#raspberrypi IRC Log

Index

IRC Log for 2018-03-21

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] * rizzitello (~quassel@24.105.220.210) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:01] * ShapeShifter499 (~ShapeShif@unaffiliated/shapeshifter499) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[0:06] <Ilyas> question, so, i
[0:06] <Ilyas> I'm typing sudo apt-get update followed by upgrade
[0:06] * clickboom (~boomclick@142.91.189.44) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:06] <Ilyas> but when I reboot, the EXACT same packages will need to be installed again
[0:08] * Alexander-47u (~Alexander@95.211.147.134) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:09] <norlevo> did anyone do the raspberry pi 3 kodi/libreelec-install and gotten netflix to work? I've installed libreelec and did the milhouse-update but I can't seem to find what to do next....do I need an addon or something?
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[0:19] <r3> Ilyas: try creating a file somewhere, like "ls / > ~/test.test", verify that it's there, and then reboot. See if it is still there.
[0:20] <CoJaBo> is it not shutting down cleanly
[0:21] <r3> if it isn't, you might be into "Groundhog Day" mode where the SD card is going bad and changes to the file system don't survive a reboot. (in my experience, this is a test you can do that shows that, but I'm sure that there is a more technical and detailed reason for it. I just happen to notice this effect, and I've mentioned it in here before)
[0:22] <CoJaBo> oh joy, another flash failure mode to worry about
[0:22] <r3> though, the credit for the term "Groundhog Day" goes to another - I stole it as I thought it was a perfect name for it ;)
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[0:29] <Giant81> is Debian the closest thing I should be using in a VM on my x86 to raspbian?
[0:29] <davr0s> anyone here used the pi camera and managed to stream it over a network? (I can preview and record using 'raspivid' find). i'm trying this, http://www.raspberry-projects.com/pi/pi-hardware/raspberry-pi-camera/streaming-video-using-vlc-player ... i see the port by scanning it from my mac, but any attempt to open that fails
[0:29] <Giant81> I wanted to tinker with a VM before my pi got here, but the pi is ARM not x86 so I Can't run raspbian in a VM
[0:30] <davr0s> i've seen something else using mjpg_stream - i got that to work but i dont think thats as good as h264 ?
[0:30] <ebarch> Giant81: check out https://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads/raspberry-pi-desktop/
[0:30] <r3> Raspbian is essentially Debian with binaries compiled to match the Pi's processor more closely than the official Debian binaries.
[0:30] <davr0s> i dont absolutely need this but it would be nice to have
[0:30] <Giant81> r3: thanks
[0:31] <Giant81> ebarch: sorry I meant to thank you
[0:31] * DuchiDachi (~DuchiDach@2.237.74.240) Quit (Quit: Quit)
[0:31] <ebarch> =)
[0:31] <Giant81> r3 yeah mostly it was also to get familiar with the windowing environment
[0:32] * r3 nods
[0:33] <r3> ebarch: I didn't know that existed, so good link - thanks
[0:34] <r3> davr0s: I've seen this answer before, but haven't tried it: https://raspberrypi.stackexchange.com/questions/23182/how-to-stream-video-from-raspberry-pi-camera-and-watch-it-live
[0:34] <davr0s> ok thanks
[0:35] <davr0s> i see it tries to fix 'restreaming a stream'..
[0:35] <r3> vlc is going to have a delay, so I think that the v4l2 driver is the way to go
[0:40] * wuzamarine (~kvirc@c-68-33-78-133.hsd1.md.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[0:43] <Giant81> so what is pixel? just a desktop environment on top of raspbian?
[0:45] <r3> “Pi Improved Xwindows Environment, Lightweight”
[0:45] * rafaeldelucena (~rafaeldel@2804:14d:ba83:2709:745b:c2cf:e7e8:f470) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[0:45] * rorro (~rorro@h-170-152-58.A163.priv.bahnhof.se) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:46] <r3> Giant81: this might help? https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/introducing-pixel/
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[2:42] <ShapeShifter499> hi
[2:42] <ShapeShifter499> I'm having this odd issue, has a pi zero not boot because of the sd card model?
[2:42] <ShapeShifter499> swapping the sd card and it boots fine
[2:42] * AntiComposite (~AntiCompo@wikipedia/AntiCompositeNumber) Quit (Quit: Uh oh, the bouncer's gone down.)
[2:42] * dreamon__ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[2:42] <ShapeShifter499> the sd card shows up on my computer
[2:45] * Reedy (~quassel@wikimedia/pdpc.active.reedy) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[2:47] <ShapeShifter499> it's a toshiba brand sd card
[2:47] <ShapeShifter499> 16gb
[2:47] <ShapeShifter499> micro sd
[2:47] * Reedy (~quassel@wikimedia/pdpc.active.reedy) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:49] <leftyfb> ShapeShifter499: it's possible the sd card wasn't imaged properly?
[2:50] <ShapeShifter499> leftyfb: I have 4 Pi zeros and 3 of them boot with different brand sd cards
[2:50] <ShapeShifter499> this one doesn't boot on any
[2:50] <leftyfb> you still haven't answered the question
[2:50] <ShapeShifter499> card is read fine on the computer
[2:51] <ShapeShifter499> leftyfb: I did the same exact thing on each sd card
[2:51] <leftyfb> except maybe something didn't go right on the one with the issue
[2:51] <ShapeShifter499> I ran fdisk and setup two partitions with a dos partition
[2:51] <ShapeShifter499> I mean dos layout, one partition is fat32 and the other is ext4
[2:52] <leftyfb> that's not how you image an sd card for a pi
[2:53] <ShapeShifter499> leftyfb: I installed arch linux, they don't offer a img file
[2:53] <ShapeShifter499> they offer a compressed file system full of everything thats needed
[2:54] <ShapeShifter499> I already have arch linux booting on the other pi zeros
[2:54] <ShapeShifter499> I absolutely cannot think what it could be
[2:54] <ShapeShifter499> could the SD card require a odd amount of power?
[2:55] <ShapeShifter499> I have two of these toshiba cards
[2:57] * Jekotia (~Jekotia@2607:fea8:a7a0:41a::9) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:58] <ShapeShifter499> leftyfb: I'm so confused
[2:58] <leftyfb> ShapeShifter499: Try imaging raspbian to it as a test
[2:58] <leftyfb> ShapeShifter499: if that works, wipe it and put arch on it again
[2:59] <ShapeShifter499> leftyfb: dd if=/path/to/img of=/path/to/sdcard
[2:59] <leftyfb> yes
[2:59] <ShapeShifter499> alright
[3:02] * redstarcomrade (~quassel@cpe-104-175-255-182.socal.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[3:06] * darsie (~username@84-114-73-160.cable.dynamic.surfer.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:06] <darsie> The service was designed to be cheap and easy to run, says Mr Dittoh - it works on a Raspberry Pi 2 computer with a GSM dongle. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-43409952 'Siri, will talking ever top typing?'
[3:09] * Reedy (~quassel@wikimedia/pdpc.active.reedy) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
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[3:20] <ShapeShifter499> leftyfb: strange, it boots with rasbian
[3:20] <ShapeShifter499> I don't know what I did wrong
[3:20] <leftyfb> not strange. Like I said, something didn't go right with your original OS install.
[3:21] <ShapeShifter499> so I ended up with three correct installs and one not?
[3:21] <ShapeShifter499> hmm
[3:22] * ShapeShifter499 trys again
[3:22] * duckpuppy (~patrickai@h213.6.30.71.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[3:25] <GenteelBen> ShapeShifter499 +1
[3:25] <GenteelBen> You are now ShapeShifter500.
[3:26] <GenteelBen> It's like when Charmander was stuck on Charmander for so long.
[3:27] <ShapeShifter499> GenteelBen: over flow error
[3:27] * ShapeShifter499 is now known as missinNo
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[3:30] * missinNo corrupts all of GenteelBen Pi installs
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[4:09] * missinNo is now known as ShapeShifter499
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[4:40] <I_Died_Once> the new pi 3 b plus board.... is there a way to run Jessie on it, or does it HAVE to be Stretch?
[4:42] * fredp (~fredp@unaffiliated/fredp) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:44] <HrdwrBoB> why
[4:44] <I_Died_Once> existing projects
[4:45] <HrdwrBoB> tbh I'm not sure
[4:45] <HrdwrBoB> but I'd be getting one and testing
[4:45] <I_Died_Once> i have some images i use for the rpi 3 model b that i would like to use on the new board, the b plus
[4:45] <I_Died_Once> but they do not appear to want to work
[4:46] <HrdwrBoB> ah
[4:46] <I_Died_Once> even after dist-upgrade and everything
[4:46] <HrdwrBoB> that seems like it SHOULD work
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[5:33] * Mutsumi (~Mutsumi@unaffiliated/mutsumi) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[5:35] * Osirus126 (~quassel@24-138-154-156.eastlink.ca) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[5:46] * comptroller (~comptroll@47-213-222-253.paolcmtc01.res.dyn.suddenlink.net) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[5:49] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:49] * comptroller (~comptroll@47-213-222-253.paolcmtc01.res.dyn.suddenlink.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:53] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[6:01] * caoliver (~caoliver@174-084-160-128.dhcp.chtrptr.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[6:04] * ozlo (~ozlo@69.73.86.222) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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[6:18] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[6:23] * Ivoah (uid49352@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-samcugerrfnilorc) has joined #raspberrypi
[6:23] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[6:25] * maldata (~alarm@gateway/tor-sasl/maldata) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[6:43] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[7:32] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[9:45] <Taxicletter> Hello!
[9:46] <Taxicletter> I have a problem, and I hope to find some tips...
[9:46] <Taxicletter> I have a Rpi3 with Raspbian Stretch, but from the Google Voice HAT AIY image
[9:46] <Taxicletter> I use the speaker as my soundsource, which worked perfect.
[9:47] <Taxicletter> But suddenly, the volume slider in the taskbar and on Audacious, don't work anymore.
[9:47] <Taxicletter> the soundscr and soundconf files are correct
[9:48] <Taxicletter> I DO install and remove a lot of stuff, but I don't think I messed with something sound-related...
[9:48] <Taxicletter> What could I try to fix this?
[9:48] * dansan (~daniel@2600:1700:be30:d00::40) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
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[10:21] <EdwardIII> hey, how come in raspian pi can use sudo passwordless? i looked inside sudoers and don't see any clues
[10:22] * Tfid (~Tfid@unaffiliated/tfid) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[10:23] <gordonDrogon> EdwardIII, have a look in /etc/sudoers.d/
[10:23] <zleap> hi gordonDrogon
[10:23] <gordonDrogon> morning zleap
[10:23] <zleap> how are things going
[10:23] * Warmy (~Warmy@s13490149139.blix.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:24] <gordonDrogon> going well today. bread all done, but I have some catering for tomorrow & friday, but I'll start the perp for that later today.
[10:24] * quarterback (~quarterba@unaffiliated/quarterback) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:25] * codestorm (~codestorm@2605:e000:9196:e300:b0c7:5298:3889:2a49) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:25] <quarterback> Is there a way I can start snmpd at boot time in raspbian? It seems like it doesn't start unless I type sudo service snmpd start after bootup.
[10:26] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:27] <quarterback> I tried creating a .sh file for that with the lines
[10:27] <quarterback> #!/bin/sh
[10:27] <quarterback> , sudo service snmpd start and had made chmod +x on it. Still it wont run unless i execute sudo service snmpd start after booting up.
[10:28] * Tfid (~Tfid@unaffiliated/tfid) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:28] * dreamon_ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:28] <quarterback> Something weird is happening with file permissions or accesses
[10:30] * codestorm (~codestorm@2605:e000:9196:e300:b0c7:5298:3889:2a49) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[10:30] * s8548a (~s8548a@unaffiliated/s8548a) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:34] <BurtyB> quarterback, running "sudo systemctl enable snmpd" should make it auto start on boot
[10:35] <quarterback> BurtyB, oh, I'll try that, thanks.
[10:37] <quarterback> BurtyB, Still, the same problem
[10:38] <quarterback> I had put the above script in /etc/init.d/ directory
[10:38] * s8548a (~s8548a@unaffiliated/s8548a) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:39] <quarterback> Only this line is starting snmpd -
[10:39] <quarterback> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo service snmpd start
[10:40] <BurtyB> quarterback, strange as it works for me on raspbian
[10:40] <quarterback> BurtyB, I believe snmpd is broken on my pi. It had some issues with pci which was missing during a status check command.
[10:40] <shauno> same. perhaps after a fresh boot, when it should have been started but hasn't, try "service snmpd status" to see if it's logged a reason why it failed?
[10:41] * v01d1 (~v01d1@5-12-20-170.residential.rdsnet.ro) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1)
[10:41] <shauno> it complains about pci being missing here too (the pi doesn't have pci ..) but still starts
[10:42] * CyberManifest (~CyberMani@r74-192-54-3.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[10:44] <quarterback> Please see error messages for 'service snmpd status' at boot - https://dpaste.de/upqL
[10:45] * moshisushi (~holodisc@58-251-47-212.rev.cloud.scaleway.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:49] * defsdoor (~andy@cpc120600-sutt6-2-0-cust232.19-1.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:49] <BurtyB> quarterback, the error 'endpoint "udp:19...' is prob the problem - trying to talk to something that hasn't started or something maybe?
[10:50] <quarterback> I had configured udp port to be 161 in snmpd.conf file
[10:51] * m0j0dj0dj0 (~punk3r@unaffiliated/m0j0dj0dj0) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:54] <BurtyB> looks like it's trying to do something with a port starting with 19 from the log tho
[10:57] * shantorn (~shantorn@184-100-130-159.ptld.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[10:59] * Haxxa (~Harrison@180-150-30-18.NBN.mel.aussiebb.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[11:01] <quarterback> BurtyB, I fixed that line, I had commented out the line which contained agentAddress udp:192.168.1.2:161,udp6:[::1]:161
[11:01] <quarterback> and enabled the line
[11:01] <quarterback> agentAddress udp:161
[11:01] <quarterback> in snmpd.conf. That worked.
[11:02] * immibis (~chatzilla@222-155-160-32-fibre.bb.spark.co.nz) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[11:05] <quarterback> BurtyB, snmpd now starts at bootup.Thanks.
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[11:43] <katnip> http://www.zdnet.com/article/raspberry-pi-with-a-side-of-ai-these-powerful-new-boards-come-with-npus/
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[11:46] <Taxicletter> Hi,
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[11:56] <EdwardIII> gordonDrogon: ah it's right there, as the includedir line in /etc/sudoers is commented out i didn't think to look
[11:57] <shiftplusone> What a terrible and misleading zdnet article title
[11:58] <EdwardIII> so i've setup raspbian, it's installed openssh-server just fine which is good, but i can't seem to access the machine outside of my network? my network admin says he's added a dmz from a dedicated ip to this device. worked fine when i used ubuntu
[11:58] <EdwardIII> is there something specific in the raspbian networking default config that might cause this? i did set a static ip in /etc/dhcpcd.conf
[11:58] <quarterback> You have to setup a dmz host on the rpi, port foward an external port to any port on your rpi.
[11:59] <quarterback> configure this in your router.
[11:59] * JasonCL (~JasonCL@cpe-174-109-154-111.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:00] <EdwardIII> that's already done
[12:00] <EdwardIII> well, the second bit is
[12:00] <EdwardIII> it was all working fine when i had ubuntu on the pi, now i've swapped it for rasbian it's not responding to any external network requests
[12:00] * codestorm (~codestorm@2605:e000:9196:e300:b0c7:5298:3889:2a49) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[12:01] <EdwardIII> how do i setup the dmz host on the rpi? couldn't see anything from googling stuff like 'can't access rasbian outside of network'
[12:01] <quarterback> You have to configure a ip addres in the router which would be the ip addres of your rpi to which all data on a particular port from the external world on your router would forward to.
[12:01] * ConkyAxis (~ConkyAxis@cpc82865-enfi22-2-0-cust482.20-2.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Quit: ConkyAxis)
[12:01] <EdwardIII> that's all done - it worked fine when i had this setup with ubuntu
[12:02] <EdwardIII> so i know the network config external to the pi is all ok
[12:02] <quarterback> You have something like this: Forward all data on port 5900 on your router which has a ip addres such as 123.110.102.194 to an internal IP address in your lan such as 192.168.1.2 which would also be the ip address of your rpi.
[12:02] <EdwardIII> when i was using ubuntu i added an alias ip address as eth0:0 so it used dhcp for everything else but just had an additional ip address that wouldn't change (the one the external router mapped to)
[12:03] <EdwardIII> quarterback: yeah that's all done - it worked ok
[12:03] * Snircle (~textual@2600:8801:c404:7900:70d7:fbef:71c5:df63) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:03] <EdwardIII> my problems only occured since switching to rasbian
[12:03] <quarterback> You must select a port on the router from which all data would come to a ip addres in the lan which is the ip address of your rpi.
[12:04] <EdwardIII> yeah that's all done and i tested it - it was working
[12:04] <EdwardIII> so i know the networking config of the router is good
[12:04] <quarterback> Then try to manually assign Ip address to your raspbian machine in the router using a dhcp client table.
[12:05] <quarterback> detect its macaddres or something else and assign a fixed lan ip address such as 192.168.1.2
[12:05] <quarterback> The newer routers have this feature. I have a cisco e3200 which allows me to do the same.
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[12:08] <EdwardIII> think i've found the problem, it looks like if you assign one value in dhcp config you have to assign them all
[12:08] <EdwardIII> unlike doing an adapter alias
[12:08] <EdwardIII> so the routing table on the pi was messed up
[12:10] <quarterback> Its not necessary to assign all ip addresses in the dhcp client table. Just assign one for your rpi which would most likely work.
[12:10] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[12:11] <quarterback> But beware that enabling a dmz host would make your machine vulnerable from ddos attacks
[12:12] <EdwardIII> i don't actually have access to the routing equipment
[12:12] <EdwardIII> so changes there are kind of a pain - makes more sense for me to assign a static address to the pi
[12:12] <quarterback> You would need access to the router to make those changes.
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[12:31] <pwillard> Is your rpi a router? re: how do i setup the dmz host on the rpi?
[12:31] <davr0s> got my first on-bike footage from a rpi cam .. despite the mess of tape it works
[12:32] * Oksana (~Wikiwide@Maemo/community/ex-council/Wikiwide) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[12:32] <pwillard> Duct Tape FTW
[12:32] <davr0s> what makes it worse is my pi 0 camera connector tab snapped off, which means i have to tape in a specific way to hold the camera in , lol
[12:32] <davr0s> the whole setup has that extra layer of flakiness
[12:33] <davr0s> thats why i'm so surprised to actually get back and have some footage
[12:33] <pwillard> That makes you normal, not special lol.
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[12:33] <davr0s> now i've seen it work , i can consider scratching the itch of getting a few of these for stereo footage etc
[12:33] * djk (~Thunderbi@pool-96-242-161-125.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:34] <EdwardIII> pwillard: no - my rpi is the dmz target, that was a response to this comment as i was a bit confused: it sounded like setup needed to be done on the rpi and on the router rather than just the router: < quarterback> You have to setup a dmz host on the rpi, port foward an external port to any port on your rpi
[12:34] <EdwardIII> to be clear this is all setup and working now
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[12:34] <pwillard> Ah... ok.
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[12:35] <quarterback> Well, you need't do anything on the rpi, let the router assign a static lan IP addres to the rpi. Seems like you got it right.
[12:35] * raynold (uid201163@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-spkrtwnnmwnlmkex) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[12:35] <davr0s> i need a better way of starting /stopping than SSHing in before i leave the flat aswell , lol
[12:35] <pwillard> Yeah, I usually just goto my DHCP server, run IFCONFIG on my rpi and snag the mac address and tell DHCP that this MAC has reserved address <whatever>
[12:35] <quarterback> if you have a firewall like iptables running, you'd have to configure it to allow traffic on a port from the router.
[12:36] <quarterback> Just check sudo iptables -L . If you have everything setup as accept ALL, then there is nothing to be done the rpi for the firewall part.
[12:36] <pwillard> https://i.pinimg.com/564x/3c/f6/ab/3cf6ab1d646baaa09e3b629cdf8cf591.jpg
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[12:39] <EdwardIII> pwillard: in ubuntu i can just dump an alias into /etc/network/interfaces.d/ for eth0:0 and it seems to work pretty beautifully
[12:39] * EdwardIII shrugs
[12:39] <EdwardIII> it's ok, our network admin isn't likely to change the gateway ip address any time soon
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[12:52] <quarterback> Seems like you would have to ask your netadmin to configure dmz. If its your home router, you can do it yourself.
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[12:53] <michaelis> Hi. I'm helping a friend with auto mounting a hdd but when lshw it seems that all storage devices are connect via usb. Which ones are part of the inital setup?
[12:53] <michaelis> It's a external hdd, of course.
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[13:00] <pwillard> Just about everything on the PI is connected to USB...
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[13:22] <my123> https://fccid.io/2ABCB-RPI3BP/Letter/Confidentiality-Letter-3777899
[13:22] <my123> interesting that "SW Security Information" is not published
[13:25] <Draylor> meh, FCC filings will contain details from suppliers that arent intended to be public, they'll be required to send that letter. as dull as it gets
[13:26] <my123> Draylor, yeah, SW sec info not being pushed is odd tho
[13:26] <my123> except if it's about the WiFi/BT stack firmware
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[13:31] <shiftplusone> odd in what way? In the "omg backdoorz" way or in the obvious "They don't want to get sued by mpegla" way?
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[13:34] <my123> shiftplusone, I think that it'd have something like the signature checks info for band compatibility and lockdown across regions (required for WiFi)
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[13:36] <my123> shiftplusone, isn't MPEG2 out of patent protection these days?
[13:37] <shiftplusone> Not worldwide and that wouldn't negate whatever contract is inplace.
[13:38] <my123> ok, enabling it is a single sed away anyway, not strong protection
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[13:39] <JimBuntu> The real point, is that the Rpi isn't meant to be an open-source hardware platform... and the foundation has seen what has happened to things like Arduino (knock-offs/etc eating into sales)... and what's happened to Adafruit in general... basically, "We do what's required to get permission, all the stuff is ours, if you want to complete then you will have to make the same mistakes we made"
[13:41] <my123> JimBuntu, even the Odroid using the BCM SoC didn't get a proper supply
[13:41] <JimBuntu> supply?
[13:41] <my123> JimBuntu, http://www.hardkernel.com/main/products/prdt_info.php?g_code=G140610189490
[13:41] <JimBuntu> Do you mean, they didn't get enough SoC's...? nvm, reading link
[13:41] <shiftplusone> A while back odroid released a board with the same soc without getting a license for the firmware or sourcing the chips from a legitimate channel
[13:42] <JimBuntu> Oh. Yeah, you can release whatever you want so long as it's released in certain numbers and you include the right labeling
[13:43] <my123> they were just expecting RPi firmware to be used
[13:43] <my123> "We have to stop Odroid-W project soon since Broadcom decided not to accept our order of the BCM2835 SoC anymore" was their statement
[13:43] <shiftplusone> given that they'd have to license that from Raspberry Pi and Broadcom, that would've never worked.
[13:44] * codestorm (~codestorm@2605:e000:9196:e300:5179:2db1:b812:c531) has joined #raspberrypi
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[13:45] <JimBuntu> Well... that statement they made, means they couldn't find another economical supplier. I only know as much as you quoted and my industry excperience
[13:45] <my123> * This software may only be used for the purposes of developing for,
[13:45] <my123> running or using a Raspberry Pi device.
[13:45] <my123> that clause is what ultimately killed them I'm afraid
[13:46] <JimBuntu> If they had a good business model, they could have approached Rpi foundation and requested permission... they may have... and been refused... I don't know the back-story
[13:47] * saptech (~saptech@unaffiliated/saptech) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[13:47] <JimBuntu> I figure they could pick back up and use a board/system they actually designed based on reference material, completely their own design... it's NOT easy to buy many SoC's in volume though as their are SO SO many competitors all fighting for the same stock... and these things don't age like fine wine
[13:48] <JimBuntu> s/their/there/
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[14:38] <ali1234> it's really quite impressive that they managed to make a SoC that has the hardware equivalent of microtransactions :)
[14:38] <kb9ylw> What's a microtransaction?
[14:39] <ali1234> i wonder how long it will be before someone makes a CPU where you not only have to pay to unlock features but have to keep doing it every 12 months
[14:39] <ali1234> a microtransaction is when you have to pay extra money to unlock some feature of a game
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[14:40] <ali1234> most people hate it but that 1% of people who use it are responsible for 90% of game companies revenue
[14:40] <ali1234> so it will not go away
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[14:43] <shiftplusone> that's quite an unfair characterization of the pi
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[14:43] <ali1234> i don't think it is unfair at all - it is exactly how the codec licensing works
[14:43] <Tenkawa> what did I miss?
[14:43] <ali1234> and who knows what other features are locked up behind the firmware paywall?
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[14:46] <Habbie> Tenkawa, it looks like a complaint about the codec licenses not being free with every pi
[14:47] <kb9ylw> Are the codecs from Broadcom?
[14:47] <Habbie> i bet
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[14:48] <kb9ylw> I suppose that's what we get for running a phone SoC.
[14:49] <gilesc> hmm... If I don't want to use the codecs then I wouldn't want to pay for them
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[14:49] <kb9ylw> gilesc: Sounds reasonable.
[14:49] <gilesc> hmm... if I want to use the codecs then they seem to be pretty cheap...
[14:49] <ali1234> i dont think it is particularly bad to have the choice
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[14:49] <ali1234> you would not guess that choice if you bought a phone for example
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[14:49] <ali1234> the phone manufacturer would make it for you
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[14:50] <ali1234> i am more of the opinion that codecs should not be allowed to be patented at all
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[14:51] <Twist> ali1234: IMB already does that with some of their power chips.
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[14:51] <Twist> IBM, rather
[14:51] <ali1234> Twist: really? which ones?
[14:51] <JohnGabrielUK> Are there any benefits in getting an £8 power supply off Amazon rather than a £3 one from eBay? Any risk of frying my Pi?
[14:51] <kb9ylw> JohnGabrielUK: Possibly. I tend to avoid eBay anyway.
[14:52] <JohnGabrielUK> How come?
[14:52] <Twist> ali1234: I'd have to research.. mainframes really aren't my thing. But we've had situations at work where the responsible teams paid to temporarily activate more cores for temporary load spikes.
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[14:52] <kb9ylw> Twist: IBM offer server features that can be turned on and off at different times based on a payment. They call it capacity on demand, I think.
[14:52] <shiftplusone> game companies do it to milk every last cent from people. Raspberry Pi did it to avoid bundling the license in a way that would require everybody to pay for it and to keep the price of the pi itself low. You don't even need the codecs nowadays, since CPU ones have comparable performance now.
[14:52] <ali1234> Twist: isn't that software licenses though? rather than the hardware
[14:52] <kb9ylw> Twist: That's not just a mainframe thing, it's on minicomputers, too.
[14:52] <kb9ylw> ali1234: No, it's hardware.
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[14:55] <Twist> ali1234: IF you want a wintel analogy, it's possible on some machines to disable CPU cores from BIOS
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[14:57] <Twist> You could imagine a situation where intel found it wasn't cost effective to produce dual and quadcore chips, so they start selling the same hexcore model with cores locked out via software.
[14:57] <ali1234> AMD has been doing that for years
[14:57] <Twist> Yeah. I remember some of that.
[14:58] <Twist> People getting 3 core chips with a 4th disabled.
[14:58] <ali1234> i have never heard of any system where you have to pay a recurring fee or the working cores stop working
[14:59] <Twist> ali1234: mainframes, midrange boxen, etc. You don't see 'em outside of finance and healthcare much anymore.
[15:00] <gilesc> Twist, I thought it was more about the manufacturing process, manufacture loads of chips more or less the same, say with x cores, during testing they find some are unstable with all cores enabled, so they disable some and change the operating frequency and decide what model the cpu will be
[15:00] <ali1234> gilesc: in AMD's case it was
[15:01] <ali1234> very few AMD chips could have the cores unlocked and still run reliably
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[15:01] * kb9ylw nods
[15:01] <kb9ylw> There's a difference between binning and Capacity-on-Demand.
[15:04] <Twist> https://www-01.ibm.com/software/passportadvantage/subcaplicensing.html
[15:04] <Twist> that might be it
[15:04] <kb9ylw> Perhaps that's their new name for it.
[15:05] <Twist> oh hey, they've got some 3B+ in stock at the local microcenter
[15:06] <kb9ylw> Twist: Adafruit have them too, I'm told.
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[15:07] <Twist> kb9ylw: I bought a 3B from microcenter back on 2018-03-10. I should still be in the return window.
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[15:08] <shiftplusone> No questions asked return policy?
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[15:08] <Twist> I've been waiting for them to get some in stock
[15:08] <Twist> Yeah, 30 days.
[15:08] <shiftplusone> ah
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[15:09] <Twist> I never even opened the box
[15:09] <mave_> meh, since release day i had troubles with the new pi 3b+. Seems that the memory is corrupt, returning it today.
[15:09] <mave_> does this happen a lot?
[15:10] <Twist> mave_: I've no 3B+ experience. Haven't seen it on other Pis.
[15:10] <Rickta59> power supply issues mave_ ?
[15:10] <Twist> mave_: What symptoms are you seeing?
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[15:10] <mave_> i thought of power issues, so i got myself a 3A adapter
[15:10] <chongtxtx> I've never had problems with my first gen pi 3
[15:10] <mave_> still experiencing kernel errors and freezes
[15:10] <mave_> and a memory test makes it freeze for sure
[15:11] <chongtxtx> heat issue?
[15:11] <mave_> 57 degrees celsius at the time of testing
[15:11] <chongtxtx> ehh not bad at all
[15:12] <mave_> ah well, it's hardware, it can be broken
[15:12] <chongtxtx> I have had symptoms like that on regular machines due to heat issues
[15:13] <gilesc> my pi3b+ kind of misbehaved for a while, left it plugged in more or less idle overnight, and it seemed to settle down
[15:13] <michaelis> Hi. I managed to corrupt fstab. I added som entries at the end and after that raspbian wont boot. How do I get into the pi now?
[15:14] <gilesc> michaelis, on a linux system you can mount your sd card and correct fstab I imagine, at least, that's how I would do it
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[15:16] <r3> aye, mounting the sd card in an existing linux system is going to be the easiest way
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[15:17] <r3> not sure if there exists a "boot disk" for Raspbian, like - for instance - in other distributions there is a "bootable CD" that can help you get back into a hung system. Don't think you can boot from the USB, so that solution has numerous problems...
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[15:19] <gilesc> think pi3 can usb boot, can network (PXE) boot too, but buggy in pi3, pi3b+ supposed to have ironed out the bugs
[15:20] <r3> gilesc, I will have to read up on that - I still think putting the sd card in another system is the 2 minute fix here ;)
[15:20] <gilesc> r3, yes, by far the easiest option
[15:21] <kb9ylw> brb, coffee++
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[16:11] <michaelis> gilesc, r3 Thank you for your help. It's not my pi so I don't have control over it. I just messed up the fstab. ;) The owner has some way of recovering it but it seems troublesome to do this every time.
[16:12] <Bitweasil> So don't mess up the fstab. :p
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[16:13] <gilesc> michaelis, fstab is one of those things you want to be very sure of before proceeding with a reboot.
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[16:14] <michaelis> But if I'm not 1005 sure I have to try it out. I guess there's no trail and error with fstab? And I also thought that as long as I have working drive to boot into the rest of the error would just show up in the logs.
[16:15] <michaelis> 100%
[16:15] <michaelis> trial
[16:15] <Bitweasil> So try the mount command before you reboot.
[16:15] <Bitweasil> sudo mount /path/to/something/in/fstab should work.
[16:15] <Bitweasil> But, no, it's not particularly forgiving.
[16:15] <Bitweasil> It's also not particularly complicated.
[16:15] <michaelis> Bitweasil, But if I have some different flags I want to try out? Is it all with the mount command?
[16:15] <Bitweasil> Get the device path, the mount path, and the filesystem path correct, with the defaults 0 0 suffix...
[16:15] <Bitweasil> Yeah.
[16:16] <Bitweasil> Shit. Mount that stuff manually.
[16:16] <Bitweasil> mount /dev/sdb1 /mnt/foobar -ocompress,noatime,blahblahblah
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[16:16] <michaelis> I was trying to mount three external drives with their UUID. One had only a PARTUUID
[16:16] <Bitweasil> Don't commit to fstab until you know what you want.
[16:16] <michaelis> .
[16:16] <Bitweasil> What's wrong with the normal automount that dumps them in /media/pi/... ?
[16:18] <michaelis> Bitweasil, That's a good question. My friend said he had to mount them manually and I didn't think more of that.
[16:18] <ericus> Why is it that some distros doesn't work with the latest RPI?
[16:19] <Bitweasil> With the 3B+? Probably because they don't have the firmware or kernel modules needed for it. No actual idea how much has changed, but the firmware is certainly going to be different.
[16:19] <ericus> Yes, the 3B+
[16:19] <ericus> Is it a different CPU arch?
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[16:20] <lopta> ericus: I don't think so.
[16:21] <ericus> then what is it?
[16:21] <Bitweasil> I know the firmware is different, the ethernet controller is presumably different, and it may require some different kernel modules.
[16:21] <lopta> ericus: Hang on, I'll look it up
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[16:21] <Bitweasil> But i don't have one to mess with.
[16:22] <ericus> https://www.board-db.org/compare/251,103/
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[16:27] <ericus> from what I can tell it's the CPU, wifi and BT that changed
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[16:27] <lopta> Looks like 2B (as of v1.2) 3B and 3B+ all run a BCM2837 SoC
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[16:28] <ericus> thats the reason why I guess
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[16:29] <shauno> power management hardware has changed too. haven't heard much feedback on what that actually means for us though
[16:29] <lopta> ARMv8 but Linux (and probably other operating systems) run it as ARMv7 because of blobs or something.
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[16:30] <lopta> ng
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[17:12] <my123> lopta, ARMv8 Linux works fine on the Pi3
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[17:22] <lopta> my123: That's good to know. I don't run Linux so my information was out of date, apparently.
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[17:34] <my123> lopta, which OS do you use?
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[17:34] <lopta> my123: NetBSD/evbarm
[17:35] <lopta> my123: My work desktop is a 1B
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[17:36] <lopta> my123: I've just plugged a hard disk in because I was running out of swap when I tried to build Firefox.
[17:37] <my123> ok, nice
[17:37] <lopta> That has freed up some space on my SDHC card, too.
[17:37] <lopta> I should probably be doing this on my 2B
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[17:39] <my123> cross-compiling might be better
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[17:41] <leftyfb> lopta: Out of curiosity, why do you use *BSD for your OS's on pi's as opposed to linux distro's on x86 devices for getting any work done?
[17:42] <lopta> leftyfb: Linus is on my list of things to learn but I don't have time right now for that.
[17:42] <lopta> ...so I use what I know.
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[17:42] <lopta> Linux*
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[18:06] <purplex88> how to do i get started with raspberrypi?
[18:06] <purplex88> i'm told to do download noobs
[18:07] <Bitweasil> That's an easy way, yes.
[18:07] <Bitweasil> Blow the installer onto a MicroSD card, boot the Pi, follow the prompts.
[18:07] <leftyfb> purplex88: honestly, I would just image raspbian onto the sd card. It's less steps and makes for a cleaner SD card
[18:07] <methuzla> ^that
[18:07] <lopta> purplex88: Which Pi do you have, out of interest?
[18:08] <karvas> Hello! Noob question: I have a button on a device I like to automate using a raspberry pi zero. It has two connectors, when I connect them with a wire - and close their circuit, the device understands this as "button is pressed". Can I connect (solder) them to two different GPIO-pins and then somehow tell my pi to close the circuit between those two pins - say each 5min?
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[18:08] <leftyfb> purplex88: https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/installation/installing-images/README.md
[18:08] <purplex88> why is noobs earier option?
[18:08] * Vonter (~Vonter@106.51.105.1) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[18:08] <purplex88> easier*
[18:08] <methuzla> purplex88, in general, you need to install an OS on to an SD card to be able to boot, but there are several options on the OS
[18:09] <purplex88> i can install an OS in general
[18:09] * IT_Sean is now known as IT_AFK
[18:09] <purplex88> because i installed windows os many times!
[18:10] <karvas> to clarify: the button on my device has two connectors A and B, if I hold a wire so that A is connected to B (closed current) the device starts (exactly the same as when I push the button by hand).
[18:10] <leftyfb> purplex88: I would really just download raspbian and follow the instructions in the link I sent you. That is the easiest way to get started with Raspberry Pi
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[18:10] <methuzla> purplex88, read that link leftyfb sent. you ok with doing whats there? if so, just download raspbian.
[18:10] <purplex88> but why they are saying "noobs" is easiest?
[18:11] <methuzla> one person's "easy" is another person's "why?"
[18:11] <leftyfb> ^
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[18:12] <purplex88> ok i'll skip noobs
[18:12] <purplex88> it will make me a noob :p
[18:12] <purplex88> downloading raspbian .. and it will take about 20 minutes to download
[18:13] <methuzla> before etcher, the process for burning an OS image to the SD card was different for mac/windows/linux
[18:13] <methuzla> noobs was an attempt to make it the same, and "easy"
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[18:14] <purplex88> easy means it doesn't require using etcher?
[18:14] <methuzla> but now, with etcher, it's not difficult at all, and it's more obvious what you are doing
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[18:17] <karvas> maybe it's more clear if I put it like this: Can I use two different GPIO pins on my pi to make a bypass between them? And switching this bypass on and off programmatically?
[18:17] <waveform> purplex88, correct: noobs only requires the ability to unzip files onto a FAT partition (which any OS can do out of the box); the raspbian image requires the ability to write a disk image to the disk itself (not the file-system on the disk). Until etcher came along, this required different (and sometimes rather newbie-unfriendly) instructions
[18:17] <lopta> brb
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[18:18] <leftyfb> noobs would boot into a menu that let you pick an OS which would then download the OS and install it onto the SD card, still keeping noobs on the card along with it
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[18:19] <purplex88> ok makes sense
[18:19] <purplex88> just installation is easy
[18:19] <leftyfb> so now you're downloading and unpacking twice, copying and not utilizing the entire SD card
[18:19] <leftyfb> it's easier to just download the image you want and image the card using etcher
[18:19] <leftyfb> boots right onto the OS
[18:20] <purplex88> luckily i got hdmi cable
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[18:20] <methuzla> karvas, you should probably use a relay of some sort. you don't know what's actually been sent through the connection between A and B on your device.
[18:20] * timofonic (~timofonic@unaffiliated/timofonic) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[18:20] <GenteelBen> What are people doing with their shiny new Pi 3B+ boards?
[18:20] <teclo-> good question
[18:20] <waveform> frankly, I wouldn't be concerned with not utilizing the entire SD card - NOOBS really is tiny as a percentage of the SD card, but if you're happy writing disk images (and etcher does make that trivial) raspbian is indeed as simple
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[18:22] <teclo-> ah, reminds me, I was wondering something... I got a RPi 1, 2+ and 3, and I was reading some mail I got from the Pi Hut, and it said something like "Gigabit Ethernet on USB"... then 10/100 Ethernet on the RJ45 port....
[18:22] <leftyfb> GenteelBen: To start I think it's going to be he prototype for a duckietown robot. Then I'll use it and 3 more to replace the 3b's in my pi server rack
[18:22] <karvas> methuzla: even if it is just a very simple button?
[18:22] <teclo-> so how do I "use" Gigabit Ethernet in that case ?
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[18:23] <leftyfb> teclo-: part of that is wrong, but the ethernet port itself does support gigabit. But the usb 2.0 bus it's connected to only supports 1/3 of gigabit speeds
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[18:23] <methuzla> karvas, yes. unless you know more about what's happening electrically between A and B.
[18:23] <leftyfb> teclo-: you'll get similar speeds if you plug a gigabit -> usb adapter into usb
[18:24] <karvas> methuzla: it looks a little bit like this thingy: https://www.tinkery.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/simplepush.jpg
[18:24] <karvas> methuzla: ok, thank you
[18:25] <teclo-> leftyfb: ah so I just need a USB-Gigabit adapter... ? They selle that at Pi Hut I guess ?
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[18:26] <leftyfb> teclo-: if you have the new pi3b+ then you don't need the adapter
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[18:26] <methuzla> karvas, that's the button. but what's happening on the device you want to control?
[18:26] <teclo-> leftyfb: ah... but how do I get Gigabit Ethernet on the Pi3b ?
[18:27] <purplex88> download is 53% done now.. be back
[18:27] <leftyfb> teclo-: you will not get 1000Mb/s on a pi3b+. But you can get 300Mb/s by plugging in an ethernet cord that's plugged into a gigabit switch
[18:27] <teclo-> leftyfb: ah ok
[18:28] * h4ndy is now known as H4ndy
[18:28] <karvas> methuzla: could I somehow test whats happening? maybe by measureing while pressing the button? The raspberry pi should only "simulate" the button - it should do whatever the button does.
[18:29] <karvas> methuzla: for me it seems as the button is just connecting A and B (bypassing) when I press the button
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[18:29] <methuzla> karvas, you could multimeter it, but you'd still be mostly guessing.
[18:30] <GenteelBen> teclo-: you can't.
[18:31] <methuzla> karvas, yes, the button is simply closing the connection between A and B. and you're doing the same thing with a wire.
[18:31] <GenteelBen> teclo-: Ethernet on the RPi runs through the USB bus for some bizarre reason. So you're limited to 300Mb/s on the 3B+.
[18:31] <GenteelBen> So 24MB/s
[18:31] <GenteelBen> Which is actually worse than USB 2.0...
[18:31] <GenteelBen> roflcopter.gif
[18:32] <GenteelBen> USB 2.0 gives you a real-world throughput of ~35MB/s.
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[18:32] <methuzla> karvas, but there are all kinds of ways of incorporating such a button, and you don't know what's actually going on. that button (and your wire) can handle more than a pi gpio can.
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[18:32] <GenteelBen> So the solution is to build a cluster of RPis so you can have 300000Mbit/s SuperEthernet.
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[18:34] <karvas> methuzla: yes exactly, i can also simulate a "button pressed"-event by attaching a wire for a second (thats what I tested so far) - I was hoping that there was a easy solution with the pi
[18:35] <H4ndy> GenteelBen: The "bizzare reason" is that the VideoCore IV only has a single USB 2.0 interface for external devices beside the two SDIO ports which are used for the SD card and Wifi chio
[18:36] <karvas> methuzla: thank you very much for clarifing - maybe I need to attach a switch that can be controlled more easily (i also have a arduino uno and a small circuit board that I could use)
[18:36] <GenteelBen> H4ndy so why isn't there an RPi based on an A53 core complex??????????
[18:37] <shbrngdo> mostly for ali1234 - GPU calculation errors - https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/03/21/nvidia_titan_v_reproducibility/
[18:37] <GenteelBen> A73*
[18:37] <H4ndy> Because the goal of the RPi foundation was to have a system that is as open as possible, and the broadcom SoC they are using is the only one where they got the full GPU specifications
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[18:37] <GenteelBen> The Broadcom chip in the 3+ is A53.
[18:37] <H4ndy> yes, but the ARM cores are behind the VideoCore
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[18:37] <GenteelBen> H4ndy, there should be an RPi Pro for people who want better performance and support for modern codecs etc.
[18:38] * davr0s (~textual@host86-157-66-67.range86-157.btcentralplus.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:38] <H4ndy> they are just attached to it, the VideoCore is the actual chip that does all the booting
[18:38] * rikai (~rikai@unaffiliated/rikai) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[18:38] <H4ndy> and the videocore is also the chip that has all the limits which they now reached with the 3+
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[18:38] <H4ndy> So they "announced" a Rpi4 for around 2019 which will use a new SoC
[18:38] * GenteelBen waits
[18:38] <H4ndy> but they did not tell yet which they use (probably still in negotiations)
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[18:39] <H4ndy> If you just want throughput, buy some of those plenty Allwinner or Rockchip based boards and be happy
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[18:41] <shbrngdo> *ahem* a Raspberry Pi is a low-power CPU $35 experimenter 'system on chip' board with only 1G RAM. but it has IO pins and reasonable performance. Why try and use it for what a mega-server should be used for?
[18:45] <Bitweasil> GenteelBen: if you want better performance and modern codecs, may I suggest a small form factor x86 board?
[18:45] <shbrngdo> ^^^
[18:46] <Bitweasil> You can whip a Pi3 into a tolerable desktop if you get away from the SD card interface and do some tweaking (the Raspbian stock settings are... fucking bizarre), but it's not a powerful system, and never will be.
[18:46] <Bitweasil> The USB bus interface to the world is a major limit, especially with only 2.4GHz wireless. The 3B+ opens up a few more options (you can do some decent 5GHz transfers in parallel with the USB interface), but it's simply not a high throughput system.
[18:46] <Bitweasil> "Raspberry Pi Clusters" are an interesting learning toy, if your goal is to learn about clustering.
[18:46] <Bitweasil> But they're not useful in any real sense of the word.
[18:47] <Bitweasil> A sub-$100 useful desktop is certainly a thing of use, but it's not comparable to even a quite old x86 desktop and it never will be.
[18:47] <Bitweasil> Since it simply doesn't have the IO throughput to keep up.
[18:47] <Bitweasil> (and as SGI demonstrated many, many years ago, IO throughput solves many problems)
[18:50] <karvas> methuzla: maybe one last question: do you think my pi or the device can get damaged when I try to connect them with gpio? I would like to experiment and see if it works out of the box - I know it is not likely
[18:51] <Bitweasil> Don't exceed the GPIO voltage limit on the Pi and you're probably fine.
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[18:52] <shbrngdo> also total output current - I think it's 20ma per GPIO pin but there's also a limit per group and overall [as I recall]
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[18:53] <karvas> ok thank you
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[18:55] <mlelstv> even an RPI1 blows away a high-end workstation from 1990.
[18:55] <mlelstv> performance is relative :)
[18:55] <davr0s> r.e. rpi-as-action camera. i realise now that without any buttons/indicators, i could just make it boot up and start recording .. and just unplug/plug to reset;
[18:55] <methuzla> karvas, yes, you could damage the pi, or the device, or both
[18:56] <davr0s> where would i stuff a startup command such that i can still login normally etc
[18:56] <davr0s> ssh into it
[18:56] <shbrngdo> davr0s - it's bad to power off a pi by unplugging the power - the SD card could become corrupted
[18:56] * Win7ine (~Win7ine@195.171.165.58) Quit ()
[18:56] <shbrngdo> you need to properly shut down the OS first, THEN power down
[18:56] <davr0s> shbrngdo damn you're ruining my plans
[18:56] <shbrngdo> yeah, I'm the poop in your party
[18:57] <davr0s> ok so having it recording .. 'writing to the SD'... then powering off.. would be bad
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[18:57] <methuzla> davr0s, rc.local is the old school way. systemd is the new school way. there's also a way to do it with cron (@boot or something?)
[18:57] <shbrngdo> unless you shut down the OS correctly. you could have a button for that, light up an LED
[18:57] <shbrngdo> an "ok to power off" LED. Take a look at how boards like ATX Raspi handle poweroff as an idea
[18:57] <my123> http://webosose.org/
[18:58] <davr0s> it sounds like a full power up/power down cycle is needed, hence a 'power switch'
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[18:58] <shbrngdo> right, similar to the power button on a PC. press to turn on or off. There are boards available (like ATX Raspi) that make it relatively easy to implement. I only know the name of the one, though...
[18:58] <davr0s> actually i can avoid powering it down
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[19:00] <purplex88> alright.. I flashed raspbian OS to card using etcher
[19:00] <purplex88> and now?
[19:00] <davr0s> i hope i could split the cost of this additional part over 2 or more because what i'm really after is a stereo (or better) camera
[19:00] <shbrngdo> purplex88 - try booting up with monitor/keyboard attached, I'd guess
[19:00] <H4ndy> Did someone already try the new webOS?
[19:00] <davr0s> i suppose i could make one integrated box that powers them all up/down
[19:01] <davr0s> anyway a 'power up automatic job' and SHHing into it to grab footage would be workable for me
[19:01] <davr0s> SSH^
[19:02] <davr0s> its just the business of faffing around with SSH before i go for a bike-ride that is a huge distraction hehe
[19:02] <shbrngdo> script it
[19:03] <purplex88> i have got an spare monitor and hdmi
[19:03] <shbrngdo> purplex88 - that should do ya. you'll need a USB keyboard/mouse combo too
[19:03] <davr0s> yeah my 'lazy solution' is just make it start recording on bootup. i can simply plug it in to start. actually grabbing the footage later - that can be done at home. and i guess I can automate the process of copying the footage when it's back at base
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[19:04] <shbrngdo> I think you should add some LEDs and a button or two, and a monitoring script that enables/disables recording and indicates the state on an LED
[19:04] <shbrngdo> red light on means recording, red light off means NOT recording. like that.
[19:05] <davr0s> i guess a box of LEDs and switches and other electronic stuff would be great to have around.
[19:05] <davr0s> regarding the whole pi hobby
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[19:05] <shbrngdo> check adafruit - they have bags of stuff like that. I bought a bag of pushbutton switches from them, and bags of LEDs. you'll need resistors on the LEDs though, 200-300 ohms should be fine.
[19:05] <davr0s> another alternative is smartphone app control
[19:06] <davr0s> it could broadcast it's status over adhoc wifi/bluetooth?
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[19:06] <shbrngdo> sure, if you wanna write the smartphone application. But I think a web server link would be easiest to remotely start/top it [using a web server running on the RPi]
[19:07] <davr0s> web-page interface equally visible on a smartphone, i guess.
[19:07] <shbrngdo> display a web page with a big fat button in it and a color graphic indicating "recording" or "not recording" maybe.
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[19:08] <shbrngdo> you could write a trivial application for android that has only a few lines in it that opens up that web page as "an application" and you can't even tell the difference [I did that a while back]
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[19:08] <davr0s> what would also be really cool is seeing the camera preview on the phone, especially for multiple pis (the idea is a multi-camera setup), but I haven't yet managed to get that working (i've seen vlc guideance)
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[19:09] <shbrngdo> all you need is a single frame and then display it embedded in a web page. I've actually done what you said, before. It was for a piece of medical equipment [eye test machine]
[19:09] <shbrngdo> the web page had an image of what the eye-test camera saw
[19:09] <shbrngdo> the display was on an Android slab
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[19:10] <davr0s> a still would be better than nothing
[19:10] <shbrngdo> if you repeat 'stills' you can get slow motion video. 10 fames per second is pretty good, actually
[19:10] <shbrngdo> do a rapid refresh on an iframe, for example, and it'll look like video
[19:10] <davr0s> yeah that'd be enough for just verifying they're pointing the right way etc
[19:11] <shbrngdo> you got it. and it could be scaled to 300x200 or something
[19:11] <davr0s> indeed for a multi-camera setup, they'd be scaled so you could see all of them
[19:11] <shbrngdo> the tools to do this (mostly) exist already. 'imagemagick' will scale jpeg files.
[19:12] <davr0s> yeah i was pretty certain that this would hardly be unique
[19:12] <shbrngdo> if you want to snap a single frame you *might* be able to use something like mencoder
[19:12] <davr0s> i half expected there's a complete solution on github already.
[19:12] <davr0s> and if not i could just pull some peices together and throw it on github
[19:12] <shbrngdo> you could chunk one together using bash scripts and existing tools, probably
[19:13] <davr0s> ok
[19:13] <shbrngdo> oh and a web server running PHP or similar, as a front-end
[19:14] <shbrngdo> in my case i wrote a mini-web server in C, which communicated (by serial) to an Arduino that controlled things. The serial comms more or less required the custom C program
[19:14] <purplex88> i got a usb mouse but no keyboard yet
[19:14] <shbrngdo> purplex88 - you'll have to type in a password (probably user 'pi' password 'pi' on initial boot)
[19:14] <davr0s> i've seen those emebedable c web servers, can't quite reember the name
[19:14] <shbrngdo> I just pulled it out of my ass
[19:15] <shbrngdo> write from scratch
[19:15] <purplex88> i can't type password with mouse?
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[19:15] <shbrngdo> if I spent the hours online searching for someone else's "solution", I'll be eternally frustrated with its syntax/limitations/etc. and could have written my own in the same amount of time. that's how I see it.
[19:16] <methuzla> davr0s, the whole thing could be done in python, pi camera control, image manip, web serving, etc.
[19:16] <davr0s> there's a dividing line somewhere (reuse/rewrite)
[19:16] <shbrngdo> methuzla - python too, yeah.
[19:16] <davr0s> i imagine so, python might be saner than bash, on the other hand if its just a little bit going on bash might be ok
[19:16] <shbrngdo> I have a preference for the 'UNIX philosophy' - a collection of tools that do one thing, REALLY well. then you combine them with the shell
[19:17] <davr0s> i like the UNIX philosophy. it's a shame bash is so arcane
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[19:17] <shbrngdo> the downside of Python is the object-ness. it tends to create its own monster
[19:17] <davr0s> but it's there out of the box
[19:17] <gordonDrogon> shbrngdo, the suggested limit for Pi GPIO pins is 8mA per pin with an overall current budget of 150mA, however a single pin can sink/source many more ... more than enough to crowbar the 3.3v supply and cause a reboot.
[19:18] <purplex88> finally something on screen!
[19:18] <purplex88> hey it didn't ask me for password
[19:18] <shbrngdo> gordonDrogon - thanks. I was thinking single-pin limit of 20ma but I think that's the BCM CPU limit. 8ma is safer anyway
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[19:18] <davr0s> maybe if i get some motors and stuff i can use the pi to fulfill my dream of a Self Driving Bicycle!
[19:19] <shbrngdo> but yeah if you draw too much current you can cause power droopage in the 3.3v supply, enough to do a low volt reboot
[19:19] <shbrngdo> normally you fix this by putting capacitors into key places. the better alternative is to use MOSFETs to do the actual switching, with a separate power rail for the peripherals.
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[19:20] <shbrngdo> davr0s - self-driving bike - you'll need an IMU to keep it level
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[19:21] <shbrngdo> if you want to experiment you can get an IMU from sparkfun that's pretty good - 9 axis - something 9150 I think it is
[19:21] <davr0s> is this more capable than a regular 'accelerometer'
[19:21] <shbrngdo> MPU-9150 - that's the one
[19:22] <davr0s> i was joking about the self-driving bike , but lets see
[19:22] <shbrngdo> it has 3 axis accelerometer, gyro, and magnetometer (total 9 axes).
[19:22] <shbrngdo> the gyro is more sensitive to the kinds of things you need to control bike balance
[19:22] <purplex88> whats CEA and DMT resolution mode?
[19:23] <methuzla> hdmi config
[19:23] <davr0s> a truly self-driving bicycle would need the whole traffic AI. i think we'll need the Movidius vision unit for thta.
[19:23] <shbrngdo> just self-balancing would be fun in and of itself
[19:23] <davr0s> thats if that's even capable of it.. i think the self-driving car projects rely on more compute-power (nvidia boards)
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[19:24] <davr0s> shbrngdo yeah i can see just making a 'giant remote control bicycle' would be pretty funny
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[19:24] <shbrngdo> seeing as the nvidia boards have calculation errors, that could be a problem - https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/03/21/nvidia_titan_v_reproducibility/
[19:24] <davr0s> i mean a remote control bicycle or something that just goes around a carpark
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[19:24] <shbrngdo> why not make it a UNICYCLE and REALLY have fun!
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[19:25] <davr0s> i think AI is fuzzy really, it's the volume of calculations you neednot precision
[19:25] <davr0s> i suppose you could make a self-driving tricycle but that would be cheating.
[19:26] <davr0s> a self driving bicycle is goig to need a flip down leg to stop, hmm.
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[19:26] <shbrngdo> not if it has thrusters and flywheels, heh
[19:26] <caoliver> Track standing robot?
[19:27] <davr0s> hmm you have a point (trackstand)
[19:27] <caoliver> I knew my misspent youth would find some use.
[19:27] * caoliver was a roadie though.
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[19:30] <davr0s> so i have 2xpi2, 1xpizero-w, 2 cameras (adaptors). i have what i need for stereo
[19:31] <davr0s> i'm hovering on an itch to get yet another+2cameras to bring the camera count to 4
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[19:32] <davr0s> i've messed up a little by breaking the camera connector on the pi0, it needs a flaky tape solution to use the camera (it was ok today,but its like if you brush against it wrong it'll disconnect)
[19:33] <davr0s> i also have an itch to get the camera count up to 8, but in parallel there is a voice saying "just get a nicely packaged actioncam off the shelf."
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[19:34] <davr0s> there is something very cool about a complete computer that small
[19:37] <gordonDrogon> shbrngdo, you may see some old information online about pin current limiters - there aren't any, however there are pin 'drive strength' bits you can set - the intention is that you set the drive strength to such that when you pull X mA, the voltage level stays at a level that would indicate a logic '1' to 3.3v systems.
[19:38] <gordonDrogon> the default is for 8mA, but you can set them for up to 16mA.
[19:38] <gordonDrogon> not recommended, but: http://unicorn.drogon.net/pi17leds.jpg
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[19:46] <davr0s> ok i scratched the itch. 2 more pis on the way. pi0 (i want one without a broken camera port), Pi3B+, 2more cameras.
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[19:48] <davr0s> i need to find a better solution for the camera connector too but if not i can keep that one doing non-camera related duties
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[20:12] * Haxxa (~Harrison@180-150-30-18.NBN.mel.aussiebb.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[20:17] * sidx64 (~sidx64@202.62.80.157) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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[20:29] <shbrngdo> gordonDrogon - yeah, the 20ma figure I was thinking of might be a theoretical maximum. I always include a series resistor on LEDs so the resistor dissipates the current-limit power, and not the GPIO pin's circuitry. 200-300 ohms is usually good. LED typically 1.2-1.4V across it, ~2V, ~8ma with 220 ohm resistor which is what I would use on a 3.3v system.
[20:32] <gordonDrogon> shbrngdo, probably teaching an old dog new tricks, but V * 100 is a good guestimate for resistors for most typical red/green/yellow LEDs... so 330Ω on a 3.3v system, 470/560 on 5v systems...
[20:33] <gordonDrogon> I've seen ATmega designs run without resistors, using pwm to drive LEDs, but that's just asking for problems IMO ...
[20:36] * Armand (~armand@office.prgn.misp.co.uk) Quit (Quit: Armand)
[20:36] * easzero (~quassel@p200300C343D97500743A4353AE1C164F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:37] <zleap> gordonDrogon: yeah surely the resisotrs are there to protect the LEDs
[20:37] * sidx64 (~sidx64@202.62.80.157) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:37] <zleap> i have built a led traffic light board, i am sure yellow LEDs need higher value resistors
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[20:43] * sdoherty (sdoherty@nat/redhat/x-kbvdnplssgigdtjp) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[20:45] <purplex88> does raspbian have a virtual keyboard?
[20:46] <purplex88> i only have a mouse connected to it
[20:46] * terminalator (terminalat@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/terminalator) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[20:46] <zleap> purplex88: yes,
[20:46] <purplex88> where..
[20:46] <zleap> you need to install it
[20:47] <purplex88> without internet?
[20:47] <zleap> oh
[20:47] <purplex88> i need to type Wifi password lol
[20:47] <zleap> hmm
[20:47] <zleap> i guess you can't plug in a keyboard
[20:47] <zleap> so you canconfig
[20:48] <purplex88> i don't have one
[20:48] <purplex88> only laptop
[20:48] * HeXiLeD (~grumpy@unaffiliated/hexiled) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:48] <purplex88> and a monitor for pi
[20:48] <zleap> is it running ssh
[20:49] <gordonDrogon> zleap, for hobby use my v*100 guide is fine - for production you'd consult the LED datasheet to get the right values, etc.
[20:49] <leftyfb> purplex88: https://howchoo.com/g/ndy1zte2yjn/how-to-set-up-wifi-on-your-raspberry-pi-without-ethernet
[20:49] <purplex88> they really need to add a keyboard man!
[20:49] <zleap> https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=14719
[20:49] <gordonDrogon> there is a virtual keyboard package (or 2 IIRC) for touchscreens, but I never found them that much use.
[20:49] <purplex88> pi is not connected to ethernet either or ssh
[20:50] <zleap> ok
[20:50] <zleap> what are you using for irc
[20:50] <purplex88> i just installed Raspian on card and booted it up
[20:50] <leftyfb> purplex88: follow the instructions to get your pi on wireless and enable ssh. Then you can boot up the pi and connect to it via ssh
[20:50] <leftyfb> purplex88: https://howchoo.com/g/ndy1zte2yjn/how-to-set-up-wifi-on-your-raspberry-pi-without-ethernet
[20:50] <purplex88> connected via HDMI
[20:50] <zleap> can you connect pi to ethernet
[20:50] <purplex88> but no ethernet
[20:51] <purplex88> i use wifi all the time
[20:51] <leftyfb> purplex88: please follow the instructions like I said ... twice
[20:51] <purplex88> oh oh
[20:51] <leftyfb> purplex88: also create a file called: ssh
[20:51] <purplex88> i thought the link was saying "with ethernet"
[20:51] * easzero (~quassel@p200300C343D97500B8E6096EC00E0151.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:51] <purplex88> just saw its "without"
[20:52] <purplex88> i can enable ssh from raspbian
[20:52] <purplex88> using mouse!
[20:52] <zleap> yes
[20:52] * sidx64_ (~sidx64@123.63.30.29) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:52] <zleap> run the config program
[20:52] <zleap> from the menu
[20:52] <purplex88> just enabled from config
[20:53] <zleap> :)
[20:53] * Narrat (~Narrat@p5DCC66D5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:53] <purplex88> yes i accidently saw options while snooping around gui
[20:53] <shauno> so to backtrack on my claims yesterday, you can fit the sense-hat in the official case. with just a modicum of violence, it's nice and snug
[20:54] <purplex88> leftyfb: checking out your link!
[20:55] * sidx64 (~sidx64@202.62.80.157) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[20:55] <purplex88> lol
[20:56] <purplex88> i'm planning to do this.
[20:56] <purplex88> i found some random text files on raspb pi system directory and i'm copying words to copy and paste my password!
[20:57] <shauno> lol
[20:57] <zleap> ok
[20:57] * easzero (~quassel@p200300C343D9750089DB28A129AA4C69.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:57] <Voop> i can enable ssh with no mouse or keyboard or monitor
[20:57] <zleap> apt -m 30 creates a 30 character password
[20:57] <Voop> i am that good, yes
[20:57] <zleap> apt -m 30 creates a 30 character password
[20:57] <zleap> apg -m 30 creates a 30 character password
[20:58] <zleap> sorry should be apg not apt
[20:58] <purplex88> what apt -m 30 for?
[20:58] <zleap> apg
[20:58] <zleap> automatic password generator
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[20:58] <shauno> I think he means his wifi already has a password, and he's peicing it together by copying and pasting characters from anything he finds, like a ransom note?
[20:58] <zleap> ah ok
[20:58] * sidx64 (~sidx64@202.62.80.157) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:59] <purplex88> what?
[20:59] <zleap> i was just suggesting a way to create passwords
[20:59] <purplex88> yes my wifi has a password and i want to connect to it
[20:59] <purplex88> by creating a password from random files and then copying and pasting
[21:00] <Voop> what a poop password
[21:00] <Voop> is this channel still sfw
[21:00] <purplex88> its very long
[21:00] * easzero (~quassel@p200300C343D9750089DB28A129AA4C69.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.)))
[21:00] <shauno> it was until you got here!
[21:00] <Voop> yeah but you are going to store it in a notepad doc or something, right?
[21:00] * sidx64_ (~sidx64@123.63.30.29) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[21:00] <Voop> if its a 30 char random string
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[21:05] * DammitJim (~DammitJim@173.227.148.6) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[21:07] <purplex88> done!
[21:08] <purplex88> without keyboard, without ssh, without ethernet, without wpa_supplicant.conf
[21:09] <leftyfb> would have been quicker to just write out the conf file onto the sd card and pop it back in
[21:10] <purplex88> yes i guess
[21:10] <purplex88> i thought it was too smart for it
[21:11] * Haxxa (~Harrison@180-150-30-18.NBN.mel.aussiebb.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:11] * terminalator (terminalat@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/terminalator) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[21:11] * kw21 (~kw21@D978E830.cm-3-1d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:11] <purplex88> btw, i have a spare USB cable
[21:12] <purplex88> can i write to card by connect USB to my PC
[21:12] <purplex88> without pulling card out
[21:12] <leftyfb> purplex88: not unless you have a pi zero or zero w and have put it into gadget storage mode. So no
[21:12] <shauno> no. the pi is a computer, not a cardreader
[21:13] <leftyfb> shauno: well ... gadget storage mode :)
[21:13] <purplex88> like my phone connects to pc
[21:13] <leftyfb> purplex88: if you've got it on wifi now and ssh enabled , you can just ssh to it
[21:13] * kingarmadillo (~kingarmad@70-139-18-232.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:13] <purplex88> ah great idea
[21:14] <purplex88> i want try ssh now
[21:14] <leftyfb> I tell you that 24 minutes ago
[21:14] <purplex88> my goal is to install LCD driver on pi
[21:14] * sammysands (uid32634@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gmjqlerdonuktlvd) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[21:14] <purplex88> for that i will need to type a long download url
[21:14] <purplex88> i'll transfer the url via a file into card and copy
[21:15] <Bitweasil> ffs, just enable SSH.
[21:15] <Bitweasil> Ethernet cord and drop the ssh or .ssh file in the installer, done.
[21:15] * kw21 (~kw21@D978E830.cm-3-1d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:15] <Bitweasil> And just ask your router for the new DHCP lease IP.
[21:15] <purplex88> enabled it already and i'm on wifi
[21:16] * jfmcarreira (~jfmcarrei@unaffiliated/jfmcarreira) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:16] <purplex88> i need ip address of pi
[21:16] <Bitweasil> Ask your router.
[21:16] <Bitweasil> Or just nmap your local IP space for port 22.
[21:17] * pengwen (pengwens@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/pengwens) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[21:19] * v01d1 (~v01d1@5-12-20-170.residential.rdsnet.ro) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1)
[21:20] * easzero (~quassel@p200300C343D9750089DB28A129AA4C69.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:20] <shauno> or if your laptop is mac or linux, just ssh pi@raspberrypi.local.
[21:22] <Bitweasil> Assuming you only have one on the LAN...
[21:22] * sdothum (~znc@108.63.152.41) Quit (Quit: ZNC 1.6.6 - http://znc.in)
[21:22] <squirrel> why not windows, too?
[21:22] <squirrel> are .local special in some way?
[21:23] <Bitweasil> It's local mDNS stuff, not sure if Windows resolves it properly.
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[21:23] <shauno> windows doesn't come with zeroconf by default, msft have their own scheme. it is available for windows, and is installed as part of itunes. I generally don't recommend anyone installs itunes unless I really, really dislike them, so I don't assume it
[21:23] <squirrel> i've set my pi's hostname to pie and windows resolves it
[21:24] <squirrel> seems to work in every app
[21:24] <BurtyB> you can just install the bonjour part of it tho on windows - https://learn.adafruit.com/bonjour-zeroconf-networking-for-windows-and-linux/overview
[21:25] <squirrel> i installed neither bonjour or avahi anywhere mhm
[21:26] <Voop> its probably 10.0.0.x
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[21:42] * pengwen (pengwens@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/pengwens) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[21:45] * Colti (Miramar-FL@unaffiliated/colti) Quit (Excess Flood)
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[21:47] <purplex88> done everything
[21:48] * SWAT (~swat@ubuntu/member/swat) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[21:48] <purplex88> can i also use XMing via PuTTy to show actual screen on PC?
[21:48] * giddles (~giddles@unaffiliated/giddles) Quit (Quit: gn8)
[21:49] <shauno> most people use VNC for that
[21:49] * longbeach (~mike@AAubervilliers-654-1-290-47.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:49] <methuzla> vnc
[21:49] <purplex88> since i have it already installed
[21:50] <waveform> xming is an xserver - it would typically be used to forward the displays of individual applications to your PC, but it won't capture the whole screen and forward that like VNC will
[21:51] <shauno> you can do a whole remote session in X, not just individual applications. it's just a lot more work
[21:51] * dr3w_ (~dr3w_@abercs/dr3w) has joined #raspberrypi
[21:51] <waveform> indeed - but it's also worth noting that still won't "capture the Pi's screen" - i.e. it won't be mirroring whatever's happening on the Pi's desktop (if one is running)
[21:52] <dehuman> you can do sessions in xming
[21:53] <shauno> sure. there's a reason I recommended vnc first :)
[21:53] <dehuman> you could do the whole desktop, i dont recall how to do that
[21:53] <waveform> (that said, VNC muddies the waters these days with its "virtual" sessions, but keeping things simple for the time being VNC is what's required if forwarding the display is the goal)
[21:53] <dehuman> i use rdp
[21:53] <shauno> jsut thought I'd mention that one since it's literally the only thing X has going for it
[21:53] <dehuman> RDP works well for everything but games
[21:54] <dehuman> or graphics
[21:54] <dehuman> so like if i do rfcat spectrum analyzer mode? i gotta do that via xming most of the time
[21:54] <dehuman> but rdp is way faster than vnc for me
[21:55] <dehuman> and i love vnc, but my buddy said 'give rdp a go' and after i threw up in my mouth a little, i said 'why not'
[21:55] * immibis (~chatzilla@222-155-160-32-fibre.bb.spark.co.nz) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[21:55] <waveform> I'm probably way out of touch but is there X over RDP these days? I thought it was a Windows-desktop-only sort of protocol?
[21:55] <dehuman> the caveat - i only access desktop environment of my pi from windows
[21:55] <dehuman> yah, i cant recall how its setup
[21:55] <dehuman> i forgot all about it
[21:56] <BurtyB> setting up vnc might be a little easier then as it's just a raspi-config away :)
[21:56] <waveform> intriguing - might have to look into that (RDP is considerably more efficient than VNC for certain things as you said)
[21:56] <dehuman> apt-get install xrdp
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[21:56] <dehuman> thats pretty easy
[21:57] <waveform> yes - one other thing worth noting, to the best of my knowledge VNC (more specifically realVNC that ships with Raspbian) is currently the only thing capable of forwarding GPU overlays (like the camera preview)
[21:57] <waveform> (and that's only when the "experimental capture" mode is active)
[21:57] <dehuman> yah, and that might be important for whatever app you are using
[21:57] <dehuman> (rfcat spectrum analyzer)
[21:57] <dehuman> at the time, i had horrible wifi, so vnc was busted even with all kinds of tweaks
[21:59] * clemens3 (~clemens@80-218-38-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) has joined #raspberrypi
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[22:01] <purplex88> the third time i started rasp pi.. now it stucks on "Starting Update UTMP about System Boot/Shutdown ... " line
[22:01] <purplex88> a bunch of commands
[22:02] * greggerz (~greggerz@unaffiliated/greggerz) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:02] * JohnyTheSmith (~JohnyTheS@5.146.251.168) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:03] * giddles (~giddles@unaffiliated/giddles) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:03] * TheSin (~TheSin@gateway.bluefalls.ca) Quit (Quit: Client exiting)
[22:04] * Hasselsaurus (~broseidon@c-73-0-12-47.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.6)
[22:05] <purplex88> it happened after i installed a video driver for LCD screen
[22:05] * ConkyAxis (~ConkyAxis@cpc82865-enfi22-2-0-cust482.20-2.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[22:05] * Encrypt (~Encrypt@2a01cb0401d172005827929110581254.ipv6.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:06] <purplex88> just like this https://i.stack.imgur.com/AxWQX.png
[22:06] * BOKALDO (~BOKALDO@46.109.205.38) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:06] * Keanu73 (~Keanu73@2ProIntl/User/Geek/Keanu73) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:08] * pavlushka (~pavlushka@ubuntu/member/pavlushka) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[22:08] * pavlushka (~pavlushka@ubuntu/member/pavlushka) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:09] * Encrypt (~Encrypt@2a01cb0401d172005827929110581254.ipv6.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Client Quit)
[22:10] * Hasselsaurus (~broseidon@c-73-0-12-47.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:12] * tvm (~tvm@router-sever1-nat-m.pilsfree.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:12] * longbeach (~mike@AAubervilliers-654-1-290-47.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit ()
[22:12] * tvm (~tvm@router-sever1-nat-m.pilsfree.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[22:12] * tvm (~tvm@router-sever1-nat-m.pilsfree.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:13] <purplex88> interesting
[22:13] <purplex88> I had to switch the mode to HDMI
[22:13] * Gathis (~TheBlack@unaffiliated/gathis) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:13] <purplex88> it was set to LCD
[22:15] * ConkyAxis (~ConkyAxis@cpc82865-enfi22-2-0-cust482.20-2.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:16] <purplex88> just one I cannot find is that my LCD screen is 320x240 but Raspberry has no 320x240 resolution so how it will run in it?
[22:16] <purplex88> ^one thing
[22:17] * guhcampos (~guhcampos@198-27-194-205.static.sonic.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:17] * easzero (~easzero@p200300C343D97500E1A1A238CF2FF0E3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:18] * cave (~various@h081217094041.dyn.cm.kabsi.at) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:19] <Voop> you can set the resolution in some text file
[22:20] <Voop> forgot where it is but google custom resolution rpi or something
[22:21] * tvm (~tvm@router-sever1-nat-m.pilsfree.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:22] <purplex88> i'll look at soon
[22:23] * tvm (~tvm@router-sever1-nat-m.pilsfree.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:23] * easzero (~easzero@p200300C343D97500E1A1A238CF2FF0E3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[22:23] <purplex88> what was that virtual keyboard we were talking about?
[22:23] <purplex88> i guess "matchbox"
[22:24] * easzero (~easzero@p200300C343D97500E1A1A238CF2FF0E3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[22:25] * djk (~Thunderbi@pool-96-242-161-125.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: djk)
[22:26] * duckpuppy (~patrickai@h213.6.30.71.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[22:27] * EdwardIII (~edwardiii@unaffiliated/edward123) has joined #raspberrypi
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[22:29] <purplex88> done it!
[22:30] * sidx64 (~sidx64@202.62.80.157) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[22:30] <purplex88> i'm genuis! i installed raspberry pi!
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[22:31] <purplex88> with all of everyone's help here though
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[22:43] <Tenkawa> hi all
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[22:50] <purplex88> what does this "sudo apt-get update" does?
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[22:51] <purplex88> i already did it once when I installed keyboard and now for tightvnc I need to do again?
[22:52] <shauno> you probably don't need to do it every time
[22:52] <shauno> 'apt-get update' fetches a list of the most recent package versions for raspbian. so several times a day is silly, because they're rarely changed that frequently.
[22:52] <leftyfb> purplex88: https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/linux/software/apt.md
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[22:53] <purplex88> theres "vnc server" and tightvnc server" on my laptop
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[22:54] <purplex88> i guess both are different
[22:55] <ebarch> purplex88: vnc server is most likely RealVNC. i believe that's what gets installed by default when you enable it via raspi-config
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[22:56] <ebarch> you could even use https://guacamole.apache.org/ which is browser based =)
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[22:56] <purplex88> yes raspbian os had vnc server already
[22:57] <Ilyas> loaded question but is Raspbian the most versatile distro for the Pi2 ?
[22:57] <purplex88> do i really need sudo apt-get install tightvncserver ?
[22:57] <Ilyas> I'm looking for something with an upto date repo but a small install footrpint
[22:58] <ebarch> Ilyas: what exactly do you mean by versatile?
[22:58] <Ilyas> does it have a big, up to date repository
[22:58] <ebarch> arch might make more sense if you want something minimal. it's quite up to date. you could also use raspbian lite if you don't need a GUI
[22:59] <purplex88> oh but realvnc doesn't seem free License: GPL / Proprietary software
[22:59] <ebarch> you could also start with raspbian lite and install only the packages you need
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[23:01] <Ilyas> ebarch: I'll try that
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[23:01] <Ilyas> any idea how big the install will grow?
[23:01] <ebarch> it won't have a GUI. but you can always install that :)
[23:02] <ebarch> depends what you install
[23:02] <ebarch> apt will tell you how much space packages will take up before you install them
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[23:07] <Voop> why does it need to be so small
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[23:11] <purplex88> isn't there ultravnc for pi?
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[23:12] <purplex88> no ultravnc server
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These logs were automatically created by RaspberryPiBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.