> Any dog or cat owner should know the "joys" of grass seeds.
[22:34] <[Saint]> The neighbours aren't a fan of gerdening, apparently. Their "lawn" is 6ft tall and going to seed.
[22:34] * iamjarvo (~textual@pool-98-115-181-52.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:35] <[Saint]> *gardening.
[22:35] * Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) Quit (Quit: ◀▬▬ ••••••ᗣ••••••ᗧ•ᗣᗣ••••◀▬▬ We Love You)
[22:35] * Keanu73_ (~Keanu73@unaffiliated/keanu73) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:35] <[Saint]> Grass seeds are really viscios
[22:36] <[Saint]> I think the grass seeds are colloquially known almost globally as "foxtails".
[22:36] <[Saint]> They're nasty.
[22:37] <[Saint]> Its going to be kitty-bath-time-happy-fun-fun-super-time day today. Yay me!
[22:37] * Keanu73__ (~Keanu73@unaffiliated/keanu73) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:37] <Bilby> and then happy fun peroxide and bandage time!
[22:37] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:38] <[Saint]> Hahahaha. Yeah. You know it.
[22:38] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[22:38] * Keanu73 (~Keanu73@unaffiliated/keanu73) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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[22:45] * c^ (~ChipUK@unaffiliated/chipuk) Quit (Quit: <G80R> Wiring is probably dildos. Hello Chip.)
[22:46] <Stephini> is triggering the P6 jumper the same as [sudo shutdown -r now] or is it more like code plugging it?
[22:46] * c^ (~ChipUK@unaffiliated/chipuk) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:46] <Stephini> s/code/cold
[22:47] <Bilby> p6 is a soft reboot iirc so the system is not shut down
[22:47] <Bilby> it's 'nicer' than pulling the plug - it's like punching reboot button on a computer
[22:47] <Stephini> I'm basically wondering if using it risks damage to the FS like when you cold plug it.
[22:48] <WACOMalt> Anyone know which direction I should plug a ribbon cable into the pi2 (like which side the bump on the cord should be) to plug it into a pi cobbler?
[22:48] <e^ipi> red wire is pin0
[22:48] <[Saint]> Stephini: it does, yes.
[22:48] <Stephini> WACOMalt, wouldn't that depend on how the cable in question is threaded?
[22:48] <WACOMalt> I suppose it would
[22:49] <[Saint]> Stephini: to be honest, I think the best use of p6 isn't to reboot the device, but rather, to boot it back up from a shut-down-but-powered state.
[22:49] <[Saint]> that's how I was using it.
[22:49] <[Saint]> Shut down the device, and then use a switch on p6 to bring it back up again without having to re-plug power.
[22:49] <e^ipi> WACOMalt: it almost certainly is wired for the coloured wire being pin0, because that’s how ribbon cables work
[22:49] <[Saint]> Its, IMO, a fairly elegant solution.
[22:50] <Stephini> well i guess then it's a good thing the spot i put p6 is kind of out of the way.
[22:50] <[Saint]> But, yeah, it can work as a hard-reset button - but just like any hard reset you risk data loss/corruption.
[22:51] <[Saint]> I think the /best/ use of it is to bring the device back up if its shut down but still powered.
[22:51] * BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:51] <Stephini> e^ipi, so basically you are saying just put the colored ribbon towards the USB side of the board. aye? disregard the bump like i was saying?
[22:51] <[Saint]> Having to unplug and then replug power to boot again if you shutdown the device aggravated me soooooooooooo much I had to find a solution for it quite quickly.
[22:52] <e^ipi> if you look on the circuit board itself, on the back side there should be a 0 pin that’s marked with a square rather than a circle
[22:52] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[22:52] <[Saint]> I tracked p6 as one of the very first things I ever did when I got the board.
[22:52] <e^ipi> my pi is at home, but i believe that pin is towards the back of the board (ie, opposite to the usb ports)
[22:52] <Stephini> [Saint], to bad I cant build a circuit that uses the nes power button when i cut power it sends a halt command and when i re add power it sends a short pulse to p6.
[22:52] <[Saint]> I honestly can't understand why there's not a bottun there.
[22:52] <Stephini> that would be perfect.
[22:52] <[Saint]> It'd add a few cents to the BOM.
[22:52] <[Saint]> *button
[22:53] <Bilby> I can't think of a time I'd have used it so far... so apparently needs differ ;)
[22:53] * Keanu73__ is now known as Keanu73
[22:53] <[Saint]> in quantities like RPF would be using, putting a button on the p6 header would quite literally only have cost a few cents per board.
[22:53] * benxyzzy (~b@cpc2-cmbg15-2-0-cust359.5-4.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[22:54] * veonik_ is now known as veonik
[22:54] * GentileBen (GentileBen@cpc5-lutn10-2-0-cust681.9-3.cable.virginm.net) Quit ()
[22:54] * nils_2 (~nils_2@unaffiliated/nils-2/x-2480262) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:54] <Bilby> There's lots they could have done that would have had minimal impact on the cost, but it all would have impacted it. consider that they didn't even have to expose that header - obviously they thought some but not all people would want it
[22:54] <[Saint]> Bilby: I think you would if you had a button there, personally. FOr instance, power down the device, leave it powered (ie. don't pull the plug), and then in future when you want to bring it back up, just push a button.
[22:54] <Stephini> [Saint], wouldn't a button be in the way of anyone wanting to use a case though? seems like having the jumper pins would be a better way to go.
[22:54] <[Saint]> You would use such a feature, I'm sure.
[22:54] * fatalhalt (~kyle@c-71-201-7-76.hsd1.il.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: fatal halt)
[22:54] <[Saint]> Plugging the finnicky little microUSB cable is painful.
[22:55] <[Saint]> Stephini: how so?
[22:55] <e^ipi> Bilby: there’s plenty they could do to make the cost cheaper too, the compute module is a perfect example of that. nix all the ports, solder them on if you want ‘em
[22:55] <Bilby> honestly if i'm experimenting ususally i just have the power supply on a surge protector and i flip the switch
[22:55] <[Saint]> Stephini: the button I use is literally only 1.5~2mm high
[22:55] * gordonpn (~gordonpn@bas3-montreal03-1176348045.dsl.bell.ca) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:55] <e^ipi> or hell, even just ship a broadcomm SOC and the ram chip by itself, no need for fancy circuit boards
[22:55] * Logicwax (Logicwax@c-50-161-23-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: rm -rf /)
[22:55] <Bilby> e^ipi good point, and that could be cool too, like a minimal pi kit. Though with the + models there isn't a lot on there that an avarage beginner could reliably solder
[22:56] <Stephini> yeah but if you do a case build you hafta open the case to press the button your way. but if you do it my way where you have the jumpers you can attach a hard button or a FP button from a PC best ofr all cases.
[22:56] * Encrypt (~Chuck-nor@AMontsouris-553-1-43-235.w92-151.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Quit: Quitte)
[22:56] <e^ipi> a minimal pi kit exists, the comput module. they cost $25/each in lots of 100
[22:56] * x1337807x (~x1337807x@38.104.105.178) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[22:56] * Bilby wires P6 to a knife switch and shouts "IGOR, THROW THE LEVER!" every time he reboots
[22:56] <WACOMalt> ok, I have the colored wire on the left (if the USB ports are facing the right) And those then correspond to the 3.3 VDC and 5.0VDC pins on the cobbler
[22:57] <WACOMalt> I think... I think that's right
[22:57] * rodrigograca31 (uid41821@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mefwhhxlrxjwznpg) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[22:57] <[Saint]> Stephini: not so, I just drilled a hole in the case.
[22:57] <[Saint]> Similar to the type of reset buttons that almost all consumer electronics used to have.
[22:57] <[Saint]> paperclip, boom.
[22:57] <Stephini> ok so you gotta shove your finger in the case. still inconvenient when i can wire a button TO the case.
[22:57] <[Saint]> nope.
[22:58] <Stephini> ok you need paper clip.
[22:58] <Stephini> i had typed before you said how you had it. :P
[22:58] <Bilby> true... and that's without the dev board, yeah?
[22:58] <Stephini> it's still less convenient than having a button ON the case.
[22:58] <Bilby> if you need to reboot
[22:58] <Bilby> which, hypothetically... hopefully... should be a rare occurence
[22:58] <[Saint]> on a few of my raspis I put the button on the underside of the board and drilled a slightly larger hold, and it was easily accessible from the case exterior and not physically coupled to the case at all.,
[22:59] <[Saint]> having the button on the case is highly inconvenient, IMO.
[22:59] <[Saint]> But, meh.
[22:59] <[Saint]> s/hold/hole/
[22:59] <Stephini> but you are missing my point. if they put a hard button ON the case that limits the options of the consumer. Instead they could put the jumper there and let us choose what to plug into it in 3 seconds flat.
[22:59] <[Saint]> it also coun't be pressed accidentally due to being on the underside of the case.
[23:00] * Bilby is pretty sure we're all just replicating an argument the Raspi foundation had about 3 years ago...
[23:00] <[Saint]> Stephini: you keep saying case...
[23:00] * speeddragon (~speeddrag@217.129.192.97) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:00] <Stephini> s/ON the case/ON the board
[23:00] <[Saint]> I suspect you mean board?
[23:00] <[Saint]> aha.
[23:01] <Stephini> sometimes i mean case that time i meant board
[23:01] * IT_Sean (~sean@applefritter/IRCStaff) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2)
[23:02] <Stephini> with my system idealy it will be halted when not in use since it's effectively a games console. So i dont want to have to reach ALL the way into an NES case to press a button on the pi itself. so to me jumper pins are far supperior and at the same time can meet your needs by allowing you to slot a button or switch right onto the jumper ont eh board itself.
[23:02] * Smrtz (~Smrtz@unaffiliated/smrtz) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[23:07] <Bilby> yeah, header pin to a shutdown script should be perfect for you
[23:07] <Bilby> if you want to get really fancy you could use a relay to kick power to the board off, too
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[23:10] <Stephini> Bilby, you aren't actually reading what i'm saying. :P I know how to shutdown and turn on. my point is how inconvenient having P6 a switch soldered on the board was since my intent is to use P6 to unhalt while my board is 6 inches away from where my hand could even enter the build.
[23:11] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:11] * w9qbj (~mvore@pool-72-81-135-40.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:11] <WACOMalt> blargh, I cant figure out how the heck to move a berryboot OS over to berryboot for pi2
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[23:15] <ShorTie> when was the last time the os was fully updated ??
[23:15] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[23:16] <Bilby> Stephini i saw that, it wasn't what i was talking about :P
[23:16] <Bilby> I was talking about your planned power button
[23:17] * Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:18] <Stephini> i just wish my plan could be as cool as my idea. in minecraft i could do it. i imagine pulse limiters are a real circuit but i'm sure they are beyond my skill.
[23:18] <[Saint]> Stephini: you can easily have a button on the underside of the board *and* a 2-pin jumper to break it out to the exterior of any case you desire.
[23:19] <e^ipi> are you guys for real still arguing about this?
[23:19] <[Saint]> My point was that not adding a button that would vastly increase functionality for the outlay of a few cents (if that) per board seemed a weird decision.
[23:19] <e^ipi> the world is as it is
[23:19] <Stephini> [Saint], true but wouldn't it be cheaper just to have the jumpers and let people install their own button options? since this is meant to be the uber cheap computer?
[23:19] <WACOMalt> Berryboot says making an img of my install is too big for the filesystem... what can I do now?
[23:19] <Stephini> e^ipi, discussing not arguing
[23:20] <[Saint]> Stephini: sure, but, we're really talking about a few cents.
[23:20] <[Saint]> and, yes, there's no argument here.
[23:20] <[Saint]> Its a discussion.
[23:20] <Stephini> i dont get why when i have a casual discussion with people about theories on how things could be different people get up in arms about how we should be happy with how things are. i'm not even upset with the status quo gnerally but it can be fun to theorize and discuss alternatives.
[23:21] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@191.62.248.231) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:21] <[Saint]> I suspect no one would really care if its a $30 SBC, or a $30.10 SBC in reality.
[23:21] <Stephini> [Saint], surely not. but don't forget the adage about the camal's back.
[23:22] <[Saint]> Stephini: some people, myself included, find it very difficult to read implied tone into text.
[23:22] * wiiguy (fake@unaffiliated/wiiguy) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:22] <[Saint]> I could understand, at a stretch, someone thinking this is an argument.
[23:22] * shum1 (~sdothum@207.112.100.227) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:22] <[Saint]> But, as long as we know its not - stuff 'e,. ;)
[23:22] <[Saint]> *'em
[23:23] <Stephini> it surely wouldn't hurt to have a fist full of conveniences tacked on that raise the point in a hardly noticeable way. but the issue is where you draw the line. no matter where it is it looks arbitrary and leaves out someone.
[23:23] <Stephini> pricepoint*
[23:24] * spangles (~johnmurra@host86-155-213-31.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Quit: spangles)
[23:25] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) Quit (Quit: Cya)
[23:25] <[Saint]> Oh, certainly. And I do agree. But we're not realistically talking about adding functionality at the expense of shedding any other functionality, nor adding functionality that would dramatically increase the BOM.
[23:26] * utack_ (~utack@ip9234cb8c.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:26] <[Saint]> Purchased in the type of quantity these guys would be buying them in, 2-pin headers and 2-pole surface mound dome switches are literally a couple of cents each.
[23:26] <[Saint]> *mount
[23:27] * chispas-elek (~pse@unaffiliated/chispas-elek) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:27] <[Saint]> It seemed odd to me that at the very least, p6 didn't have a header attached.
[23:27] * denete_ (~denete@216.143.242.112) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[23:28] <[Saint]> I understand cutting costs at all available opportunity, but, honestly I suspect a lot of people aren't even using the GPIO headers, so you could fairly easily make that completely optional.
[23:29] <Stephini> while you are right that alot of people aren't for sure (kodi and retropie users who dont go nuts on builds the way i do) but the target audience is definatly getting good use of the GPIO. in fact it's the only thing my sister's class really did with their pis.
[23:30] <Bilby> iirc one of the design goals was to make a BBC... whatsit microcomputer for the new generation
[23:30] <[Saint]> Right, so in that vein, its not entirely unrealistic to have p6 populated with a header as well then.
[23:31] <Bilby> BBC Micros
[23:31] * [Saint] shrugs
[23:31] * abnormal (~abnormal@125.sub-70-209-129.myvzw.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:31] <Stephini> youd think kids learning on it could really make use of some way to turn it back on after halting it.
[23:31] <[Saint]> I understand meeting a very specific price point, but this is hardly adding anything of noteable worth to the BOM.
[23:31] <[Saint]> Especially in the quantities they're produced in.
[23:31] <[Saint]> Stephini: precisely
[23:32] <[Saint]> especially considering how many people end up knocking the smoothing cap off the board when plugging/re-plugging that godawful microUSB.
[23:32] <Stephini> ok i keep seing that acronym but i cant place it. i get what it means based on context but the exact meaning evades me. i'm used to seing PPC(price per capita) the way you keep using BOM
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[23:32] * jazzzu (~jazzzu@D97B7B1C.cm-3-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[23:32] <[Saint]> Bill Of Materials
[23:33] <Stephini> ahh
[23:33] <[Saint]> "total cost of $things and $stuff"
[23:34] <Stephini> what smoothing cap are people knocking off?
[23:34] * tombrough (~tom@cpc3-newt3-0-0-cust165.19-3.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[23:35] <[Saint]> But, yeah, I would posit that having either a header that people could easily slot a push button onto, and/or a surface mount dome button on the underside of the board, would _greatly_ reduce the amount of smoothing caps that get knocked off the board, and the amount of microUSB power socket deaths.
[23:35] * tombrough (~tom@cpc3-newt3-0-0-cust165.19-3.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:35] <[Saint]> (its really easy to lift the microUSB socket off the board and rip out the traces entirely)
[23:35] * dj_pi (~dj@c-107-5-228-80.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:36] <Stephini> i have been thinking about the button on the bottom. wouldn't a dome switch on the bottom be really easy to trigger if you bumped the pi which alot of people just lay out on the counter?
[23:36] <[Saint]> Stephini: http://www.raspberrypi.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/sony-rasp-pi.jpg <-- bottom left
[23:36] <[Saint]> big round drum cap, right behind the microUSB
[23:37] <[Saint]> People use it as leverage to pull the cable.
[23:37] <Stephini> hrm dont think mine has that anywhere near the micro usb. maybe that's one of the things they fixxed in the +s?
[23:37] <[Saint]> The pi will work without it, but if you have a noisey PSU, ...things can get ugly.
[23:38] <[Saint]> yes, that's correct
[23:38] * Wec (~Perkele@a450-83-150-119-246.nebulazone.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:39] <Stephini> that's why i didn't recognize the issue. :P for me the issue is when i'm plugging and unplugging power i'm always worried i may zap something. Idealy if i lived alone i'd go all largo in a totally sterile fabric free room when working anywhere near PCBs of ANY kind.
[23:39] <Stephini> and yes i'm all kinds of paranoid and crazy. :P
[23:39] <[Saint]> just hold on to the eth port, or the edged of the baord.
[23:40] <[Saint]> The eth port casing is sheilded, and firmly anchored.
[23:40] <[Saint]> Ideally, just grip the edge of the board firmly.
[23:40] <Stephini> i figure these things. I just hate dealing with power and exposed PCBs even though i've not once in my life had SED.
[23:41] <[Saint]> But, /really/ ideally, you shouldn't have to remove the power cable and re-insert it to bring the device back up.
[23:41] <[Saint]> You can of course add an inline switch to the USB power cable.
[23:41] <[Saint]> But, that's fairly invasive and neddn't be something a user has to do.
[23:41] <[Saint]> *needn't
[23:41] <[Saint]> Yep.
[23:42] <[Saint]> Opinions. - I've gots 'em.
[23:42] <Stephini> nothing wrong with opinions.
[23:43] * hamrove (~hamrove@96-8-209-215.block0.gvtc.com) Quit (Quit: hamrove)
[23:43] <Stephini> what's the naked jumper "RUN" on the b+ for?
[23:43] * exobuzz (~xbuzz@2001:470:1f09:1970:5cc7:e40f:a5a4:29e6) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:44] <[Saint]> IIRC, that's the "new" p6.
[23:44] <Stephini> nvm that's the p6. :P weird that i wired the p6 but didnt' recognize it.
[23:44] <[Saint]> If I'm not mistaken, "run" is the functional equivalent of the p6 header on the older boards.
[23:45] <Stephini> so basically the b+ has much fewer unused connectors than the older models?
[23:49] <[Saint]> It does. I actually got one of my model B boards with the "unused" header in the middle populated.
[23:49] <[Saint]> But, I have no idea what its for.
[23:50] * m8 (~m@unaffiliated/m8) Quit (Quit: Sto andando via)
[23:50] <[Saint]> it seems that some of them were populated - though, I've no idea how or why, or when they stopped doing so, or started, or why only _one_ of my boards had that particular header populated.
[23:50] <[Saint]> See: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d2/Raspberry_Pi_Photo.jpg
[23:51] <[Saint]> My one that had that header populated also happened to have a black RCA out.
[23:51] <[Saint]> ...which I also found weird.
[23:51] <l_r> what the hell does apt-get upgrade libraspberry0 do? it makes my cm non-bootable
[23:52] <l_r> damn it
[23:52] * Saphyel (~charlie@81.202.153.234.dyn.user.ono.com) Quit (Quit: Steam powered)
[23:53] <[Saint]> apt-get upgrade doesn't work that way.
[23:53] <[Saint]> anything after 'upgrade' will just get stripped out.
[23:54] <nefarious> No it won't ;)
[23:54] <[Saint]> Hmmmm, actually, no - my mistake.
[23:54] <[Saint]> It will check, but then it'll go on and do a full upgrade anyway from what I'm seeing here.
[23:55] * divine (~divine@2001:470:8247:1::30) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:55] <[Saint]> so to me it seems functionally identical to just 'apt-get upgrade'
[23:55] <nefarious> I was thinking flags, but you could well be right also
[23:55] <[Saint]> I guess its just added piece of mind?
[23:55] * simiuskong (~simiuskon@2a01:348:99:158:255:215:77:1) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:56] <[Saint]> by way of telling you explicitly if $package is up-to-date or not.
[23:56] * c00ljs (~c00ljs@191.62.248.231) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:56] <l_r> what a pain.... sudo apt-get upgrade && sudo apt-get install libraspberrypi0 corrupts the os in some way...
[23:56] <l_r> now the cm is (again) no longer bootable
[23:56] <[Saint]> but, plain old 'apt-get-upgrade' should do that anyway. By way of telling you everything its upgrading, everything its not telling you about is up-to-date.
[23:57] * iamjarvo (~textual@pool-98-115-181-52.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[23:58] <l_r> how can i recover the boot partitoin now?
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[23:58] * IT_Sean (~Ult_Ubunt@applefritter/IRCStaff) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:59] * ChanServ sets mode +o IT_Sean
[23:59] <[Saint]> Hmmmmmmmm...
[23:59] <[Saint]> Yeah, it does appear to work the way I expected.
[23:59] <[Saint]> I wonder if that's intentional:
[23:59] <[Saint]> http://pastebin.com/mNnmZWJt
[23:59] <l_r> it seems the installation copied the old boot content in /usr/share/rpikernelhack/

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