#raspberrypi IRC Log

Index

IRC Log for 2018-04-05

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:00] * dr3w_ (~dr3w_@abercs/dr3w) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:05] * brasizza (~brasizza@2804:14c:109:88b4:fc9b:6097:864c:87a9) has joined #raspberrypi
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[0:14] <Alexander-47u> how bad is soldering fumes for you :P?
[0:16] * sdothum (~znc@108.63.186.54) Quit (Quit: ZNC 1.6.6 - http://znc.in)
[0:16] * MacGeek (~BSD@host188-232-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[0:17] * brasizza (~brasizza@2804:14c:109:88b4:fc9b:6097:864c:87a9) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
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[0:17] * defsdoor (~andy@cpc120600-sutt6-2-0-cust232.19-1.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:18] * harmlessgryphon (~default@d47-69-199-50.col.wideopenwest.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:20] * Very_slow (~dewrock@CPEc412f5da6ef1-CM84948c4b03d0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[0:21] * puff (~user@pool-72-77-34-186.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[0:21] * ConkyAxis (~ConkyAxis@cpc82865-enfi22-2-0-cust482.20-2.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[0:25] <BurtyB> Alexander-47u, I wouldn't worry too much unless you're sat over the iron feeding in solder to sniff it
[0:26] <BurtyB> but ventilation always helps :)
[0:26] * Hix (~hix@113.red-88-0-81.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[0:33] * Case77 (~Case77@pool-108-44-22-63.albyny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:34] * Keanu73 (~Keanu73@2ProIntl/User/Geek/Keanu73) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[0:35] * energizer (~energizer@unaffiliated/energizer) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[0:36] * [SLB] (~slabua@unaffiliated/slabua) Quit (Quit: Close the world, Open the nExt)
[0:38] * sammysands (uid32634@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bzkzbxtevzxidpzz) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[0:39] * TheFatherMind- is now known as TheFatherMind
[0:39] <CoJaBo> mfa298: Yeh, I meant hw accel; sucks that it's still lacking D=
[0:39] <CoJaBo> Maybe there's hope for Pi4..
[0:40] <CoJaBo> USB3 would be nice too, now that there's gig-e
[0:40] <Alexander-47u> BurtyB, ja i was pretty careless lol
[0:41] <Alexander-47u> got a very heavy feeling in my head that lasted about 10 minutes
[0:41] <Alexander-47u> xD
[0:43] <CoJaBo> The 2 things I've wanted in a pi since the first one I got, were onboard wifi and h.265. 1 out of 2 aint bad tho
[0:44] <binaryhermit> I thought the pi3 had some sort of experimental gpu-assisted h265 decoder? might be wrong, and if it did work on the 3b, it probably works better on the 3b+
[0:44] <binaryhermit> that might have been a kodi thing or something
[0:44] <binaryhermit> to be honest, huge grain of salt on those last 2 lines
[0:46] <CoJaBo> hm; I'll have to look that up, I've never heard of it before
[0:46] * Psybur (~Psybur@unaffiliated/psybur) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[0:48] * Warmy (~Warmy@185.206.224.115) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[0:49] * BeamWatcher (~gashead76@208.117.74.236) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[0:49] <binaryhermit> CoJaBo: I might be wrong
[0:49] * mythos_ (~mythos@unaffiliated/mythos) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:50] * agajania_ (~agajania@frogn.cs.newpaltz.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:50] <CoJaBo> Nothing looking relevent on google :/
[0:51] <CoJaBo> unless I just suck at googling, which is extremely possible.
[0:51] * swift110 (~swift110@unaffiliated/swift110) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:54] * agajania_ (~agajania@frogn.cs.newpaltz.edu) Quit (Client Quit)
[0:54] * AaronMT (~textual@2607:fea8:3ddf:ebc9:e5bb:dd4e:1054:4115) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[0:54] * agajania_ (~agajania@frogn.cs.newpaltz.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:55] * hamitron (~hamitron@212.159.76.90) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:55] * alexxy[home] is now known as alexxy
[0:59] <binaryhermit> CoJaBo: Apparently I was mistaken
[0:59] * pcmerc_work (~pcmerc_wo@proxy-sf.kryptochaos.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:01] <CoJaBo> Vegan terrorists. Wtf has this world come to
[1:01] <BurtyB> hmm a place where people don't read the rules in the topic
[1:03] * d4re (~d4re@gateway/tor-sasl/d4re) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[1:03] * d4re- (~d4re@gateway/tor-sasl/d4re) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:03] * d4re- is now known as d4re
[1:04] * vstehle (~vstehle@rqp06-1-88-178-86-202.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[1:05] * Qatz (~DB@c-66-31-24-126.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:06] * Qatz (~DB@c-66-31-24-126.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[1:06] * Alexander-47u (~Alexander@37.48.116.173) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[1:06] * djk (~Thunderbi@pool-96-242-161-125.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: djk)
[1:09] * M3mphiZ (~quassel@unaffiliated/memphizzzzzz) Quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
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[1:17] * Qatz (~DB@c-66-31-24-126.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:21] * BlueKiwi (~abecko@214.175.broadband11.iol.cz) Quit (Quit: BlueKiwi)
[1:22] * w7sak (~shantorn@184-100-155-229.ptld.qwest.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:28] * TheSin (~TheSin@d108-181-59-174.abhsia.telus.net) has joined #raspberrypi
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[1:33] * Gathis (~TheBlack@unaffiliated/gathis) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[1:44] * noobineer (~noobineer@c-68-55-184-193.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[1:45] <jthunder> just trying to upgrade the hardware with a new rpi3b+ but it won’t boot from an sd card used in a rpi3b, what do I need to do to update the image to work on the new hardware?
[1:45] <jthunder> running the latest rasbian
[1:46] * Anatzum (~michael@ip70-177-117-79.ok.ok.cox.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:46] <CoJaBo> jthunder: There's a raspi-update script
[1:47] <CoJaBo> and also the apt-get updates, which should usually run that automaticlaly I think
[1:47] <jthunder> yeah did a apt-get update, upgrade and dist-upgrade already
[1:47] * kingmanor (~kingmanor@ool-44c06476.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:48] <jthunder> I don’t have the rpi-update utility installed
[1:49] <jthunder> the red light just flashes four times like its not able to read the SD card at all. Plug it back into the older hardware and it comes up right away
[1:50] * GenteelBen (~GenteelBe@cpc111801-lutn14-2-0-cust55.9-3.cable.virginm.net) Quit ()
[1:51] <BurtyB> jthunder, anything on the screen?
[1:51] <jthunder> nope
[1:51] <jthunder> this also doesn’t work sudo apt-get install rpi-update
[1:52] <CoJaBo> jthunder: Try another psu and cable, and if that fails, another SDcard. Maybe it's not a swoftware problem.
[1:54] <pcmerc_work> dd image the current card & restore that to another card etc
[1:54] <pcmerc_work> process of elimination
[1:54] * muldover (~muldover0@178.79.60.253) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:55] * muldover (~muldover0@178.79.60.253) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[1:56] * muldover (~muldover0@178.79.60.253) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
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[2:00] * weez17 (~isaac@unaffiliated/weez17) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[2:01] * hamitron (~hamitron@212.159.76.90) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[2:06] * Anatzum (~michael@ip70-177-117-79.ok.ok.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[2:06] * Xionaba (~fartofago@h77-53-243-219.cust.se.alltele.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:08] <Xionaba> hi im an idiot! i installed an NES emulator "sudo apt-get install fceux", but no idea how to run it. dont want to install retro pi for it
[2:10] <leftyfb> Xionaba: what distro are you running?
[2:10] <CoJaBo> Xionaba: it'll usually be in the desktop menu automaticlaly
[2:10] <CoJaBo> Or, just run the fceux command, usually it'll be the same as the package name
[2:11] <Xionaba> running rasbian
[2:11] <Xionaba> oh
[2:15] <Xionaba> ty! that worked
[2:15] <Xionaba> should install the gui version instead
[2:16] <pcmerc_work> because you need to click a button to run what you could type on the cmdline?
[2:17] * clemens3_ (~clemens@80-218-38-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[2:17] * plugwash (~plugwash@2a02:c7f:ba49:1500::2) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:22] * CyberManifest (~CyberMani@r74-192-49-147.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:26] <Voop> ohms law question
[2:27] <Voop> i want to send a signal TO a pin on a pi
[2:27] <Voop> the voltage will be higher than a pi can handle. so i gotta step the voltage down
[2:28] <Voop> i was told i could do this with a few resistors. how do i figure out the value of the resistors?
[2:29] * saptech (~saptech@unaffiliated/saptech) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[2:31] <leftyfb> Voop: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=22841
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[2:46] * riddle (riddle@us.yunix.net) Quit (Disconnected by services)
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[2:47] * NickG365 (~NickG365@cortex.starlabs.theflash.rocks) Quit (Quit: NickG365)
[2:48] * muldover (~muldover0@178.79.60.253) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[2:51] * dex1983 (CUbjHVDi32@canopus.uberspace.de) Quit (*.net *.split)
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[2:51] * Ellied (~ellie@lpc-121-178.lpc-south-classroom.depaul.edu) Quit (*.net *.split)
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[2:51] * Alzadoua_ is now known as A-cat
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[2:51] * pixel_yo (~pixel_yo@unaffiliated/pixel-yo/x-3847297) has joined #raspberrypi
[2:51] * pklaus (~pklaus@i53874B54.versanet.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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[2:57] * Ellied (~ellie@lpc-121-178.lpc-south-classroom.depaul.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
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[3:47] * JasonCL (~JasonCL@cpe-174-109-154-111.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[3:54] * clickboom (~boomclick@mail.eisenhowercenter.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[3:56] * noobineer (~noobineer@108-197-174-33.lightspeed.gdrpmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[3:59] * harmlessgryphon (~default@d47-69-199-50.col.wideopenwest.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[4:07] * redstarcomrade (~quassel@cpe-104-175-255-182.socal.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
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[4:08] * eblip is now known as eb0t
[4:09] * clickboom (~boomclick@142.91.189.44) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[4:20] * jonvonb (~username@nat-208-66-188-116.pinebelt.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:20] * Voop (~bob@c-73-178-90-123.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[4:20] * puff` (~user@2607:3180:1:162:2c34:2870:c63c:3d40) has joined #raspberrypi
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[4:25] <jthunder> CoJaBo: tried another cable and I know the SD card is good as it boots two other PI 3bs
[4:25] * andrewa (~andrewa@189.204.47.36) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[4:25] <jthunder> I also flashed a fresh rasbian onto the same sd card and it works
[4:25] <jthunder> just not the old image
[4:26] <jthunder> I’m thinking that it must be a kernel issue
[4:26] <jthunder> but no green light at all is strange
[4:27] * uks (~uksio@p5B12FCC0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:27] * uksio (~uksio@p200300CB1BCB48A6751CB9B91E85AE0C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[4:28] * puff` is now known as puff
[4:29] * CyberManifest (~CyberMani@r74-192-49-147.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[4:36] * giddles (~giddles@unaffiliated/giddles) Quit (Quit: gn9)
[4:45] * Tex_Nick (TexNixk@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/texnixk) has left #raspberrypi
[4:51] * NavyBear-Pi (~TheNavyBe@unaffiliated/thenavybear) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
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[4:53] * Karyon (~Karyon@unaffiliated/karyon) has joined #raspberrypi
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[4:55] * uksio (~uksio@p200300CB1BC39C41751CB9B91E85AE0C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[4:58] * pigweed (~pigweed@97-119-2-177.omah.qwest.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[4:58] * uks (~uksio@p5B12FCC0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
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[5:04] * padgaland (padgaland@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/padgaland) has joined #raspberrypi
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[5:06] * malhelo (~malhelo@dslb-178-010-190-070.178.010.pools.vodafone-ip.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[5:13] * plum (~plum@unaffiliated/plum) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[5:13] * mulp is now known as plum
[5:13] * stekro (~stekro@x590e71fb.dyn.telefonica.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[5:15] * binaryhermit (~binaryher@belencomputers/member/binaryhermit) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1)
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[5:19] * Arcaelyx (~Arcaelyx@209.222.19.251.adsl.inet-telecom.org) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[5:32] * TentacleMonster (~AshKetchu@71-86-96-31.dhcp.gwnt.ga.charter.com) Quit (Client Quit)
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[5:34] * padgaland (padgaland@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/padgaland) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[5:49] * Hix (~hix@113.red-88-0-81.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[5:49] * BenGrimm (UPP@75.81.149.89) Quit (Quit: .��UPP��.)
[5:49] * Mr_Keyser_Soze (~Mr_Keyser@c-69-246-32-17.hsd1.la.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:53] * DexDeadly (~DexDeadly@pool-108-52-111-48.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[5:54] <DexDeadly> Anyone have any experience with gunicorn
[5:54] * nevodka (~nevodka@199.21.149.49) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[5:57] * noobineer (~noobineer@68.55.184.193) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[6:00] <DexDeadly> I installed gunicorn in a virtualenv using pip install gunicorn and it said it was installed yet when I run (simplyfishy) pi@simplyfishy:~/simplyfishyenv $ gunicorn --bind 0.0.0.0:8000 wsgi
[6:00] <DexDeadly> -bash: gunicorn: command not found
[6:01] * malhelo_ (~malhelo@dslb-092-074-242-030.092.074.pools.vodafone-ip.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[6:01] * malhelo (~malhelo@dslb-092-074-242-030.092.074.pools.vodafone-ip.de) has joined #raspberrypi
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[6:06] * arctair (~Thunderbi@ip-209-243-14-234.far.ideaone.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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[6:13] * djhworld (~djhworld@90.255.46.63) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[7:00] * kushal (~hopless@fedora/kushal) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[7:22] * SWAT_ is now known as SWAT
[7:25] * redstarcomrade (~quassel@cpe-104-175-255-182.socal.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[8:52] <red9> For those doing 3D-printing Pi-shells or Pi controlling 3D printers: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1352231013005086
[8:52] <red9> Ultrafine particle emissions from desktop 3D printers - ScienceDirect ; https://www.sci-hub.hk/ DOI 10.1016/j.atmosenv.2013.06.050 ; PLA material will output circa 27 000 ultrafine particles (UFP) per cm^3 measured 2 meters away. (page 3) "UFPs are particularly relevant from a health perspective because they deposit efficiently in both the pulmonary and alveolar regions of the lung (Hinds, 1999; Chalupa et al., 2004), as well as in head airw
[8:54] <red9> airways. Deposition in head airways can also lead to translocation to the brain via the olfactory nerve (Oberdörster et al., 2004)" (page 5)
[8:54] * djsxxx_away is now known as Dave_MMP
[8:57] <shiftplusone> Thanks, red9. Will start opening the window while printing now.
[8:57] <shiftplusone> probably should've been doing that all along anyway
[8:59] <red9> Well it is a danger, but the remedy is quite easy.
[8:59] <mlelstv> is it?
[9:00] <mlelstv> the particles are still there and will end up in the food chain.
[9:00] <mlelstv> of course 3d printing is only a tiny fraction of all the plastic
[9:00] <red9> mlelstv, concentration also matters.
[9:01] <mlelstv> the problem with the food chain is that it will accumulate things..
[9:01] <red9> mlelstv, Get people stop dumping plastic in the environment if you want to have an impact that matters ;) oh hint pacific garbage patch ;)
[9:01] <mlelstv> so whatever you eat will have a high concentration.
[9:01] <mlelstv> agreed :)
[9:01] <mlelstv> so far 3d printing is only a tiny fraction of the problem.
[9:01] * dreamon__ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[9:02] * shbrngdo groans
[9:02] <red9> A hood, a fan = solved on a individual basis.
[9:02] * mlelstv groans shbrngdo too
[9:02] <red9> maybe some tubing..
[9:03] * shbrngdo hears chicken little and henny penny saying "The sky is falling!"
[9:03] <mlelstv> it already fell down.
[9:04] <shbrngdo> good. then all worry can stop now
[9:05] * Zardoz (~Zardoz@cpe-70-124-157-79.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:06] <red9> Any archaeologist won't miss the 2000th century in the far future ;-)
[9:06] * wuzamarine (~kvirc@c-69-255-193-190.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:06] * Zardoz (~Zardoz@cpe-70-124-157-79.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Quit: ZNC 1.7.x-nightly-20171027-ddefb03d - https://znc.in)
[9:07] <shiftplusone> Wouldn't PLA biodegrade relatively quickly at that particle size?
[9:07] * Zardoz (~Zardoz@cpe-70-124-157-79.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:08] * shbrngdo thinks: plastic made from oil. oil comes out of the ground and leaks out into the ocean because, dead dinos. I suppose we're just putting it back where we found it. heh.
[9:08] <shbrngdo> and then there are the black helicopters.
[9:09] <shbrngdo> ok don't wanna troll too hard. it'd turn into an off-topic flame ware really fast
[9:09] <shbrngdo> er, flame war
[9:09] <red9> Can you put black helicopters back into dinosaurs? ;-)
[9:10] <shbrngdo> that'd be a fun thing to try. let's clone some dinos, printed using 3d printers controlled by RPi
[9:10] <shbrngdo> 3d bio-clone printers
[9:11] <red9> Had a look at PLA, at the right circumstances with the right bacteria the material will be recycled in 150 days.
[9:11] <shbrngdo> I reall don't want to see things I printed disintegrating so quickly
[9:11] <shiftplusone> Wake me up when you can put black dinosaurs into helicopters.
[9:11] <red9> What voltage do those ink-jet cartridges require?
[9:11] <shbrngdo> it's in the kv range I think
[9:12] <red9> shbrngdo, Use ABS and hold your breath until you replaced the air in your office ;)
[9:12] * clemens3_ (~clemens@mx.eniso-partners.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:12] <shbrngdo> that's what fume hoods are for
[9:12] <red9> Here's the bacteria that recycles PLA: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amycolatopsis
[9:12] <shbrngdo> keep it away from my plastic stuff
[9:13] <red9> Can anyone see in what environments it lives in?
[9:13] <shiftplusone> Heh... the english page is two sentences...
[9:14] <shbrngdo> it reminds me of this one 'sliders' episode where a parallel universe had some scientist clean up an oil spill with bacteria, which then proceeded to eat all of the oil on the planet
[9:14] <shbrngdo> science fiction being a predictor of actual science more often than not, such things could be seriously dangerous
[9:14] * shiftplusone doesn't recall that episode
[9:15] <shbrngdo> the episode began with a guy on a dirt road with a horse-drawn cart filled with peanut oil. even the roads were gone.
[9:16] <shiftplusone> Doesn't ring a bell. Seems like it should've been memorable. Might be time to rewatch sliders at some point.
[9:16] <shbrngdo> yeah the main character's plastic cards all disintegrated inside his wallet. the 'bugs' were everywhere
[9:17] <shbrngdo> no plastic, no petroleum, no asphalt for roads, etc.
[9:17] * govg (~govg@unaffiliated/govg) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[9:18] <shiftplusone> So solar roadways makes sense after all!
[9:18] <shbrngdo> probably a good idea to see through the potential consequences if that stuff ever got loose
[9:18] * defsdoor (~andy@cpc120600-sutt6-2-0-cust232.19-1.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:18] <mfa298> jthunder: late reply i know, but if the old card used noobs that could be your problem
[9:19] * govg (~govg@unaffiliated/govg) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:19] <red9> shbrngdo, But disasters are so pr0f1table! ;-)
[9:19] <shbrngdo> yeah, especially to politicians
[9:19] * shbrngdo ducks
[9:19] <red9> Amycolatopsis is found in Kuwait soil and in the Atacama Desert
[9:20] <shbrngdo> let's hope it stays there
[9:20] <shbrngdo> it's bad enough when termites eat the house
[9:20] <red9> I wonder if termites would eat PLA ;)
[9:20] <shbrngdo> bacteria eating it is bad enough. effectively the same
[9:21] <red9> Anyway a quick test would be to put a string of PLA in the ground. Pick it up next year and find out..
[9:21] <shiftplusone> One way to find out.
[9:21] <shbrngdo> you pay money for stuff and in 6 months it turns to powder. NO thank you
[9:21] <shiftplusone> Start a PLA-fed termite ant farm business
[9:22] <shbrngdo> consider also how people complain about a society based on 'throw-it-away' already. make things only last 150 days before the plastic turns to powder, and you can see landfills being overlowed with things that lost their plastic
[9:22] <shiftplusone> You'd expect it to degrade from the outside in though, right? Instead of the whole thing crumbling within 6 months.
[9:22] <shbrngdo> not to mention no plastic printers making stuff for makers
[9:23] <shbrngdo> think of it like rust on a car. you don't see it under the paint until it's too late
[9:23] <iKarith> hey shiftplusone
[9:23] <shiftplusone> Hey, iKarith. How's it going?
[9:24] <red9> DeLorean - stays rust free..
[9:24] <iKarith> Not bad—I'm solving some problems on my end that got me away from working on stuff for awhile…
[9:24] <shiftplusone> Ah, that tends to happen.
[9:24] <iKarith> It does—I don't currently have a suitably forgiving 15kHz screen :(
[9:25] * thallada (~thallada@fsf/member/thallada) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[9:25] <shiftplusone> shbrngdo: idk, I have PLA-printed things which are years old that show no signs of degradation yet.
[9:25] <shiftplusone> iKarith: what for?
[9:25] <shbrngdo> shiftplusone - and we hope it stays that way, yeah
[9:25] <iKarith> shiftplusone: All the stuff I was doing with image generation was for Raspple II—we use Raspberry Pis as peripherals for our Apple II computers. :D
[9:26] <red9> PLA degredation is a problem mainly for outdoors stuff. Like a Pi shell for outdoor measurements..
[9:26] <iKarith> (yes, we are insane.)
[9:26] <red9> iKarith, In what way is your 15 kHz screen forgiving? for what source ?
[9:26] <shbrngdo> the sun might be the biggest factor. if I wanted something to be weatherproof, I'd consider a 'ruggedized' enclosure
[9:26] <red9> sounds CRT'ish..
[9:27] <red9> ruggedized using what material? :p
[9:27] <iKarith> red9: The Apple II composite video signal is … not exactly standard NTSC or PAL.
[9:27] * I_Died_Once (~I_Died_On@unaffiliated/idiedonce/x-1828535) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:27] <iKarith> More than sufficient for analog CRTs, but modern displays tend to assume your video signals are in spec.
[9:27] <shbrngdo> apple II ? wow that's a really long time ago.
[9:27] <iKarith> Ours aren't. :(
[9:28] <iKarith> And 15kHz RGB (as in SCART connector) is not a thing in the US really.
[9:28] <shbrngdo> maybe you could use a TV that is capable of handling composite video
[9:28] <iKarith> I could if I had one
[9:28] <shbrngdo> you can still buy them I think.
[9:29] <iKarith> not the LCDs
[9:29] <iKarith> oh they "handle" it sure, but only if it's in spec.
[9:29] <shbrngdo> you sure? well, they'll have HDTV inputs of course, and component video, and probably composite too. I bought a big one ~2 years ago and it has composite input
[9:29] <iKarith> If I found a quality trinitron CRT that took Y/C (S-Video) it'd be perfect.
[9:29] <red9> iKarith, Is your signal RGB or monochrome?
[9:30] <iKarith> Yeah, composite out of spec tends not to display at all
[9:30] <shbrngdo> you can get composite video to HDMI converters for maybe $30-$50 online
[9:30] <shbrngdo> they're useful for connecting old VCRs and stuff
[9:30] <iKarith> it's "color" composite, but the color is artifact-based with something that isn't quite a colorburst
[9:30] <iKarith> the processors in many TVs can't lock on to the signal.
[9:31] <iKarith> the ones that double the Y signal of Y/Pb/Pr as composite are the worst for that.
[9:31] <red9> iKarith, Any scope image of the signal for one line?
[9:31] <shbrngdo> oh so you'd need an older analog set? I had this old 9" color TV with tubes in it that went to the thrift store a few years back
[9:31] <iKarith> There's also a brief voltage spike at power on that I'm sure isn't good for some of those signal processors.
[9:31] <iKarith> Possibly, but I haven't got one.
[9:31] <shbrngdo> it had mechanical channel selector. I bought it around 1983 I think.
[9:32] <iKarith> Anyway, I'm working on solutions to that.
[9:32] <red9> I had a color CRT using tubes 100%. Took 20 minutes to get a picture from "cold start" .. ;-)
[9:32] <shbrngdo> that old TV got a lot of use. it lasted for 3 decades, effectively
[9:32] * uks (~uksio@p200300CB1BC39C3FD91F20EB432836DD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:32] <shbrngdo> yeah that 9" was a portable, didn't weigh a lot. but useless with digital signals
[9:33] <iKarith> For the Pi side of things, we've been doing some interesting things that let the Pi read the Apple's disk drives, keyboard, mouse (if you have one), joystick, etc to use the Pi to run a 20MHz accelerated Apple II emulator
[9:33] <shbrngdo> you'd need one of thsoe channel 3/4 RF converters for it
[9:33] <shbrngdo> I still have one, somewhere in the boneyard of forgotten electronics gear
[9:33] <iKarith> we've also used it to make disk drives over serial port for the Apple II, and set it up as AppleTalk servers.
[9:33] <red9> RS-422 as I recall?
[9:34] <iKarith> We had to ask the people who build kernel images to add AppleTalk support to their kernel image for us to do that.
[9:34] * k1l0b1t (~HOST@91.179.100.197) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:34] <shbrngdo> RPi as an apple II emulator. good idea! [people use this with simvh and xmame also]
[9:34] <iKarith> Macs do RS-422, and so does the Apple IIgs. But the IIe and IIc use a SY6551 ACIA chip. RS-232, with "interesting" handshaking on the IIc's 5 pin serial ports
[9:35] <k1l0b1t> anyone knows why i cant connect to my pi via ssh over wifi from win10? it works from my phone
[9:35] * uksio (~uksio@p200300CB1BC39C41751CB9B91E85AE0C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[9:35] <iKarith> shbrngdo: It'd be much cooler if we could have the IIgs emulator use the real IIgs's sound processor. That doesn't work yet. :(
[9:35] * thallada (~thallada@fsf/member/thallada) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:36] <shbrngdo> k1l0b1t - at the risk of sounding snarky, it's probably Win-10-nic doing it. I can't imagine what Micro-stuff did to their OS. could be firewall. I suggest installign Cygwin anyway, do ssh from that environment [or abandon windows altogether]
[9:36] <red9> k1l0b1t, draw a picture of your network setup.
[9:37] <red9> Microsoft is Evil.
[9:37] <shbrngdo> the picture might help but assuming the network is ok, ssh could fail due to a number of "it's windows' fault" things. At least Cygwin would give you an error telling what is happening.
[9:37] * sir_galahad_ad (~aaron@cpe-76-179-65-199.maine.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:38] <red9> Putty (tip)
[9:38] <shbrngdo> red9 - I actually think they're just dumber than dirt these days. I used to like what they did.
[9:38] * MacGeek (~BSD@host188-232-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:39] <shbrngdo> anyway, if you plan on using ssh from a windows box, I suggest doing it from within Cygwin.
[9:39] * sir_galahad_ad (~aaron@cpe-76-179-65-199.maine.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:39] <red9> iKarith, You are dealing with IIc and IIe ?
[9:39] <k1l0b1t> red9: I'm using putty, on a surface pro 4. the router is a linksys one, dont know the model. wich I linked to the pi with a static IP
[9:39] <shbrngdo> I think it's an awesome idea to emulate apple II with an RPi. Fun 'retro' project
[9:39] <shbrngdo> There's something like it for C64 already
[9:40] <iKarith> red9: Generally IIc, IIe, and IIgs. Some folks have II/II+ but there's less to do there. II is only possible with II+ ROMs anyway.
[9:40] <k1l0b1t> It worked before, but now it always crashes on windows, but not on terminus on android
[9:40] <red9> Actually I think FPGA is the tool for implementation of old computers because you can get cycle accurate.
[9:40] <shbrngdo> k1l0b1t - well, assuming you can ping the RPi, proving the network is working, I'd say it's putty. I don't like putty.
[9:41] <k1l0b1t> shbrngdo: I can ping it, I'l try cygwin
[9:41] <shbrngdo> either that or Win-10-nic firewall
[9:41] <iKarith> red9: Serial disk drives require ProDOS. AppleTalk requires ProDOS or GS/OS and either a IIgs or a IIe with the Workstation Card—and a LocalTalk to EtherTalk bridge. Netatalk doesn't speak serial AppleTalk (SDLC using RS-422). It needs Ethernet AppleTalk (DDP protocol)
[9:41] <shbrngdo> it might take an hour or so to download+install. I think the default setup includes ssh [otherwise you should read up before installing I think]. but when you have it installed, you'll have all of the familiar userland tools like Linux
[9:42] <iKarith> I'd _LOVE_ to teach netatalk the SDLC protocol somehow.
[9:43] <shbrngdo> if all of these protocols are well documented it sounds like just a matter of going through the process of implementing them
[9:43] * Mr_Keyser_Soze (~Mr_Keyser@c-69-246-32-17.hsd1.la.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
[9:43] <iKarith> Unlike DDP it would probably be entirely userspace
[9:43] <shbrngdo> 'entirely userspace' has its advantages
[9:43] <iKarith> shbrngdo: Well, they're documented somewhere.
[9:44] <shbrngdo> anyway - back to my thing
[9:44] <iKarith> I actually have some mind to come up with a new TCP/UDP-based file/print protocol for the Apple II.
[9:44] <iKarith> We do have ethernet cards for the machines.
[9:44] <red9> re Apple video chores: http://www.apple2faq.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Apple_IIgs_RGB_pin_outs.jpg
[9:44] <iKarith> But I'm thinking a microcontroller sitting on the Apple II bus could interface nicely via CPLD
[9:45] * shoogz (~shoogz@gateway/tor-sasl/shoogz) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:45] <iKarith> red9: Yeah, that'll get you the ability to build a SCART cable for teh IIgs.
[9:45] <red9> Considering that RGB is available + composite Sync. The problem should be managable?
[9:45] <iKarith> In Europe yes.
[9:46] <red9> Another solution is to use any Bt848 based video grabber. Which have a nice sync on any crap signal feature (patented).
[9:46] <iKarith> American TVs and monitors don't take 15kHz RGB signals
[9:46] <red9> Import one from Europe?
[9:46] <iKarith> They either took composite, Y/C, or Y/Pb/Pr.
[9:47] * iKarith ponders importing a 19" CRT TV from Europe :D
[9:47] <iKarith> These days people tend to use things like OSSC/Framemeister devices for that
[9:47] <red9> Isn't your Apple's from USA and thus.. NTSC?
[9:48] <iKarith> Yeah, but NTSC RGB isn't a thing anybody supported here.
[9:49] <red9> NTSC Y/C should be supported?
[9:49] <iKarith> we went composite -> Y/C -> Y/Pb/Pr -> HDMI
[9:49] <red9> ouch.
[9:49] <iKarith> and Y/C is now rare and unsupported
[9:49] * BlueKiwi (~abecko@214.175.broadband11.iol.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:49] <iKarith> RGB to Y/Pb/Pr devices sometimes can be found.
[9:50] * Hix (~hix@113.red-88-0-81.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:50] <iKarith> some positive experiments have found affordable SCART to HDMI devices that are reasonably low-latency if you can get an RGB to SCART cable
[9:51] <red9> If you want to do the hardcore approach. The X and Y positioning can be done with plain audio amplifiers infact.
[9:51] <iKarith> And an NTSC comb filter can condition the Apple II video signal into something modern TVs will take, if you can find a comb filter box
[9:51] <red9> The beam RGB usually can be controlled at the base of control transistors on the PCB situated on the tube.
[9:51] <iKarith> (Those were kind of pro/prosumer devices, so they're pretty uncommon)
[9:52] <iKarith> The comb filter approach would be needed for IIe/IIc
[9:52] <iKarith> I've considered whether modding CRT TVs for RGB input is feasable. For someone probably, but my soldering is poor at best. I'm legally blind. :)
[9:53] <iKarith> I should have someone ELSE do that bit of soldering. :D
[9:53] <shauno> at least you've got an excuse. I'm just bad at it.
[9:53] <iKarith> shauno: lol
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[9:54] <red9> iKarith, It can be done.
[9:54] <red9> iKarith, Advantage is that you can get just about any signal to "sync".
[9:54] <iKarith> Saw a video where someone did with a Sony
[9:54] <iKarith> Looked GREAT!
[9:54] * Hix (~hix@113.red-88-0-81.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[9:55] * Keanu73 (~Keanu73@2ProIntl/User/Geek/Keanu73) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:55] <red9> Can probable also be done with a 1950's color TV..
[9:55] <iKarith> Trinitron TVs with their nice stripe masks
[9:56] <iKarith> Well the last 1960s TV I saw was not so much a thing you put on a TV stand as it was a big wooden hunk of furniture you put against a wall.
[9:56] <iKarith> Might prefer something late 80s :)
[9:56] <iKarith> I think my fiancee would stab me in my sleep if I got a nice big CRT TV in our little studio apartment.
[9:57] <red9> Just keep the fingers away from the HV cable and supply transformer. Preferably rubber gloves.
[9:57] <iKarith> Confirmed, she would. :)
[9:58] <iKarith> She did tell me the other day that I could buy some uranium on eBay and a geiger counter on Amazon … those would be small at least…
[9:58] <red9> doh.. ;)
[9:58] <k1l0b1t> shbrngdo: ssh is not default, any idea how I add that package?
[9:58] <iKarith> I'm tempted to buy the uranium just so I can tell people I ordered uranium on eBay.
[9:58] * pauliunas (uid237462@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bbukodjryzxjgrma) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:59] <red9> WAF-factor; The important is LOOKS, functionality, price or dangers.. won't matter ;)
[9:59] * dreamon__ (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) has joined #raspberrypi
[9:59] <iKarith> Yes, that's a thing, and no, it's not dangerous. The box it comes in, literally the cardboard, is enough to shield you from the radiation in those rocks. Most people don't know that. :D
[10:00] <red9> Gamma and neutron radiation penetrates cardboard as if it weren't there..
[10:00] <iKarith> uranium ore isn't gamma radiation.
[10:00] <red9> What saves you is the intensity.
[10:01] <iKarith> gamma you need like lead or thick metal. alpha and beta radiation are stopped much easier.
[10:01] * hgnoel1980 (~hgnoel198@host213-123-120-65.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:01] <red9> It might be that the ore has granite etc that blocks it.
[10:01] <iKarith> You can get certified to handle this stuff. The government trained me to do it. (The fools!)
[10:01] <k1l0b1t> shbrngdo: never mind, got it working thanks
[10:02] <red9> k1l0b1t, the solution was?
[10:02] <k1l0b1t> red9: cygwin made it work.
[10:02] <red9> just install cygwin + ssh => works?
[10:02] <k1l0b1t> yup
[10:02] <k1l0b1t> wired af
[10:03] <k1l0b1t> but hey, it works ;)
[10:03] <red9> wired af ?
[10:03] <iKarith> They did not know they were training a mad computer scientist with evil plans for a new 8 bit computer revolution! mUAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
[10:03] <iKarith> *ahem* Um, hi. :)
[10:03] <red9> Uranium powered Apple IIc ? ;-)
[10:03] <k1l0b1t> red9: yes, because it didn't work with putty
[10:03] <iKarith> red9: You could build a random number generator for it.
[10:03] <red9> win10?
[10:04] <red9> iKarith, had some thougths on that ;)
[10:04] <k1l0b1t> yes win10, win8.1 putty works fine
[10:04] * iKarith wonders if any Raspberry Pi projects have been built using nuclear materials
[10:04] <iKarith> Hello to our friends in domestic intelligence. In several countries. :)
[10:05] <iKarith> red9: Mostly I'd like to do the random number thing because it'd be cool sometime.
[10:05] <red9> You can exploit nuclear materials at small scale using thermal seeback effect or electron charging effects. Though the first one will require above the critical mass.. :)
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[10:06] <red9> iKarith, Have a look at the vacuum tube in a magnetic field thing.
[10:06] * divx118 (~divx118@D93F170F.cm-20.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[10:07] <iKarith> I have :)
[10:09] * tdy (~tdy@unaffiliated/tdy) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[10:09] <red9> iKarith, What do you think about the feasability to implement eleptic curve crypto on Apple II ?
[10:09] <iKarith> For now though, I'm working on more mundane questions like can I get latched signals on the Apple II bus to be read on the Pi as fast as I can write to it at 1MHz. Logically the answer should be yes.
[10:10] * agajania_ (~agajania@frogn.cs.newpaltz.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:10] <iKarith> Not realistic. Currently. :)
[10:10] * RayS (~raysl@sdf1.xen.prgmr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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[10:10] <red9> iKarith, Try externally triggered DMA.
[10:10] * paulfantom (uid289043@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kzvfpokyedzlqjlq) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[10:10] <red9> (on the Pi)
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[10:11] * d4re- is now known as d4re
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[10:11] <iKarith> red9: probably on the 1MHz side of things, it'll be writing to a latch at a given address in memory. Technically DMA is possible on the Apple side, but I don't want to think about the interfacing required. Only a compute module would have enough pins to interface directly and it can't keep up with serving them running Linux.
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[10:13] <iKarith> red9: We could write code for the bare metal, but I don't know if we want to lose all the drivers we'd lose. I don't even know if you can realistically do anything interesting with the VC4 without Linux
[10:13] <iKarith> framebuffer maybe?
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[10:13] <red9> VC4?
[10:13] <iKarith> I've considered that someday I might want to send 3D graphics to that core from an Apple II. Again because I'm nuts.
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[10:14] <iKarith> Actually, we are thinking we might be able to do magic to pull the Apple's framebuffer in through eg the camera connector using FPGA magic
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[10:14] <iKarith> then you could draw right on top of it
[10:14] <iKarith> That's not my area of skill really.
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[10:15] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, 8-bit revolution did you say? some reckon they never went away ...
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[10:15] <iKarith> Still pie in the sky stuff, but damn it'd be cool
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[10:15] <iKarith> Escape from the Homebrew Computer Club with full 3D acceleration!
[10:15] <red9> Why involve the Apple II at all and just wire all I/O to the Pi?
[10:15] <gordonDrogon> there is a Pi for Apple II board out there...
[10:15] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: it's lame though
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[10:16] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: We're talking about replacing it with something better.
[10:16] <iKarith> the Apple II Pi only connects to the UART
[10:16] <red9> Btw, I think DMA setup can be done from userspace.
[10:16] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, I've never looked in detail... I do have a bunch of Apple II's though.
[10:16] <iKarith> on a Pi 3 it doesn't even provide power
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[10:16] <red9> What's so special about Apple II serial btw that standard routines won't work?
[10:16] <gordonDrogon> red9, technically you need to be root, but yes, dma on the Pi is possible like that.
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[10:16] <iKarith> The Pi 3 sucks more 5v than the Apple II does.
[10:17] <gordonDrogon> red9, it's how pigpio works.
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[10:17] <iKarith> red9: On the IIe, nothing. On the IIc, the handshaking lines are a little strange. On the IIgs nothing unless you wanna use RS-422 mode :)
[10:17] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, of-course there's always graforth for the Apple too :)
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[10:18] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: We want something faster than the UART to connect Pi and A2.
[10:18] <red9> IIgs, use RS-422 for RTS/CTS DSR/DTR too ?
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[10:18] <iKarith> red9: RS-422 only uses those in RS-232 emulation mode
[10:18] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, there are some projects that make the Pi look like a "Tube" processor for the Beeb - it's done in baremetal on the Pi side - ought to be possible to make it act like a parallel peripheral on the II.
[10:18] * Ellied (~ellie@lpc-121-178.lpc-south-classroom.depaul.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[10:19] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: That's kinda what we're looking at
[10:19] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, neat.
[10:19] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: For now we're not that far along.
[10:19] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: Have you stumbled across TiPi for the TI-99/4A?
[10:19] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, wish I had time to look at that stuff, but too much other stuff going on - including a 6502 project of my own...
[10:20] <iKarith> That machine's so slow the interface is quite fast enough running in Python, but it's doing really cool stuff.
[10:20] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, no idea what TiPi is.
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[10:20] <gordonDrogon> I was never into the TI-99 though.
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[10:20] <red9> iKarith, Regarding randomness.. http://noosphere.princeton.edu/
[10:20] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: TiPi lets the TI-99/4A nerd do internet from basic.
[10:20] <iKarith> red9: thanks
[10:21] <iKarith> gordonDrogon: also provides a disk device and other fun stuff.
[10:21] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, er, ok...
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[10:22] <gordonDrogon> iKarith, actually, I looked briefly at how the TI99 does graphics and am making my 6502 system do something similar - ie. separate graphics processor accessed over a parallel bus...
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[10:22] <gordonDrogon> you just can't get the old CRTC chips easily now.
[10:23] <gordonDrogon> (and I didn't want to sacrifice 16KB of my precious 8-bit RAM!)
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[10:23] <gordonDrogon> anyway - gotta go & deliver some bread. back in a few hours.
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[10:26] <red9> I had some funny idea about a IEC-488 based video device for Commodore 64 some days ago. A 6510 + VIC-II + 16 kB of RAM => remote display.. ;-)
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[10:26] <red9> "SAVE "Document",14,1" --> read it on another display or so... ^_)
[10:27] <iKarith> red9: Are you aware of the ZoomFloppy?
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[10:28] <iKarith> red9: I'd like to see something for the Pi that could actually be a proper 1541 emulator, which is something the ZoomFloppy cannot do.
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[10:30] <iKarith> red9: For the Atari 8-bits, we have SIO2PC-USB devices that let a Pi be eight peripherals at once.
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[10:31] <iKarith> Qt GUI—I'd like someday to make that work using framebuffer graphics and a 5" touchscreen on the Pi
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[10:31] <red9> ZoomFloppy is what?
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[10:33] <shbrngdo> 1541 - that was the C-64 disk drive wasn't it? I remember doing assembly language on the disk drive itself. it was actually very well documented in the various C64 ROM books
[10:33] <shbrngdo> but I gave away every C64 thing I had back in the early 90's
[10:33] <shbrngdo> if you can get ahold of those resources you could probably emulate the serial itnerface on an RPi
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[10:34] <shbrngdo> as I recall it was almost like a 2-wire SPI with common I/O on one wire...
[10:34] * agajania_ (~agajania@frogn.cs.newpaltz.edu) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[10:34] <shbrngdo> the 'fast disk' or 'speed disk' or whatever it was made use of that and clocked at a much higher rate
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[10:35] <shbrngdo> and it emulated an IEEE-like sequence to indicate the bus address at the beginning of a packet
[10:35] <shbrngdo> anyway - back to kernel build
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[10:35] <red9> ZoomFloppy seems to be a USB <--> IEEE-488 thing.
[10:36] <red9> CBM-488 that is ;-)
[10:37] <iKarith> USB to IEC actually.
[10:37] <iKarith> well, also IEE-488
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[10:37] <iKarith> but it cannot manage to allow the host machine to emulate a 1541 floppy. Timings aren't exact enough.
[10:37] <red9> shbrngdo, Yeah 1541 = Commodore 64 5,25" floppy 170 kB capacity ~400 bytes/transfers.
[10:38] <iKarith> It can go way faster with the right firmware
[10:38] <red9> yeah 3000 bytes/s or so ;
[10:38] <red9> )
[10:39] <red9> The fastest timing is 20 microseconds hold time per bit.
[10:39] <red9> Should be possible to handle for the Pi..
[10:39] <iKarith> If you have realtime scheduling it is.
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[10:42] <red9> Userspace actually manages 5.9 million I/O operations per second. So it should work without too special things.
[10:43] <red9> Is interrupt-on-change a thing on the Pi ?
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[10:44] <Habbie> red9, not a useful thing
[10:44] <Habbie> red9, the delay is 100 microseconds or worse
[10:44] <red9> ouch..
[10:44] <Habbie> i have some notes here https://github.com/Habbie/hardware-hacks/tree/master/binary-scope
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[10:45] <red9> Is it the kernel or hardware that mess it up? ie would a kernel driver fix it?
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[10:45] <Habbie> red9, i have no idea
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[10:49] <iKarith> red9: most of the problems with Linux on the Pi for realtime response are that you can't guarantee the scheduler will call you often enough.
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[11:00] -mquin- [Global Notice] The CFP for this year's freenode #live is open! If you or your project have something you'd like to tell the world about, head over to https://freenode.live and submit a talk - we'd love to have you on stage. Fancy supporting this year's event? Drop us a line to sponsor@freenode.live and we'll figure something out! See you in Bristol in November!
[11:01] <red9> Seem interrupt-on-change is a thing but that context switches will kill it with a 100 us delay.
[11:02] <red9> What is needed is kernel module or addition that hooks directly into the interrupt table and which will reside in memory not swappable.
[11:03] <red9> The other solution is $2 blue pill (stm32f103) that will do the job externally.
[11:09] <red9> iKarith, Do you know if the IIc and IIe uses GCR and speed zoning on the floppy?
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[11:11] <Hanonim> hi folks !
[11:12] <Hanonim> I've just learned about libgpiod, the new "linux way" of handling gpio, I was wondering if someone got good results on the RPI using this method
[11:12] <red9> sounds like latency-R'-us ;-(
[11:13] <red9> ;-)
[11:16] <Hanonim> I expect it to be slow, but maybe faster than the fs
[11:16] <Hanonim> And it's nice to have a standard way
[11:17] <red9> fs?
[11:17] <Hanonim> file system
[11:17] <Hanonim> sysfs
[11:23] <Ben64> speaking of gpio, do i need to do anything special to flip on a solid state relay? or can i just put gpio in one side, and ground on the other
[11:28] <BurtyB> Ben64, depends on the ssr really
[11:29] <Ben64> how so?
[11:29] <Ben64> i guess my real question is do i need a resistor or anything like that
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[11:36] <IamTrying> https://i.imgur.com/v1SGObt.png - What is this? Do i need to enable/disable anything to use this : http://wiringpi.com/
[11:37] <Ben64> https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=160310
[11:37] <Ben64> first link from google
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[11:38] <IamTrying> I have already : gpio version: 2.44
[11:38] <IamTrying> do i do anything then? https://i.imgur.com/v1SGObt.png
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[11:40] <Ben64> depends if you want to use that
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[11:42] <IamTrying> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Jjz9Mx2436/ - Ben64 my board already gives this output. Do i still need to build this: http://wiringpi.com/download-and-install/
[11:42] <IamTrying> confused.
[11:43] <Ben64> depends what you're trying to accomplish
[11:46] <IamTrying> Ben64: i want to switch on / off pin 1 using BASH
[11:46] <IamTrying> (not use C, C++ like i did in Arduino YUN which cost me to lose lot of time)
[11:48] <IamTrying> `echo "1" > /sys/class/gpio/gpio18/value` will this enable the pin 18?
[11:48] <IamTrying> `echo "0" > /sys/class/gpio/gpio18/value` high/low?
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[11:51] <IamTrying> `#!/bin/bash echo "18" > /sys/class/gpio/export; echo "out" > /sys/class/gpio/gpio18/direction; echo "1" > /sys/class/gpio/gpio18/value;` - that set the pin 18 to high
[11:52] <BurtyB> Ben64, some want 1.7v max 20mA like an LED some want 3-32v some want 4v-32v etc.. lots of them out there
[11:55] <red9> multimeter + datasheet will solve a lot..
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[12:01] <Ben64> BurtyB: mine wants 3-32v, but it's cool to do it without limiting current?
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[12:03] <red9> Ben64, datasheet should tell you about "input current"
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[12:04] <iKarith> red9: the Apple 5.25 format is soft-sectored GCR. No indexing at all.
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[12:04] <iKarith> red9: constant speed on 5.25, on 3.5" there's variable speed
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[12:17] <Ben64> red9: i'm talking about the pi
[12:21] <red9> The Pi can output 16 mA asfaik. So if your device sinks/sources more than that = trouble.
[12:22] <red9> But a 207 ohm in series would prevent any overcurrent.
[12:22] <red9> So the datasheet should be able to tell how much current is needed to switch it.
[12:23] <Ben64> datasheet could be a lie
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[12:26] <bkchr> Hi, is it possible to boot a kernel from the root partition with uboot? (so, the kernel does not need to be copied to /boot)
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[12:28] <mfa298> bkchr: possibly, that would likely depend on u-boot which is a non standard setup on the pi so you might be on your own there
[12:28] <bkchr> hmm okay
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[12:30] <mfa298> it's certainly possible to put u-boot in the middle, but I don't know how restricted it is in terms of where it loads the kernel from.
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[12:41] <red9> bkchr, Check uBoot support for the '/' filesystem.
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[12:55] <bindi> rpi 3 usb shield and gnd are connected together, that can't be good
[12:58] <red9> ground currents R' us! :-)
[13:00] * deww (dc2@unaffiliated/deww) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[13:01] <red9> How is USB shield and GND wired on previous Pi's ?
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[13:03] <bindi> i noticed that my nooelec sdr was tingly on the outside (metallic body)
[13:03] <bindi> that can't be good for RF reception either :)
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[13:11] <bindi> hmm they're supposed to be connected but not directly, some protection inbetween
[13:11] <bindi> but my problem was that my sdr stick was tingly
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[13:13] <red9> bindi, This is why 4 kV isolation of Ethernet is so good..
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[13:41] <Shapeshifter> Hi. I bought a Pi 3 Model B+ and installed archarm. I can't get stereo audio to work. Installed alsa-utils. cat /proc/asound/cards shows --- no soundcards ---
[13:42] <shiftplusone> Shapeshifter: what does your config.txt look like?
[13:44] <Shapeshifter> shiftplusone: https://paste.pound-python.org/show/msEk2i4sSZeScTAAAzlR/
[13:45] <Shapeshifter> I see
[13:45] <Shapeshifter> I need audio=on
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[13:45] <shiftplusone> not sure if it's audio=on or dtparam=audio=on or if they're equivalent.
[13:46] <shiftplusone> Raspbian has dtparam=audio=on, but audio=on might also work.
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[13:50] <Shapeshifter> shiftplusone: it's the former, thanks.
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[13:53] <shiftplusone> np
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[14:58] <Owner> HOLA
[15:00] <darsie> .
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[15:49] <Li> 1) I don't understand what is exactly this command vcgencmd and what is the argument otp_dump
[15:49] * Riyria (~Riyria@s9120518626.blix.com) Quit (Quit: His home wifi router cost more than his car... He is... the most interesting network tech in the world...)
[15:50] <Li> 2) following up this post to boot from mass storage deviec i'm not sure if I'm wrong or it's just meant to add a single line into /boot/config.txt and that is all about it
[15:50] <Li> https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberrypi/bootmodes/msd.md
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[15:50] <Li> if not doing anything for the firmware on rPi then any text editor will do the config.txt
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[15:51] <dan2wik> Li, vcgencmd is a way to talk to the firmware running on the video core and otp_dump is a way to grab all the data in the One Time Programmable memory which is used to store things like Boot options and mac addresses
[15:52] <dan2wik> https://elinux.org/RPI_vcgencmd_usage
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[15:57] <shiftplusone> Li: 2) that's right. You add that line and boot once. Then the bit is set forever and you can take the line out of config.txt
[15:57] <Li> dan2wik: thanks for your the explanation .. however I've checked line 17 and it returns the mentioned value but my rPi isn't booting anything from usb
[15:57] <shiftplusone> if you're on a 3B+, you don't ever need that line.
[15:57] <shiftplusone> Not all USB MSDs are supported
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[15:57] <Li> shiftplusone: OK .. now it's clear .. adding the line to config.txt will change the firmware ... right?
[15:57] <shiftplusone> not the firmware
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[15:58] <Li> some part of it
[15:58] <shiftplusone> it will set a bit within the main chip on the pi
[15:58] <shiftplusone> permanently
[15:58] <Li> now it makes sense
[15:59] <Li> thank you
[15:59] <shiftplusone> it's like blowing a fuse, but without the negative connotations.
[15:59] <gordonDrogon> Ben64, I've used SSRs off a Pi in the past....
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[15:59] <gordonDrogon> Ben64, worked OK, but the 3.3v signal from the Pi is almost at the bottom of the range which is usually 3v to 18v.
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[16:40] <red9> gordonDrogon, Do those SSR tend to leak nasty electrical things back into the i/o pin ?
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[16:54] <cirdan> anyone have any experience with other filesystems for the root? i built an initrd with zfs modules, and zfs works fine as an additional partition but boot it just stopping when i try to make it root. how do i debug this? there's no error
[16:55] <cirdan> boot log is at http://termbin.com/lgnz
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[17:04] <gordonDrogon> red9, no - the inputs are opto isolated.
[17:05] <stiv> iirc, /boot has to be FAT
[17:05] <cirdan> yeah not boot, root
[17:05] <cirdan> boot is fat
[17:05] <gordonDrogon> red9, that gives the input voltage range - basically you're feeding a non-ideal resistor and led combination. at 3.3v from a Pi, I've found that the visible LED in parallel with the internal LED barely comes on.
[17:06] <cirdan> passing init=/bin/sh doesn't seem to do anything as well, so i can poke around
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[17:27] * Alzadoua_ is now known as A-cat
[17:28] <cirdan> stiv: any other ideas?
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[17:29] * tuxiano (~tuxiano@2a02:8070:898a:3500:a3e5:6de3:44b:c0c2) has joined #raspberrypi
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[17:34] * h4ndy (H4ndy@gateway/shell/panicbnc/x-svzvplaiswfpkbnq) has joined #raspberrypi
[17:35] <Li> grep 17 still showing 3020000a before and after adding the line to config.txt, however there is no booting from usb!
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[17:43] <Li> not nice .. the first usb boot is kernel panic not able to mount root
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[17:44] * govg (~govg@unaffiliated/govg) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[17:45] <shauno> I think that's actually a good thing. that's getting somewhere. better than getting nowhere
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[17:57] <FireHopper> hello
[17:58] * r0Oter (~r00ter@p5DDF1C06.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:58] <Tenkawa> greetings
[17:59] <FireHopper> anyone good with programming on the RPI?
[18:00] <Bitweasil> Um.
[18:00] <Bitweasil> I mean.
[18:00] <Bitweasil> It's just a Linux environment, you can do anything from Ruby to assembly on it.
[18:00] * Case77 (~Case77@pool-108-44-22-63.albyny.east.verizon.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:00] <IT_Sean> What specifically do you need help with, FireHopper
[18:01] <FireHopper> yeah but I'm a noob with programming. and I'm not sure the best way to do what I want..
[18:01] * Dave_MMP is now known as djsxxx_away
[18:01] <FireHopper> I have one of those adafruit 64x64 led matrix things, with the adafruit matrix bonnet/hat thing.
[18:02] <IT_Sean> There should be example code for it on the adafruit site. Start there.
[18:02] * dr3w_ (~dr3w_@abercs/dr3w) Quit (Quit: https://media3.giphy.com/media/3oKIPsx2VAYAgEHC12/giphy.gif)
[18:03] <FireHopper> and I'd like to display weather info and a clock on it. but no idea how to go about it. it can be programmed in C(maybe c++) or python, libs.
[18:03] <Bitweasil> The easiest way would be to find someone else's utility that does what you need.
[18:03] * r00ter (~r00ter@p5DDF1C06.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:03] <FireHopper> yeah there is but like I said. noob programming wise.. so no idea on the how.. plus not sure how to get the weather data.
[18:04] <FireHopper> just want forcast image, current temp and time.. thats all I would like to display.
[18:04] <IT_Sean> Well, you should be able to get the weather data from wunderground, download it, and parse it for the bits you need, then insert that data into your screen-display code.
[18:05] <FireHopper> okay, but which language to choose?
[18:05] <IT_Sean> No one here is going to code it for you, FireHopper. You know what you need to do... I suggest looki at the example code that came w/ the display and modifying it to suit your needs
[18:05] <cirdan> perl, python are 2 popular choices
[18:05] <Bitweasil> Don't subject someone new to programming to Perl in 2018. :p
[18:05] <cirdan> both have a special version of hell inside :)
[18:05] <Bitweasil> Do it in Python.
[18:06] <Bitweasil> Or C++.
[18:06] <FireHopper> have python libs and c++ libs
[18:06] <cirdan> eww man you are twisted
[18:06] <cirdan> whitespace is not code.
[18:06] <Bitweasil> Me? Shit, I'm happy when I can come up to C++. I don't touch Python with a long stick.
[18:06] <Bitweasil> I spend my days in C and assembly.
[18:06] <IT_Sean> Bitweasil: language
[18:06] <Owner> Bitweasil: :D
[18:06] <r3> however, python is a popular choice for new programmers and having the library available for the device will go a long way
[18:07] <cirdan> perl is a hardware store where every tool ever made is available to use...
[18:07] <FireHopper> I've done a lil bit of arduino stuff. and some spin, and lots of basic.
[18:07] <Owner> is there a way to use pythons libraries without having to code in python?
[18:07] * dr3w_ (~dr3w_@abercs/dr3w) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:07] <Owner> or do you just go to the c versions....
[18:07] <Owner> like python does
[18:07] <cirdan> anyway. someone make this zfs pool boot for me :-)
[18:07] <Owner> but then you have to code c...
[18:08] * cirdan doesn't understand why the pi just sits there
[18:08] <Owner> cirdan: what does it say?
[18:08] <Bitweasil> cirdan: I've been of the impression ZFS doesn't do an amazing job on small RAM boxes.
[18:08] <Bitweasil> But, yeah, get logs out somehow.
[18:08] <cirdan> it's fine
[18:08] <r3> FireHopper: start with python. There are many, many tutorials for it, including - probably - some from the adafruit site for the device. That would be the best route forward.
[18:08] <cirdan> here's ma logs: http://termbin.com/lgnz
[18:08] <Bitweasil> Does the Pi have a serial console you can redirect dmesg to?
[18:08] <cirdan> yup
[18:08] <cirdan> see above
[18:10] <Owner> anyone know why using the 'sync' mount option on filesystems will make things like wget's fail to download / write properly?
[18:10] <Owner> ext4
[18:10] <Owner> only seen on rpi in my life...
[18:10] * ebsen (~ebsene@2600:1014:b12d:f7b1:8c2d:95da:29cc:5ad8) has joined #raspberrypi
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[18:10] <Owner> its so much slower because of sd card, but i dont think it should cause download problems.......just my opinion
[18:11] <Owner> if you want to try it.... mount -o remount,sync /; wget https://github.com/raspberrypi/linux/archive/raspberrypi-kernel_1.20180328-1.tar.gz
[18:12] <cirdan> great thing about zfs is transparent compression... my 4.6gb sd card only takes 3.6 with lz4 compression enabled. faster to read/write since it's less data
[18:12] <cirdan> also snapshots and all
[18:13] <Owner> abuses bits more though
[18:13] <cirdan> na
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[18:13] <Owner> if its packed in more, then it uses the same bits more
[18:13] <cirdan> why do you think that? just turn atime off
[18:13] <Owner> well maybe you are right
[18:14] <cirdan> ...thats not how compresion works :)
[18:14] <Owner> depends if zfs spreads it out
[18:14] <cirdan> it's copy on write so it writes to a new spot
[18:14] <Owner> oh
[18:14] <Owner> well that helps :D
[18:14] <FireHopper> I have a bunch of tutorials for python from stackskills so that should help I hope.
[18:15] <Owner> cirdan: linux + zfs ?
[18:15] <cirdan> Owner: ?
[18:15] <Owner> you are using zfs with linux on an rpi?
[18:16] <cirdan> this is raspberian, i made an initrd like the instructions said, and it does use it
[18:16] <Owner> ah nice
[18:16] <cirdan> [ 0.158990] Trying to unpack rootfs image as initramfs...
[18:17] <cirdan> If it would drop me into a rescue shell I could maybe figure something out
[18:17] <cirdan> but it doesn't :/
[18:17] <Bitweasil> Why are you using an initrd? Just rebuild the kernel with what you need...
[18:17] <Bitweasil> (I've never had that much luck adding initrds to systems that weren't originally using them)
[18:18] <plugwash> cirdan, I think you may be looking at the wrong console
[18:18] <cirdan> zfs is far easier to use as a module, esp with dkms
[18:18] * jerryq (~jerryq@32.97.110.56) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:18] <cirdan> i'd prefer to not have to track kernel updates on my own, nor build it
[18:19] <plugwash> if you specify more than one console on the kernel command line (e.g. a serial console and local kvm console) then the kernel messages go to all of them but userland stuff only goes to one of them (can't remember if it's the first or the last offhand)
[18:19] <cirdan> hmm I dind't do anything other than use rpi-config
[18:19] * FireHopper (~fireh@24.115.112.187.res-cmts.flt.ptd.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[18:22] <plugwash> Try editing cmdline.txt and swapping "console=ttyS0,115200" with "console=tty1"
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[18:26] <cirdan> yeah i just removed the tty one
[18:26] <cirdan> oh soooo much better thanks plugwash
[18:27] <cirdan> it is booting woot
[18:27] <cirdan> sitting at [ ok ] Starting Avahi mDNS/DNS-SD Daemon: avahi-daemon.
[18:28] * Case77 (~Case77@pool-108-44-22-63.albyny.east.verizon.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
[18:29] * giddles (~giddles@unaffiliated/giddles) Quit (Quit: brb)
[18:30] <cirdan> seems like it's unhappy cause wifi doesn't connect for some reason..
[18:30] * Encrypt (~Encrypt@2a01cb0401d172001082b2374536b8c4.ipv6.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:30] <Owner> i have a question AGAIN
[18:31] <Owner> ttyUSB0 to initrd, and it works when usb to serial is plugged in
[18:31] <Owner> but if it isnt plugged in
[18:31] * Octainne (~Octainne@vpn02.critical.pt) Quit ()
[18:31] <Owner> console gets spammed with the respwning too fast
[18:31] * r00ter (~r00ter@p5DDF1C06.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[18:31] <Owner> anyay to just make it stay there and not spam?
[18:31] <Owner> *inittab not initrd
[18:32] <Owner> id like to not have to uncomment a line in inittab everytime i want to use the serial console, but also if possbile not have the 'console' with the monitor attached getting spammed
[18:33] <cirdan> so it boots. awesome.
[18:33] * cave (~various@h081217094041.dyn.cm.kabsi.at) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:34] <cirdan> just need to see why wifi isn't working
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[18:35] <cirdan> that was much easier than I thought
[18:35] * tommy`` (~UPP@95.235.71.104) Quit (Quit: :::: ( UPP ) ::::)
[18:35] <Owner> agetty doesnt have any silent option...
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[19:46] <Owner> is pi3 big or little endian
[19:48] <baldengineer> run lscpu
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[19:52] <DexDeadly> Having issues when I try to launch a flask app via a service using gunicorn and a virtualenv I'm getting upstream prematurely closed connection while reading response. I can run the app just fine using gunicorn --bind 0.0.0.0:5000 wsgi:simplyfishy within the virtualenv its only when I try to run it via the service through nginx that I get the issue
[19:52] <red9> armv6l - Little Endian
[19:52] * Ivoah (uid49352@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ippnqqanvhifhabm) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[19:53] <cirdan> does it make a difference if you advert the pi as arm8, or will it screw up raspbian?
[19:54] <red9> Asfaik, the ARM architecture has instructions such that it's possible to switch endianess on the fly.
[19:54] <DexDeadly> heres my service file
[19:54] <DexDeadly> https://pastebin.com/2ys5EUmP
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[19:57] <Owner> baldengineer: nice, didnt know that
[19:58] <baldengineer> Owner me either. it was the first google result for "ls pi3 big or little endian"
[19:58] <Owner> :)
[20:00] <cirdan> i do wish the pi had aes accel. i see some new routers do
[20:00] * tomaw_ is now known as tomaw
[20:01] * stivs is now known as stiv
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[20:02] <red9> cirdan, How do you know, you can trust that implementation?
[20:02] <cirdan> by testing the input and output?
[20:04] <red9> That will prevent covert key copies or triggered backdoors?
[20:05] * Singmyr (~singmyr@80.216.49.44) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:05] <cirdan> no
[20:06] <cirdan> do you disable the hw crypto on all your computers?
[20:06] <cirdan> i'd be surprised if you do
[20:08] <red9> Software implementations can be verified more extensivly. Costs more CPU, but backdoored crypto is worthless even if it's efficient hardware.
[20:09] <cirdan> i say again, almost all cpus in the last 10 years have hw crypto. do you disable them all?
[20:09] <red9> cirdan, No need to enable them in the first place.
[20:09] <cirdan> they are
[20:11] * agajania_ (~agajania@frogn.cs.newpaltz.edu) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:11] <cirdan> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AES_instruction_set
[20:12] <Habbie> if you don't trust the hardware, doing the AES in software will do extremely little for you
[20:12] <red9> Habbie, I trust the hardware less.
[20:12] <Habbie> but the software still runs on the hardware
[20:13] <Habbie> you only made it very slightly harder for the hardware to know that you are doing crypto
[20:13] <cirdan> and the hardware pwns *. see the recent problems with intel's ME bugs
[20:13] <red9> Connect the SM interrupt pin to reset pin ;)
[20:14] <red9> (maybe it were SMMODE)
[20:14] <cirdan> actucally you can trick the chip to take a firmware w/o ME if done in a special way but still
[20:14] <cirdan> you're pwnt by bugs everywhere else
[20:15] * Smuckerz is now known as smuckerzz
[20:15] * smuckerzz is now known as SmuckerZzZ
[20:15] <red9> Because perfection can't be accomplished. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to just give up. it's about risk reduction.
[20:16] * SmuckerZzZ is now known as Smuckerz
[20:16] <cirdan> right. we are saying not trusting hardware aes accel doesn't reduce your risk
[20:17] <cirdan> if you trust aes it's fine. if you don't, don't use aes
[20:18] <red9> Using the hardware is like saying "hey, here's my secret key. Copy it now into that undechipherable bitstream."
[20:19] <cirdan> using the software is like saying ""hey, here's my secret key. Copy it now into that undechipherable bitstream."
[20:19] * cstk421 (~cstk421@2600:1700:36d0:1600:ec26:fdbd:ce7f:7c43) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:19] <red9> That source code is scrutinized by many..
[20:19] <cirdan> and $evil_org already knows your secret key by using an OS 0-day
[20:20] <red9> There are of course other tools I have not mentioned.
[20:20] <cirdan> yeah and how many suprt critial bugs does openssl have?
[20:20] * jj- (juutiju@hilla.kapsi.fi) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:20] <cirdan> ever hear of heartbleed?
[20:20] <red9> yes
[20:20] <red9> again, not perfection.
[20:20] <cirdan> or debian's bug caused by an extra ( to basically make all ssh keys the same?
[20:20] <Habbie> i did not say that software aes leaks just as easily as hardware aes
[20:21] <Habbie> i did mean to say that the difference is not that interesting
[20:21] <cirdan> you are worried about a risk that's so small it's almost nonexistant
[20:21] <red9> That is not the current environment.
[20:22] * jj- (juutiju@hilla.kapsi.fi) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:32] * Mr_Keyser_Soze (~Mr_Keyser@c-69-246-32-17.hsd1.la.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:33] <plugwash> As crypto accelerations go acceleration of symetric ciphers is probablly not a good place to put a backdoor
[20:33] <plugwash> because their correct operation is deterministic and their output is the same size as their input
[20:34] <Habbie> yeah so leaking is the only option there
[20:34] <Habbie> 'somehow
[20:34] <Habbie> '
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[20:41] <DexDeadly> Having issues when I try to launch a flask app via a service using gunicorn and a virtualenv I'm getting upstream prematurely closed connection while reading response. I can run the app just fine using gunicorn --bind 0.0.0.0:5000 wsgi:simplyfishy within the virtualenv its only when I try to run it via the service through nginx that I get the issue
[20:42] <DexDeadly> anyone run into this ?
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[20:48] <binaryhermit> Also, if you trust your hardware that little... who knows what's in the binary blobs? Or what's hidden in the software unless you audited it all...</tinfoil_hat>
[20:50] <binaryhermit> I mean, the NSA has code in many Linux distros... (though I'm sure SELinux is heavily audited by people with the skills to do so, if only because of its origins)
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[20:50] * kzisme (~kzisme@unaffiliated/kzisme) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:51] <binaryhermit> anyway...
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[20:57] <Li> how many ways to disable wifi and bluetooth on debian based distros? which one is the right one? including disabling power from wifi and bluetooth
[20:57] * cave (~various@h081217094041.dyn.cm.kabsi.at) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[20:58] * Gachr (~gasher@2a00:23c4:1e39:a00:34f2:8700:fe01:2a8f) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:58] <Gachr> hello, I've failed a bit... I have my Raspberry Pi, but I forgot the ssh user and password for him, and I cannot access the SD card (I don't have uSD to SD adapter). can I do anything?
[20:58] * YuGiOhJCJ (~YuGiOhJCJ@gateway/tor-sasl/yugiohjcj) has joined #raspberrypi
[20:58] <lopta> Gachr: Are you able to log in on the console as root?
[20:59] <shbrngdo> it's 'pi:pi' for raspbian 'out of the box'
[20:59] <shbrngdo> I assume you changed it, though.
[20:59] <Gachr> nope, pi:raspberry nor pi:pi worked
[21:02] <shbrngdo> I'm guessing it boots into a GUI without a password, though, and maybe you can go there to do a password reset. use 'sudo passwd username' <-- that should let you do any user's password
[21:02] <Gachr> good idea, thanks
[21:02] * andrewa (~andrewa@189.204.47.36) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[21:02] <shbrngdo> you'll need monitor + keyboard + mouse of course, and try that command in a console window
[21:02] <leftyfb> shbrngdo: the default password is raspberry, not pi
[21:03] <shbrngdo> it used to be pi:pi as I recall, or maybe that was for something else
[21:03] <Gachr> oh, and I forgot, I don't have a keyboard xD I'm in the middle of moving, and I'll have one next week :v
[21:03] <shbrngdo> I use more than one OS
[21:03] <leftyfb> shbrngdo: negative
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[21:03] <shbrngdo> ok pi:raspberry for Linux then
[21:03] * hazardce_ (~hazardcel@host86-170-34-129.range86-170.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:04] <Gachr> btw, I can access my web server
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[21:09] <Gachr> can I get my Linux distro info from the web server?
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[21:50] <Tenkawa> yay I'll have my first 3+ tonight
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[21:52] <cirdan> hey red9... see this is what I mean, there's so many other things to worry about than and hw aes engine... http://rachelbythebay.com/w/2018/04/05/bangpatch/
[21:52] <cirdan> lots of eyes not seeing
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[22:00] <Apocx> anyone else experiencing crashes on reboot/shutdown with the pi 3+?
[22:00] * JasonCL (~JasonCL@cpe-174-109-154-111.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[22:00] <Ben64> nope
[22:00] <Apocx> tried two different pi 3+ boards and they both do it randomly (not all the time)
[22:01] <Ben64> maybe bad power
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[22:03] <cirdan> man this is slow :-) run-parts: executing /etc/kernel/header_postinst.d/dkms 4.14.30-v7+
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[23:06] <extorr> Has anyone purchased multiple pi zeros from microcenter?
[23:10] * Mikelevel (~MoVeWoRk@unaffiliated/mikelevel) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:10] <Tenkawa> yes
[23:11] * Haxxa (~Harrison@180-150-30-18.NBN.mel.aussiebb.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[23:11] <Tenkawa> curious about their reverse tiered pricing?
[23:13] <larsks> extorr: I have, but mostly by dropping by on my way home and buying one at a time :)
[23:13] * zesterer (~zesterer@cpc138506-newt42-2-0-cust207.19-3.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Quit: zesterer)
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[23:14] <extorr> larsks, do they track you by id or phone?
[23:14] * zesterer (~zesterer@cpc138506-newt42-2-0-cust207.19-3.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:14] <larsks> extorr: neither.
[23:14] * Haxxa (~Harrison@180-150-30-18.NBN.mel.aussiebb.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:14] <larsks> They just won't let you buy more than one at a time at the low price.
[23:14] <extorr> Tenkawa, yes exactly...I bought one for $5 but they say the second one is 10 and the 4th 20 or something awful
[23:14] <larsks> They don't care how many you get over time.
[23:14] <Tenkawa> thats a normal volume policy
[23:15] <Tenkawa> its documented on the site
[23:15] <extorr> larsks, when I was there last and gave them my debit card the register lit up like an xmas tree with my phone number and email and name
[23:15] <extorr> It's not CLARIFIED on the site
[23:15] <larsks> I have always declined to provide my contact information to them.
[23:15] <Tenkawa> yes it is
[23:16] <larsks> extorr: the pricing is listed right there on the website. http://www.microcenter.com/product/486575/zero_w
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[23:16] <larsks> (although I see that singles are now $10. They were $5 last time I looked. Glad I got mine when I did.)
[23:16] <Tenkawa> 1 at $10.00 each
[23:16] <Tenkawa> 2-5 at $14.99 each
[23:16] <Tenkawa> 6+ at $19.99 each
[23:16] * nemesit|znc (~nemesit@2a01:488:66:1000:2ea3:4eeb:0:1) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:16] <Tenkawa> very clearly stated
[23:16] <extorr> Holy fuck they changed!
[23:17] <extorr> It was $5 when I grabbed mine a few weeks ago I swear
[23:17] <Tenkawa> it was a special
[23:17] <larsks> extorr: yeah, that's what I was just saying.
[23:17] <Tenkawa> those can happen
[23:17] <larsks> Tenkawa: It was $5 for quite a while (since December, at least)
[23:18] * zesterer (~zesterer@cpc138506-newt42-2-0-cust207.19-3.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Client Quit)
[23:18] <Tenkawa> larsks: yeah... either way the point was the tiered pricing was documented
[23:18] * zesterer (~zesterer@cpc138506-newt42-2-0-cust207.19-3.cable.virginm.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:18] <Tenkawa> thats what I wanted him//her to know
[23:18] <larsks> The pi zero (no W) was $3.14 for a while. Clever :)
[23:18] <extorr> I still see it as $5 with pickup
[23:18] <JohnyTheSmith> Hey, so i have a php script which among other things will generate an .sh file, so i need to set my pi up to do two things: access the server to make the server run the script and then download the shell file and execute it. Running it once downloaded is obviously rather simple, just have to take care of cron doing that in the right folder or there wont be a file... Both the php script
[23:18] <JohnyTheSmith> and the .sh file could be run or downloaded by anyone,the former outputs only an empty page anyways, its just about the operations it does....
[23:19] <Tenkawa> larsks: wasnt that just during pi week?
[23:19] <larsks> Possibly, yeah.
[23:20] <extorr> larsks my pi zero was $5 when I got it
[23:20] <extorr> Now I just see the non zero for 5
[23:20] <larsks> extorr: I picked up I think 4 Zero W's at the $5 price. Too bad it went back up.
[23:20] <larsks> Although it is costing me a relative fortune in SD cards :).
[23:20] <Tenkawa> they've also made revisions too i noticed
[23:21] <Tenkawa> I checked 2 of my boards today and they had different dates and main chips
[23:21] <Tenkawa> cant wait to get my 3+ tonight
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[23:23] <extorr> yeah even the cases are minimum $5
[23:23] <extorr> What is a 3+
[23:23] <JohnyTheSmith> does the pi come with a text web browser?
[23:24] <JohnyTheSmith> raspbian, rather
[23:24] <Li> downloaded/imaged/booted FreeBSD-armv6-12.0-RPI-B-316181M.img on rPi3 nothing is not happening other than colorful start screen! is the right distro for rPi3?
[23:24] <extorr> Also, this raspberry pi zero WH doesnt have wifi does it? It's on sale mailorder for $13.99 http://www.microcenter.com/product/502843/Zero_WH_-_with_Pre-Soldered_Headers
[23:24] * TheSin (~TheSin@gateway.bluefalls.ca) Quit (Quit: Client exiting)
[23:24] <larsks> JohnyTheSmith: sure, there are several available for installation.
[23:24] * nemesit|znc (~nemesit@2a01:488:66:1000:2ea3:4eeb:0:1) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:25] <larsks> JohnyTheSmith: At least lynx and w3m are available. I suspect they are becoming increasingly less useful these days, but they're there.
[23:25] * Warmy (~Warmy@185.206.224.115) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:25] <Tenkawa> larsks: I still use them a lot
[23:25] <Tenkawa> and links
[23:25] <larsks> Cool.
[23:25] * nsk_nyc (~nsk_nyc@network179-254-host-74.inethn.net) Quit (Quit: My computer has gone to sleep.)
[23:25] * plugwash was pretty sure WH had both wifi and headers
[23:26] <plugwash> the picture on microcenter's site certainly seems to show the wifi chip
[23:26] * Tenkawa is an old geek
[23:26] <extorr> So is a WH for $13.99 a better buy than the W for $9.99 then
[23:26] <larsks> plugwash: yes, the 'W' is for wifi and the 'H' is for headers.
[23:26] <extorr> I was afraid the W may be for "with" lawl
[23:26] <Tenkawa> zero wh has wifi bt and pins
[23:26] <Tenkawa> I have one
[23:27] <Tenkawa> sitting ready for a project
[23:27] * tdy (~tdy@unaffiliated/tdy) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:27] <extorr> So the non header one can still be made to work on the same projects but needs soldering?
[23:27] <larsks> Right.
[23:27] <larsks> Just solder on a header.
[23:28] <larsks> The WH is just saving you some work.
[23:28] * Li (~fwz@unaffiliated/li) has left #raspberrypi
[23:28] <Tenkawa> https://www.adafruit.com/product/3708?gclid=Cj0KCQjwkpfWBRDZARIsAAfeXaroQvb4g2BCv2u3tI1berC0yGAK_5mihYA4WozMyj5kHv9SVv_T_fAaAreJEALw_wcB
[23:28] <Tenkawa> theres the details
[23:29] * hazardcell (hazardcell@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/hazardcell) Quit ()
[23:29] <extorr> I would think they perhaps sold a Male to Male header adapter that just seats into the header holes
[23:30] * nsk_nyc (~nsk_nyc@network179-254-host-74.inethn.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:31] <extorr> Wait hold on a second. If I go and grab 1 pi zero with camera, 1 pi zero w with no headers and one pi zero with headers then technically I can buy all three of them at the reduced QTY 1 price ya?
[23:32] <extorr> For $2.99 they seem to have a wifi and blootoof addon board also: http://www.microcenter.com/product/467737/IoT_pHAT_for_Raspberry_Pi
[23:34] * Karyon (~Karyon@unaffiliated/karyon) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:39] <JohnyTheSmith> larsks thanks, yeah to actualy read anything online its useless. I just want it to regularly access a certain .php script so that will regularly be executed on the remote server.
[23:39] <larsks> JohnyTheSmith: maybe just use curl?
[23:39] <Tenkawa> bbl...need a rebooto
[23:39] * Tenkawa (~na@unaffiliated/tenkawa) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[23:40] <JohnyTheSmith> larsks maybe... will look into that
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[23:42] * MacGeek (~BSD@host188-232-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[23:43] * immibis (~chatzilla@222-155-160-32-fibre.bb.spark.co.nz) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[23:44] * purplex88 (~purplex88@unaffiliated/purplex88) Quit (Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com))
[23:44] <JohnyTheSmith> larsks yeah
[23:48] * Chinesium (~ER_nesto@unaffiliated/funk) Quit (Quit: I probably fell asleep again)
[23:48] * Ilyas (uid43013@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iharyeopufcidvza) has joined #raspberrypi
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[23:48] <extorr> Is there no cheap way to run like 4 or 5 pi zeros without buying an outrageously expensive plastic case for each?
[23:49] <extorr> Surely someone must have 3D printer plans for an enclosure that can stack multuple zeros which I can print at a library? *crosses fingers*
[23:50] <JohnyTheSmith> libraries have 3D printers now?
[23:50] <Ben64> some
[23:50] * stiv (~steve@blender/coder/stivs) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[23:50] * migul (~mig@pdpc/supporter/student/migul) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[23:50] <Ben64> extorr: and theres tons of cases on thingiverse
[23:51] <extorr> mmm lemme check out this thingiverse site
[23:51] <JohnyTheSmith> Mine is just laying on the table or maybe hanging a bit due to rigidity of cables... Not like that poses a problem as long as you arent spilling liquids or filing metal on that table
[23:51] <extorr> I am shocked that the zero does not support androidOs by virtue of being too weak! https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=198924
[23:51] <Ben64> extorr: never heard of thingiverse?
[23:52] * JasonCL (~JasonCL@cpe-174-109-154-111.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:52] <extorr> Nope...never seen or used a 3D printer either but hopefully my city may have one for free at a uni or public library
[23:52] <Ben64> cool
[23:53] <Ben64> they're really useful, but be prepared for long print times
[23:53] <extorr> Long as in 30 minutes?
[23:53] * JasonCL (~JasonCL@cpe-174-109-154-111.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[23:53] <extorr> They print with rubberized plastic compounds I take it, ya?
[23:53] <Ben64> hours depending on size
[23:54] <Ben64> usually PLA, a hard corn based plastic
[23:55] <extorr> Do copyshops rent 3D printers too? Hopefully at a decent price
[23:56] * hamitron (~hamitron@212.159.76.90) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:56] <Ben64> rent?
[23:56] * ConkyAxis (~ConkyAxis@cpc82865-enfi22-2-0-cust482.20-2.cable.virginm.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[23:56] <Ben64> your best bet is either a library or a makerspace
[23:57] <extorr> yeah back in the old days you used to have places like kinkos where they had copy machines for rent where people made xerox copies of paper documents in colour and black and white for a price.
[23:57] <extorr> I would think someone may have tried the same business model again recently
[23:59] <Ben64> i wouldn't call that renting
[23:59] * Voop (~bob@c-73-178-90-123.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:59] <extorr> Ahh they're called Fedex Kinko's now: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FedEx_Office

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