#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2017-03-21

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

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[0:12] <plum> don't need to tidy your ~/Desktop if you've always got a mess of windows covering it.
[0:12] <plum> #rollsafe
[0:12] <plum> :P
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[0:19] <julius_> whats the pi zero power usage in idle when not using the attached camera?
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[0:37] <methuzla> julius_: ~100mA
[0:39] <julius_> thanks
[0:39] <methuzla> julius_: http://raspi.tv/2017/how-much-power-does-pi-zero-w-use
[0:39] <julius_> ah great
[0:40] <julius_> was just curious if battery operation for a camera that gets activated when movement is detected via a pir sensor
[0:40] <julius_> would be possible
[0:41] <julius_> but with 100ma, one would need a big battery
[0:41] <methuzla> wildlife camera?
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[0:47] <julius_> whats a wildlife camera?
[0:48] <julius_> found a pi zero on aliexpress with a 5mp camera module connected via the flat "ribbon" cable
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[0:53] <swift110> nice julius_
[0:55] * jaziz (~jaziz@unaffiliated/jaziz) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[0:55] <methuzla> julius_: camera that takes photo of animals (wildlife) when they walk by
[0:55] <methuzla> julius_: how long do you want camera to run?
[0:55] <julius_> ah ok...
[0:55] <swift110> methuzla: I want to build one of those
[0:55] <julius_> at least 10minutes
[0:56] <methuzla> in total? thats very doable with battery. can go up to hours.
[0:56] <julius_> kind of a burglary alarm, send out intrusion detection message via wlan and also record a few minutes
[0:57] <julius_> sure, but how long can a bettery last when the zero uses its ~60ma idle all the time
[0:57] <methuzla> hours
[0:57] * whatever_hi (~whatever_@63-157-105-234.dia.static.qwest.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:57] <julius_> was more thinking about weeks....gonna go with a 5v power supply
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[0:58] <julius_> is it allowed to ask orange pi questions here?
[0:58] <swift110> wow
[0:58] <methuzla> meh. not disallowed. but don't expect answer.
[0:59] <methuzla> and weeks would indeed require a large a battery or some other tricks
[1:00] <dtype> you can get pretty big usb batteries these days
[1:01] <dtype> a moderately large 30Ah one would be 300h at 0.1A idle (about that of a pi0)
[1:01] <dtype> assuming that you get the ideal math out of it
[1:02] <dtype> camera is going to use battery too though, along with motion sensing processing
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[1:06] <julius_> ok, didnt know that
[1:07] <julius_> thats actually almost what i need
[1:07] <mfa298> dtype: except that the Ah rating is likely at 3.7V rather than the 5v needed by the pi, so you might be drawing nearr 0.2A from the battery
[1:07] <mfa298> also a battery claiming 30Ah may well be using alternative facts (i.e. made up numbers)
[1:08] <dtype> yep, and may not provide that at a particular draw
[1:08] * de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[1:08] <codingpanic> really, alternative facts?
[1:08] <dtype> but one could shoot for half of ideal/advertised and at least have some place to work from for napkin calculations
[1:08] * codingpanic wished people would stop using that phrase
[1:09] <HrdwrBoB> codingpanic: alternative facts?
[1:09] <HrdwrBoB> it's a great way to say lies
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[1:09] <codingpanic> HrdwrBoB: yeah, but it sounds doubleplusungood
[1:10] <HrdwrBoB> heh
[1:10] <codingpanic> they are not facts at all
[1:10] <codingpanic> they are just lies
[1:10] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@host-67-21-184-89.nctv.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[1:10] <HrdwrBoB> are you saying that people in the governemnt are lying?
[1:10] <codingpanic> HrdwrBoB: this isnt a political channel
[1:11] <HrdwrBoB> I know, I'm also being sarcastic
[1:11] <mfa298> for electronics those made up numbers are often based on something in reality, they're just not useful numbers
[1:11] <dtype> back to the topic, and taking bets on whether or not a 30Ah battery will sustain a little p0 for a week
[1:12] <HrdwrBoB> dtype: the only way to be SURE is to test
[1:12] <HrdwrBoB> because the real world is harsh
[1:12] <dtype> fire one up, let it idle, and let's watch it for a week over a few beers?
[1:12] <julius_> i was thinking about starting the pi zero via a atmega which would look for movement in the room. but from my rpi2 experience i guess boot times of the zero will be to slow
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[1:12] <HrdwrBoB> dtype: yep
[1:12] <HrdwrBoB> dtype: live stream too
[1:13] <HrdwrBoB> julius_: way too slow
[1:13] <HrdwrBoB> pi3 with decent storage is reasonably fast
[1:13] <julius_> is there maybe a way to use the pi zero to just record the camera signal without having a full os running in the background?
[1:13] <HrdwrBoB> I don't find it a problem in the car
[1:14] <mfa298> i suspect the average curent draw of a pi zero doing something useful is > 0.1a
[1:14] <julius_> HrdwrBoB, thats where my pi2 will be soon :)
[1:14] <HrdwrBoB> julius_: http://imgur.com/a/quEDa
[1:14] <HrdwrBoB> I just ordered a new 7" 1024x600 touchscreen for it
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[1:15] <julius_> HrdwrBoB, quite nice
[1:16] <julius_> HrdwrBoB, what will you be using it fore besides technical data?
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[1:16] <julius_> will it also be used for music?
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[1:19] <HrdwrBoB> no
[1:19] <HrdwrBoB> I have an android head unit which handles all of that
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[1:23] <HrdwrBoB> I have done things like that before - it almost never comes out as good as an off the shelf solution
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[1:23] <HrdwrBoB> car radios have lots of features that are hard/impossible to replicate
[1:24] <HrdwrBoB> like adding an FM radio ... I did it with a USB radio, but it pinned the cpu (which I could live with), but it was also about 5 seconds delayed due to the way it worked, which ends up being a dealbreaker
[1:24] <HrdwrBoB> lots of little issues like that
[1:28] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[1:31] <julius_> that is very true
[1:32] <julius_> hard to replicated and you dont come out cheaper
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[1:42] <HrdwrBoB> yep
[1:42] <HrdwrBoB> better to work on this that don't exist
[1:42] <HrdwrBoB> or that you know you can improve on
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[1:46] <Chillum> mfa298: my experiments showed that while idle with no usb devices it was at about 80mA
[1:47] <Chillum> that was with no GPU usage either though, that GPU will use a fair bit mroe
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[1:55] <dtype> Chillum: that meshes with other things I've seen for idle power
[1:57] * Duckle|wasDumle (~quassel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[1:58] <Duckle|wasDumle> Hey there. I'm trying to cut corners here, and was wondering if the pi would be ok if connected to some IO that is pulled to 5v through a 10k resistor?
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[2:00] <Duckle|wasDumle> If we assume any io diode clamps are there, they'd clamp 0.17uA or less
[2:00] <Duckle|wasDumle> ehh, mA
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[2:06] <Chillum> Duckle|wasDumle: I have done it and it worked
[2:06] <Chillum> but after a few months the pin died
[2:06] <Duckle|wasDumle> 10k?
[2:06] <Duckle|wasDumle> or lower?
[2:06] <Chillum> yes
[2:07] <Duckle|wasDumle> dang. I guess I'll have to make a small board for this level-shifter then
[2:07] <Chillum> I had another, it is still working after ayear
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[2:07] <Duckle|wasDumle> This is for my 3d printer, It'll be allways on, and I want it to be reliable :/
[2:07] <Chillum> a simple voltage divider will do in most cases
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[2:08] <Duckle|wasDumle> It's a pullup for a pfet
[2:08] <Chillum> oh
[2:08] <Duckle|wasDumle> adding a resistor to gnd would kinda defeat the purpose
[2:08] <Duckle|wasDumle> :)
[2:08] <Chillum> ya one of those super cheap level shifter boards will do nicely
[2:08] <Duckle|wasDumle> yea
[2:08] <Duckle|wasDumle> this one just has 4 channels, and I only need 1 :P
[2:08] <precarken> Hello all, just finished my first Raspberry Pi project... Controlling a k'nex roller coaster motor and LED lights... I'm getting ready to add a k'nex ferris wheel, once I add it though I will not have any pins left. What do people normally do when you have used up all pins? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6Pb5WgyIvQ
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[2:10] <Chillum> Duckle|wasDumle: really it is just a transistor(https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/BSS138.pdf) and two resistors
[2:10] * NeverDie (~NeverDie@pool-98-116-59-104.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:10] <Chillum> assuming you already have a 3.3V and 5V reference that is all you need
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[2:12] <Duckle|wasDumle> Chillum: Yeah, I know the thing :)
[2:12] * bberg (~bbergz@unaffiliated/bberg) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[2:12] <Duckle|wasDumle> Chillum: Have you read the original phillips doc on it? Beautifully simple :)
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[2:13] <plugwash> Chillum, while it is just one transistor it is a transistor with pretty specific properties
[2:13] <Duckle|wasDumle> It's an nmos, logiclevel
[2:14] <Duckle|wasDumle> not much more specific than that is it?
[2:14] <plugwash> I seem to remember people struggling to find a throuhole part with the right properties
[2:14] <Chillum> no, which phillips doc?
[2:15] <Duckle|wasDumle> Chillum: https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/an97055.pdf
[2:15] <Chillum> a through hole version would be handy
[2:15] <plugwash> https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/an97055.pdf
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[2:18] <plugwash> seems my memory was mistaken. Phillips actually reccomend a throughole device
[2:19] <plugwash> but hmm, not sure if it's actually available
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[2:36] <BurtyB> Duckle|wasDumle, I've been using a 100k and it seems ok so far
[2:37] <Duckle|wasDumle> almost done wiring in this levelshifter, so eh
[2:37] <Duckle|wasDumle> just a waste of space, but if it fits in the case, eh
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[2:40] <BurtyB> Duckle|wasDumle, http://www.mosaic-industries.com/embedded-systems/microcontroller-projects/raspberry-pi/on-off-power-controller has some maths on it
[2:43] <hmoney> burtyb: i got the clusterhat setup as a docker swarm :)
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[3:00] <BurtyB> hmoney, :) did the network side of things play OK for you?
[3:01] <hmoney> yeah.. turns out once i installed docker on the controller, then it automatically blocks all network connections to the zero's. I just had to run a simple iptables command and I was back up and running
[3:01] <hmoney> I thought my router was going crazy
[3:01] <hmoney> the zeros would all pop up as connected clients then disappear 5 seconds later
[3:02] <hmoney> I'm now going to try and get someone to 3d print this case for me: https://www.tinkercad.com/things/3ESgqNZjDJJ-clusterhat-case
[3:02] <hmoney> I clicked a link on tinkercad's website and did a price check, they wanted like 45+shipping though :(
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[3:07] <BurtyB> hmoney, I hadn't seen that before - looks a bit big for my 3d printer tho as is :/
[3:08] <hmoney> yeah I'm not 100% sure it's necessary, nor worth the money, but I'm still gonna see what the cheapest option is before i build a small box
[3:09] * BurtyB ordered the bits for https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/clusterhat/case$20modmypi%7Csort:relevance/clusterhat/_dVg2heVLw8/McygLGoRAwAJ a while ago tho I haven't put it together yet
[3:10] <hmoney> damn
[3:10] <hmoney> just looks like a storage container with a hole drilled into it lol
[3:13] <BurtyB> heh true - I'm prob going to take off a micro usb connector (or err not put one on) and wire it up to one of the sockets to I don't have the usb cable outside but it should be a bit safer on my super tidy desk in a case ;)
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[3:18] <hmoney> ah nice
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[3:28] <[Saint]> It's the modmypi stacker case with a bunch of additional stacker rings, apparently.
[3:29] <[Saint]> I do have the Pi cluster hat, but due to the fundamental limitations of the Pis themselves I find that clustering with them is pretty foolish.
[3:29] <GreeningGalaxy> too much communication overhead?
[3:30] <[Saint]> Eh, not really. Just piss-poor latency and throughput potential.
[3:30] <[Saint]> I do have a couple of Pi-based clusters, but I use an ODROID XU4 as the client and Rpi 3s as the slaves.
[3:30] <hmoney> im using them to learn docker and docker swarm :/
[3:31] * akk (~akkana@71-222-171-13.albq.qwest.net) Quit (Quit: +++)
[3:31] <[Saint]> XU4 has dedicated USB3 controller and gigE.
[3:32] <[Saint]> So you can use an XU4, and 8 rpi 3s, on a 10 port gigabit switch, and still have a free port for WAN/LAN.
[3:32] <[Saint]> And not jam the network up with bottleneck.
[3:33] <[Saint]> Most inexpensive and flexible way to throw the largest amount of reasonably powerful ARM cores at a cluster that I'm aware of.
[3:34] * Colti (Miramar-FL@unaffiliated/colti) Quit (Excess Flood)
[3:34] <[Saint]> End up with a potential of ~45GB of processing power and 8GB RAM with 8 Pi 3s in a cluster with an ODROID XU4 (or similar) as the client.
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[3:36] <[Saint]> That's at 1.4GHz (200MHz overclock) though. Which /most/ RPi 3s will do.
[3:36] <[Saint]> At default clocks it's ~38GHz.
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[3:59] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@host-67-21-184-89.nctv.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[3:59] * patr0clus (~weechat@unaffiliated/patr0clus) Quit (Quit: tempusfugit)
[4:00] * hon (~hon@c-68-47-51-53.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
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[4:05] <Sonny_Jim> Erg
[4:05] <Sonny_Jim> iptraf-ng seems to be spamming my mail
[4:05] <Sonny_Jim> error: iptraf-ng:2 duplicate log entry for /var/log/iptraf/mail-stopper.log
[4:05] <Sonny_Jim> Get one of those each day, looks like bad configuration :/
[4:06] * mossman93 (~mossman93@unaffiliated/mossman93) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:07] * webturtle0 (~webturtle@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[4:08] * danielmetlitski (a29c49c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[4:08] <danielmetlitski> hello
[4:08] <Sonny_Jim> Hi
[4:08] <danielmetlitski> i just got a raspberry pi zero w and im having trouble setting it up
[4:08] <Sonny_Jim> ok
[4:09] <danielmetlitski> i got the basic pac that comes with a microUSB with the NOOBS installed
[4:09] <danielmetlitski> and i wanna ssh into my raspberry pi
[4:09] <danielmetlitski> but i cant find a config.txt file on the microusb
[4:10] <Sonny_Jim> What files do you see on the SD card
[4:10] <danielmetlitski> https://i.snag.gy/ktsEwM.jpg
[4:10] * de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[4:11] <Sonny_Jim> I haven't used NOOBS so I'm not sure you would expect to see config.txt in there
[4:11] * hmoney- (~hmoney@unaffiliated/hmoney) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:11] <danielmetlitski> hmmm
[4:11] <danielmetlitski> im just confused what to do
[4:11] * alexandre9099 (~alexandre@gateway/tor-sasl/alexandre9099) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[4:11] * h1a1c0k1e1r1 (~h1a1c0k1e@gateway/tor-sasl/h1a1c0k1e1r1) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[4:12] <Sonny_Jim> Are you looking to use Rasbian?
[4:12] * hmoney (~hmoney@unaffiliated/hmoney) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[4:12] <danielmetlitski> yes
[4:12] * dj_pi (~dj@c-68-43-191-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:12] <Sonny_Jim> If so, just write a recent Raspbian image to the SD card and off you go
[4:12] <Sonny_Jim> I appreciate NOOBS is supposed to help new users, but I think it can cause confusions, such as this
[4:12] * amiiboh (~amiiboh@ has joined #raspberrypi
[4:12] <danielmetlitski> https://www.adafruit.com/product/3259
[4:13] <danielmetlitski> im using this
[4:13] <Sonny_Jim> Ah ok
[4:13] * h1a1c0k1e1r1 (~h1a1c0k1e@gateway/tor-sasl/h1a1c0k1e1r1) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:13] <danielmetlitski> and i dont have a monitor
[4:13] <Sonny_Jim> NOOBS doesn't let you see the config.txt (it's held on a partition Windows can't see)
[4:13] <danielmetlitski> so i wanna connect via ssh
[4:13] * de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:13] <danielmetlitski> im on mac by the way
[4:13] <Sonny_Jim> So yeah, just download and install Raspbian
[4:13] * alexandre9099 (~alexandre@gateway/tor-sasl/alexandre9099) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:14] <danielmetlitski> onto where
[4:14] <danielmetlitski> the SD card?
[4:14] <Sonny_Jim> Yes
[4:14] <Sonny_Jim> Instructions are available on the wiki (somewhere)
[4:14] <danielmetlitski> err
[4:14] <danielmetlitski> well it should be simple
[4:14] <danielmetlitski> but i dont wanna erase this sd card
[4:14] <danielmetlitski> since it came a long with it
[4:14] <Sonny_Jim> https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/installation/installing-images/mac.md
[4:14] * Sonny_Jim shrugs
[4:14] <Sonny_Jim> It's just data
[4:15] <danielmetlitski> why would they disable ssh in noobs
[4:15] <danielmetlitski> wtf
[4:15] <Sonny_Jim> There's a very good reason
[4:15] <danielmetlitski> ?
[4:15] <Sonny_Jim> In fact SSH is disabled in Raspbian too
[4:15] <danielmetlitski> so people without screens cant connect?
[4:15] <Sonny_Jim> Having over a million devices with SSH exposed and a default password is not good
[4:16] <Sonny_Jim> You can turn on SSH easily enough under Raspbian by creating a file called 'ssh'
[4:16] <Sonny_Jim> Not sure about NOOBS
[4:16] <danielmetlitski> hmm
[4:17] <danielmetlitski> also
[4:17] <danielmetlitski> do you know if the raspberry pi zero w has a light
[4:17] <danielmetlitski> that helps you know if its turned on
[4:18] <Sonny_Jim> No idea, I only have the 'normal' ones
[4:18] <Sonny_Jim> The wiki will probably have the answer
[4:19] <Sonny_Jim> "the PI zero does NOT have a power LED, only an activity LED which becomes only active after the PI is booting."
[4:19] * elnormous (~elnormous@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:19] <danielmetlitski> hmm
[4:19] <danielmetlitski> also
[4:19] <danielmetlitski> how do i turn it off
[4:19] <danielmetlitski> just unplug?
[4:19] * julius_ (~julius@dslb-092-076-153-113.092.076.pools.vodafone-ip.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[4:19] <Sonny_Jim> Well, you need to issue a shutdown, but you can't do that headless with no network
[4:19] <danielmetlitski> hmm yes
[4:20] <Sonny_Jim> So yeah, just yank it out. There's no power button
[4:20] <Sonny_Jim> You can always make your own if you see fit
[4:20] <danielmetlitski> is it bad to yank it?
[4:20] <Sonny_Jim> Well, 'carefully remove it' would be better ;)
[4:20] <danielmetlitski> ok
[4:20] <danielmetlitski> im gonna go to the dollar store rite now to see if i can find some cables
[4:20] <danielmetlitski> to use a monitor with it
[4:20] <danielmetlitski> brb
[4:20] * \\Mr_C\\ (mrc@ has joined #raspberrypi
[4:20] <danielmetlitski> thx for the help Sonny
[4:21] <Sonny_Jim> np
[4:27] * RaTTuS|BIG (~RaTTuSBIG@37.152-253-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[4:43] * insomnia is now known as BipolarBear
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[5:28] * spacebar_ (~textual@2601:58a:8601:8e2:48c6:540:4125:ecb8) Quit (Quit: spacebar_ pressed ESC)
[5:32] * GreeningGalaxy (~ellie@24-148-40-135.c3-0.grn-ubr1.chi-grn.il.cable.rcn.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:34] * Leeky (Leeky@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:abfb) Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
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[5:38] * de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[5:39] * plugwash (~plugwash@2a02:c7f:ba49:1500::2) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[5:39] * Leeky (Leeky@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:abfb) has joined #raspberrypi
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[5:40] <danielmetlitski> ok
[5:40] <danielmetlitski> i got the cables i need
[5:40] <danielmetlitski> i plugged my raspberry pi zero w to my monitor
[5:40] <danielmetlitski> now what
[5:41] <danielmetlitski> it was a microusb with a noobs on it
[5:41] <danielmetlitski> Sonny_Jim you still here by any chance
[5:42] <danielmetlitski> raspberry pi zero w
[5:43] <danielmetlitski> im using the pre installed microsd
[5:43] <danielmetlitski> does anyone here have a raspberry pi zero w
[5:44] <danielmetlitski> its making some kind of noise when i put my ear to it
[5:45] <danielmetlitski> ive never worked with one before, does anyone here know
[5:45] <dtype> I thought noobs normally booted up into a little system with a display and all
[5:45] <dtype> although admittedly I'm not the expert on that. I just flash a different OS.
[5:45] <dtype> but the couple of times I saw noobs, pretty sure it was at least a way to verify you were getting video and a valid boot
[5:46] <danielmetlitski> hmm
[5:46] * BipolarBear is now known as Boomerangutan
[5:46] <danielmetlitski> do you have a zero w dtype?
[5:46] <dtype> not a 0w, no.
[5:47] <GreeningGalaxy> I got my 0W today, haven't powered it up yet. Someone over in ##electronics was saying the wifi chip makes noises, though.
[5:48] <GreeningGalaxy> I think it's normal for it to do that. If it's a problem, best fix is probably either disabling the onboard wifi or getting an insulating case.
[5:49] * precarken (~precarken@unaffiliated/precarken) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[5:50] * Boomerangutan is now known as MervPumpkinhead
[5:53] <redrabbit> lol
[5:53] * redrabbit spreading rumors
[5:54] <redrabbit> the alfa cards emit that sound as well.. i guess i have good ears
[5:54] <redrabbit> its a bit of coil whine when it starts and on some wlan activities like high throughput
[5:54] <redrabbit> got to be cose
[5:54] <redrabbit> close*
[5:55] * spybert (~spybert@c-50-173-239-209.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[5:55] <redrabbit> ah it seems like the method to disabel the act led that worked on the pi0 dont work on the pi0w
[5:56] * enginerd123 (47da02e3@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[5:56] <enginerd123> Anybody home?
[5:58] * danielmetlitski (a29c49c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[6:02] * cave (~various@2001:15c0:65ff:8850::2) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:04] * spybert (~spybert@c-50-173-239-209.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:06] * hydrogen (~hydrogen@amarok/developer/hydrogen) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[6:06] * enginerd123 (47da02e3@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[6:07] <Chillum> I am home
[6:07] <Chillum> geez
[6:07] <Chillum> try waiting more than 10 minutes
[6:10] <redrabbit> fail to irc
[6:13] * Blendify is now known as Blendify|zzz
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[6:26] * rikk (~rikk@unaffiliated/rikk) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[6:26] * GreeningGalaxy (~ellie@24-148-40-135.c3-0.grn-ubr1.chi-grn.il.cable.rcn.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[6:27] <Sonny_Jim> redrabbit: That'll be transformer/inductor whine
[6:28] <Sonny_Jim> https://superuser.com/questions/832480/why-do-some-ac-adapters-and-power-supplies-generate-a-whining-noise-and-what-ca
[6:29] <Sonny_Jim> From memory, there's a small inductor on the board for the 5v regulator
[6:30] <redrabbit> pwm regulation noise maybe
[6:31] <Sonny_Jim> Chips generally don't make any noise
[6:31] <Sonny_Jim> It'll be the inductor/transformer, it changes pitch when the load on the PSU changes
[6:31] <HrdwrBoB> they do
[6:31] <HrdwrBoB> everything makes noise
[6:31] <Chillum> wow man, nothing is still
[6:31] * Sonny_Jim shrugs
[6:31] <Chillum> everything vibrates
[6:31] <Sonny_Jim> Never heard a piece of sillicon make a noise
[6:31] <HrdwrBoB> but for this purpose, yeah
[6:32] <Sonny_Jim> Well, apart from 'ffssst *bang*'
[6:32] <Chillum> the whole universe is singing in harmony
[6:32] <redrabbit> looks like shorewall is breaking my pi0w
[6:32] <redrabbit> :v
[6:33] <HrdwrBoB> ambient noise is typically WELL above any electronics noise
[6:33] * phinxy (~tehhhd@unaffiliated/phinxy) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[6:35] <Lartza> Graphics card coil whine can get over that, but that's the only time I've experienced issues :)
[6:36] * Allen_ (~Allen_@c-73-220-153-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[6:36] <redrabbit> usb extension cords
[6:36] <redrabbit> load of whine
[6:36] <redrabbit> with some of them
[6:36] <Lartza> How?
[6:36] <Lartza> They don't have anything that can whine
[6:36] <redrabbit> you plug then, you hear them
[6:36] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@host-67-21-184-89.nctv.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:37] <redrabbit> ^^
[6:37] <Lartza> :D
[6:37] <Sonny_Jim> At a guess, they have regulators on each end to make sure there's not a large drop in the 5v
[6:37] <Sonny_Jim> Some of them aren't just a straight piece of wire, but have electronics in them
[6:37] <redrabbit> yeah and they spit it in the system
[6:37] <redrabbit> making everything noisy
[6:38] * cave (~various@2001:15c0:65ff:8850::2) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[6:41] * Dark-Show (~Dark-Show@sydnns0115w-047054178122.dhcp-dynamic.FibreOP.ns.bellaliant.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[6:49] * elnormous (~elnormous@ Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[6:58] * An_Onion (~Anorion@unaffiliated/saidinunleashed) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[6:58] <Zardoz> it's called inductance
[7:00] * mawnkey (~quassel@c-69-247-120-180.hsd1.ms.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[7:00] <Zardoz> and if you have enough electron flow it can make things hum and whine
[7:00] * vstehle (~vstehle@rqp06-1-88-178-86-202.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[7:16] * mal_will (uid195162@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qgymnvmgkvbobbzf) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
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[7:58] * int3nz0r (~int3nz0r@541A8E1B.cm-5-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:02] <kerio> redrabbit: it worked for me on the pi0w
[8:02] <kerio> i mean, just set the led to default-on if you really want
[8:03] * Viper168_ is now known as Viper168
[8:03] <kerio> or use the dtoverlay to invert it
[8:08] * Tyklol is now known as Tykling
[8:11] <kerio> why didn't anyone mention that the pi supports hdmi cec
[8:12] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[8:13] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:13] * danielmetltiski (a29c49c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[8:14] <danielmetltiski> hello friends, i got a raspberry pi zero w
[8:14] <kerio> me too ;o
[8:14] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[8:14] <danielmetltiski> i was able to connect via ssh to it, but am unsure how to connect to the internet with wifi
[8:14] <kerio> how did you ssh into it? g_ether?
[8:14] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:14] <danielmetltiski> yes kerio
[8:15] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[8:15] <danielmetltiski> eventually i would like to vpn to the desktop since i cannot afford a monitor
[8:15] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:15] <danielmetltiski> but i am lost right now trying to connect it to my wifi so i can 'sudo apt-get update'
[8:15] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[8:16] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:16] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[8:16] <kerio> danielmetltiski: append http://sprunge.us/MZdf to /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf
[8:17] <kerio> and then... huh, reboot
[8:17] <danielmetltiski> do you know how to reboot?
[8:17] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:17] <danielmetltiski> other than unplugging the power?
[8:17] * Rolfs (~rolf@ has joined #raspberrypi
[8:17] <kerio> sudo reboot
[8:17] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[8:17] <danielmetltiski> thank you
[8:18] <kerio> i mean you could've just restarted wpa_supplicant i guess?
[8:18] <kerio> or done the connection manually
[8:18] <danielmetltiski> do you know
[8:18] <danielmetltiski> does it support 5G networks?
[8:18] <kerio> i believe it's 2.4ghz only
[8:19] <danielmetltiski> thanks
[8:19] <danielmetltiski> fiber internet problems XD
[8:19] <danielmetltiski> i have a network for 2.4 tho too so its all good
[8:19] * elnormous (~elnormous@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[8:20] * MervPumpkinhead (~insomnia@unaffiliated/insomnia) Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[8:20] <danielmetltiski> kerio
[8:20] <danielmetltiski> do you know the command to shut it down by chance
[8:20] <kerio> that would be poweroff
[8:20] <danielmetltiski> before i unplug it
[8:20] <kerio> (run as root, so sudo poweroff)
[8:21] <danielmetltiski> thank you so much (:
[8:22] * CompanionCube (samis@unaffiliated/drmushroom) Quit (Excess Flood)
[8:22] * CompanionCube (samis@unaffiliated/drmushroom) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:23] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
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[8:29] * Zparx (~Fox@dslb-188-108-178-006.188.108.pools.vodafone-ip.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:30] * hhmmm (~i@unaffiliated/humbag) Quit (Quit: oops)
[8:33] * jguillen (~jguillen@s158m188.unavarra.es) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:33] * webturtle0 (~webturtle@ Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[8:34] * ZapaN (uid217421@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vpyntuhlopxfbaty) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:34] * fragtion (~dems@srv.webintuitive.co.za) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[8:36] * Allen_ (~Allen_@c-73-220-153-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[8:41] * Allen_ (~Allen_@c-73-220-153-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[8:41] * RaTTuS|BIG (~RaTTuSBIG@37.152-253-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:41] * ChanServ sets mode +o RaTTuS|BIG
[8:41] * ChanServ sets mode -o RaTTuS|BIG
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[8:47] * chra94 (~chra94@unaffiliated/chra94) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[8:47] <danielmetltiski> hey kerio
[8:47] <danielmetltiski> i edited my file thing
[8:47] <danielmetltiski> how do i save
[8:47] <danielmetltiski> i tried command+X
[8:47] * max12345 (~max@x55b3a900.dyn.telefonica.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:48] <kerio> how did you edit it
[8:48] <danielmetltiski> command x
[8:48] <kerio> wtf
[8:48] <danielmetltiski> i was able to close it
[8:48] <danielmetltiski> ok
[8:48] <danielmetltiski> i closed it
[8:48] <danielmetltiski> i edited it with
[8:48] <danielmetltiski> sudo nano /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf
[8:49] <danielmetltiski> for SSID
[8:49] <danielmetltiski> i entered my wifi name thing
[8:49] <danielmetltiski> is that right
[8:49] <danielmetltiski> like, my wifi network name
[8:49] <danielmetltiski> im following this guide
[8:49] <danielmetltiski> https://www.piborg.org/blog/pi-zero-wifi-bluetooth
[8:49] * teepee_ (~teepee@unaffiliated/teepee) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:49] * miczac (~miczac@mobiledyn4.mrsn.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[8:50] <danielmetltiski> i guess my question is
[8:50] <danielmetltiski> is how do i check if internet work
[8:50] <danielmetltiski> works
[8:51] <danielmetltiski> via ssh
[8:51] <danielmetltiski> ill try sudo apt-get update i guess
[8:52] <Sonny_Jim> ping google.com
[8:52] <Sonny_Jim> or ping if you just want to check for internet and not DNS resolving
[8:52] <danielmetltiski> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ ping google.com ping: unknown host google.com
[8:52] <Sonny_Jim> Right, so try ping
[8:52] <danielmetltiski> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ ping connect: Network is unreachable
[8:52] <Sonny_Jim> There you go
[8:52] <danielmetltiski> ok so
[8:52] <Sonny_Jim> Did you manually configure your internet?
[8:52] <danielmetltiski> error in my conf file?
[8:53] <Sonny_Jim> Sounds like the Pi doesn't know what gateway it's supposed to use
[8:53] <danielmetltiski> i cinfigured it with
[8:53] <danielmetltiski> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo nano /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf
[8:53] <danielmetltiski> and changed the SSD to my network name
[8:53] * teepee (~teepee@unaffiliated/teepee) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[8:53] * teepee_ is now known as teepee
[8:53] <danielmetltiski> what can I do Sonny_Jim>
[8:53] <Sonny_Jim> So what we can gather, it's connected to your Wifi network, your PC can connect to the Pi via ssh, right?
[8:54] <danielmetltiski> im not sure if its connected to my wifi network
[8:54] <danielmetltiski> since its giving me that error
[8:54] <danielmetltiski> but i can connect to the pi via ssh yes
[8:54] <Sonny_Jim> How is the Pi connected to your home network, via a cable or Wifi
[8:54] <danielmetltiski> via microusb
[8:54] <danielmetltiski> cable
[8:54] <Sonny_Jim> ...
[8:54] <danielmetltiski> oh
[8:55] <danielmetltiski> it should be connected to my network via wifi, sorry
[8:55] * dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[8:55] <Sonny_Jim> So there's no ethernet cable?
[8:55] <danielmetltiski> nope, its a raspberry pi zero w
[8:55] <Sonny_Jim> Ah ok
[8:56] <Sonny_Jim> So to connect to your Pi via ssh it's using the Wifi, right?
[8:56] <danielmetltiski> no
[8:56] <danielmetltiski> microusb
[8:56] <danielmetltiski> i think at least
[8:56] <danielmetltiski> i plugged it into my mac with a microusb
[8:57] <Sonny_Jim> Odd
[8:57] <danielmetltiski> same cable as an android phone
[8:57] <Sonny_Jim> Didn't know that you could connect via the microusb
[8:57] <danielmetltiski> its the only way i can connect
[8:57] <danielmetltiski> because my wifi network has a password
[8:57] <Sonny_Jim> I have zero experience with the zero
[8:58] * defsdoor (~andy@cpc35-sutt4-2-0-cust184.19-1.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[8:58] <danielmetltiski> kerio any clues?
[8:58] <Sonny_Jim> So what IP address do you use to connect via ssh?
[8:59] <Sonny_Jim> I'm just a little bit baffled that the only connection is via the microUSB and you are connecting via a network
[8:59] <danielmetltiski> im not sure, and im not sure how to find out
[9:00] <Sonny_Jim> heh
[9:00] * High_Priest (~hp@unaffiliated/high-priest/x-8117523) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:00] <Sonny_Jim> So what program did you use to connect via ssh?
[9:00] <danielmetltiski> ive been trying to connect to wifi with this guide
[9:00] <danielmetltiski> https://www.piborg.org/blog/pi-zero-wifi-bluetooth
[9:00] <danielmetltiski> ive been using terminal
[9:00] <danielmetltiski> im on mac
[9:00] <danielmetltiski> also im on ubuntu
[9:00] <Sonny_Jim> So what's the ssh command you use to connect
[9:01] <danielmetltiski> sudo ssh pi@raspberrypi.local
[9:01] <Sonny_Jim> Hmm
[9:01] <Sonny_Jim> You don't need to use sudo btw
[9:02] <danielmetltiski> thx
[9:02] <danielmetltiski> but what now
[9:02] <Sonny_Jim> could you ping raspberrypi.local and see what the IP address is please?
[9:02] <Sonny_Jim> (do this on the mac)
[9:02] <danielmetltiski> 64 bytes from icmp_seq=9 ttl=64 time=0.372 ms
[9:03] <Sonny_Jim> Ah ok, it's not getting any DHCP response
[9:03] <Sonny_Jim> On the pi, run 'service dhcpcd status'
[9:03] <Sonny_Jim> Hopefully you'll see something in the output that says 'running'
[9:04] * Muzer (~muzer@tim32.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[9:05] <danielmetltiski> Last login: Fri Mar 3 17:22:07 2017 from fe80::cf5:67ff:fee8:35de%usb0
[9:05] <danielmetltiski> ● dhcpcd.service - dhcpcd on all interfaces Loaded: loaded (/lib/systemd/system/dhcpcd.service; enabled) Active: active (running) since Fri 2017-03-03 17:06:44 UTC; 16min ago Process: 356 ExecStart=/sbin/dhcpcd -q -b (code=exited, status=0/SUCCESS) Main PID: 369 (dhcpcd) CGroup: /system.slice/dhcpcd.service └─369 /sbin/dhcpcd -q -b
[9:06] <Sonny_Jim> Ok, it's beginning to make sense to me know
[9:06] <Sonny_Jim> Unbeknownest to me, the Pi Zero W can act as a network device over the USB, which was confusing me
[9:07] <Sonny_Jim> From what I can see, the Wifi isn't configured correctly, we can check this
[9:07] <Sonny_Jim> Have a look at the output of 'iwconfig'
[9:07] * kronsbe (~chatzilla@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:07] <danielmetltiski> i think the issue might be
[9:07] <danielmetltiski> ssid="Your WiFi name"
[9:07] <Sonny_Jim> heh
[9:07] <danielmetltiski> the wifi name might be wrong?
[9:08] <Sonny_Jim> Glad I could be of assistance ;)
[9:08] <danielmetltiski> hold on let me try your command
[9:08] <danielmetltiski> i restarted it just now so itll be a min
[9:08] <danielmetltiski> ok so
[9:08] <danielmetltiski> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo iwconfig wlan0 IEEE 802.11bgn ESSID:off/any Mode:Managed Access Point: Not-Associated Tx-Power=31 dBm Retry short limit:7 RTS thr:off Fragment thr:off Encryption key:off Power Management:on lo no wireless extensions. usb0 no wireless extensions.
[9:09] <Sonny_Jim> Yeah the giveaway there is this part:
[9:09] <Sonny_Jim> Access Point: Not-Associated
[9:09] <danielmetltiski> still not working
[9:09] <danielmetltiski> hmm
[9:09] <Sonny_Jim> Did you enter in the correct ssid?
[9:09] <Sonny_Jim> (ssid being the name of your wifi network)
[9:10] <Sonny_Jim> again, you shouldn't need to run sudo
[9:10] <Sonny_Jim> Always good security practice to not use sudo unless you need it
[9:11] <danielmetltiski> umm
[9:11] <danielmetltiski> is my ssid the same this as my network name
[9:11] <danielmetltiski> i tried two variations of it
[9:11] <Sonny_Jim> Yes
[9:12] <Sonny_Jim> iwscan should show a list of wifi networks available
[9:12] <Sonny_Jim> oh wait
[9:12] <Sonny_Jim> iwlist scan
[9:13] <Sonny_Jim> Double check that you've spelled the ssid correctly
[9:13] * RebelCoder (~Yuriy@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:14] <Sonny_Jim> Also you might find some information about why it's not connecting by running the 'dmesg' command
[9:15] <danielmetltiski> heres the output
[9:15] <danielmetltiski> https://hastebin.com/raw/icazatusep
[9:16] <Sonny_Jim> This part is slightly odd, but then again I haven't got a Zero W:
[9:16] <Sonny_Jim> brcmfmac: brcmf_add_if: ERROR: netdev:wlan0 already exists
[9:17] <Sonny_Jim> You checked that the ssid in wpa_supplicant.conf is exactly the same as the one in the output of iwlist scan?
[9:17] * djsxxx_away is now known as Dave_MMP
[9:18] <Sonny_Jim> Oh and did you restart wpa_supplicant after changing it?
[9:19] <Sonny_Jim> sudo service wpa_supplicant restart
[9:19] <danielmetltiski> lets try that
[9:19] * Muzer (~muzer@2001:470:1f09:28f::1) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:20] * Jonwel (~Jonwel@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:21] <danielmetltiski> nope
[9:22] * teepee (~teepee@unaffiliated/teepee) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[9:23] <Sonny_Jim> so is your ssid listed in the output of iwlist?
[9:23] <danielmetltiski> no
[9:23] <Sonny_Jim> well
[9:23] <danielmetltiski> i just took it from my macbooks list of wifi names
[9:23] <danielmetltiski> ill take it from there
[9:23] <Sonny_Jim> if it cant see it in a scan, it wont be able to connect to it
[9:24] <danielmetltiski> one sec sorry
[9:24] <danielmetltiski> it takes me a minute to reboot
[9:25] <danielmetltiski> ok whats the command?
[9:25] * jaziz (~jaziz@unaffiliated/jaziz) Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
[9:25] <Sonny_Jim> iwlist scan
[9:25] <danielmetltiski> https://hastebin.com/raw/axupaquxac
[9:25] <danielmetltiski> oh um
[9:25] <danielmetltiski> heres the result
[9:25] <danielmetltiski> https://hastebin.com/raw/gofigegeli
[9:26] * Sonny_Jim has a look
[9:26] <danielmetltiski> i found the command
[9:26] <danielmetltiski> sudo iwlist wlan0 scan
[9:26] <Sonny_Jim> odd
[9:26] <Sonny_Jim> try bringing the wlan0 interface up with this:
[9:27] <Sonny_Jim> ifconfig wlan0 up
[9:27] <Sonny_Jim> Then run
[9:27] <Sonny_Jim> iwlist scan
[9:27] <danielmetltiski> heres the output of wlan0 scan
[9:27] <danielmetltiski> https://hastebin.com/ziriremuxu.coffeescript
[9:27] <danielmetltiski> mine is TELUS3869
[9:27] <Sonny_Jim> Ok, so the wlan0 interface is seeing some wifi networks, so that's good
[9:27] <danielmetltiski> both TELUS3869-2.4G and TELUS3869-5G
[9:28] <Sonny_Jim> I don't see TELUS3869 in that paste?
[9:28] <danielmetltiski> its listed
[9:28] <danielmetltiski> TELUS3689-2.4G
[9:28] <Sonny_Jim> Yeah, you swapped some digits there ;)
[9:28] <danielmetltiski> sorry its late ive been trying this for 4 hours now >.<
[9:29] <Sonny_Jim> so in wpa_supplicant.conf, set the ssid as 'TELUS3689-2.4G'
[9:29] <Sonny_Jim> Then restart wpa_supplicant
[9:29] * webturtle0 (~webturtle@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:29] * max12345 (~max@x55b3a900.dyn.telefonica.de) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[9:29] <Sonny_Jim> You've got a good link quality there (67/70) so that's good
[9:29] * jamesaxl (~jamesaxl@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:29] <danielmetltiski> i got fiber :D
[9:30] * jguillen (~jguillen@s158m188.unavarra.es) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[9:30] <Sonny_Jim> That refers to the link quality of the Wifi, not the fibre
[9:30] <danielmetltiski> ok lets restart this baby
[9:30] <danielmetltiski> and see what happens
[9:31] <Sonny_Jim> As an aside, I see that there's another network using the same channel, but yours is so strong it shouldn't be an issue
[9:31] * teepee (~teepee@unaffiliated/teepee) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:31] * brainzap (~brainzap@ has joined #raspberrypi
[9:31] <danielmetltiski> omg
[9:31] <Sonny_Jim> in fact there's 8 networks around you all using channel 6
[9:31] <danielmetltiski> it works it seems :D!!!!!!!
[9:31] <Sonny_Jim> Cool
[9:32] <danielmetltiski> yes i live in a high tech community lol
[9:32] <danielmetltiski> vancouver city bird gang
[9:32] <Sonny_Jim> If you find you get poor wifi performance, consider moving your wifi channel to something other than 6
[9:32] <danielmetltiski> whatever that means >.<
[9:32] <danielmetltiski> ok cool
[9:32] * Sonny_Jim shrugs
[9:32] <danielmetltiski> ok time to see the desktop
[9:32] <Sonny_Jim> If it works, leave it alone, but it's something to consider
[9:32] <danielmetltiski> vnc
[9:32] <Sonny_Jim> There's apps available for android/iOS that can show you visually which WiFi channels are in use
[9:33] <danielmetltiski> its 1:30 am and i got work at 7
[9:33] <danielmetltiski> screw it i got this far lets keep going :D
[9:33] * sunn (~oliver@host86-143-19-39.range86-143.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:33] <Sonny_Jim> Nah like I said, if it works, it works
[9:33] <danielmetltiski> i wanna play minecraft
[9:33] <danielmetltiski> i got this baby today (:
[9:33] <Sonny_Jim> Cool, well glad you got it working. For reference, I guess the issue was the ssid name?
[9:34] * webturtle0 (~webturtle@ Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[9:34] <danielmetltiski> yes, i was being a fool as usual >.< human error >.< silly human brain
[9:34] <Sonny_Jim> I prefer it to be something simple :)
[9:34] <Sonny_Jim> The worst kind of fixes are ones where you don't know why it starts working
[9:34] <danielmetltiski> all day long i hear coworkers blaming their problems on stacks, and technologies
[9:35] <danielmetltiski> when in fact we forgot a semicolon >.>
[9:36] * humbot (~i@unaffiliated/humbag) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:36] <danielmetltiski> any clue how to connect to vnc via mac?
[9:36] <danielmetltiski> i did apt-get update
[9:36] <danielmetltiski> and did sudo apt-get install realvnc-vnc-server realvnc-vnc-viewer
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> and i did
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> sudo raspi-config
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> following this guide
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/remote-access/vnc/
[9:37] <Sonny_Jim> personally, I use x11vnc, as that will connect to an already running X server
[9:37] <Sonny_Jim> vnc-server creates a 'new' desktop for each VNC session
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> i think mac has some sort of vnc built in>
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> ?
[9:37] <danielmetltiski> not sure
[9:37] <Sonny_Jim> (and is generally more of a pain to get working)
[9:40] <danielmetltiski> ok i downloaded a program called VNC viewer
[9:40] <danielmetltiski> what can i search for
[9:40] <danielmetltiski>
[9:41] <Sonny_Jim> Are you looking for the ip address of the pi?
[9:41] <kerio> Sonny_Jim: he's using g_ether
[9:41] <danielmetltiski> https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/remote-access/vnc/
[9:41] <danielmetltiski> YES
[9:41] <kerio> which is incredibly helpful
[9:41] <danielmetltiski> yes* g_ether
[9:42] <Sonny_Jim> kerio: Not anymore ;)
[9:42] <kerio> (because you can enable it just with config.txt and cmdline.txt from the vfat partition)
[9:42] <Sonny_Jim> danielmetltiski: ifconfig wlan0
[9:42] <Sonny_Jim> That will give you the ip address of the wireless card in the zero
[9:42] <kerio> Sonny_Jim: still probably a good idea to leave it enabled, if he doesn't need the usb port for something else
[9:42] <danielmetltiski> https://hastebin.com/hagunuzepo.rb
[9:42] * Sonny_Jim nods
[9:42] <kerio> alternatively, g_serial i guess?
[9:43] <Sonny_Jim> kerio: Confused the heck out of me, as I didn't realise that the Zero had USB networking
[9:43] <kerio> it also works on the pi1 i believe
[9:43] <kerio> it only works on 2 and 3 if you desolder the usb hub
[9:43] <kerio> it's usb gadget mode
[9:43] <danielmetltiski> kerio any clue how to vnc in?
[9:44] <kerio> if the pi supported actual usb otg you could just use an actual cable that's up to spec
[9:44] <kerio> to avoid having to do any sort of configuration
[9:44] <kerio> but alas
[9:44] <kerio> danielmetltiski: do you even have a desktop running?
[9:44] <danielmetltiski> desktop?
[9:44] * Sonny_Jim hands over to kerio and wanders off to listen to some websdr
[9:44] <kerio> Sonny_Jim: o no you dint
[9:44] <brainzap> good morning raspberrybros
[9:45] <danielmetltiski> thank you for all the help Sonny_jim you are great
[9:45] <kerio> danielmetltiski: did you install the full raspbian on your microsd
[9:45] <danielmetltiski> i am using RASPBIAN JESSIE WITH PIXEL
[9:45] <danielmetltiski> yes
[9:45] <danielmetltiski> Image with PIXEL desktop based on Debian Jessie
[9:45] <kerio> well i mean
[9:45] <kerio> did you follow https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/remote-access/vnc/ ?
[9:45] <danielmetltiski> yes but im on mac is its not the same
[9:46] * sunn (~oliver@host86-143-19-39.range86-143.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[9:46] <danielmetltiski> wait
[9:46] <danielmetltiski> i see something new
[9:47] <danielmetltiski> ok
[9:47] <danielmetltiski> i enabled it now
[9:47] <danielmetltiski> do i need to leave the console ssh connection
[9:47] <kerio> you can just make more than one connection, anyway
[9:48] <danielmetltiski> ok so
[9:48] <danielmetltiski> i enabled vnc now
[9:48] <danielmetltiski> with sudo raspi-config
[9:48] <kerio> it should be the same on macos, btw
[9:48] <kerio> just download the vnc viewer for mac instead of the one for windows
[9:48] <danielmetltiski> oooh
[9:48] <danielmetltiski> whats the default userna,e
[9:49] <danielmetltiski> username
[9:49] <danielmetltiski> something is happening now!!!!!!
[9:49] <kerio> "pi", with password "raspberry"
[9:49] <Sonny_Jim> Always a good idea to change that passwd ASAP
[9:49] <danielmetltiski> ummm
[9:49] <kerio> *and* disable passwordful ssh
[9:49] <danielmetltiski> says incorrect for some reason
[9:49] <danielmetltiski> maybe my hands are shaking of excitement
[9:49] <kerio> danielmetltiski: is it just vnc
[9:49] <danielmetltiski> im connecting to
[9:50] <kerio> wait what
[9:50] <danielmetltiski> https://hastebin.com/avafavirot.rb
[9:50] <kerio> no, you're supposed to run vnc on your computer
[9:51] <kerio> and just connect to raspberrypi.local i guess
[9:51] <danielmetltiski> OMFG
[9:51] <danielmetltiski> OMFG
[9:51] <danielmetltiski> OMFG
[9:51] <danielmetltiski> IT WORKS
[9:51] * danielmetltiski creams in his pants
[9:51] * mschorm (~mschorm@ip-78-102-201-117.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:51] <kerio> TMIgeddon
[9:51] <danielmetltiski> minecraft minecraft minecraft
[9:52] <danielmetltiski> slow
[9:52] <danielmetltiski> WHATS WRONG WITH MINECRAFT???
[9:52] <danielmetltiski> :(
[9:52] <kerio> don't expect a fluid interface over vnc
[9:52] <danielmetltiski> its a black fin screen
[9:53] <kerio> danielmetltiski: read that page again btw
[9:53] <kerio> there's a thing about configuring vnc to use some different capture method
[9:53] <danielmetltiski> its 2 am i got work at 7 fml
[9:53] * wonderer (quakeroate@tm. has joined #raspberrypi
[9:54] <danielmetltiski> it tells me to go to menu->options->troubleshooting
[9:54] <danielmetltiski> but i dont see it
[9:54] <danielmetltiski> i see preferences
[9:54] <danielmetltiski> when i click on the berry in top left
[9:55] <danielmetltiski> oh it says i might have to do it in the vnc client
[9:55] <danielmetltiski> On your Raspberry Pi, open the VNC Server dialog. Navigate to Menu > Options > Troubleshooting and select Enable experimental direct capture mode.
[9:55] <danielmetltiski> cant find that somehow
[10:01] <danielmetltiski> thx so much kerio
[10:01] <danielmetltiski> u got the keys to success
[10:01] * majorshake (~chat@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:01] * danielmetltiski slides some coke and hookers to kerio
[10:04] * finlstrm (~finlstrm@ip70-181-32-127.ri.ri.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[10:07] <danielmetltiski> hey
[10:07] <kerio> hm
[10:07] <danielmetltiski> any clue how to vanigate tot hat meu
[10:07] <kerio> should i put some electric tape on the bottom of my pi0
[10:07] * majorshake (~chat@ has joined #raspberrypi
[10:07] <Sonny_Jim> kerio: I make up a ghetto case with cardboard from cereal boxes
[10:08] <kerio> Sonny_Jim: i'm using literally a piece of cardboard now
[10:08] <kerio> (with electric tape on it, because apparently moisture is a thing)
[10:08] <danielmetltiski> https://i.snag.gy/KcrPR1.jpg
[10:08] <danielmetltiski> this is what i see
[10:08] <danielmetltiski> what can i do
[10:08] <danielmetltiski> to get to
[10:08] <danielmetltiski> On your Raspberry Pi, open the VNC Server dialog. Navigate to Menu > Options > Troubleshooting and select Enable experimental direct capture mode.
[10:08] <danielmetltiski> where is menu
[10:09] <kerio> oh lmao
[10:09] <danielmetltiski> like my resolution is small
[10:09] <danielmetltiski> can i change it
[10:09] <shiftplusone> No monitor plugged in?
[10:10] <danielmetltiski> no im vnced in
[10:10] <kerio> danielmetltiski: "hdmi_group=2" and "hdmi_mode=16" in config.txt
[10:10] <kerio> and reboot
[10:10] <kerio> oh wait, also hdmi_force_hotplug=1
[10:10] <danielmetltiski> omg omg
[10:10] <shiftplusone> Yes, but one doesn't exclude the other. The resolution is automatically detected from the monitor and that's used by VNC as well. Since there is nothing, I think it will default to composite output, which is low res. If you do what kerio said, that should override that.
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> minecraft is working
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> W000t w00000t
[10:11] * danielmetltiski gang gang
[10:11] <kerio> w00t w00t
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> time to sleep after i play a wee bit
[10:11] <kerio> danielmetltiski: did you do what i said?
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> yes yes yes
[10:11] <kerio> those 3 lines
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> oh
[10:11] <kerio> well if it's working
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> where is config.txt
[10:11] <danielmetltiski> on microsd?
[10:12] <shiftplusone> /boot/config.txt
[10:12] <danielmetltiski> ok well either way
[10:12] <danielmetltiski> its working
[10:12] <danielmetltiski> and its way past my bedtime
[10:12] <danielmetltiski> thank u all for so much help
[10:12] <danielmetltiski> u are the nicest people ive met in my life
[10:13] <danielmetltiski> willing to deal with an idiot like me XD
[10:13] <danielmetltiski> god bless u all thank u
[10:13] * danielmetltiski thanks
[10:13] <danielmetltiski> ill change those in the config.txt before i sleep
[10:13] <danielmetltiski> i g2g tho its far too late
[10:13] <danielmetltiski> bye
[10:13] <danielmetltiski> minecraft minecraft MINECRAFT!!!
[10:13] * Chillum (~highinbc@unaffiliated/chillum) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[10:14] * Chillum (~highinbc@unaffiliated/chillum) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:14] * danielmetltiski (a29c49c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Quit: Page closed)
[10:16] <kerio> #blessed
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[10:47] <RebelCoder> Guys, anyone running Rocket.Chat on the Pi ?
[10:49] <Sonny_Jim> Not me
[10:50] <Sonny_Jim> I've been irssi for so many years now, it might even be decades
[10:50] <HrdwrBoB> me2
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[11:03] * sunn (~oliver@host86-143-19-39.range86-143.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Client Quit)
[11:06] <humbot> webRTC
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[12:12] <Shadonovitch> Hey, when you use Pulseaudio networking, is the server the one playing and streaming to client ?
[12:13] <shiftplusone> No, I believe the server is the one actually outputting the audio to the hardware.
[12:13] <shiftplusone> The client streams to the server.
[12:13] <Shadonovitch> In my case, i've managed to connect bluetooth A2DP to the raspberry analogic output ; the next part of my project is to stream this to other pi's within the wifi network
[12:14] <Shadonovitch> So, should the server be on the bluetooth end ? Or on the players end ? I don't really understand all I read about pulse networking
[12:15] <Shadonovitch> "One of PulseAudio's unique features is its ability to stream audio from clients over TCP to a server running the PulseAudio daemon reliably within a LAN" from the man page ;; this means the server is playing the sounds, not the clients, right ?
[12:16] <Shadonovitch> In my case, i'd want clients to connect to the server and play what the server plays'
[12:16] <shiftplusone> I think you might be using 'playing' a little differently here.
[12:16] <Sonny_Jim> Mix it down to an mp3 stream and use something like icecast, would be my suggestion
[12:16] <shiftplusone> By play, I would mean that it is the device that talks to the actual audio device.
[12:16] <shiftplusone> where the speakers would be
[12:16] <shiftplusone> that's the server end
[12:17] <shiftplusone> The server plays the audio. The client sends the audio to be played by the server.
[12:17] * sandeepkr (~sandeepkr@ec2-54-255-178-4.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com) Quit (Excess Flood)
[12:17] <Shadonovitch> shiftplusone: i see what you mean. Although it meeans there's no way i'm doing my project using Pulse then :/
[12:17] <Sonny_Jim> Well
[12:18] <Sonny_Jim> I guess you have a single source, right?
[12:18] <Shadonovitch> Yep'
[12:18] * doomlord (~textual@host86-153-153-151.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:18] <Sonny_Jim> And you want that single source to be played out to clients connecting to the server, correct?
[12:18] <HrdwrBoB> sooo
[12:18] <HrdwrBoB> like a stream
[12:18] <Shadonovitch> Exactly, so that it gets play on many different speakers
[12:18] <shiftplusone> it would work, but I would use something like MPD or icecast.
[12:18] <HrdwrBoB> if only that technology existed :P
[12:18] <Sonny_Jim> ^
[12:18] <Sonny_Jim> mpd or icecast will do that for you
[12:19] * sandeepkr (~sandeepkr@ec2-54-255-178-4.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:20] <Shadonovitch> I'd need to find a way to turn the A2DP stream to mp3 though
[12:20] <Sonny_Jim> Well
[12:20] <Sonny_Jim> Not to mp3, icecast/mpd will do the encoding for you
[12:20] <Sonny_Jim> I *think* you might even be able to mirror what's playing out the soundcard with mpd/icecast
[12:21] <Sonny_Jim> So as along as the A2DP stream comes out of the speakers, you'll be able to stream it out
[12:21] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:21] <Shadonovitch> Sonny_Jim: my first idea was to hook pulse sink of the audio output to the network one way or the other ;; thanks for the names although, i need to man mpd/icecast
[12:22] <Sonny_Jim> http://icecast.org/ices/docs/ices-2.0.2/inputs.html
[12:22] <Sonny_Jim> I think you'll find a way of doing it there
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[12:23] <Sonny_Jim> If I'm reading it right, then you can use OSS or ALSA as the source input
[12:23] <Sonny_Jim> and IIRC, pulseaudio is just a layer ontop of ALSA anyway
[12:24] <j4ckcom> ABC
[12:25] <Shadonovitch> Sonny_Jim: OpenSound : "This will read audio from the DSP device " -> looks like it
[12:26] <Sonny_Jim> Yeah I certainly believe it's possible
[12:26] <Sonny_Jim> It can be a bit of a configuration nightmare
[12:27] <Sonny_Jim> Might be an idea to setup a simple mp3 streamer first, then try and use the bluetooth/soundcard output as the input source
[12:27] <Shadonovitch> That's what I was after with Pulse yeah
[12:28] <Shadonovitch> Anyway, i'm off for lunch; Thank you for your time :)
[12:28] <Sonny_Jim> Good luck!
[12:29] * jkridner (~jkridner@pdpc/supporter/active/jkridner) Quit (Quit: Leaving...)
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[15:27] <ScrumpyJack> i want to create a USB gadget serial device from /dev/hwrng on the pi zero to that a USB OTG host can access it. any thoughts?
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[15:29] <kihis> ali1234: pcb's arrived! thanks again :)
[15:29] <Chillum> ScrumpyJack: Is there a usb gadget for a serial port?
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[15:29] <Chillum> if not your could make it a NIC and have it serve it up over a service
[15:30] <kerio> Chillum: g_serial
[15:30] <Chillum> good idea btw, using a pi zero has a plug in hwrng
[15:30] <kerio> i wouldn't know how not to waste it tho
[15:30] <Chillum> waste?
[15:30] <kerio> do serial consoles have a concept of "other side is connected"?
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[15:31] <Chillum> ya well you could wait until something was said by the host
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[15:31] <Chillum> like "50 random bytes please"
[15:32] <Chillum> the hwrng can provide something like 20kb/s of data pretty much forever so no reason not to send always
[15:32] <kihis> now anyone wants to help me wiring up this display with pi? :D http://www.buydisplay.com/download/manual/ERC240160-1_Series_Datasheet.pdf
[15:32] <ScrumpyJack> i've got gadget working, usb ethernet, mass storage and serial console. wondering how to add another device
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[15:33] <kerio> Chillum: cpu :<
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[15:33] <BurtyB> ScrumpyJack, if you want more you'd prob need to fiddle with configfs
[15:34] <ScrumpyJack> it would be easier to be able to point apps to /dev/zero_rand on the host
[15:34] <kerio> ScrumpyJack: that is a HORRIBLE idea
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[15:34] <kerio> you don't do random numbers like that
[15:34] <Chillum> kerio: does the hwrng use up CPU? Keep in mind it would just be serving its seed data, not calculating the prngs from it itself
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[15:34] <ScrumpyJack> i'm reading the configfs gadget docs on kernel.org atm
[15:35] <kerio> ScrumpyJack: would it just be a usb serial marked as a known usb hwrng?
[15:35] <ScrumpyJack> kerio: think device proxy
[15:35] <Chillum> ScrumpyJack: you don't want to point devices directly to the hwrng, you want to use something like rngtools to use hwrng as the seed source to fuel the entropy for /dev/random
[15:35] <kerio> no i mean
[15:36] <ScrumpyJack> Chillum: sorry yes, rngtools or other
[15:36] <Chillum> I wonder just how good the hwrng is... I know I have used it to make bitcoin wallets, nothing stolen yet
[15:37] <kerio> Chillum: just pipe it into urandom
[15:38] <Chillum> no, you don't want to access the numbers directly, it is more of an entropy source
[15:38] <Chillum> you want to feed it into your entropy pool then acess it from /dev/random
[15:38] <Chillum> then point your apps to use that instead of urandom
[15:39] <kerio> writing in /dev/random results in exactly that
[15:39] <kerio> and no, use urandom
[15:39] <Chillum> if for some reason urandom stops getting the feed it will just fall back to a poorer system, if random stops getting the feed it will block
[15:39] <Chillum> big difference
[15:39] <kerio> that is not how it works
[15:39] <Chillum> urandom does not block, if just falls back
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[15:40] <Chillum> random will block when exhausted
[15:40] <kerio> even with linux's idiotic difference between random and urandom, you're still running a csprng
[15:40] <Chillum> yes, but random relies on an entropy pool and will block when that pool is exhausted
[15:40] <kerio> except that "exhausted" is not something that can be estimated correctly in any way and is not something that's in any way meaningful for the entropy pool of a csprng
[15:40] <Chillum> and urandom will just amke stuff up
[15:40] <kerio> "just make stuff up" by running a csprng, yes
[15:41] <Chillum> csprngs are as good as the entropy given to them
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[15:42] <Chillum> if you use urandom you don't really know that you are using the hwrng at any given time, say if you ask for random numbers too fast it will overuse the entropy given by the hwrng
[15:42] <kerio> it's not like you're being given "perfectly entropic" data until the entropy "runs out" and then you're given zeroes
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[15:42] <Chillum> of course not, it is statistical
[15:42] <kerio> you can't "overuse" entropy
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[15:42] <Chillum> of course you can overuse entropy
[15:43] <Chillum> that is the whole point of the entropy pool
[15:43] <kerio> that's for reseeding
[15:43] <Chillum> what do you think the seed is?
[15:43] <kerio> so that an attacker has to know all the sources of your entropy all the time to know exactly which numbers are going to be outputted
[15:43] <Chillum> that is the entropy
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[15:43] <kerio> if you have 256 random bits
[15:43] <kerio> that the attacker doesn't know
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[15:43] <kerio> and you use them for a csprng
[15:43] <kerio> you're not going to "run out"
[15:44] <Chillum> it is not just about guessing the seed, if you use the same seed for an infinite string of prngs it is more susceptible to pattern analysis, if only theoretical
[15:44] <kerio> "infinite"
[15:45] <Chillum> as the string grows
[15:45] <kerio> yes, you might start getting into problems after 2^128 bits or so
[15:45] <kerio> so that's 3E22 petabytes
[15:45] <Chillum> you know there is a reason why tools like PGP don't use urandom and insist on blocking until enough entropy for random is available
[15:45] <Chillum> it is not just to annoy people
[15:46] <Chillum> the thing about security is that a bit of understanding can be a terrible thing, the devil is in the details
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[15:46] <kerio> linux is literally the only OS that blocks based on entropy "running out"
[15:46] <Chillum> ya, notice it is used for pretty much anything security based?
[15:46] <kerio> huh
[15:46] <kerio> openbsd?
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[15:47] <Chillum> is that still around?
[15:47] <kerio> yep
[15:48] <Chillum> looks like it has an entropy pool, and it uses the entropy pool to manage hwrngs: http://man.openbsd.org/ualea.4
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[15:48] <Chillum> if it does not block, well that would be a feature I would want before I did anything for serious security
[15:49] <kerio> arc4random() doesn't block, no
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[15:49] <kerio> except during early boot
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[15:49] <Chillum> my whole point is that urandom will silently fail over to normal rng if the hwrng fails and silent failure is bad
[15:49] <kerio> and your whole point would be wrong
[15:49] <kerio> because both random and urandom use the same prng
[15:49] <Chillum> I know
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[15:50] <kerio> literally the same data path
[15:50] <Chillum> but random will limit how much it uses a given set of seed data to a finite amount
[15:50] <kerio> random just blocks whenever it feels like it hasn't been fed enough entropy
[15:50] <kerio> which is stupid
[15:50] <kerio> and urandom will never block, even if it hasn't been initialized at all
[15:50] <kerio> which is VERY stupid
[15:50] <Chillum> it is not stupid, these prng algos are not perfect you realize
[15:51] <Chillum> would you make up on really good random seed then use it for the rest of your life?
[15:51] <kerio> http://www.mail-archive.com/cryptography@randombit.net/msg04763.html
[15:51] <kerio> https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/3936/is-a-rand-from-dev-urandom-secure-for-a-login-key/3939#3939
[15:52] <kerio> and those two aren't just random hacks, mind you
[15:53] <Chillum> urandom provides very good numbers, but people who use a HWRNG sort of want those hardware rngs to actually be used
[15:53] <Chillum> random makes sure it is being used
[15:53] <Chillum> urandom does not
[15:53] <kerio> yes, which is why you use them to constantly feed the csprng state
[15:53] <Chillum> and you have no way of knowing if it is
[15:53] <kerio> and you'd be wrong
[15:54] <Chillum> well I guess we will have to just go on thinking each other is wrong
[15:54] <lopta> I think you're both wrong. <- there, I brought balance to The Force.
[15:54] <Chillum> I have been working with computer security for 15 years and all but whatever
[15:54] * lopta does the Vulcan salute and gets thrown out of the theatre.
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[15:55] <kerio> and you still haven't understood the point of a csprng?
[15:55] <Chillum> I know exactly what it is
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[15:55] <Chillum> you give it entropy, but it does nto create it
[15:56] <Chillum> I think you are not getting the subtle but crucial difference between random and entropic
[15:56] <lopta> I don't know Linux but I am aware that some other operating systems "save entropy" during a clean shutdown
[15:56] <Chillum> the p stands for pseudo
[15:56] <lopta> Does Linux do that?
[15:56] <kerio> usually, yes
[15:56] <kerio> it's not the kernel, it's userland
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[15:57] <Chillum> when you reveal csprng numbers created from a certain set of entropy that entropy is potentially compromised by an attacked by observing those csprng numbers. Thus the importance of regularly changing that entropic source
[15:58] <kerio> if the entropy is potentially compromised by an attacker by observing the result you're either generating a LUDICROUS amount of data without reseeding, or the csprng is not actually cryptographically secure
[15:58] <Chillum> that is the assumption
[15:59] <kerio> that is not the assumption
[15:59] <Chillum> that the csprng is insecure, get it?
[15:59] <kerio> no, the assumption is that the csprng is secure
[15:59] <kerio> dear lord
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[15:59] <kerio> you don't assume that a critical primitive is insecure
[16:00] <Chillum> you get that security is about assuming that algos can be broken in time right?
[16:00] <Chillum> one of the main features of a hwrng is that the data was created by some physical event that can't just be mathematically broken later, it needed to be observed
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[16:01] <kerio> what does a hwrng have to do with this
[16:01] <kerio> i'm talking about the fact that the distinction between random and urandom in linux is wrong
[16:01] <Chillum> any source of entropy is about getting data that was not computationally generated
[16:01] <kerio> Chillum: yes, and you shove that data right into the entropy pool of a csprng
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[16:03] <Chillum> again, if you over draw to /random faster than the 20kb/s that the hwrng produces it will silently move over to resusing the entropy
[16:03] <Chillum> you want it to block if you overdraw
[16:03] <Chillum> if your goal is to use the hwrng, you want to always be using it, not just sometimes
[16:04] <Chillum> /urandom that is
[16:04] <kerio> you don't "reuse" the entropy
[16:04] <Chillum> urandom will do exactly that, it will say "ohh no more entropy, I will just keep using the same seed"
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[16:04] <kerio> it's not like there's a big conditional "if we still have data from hwrng give that data otherwise use a fucking mersenne twister"
[16:05] <Chillum> it simply reseeds itself if it can, and not if it cannot
[16:05] <Chillum> remind me to never use and security based application you designed ;)
[16:06] <Chillum> do you at least agree that /random has higher standards for how it uses its seed data?
[16:06] <kerio> no
[16:06] <kerio> it has a weird counter that estimates "remaining entropy" in a very silly way
[16:07] <kerio> for no reason
[16:07] <Chillum> really? So random will stop and wait for more seed data and urandom will just keep using it, but they do't have different standards?
[16:07] <Chillum> you may not see the value of the entropy pool but it still has value
[16:07] <Chillum> entropy can be a tricky concept to grasp
[16:07] <Chillum> but it is based on sound math
[16:08] <lopta> Do Intel processors ship with a hardware RNG?
[16:08] <Chillum> I am sorry if I have a hard time taking your work for it over decades of security best practices, but you really have not explained why you think it lacks value
[16:08] <kerio> at least modern-ish ones do
[16:08] <Chillum> lopta: I wish mine did
[16:09] <kerio> Chillum: you're the only one insulting me and pulling rank
[16:09] <Shadonovitch> hey, i'm doing A2DP on my bluetooth ; i've had managed to make it output on the analogic, but now everything is played over HDMI, and the command "sudo amixer cset numid=3 1" doesn't redirect to jack
[16:09] <Chillum> not pulling rank, just saying you are contradicting what I know from experience and interaction with very smart people
[16:09] <Shadonovitch> is there a different way to make it play to the jack ? I can't find how i did it earlier
[16:09] <Chillum> you are making an extraordinary claim and I am not hearing extraordinary proof
[16:09] <kerio> i've provided links to posts from what is possibly the best cryptographer in the world and a pretty good cryptographer
[16:10] <kerio> explaining why the behaviour of /dev/random and /dev/urandom on linux is very silly
[16:10] <Chillum> and I am sure many disagree with this learned fellow
[16:11] * lopta disagrees with his own feet.
[16:11] <kerio> yeah like you
[16:11] <Chillum> but I have to disagree with point #2, "we _can_ figure out how to use a single key to safely encrypt many messages " anyone serious about security does not assume PGP or the like will be unbreakable forever
[16:12] <kerio> he said "many"
[16:12] <lopta> Does the Broadcom SoC have an RNG in it?
[16:12] <kerio> not "infinite"
[16:12] <kerio> lopta: the one on the pi? yep
[16:12] <kerio> available as /dev/hwrng, by default
[16:12] <Chillum> this is one of the reaosn perfect forward secrecy rotates keys, but this needs a handshake and won't work for algos like PGP etc
[16:12] <lopta> Well that's nice.
[16:12] <kerio> pgp is not an algorithm
[16:12] <Chillum> with rngs we have the advantage of not having to share key data
[16:13] <Chillum> kerio: I was just using an example he gave
[16:13] <Chillum> but ya, I concede PGP is not an algo
[16:13] <kerio> thanks for the concession
[16:13] <Chillum> well you were right!
[16:13] <kerio> http://www.2uo.de/myths-about-urandom/ this is a decent explanation, if a bit condescending maybe
[16:14] <Chillum> if we could use quantum entanglement to produce the same truly random numbers at the same time for two people then that would be much better than anything we use based on static keys
[16:14] <Chillum> but we certainly would not switch over to csprng when it ran out of bandwidth, not without defeating the purpose of this wonderful device
[16:15] <Chillum> he may be a good cryptographer but his comparison is not really valid in my opinion
[16:15] <kerio> http://blog.cr.yp.to/20140205-entropy.html
[16:15] <kerio> (still djb)
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[16:18] <Chillum> right now they are recording everything encrypted on hard drives in a giant set of buildings in utah
[16:19] <Chillum> in 30 years when they are trying to crack it I would prefer that I was regularly changing my seed
[16:19] <Chillum> but that is just me
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[16:19] <Chillum> after all cryptographically secure algos tend to have a shelf life
[16:19] <Chillum> but I doubt they will figure out how my zener diode breakdown sounded like
[16:19] <lopta> Chillum: I'd say that's true for all software.
[16:20] <lopta> Chillum: ...except Algol60, obviously.
[16:20] <Chillum> yes, which is why hardware rngs don't rely on software but measure physical activity
[16:21] <Chillum> the entropy part is the part not based on math, and thus can probably not be broken by math later
[16:21] * HeXiLeD (~grumpynes@unaffiliated/hexiled) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:21] * marcdinkum (~marcdinku@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:21] <Chillum> the rest you have to assume will be figured out my smarter people in the future
[16:21] <Chillum> if falling back to the csprng is acceptable to you then you probably don' need a hwrng
[16:22] <Chillum> I need coffee my brain is running at 60%
[16:22] <Chillum> coffee is my entropy pool
[16:23] <kerio> you keep saying "falling back to the csprng"
[16:23] <lopta> I fetched a fancy coffee from the garage across the road at about 07:55 this morning.
[16:23] <kerio> this tells me that you still haven't understood how /dev/(u)random works
[16:23] <lopta> ...so I'm a little ahead of schedule
[16:24] <kerio> lopta: why'd you fetch a coffee from a garage? :|
[16:24] * NicoHood (~arch@ip5f5bfaa9.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:24] <lopta> kerio: It's within walking distance and better than the coffee in the office.
[16:25] <gordonDrogon> I have nice coffee in my office, however as I work from home, I also have nice coffee in my home :-)
[16:25] <kerio> how's a coffee from a garage better than the coffee in the office
[16:26] <gordonDrogon> my experience of offices is that they often have terrible coffee )-:
[16:26] <gordonDrogon> because the person doing the buying will buy cheap...
[16:26] <gordonDrogon> or .... (sorry to say this out loud) ... instant.
[16:27] <shiftplusone> pi towers went a bit overboard with the coffee. O_o
[16:28] <Chillum> kerio: fine, let me reword it. It falls back to using the same seed it was using before more than it would be budgeted for with dev random
[16:28] <Chillum> I get that /dev/random uses the same csprng
[16:28] * evanextreme (~evanextre@ehirshlaptop.student.rit.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:28] <Chillum> smantics
[16:28] <Chillum> semantics even
[16:29] <brainzap> I drink instant
[16:29] <lopta> hello evanextreme
[16:29] <evanextreme> hi!
[16:29] <lopta> I'd drink tea if we had a kettle.
[16:29] <lopta> Come to think of it, I should make that an interview question.
[16:29] <lopta> ...make it a condition of employment.
[16:30] * marcdinkum (~marcdinku@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:30] <kihis> arrgh. two pins connected, 23 to go...
[16:30] <lopta> "just how bad /is/ your coffee?" "do you have a kettle?"
[16:30] * [diablo] (~textual@unaffiliated/miles/x-000000001) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[16:30] <kihis> why this so hard
[16:30] <lopta> kihis: What're you building?
[16:30] * ipnos (~00@natunime-wifi-200.unime.it) Quit (Quit: Quit.)
[16:30] <gordonDrogon> shiftplusone, you got a good machine then?
[16:31] <kihis> lopta: trying to find out how to connect a lcd display with pi...
[16:31] <shiftplusone> A few photos here https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/javawatch-automated-coffee-replenishment-system/
[16:31] <shiftplusone> I think there was a training session for it
[16:31] * elnormous (~elnormous@gateway.evolutiongaming.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:32] <evanextreme> lopta where do you work?
[16:32] <lopta> kihis: What sort of LCD?
[16:32] <lopta> evanextreme: Illinois, USA
[16:32] <kihis> lopta: http://www.buydisplay.com/default/3-4-inch-240x160-dot-matrix-lcd-display-serial-interface-black-on-white
[16:32] <evanextreme> oh cool
[16:33] * int3nz0r (~int3nz0r@541A8E1B.cm-5-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
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[16:36] <lopta> evanextreme: It seemed like a good idea at the time.
[16:36] <lopta> kihis: That's a nice looking display!
[16:37] <kihis> lopta: would look better if there would be shown something in it :D
[16:37] <lopta> Yes, that's important too.
[16:37] <evanextreme> lopta I wanna stay in New York or the New England area, or maybe move to the west coast
[16:37] <kihis> i have absolutely no idea what i'm doing right now
[16:38] <evanextreme> granted I just need to find a co-op right now so i'll go wherever
[16:38] <lopta> kihis: Do you have the data sheet for it?
[16:38] * svm_invictvs (~patrick@unaffiliated/svminvictvs/x-938456) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:38] <kihis> i think pins 6, 11 and 12 need constant 3,3v from pi? and pin 7 is ground...
[16:38] * svm_invictvs (~patrick@unaffiliated/svminvictvs/x-938456) Quit (Client Quit)
[16:39] <kihis> lopta: http://www.buydisplay.com/download/manual/ERC240160-1_Series_Datasheet.pdf page 8
[16:39] * webturtle0 (~webturtle@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[16:40] <lopta> Oh nice, it takes 8-bit parallel or SPI!
[16:40] <lopta> You're so lucky.
[16:42] * elnormous (~elnormous@gateway.evolutiongaming.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[16:42] <kihis> lopta: yes. but how do i 1) wire it up? and 2) run it? :D
[16:42] * u1dzer0 (u1dzer0@inaddr.org) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:43] <lopta> 1) should be achievable based on the data sheet (pages 8 and 9). 2) is a challenge because I don't see any description of commands.
[16:43] <lopta> ...perhaps you need a programmer's guide for it.
[16:43] <lopta> ...or a compatible library, if someone else has already used it and released their work.
[16:44] * marcdinkum (~marcdinku@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:45] <lopta> ...ah, the controller's an ST7586, so you might be able to google that.
[16:46] * [Butch] (~butch@c-98-207-53-60.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:46] <kihis> lopta: yeah. and there is separate datasheet for that
[16:47] <kihis> and a frame buffer driver also... if that's needed?
[16:47] <lopta> kihis: That would depend on your software needs.
[16:48] * dconroy (~dconroy@ Quit (Quit: dconroy)
[16:48] <ali1234> kihis: did you get my email with the correction?
[16:49] <ali1234> kihis: that screen should work in DPI mode on raspberry pi
[16:49] * dconroy (~dconroy@ has joined #raspberrypi
[16:49] <kihis> ali1234: yes. got the first edition and soldered it working :) fixed version is still somewhere between usa and finland
[16:50] <lopta> ali1234: What's DPI mode?
[16:50] * HerculeP (~Poirot@ip-109-47-1-9.web.vodafone.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:50] <ali1234> lopta: it's a digital parallel interface
[16:50] <lopta> ali1234: Is that the 8-bit parallel mode?
[16:50] <ali1234> no, its up to 24 bit
[16:50] <ali1234> see https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nUnaWl_veBKlnqsDwPQUYZNKKiIYhf8f8a6e_bd1cKc/edit?usp=sharing
[16:51] <ali1234> under ALT2
[16:51] <lopta> Oh! I didn't see mention of that in the data sheet.
[16:51] <ali1234> DPI
[16:51] <ali1234> you should be able to wire that LCD directly to it
[16:51] <ali1234> and then activate DPI mode
[16:52] <gordonDrogon> shiftplusone, Good grief. It's a coffee machine monster.
[16:52] <ali1234> this uses the same interface: https://github.com/fenlogic/vga666
[16:52] <ali1234> you can check those docs for how to activate DPI and set modes
[16:53] * dconroy (~dconroy@ Quit (Client Quit)
[16:53] <shiftplusone> gordonDrogon: yup, it's just too much.
[16:53] <shiftplusone> Takes forever to boot up too
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[16:54] <gordonDrogon> shiftplusone, my coffee engine: http://unicorn.drogon.net/IMG_20160805_142412.jpg no pump, no motor, no internet connection, no bean to cup mechanics. no buttons.... just a boiler and a lever. Simples.
[16:54] <gordonDrogon> yea, mines only an 850 watt heater. takes 10 minutes to get up to pressure )-:
[16:55] <lopta> Hey, who remembers the SGI Espressigo?
[16:55] <kihis> ali1234: looks actually pretty good!
[16:55] <lopta> That Elektra looks nice.
[16:55] * lopta burns another Minix CD
[16:55] <gordonDrogon> minix? is that still a thing?
[16:56] * lopta nods
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[16:56] <brainzap> CDs? is that still a thing?
[16:57] <gordonDrogon> Compact Data ... :)
[16:57] <lopta> brainzap: I tried dumping the .iso image to a USB flash stick but apparently it wasn't prepared with that in mind.
[16:58] * u1dzer0 (u1dzer0@inaddr.org) has joined #raspberrypi
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[16:59] <lopta> ...so I'm doing this the old fashioned way.
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[17:02] <ali1234> kihis: actually i dont think you want dpi for that screen
[17:03] <ali1234> just SPI
[17:03] * brainzap (~brainzap@ Quit (Quit: IRC client 0x7ffff85f21cce has value 0x20ec8348 which is neither locked or unlocked. The memory has been smashed.)
[17:03] * MarioBranco (~MarioBran@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:03] <kihis> ali1234: oh. mmkay :) why?
[17:04] <ali1234> it isn't colour
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[17:04] <kihis> that's true
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[17:06] * evanextreme (~evanextre@ehirshlaptop.student.rit.edu) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[17:06] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@host-67-21-184-89.nctv.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[17:08] * dconroy (~dconroy@ Quit (Quit: dconroy)
[17:08] * MarioBranco (~MarioBran@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[17:14] <kihis> so. the wiring. http://pastebin.com/Bnbr178n
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[17:14] <kihis> i need something else. but what? some examples says there is RST, DC, CLK and DATA for SPI.
[17:16] <kihis> pin24 from display might be clock?
[17:17] * nitpe (~nitpe@d108-180-126-162.bchsia.telus.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:17] * nitpe (~nitpe@d108-180-126-162.bchsia.telus.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[17:17] <kihis> what is A0 and SDA signals?
[17:22] * mythos (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[17:23] <Habbie> SDA is part of i2c
[17:23] <Habbie> but i only read your very last line
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[17:24] <BurtyB> and A0 could be for address selection for I2C also
[17:25] <kihis> that datasheet says nothing about i2c
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[17:31] <BurtyB> kihis, it's prob "3-line"
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[17:32] * cwesterfield-awa (~cwest@66-38-67-33.pool.dsl.duo-county.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
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[17:32] <JuPaname> Bonjour tout le monde
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[17:32] <BurtyB> tho I haven't really looked :) I decided against buydisplay when they ignored a request :)
[17:33] <kihis> BurtyB: it's a bit weird shop. what you requested?
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[17:46] * mike_t (~mike@5850-AMTS-2-173.dialup.samtel.ru) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[17:46] <BurtyB> kline, it was an emailed quote for stuff not on the site but they didn't want to do the postage method (available on the site) I wanted
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[19:18] * Madatnek (~Madatnek@c-50a6db54.046-15-7673745.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) Quit (Read error: No route to host)
[19:18] * |gonzo| (~|gonzo|@unaffiliated/gonzo/x-2867351) Quit (Quit: quit)
[19:20] <plum> does anyone know how to use either iptables or its wrapper ufw to auto-block ^null$ attacks?
[19:20] * Madatnek (~Madatnek@c-50a6db54.046-15-7673745.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) has joined #raspberrypi
[19:20] <plum> i occasionally see messages in logwatch like so
[19:20] <plum> Attempts to use known hacks by 1 hosts were logged 2 time(s) from:
[19:20] <plum> ^null$ 2 Time(s)
[19:21] <plum> there's an ip address associated with it too which changes
[19:21] <kerio> does pi3-disable-bt actually cut the power to the bluetooth adapter?
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[19:43] <CoJaBo> Has anyone had image corruption issues with HDMI lately? I updated several months back, and was met with odd disruption (small dots of static and single-line tearing) that was quite severe (many lines per frame affected); over the last few months this has improved to only one bad line per few seconds, but it's still quite annoying, and very bad compared to my pre-update SD card.. anyone got any ideas? :/
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[19:49] <clever> CoJaBo: check the hdmi power config in config.txt?
[19:49] <CoJaBo> clever: No affect at all
[19:50] <CoJaBo> I tried every value from min to max on both old and new versions; every time, picture is perfect on old version, garbage on new
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[20:58] <ali1234> anyone used RPIO?
[20:58] <ali1234> i keep getting "RPIO.Exceptions.InvalidChannelException: The channel sent is invalid on a Raspberry Pi (not a valid gpio)"
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[21:01] <badger_> OpenBSD 6.1-current works on the RPi 3, I have tested it. Stable 6.1 release will come the 1st of May, packages will come for 6.2 possibly
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[21:01] <badger_> It's a really interesting OS for a server
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[21:02] <gordonDrogon> ali1234, I've not used it, but I've seen stuff use it. did you initialise it with the right pin mapping - board or bcm ?
[21:02] <ali1234> yes, still doesn't work
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[21:02] <ali1234> does wiringPi have python?
[21:02] <gordonDrogon> ali1234, there are some python wrappers on github - but I don't maintain them.
[21:03] <gordonDrogon> https://github.com/wiringpi I think.
[21:03] <ali1234> i have four buttons on four gpios and i want to run commands when they are pushed
[21:03] <ali1234> pretty simple really
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[21:03] <gordonDrogon> do it in a shell script..
[21:03] <methuzla> ali1234: what version pi are you using?
[21:03] <ali1234> what's the simplest way to implement this?
[21:03] <ali1234> methuzla: A+
[21:04] <gordonDrogon> https://projects.drogon.net/raspberry-pi/gpio-examples/tux-crossing/
[21:04] <gordonDrogon> that's just one button, but the principle is there.
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[21:04] <ali1234> geez that's like several hundred lines of code
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[21:05] <gordonDrogon> https://git.drogon.net/?p=gpioExamples;a=blob;f=tuxx/tuxx.sh
[21:05] <gordonDrogon> it's just an example.
[21:05] <ali1234> polling
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[21:06] <gordonDrogon> polling is fine. there are non-blocking ways, but harder to use in a shell script.
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[21:06] <gordonDrogon> er, blocking ways.
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[21:06] <ali1234> polling is not fine for battery operated device
[21:06] <ali1234> also, that can miss events
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[21:06] <gordonDrogon> you could run 4 shell scripts... one for each button. you'd use the gpio wfi ... command.
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[21:07] <gordonDrogon> that's a zero cpu cycle wait until the button is pushed.
[21:07] <ali1234> what would probably work
[21:07] <ali1234> *that
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[21:08] <gordonDrogon> want a very quick demo now?
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[21:08] <methuzla> ali1234: have you tried RPi.GPIO ?
[21:08] <ali1234> methuzla: no, does it have interrupts?
[21:08] <gordonDrogon> you need a Pi with 2 command/terminals in-front if you...
[21:08] <ali1234> i have that
[21:09] <ali1234> gpio -g is broadcom numbers right?
[21:09] <gordonDrogon> di you have anything connected to the gpio?
[21:09] <gordonDrogon> ali1234, yes, -g is bcm numbers.
[21:09] <ali1234> yeah, buttons on 5, 6, 12, and 13
[21:09] <gordonDrogon> are the butons biased - or just gpip pin -> 0v ?
[21:09] <ali1234> i need to activate internal pull up too
[21:09] <gordonDrogon> ok.
[21:09] <ali1234> they are pin -> siwtch -> 10k -> gnd
[21:09] <gordonDrogon> so, do this: in one window: gpio -g mode 5 up ; gpio -g wfi 5
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[21:10] <gordonDrogon> you might need < 10K.
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[21:10] <gordonDrogon> the internal is 50K.
[21:10] <ali1234> Usage: gpio wfi pin mode
[21:10] <gordonDrogon> anyway - if you do that, the terminal will hang at the wfi command.
[21:10] <gordonDrogon> sorry - gpio -g wfi 5 falling
[21:10] <ali1234> it works
[21:11] <gordonDrogon> then push the button ... yea.
[21:11] <gordonDrogon> the 2nd terminal was in-case you didn't have the buttons - I was going to get you to set the pull-down resistor to simulate a button push.
[21:12] <ali1234> this is for a headless project
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[21:12] <gordonDrogon> and I'm wondering now what RPIO is - I thought you were meaning RPi.GPIO ...
[21:12] <ali1234> i want a button to restart my service if it messes up, and a button to shutdown the pi
[21:12] <ali1234> no RPIO is a python library, all interrupt based
[21:12] <gordonDrogon> well that's how to do it - just run separate shell script for each button.
[21:12] <ali1234> i think it uses RPi.GPIO
[21:12] <methuzla> ali1234: https://sourceforge.net/p/raspberry-gpio-python/wiki/Inputs/
[21:13] <gordonDrogon> hm. ok.
[21:13] <gordonDrogon> good job I don't program in Python :)
[21:13] <ali1234> methuzla: hmm that looks almost identical to RPIO
[21:13] <gordonDrogon> anyway - back later. bakery time now.
[21:13] <ali1234> GPIO.add_event_callback(channel, my_callback, bouncetime=200)
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[21:20] <ali1234> i think RPIO isn't the package i thought it was
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[21:23] <methuzla> i think RPIO is based on RPi.GPIO
[21:23] <methuzla> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/RPIO
[21:23] <ali1234> ah gpiozero
[21:23] <ali1234> that's what i wanted to try to use
[21:24] <ali1234> https://gpiozero.readthedocs.io/en/stable/
[21:24] <ali1234> but checking my logs, apparently it polls
[21:24] <methuzla> yes. and then there's that one.
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[21:25] <ali1234> or apparently it can use RPi.GPIO too
[21:25] <waveform> ali1234, gpiozero polls? Only in the native pin backend which isn't the default
[21:25] <ali1234> yeah i just re-read that :)
[21:25] <waveform> (native's just a hacky thing I threw together as a fallback ;)
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[21:25] <ali1234> i just want to run "systemctl ..." when i press a button in the least amount of code, and as reliable as possible :)
[21:26] <waveform> should be easy enough: construct a button and set a handler for "when_pressed"
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[21:26] <ali1234> and i need to set the pull up resistors too
[21:26] <waveform> under the hood, that'll use edge-detection in RPi.GPIO to detect the button being pushed
[21:27] <ali1234> i'll read the docs :)
[21:27] <waveform> nope - the fact it knows it's a button means it'll set pull-up for you
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[21:27] <ali1234> but how does it know if i want pull up or pull down?
[21:28] <waveform> it defaults to up (but you can specify down). We assumed up as the default because then the circuit connects to ground, same as the basic LED circuit
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[21:29] <waveform> for example, at its most basic: https://bpaste.net/show/ff75ae5b758c
[21:29] <ali1234> um... where is the documentation?
[21:30] <ali1234> it just links to itself...
[21:30] <ali1234> oh i found it... "input devices"
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[21:30] <waveform> yup - we start with recipes (i.e. "show me how to do simple stuff") and the API reference is further on, divided into inputs, outputs, SPI, etc.
[21:31] <ali1234> oh and it is linked as well... just doesn't look like a link
[21:31] <Simonious> How do I set nilfs_cleanerd up as a service?
[21:32] <waveform> ali1234, yeah - that's RTD's default style - I've considered changing for alabaster (e.g. http://picraft.readthedocs.io/en/release-1.0/) but there's things I don't like about that one too :)
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[21:34] <ali1234> hey can i extend the Button class?
[21:35] <waveform> sure, if you want
[21:35] <ali1234> instead of saying button.when_pressed=<a function>
[21:35] <ali1234> can i just override when_pressed?
[21:35] <waveform> well, when_pressed is a property rather than a method so overriding it is not quite trivial
[21:35] <ali1234> oh :(
[21:35] <waveform> but, it is possible to override a method to be called on activation - let me dig out which it is
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[21:36] <waveform> good grief - mixins, I'd forgotten how complex it all is under the covers - I need to get back into this, meant to be hacking on gpizoero this week
[21:37] <ali1234> python can get pretty crazy when you get advanced with it
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[21:37] <ali1234> descriptors nearly made me quit python forever
[21:38] <waveform> heh - there's meta-classes at the base of gpiozero - it's easy at the top and gets progressively nastier the further you go down
[21:38] <waveform> ah, there it is: _fire_activated(self) is the method that gets executed when the device is activated (which in turn kicks off when_activated, when_pressed, etc.)
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[21:39] <ali1234> what about when_held?
[21:39] <ali1234> does it do them all?
[21:39] <waveform> nope - that one's trickier - there's a background that periodically fires that off (in another mixin) - just a sec
[21:40] <waveform> (because when_held isn't fired by anything electrical)
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[21:41] <waveform> ah, _fire_held(self) - I should've guessed :)
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[21:41] <ali1234> what about release?
[21:41] <waveform> _fire_deactivated(self)
[21:41] <waveform> (you'll find 'em under EventsMixin in gpiozero/mixins.py)
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[21:41] <ali1234> okay... so _fire_activated only fires on press
[21:42] <waveform> yup
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[21:42] <ali1234> nothing else?
[21:42] <ali1234> okay... this should be good then
[21:42] <waveform> https://github.com/RPi-Distro/python-gpiozero/blob/master/gpiozero/mixins.py#L146
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[21:43] <ali1234> does this look reasonable? http://paste.debian.net/923040/
[21:43] <waveform> (just don't look at _wrap_callback if you don't like descriptors ;)
[21:43] <ali1234> oh it should be Button.__init__(...
[21:43] <waveform> yeah, and personally I'd use super() rather than just naming the super-class but otherwise should be okay
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[21:45] <waveform> oh - I vaguely recall some issue with system() and RPi.GPIO though ... I think Ben mentioned that'd been fixed, but my memory's fuzzy
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[21:46] <ali1234> the whole thing will run as a service as root
[21:46] <waveform> (it was a bug in RPi.GPIO - something about signals as I recall)
[21:46] <ali1234> i'll be running systemctl and stuff
[21:46] <methuzla> ali1234: self.command in _fire_activated()
[21:47] <ali1234> haha yeah, i'm fixing all this stuff now
[21:47] <ali1234> lots of mistakes in it, just wanted to show the general idea
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[21:47] <methuzla> someone could probably sell a python programmers keyboard that has a 'self.' button on it
[21:47] <enginerd123> any suggestions for simple SPI tutorials written in Python?
[21:48] <ali1234> enginerd123: spidev is really simple
[21:48] * mschorm (~mschorm@ip-78-102-201-117.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[21:48] <ali1234> you just read and write the device like a file
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[21:48] <ali1234> if you need bidirectional transfers it gets harder
[21:49] <ali1234> waveform: http://paste.debian.net/923045/
[21:50] <ali1234> i tried with python3...
[21:50] <waveform> you're in a virtualenv?
[21:50] <ali1234> nope
[21:50] <enginerd123> I want my arduino to send sensor data, then have my pi send commands back
[21:50] * spacebar_ (~textual@2601:58a:8601:8e2:f9d9:8f42:fde3:ad93) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:51] <waveform> ali1234, that's weird - very weird. How did you install gpiozero? (I've obviously missed a dependency somewhere...)
[21:51] <ali1234> apt-get
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[21:52] <waveform> okay, very very weird - Raspbian ought to have python-pkg-resources by default. Hmmm.
[21:53] <waveform> can you try "apt-get install python-pkg-resources python3-pkg-resources" - that should fix it up, but I should have a look at why that got missed
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[21:53] <ali1234> it works fine with python2
[21:53] <ali1234> python3-pkg-resources wasn't installed
[21:54] <waveform> interesting - Raspbian jessie?
[21:54] <ali1234> yes
[21:54] <ali1234> downloaded yesterday
[21:54] <ali1234> or maybe it was last week actually
[21:54] <ali1234> recent, anyway
[21:54] * Abraham_Slam (~Abraham_S@rene.sbs.umass.edu) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[21:54] <waveform> well, either way sounds like I've got a dep missing on the py3 package ...
[21:54] <waveform> (sorry about that - should work out of the box)
[21:55] <Simonious> anyone used nilfs2 with raspian?
[21:55] <ali1234> with bounce_time=1 the actual delay is about 5 seconds between presses
[21:55] <ali1234> but... hmm i did say yesterda that the whole system feels slow, like a clock is wrong
[21:56] <ali1234> with bounce_time=None there's no delay... but there's bounces
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[21:56] <waveform> ali1234, yeah - I'd leave off bounce elimination for now - I'm not convinced RPi.GPIO does it terribly well
[21:57] <waveform> (gpiozero just passes all that stuff down to the pin driver so we rely on its implementation - it's one of the reasons we're moving toward pigpio as the default backend)
[21:57] <ali1234> i need debouncing though
[21:57] <ali1234> it seems to work fine, just seems confused about the length of a second
[21:58] <waveform> well, you can try pigpio as the backend and see if that improves things
[21:58] <ali1234> how?
[21:58] <enginerd123> my RPi storage got filled, and now will no longer boot...it shows the Raspian logo, then goes black with a blinking cursor. Any suggestions?
[21:58] <waveform> first enable pigpio's daemon: systemctl enable pigpiod
[21:58] <waveform> then run your script with GPIOZERO_PIN_FACTORY=PiGPIOPin in the environment
[21:59] <ali1234> this is an A+
[21:59] <Simonious> enginerd123: can you make an image of that sdcard and then write it to a new bigger sdcard?
[21:59] <ali1234> i'm more and more suspecting a clock is messed up
[21:59] <waveform> (warning: this is experimental stuff and that variable *will* change in the next release)
[21:59] <enginerd123> I tried, but every time I do that, it partitions the bigger card (16gb) down to 2gb
[21:59] <Simonious> enginerd123: or.. *thinks* put a clean install on a bigger card and then pull over the things you need from the old install
[22:00] <Simonious> enginerd123: yes, but does it boot?
[22:00] <enginerd123> no
[22:00] <enginerd123> same problem
[22:00] <Jusii> you need to resize the partitions after clone
[22:00] <Jusii> fdisk + resize2fs
[22:00] * Simonious nods
[22:00] <waveform> ali1234, not so sure about the clock being messed up - I've had the same debounce issues with RPi.GPIO on a Pi3 (not quite as extreme as a full second, but it's way more than specified)
[22:00] <ali1234> this should be 1 second but its more like 5-7 seconds
[22:00] <enginerd123> is it possible a lack of disk space is causing the boot issue? It ran out when I tried to install sympy
[22:01] <ali1234> enginerd123: yes
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[22:02] <Simonious> enginerd123: If it were me.. I might do a fresh install on a larger stick, open the broken full image on another machine, copy it to a USB stick, move that stick to the pi and grab the things I need.
[22:02] * eroux (~eroux@196-210-1-8.dynamic.isadsl.co.za) Quit (Quit: ZZZzzz… ZZZzzz…)
[22:03] * marshmn (~matt@marshmn.plus.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[22:03] <enginerd123> how do I grab the things I need, when even the image I have won't boot?
[22:03] <methuzla> enginerd123: did you resize partition?
[22:03] <enginerd123> really, I just want to grab the .py files. I can reinstall the modules later.
[22:04] * jkridner|pd is now known as jkridner
[22:04] <Simonious> If you can mount it on another machine you can copy it to a USB stick that you can use on the pi OR just transfer them via network.
[22:04] <enginerd123> I'm writing the image to the larger disk now
[22:04] <ali1234> waveform: http://paste.debian.net/923050/
[22:04] * phil42 (~phil42@c-76-125-104-228.hsd1.ar.comcast.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:04] <ali1234> (it didn't work)
[22:04] <enginerd123> simonious what do you mean mount it?
[22:05] <waveform> ali1234, yeah - that's a bug in our pigpio driver most likely (debounce is one of the things we haven't tested yet in there)
[22:05] <ali1234> can i specify a float for debounce time?
[22:05] <waveform> sure
[22:06] <ali1234> maybe the problem is my pull down is too big
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[22:06] * marcdinkum (~marcdinku@ Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[22:07] <waveform> (I realize seconds is a bit of a weird measure for debounce, but for the sake of consistency/simplicity we went with "all times measured in seconds" throughout the library)
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[22:10] <waveform> argh, I see the issue with the pkg-resources missing dep - it's in the build deps, not the install deps. Right, that's another thing to get fixed up this week
[22:10] <ali1234> waveform: it consistently loses the first press
[22:10] <ali1234> even with no debounce
[22:10] <waveform> with the RPi.GPIO backend?
[22:10] <ali1234> yes
[22:11] <ali1234> fixed code: http://paste.debian.net/923051/
[22:12] <ali1234> i suppose it might be consistently failing to run system() the first time
[22:12] <ali1234> i'll make it print too
[22:12] <ali1234> nope
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[22:13] * HoloIRCUser (~holoirc@host228-111-dynamic.22-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:13] <icee> hi, any known issue with gdb on raspberry pi? Attempting to gdb a multithreaded program, and i only get to see the first thread
[22:13] <waveform> ali1234, hmmm - just a mo and I'll rig up a button to test
[22:14] <ali1234> i'll put a scope on it, make sure it's not my wiring
[22:14] <icee> ps -eFL correctly shows oodles of lightweight processes.. but gdb just shows the one.
[22:14] <waveform> ali1234, can't seem to reproduce missing the first one - fires nicely for me
[22:14] <HoloIRCUser> Hello guys I need a media center computer, like watching on streaming football games in HD. I was thinking to buy a cheap laptop, but then I thought 'Ehy the raspberry pi is just 30€!'. Do u think the raspberry pi 3 could do the job?
[22:15] <ali1234> maybe related to the suspected messed up clock
[22:15] <waveform> 'course might not be the "first" pulse if my switch is bouncy
[22:15] <ali1234> any idea how i can check that?
[22:15] <waveform> oh, and I am testing on a Pi3 here - the A+ is buried somewhere :)
[22:15] <ali1234> i'm using tactile switches... they are not very bouncy
[22:15] <kerio> HoloIRCUser: might get away with a pi0w actually
[22:15] <kerio> 10 monies
[22:16] <kerio> ...honestly tho, just buy a chromecast
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[22:16] <HoloIRCUser> kerio: so a raspberry is not enough?
[22:16] <Simonious> enginerd123: Hmm, well I can't mount it on the windows box I am on.. that's not true I can mount it, but linux doesn't know how to read it. I *think* on a linux box you could mount the image AND read it
[22:16] <kerio> HoloIRCUser: it probably is
[22:17] <kerio> it's not going to be as simple of an experience as a chromecast tho
[22:17] <kerio> keep that in mind
[22:17] <methuzla> HoloIRCUser: if the software engages the GPU, any pi can handle it
[22:17] <kerio> if your streaming site is supported by youtube-dl or livestreamer, then it's going to be easy
[22:18] * immibis (~chatzilla@122-59-202-57.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[22:18] <HoloIRCUser> kerio: I'll check if it is.
[22:18] <HoloIRCUser> methuzla: that sounds great
[22:18] <kerio> the pi 0 is tiny ;o
[22:18] <kerio> buy one
[22:19] <waveform> ali1234, oh there's something interesting ... https://sourceforge.net/p/raspberry-gpio-python/code/ci/default/tree/source/event_gpio.c#l324 <-- that's the chunk of RPi.GPIO that handles edge detection
[22:19] <kerio> everyone needs to buy one
[22:19] <HoloIRCUser> kerio: ahah ah I will some day
[22:19] <waveform> ali1234, note the "ignore first epoll trigger" line ... there's probably a good reason for that (which I don't know off the top of my head) but I wonder ...
[22:20] <kerio> unless you have ethernet behind your tv, 0 and 3 shouldn't really make much of a difference
[22:20] <kerio> the heavy lifting is done by the gpu core
[22:20] <ali1234> waveform: i did implement the polling loop myself once, it was annoying
[22:21] <enginerd123> hmm, Simonious is it normal for the image partition to naturally only be 2gb, then it uses the remaining 6gb on an 8gb disk as file storage? Or should the image show 2gb of 8gb used for the image partition?
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[22:21] <waveform> epoll ultimately does the heavy lifting in RPi.GPIO (edge detection is effectively epoll on the sysfs files). In native I used the GPIO registers to do edge detection instead, but that turned out to have drawbacks of its own
[22:22] <HoloIRCUser> I actually thought about a raspberry pi 3 because it's not for me, it would be for a public place in which we steam football games. So if raspberry does support HD playback, I'd install q4os on it with Xp skin package, so it will look extremely close to windows and make it be easy to be used by anyone. It'd be connected to a projector and on the net through an Ethernet cable
[22:22] <Simonious> enginerd123: I don't know what is normal. ;) So much variation out there. When I install a 2GB image on a larger card I go into raspi-config and find the 'expand filesystem' option to use all the space
[22:22] <Simonious> I do also mount a USB stick to /home
[22:22] <HoloIRCUser> We'd just need to spend 2€ for a keyboard and a mouse and then boom we have a computer with 32€ instead of 300
[22:22] <kerio> HoloIRCUser: yeah no
[22:22] <Simonious> because that is where I do datalogging and I don't ant to murder my sdcard
[22:23] <HoloIRCUser> kerio: why no :(
[22:23] <HoloIRCUser> kerio: you are breaking my dreams :(:(
[22:23] <kerio> because you're not going to be able to just open chromium and go to your streaming site and play the video back
[22:23] <Simonious> I've got nilfs2 on there right now and it is giving me a little trouble, I've not nilfs-tools installed, but it isn't auto running cleanerd like it does on ubuntu, so I need to get that setup as a service
[22:23] * kubaxvx (xkx@gateway/shell/mydevil.net/x-tzkqrsotvvozmrni) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:23] <Simonious> or else the nilfs volume will never reclaim space!
[22:24] * mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:24] <HoloIRCUser> kerio: i don't understand why
[22:24] <methuzla> HoloIRCUser: if the software engages the GPU, any pi can handle it (note the 'if')
[22:24] <kerio> well ok there's experimental builds with hardware acceleration support
[22:25] <kubaxvx> Hi, I am trying to register on raspberrypi.com but cannot pass captcha (there is just a heading "Captcha check" but no captcha itself). Do any of you have the similar problem or I just turned into robot overnight? ;)
[22:25] * YuGiOhJCJ (~YuGiOhJCJ@bur64-4-78-199-90-154.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Quit: YuGiOhJCJ)
[22:25] <methuzla> kubaxvx: prove youre not a robot
[22:26] <HoloIRCUser> What in interested in is: can I make it be done automatically? I mean, I can take a day setting it and I'm fine, it's gonna be fun in some way. But once I'm done, will I need to set it every time I need to watch a video online or it will do it automatically?
[22:26] <enginerd123> when I try to mount the image, it says it's corrupted :(
[22:26] <HoloIRCUser> methuzla: doesn't online steaming influence the gpu?
[22:26] <Simonious> enginerd123: what OS are you trying to mount with?
[22:26] <enginerd123> windows
[22:27] <kubaxvx> I've tried Firefox & Chrome, on Linux & Win and no captcha at all
[22:27] <Simonious> enginerd123: I don't think windows is going to be able to mount an ext* volume
[22:27] <Simonious> enginerd123: do you have a linux machine you can try to mount that volume with?
[22:27] <kubaxvx> methuzla: heh, I'd really love to do so xD
[22:27] <enginerd123> that's the only OS I have
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[22:27] <HoloIRCUser> kubaxvx: it happened to me too with opera and Internet Explorer
[22:28] <HoloIRCUser> kubaxvx: sorry I meant edge not explorer
[22:28] <enginerd123> hm so before you were saying install NOOBS on my new card, get the RPi booted, then mount the image of the old card via the USB reader there?
[22:28] <ali1234> waveform: my scope has no problems with it. there is some bouncing but no more than 1ms
[22:28] <Simonious> enginerd123: yeah give that a go
[22:28] <methuzla> HoloIRCUser: the stream will most likely be some form of compressed video, which will need to be decompressed on the pi
[22:28] <Simonious> you may find that image can be mounted when it doesn't have to do the booting.
[22:29] <methuzla> HoloIRCUser: the GPU can generally handle that much more easily than the CPU
[22:29] * phil42 (~phil42@c-76-125-104-228.hsd1.ar.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:29] <methuzla> HoloIRCUser: the crux being having software that utilizes the GPU vs. just brute force math on the CPU
[22:30] <kerio> honestly you'd be hard pressed to use chromium in the first place
[22:30] * mschorm (~mschorm@ip-78-102-201-117.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:30] <shauno> kubaxvx: same here, it appears. I can't promise you're not a robot though
[22:30] <kerio> thing's *heavy*
[22:31] <kerio> HoloIRCUser: apparently kodi has a bunch of plugins for streaming sites
[22:31] * HoloIRCUser (~holoirc@host228-111-dynamic.22-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit (Quit: HoloIRCUser)
[22:31] <kerio> but you'll have to rethink your view of the thing
[22:31] <ali1234> actually up to about 5ms
[22:31] <kerio> the pi is not a desktop computer
[22:31] <kerio> it can serve as a decent and cheap(!!!!!) media center
[22:31] <waveform> ali1234, afraid I can't reproduce here at the moment - works happily on the first go (I can definitely reproduce the debounce taking *ages* to reset though)
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[22:33] <kerio> well, they just ragequit
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[22:34] <ali1234> if (g->bouncetime == -666 || timenow - g->lastcall > g->bouncetime*1000 || g->lastcall == 0 || g->lastcall > timenow)
[22:34] <ali1234> looks fine to me
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[22:41] <waveform> yes - which means it's something in epoll or sysfs (or some interaction between them - urgh)
[22:41] <ali1234> i set bounce to 0.01 and its not dropping the first event now
[22:43] <waveform> I expect it's still suppressing more edges than it should though?
[22:43] <ali1234> maybe. it looses a press every now and then
[22:43] <waveform> yeah - that's usually my experience of it
[22:43] <ali1234> seems like a subsequent "bounce" can mask an edge that already happened
[22:44] <ali1234> if timeout is 1 and you press really fast, you can prevent the event from ever firing
[22:44] <ali1234> until you stop anyway
[22:44] <waveform> indeed - which just shouldn't happen
[22:45] <waveform> unfortunately I haven't got time to dig into it further right now, but when I get onto gpiozero work later this week I'll try and remember to have a poke around that stuff
[22:47] <ali1234> any advice for how to debounce manually in python?
[22:47] <methuzla> time.sleep()?
[22:47] <ali1234> well, will that just queue up the events?
[22:47] <SpeedEvil> ali1234: 100ms post last change, after 10 samples, for example
[22:47] <SpeedEvil> sample every 10ms
[22:48] <ali1234> i am using gpiozero
[22:48] <ali1234> it is interrupt driven
[22:48] <methuzla> oh yeah.
[22:48] <SpeedEvil> Then add a timer to check if the last change was 10ms ago
[22:48] <ali1234> yeah
[22:48] <SpeedEvil> 100
[22:48] <ali1234> i'll just reimplement the same logic
[22:49] <ali1234> except mine will work :)
[22:49] <methuzla> ^^that
[22:49] <atomi> you guyus know about this https://wiki.openwrt.org/toh/raspberry_pi_foundation/raspberry_pi
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[22:51] <methuzla> or hardware debounce
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[23:01] <enginerd123> alright I'm trying to mount my USB in command line, but I have 4 different sda devices- how do I know which one is the USB?
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[23:04] <gordonDrogon> enginerd123, type dmesg and see what it says was the last one plugged in. Also cat /proc/partitions
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[23:06] <HrdwrBoB> what gordonDrogon said
[23:06] <enginerd123> it's got all kinds of shit happening in dmesg
[23:06] <methuzla> dmesg | grep sda
[23:07] <HrdwrBoB> or
[23:07] <HrdwrBoB> unplug and replug it
[23:07] <enginerd123> attached SCSI removeable disk, recovery on sda5, volume not properly mounted on sda6, recovery complete on sda7
[23:07] * de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:07] <HrdwrBoB> methuzla: that only shows sda, that's not what he wants
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[23:08] <enginerd123> "new high-speed USB device number 7"...so sda7?
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[23:09] <enginerd123> it's not very explicit about which sda I'm looking for
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[23:10] <enginerd123> or are all the sda's the different partitions on the usb?
[23:11] <gordonDrogon> you may see /dev/sdd1, /dev/sdd2, etc. for a device with multiple partitions.
[23:12] * sphenxes (~sphenxes@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:13] * sphenxes01 (~sphenxes@ Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[23:13] <enginerd123> don't see that at all
[23:13] * dj_pi (~dj@c-68-43-191-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:14] <HrdwrBoB> enginerd123: no
[23:14] <HrdwrBoB> sd? is a hardware device
[23:14] <HrdwrBoB> sda is the first one
[23:14] <HrdwrBoB> you are almost certainly not looking for sda
[23:14] <enginerd123> I'm just trying to mount the USB via this article: http://www.raspberrypi-spy.co.uk/2014/05/how-to-mount-a-usb-flash-disk-on-the-raspberry-pi/
[23:16] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@host-67-21-184-89.nctv.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:17] <methuzla> what does ls -l /dev/disk/by-uuid/ show?
[23:17] * Datalink (~Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:17] <enginerd123> hang on, I'm resetting it so I can VNC and copy/paste my screen
[23:18] <methuzla> also, what is 'the USB' ?
[23:19] <enginerd123> http://imgur.com/a/Ttq9W
[23:19] <enginerd123> it's a microSD card reader, I'm trying to recover some files from a corrupt image
[23:19] * Gathis (~TheBlack@unaffiliated/gathis) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:20] <methuzla> is there anything in it?
[23:20] <enginerd123> uuid shows: http://imgur.com/a/JhCXy
[23:20] <enginerd123> ...yes.
[23:20] <enginerd123> ...the SD card with the corrupt image.
[23:21] <enginerd123> also plugged in is a USB keyboard and HDMI monitor
[23:22] * averagecase (~fjorton@dslb-092-072-187-237.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:23] * nitpe (~nitpe@d108-180-126-162.bchsia.telus.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:23] * oxhak (~OxHaK@unaffiliated/oxhak) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[23:23] <enginerd123> any ideas?
[23:25] * spoutnik16 (53e4f8e5@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[23:25] <spoutnik16> hi
[23:26] <spoutnik16> i would like to set up my raspberry pies so that, when i go to my friends, i can hide them with a power plug, and they'll get me a secret vpn
[23:26] <spoutnik16> how would you do that ?
[23:27] * TheSin (~TheSin@d108-181-59-119.abhsia.telus.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:27] <methuzla> enginerd123: i'd guess it's like gordonDrogon said. four different partitions. maybe just mount them all and see which one has what you want.
[23:27] <leftyfb> spoutnik16: you won't get help with that here
[23:27] <spoutnik16> that's just theoretical
[23:27] <leftyfb> spoutnik16: right. Good luck
[23:28] <methuzla> spoutnik16: the same way you'd do it with your own network
[23:28] <spoutnik16> ok, next question: is it a bad question to ask where i should get such an answer ?
[23:28] <leftyfb> spoutnik16: google
[23:28] <spoutnik16> google is not a place, google is the internet :)
[23:29] <spoutnik16> next question :) : i would like to have a raspberry pi i could let at home and use as a vpn, how do i do that ?
[23:29] <leftyfb> spoutnik16: http://bfy.tw/AlyD
[23:29] <leftyfb> there ya go
[23:29] <Broly> NetWinder Floating Point Emulator V0.97 (extended precision) http://pastebin.com/arNzC82d is this emulation a result of the wlan "blobs" being softfloat? i know this is the reason it panics after startup (can't initialise them). just found the emulator bit curious because when it checks the procs it detects VFP mode (just can't use it, again i suspect due to the blob)
[23:29] <spoutnik16> leftyfb: thx :)
[23:29] <Broly> ^ none of you guys can answer this question that's not the purpose of me sharing the above
[23:30] <enginerd123> ok I have the usb mounted, how can I unwrap the image so I can recover files?
[23:30] <Broly> it's more to convey there are some seriuos questions regarding the hardfloat "feature" on armv7 and up, especially when you're only linking wlan blobs. no reason the kernel built for the architecture should flip on an emulator. i'm pretty sure it's on the broadcom end
[23:30] <spoutnik16> leftyfb: *steal* was the magic keyword i was looking for, thank you
[23:30] <Broly> ARM is in serious trouble. no wonder rothschild booked it out in late 2015
[23:30] <Broly> freakin' runt
[23:31] <Broly> shouldn't need an emulator for a hardfloat CPU when the kernel is being built from *SCRATCH*
[23:31] <Broly> as you can see the VFP feature is picked up without issue (again, just can't use it)
[23:32] <spoutnik16> !!! i saw a guy use a raspberry pi in Mr Robot, this must be such a cool hype hacker tool !!!
[23:32] * rigel3 (~rigel3@ Quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.4)
[23:33] * TheSin (~TheSin@d108-181-59-119.abhsia.telus.net) Quit (Quit: Client exiting)
[23:35] <clever> Broly: from what ive heard, its extremely rare for kernel drivers to ever use the FPU
[23:35] * evanextreme (~evanextre@ehirshlaptop.student.rit.edu) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[23:35] * netzfisch (~Thunderbi@x55b06365.dyn.telefonica.de) Quit (Quit: netzfisch)
[23:37] <ExeciN> I'm trying to bring xdebug in my php7 environment. I fetched php7 from the stretch raspbian repo so when I try to install php7.0-dev from stretch it tries to fetch the rest of the stretch repo too
[23:38] <Broly> clever: not drivers. programs that i want to compile in the OS
[23:38] <leftyfb> no, it tried to pull in the php7.0-dev dependency tree
[23:38] <ExeciN> https://gist.github.com/anonymous/eb72a8289e13cb394793e2b63e9ea273
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[23:39] <clever> Broly: if hardfloat is available, it shouldnt need fpu emulation, x86 works the same way
[23:39] <Broly> it does though
[23:39] <clever> weird
[23:39] <Broly> as you can see in the boot log posted above, it detects VFP but flips on teh emulator
[23:39] <Broly> not weird, it's a fraud
[23:39] <ExeciN> well, I like to exaggerate
[23:40] <Broly> i checked the dd-wrt kernel that's softfloat and it does not call the emulator
[23:40] <Broly> so this issue is strictly when you build a proper hardfloat ARM kernel for the target
[23:40] <ExeciN> is there any other way to get xdebug without fetching the whole stretch repo?
[23:40] <leftyfb> ExeciN: every one of those is part of the dependency tree for the package you're trying to instal
[23:40] * mschorm (~mschorm@ip-78-102-201-117.net.upcbroadband.cz) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:40] <leftyfb> ExeciN: it's not the whole stretch repo
[23:41] <leftyfb> ExeciN: and no, unless you don't want it to work
[23:41] <leftyfb> ExeciN: that's why they're called dependencies
[23:41] <ExeciN> I know, its just a lot of packages (and I like to exaggerate)
[23:41] <leftyfb> it's 33 new packages
[23:41] <leftyfb> 46mb
[23:41] <leftyfb> that's nothing
[23:41] <ExeciN> yeah I'm more worried about the "375 not upgraded" part
[23:42] <leftyfb> why?
[23:42] <leftyfb> actually, looking at the list, upgrading things like libc6 and not the rest of your OS might be problematic
[23:42] <ExeciN> because if I upgrade I'm gonna find my pi installing 375 packages
[23:42] <leftyfb> don't upgrade
[23:43] <ExeciN> if I don't use -t stretch nothing needs upgrading
[23:43] <leftyfb> install what you need from the repo and then disable it
[23:43] <ali1234> ExeciN: http://jaqque.sbih.org/kplug/apt-pinning.html
[23:43] <leftyfb> heh
[23:44] <leftyfb> ali1234: are you suggesting he pins 375+ packages? :)
[23:44] <ali1234> no, it doesn't work like that
[23:44] <ExeciN> ali1234: I thought about pinning but I'm worried that they packages will get stuck
[23:44] <ali1234> you set stretch priority lower, and then pin what you want from stretch
[23:44] * feksclaus (~feksclaus@80-71-131-204.u.parknet.dk) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.7)
[23:44] <ExeciN> and keep me from upgrading/installing other stuff in the future
[23:44] * defsdoor (~andy@cpc35-sutt4-2-0-cust184.19-1.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:44] * webturtle0 (~webturtle@ Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[23:44] <ExeciN> *the
[23:45] * feksclaus (~feksclaus@80-71-131-204.u.parknet.dk) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:47] * ozy is now known as lugbot
[23:47] <ExeciN> all those dependencies are for php7.0-dev
[23:47] * lugbot is now known as ozy
[23:47] <ExeciN> is there a way to get xdebug without php7.0-dev?
[23:49] <badger_> is there a way to turn off red and green leed on RPi3? after looking for a solution I concluded it's not possible :( am I wrong? I hate to not be able to turn off lights in a non-physical way
[23:50] * miczac (~miczac@ has joined #raspberrypi
[23:50] <ali1234> badger_: it can be done through device tree but i don't know how
[23:50] <ali1234> i remember reading it in /boot/overlays/README
[23:51] <badger_> I've read it's possible on previous RPis.. thanks, I'll check it
[23:51] * foul_owl (~foul_owl@c-73-97-48-166.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:51] * semyon (~semyon@unaffiliated/semyon) Quit (Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com))
[23:52] <foul_owl> Does rpi support linux containers "out of the box" now or do I have to recompile the kernel?
[23:52] * Datalink (~Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[23:53] <Broly> it does not support a built from scratch kernel out of the box, as you have to link broadcom's blob to make it boot
[23:53] <Broly> but there is a blob available, so it's semi outta da bawx
[23:54] <badger_> anyway the Broadcom SoC is a blob
[23:54] <Broly> BLAWB
[23:55] <badger_> https://ftp.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/songs/song39.ogg blooooob
[23:55] <ali1234> how do i enable the systemd journal on raspbian?
[23:55] <badger_> ( https://www.openbsd.org/39.html )
[23:55] <badger_> oh sorry this is the link https://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#39
[23:56] <ali1234> oh never mind
[23:57] * Cy-GorWork (~IceChat9@ Quit (Quit: Copywight 2016 Elmer Fudd. All wights wesewved.)
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[23:59] * Kostenko (~Kostenko@bl5-166-253.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #raspberrypi

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