#raspberrypi IRC Log


IRC Log for 2018-04-19

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:02] * tvm (~tvm@router-sever1-nat-m.pilsfree.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[0:02] * Li (~fwz@unaffiliated/li) has joined #raspberrypi
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[0:04] <Li> ok, I made my first gpio command .. gpio mode 7 out; gpio write 7 1 and it worked like a charm. the second was the same for pin 40 it didn't work then I tested on all other possible pins they're not working.. can anyone tell me what I'm missing here?
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[0:10] <wonderer> how do i make an nfs permanent on my /etc/fstab tab?
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[0:13] <stiv> Li, pin layout confusion?
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[0:22] <blu_> hi guys. I will leave the EU for some travelling soon and I don't want to pay roaming cost for incoming calls. I thought that I use a raspberry PI and have it connect to my phone provider via SIP. Then I also want to attach a UMTS stick with a sim card to it which can be used to do phone calls via AT commands. Then if a call comes in, I want to forward from SIP to the SIM, which dials to the sim I carry in my mobile (did I make myself clear?).
[0:22] <blu_> Is there any similar project to this or do I need to code this myself?
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[0:23] <Choscura> blu_, I've seen things like this but not on a raspberry pi...
[0:23] * stiv (~steve@blender/coder/stivs) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[0:23] * stivs is now known as stiv
[0:23] <blu_> Choscura, I would prefer a raspi, but I assume one could write an android app too. I'm looking for anything similar atm
[0:24] <Choscura> actually, around 2012-13 I worked in a call center calling the UK and had an outgoing UK number from Bridgend, but I was in Thailand
[0:24] <Choscura> so I know it can be done
[0:24] <Choscura> but, it will increase the delay
[0:25] <Choscura> honestly, in your situation, I might seriously just use the raspi for encrypted com forwarding so that secure communication remains possible, and just use an android app like skype or facebook messenger to do the calls instead of on roaming networks
[0:25] <Choscura> the facebook messenger voice memo thing is fucking amazing as a tool to replace phone calls with
[0:25] * Psybur_ (~Psybur@unaffiliated/psybur) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:25] <Choscura> oh! sorry!
[0:25] * timofonic (~timofonic@unaffiliated/timofonic) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[0:25] <Choscura> I has a potty mouth and I keep mistaking this as a room with grownups in it
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[0:26] * Choscura is now known as Jew_Zeus
[0:26] <blu_> well thats sip only. I can use sip on my android phone whenever I have internet. But I only want to have GSM and still be reachable on my number
[0:27] <blu_> guys.. If I want to use fb for voicecalls, I wouldnt be asking here.
[0:27] <Jew_Zeus> well, that's going to incur the roaming charge itself that you're trying to avoid
[0:27] <blu_> ;)
[0:27] <Jew_Zeus> lol
[0:28] <blu_> Jew_Zeus, no. What I want is somebody -calling-> sipgate -> raspberry PI -> UMTS modem with local country sim -> my phone with local country sim
[0:28] <Jew_Zeus> aah, gotcha
[0:28] <ebarch> Jew_Zeus: not sure if it would do what you want. but Google Voice will forward incoming calls to Hangouts over data
[0:28] <Jew_Zeus> I thought you wanted to forward an IP call to your normal number over the pi to your new country
[0:28] <ebarch> or to a different number
[0:29] <Jew_Zeus> ebarch++
[0:29] * phil42 (~phil42@c-76-125-104-228.hsd1.ar.comcast.net) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:29] <ebarch> whoops, didn't mean to reply to you :P
[0:29] <Jew_Zeus> that's functionally the same as the facebook calls thing
[0:29] <Jew_Zeus> as is skype
[0:29] <ebarch> that was meant for blu_
[0:29] * Psybur (~Psybur@unaffiliated/psybur) Quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
[0:29] <Jew_Zeus> eh, no worries, lol. same convo.
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[0:30] <blu_> I dont care about google or fb. I have a number with sipgate for our company. that needs to be forwarded
[0:30] <blu_> I dont want to go away from sipgate
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[0:30] <Jew_Zeus> then the IP call thing works for that, blu_
[0:30] <ebarch> blu_: Twilio could be another option (a la https://support.twilio.com/hc/en-us/articles/223179908-Setting-Up-Call-Forwarding)
[0:30] <blu_> I dont have internet on my phone when receiving the call
[0:30] <Jew_Zeus> and, it's probably the best and easiest solution, and with an enterprise account with google, you can do your own encryption, I think
[0:31] <ebarch> hmm. GVoice should work without data
[0:31] <blu_> when I use call forwarding I will pay roaming charges
[0:31] <blu_> hence I want to accept the call at a device which has a sim local to the country I'm in
[0:31] <blu_> via SIP - and then use the sim to forward to another SIM
[0:31] <Jew_Zeus> Basically, you're not going to escape some kind of roaming charge, and you have only to choose the best of the options for this.
[0:31] <Jew_Zeus> I think gvoice, fb messenger, or skype are probably the best sort of bet for this
[0:32] <Jew_Zeus> and this is widely used by companies everywhere dealing with international travel
[0:32] <Jew_Zeus> as are things like qq/sanuk and so on
[0:33] * Ceber (~cerberus@dslb-002-203-012-250.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:33] <blu_> again what I want to do. Somebody calls me at my german number. This number is managed by sipgate, and I can use a VOIP capable phone to accept the calls. Hence, I can use sip software on, say, a raspi to accept the call. On this raspi, there is a UMTS stick which is capable of doing voice calls (via AT commands). When a SIP call is incoming on the raspi (via the internet), I want the call to be "forwarded" to the UMTS stick - which then calls
[0:33] <blu_> my mobile, which also has a SIM local to the country. This way there is no roaming charge
[0:33] <blu_> I know this works, as I can program it. I just want to know if this already exists so I dont have to code it myself
[0:33] <Jew_Zeus> so you have a competitive marketplace to choose from, or your described thing could be customers call -> pi phone sipgate -> international call to your roaming disposable number
[0:33] <blu_> no roaming
[0:33] <blu_> lol :D
[0:34] <Jew_Zeus> well, that sipgate to you has to go over your non-data network
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[0:34] <Jew_Zeus> so that's what I'm calling your "roaming charge"
[0:34] * Gathis (~TheBlack@unaffiliated/gathis) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[0:35] <blu_> sipgate is EU, and I am lets say in africa. Then in africa there is the raspi attached to the internet, which accepts the call. There is no extra charge for acceping calls via the internet
[0:35] <blu_> the raspi then has a UMTS stick (GSM Modem), which it uses to call my phone. When I pick up, it will "forward" the call - maybe forward is the wrong word. It will keep SIP connection open of course and just relay voice from both ends
[0:35] * Johnjay (26780a63@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[0:36] <blu_> acting as a gateway of a sort
[0:36] <blu_> is there software that does this already :) ?
[0:36] <Jew_Zeus> hmm
[0:36] <Jew_Zeus> yes, google voice, fb messenger, skype
[0:36] <blu_> your kidding me right? :D
[0:36] <blu_> hahahah
[0:36] <Jew_Zeus> but I don't have an open source thing that does this to point you to
[0:36] <blu_> :P
[0:37] <Jew_Zeus> I'm not kidding, that's doable, particularly skype in your description
[0:37] <blu_> well I suppose skype has "endpoints" that route to GSM in every country
[0:37] <blu_> but, as said, my company has sipgate, and I cant go away from sipgate
[0:37] <blu_> and on the phone I carry I dont have internet, so I cant accept calls from skype or similar - it only has GSM
[0:37] <Jew_Zeus> my dad's business has done this so he could get calls that went to a number that had been his number that was set up with skype so it forwarded to whoever's phone was available in the company
[0:38] <Jew_Zeus> I'm not exactly sure on the specifics, but he did this with skype like 10 years ago
[0:38] <Jew_Zeus> "VOIP" is one of the things to look up on this topic
[0:39] <Jew_Zeus> and, this is an area of research of mine, I do understand the problem (und wir kann uber dieser idearen beraten, wenn sie wilst), even in the context of, eg, third world africa
[0:40] <blu_> this: https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-gsm-gateway/ is getting close, but I want only one raspi as incoming calls come from SIP
[0:40] <blu_> not from GSM
[0:40] <Jew_Zeus> well, that's the gateway to bridge, then
[0:41] <blu_> I'm not sure if I get the wording correctly, but imagine this:
[0:42] <Jew_Zeus> I think I understand. customer -> german number -> pi in germany forwarding over net to you in africa -> pi in africa with GSM makes call to -> your local african number and connects line
[0:42] <blu_> (german person via any phone, mobile or whatever) -> calling my number -> raspberry pi connected to SIP in africa -> forwards to africa GSM network by using a GSM modem -> my mobile in africa rings
[0:42] <blu_> nah, the pi is in africa
[0:42] <Jew_Zeus> hmm
[0:42] <blu_> and it has a GSM modem with africa sim, so there wont be any roaming charges
[0:42] <Jew_Zeus> well, VOIP with skype works in that case
[0:42] * slystone (~slystone@unaffiliated/slystone) has joined #raspberrypi
[0:43] <blu_> dude, forget skype please :D
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[0:43] <Jew_Zeus> lol
[0:43] <blu_> I can use a android with a sim client in africa for free
[0:43] <blu_> THATS the point! VOIP is free everywhere in the world
[0:43] <blu_> BUT I want to be reachable via GSM
[0:43] <Jew_Zeus> you want me to forget skype, but keep the shitbox that is android? wut lol
[0:43] <blu_> android is just an example for a sip phone
[0:43] <blu_> sip / voip phone
[0:43] <blu_> the android is the sip phone in my example
[0:43] * Warmy (~Warmy@ Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[0:44] <Jew_Zeus> well, there's a pi phone
[0:44] <blu_> or think with skype, it doesn't matter. skype, sipgate, google.. whoever provides phone numbers
[0:44] <Jew_Zeus> and I've got developments on that in the works, for Uganda actually, as it happens
[0:44] <Jew_Zeus> I'm not on the best of terms with the mostly Christian Burmese refugees in Thailand I knew, lol
[0:45] * Jew_Zeus is the annoying sort of atheist as a result of a little *too much* bible study
[0:46] * Jew_Zeus is now known as Choscura
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[0:47] <Choscura> I gotta go AFK
[0:49] <Choscura> blu_, there's a #raspberrypi_NSFW that fricken taleren are allowed in, pi weapons and sex toys are regular topics of discussion
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[0:50] <blu_> lol
[0:50] <blu_> gr8
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[1:11] <john_rambo> Hi, My time is wrong ... How to configure NTP ?
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[1:19] <BurtyB> john_rambo, I think that feature has been borged into systemd these days :/
[1:19] * Alzadoua_ (~Alzadoua@unaffiliated/alzadoua) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:19] <ebarch> john_rambo: take a look at https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/systemd-timesyncd
[1:20] * kamyl (~user@unaffiliated/kamyl) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[1:20] <ebarch> BurtyB is correct -- it's now a part of systemd / timesyncd
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[1:21] <john_rambo> Okay /Thanks
[1:21] <ebarch> in the current release of raspbian, NTP _is_ enabled by default
[1:22] <john_rambo> ebarch, How do I configure it ?
[1:23] <ebarch> are you using raspbian? if so, it should already be configured. if not, take a look at the "Configuration" heading on that page
[1:23] <john_rambo> Okay
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[1:41] <ttgg> Hello, what is the best approach to enabling auto-root login on a raspbian build? (root login with no user input, upon boot)
[1:43] * dr3w_ (~dr3w_@abercs/dr3w) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:43] <ebarch> ttgg: that's a bit dangerous. why do you need root?
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[1:45] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: to what end
[1:45] <ttgg> Bandwidth and overhead reasons, a separate user account will require more random read access. My project necessitates all possible minimization of random data access, for maximum possible throughput. (Bus speeds are low, memory is relatively low. Need to capitalize on available resources.)
[1:45] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: you're better off telling us what you want to achieve overall
[1:45] <HrdwrBoB> er, that seems like you're prematurely optimising
[1:45] * energizer (~energizer@unaffiliated/energizer) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[1:46] <HrdwrBoB> if you're that close to the wire, you're probably doing it wrong
[1:46] <ttgg> I need it due to hardware limitations. There is no scenario where a standard user requires less random read access, than root, as far as I have read so far.
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[1:46] <ebarch> ttgg: what have you read? got any sources you can link? read access to what?
[1:47] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: yes, I am talking about using different hardware
[1:47] <HrdwrBoB> also what is the user DOING
[1:47] <HrdwrBoB> in cases where something is like that, surely it should be a service
[1:47] <ttgg> I'm in dev-storm mode. I have read waaaaay too much info, to isolate the exact source for what I have read. I mean, I read the full breakout manual for systemctl today. I'm a little fried from that.
[1:48] <HrdwrBoB> I feel like you've scipped to the end
[1:48] <HrdwrBoB> and you're so deep in it you need to pull back
[1:48] <ebarch> yup. what exactly are you trying to optimize?
[1:48] <ttgg> That part of this project, is unfortunately, proprietary and not something I can disclose at this time.
[1:49] <ebarch> we likely won't be able to help then
[1:49] <ttgg> Yeah, I agree with you on that.
[1:49] * Psybur_ (~Psybur@unaffiliated/psybur) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[1:49] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: I would suggest that you are prematurely optimising
[1:50] <ebarch> i'd agree with HrdwrBoB. if you're cutting resources that close. you may need to reevaluate the hardware you're using. RPi is a very open community
[1:50] <HrdwrBoB> or you have the wrong fit for hardware and/or software
[1:50] * timofonic (~timofonic@unaffiliated/timofonic) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:51] <ebarch> there are plenty of similarly priced boards with better performance (but with less community support)
[1:51] <ttgg> You would be 100% correct BoB, but the proprietary part of this, alleviates the hardware limitation, to a point. Software limitations are still a possibility, and the only thing I am tweaking with right now.
[1:51] * semeion (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) has joined #raspberrypi
[1:52] <ttgg> Odroid's max model is far more powerful than my needs, but raspberry pi, seems just barely below my needs. Thus, my "optimization" at this point.
[1:52] <HrdwrBoB> haha
[1:52] <ebarch> aren't they only a few dollars difference in price?
[1:52] <ttgg> Since I'm building a testing prototype. The goal is to be as cost efficient as possible. I have to use more than one pi for this, and I can't really justify the cost difference with two Odroids, in this case.
[1:52] <HrdwrBoB> build it with the pi in a sensible way
[1:53] <HrdwrBoB> if it's not fast enough
[1:53] <ttgg> $70+ Roughly double pi
[1:53] <HrdwrBoB> revisit.
[1:53] <HrdwrBoB> and your time is worth roughly $0?
[1:53] <ttgg> This project is currently my job, so yes. The time is irrelevant.
[1:53] <HrdwrBoB> because I can tell you you've already burned through the cost difference farting about withi t
[1:54] <ttgg> I already had a familiarity with the pi. Odroid would have required me to learn more information.
[1:55] <ttgg> Time isn't money, but speed is preferable for me on this project. I have to build a unit, so I can make sure the proprietary idea can be patented.
[1:55] <ttgg> Don't want to get beaten to that.
[1:55] <ttgg> (Not using pi directly for commercial purposes, just in-house testing to validate the idea.)
[1:55] <CoJaBo> Never optimize a prototype
[1:56] <HrdwrBoB> ^^
[1:56] <Johnjay> anybody know what happened to the open firmware project?
[1:56] <Johnjay> last update is a year ago
[1:56] <Johnjay> https://github.com/christinaa/rpi-open-firmware
[1:56] <stiv> yeah. better to buy options
[1:56] <ebarch> although I'm sure there's a way to accomplish what you're after, I'd highly recommend against a solution that involves auto-logging in as root. i've seen far too many projects that are "proofs of concept only" that end up shipping as finalized products
[1:56] * Li (~fwz@unaffiliated/li) Quit (Quit: leaving)
[1:57] <ebarch> as soon as management sees it working, they expect it to ship ASAP
[1:57] <ttgg> I have full control of the design-to-implementation phase. This tester won't influence the final product.
[1:57] <ebarch> IMO you'd be better off overclocking
[1:58] <ttgg> Can I overclock the board bus speeds?
[1:58] <ttgg> If that's a no, not sure about that.
[1:58] <ttgg> I'm bottlenecking the bus at this moment.
[1:58] <ebarch> what are you optimizing for? which bus?
[1:59] <ttgg> fairly certain whatever the gpio is on, but let me double check that
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[2:00] <ttgg> BCM chip and USB, rather
[2:00] <ebarch> what language are you using? with Python, you're going to max out around 70 kHz GPIO switching rate. with C, you'll get closer to 5.4 MHz
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[2:00] <ebarch> http://codeandlife.com/2012/07/03/benchmarking-raspberry-pi-gpio-speed/
[2:01] <HrdwrBoB> and if you're using a pi other than a 3
[2:01] <HrdwrBoB> .... upgrade
[2:01] * semeion (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) Quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1)
[2:01] <ttgg> Was wrong about gpio probably, after looking back over it. It's the BCM/USB paths
[2:01] <ttgg> 3 model b+
[2:02] <ebarch> so you're trying to avoid context switching in the OS?
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[2:04] <ttgg> I believe that is a correct statement ebarch
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[2:04] <ttgg> Do you know a solution?
[2:04] <ebarch> writing a kernel module tbh
[2:04] <ttgg> Does that require me to do a re-compile?
[2:05] <HrdwrBoB> no
[2:05] <ebarch> nope
[2:05] <HrdwrBoB> you can just add a module
[2:05] <ttgg> kk, thanks
[2:05] <HrdwrBoB> that's the point :)
[2:05] <ttgg> That's probably what I need
[2:05] <ebarch> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/240390/linux-permissions-uid-0-vs-ring-0
[2:05] <ebarch> "However code running in a process is still bound by the limitations of the processor's user mode: every access to a peripheral (including disks, network, etc.) still has to go via a system call"
[2:05] * slystone (~slystone@unaffiliated/slystone) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[2:06] <ebarch> hence, why running under root probably won't do much ;)
[2:06] <ttgg> Sorry my *nix/bsd file system knowledge is rusty. Been 5 years since redhat training and 3 years since I used any flavor of non-windows distro in a work environment.
[2:07] <ttgg> I dual boot at home, but I don't normally work on a project with these requirements.
[2:07] <ebarch> no worries. but it's quite difficult for us to provide good advice without a proper understanding of what you're trying to do :P
[2:07] * ttgg remembers a piece of RHCSA training
[2:07] <ttgg> can I just belch out the necessary command via a cron job at boot?
[2:08] <HrdwrBoB> er
[2:08] <HrdwrBoB> you mean A SERVICE
[2:08] * ttgg might be mixing up what cron is for in my head lol
[2:08] <HrdwrBoB> like I said first up
[2:08] <HrdwrBoB> cron is for scheduling
[2:08] <ttgg> So, can I make a service that just executes other services?
[2:08] <ttgg> Like service sym links?
[2:08] <ttgg> or something along that line of thought?
[2:08] <ebarch> systemd allows you to define targets
[2:09] <ebarch> you can use that to fire up additional services
[2:09] <ebarch> systemd isn't cron. it's the init system that brings up all the services on the system during boot
[2:09] <ttgg> alright, maybe I don't need root after all, module overhead is baby sized
[2:09] <ttgg> isn't systemd deprecated? 'systemctl' ?
[2:09] <HrdwrBoB> ...
[2:09] <ebarch> and if you implement a module, you just add it to /etc/modules
[2:09] <ttgg> I thought there was a move for systemctl, in place of systemd?
[2:10] <ebarch> ttgg: nope. systemd is the way of debian now
[2:10] <ebarch> systemctl controls systemd
[2:10] <ebarch> it's the CLI you use to interface with it
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[2:10] <ebarch> init.d was the older init system
[2:10] <ttgg> systemd is systemctl then, by way of proxy. extra layer possibly? but safer than root by a lot. Thanks
[2:11] <HrdwrBoB> not really proxy
[2:11] <ttgg> it's just no the only thing systemctl is for
[2:11] <ebarch> systemd is PID 1! it's the first process that starts after the kernel :P
[2:11] <ttgg> Oh nice!
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[2:11] <ebarch> systemd then brings up everything else
[2:11] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: you can still run stuff as root under systemd
[2:11] <HrdwrBoB> but it starts services
[2:11] <ttgg> Yeah, that would probably approach 0.00001 seconds the speed difference for direct root login. But that definitely sounds safer.
[2:12] <ebarch> ttgg: https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/linux/usage/systemd.md
[2:12] <ebarch> that shows you how to write a unit file (to create a service)
[2:12] <ttgg> so, systemd triggers, starts up the services I want, with appropriate access, and I can just make the auto-login a standard account, non-root ?
[2:12] <ttgg> Is this correct?
[2:12] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: you are confused again
[2:12] <HrdwrBoB> 'autologin'
[2:12] <ebarch> auto-login has nothing to do with systemd per se
[2:12] <ttgg> Oooooh
[2:12] <HrdwrBoB> it just RUNS STUFF.
[2:12] <ttgg> you're right
[2:13] <ttgg> services execute regardless of login status???
[2:13] <ttgg> correct?
[2:13] <ebarch> in fact, you can entirely disable the GUI and systemd still runs
[2:13] <HrdwrBoB> yes
[2:13] <ttgg> NICE!
[2:13] <HrdwrBoB> but 'login' is a fairly abstract concept anyway
[2:13] <ebarch> no login required for systemd to work
[2:13] <ttgg> <3 Thank you for talking sense into me.
[2:13] <HrdwrBoB> depending on how you're managing it
[2:13] <ttgg> I get it
[2:13] <ebarch> and by login, I mean TTY
[2:13] <ttgg> Yep, that is fantastic advice guys, thanks! <3
[2:14] <ebarch> =)
[2:14] <HrdwrBoB> now
[2:14] <HrdwrBoB> come and work on my dash project
[2:14] <HrdwrBoB> I don't have time
[2:14] <ttgg> lol what's it about?
[2:15] <HrdwrBoB> I have an arduino that's on the car CANBUS and has a bunch of sensors and runs the gauges in the dash
[2:15] <ebarch> ooh. I just worked on a CAN project using Teensy boards
[2:15] <HrdwrBoB> and I have an rpbi that I need to put on theCANBUS and recieve the data from the arduino, as well as the car sensors, and work a 7" diplsya as well as a small RGD OLED display
[2:16] <ttgg> Why the smaller OLED?
[2:16] <HrdwrBoB> it's integrated into the dash cluster
[2:16] <ttgg> gotcha, so you want to use it, since it's there
[2:16] <HrdwrBoB> well no
[2:16] <ebarch> HrdwrBoB: you using something like http://copperhilltech.com/pican-2-can-interface-for-raspberry-pi-2-3/ ?
[2:16] <HrdwrBoB> I put it there
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[2:16] <ttgg> oooh
[2:16] <HrdwrBoB> ebarch: I have an SPI can device I just need to set it up
[2:17] <ebarch> ah, gotcha
[2:17] <ebarch> i've had good luck with that HAT
[2:17] <HrdwrBoB> https://imgur.com/tUubHI1 https://imgur.com/QMQGfX3 pi installation
[2:17] <ttgg> Does the car have it's default computer handling anything? Or are you replacing the on-board stock computer, 100%?
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[2:18] <HrdwrBoB> https://i.imgur.com/OexBSTB.jpg?1 OLED display
[2:18] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: are you insane?
[2:18] <HrdwrBoB> this is purely for reporting/etc
[2:18] * ShapeShifter499 (~ShapeShif@unaffiliated/shapeshifter499) Quit (Max SendQ exceeded)
[2:18] <ebarch> that's awesome
[2:18] <ttgg> >are you insane
[2:18] <ttgg> probably
[2:18] <ttgg> I've modified my own vehicle some.
[2:18] <HrdwrBoB> https://i.imgur.com/r3PrBNp.jpg Replaced the steppers with GM steppers driven from the pi
[2:19] <HrdwrBoB> https://i.imgur.com/g6BPbvs.gifv startup sequence
[2:19] <HrdwrBoB> https://i.imgur.com/eMHbuiD.jpg another test point a long time ago
[2:20] <ttgg> It's a 97 jeep grand cherokee. I swapped in a new fuel rail and replaced all the injectors with injectors from a Mercedes XD I gained like 3-4 mpg from that. Stock is like 19/21 I'm up to 21.5/24~
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[2:21] <HrdwrBoB> https://imgur.com/a/8thp1 that's the car
[2:21] <HrdwrBoB> I replaced the engine/gearbox/suspension/bushes/interior/etc/etc
[2:21] <ebarch> (this is why I love hanging out here)
[2:21] <swift110> hey all
[2:21] <ttgg> long time no ping, swift
[2:22] <HrdwrBoB> TLDR: I don't know how to limit scope on a project
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[2:22] <ebarch> the secret is to outlive your manager
[2:22] <HrdwrBoB> https://imgur.com/a/TO7eu I had this. I owned it. I integrated it.
[2:22] <HrdwrBoB> then I'm like.. no fuck that I can make a better one!
[2:23] <ttgg> ooooh! Do you have sensor on the battery, and/or the alternator?
[2:23] <HrdwrBoB> fast forward like.. 2 years? project scope has expanded, doesn't even work :)
[2:23] <HrdwrBoB> ttgg: why would you need one?
[2:23] <HrdwrBoB> I just have a voltage divider on the 12V input to the buck converter, then it goes to an analog input
[2:23] <HrdwrBoB> "12V"
[2:23] <ttgg> Well, a failure from either of those, will look somewhat like the other.
[2:24] <ttgg> If you had a sensor for each, you would know which died/is dying
[2:24] <HrdwrBoB> that seems like ridiculous overkill
[2:24] <HrdwrBoB> and that's coming from me
[2:24] <ttgg> You could just measure drop voltage across them. I could build that with stuff from walmart, probably.
[2:24] <HrdwrBoB> yes...
[2:24] <HrdwrBoB> but to what end?
[2:25] <ttgg> ^ I raise you that same question, to what you've done so far.
[2:25] <HrdwrBoB> if your voltage is down, check them. it takes 3 minutes.
[2:25] <HrdwrBoB> if one of them is broken you need to fix it anyway
[2:26] <HrdwrBoB> plus, as a rule, it's the battery.
[2:26] <ttgg> Well, I'd like to know from the comfort of my driver seat. :p
[2:26] <HrdwrBoB> yeah but I'm under the bonnet basically every week
[2:26] <ttgg> only a personal project? not commercial?
[2:26] <HrdwrBoB> yeah absolutely
[2:27] <HrdwrBoB> I could commercialise dash modification but it would be super expensive and not worth it
[2:27] * v01d4lph4 (~silent_fr@ Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[2:27] <ttgg> If you did it for someone else, it would be a nice feature. But I understand if you wouldn't need it for yourself.
[2:27] <HrdwrBoB> my dash cluster is a custom design I made
[2:27] <HrdwrBoB> it wouldn't
[2:27] <HrdwrBoB> it's a total waste of time
[2:27] <HrdwrBoB> it's not implemented in any car I have ever seen OR heard of
[2:27] <ttgg> Right
[2:27] <HrdwrBoB> all you need to know is the voltage
[2:28] <ttgg> Well, all I need to do, to know I have a flat, is look at my tires.
[2:28] <ttgg> car companies are putting tire sensors into their dashes anyway
[2:28] <HrdwrBoB> not the same
[2:28] <HrdwrBoB> the TPMS doesn't tell you if it's worn out
[2:28] <HrdwrBoB> or if it has a nail
[2:28] <HrdwrBoB> it just says low pressure
[2:28] <HrdwrBoB> same with a voltage low warning
[2:29] <HrdwrBoB> because maybe the voltage low issue is the wiring is literally on fire
[2:29] <HrdwrBoB> ok work
[2:29] <ttgg> Well, checking alternator voltage, in technicality, would give you a lot more information than a tire pressure sensor.
[2:30] <ttgg> What if your distributor, or a spark plug connector is messed up?
[2:30] <ttgg> Alternator voltage would tell you
[2:30] <ttgg> ignition coils, coil packs, etc...
[2:31] <ttgg> If something isn't drawing it's load. The voltage will be higher than normal.
[2:31] <ttgg> since that energy wouldn't get used, by the faulty piece
[2:32] <ttgg> I've had to do some interersting changes to my electrical, because I switched my filaments for LED's, once the headlights were using a grossly low value, that the default computer didn't recognize as correct.
[2:32] <ttgg> I'd get headlight bad warnings
[2:32] <ttgg> Had to put a power resistor on each, to simulate the filament power draw
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[3:54] <john_rambo> Is there an alternative app that can read .ODS file.....Libreoffice is too heavy
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[4:26] <azizLIGHT> ods is spreadsheet?
[4:26] <azizLIGHT> gnumeric
[4:26] <azizLIGHT> i use it on ubuntu for the same reason, its pretty light, and it hsould be on raspbian
[4:27] <azizLIGHT> oh, hes gone
[4:27] * timofonic (~timofonic@unaffiliated/timofonic) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[4:27] <azizLIGHT> anyway, has anyone found a microusb flash drive thats tiny and doesnt have any other bulky things like a regular size usb connector
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[4:30] <SpaceAce> what's my best option for TOSLink/SPDIF output?
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[4:39] <john_rambo> Is there any omxplayer GUI available in the repos ? Dont want to install anything from random places
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[4:49] <Ben64> gui for video player? but why
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[5:06] <john_rambo> Hi, I am trying to configure SMPLAYER with omxplayer as backend but when I play a file it says ''Oops Something went wrong''
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[5:10] <Ben64> gui for video player? but why
[5:11] * Karyon (~Karyon@unaffiliated/karyon) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[5:11] <john_rambo> Ben64, Coz I need to manage a long playlist
[5:12] <Ben64> manage?
[5:12] <john_rambo> Ben64, Is there any working GUI for omxplayer ?
[5:13] <Ben64> i don't use gui for video players
[5:13] <john_rambo> Okay
[5:13] <Ben64> they aren't useful
[5:14] <john_rambo> WHen I try to play a video with Smplayer it fails and prints ''usr/bin/omxplayer.bin: unrecognized option '--no-config''
[5:16] <Ben64> don't pass it '--no-config' then i guess
[5:17] <john_rambo> Ben64, How do I do that ? I mean which option to deselect ?
[5:17] <Ben64> well idk what you've done
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[5:18] <john_rambo> Ben64, Installed Smplayer then changed MULTIMEDIA ENGINE to /usr/bin/omxplayer
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[5:19] <Ben64> https://forum.smplayer.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8422
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[6:36] <Johnjay> can someone link me to a discussion of exactly what the firmware blob does?
[6:36] <Johnjay> i think mpv not working with opengl has something to do with the firmware blob providing video codecs?
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[7:35] <john_rambo> I am trying to configure my Gmail (pop3) a/c with Claws-Mail ...Its ending with >>>Authentication failed:-ERR [AUTH] Web login required: https://support.google.com/mail/answer/78754
[7:35] <john_rambo> What is the solution ?
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[7:39] <john_rambo> Any ideas ?
[7:40] <d0rm0us3> https://support.google.com/mail/answer/7104828
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[7:42] <john_rambo> d0rm0us3, Dont know what to do with that link... There is no specific solution
[7:42] <Ben64> you do the steps listed
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[7:47] <john_rambo> Ben64, WHen I visit the page for allowing insecure login I get ''Your browser is not supported anymore. Please update to a more recent one''
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[7:48] <Ben64> use one then
[7:49] <john_rambo> Ben64, Chromium is terribly slow ...Cant do anything with it ... I guess I am stuck
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[7:49] <Ben64> do you have a different computer
[7:49] <john_rambo> Ben64, No
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[7:50] <Ben64> well, time to visit the library
[7:50] <john_rambo> Okay
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[9:53] <superprower> Hello! I'm looking how to monitore temperature on my RPi Zero W. I found two ways of doing that: one by cat'ing values, and I think it should work for CPU and ambient, and by using vgencmd, which should give temperature for GPU. However, I don't see many chips on RPi Zero W - is it integrated? Can I just use vgencmd to monitor temperature, or I should consider all possible values?
[10:02] <mfa298> 1~depending what values your catting that might be the same as the gpu temp
[10:03] <mfa298> cpu/gpu temperature will be on the SoC itself (which is under the ram chip on the Zero)
[10:04] <mfa298> ambient you'd need to add a sensor for (theres no ambient temp sensor built in)
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[10:14] <Li> Does rPi3 recognize 32Gb sdcard?
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[10:15] <mfa298> why wouldnt it?
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[10:15] <mfa298> im pretty sure all the other pi models support much larger cards
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[10:23] <gordonDrogon> Not sure there is a limit, but I've a funny feeling the first partition needs to be under a certian size for the FAT filesystem, but other than that...
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[11:01] <saimazoon> hi there
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[11:18] <Li> gordonDrogon: I've dd(ed) bunch of rPi images on a 32GB scandisk ultra but none of none of them was bootable! I've checksum is correct
[11:20] <Ben64> what exactly did you dd
[11:20] <Ben64> and how
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[12:03] <Li> Ben64: this is my zillion time dd an sdcard, so you don't need to verify
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[12:04] <Habbie> Li, did you check the checksum -after- dd'ing as well?
[12:05] <Habbie> Li, i have other suggestions but they're quite useless if your position is that we don't need to know how you are doing things
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[12:15] <Li> dd if=file.img of=/dev/sdb bs=4M && sync
[12:16] <Li> also tried conv=fdatasync
[12:19] <BurtyB> hum ho
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[12:20] <Hanonim> hey
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[12:22] <Habbie> Li, and how does the boot fail?
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[12:44] <JimBuntu> Can you still boot the Pi with other cards? Can you image a 16GB or such card using the same command and does that boot? Have you mounted the uSD elsewhere and given the filesystem any quick inspection?
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[12:54] <dehuman> could be the card, could be the pi, could be the image
[12:54] <dehuman> try 1mb blocksize? try conv=fsync not just fdatasync
[12:55] <dehuman> do you have a known good card or some other way to eliminate variables
[12:56] * veverak (~squirrel@ip-89-102-104-133.net.upcbroadband.cz) has joined #raspberrypi
[12:56] <dehuman> https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/installation/installing-images/linux.md
[12:56] <veverak> hi folks!
[12:56] <veverak> anybody has ever similar problesm with hdmi display? https://imgur.com/a/torSRoo
[12:56] <dehuman> try that bit?
[12:58] <Habbie> veverak, i've seen something -similar- to it a few times - physically unplugging power to the monitor for a while did the trick those times
[12:58] <veverak> I see
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[13:00] <dehuman> i know it sounds redundant -- try another cable and/or display device?
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[13:03] <veverak> well
[13:03] <veverak> did that now
[13:03] <veverak> :/
[13:04] <dehuman> what did you try differently?
[13:06] <veverak> different cable
[13:06] <veverak> different monitor
[13:06] <veverak> different cable with different monitor
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[13:08] <BCMM> veverak: same issue with both monitors?
[13:08] <veverak> yep
[13:08] <veverak> exact same colors
[13:08] <BCMM> are the monitors different brands/models?
[13:08] <veverak> yup
[13:08] <BCMM> sounds like either a defective pi, or a weird config.txt
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[13:09] <veverak> ubuntu mate installation
[13:09] <veverak> tried installed ubuntu mate (Second sd card)
[13:09] <veverak> same effect
[13:09] <veverak> maybe raspbian?
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[13:11] <pksato> veverak: enable hdmi_safe on config.txt
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[14:14] <veverak> pksato: will do, thanks
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[14:43] <elim_garak> im using debian jessi, is it suggested to update to stretch that i edit the sources list ?
[14:43] <elim_garak> what is the suggested upgrade path?
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[15:08] <Habbie> elim_garak, writing the new image to your SD will save you about a day - assuming you can easily backup/restore your data and settings
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[15:10] <elim_garak> Habbie, i just updated my source.list to point to stretch and am doing a dist upgrade
[15:10] <elim_garak> hoping that works
[15:10] <Habbie> it should
[15:10] <Habbie> it just takes very long
[15:10] <elim_garak> the dist upgrade completed in like 45 mins, but it failed to fetch some files so im doing an update /upgrade
[15:11] <elim_garak> might try dist upgrade again
[15:11] <elim_garak> it was pointing to raspbians source list however
[15:11] <Habbie> if it failed to fetch some files, then it did not 'complete' i'm afraid
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[15:11] <elim_garak> is the right way to try and complete by running apt-get dist-upgrade again ?
[15:11] <elim_garak> sudo !!
[15:12] <Habbie> sure
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[15:25] <Li> just to confirm the issue with dd was the blocksize, it worked fine with bs=1M
[15:25] <Habbie> interesting
[15:25] <Habbie> that means something is broken on your system
[15:26] <Li> Habbie: how's that?
[15:26] <Habbie> the blocksize should not affect the contents
[15:26] <Habbie> just how long the dd takes
[15:26] <Li> could be related to sdcard speed
[15:27] * sdoherty (sdoherty@nat/redhat/x-tvnrisywbdsqacuv) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[15:27] <Habbie> still means something is broken
[15:28] <Li> good, can you put some possible assumbtions to check which one is broken?
[15:28] <mfa298> sd card speed shouldn't make a difference for whether a blocksize works or not (unless the SD card is on it's way out in which case slower speed might just mask the issues)
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[15:28] <Habbie> Li, if bs=4M works with some cards and not others, and they are the same speed, blame the cards
[15:28] <Habbie> Li, if they are not the same speed, we can blame anything 'above' the SD - the reader, the OS kernel
[15:28] <Habbie> very roughly speaking
[15:28] <Habbie> also what mfa298 said
[15:29] <Habbie> Li, so did you ever verify the contents of an SD after dd'ing?
[15:30] * unkn-error (598833ad@gateway/web/freenode/ip. has joined #raspberrypi
[15:30] <unkn-error> hello
[15:30] <mfa298> I think the only time bs=4M might not work is if the image file is not a multiple of 4MByte, but I've never seen an issue writing a raspbian image with bs=4M.
[15:30] <Habbie> mfa298, i did wonder about truncation, but that should not fully prevent boot
[15:31] <Habbie> mfa298, failure should come no earlier than 30 seconds in
[15:31] <Habbie> mfa298, and involve readable error messages
[15:31] <mfa298> and in that case dd might spit a warning but could still write all the data (not something I've ever looked into)
[15:33] <unkn-error> can someone help me out a little bit? I wish to take a berryboot for a test-spin to see how it is and I am not quite shure which version should I download
[15:33] <mfa298> Habbie: yeah, if it was unbootable I doubt that would come from truncation (should at least get the kernel booting seeing as /boot is at the start of the image). If different bs= values led to issues I'd guess at an old broken SD or a fake SD
[15:33] <Habbie> mfa298, agreed
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[15:34] * Deele (~Deele@ has joined #raspberrypi
[15:34] <Deele> Hello there! How do I know what is the smallest (speed, lower/higher limit, resolution) Ampere value and what is the smallest (speed, lower/higher limit, resolution) of Vatts RaspberryPi can detect, if they change realtime? Sorry for newbie question.
[15:34] <unkn-error> ...
[15:35] <unkn-error> Berryboot for the original Raspberry Pi VERSUS Berryboot for the quad-core Raspberry
[15:35] <Habbie> unkn-error, what pi do you have?
[15:35] <unkn-error> which one I need?
[15:35] <unkn-error> it is a pi 3
[15:35] <Habbie> the pi 3 is quad-core :)
[15:35] <gordonDrogon> Deele, that sort of question usually means that the Pi is the wrong device.
[15:35] <unkn-error> oh, ok. thank you guys
[15:35] <gordonDrogon> Deele, however you need either 0v or 3.3v to signal logic 0 or 1. input current is virtually zero for a pin in input mode.
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[15:36] <gordonDrogon> Deele, speed wise - the pins are edge-triggered, so the answer there is zero, however it takes a finite time for the interrupt to be processed in the kernel.
[15:36] <n4n0`> Yeah maybe rephrasing the question, and is a pibrella involved or other diagnostics module?
[15:36] <Deele> gordonDrogon, I will have an analog input from two wires, and I want to know if I will be able to detect changes
[15:36] <gordonDrogon> Deele, the pi has digital inputs.
[15:37] <Deele> oh
[15:37] <gordonDrogon> if you want to detect a change then feed your analog into a schmitt trigger.
[15:38] <gordonDrogon> if you want to detect the actual voltage then you need some sort of analog to digital converter (ADC)
[15:38] <n4n0`> Yeah I feel like there was once an article on building a Pi-Oscope which might be of assistance
[15:39] <gordonDrogon> the piscope project was a logic analyser - digital only from what I recall.
[15:39] * Acilim_A is now known as Acilim
[15:39] <Deele> as I was told, the project will have 0-5 V divided into about 20 sections depending on position of dial, and I need to detect position of dial, that is it - so, I need some sort of measurement tool to measure it, right?
[15:39] <gordonDrogon> you need an ADC.
[15:40] <gordonDrogon> e.g. mcp3004.
[15:40] <n4n0`> the mcp3004 does 4 single-ended channels right?
[15:41] <gordonDrogon> yes.
[15:41] <n4n0`> That would work for you then wouldn't it Deele
[15:42] <Deele> n4n0`, dunno, reading its description now
[15:42] <gordonDrogon> is this something like one of those wind direction things?
[15:42] <gordonDrogon> or just a dial on a panel..
[15:42] * sdoherty (sdoherty@nat/redhat/x-ippncgljawdwboff) has joined #raspberrypi
[15:43] <Deele> gordonDrogon, sort of a phone dial in exhibit, that I need to detect what is being dialed
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[15:44] <gordonDrogon> ok.
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[15:45] <gordonDrogon> so a real phone dial and just count the pulses.
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[15:45] <Deele> gordonDrogon, no, not real one, it is "upgraded one" that now outputs a voltage depending on position
[15:46] <gordonDrogon> ok, well ,you need an ADC. so it's just a matter of picking one you've used before, or one we suggest.
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[15:47] <Deele> gordonDrogon, sadly, I'm php programmer and all of this is new to me, except that I have knowledge of electricity and soldering :) Soo, I want in the result a raspberry to send a signal to my php app on another server via network.
[15:47] <Deele> gordonDrogon, guy from electronics channel told that "it's an ADC - you still need to tap into a signal and convert it to a voltage for the ADC to convert to digital representation."
[15:47] <gordonDrogon> you can do that in a shell script.
[15:47] <gordonDrogon> or from php running on the Pi.
[15:48] <gordonDrogon> $value = `gpio -x mcp3004:100:0 aread 100` ;
[15:48] <n4n0`> and you could exec that in php
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[15:48] <gordonDrogon> that is php.
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[15:49] <Deele> yeah, no problem with that, I am worried only about electronics part
[15:49] <n4n0`> I agree gordonDrogon
[15:49] <gordonDrogon> google - I'm sure you'll fine many example of how to wire it up.
[15:49] <gordonDrogon> the gpio command is something I wrote to go with the wiringPi gpio library.
[15:49] <shbrngdo> what voltage are you measuring, just curious
[15:49] <gordonDrogon> 0-5v was mentioed earier.
[15:50] <Deele> 0-5 V DC, supposedly split into 20 sectors that I need to measure
[15:50] <shbrngdo> oh, ok. so you need 20 A:D converters, or one converter and an analog mux of some kind
[15:50] <gordonDrogon> no - one to measure and define 20 voltages.
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[15:51] <gordonDrogon> at least that's what I'm assuming - e.g. just one bit rotary potentiometer.
[15:51] <Deele> if I get volage in script, I can do splitting by it, no problem with that
[15:51] <gordonDrogon> one big ...
[15:51] * teepee (~teepee@unaffiliated/teepee) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[15:51] <Deele> gordonDrogon, supposedly (I don't have device at hand) there are two wires that give out voltage
[15:51] <shbrngdo> so one rotary selector of some kind to do the 'mux' part then
[15:51] <gordonDrogon> one wire will be 0v, the other wire the voltage.
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[15:52] <shbrngdo> FYI - since it measures 0-5V on the A:D, and the RPi is 3.3v, is the logic side compatible?
[15:52] <gordonDrogon> shbrngdo, you're over thinking it. just think of a potentiometer - 5v - wiper - 0v --- wiper connected to ADC input.
[15:52] <n4n0`> hmm
[15:52] <gordonDrogon> and the analog side of the ADC takes care of the 5v inputs
[15:53] <gordonDrogon> as it has a separate analog reference pin, so you feed 5v into that.
[15:53] <shbrngdo> right, but typically a device capable of measuring 0-5V would need to have a 5V power supply as well. a 5V reference pin might not work unless there's 5V on the power supply as well. I guess it depends on the A:D
[15:54] <shbrngdo> that's something you'd need to check the specs for, if you can measure voltages higher than Vcc
[15:54] <gordonDrogon> the mcp3004/8 has a separate Vref input.
[15:55] <shbrngdo> that's actually expected yes. but I haven't read the spec sheet on it and dn't have it handy, so it's something I'd look for
[15:55] <shbrngdo> if someone knows for sure you CAN do that, then sure.
[15:55] <shbrngdo> it's one of those
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[15:56] <shbrngdo> er, stupid keyboard - it's one of those 'red flag' things that says to me "check the spec sheet"
[15:56] <gordonDrogon> I have.
[15:56] <shbrngdo> ok - that's good enoughf or me
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[15:58] <shbrngdo> I assume there's a limit on Vref, maybe "no more than XX volts" or "no more than XX volts above Vcc/Vdd or below Vee/Vgnd/Vss/whatever"
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[15:58] <Deele> thank you for all the suggestions
[15:59] <Deele> I will order this MCP3004 as soon as possible
[15:59] <shbrngdo> maybe just playing around with it will give you ideas
[15:59] <Deele> and what about Amperes, what about measuring those?
[16:00] <gordonDrogon> I don't think you really need to measure amps, do you?
[16:00] <Deele> that is for another future project
[16:00] <gordonDrogon> of-course it would really help if you could provide a schematic of this dial thing...
[16:00] <gordonDrogon> to measure amps, you use a digital ammeter chip with I2C or SPI output and glue it to the wire.
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[16:01] <shbrngdo> there are 2 ways to measure DC current. the cheap way is to use a very low resistance between the power supply and the load [your power supply must tolerate this], and then use a differential voltage across the resistor to measure current. The 2nd is with a hall device that's calibrated to measure amperage based on magnetic field from a wire.
[16:02] <Deele> and what parts should I buy to experiment with?
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[16:02] <shbrngdo> in an AC device, you can use a 'current transformer' in series with the load, either by inductive coupling from the incoming power wire [like a clamp-on amp meter] or by inserting it into the circuit. A CT typically won't drop the incoming voltage by any significant amount.
[16:03] <gordonDrogon> Deele, we don't know because we don't see the schematic nor know what range you're trying to measure.
[16:03] <shbrngdo> yeah the digital ammeter chip would be the hall device I was thinking of
[16:04] <Deele> gordonDrogon, 0-5 mA
[16:04] <Deele> that is all I know at this moment
[16:04] <shbrngdo> at what voltage?
[16:04] <Deele> 5 V
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[16:07] <shbrngdo> in this case you'd probably need to be able to mesure millivolts with enough accuracy to get something meaningful. you'd need to be able to measure a differential voltage of, let's say, 50mv (both sides of a series 10 ohm resistor maybe)
[16:07] <shbrngdo> if there is a single device you could glue onto a wire it might be cheaper
[16:08] <shbrngdo> some microcontrollers have differential A:D capability - I've leveraged this before
[16:08] <shbrngdo> but the RPi needs an external device, so it may be better to find one that does exactly what you need
[16:10] <Deele> ok, what else do I need to ask then?
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[16:17] <shbrngdo> Deele - there are a number of problems I can see here. I just did a cursory look at what Digikey has that might do what you want, basically magnetic sensors for hall effect that have an I2C output. They are somewhat expensive, and most of them have cases that a newbie wouldn't want to deal with (like QFN)
[16:17] <shbrngdo> in short, without the right gear, you can't solder them.
[16:18] <shbrngdo> and no hope for putting on a breadboard. MAYBE you could find a breakout board someplace
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[16:18] <shbrngdo> Deele - so this goes back to what you're measuring, if it's less than 10ma, there might not be a simple solution that does not involve using differential amplifiers
[16:19] <Deele> it is for bigger project, so the cost is not really a problem, but the complexity is
[16:19] <unkn-error> do you guys use a pi for personal cloud?
[16:19] <shbrngdo> unkn-error there's no reason you can't, if you run the right back-end on it
[16:20] * Eljotto (~Eljotto@b941c009.business.dg-w.de) has joined #raspberrypi
[16:20] <r3> there's this: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8882
[16:20] <shbrngdo> thing is you'll need qemu to be able to do the work and if the things you run are x86 code, it'll be Sloooooow
[16:20] <r3> and maybe into a ADC
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[16:21] <r3> Deele: I meant to point that out to you, https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8882 - but I've come into the end part of a conversation - but heard "breakout" and thought of sparkfun
[16:22] <shbrngdo> intresting device but the desired measured current was less than 10ma
[16:22] <shbrngdo> however that is the sort of thing I was thinking about earlier - looks like sparkfun has a breakout then [I'm bookmarking it]
[16:22] <shbrngdo> interestingly enough it's a DIP
[16:23] <r3> aye and could be hand soldered
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[16:23] <unkn-error> I wonder which approach should I take, for using pi as a personal cloud, as there are different scenarios?.... 1. install OS, then install docker and in docker install a doker-cloud container and other containers for other stuff . or 2-nd scenario install os, and in the os install the cloud software. hmmm
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[16:25] <shbrngdo> all of the ones I was seeing had ugly cases except for the SOT-23 ones
[16:26] <shbrngdo> there were a couple of them that looked like transistors with 4 leads instead of 3, though
[16:26] <shbrngdo> and you still need to calibrate it somehow...
[16:27] <shbrngdo> problem measuring < 10ma is that you either have to have a very sensitive device that is NOT affected by its own current, or you wrap 1000 turns of wire around it to increase the magnetic field strength
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[16:28] <shbrngdo> I wouldn't want to do any of those things
[16:28] <shbrngdo> so it's back to series resistor in the power supply circuit. upstream of the regulator, it's affected by the regulator. so it has to be downstream
[16:28] <shbrngdo> and then I have to wonder why it needs to be measured
[16:29] <DammitJim> where did the gpac package go to convert h264 to mp4?
[16:29] <DammitJim> or "wrap it"
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[16:29] <shbrngdo> check to see if you're including 'non-free' in your sources.list file [assuming raspbian]
[16:30] <DammitJim> yes, raspbian
[16:30] <shbrngdo> a lot of video conversion thingies end up in non-free, because of the way debian does things
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[16:30] <DammitJim> deb http://raspbian.raspberrypi.org/raspbian/ stretch main contrib non-free
[16:30] <DammitJim> rpi
[16:30] <BCMM> gpac is lgpl, and on debian it's included in main
[16:30] <shbrngdo> oh ok. also possible packages were removed because of licening, patent encumberance, or just plain unavailable
[16:31] <azizLIGHT> can rpi zero w boot off a usb?
[16:31] <shbrngdo> oh maybe it's just not ported to ARM
[16:31] <DammitJim> what do you guys suggest I do to wrap h264 in mp4?
[16:31] <DammitJim> https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/usage/camera/raspicam/raspivid.md
[16:31] <DammitJim> I was following that
[16:31] <Deele> shbrngdo, ok, thank you, I will try to get more information then, before return back with more questions :)
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[16:32] <shbrngdo> hmmm... so you're using the RPi video and creating h.264 and you want to wrap it in an mp4. yeah there might be a gstreamer thingy for that
[16:33] <BCMM> DammitJim: ffmpeg can definitely do that, but i'm really not sure how...
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[16:33] <DammitJim> thanks
[16:33] <shbrngdo> ffmpeg - good suggestion. sometimes it's a little cryptic how to use it, yeah
[16:33] <DammitJim> I"ll google it
[16:34] <shbrngdo> good idea
[16:34] <BCMM> DammitJim: I think you'll need to give it `-c copy` to prevent re-encoding, though
[16:34] <shbrngdo> ack on the 'copy' option. I run into that with mencoder as well. mencoder won't do mp4 output though [last I checked]
[16:35] <shbrngdo> but it DOES give you a lot of other cool options
[16:35] <shbrngdo> conversio to/from individual JPEG files, one per frame.
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[16:36] <Li> what is Remote GPIO and Pi-Top from raspi-config
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[16:37] <BCMM> shbrngdo: that option is awesome; i used it to make some timelapses of plants growing
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[16:37] <shbrngdo> BCMM I think it's the only open source tool that does it directly like that
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[16:38] <shbrngdo> I've considered writing a video editor to wrap around mencoder but you'd need other things as well. time, money prohibitive
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[16:38] <shiftplusone> Li: there's anything related to pi-top in raspi-config? remote GPIO lets you twiddle gpios over the network
[16:38] <Li> now I'm trying xubuntu on rPi 3 which comes without gpio (program/command), apt search result listing raspi-gpio and I'm wondering if that is the same with gpio program on rasbian
[16:38] <BCMM> shiftplusone: well there's mpv, but that's an mplayer fork
[16:38] <shiftplusone> tab completion fail?
[16:39] <BCMM> yeah, sorry. i meant shbrngdo
[16:39] <BCMM> i was being really careful, i even typed *two* letters
[16:39] <shbrngdo> Li - you can install wiringPi to get the gpio command if it's what I'm thinking you want to do
[16:40] <shbrngdo> I don't know if Ubu's 'raspi-gpio' package is the saem thing though
[16:40] <shbrngdo> gordon probably would [it's his pakage]
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[16:40] <Habbie> packages.ubuntu.com does not know raspi-gpio
[16:41] <shbrngdo> BCMM I just tried tab completion on a name - didn't know I could
[16:41] <BCMM> shbrngdo: well, it depends on the irc client. but most clients have it
[16:41] <BCMM> (like highlighting lines with your nick in)
[16:41] <shbrngdo> I'm so used to just typing it out
[16:42] <Rob235> got my first rpi project working! node server sending commands from a website to another microcontroller over SPI: https://youtu.be/lVqHXZs0Co4
[16:42] <Rob235> :)
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[16:43] <shbrngdo> seems like magic the first time you get a device to respond to commands, heh
[16:43] <Habbie> yeah it is
[16:43] <Habbie> good times
[16:43] <Rob235> definitely
[16:44] <Rob235> been waiting a long time to get to this point (the whole project, not just the rpi stuff)
[16:44] <Rob235> time to get drawing :)
[16:44] <shbrngdo> getting the incantations "just right"
[16:45] <Habbie> at some point things start to feel less magical
[16:45] <Habbie> but i could not tell you if that is 'understanding' or 'acquired intuition'
[16:45] * shbrngdo imagines Hermione saying "Wingardium Leviosa, not Wingardium Levio-SA"
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[16:46] <Rob235> well I understand all the low level, even wire/electrical level communication, but seeing everything you put together piece by piece work together will always be magical :)
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[16:47] <shbrngdo> ack - breadboard each individual subsystem, then when the board design comes back, build it, jump on one foot and sacrifice a chicken while dancing to the macarena, and hope for the best
[16:47] <Habbie> just don't spill any blood on your circuits
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[16:48] <shbrngdo> heh
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[16:48] <shbrngdo> at used-to-company [last on-site gig] one lady joked about "the flash dance" where you hold the button and send the code and if you did the dance right, it wouldn't "brick"
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[16:50] <Habbie> dancing is a terrible way to make sure you are holding a button though
[16:51] <Rob235> :)
[16:51] <shbrngdo> it's to please the gods/angels/daemons/spaghetti-monsters of 'flashing firmware' so that they don't play a bad joke on you
[16:53] <shbrngdo> with any luck, they can keep the magic blue smoke inside of the electronic components, too
[16:53] <unkn-error> as Pi use arm CPU, the packages like firefox and kernel and userland are specially compiled for ARM arhitecture?
[16:53] <shbrngdo> yes
[16:53] * s8548a (~s8548a@unaffiliated/s8548a) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:53] <shbrngdo> the beauty of open source is that if the author does it right, the CPU won't matter. and so it just works!
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[16:54] <shbrngdo> occasionally you'll need a cpu-specific hack, but that's usually not the case
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[16:54] <unkn-error> hmm, so there are packages which works on x86 and also on ARM (Pi)?
[16:54] <Habbie> more often you need to undo a hack that turns out not to work everywhere ;)
[16:54] <Habbie> unkn-error, when compiled for one or the other, yes
[16:55] <shbrngdo> unkn-error I wouldn't say "packages" per se unless they're documentation or Python or something lke that
[16:55] <Habbie> unkn-error, unless they are fully written in an interpreted language, like python or perl, then the same package might be reusable between x86 and arm
[16:55] <unkn-error> oh, I see so it is more complex
[16:56] <shbrngdo> the source code compiles into an archtecture-specific binary, which is then included in a binary package that you install
[16:56] <shbrngdo> so the binary package has to be architecture-specific most of the time
[16:56] <Habbie> yes
[16:56] <shbrngdo> however, the debian package system gives you the option of getting the source and building it yourself, if you want.
[16:57] <unkn-error> not enough patience here, heh :)
[16:57] <shbrngdo> as I recall it's apt-get source packagename and there's another for build dependencies
[16:57] <Habbie> shbrngdo, apt-get build-dep
[16:57] <Habbie> unkn-error, is there any specific package you are interested in?
[16:57] <shbrngdo> that's what I was thinking, thanks. wasn't sure
[16:58] <Rob235> I wish sublime text had a arm version
[16:59] <shbrngdo> if there's a package available in x86 land, you should be able to grab the source and compile it elsewhere. more complex if there's no source package already for raspbian
[16:59] <shbrngdo> build-dep may prove to be a bit problematic without a package already there
[16:59] <unkn-error> Habbie: not specifically but I was curious to have a better picture on what is happening into the system. Hmm maybe there is some remote software if I think better.. but I need to search for it
[17:00] <Habbie> unkn-error, ok
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[17:01] <unkn-error> Habbie: take a look here: https://www.dwservice.net/en/download.html
[17:01] <unkn-error> they have a Pi version of the package - which is I guess for Raspaberian OS
[17:01] <unkn-error> which is based on Debian
[17:01] <unkn-error> and they have a Linux version
[17:02] <unkn-error> but if the Pi runs Ubuntu MATE for ARM, which package is compatibile?
[17:02] <Habbie> i wonder why the raspbian package is separate
[17:02] <Habbie> if they also have a 'generic' one for linux
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[17:02] <Habbie> they are the same.
[17:03] <Habbie> looks like this one manages to be portable between architectures by being written in python
[17:03] <unkn-error> I guess the one for Pi - from a CPU perspective. But I asume that ubuntu mate for ARM have some differences when compared with the raspaberian on the mechanichs
[17:03] <Habbie> there is no cpu perspective
[17:03] <Habbie> it is the exact same thing
[17:03] <Habbie> in this case
[17:04] <unkn-error> ok
[17:04] <unkn-error> so that package is more like a phyton script - alike, not like a c++ software
[17:04] <Habbie> probably
[17:04] <Habbie> i'll check for you
[17:06] <Habbie> it installs itself in /usr/share/dwagent (by default)
[17:07] <unkn-error> so it is compatibile with the official raspaberian and with the ubuntu mate for pi?
[17:07] <Habbie> and looks like a bunch of python, yes
[17:07] <Habbie> unkn-error, that seems likely
[17:07] <unkn-error> Thank you Habbie
[17:08] <Li> shbrngdo: no wiringpi on xubuntu repo, I found someting call pigpio "library for raspberry pi gpio control" not sure if it could be used on the terminal or has to be included and call from code
[17:09] <Habbie> pigpio comes with terminal tools
[17:13] <Li> thanks Habbie
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[17:17] <Apocx_> Question: Does anyone know of a methodology to backup a Pi while it is running with a read-only filesystem, which can then be used to flash a new SDCard via Etcher/Win32DiskImager and result in a clone of said Pi
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[17:17] <Apocx_> Like, will the dd commands result in something that can be flashed via Etcher?
[17:17] <Habbie> if it's running read-only, yes
[17:17] <Habbie> but why do you want this?
[17:17] <Apocx_> Periodic backups
[17:17] <Habbie> how would you make it read-only?
[17:18] <Apocx_> Followed some guide, and it can be toggled on/off with rw/ro commands
[17:18] <Habbie> several daemons will crash when you do that though
[17:18] <Apocx_> so you can type rw if you need to update things or write out to files etc
[17:18] <Apocx_> Seems to be working fine
[17:18] <Habbie> interesting
[17:18] <Habbie> but yes, a dd while ro is fine
[17:19] <mfa298> a lot of stuff won't like suddenly getting a ro filesystem unless everything has been designed for that to happen (not the case as standard)
[17:19] <Habbie> that
[17:19] <Apocx_> Well what I'm asking is, will a raw dd image be writeable via Etcher? If I wrote the dd image to a fresh SD Card would the Pi boot?
[17:19] <Tenkawa> its all timing
[17:19] <Apocx_> I'm using http://hallard.me/raspberry-pi-read-only/ for the readonly aspects
[17:20] <Tenkawa> the journal can prevent the crashes
[17:20] <mfa298> personally my backup system is good documentation (some in the form of systems automation) for software and configuration and then rsync to another system for data.
[17:20] <Tenkawa> but if he is creating an image yes in theory anything that can drop it straight on a blank card should work
[17:21] <Apocx_> I will try it out with a fresh Pi and see if it works
[17:21] <Tenkawa> I replicate multiple builds like that with just a straight dd\
[17:21] <Apocx_> Ah cool, thanks
[17:21] <Tenkawa> after I build it I shut it down... dd the card to an image
[17:21] <Tenkawa> take that image
[17:21] <Tenkawa> dd it to a new card
[17:22] <Tenkawa> mount it on a new box, make wanted changes to make it "unique"
[17:22] <Tenkawa> (since I'm cloning)
[17:22] <Tenkawa> and boot it up
[17:22] <mfa298> Apocx_: you'll also need the same size or bigger SD to restore onto (and not all SD cards with an advertised size will be exactly the same)
[17:22] <Tenkawa> mfa298: yep
[17:22] <Apocx_> All SD cards are the exact same brand model and size
[17:22] <Tenkawa> i've been bit by that once
[17:23] <Tenkawa> fortunately it was just a test run
[17:23] <Tenkawa> 2 sectors difference
[17:24] <Apocx_> Damn
[17:24] <Tenkawa> ?
[17:24] <Apocx_> The two sector difference
[17:24] <Tenkawa> yep
[17:24] <Apocx_> Ideally I want to be able to do weekly full backups of these Pis so if something happens to one I can just flash the last backup to a new card, throw it in a spare Pi, and be good to go
[17:25] <Tenkawa> I usually go, dd first, fsck, then mount and rsync
[17:25] <Tenkawa> to make sure I have all changes
[17:25] <Apocx_> alright thanks
[17:26] * Volis (uid12493@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qtzdjgehukaghzck) Quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[17:26] <Tenkawa> good luck'
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[17:50] <Apocx_> Backup commencing, fingers crossed
[17:51] * CatCow97 (~mine9@c-24-22-38-85.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
[17:52] <Habbie> it's not backing up that is exciting or scary
[17:52] <Habbie> it's restoring
[17:52] <Tenkawa> heheheh
[17:52] <Tenkawa> Apocx_: what dd string do you use?
[17:53] <Apocx_> well the restore will be relatively straight forward, it's whether it works or not that is the big question :D
[17:53] <Habbie> yes
[17:53] <Tenkawa> or do you use the tool?
[17:53] <Habbie> the tool?
[17:53] <Apocx_> using a script, but the dd line in question is dd of=$OFILE bs=1M conv=sync,noerror iflag=fullblock
[17:54] <Apocx_> Filesystem is readonly, and it is backing up to a network share
[17:54] <Apocx_> 30%
[17:54] <Apocx_> this is just a spare test Pi so even if everything fails miserably, no big deal
[17:54] <Tenkawa> you can add direct to oflag too
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[17:54] <Tenkawa> to give it a bit more in the future
[17:55] <Apocx_> ok
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[17:55] <Tenkawa> speed
[17:55] <Apocx_> will do thanks
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[17:55] <Tenkawa> make sure you do sync command on the shell command at the end to flush buffers
[17:56] <Apocx_> ok
[17:56] <Apocx_> I am using this script which I modified a bit: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=136912#p173999
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[17:57] <Habbie> the first script i see there does not do the readonly remount
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[17:57] <Apocx_> ah yeah I did that manually with ro
[17:57] <Apocx_> I will add that to the script later
[17:58] <Habbie> how exactly?
[17:58] <Apocx_> http://hallard.me/raspberry-pi-read-only/
[17:58] <Tenkawa> it probably just uses the journal to cleanup the fs
[17:58] * philomath_ (~da_vinci@ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[17:58] <Apocx_> ro is a custom command that remounts everything
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[17:58] <Habbie> Apocx_, you mean you added ro to cmdline.txt?
[17:59] <Apocx_> bash.bashrc
[17:59] <Apocx_> alias ro='sudo mount -o remount,ro / ; sudo mount -o remount,ro /boot'
[17:59] <Habbie> ah yes
[17:59] <Habbie> that'll do
[17:59] <Habbie> Tenkawa, without that ro thing, the journal will not save you
[17:59] <Apocx_> 58%
[17:59] <Habbie> Tenkawa, and with that ro thing, it won't have to :)
[17:59] <Apocx_> plenty fast IMO
[17:59] <Tenkawa> Habbie: It can... depending on activity
[17:59] <Tenkawa> i have tested it
[18:00] <Habbie> you may have gotten lucky
[18:00] <Habbie> i have seen many people get unlucky
[18:00] <Habbie> it is not a viable approach
[18:00] <Tenkawa> indeed it usually breaks
[18:00] <Habbie> unless we're talking snapshots (like LVM) instead of dd
[18:00] <Tenkawa> I dont advise it
[18:00] <Habbie> lvm snapshot + journal is mostly viable
[18:00] <Tenkawa> I was agreeing with you
[18:00] <Habbie> oh sorry :)
[18:00] <Tenkawa> I was just explaining how he probably did it
[18:01] <Tenkawa> as an alternative
[18:01] <Habbie> ack
[18:01] <Habbie> apparently not true in this case
[18:01] <Tenkawa> oh?
[18:01] <Habbie> that page makes the filesystem readonly
[18:01] <Habbie> so a dd is simply safe
[18:01] <Tenkawa> yes
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[18:02] <Tenkawa> its still best to fsck things
[18:02] * Dave_MMP is now known as djsxxx_away
[18:02] <Tenkawa> and run a rsync
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[18:02] <Tenkawa> thats just a safety net though
[18:02] <Habbie> one backup is no backup
[18:03] <Tenkawa> Habbie: if one thing you've learned about me over time is I like redundencies in my systems
[18:03] <Habbie> uhuh
[18:04] <Li> Habbie: pigpio doesn't give the same control gpio does, it's a daemon
[18:04] <Habbie> Li, yes
[18:04] * saimazoon (~user@unaffiliated/saimazoon) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:04] <Li> but anyway, something new to learn about xbuntu
[18:04] <Habbie> you could compile wiringPi for yourself
[18:04] <Habbie> if you really prefer the gpio tool
[18:04] <Li> I will
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[18:06] <methuzla> for a pi 3b+, configuring wifi via editing /boot/wpa_supplicant.conf. is there anyway to get around having to 'sudo rfkill unblock wifi' after booting?
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[18:07] <shiftplusone> methuzla: if you have the country code in your wpa_supplicant.conf, you shouldn't need to do that
[18:08] <methuzla> i do
[18:08] <methuzla> still need to
[18:08] <shiftplusone> even with the image released today
[18:08] * Stromeko (~Stromeko@unaffiliated/stromeko) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[18:08] <shiftplusone> ?
[18:08] <methuzla> oh...hold....
[18:09] <shiftplusone> if it still doesn't work, do you have a way to access the pi to check what's going on?
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[18:10] <methuzla> no. was using the 3/13 image. let me try latest.
[18:10] <methuzla> yes. i'm booting with a serial console cable attached.
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[18:12] <methuzla> slow download...may take a while. i'll test and report back in a bit. thanks for pointing out new image shiftplusone
[18:12] <shiftplusone> np
[18:13] <shiftplusone> In the old image the service which blocks rfkill if the country is not set and the service which copies the new wpa_supplicant.conf ran roughly at the same time and I suspect the problem may be that in your case, rfkill would block before the new wpa_supplicant.conf file was copied.
[18:14] <methuzla> yep. kind of what i saw in the boot messages as well.
[18:14] <shiftplusone> In the new image, they're ordered.
[18:14] <shiftplusone> or should be anyway >.>
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[18:18] <methuzla> slow....are there any mirrors for the img files?
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[18:19] <JonelethIrenicus> hi does you need a different image when comparing the raspberry pi 3 and 3 + ?
[18:19] <shiftplusone> you could try restarting the download or using the torrent. There are load balancers, so you should already hit different mirrors.
[18:19] <Habbie> JonelethIrenicus, the 3+ requires a more recent image; but that image will also work on 3
[18:19] <methuzla> JonelethIrenicus, yes
[18:19] <JonelethIrenicus> ok thanks peeps
[18:19] <shiftplusone> JonelethIrenicus: images are backwards compatible, but not forwards compatible, if that makes sense.
[18:20] <JonelethIrenicus> gotcha
[18:20] <shiftplusone> methuzla: the torrent option is also there
[18:20] <shiftplusone> But yeah, the servers tend to get a bit busy when a new image is out.
[18:21] <Habbie> i like the torrent option a lot
[18:21] <Habbie> i like to save the images to my NAS anyway so it's just as easy as the http version for me
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[18:27] <dougquaid> My raspberry pi 3 says its tempurature is 50.5C. Is that a normal temp? What is considered a high temp?
[18:28] * philomath_ (~da_vinci@ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:28] <shiftplusone> that's a normal temp
[18:28] <shauno> I still find http much easier to deal with. I don't care if it's slow from time to time, I'm only gonna grab it once anyway
[18:28] <ebarch> yup. CPU throttling doesn't begin until 80C
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[18:28] <ebarch> (how the chip protects itself)
[18:29] <dougquaid> Awesome, thanks!
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[18:29] <Habbie> shauno, ack - i meant in my case it literally is clicking one link or the other
[18:29] <Habbie> dougquaid, i'm not sure i've ever seen mine that low!
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[18:30] <shiftplusone> really?
[18:30] <shiftplusone> In a FLIRC case: temp=44.0'C
[18:30] <Habbie> but i only looked a few times
[18:30] * troulouliou_div2 (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-div2/x-0271439) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
[18:30] <Habbie> i think my broken retropie install is stealing a bit of CPU
[18:30] <shiftplusone> Just out in the open temp=53.2'C
[18:30] <shauno> I just have a script that snags the latest version. http makes this so much cleaner. eg "wget --trust-server-names -c -N https://downloads.raspberrypi.org/raspbian_lite_latest" won't download anything unless the server has a version I don't
[18:31] <shiftplusone> and it's a warm day here in Cambridge today. I think it's UK's annual sun week.
[18:31] <Habbie> shauno, oh neat
[18:31] <Habbie> shiftplusone, annual sun week in NL as well
[18:31] <Habbie> shiftplusone, it is unbearable
[18:31] * john_rambo (~john_ramb@unaffiliated/john-rambo/x-5460353) has joined #raspberrypi
[18:31] <Habbie> shiftplusone, and somebody made me go outside and EXERCISE
[18:31] <shauno> we have sun in ireland too. it's surely the endtimes.
[18:31] <shiftplusone> I'm Australian, so I like it. The Brits tend to start melting though.
[18:31] * louisdk (~louisdk@static-5-103-138-205.ip.fibianet.dk) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
[18:32] <john_rambo> My clock is in 24hrs format ...I want 12hrs format ...How do I change that ?
[18:32] <shauno> I've spent half the day drooling because if I'm fed and it's too warm, I just go into nap mode
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[18:32] <shiftplusone> ah
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[18:33] <gordonDrogon> warn & sunny in Devon, but thats just normal & boring here.
[18:33] <shiftplusone> I have that when I go back to Australia during UK winter and it's over 35 degrees over there.
[18:33] <shauno> I'd be hugging the basement floor @ 35. that's just not sensible.
[18:34] <shiftplusone> gordonDrogon: nice. Over here, the sun is a novelty for the first hour or so and then people start complaining that it's too warm and that the AC doesn't go high enough.
[18:34] <Habbie> over here people buy ACs in these weeks
[18:34] <Habbie> and then realise they have no use for them the rest of the year
[18:35] <shiftplusone> anything above ~32 is when I start getting uncomfortable and go into zombie mode. The trick is to go to the beach or a pool where you can cool off.
[18:35] <dougquaid> Will binaries compiled on a raspberry pi 3 work on a pi zero W? I compiled a project on github that took a long time on the pi3, so if I could just copy the binaries to the pi zero W that would save me a lot of time
[18:36] <shiftplusone> dougquaid: gcc in raspbian will compile binaries which work on all pi models by default
[18:36] <shiftplusone> You may run into trouble if you override defaults and target specific CPUs
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[18:37] <dougquaid> Cool, thanks
[18:38] <cirdan> oh hey, I have wiki. woot. https://github.com/zfsonlinux/pkg-zfs/wiki/HOWTO-install-Raspbian-to-a-Native-ZFS-Root-Filesystem,-or,-How-I-Learned-to-Love-Data-Integrity
[18:38] <dougquaid> Ok, last question for now. I know that if the raspberry pi isn't getting enough power it'll show a rainbow icon on the screen. I'm running my pi as a server without a screen. Is there a way in the command line to check if my pi is getting enough power?
[18:38] <cirdan> zfs on pi
[18:39] <BurtyB> dougquaid, if "vcgencmd get_throttled" says 0x0 then it's OK
[18:39] <Habbie> dougquaid, 'vcgencmd' is a good google term
[18:39] <dougquaid> thanks
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[18:41] <cirdan> if anyone tries it let me know if I missed anything
[18:41] <shiftplusone> the new kernel will also let you know in dmesg when there are power issues
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[18:54] <methuzla> shiftplusone, works with latest img. thanks
[18:54] * Vonter (~Vonter@ Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[18:55] <shiftplusone> phew
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[18:57] <shiftplusone> surprised there hasn't been a forum post yet about the new image. Usually somebody notices while it's being uploaded. And usually Dougie happens to hit a mirror that doesn't have it yet or find a link that hasn't been updated yet. And somebody else says the shasum is wrong, but it turns out they're checking the shasum of the .img file rather than the .zip file.
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[19:03] <BurtyB> shiftplusone, do you know if there's a list or something where new images are announced?
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[19:04] <shiftplusone> Something like this http://downloads.raspberrypi.org/rss.xml ?
[19:06] <BurtyB> shiftplusone, something 100% like that would be great, thanks :)
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[19:06] <shiftplusone> In that case, try that.
[19:07] <shiftplusone> They should probably go here as well https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=187256, but idk
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[19:15] <Apocx_> Backup and restore worked perfectly :D
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[19:29] <red9> How is one supposed to get video from a Raspberry Zero? The video connector is certainly non-standard....
[19:30] <Habbie> red9, the mini-hdmi?
[19:30] <shiftplusone> Non-standard? HDMI 1.3 - Type C
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[19:30] <methuzla> common != standard
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[19:31] <shiftplusone> Yeah, I don't think I've seen it on anything else. But there's no lack of cables and adapters on amazon.
[19:31] <methuzla> just use an adapter, or cable with mini on one end
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[19:33] <IT_Sean> It's a mini-hdmi, isn't it? I wouldn't call that non-standard.
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[19:34] <red9> Well.. not something near att hand after closing hours.. doh.
[19:34] <IT_Sean> That doesn't mean it's non-standard.
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[19:37] <red9> I'm at a tech club.. and well no mini-hdmi.
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[19:37] <jkemppainen> How is mini-HDMI "non-standard"? That has very detailed specifications and it's used all over the place.
[19:39] <shiftplusone> it doesn't follow the "does red9 have a suitable cable or adaptor" standard.
[19:40] <Habbie> red9, are you the first person with a pi zero at the tech club?
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[19:40] <Habbie> red9, maybe they have some serial stuff you can use instead
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[19:41] <IT_Sean> shiftplusone: that's a very obscure standard, and I would imagine not may people pay it any mind.
[19:42] <shiftplusone> Idk, I may have to flag it up as non-compliant with the hardware team.
[19:42] <red9> Habbie, I'm considering the IDC 2-pin header --> Composite video path. Seems easier. Only need a text console..
[19:43] <shiftplusone> Or you can boot the thing as a serial device, plug it into a USB port on your PC and go from there.
[19:44] <red9> It will show up as serial device =?
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[19:44] <shiftplusone> if you configure it to do so
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[19:45] <shiftplusone> https://blog.gbaman.info/?p=791
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[19:46] <shiftplusone> it doesn't need to be Jessie like the guide says. Works with Stretch too.
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[19:47] <shiftplusone> ah, that example is to get it working as an ethernet device, which is much better anyway
[19:47] <shiftplusone> since then you can ssh/vnc into it or do whatever else you may want to.
[19:48] <red9> To make any configuration I need console..
[19:49] <shiftplusone> not if you can just ssh into it
[19:49] <shiftplusone> check the link I sent
[19:49] <red9> reading / | \ - ;)
[19:52] <red9> oh well fat32 access, edit, boot.
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[20:43] <Tenkawa> Apocx_: did that copy work?
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[20:44] <Apocx_> Yes everything worked perfectly
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[20:44] <Apocx_> thanks for the help
[20:44] <Tenkawa> no problem
[20:44] <Tenkawa> i really like that method
[20:44] <Tenkawa> great for cloning
[20:45] <Tenkawa> especially for my cluster pi
[20:45] <Tenkawa> (need to build 4 pi zeros exactly the same at once)
[20:45] <Apocx_> yeah. I just fleshed out the script a bit more so now it will activate read-only, mount a network share, backup the image to it, compress old images, delete images older than 3 months, and unmount. figure I'll just run it once a week or os
[20:46] <ghoti> So .. there's this glut of relay boards all marketed for arduino, usually using Songle 5VDC coils. I get the impression that arduinos drive the 30ma relay coils directly, but a RPi GPIO has a 16mA limit. Are Arduino relay boards useless to me? What's the best way to drive a couple of relays from a RPi?
[20:46] <Tenkawa> Apocx_: nice
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[20:50] <BurtyB> ghoti, automation hat? or one of the many relay boards for arduino with driver transistor/mosfet/etc.
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[20:54] <pksato> most of arduino relay board are activated by low level (5V-0.7V) signal.
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[20:56] <pksato> RPi, is 3.3V, that is sufficient low to activate the relay drive transistor.
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[20:57] <ghoti> I was thinking I could drive the relays with transistors.. Would mosfets be the right choice? Or could I get away with a transistor package like a ULN2803A to drive multiple relays?
[20:57] <ghoti> GPIO drives transistors, transistors switch the relays, relays switch my mains...
[20:58] <cirdan> bzzzt...
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[21:03] <pksato> other relay modules use a opto-coupler, low activated. But more easy to connecto on RPi.
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[21:21] <ghoti> pksato: hmm. I just realized that my box of random parts has a dual relay board by "Keyes", labelled "Funduino" and "2R1B". It has connections comparable to the ones described in http://descargas.cetronic.es/ReleRaspberry.pdf .
[21:22] <ghoti> Does it sound to you like this board might contain an on-board optocoupler, and the green jumper might be a power bypass so the relays aren't powered from the Pi?
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[21:25] <mgottschlag> those chips are definately optocouplers
[21:26] <mgottschlag> the jumper is at GND, so no power
[21:26] <mgottschlag> I only see one VCC though
[21:26] <mgottschlag> ah
[21:27] <mgottschlag> okay, if it looks like that, yes, the relays don't need to be powered by the pi
[21:27] <mgottschlag> (if yours looks like that one)
[21:27] <pksato> high activated module.
[21:28] <pksato> just need a 5V from other that on RPi header.
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[21:31] <ghoti> So .. I'm powering the pi from 2A power supply. Can I just carry a 5v over to the relay board, and trust that GPIO will only be used for signal once the jumper is removed?
[21:31] <ghoti> I'm afraid I'm not quite clear on what the jumper is doing.
[21:32] <stiv> use an opto-isolator to separate the pi from the relay. don't forget diodes for back-emf protection
[21:32] <pksato> just connect board gnd to "control" gnd.
[21:33] <ghoti> stiv: the thought is that the relay board in question already has optocouplers on-board.
[21:34] <pksato> for two relay, Is safe to connect 5V to RPi 5V.
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[21:39] <ghoti> pksato: are you sure? The relays are Songle SRD, which according to their data sheet draw 0.36W @ 5v. Is the 16mA limit for GPIO only, or for vcc?
[21:39] <ghoti> http://datasheetcafe.databank.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/SRD-05VDC-SL-C-Datasheet.pdf
[21:39] <pksato> 16mA is for GPIO pin. not for 5V line.
[21:39] <ghoti> Awesome, thanks.
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[21:41] <pksato> 5V load are limited by input "fuse".
[21:41] <ghoti> So .. leave the jumper installed, connect VCC to pin 02/04, Gnd to Gnd, and IN1/IN2 to any free GPIO lines? Does that sound right?
[21:42] <pksato> Yes.
[21:45] <ghoti> Thanks again. I'll report back when my Pi loses its magic smoke. ;-)
[21:45] <pksato> But, if RPi reset when activate the relays, my br need a better usb cable.
[21:46] <ghoti> Right, or perhaps a higher quality 2A power supply. :)
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[21:52] <stiv> or perhaps separate power to keep noise & voltage spikes out of your pi
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[22:13] <extor> If I were to take a mini usb cable could it possibly be modded to become a cable that turns my smartphone into a portable battery pack for my pi? Or would I need another feather board or something
[22:14] <extor> *two mini usb cables
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[22:32] <jberkus> hey, I'm looking to set up a wifi camera with sound for monitoring a piece of equipment. I've found several tutorials online for Pi-based wifi cameras, but all of them are for security cameras, i.e. motion cameras. I'm really looking for a more standard video camera approach, I only need to check the camera when I look at its feed and don't need it to record.
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[22:33] <jberkus> is it still be best approach to use motionPi and configure it to be a plain webcam, or should I do something else?
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[22:39] <ShorTie> the regular camera and https://elinux.org/RPi-Cam-Web-Interface works preaty good
[22:41] <jberkus> thanks
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[22:51] <ghoti> jberkus: I've got a PiNoir in my chicken coop, with a small bank of IR LEDs to light things up for periodic stills overnight. Whether a camera is used for security or chickens or plant minding depends on software - a picture is just a picture. :)
[22:52] <ShorTie> how many chickens do you have ??
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[22:57] <jberkus> PiNoir?
[22:58] <jberkus> found it
[22:58] <ghoti> https://www.raspberrypi.org/products/pi-noir-camera-v2/
[22:58] <jberkus> I don't think I want an infrared sensor, the thing I'll be monitoring has lighted controls
[22:58] <jberkus> (the thing is a pottery kiln, FWIW)
[23:00] <jberkus> the only real reason I want video is to get sound
[23:00] <ghoti> Just saying what I use. You can plug any Pi camera in and use code to turn the picture into something useful for you.
[23:00] <jberkus> yah. now I have to decide how much it's worth it to me to get sound.
[23:01] * ghoti parses... You want video so you can get sound? Why not just get sound? Do you need video at all?
[23:01] <jberkus> since that would require a USB camera and different software
[23:01] <jberkus> I need still pictures and sound
[23:01] <ghoti> ah. :)
[23:01] <ghoti> Are you thinking you'll mount the camera *inside* the kiln?
[23:01] <jberkus> the sound is really just a safety check; a lot of things that can go wrong with a kiln make noise
[23:02] <jberkus> oh, heck no. Do they even make cameras safe at 1500C?
[23:02] <ghoti> But by the time you detect the noise, the damage is done, is it not?
[23:02] <ghoti> I was gonna say.. ;) Though, if you did find a way to keep the heat off the camera, that cold spot in the kiln would probably affect quality.
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[23:04] <ghoti> jberkus: https://lenoxinst.com/Pultz_High-Temp_Cameras.html ? :-)
[23:05] <jberkus> ghoti: anyway, firing problems don't necessarily happen all at once
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[23:28] <plum> hi!
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[23:30] * cstk421 (~cstk421@rrcs-98-6-11-10.sw.biz.rr.com) has joined #raspberrypi
[23:31] <plum> i tried installing Raspbian Stretch yesterday, but booting it up i was met with a black screen that had four raspberry icons at the top-left of the screen
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[23:32] <plum> i used win32diskimager to burn the stretch image to the sd card
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[23:32] <plum> after it installed, it had a boot partition and a data partition... so i think it worked okay? but still didn't have success
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[23:34] <plum> i've used dd to install images in the past, might just need to go back to that... windows has not given me good luck
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[23:39] <prauat> Hi, anyone ever used ads1256 with rbpi?
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[23:40] <mfa298> plum: seeing four raspberrys sounds like it started to boot properly, you may need to leave it a bit on first boot for it to resize the partiton (maybe 5-10 mins)
[23:41] <plum> ohhhh that makes sense! maybe i'm just too impatient ugh
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[23:49] <akk> I have a 0w that seems to have died (maybe from a bad power source?) -- nothing lights up when I plug in a power supply, and it doesn't print anything over serial.
[23:50] <akk> Is there anything else I can test on it before giving up? I've tried multiple power supplies and SD cards (which work with other Pis).
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[23:58] <GenteelBen> kingarmadillo, do you have experience leading armadillos?

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